See, this is how people felt about the incoming-Mexican president. She’s our first woman president, but she’s also playing into AMLO’s dissolution of government safeguards
Jon doesn't understand basic political strategy. If he keeps yelling about Biden's mental state, that'll dissuade people from voting blue and we'll have a fascist in the White House.
The game plan at this point is for Biden to win and step down in a year or so, passing the reigns to Harris. She's not particularly charismatic but she'll be a decent president.
I'd rather have a bland ex-junior-senator president than a fucking dictatorship.
How about the blues realize they need an actual candidate against Trump who isn't 5000 years old with speech impediments? Don't get me wrong, if I were American I'd still vote blue because it would only take one day from my life, but this "vote blue no matter who" tactic shouldn't shield the democratic party from all critique because it "dissuades" people from voting for them. You know what actually dissuades people? Their candidates.
We're at a point where the establishment parties worldwide think that just because their main opposition is made out of fascist loonies they can do anything they want with no consequences because the alternative is worse (which is correct, but I hope you see where this leads).
>We're at a point where the establishment parties worldwide think that just because their main opposition is made out of fascist loonies they can do anything they want with no consequences because the alternative is worse (which is correct, but I hope you see where this leads).
I don't think that's exactly right. Biden most likely got chosen because he's a safe choice between the more popular candidates and make Republicans vote for him. 2020 was a different time lol
Right, but I think that criticism is more pertinent after beating Trump, not before. Anything that could dissuade voters from voting for Biden at this point is only helping Trump.
Exactly. Did the vote blue no matter who crowd think that if they just stomped out all criticism about Biden's mental well-being, people would never notice?
Political strategy is never criticizing the geriatric pro-genocide dipshit president, because the other geriatric pro-genocide dipshit president is somehow much worse?
Sounds like shit
This is the weird way of thinking I've been seeing for the last 4 years. This idea that it's not democrats or the president's responsibility to persuade anyone to vote for them, but instead it's the people's responsibility to silence any criticism and just hope that voters don't realize how glaringly obviously shit they are. And then they act all shocked when they lose a bunch of undecided voters and swing states who never took the "vote blue no matter who" pledge. Last nights debate was the logical result of this thinking. People were always eventually gonna notice that Biden isn't mentally fit for this. All the "vote blue no matter who" crowd have done is kick the can so far down the road that it's too late for another candidate to start campaigning, and we just have to pray that we don't get another 4 years of fascism because the dems decided the to run the worst candidate imaginable.
People who criticize Biden don't want Donald Trump to win, they want him to lose and they don't think geriatric old man on deaths door is a good last line of defense against fascism.
Mixing up pursued with persuade is one my favorite typos I've ever seen because of how understandable it is. Like... damn. The letters do match up perfectly with the phonemes.
We've all been saying this shit for over a year now and every time it was brought up Libs shouted us down and people in this sub have been extremely militant against any criticisms.
I can't say this outcome is surprising whatsoever since Libs have clearly been fumbling so fucking hard when *everything is in their favor*. This election should be an easy clap. At least this is somewhat of a wake up call, finally, since Libs have had cotton in their ears for months.
I'm gonna be honest, Biden wasn't at his absolute best, but at least he could stay on topic most of the time. He still brought out statistics, and he managed to answer the questions with solid points. At one point they gave Trump 3 or 4 opportunities in a row to answer a simple yes or no question, and he used every single opportunity to rant about whatever he had on his mind
Edit: To expand on what I mean, it doesn't really feel like he's confused or anything. He misunderstood a question at one point, but he was very clearly listening to the questions and Trump's responses and responding accordingly. It really just sounds like he's having trouble putting thoughts to words, doesn't he have a stutter that he's struggled with since school? My man isn't lost at all, it just takes him a second to speak
it was actually kinda painful to watch myself, biden seemed like he could barely even speak. the stutter wasn’t the issue, it was how he spoke at a whisper for the whole thing. it was how slow his body language was. it’s how he looks a decade older than trump w/ only a 4 year difference.
trump is a bullshitter, and while biden can keep up sentence by sentence that’s not how the guy wins. it should be simple to call his bluff, refocusing when he flips the topic & baiting him where possible. i don’t think biden lacked the drive to do so, it seemed like he lacked the energy to play hardball like that. like he could only go sentence for sentence, playing defense.
i know the bar’s on the floor here but it really seems like something’s wrong. even in 2020 he could at least make trump look like an ass (more than normal) too. it’s not the speech impediment, and fucking hell I just can’t see a real silver lining here
It's because incumbents get a very large advantage in elections. That's basically it. Biden is the most likely Democrat to win simply because of his last 4 years in office.
My personal favourite was a question about US citizens and drug addiction rehabilitation. Trump spiraled off talking about human trafficking and immigration and other alt-right talking points, and Biden mumbled about "fentanol boxes" for 60 seconds
One of the historical issue with socialism/communism is that most attempts at reaching it were met with great violence from outside forces, with coups and death squads and all. Such that we now only think about the USSR or Mao's China when we think of communism, when there were also democratic and constitutional attempts, like in Chile, or pretty peaceful attempts, like in 1918 Germany or the Paris Commune.
I think they're reason enough to not equate communism with authoritarianism, since it doesn't also engage with any political goals and just depends on a generalization, Marx was a big fan of the democratic process and not a big fan of centralizing all powers under an all-encompassing state.
At least I think you're not gonna find an end to exploitation and oppression as long as you have a state or a capitalist mode of production in general, the alternative isn't to be a tankie
Genuinely what do you think communists could do? Save a magical mass opinion shift how would they make their views palettable to the average American. Progress is progressive. Things in politics happen slowly. That's why we have to fight the long game, not daydream about a revolution that will never happen.
I really don't understand how Biden got the nomination even last time, let alone this time. Who the fuck likes this guy? Man I wanted Big Booty Buttigieg but apparently he's "fake" whatever that means.
it’s super worrying to see how biden is moving through this debate. i know that if i was a moderate just the difference in surface level coherency would make me vote trump. on the other hand, trumps lying out of his ass about after birth abortions and bidens barely calling him out
This debate absolutely is terrible PR for Biden but Trump isn't coming off like a saint either.
To anyone with any sense it's an obvious fascist spewing nonsense and nazi rhetoric with the word Jew replaced with the word Immigrant, talking to a very old, tired, and not very politically savvy man.
We just have to hope that at least alittle over half the country has sense.
But even than things like the Dobbs decision make it look good for biden.
Man if only the Democrats had fucking let bernie win the primary in 2016
My biggest concern is the people who aren't necessarily tankies but will fall for tankie rhetoric and choose not to vote because that sounds like a better option than choosing the senile mumbling or the Nazis who will do everything in their power to take their ability to vote away
Like I get why they'd do that, but oh my god if trump becomes president we will all suffer, while if Biden gets elected it'll just be a little boring
Got banned from a communist sub for saying voting for Biden is the only choice. Marx and Engels clearly told is to form wide coalitions where possible and when possible.
During the Weimar republic the Communists refused to work with the Social Democrats, and that allowed the Naz#@ to advance bit by bit. (Yes, the Social Democrats crushed the 1919 revolution and killed Rosa Luxemburg, but sometimes you have to compromise to stopped the worst people from gaining power.)
Online communists are most of the time a joke.
Honestly almost every election in American and Europe recently gives me extreme KPD vs SPD vibes and its extremely frustrating because we quite literally went trough this before.
My question to "voting doesn't matter fuck the system" people is how come, without fail, the people that gain the most from you not voting, are fascists?
Fascists **always vote**, without fail, and there's not enough support/solidarity from the general public for revolution or anything like that so not voting is one of the worst things one that's an antifascist can do.
I got permanently banned from WorkersStrikeBack because I said how voting third party or not voting only helps fascists this election. We need ranked choice voting in place before a third party becomes viable because of this two party bullshit that's been established in our country. It's frustrating but that's the system we have and the alternative is societal collapse with millions of unnecessary deaths. I feel like ripping my hair out trying to get through to these apathetic people
Please eligible voters, I'm not a fan of Biden but if we don't keep Trump out of office we are fucked. Especially minorities like POC and LGBTQ. It's Mr. Mumbles or the loss of our freedom, democracy, and for many their lives. I don't like it but that's where we are.
I'm not American so please bear with me but it seems like you don't have a two party system, you have a two presidential candidate system. Which from the outside looks kind of weird. If you think of the election involved voting for a whole party of politicians, each competent in their own area, does that make it easier? Or is the president really that powerful? Because that doesn't seem very democratic at all?
>If you think of the election involved voting for a whole party of politicians, each competent in their own area, does that make it easier?
Not sure what you mean by "make it easier" but it's assumed that if you're voting for the Democratic presidential candidate that you'd also vote for the other Democrats on the ballot. It's not just the president that we vote for, it's also members of Congress and local politicians as well.
>Or is the president really that powerful? Because that doesn't seem very democratic at all?
I feel like I'm not understanding your question tbh, the president is indeed powerful as head of the executive branch but he's not a dictator. Although the power that is there as president coupled with a judicial branch already compromised and a legislative branch overtaken by blood thirsty sycophants could very easily turn it into a dictatorship. Which is why it's so important to vote for Biden (as well as voting for the other Democratic candidates over the Republican candidates down the ballot as well).
Think the oddest part for me was listening to my father who is an immigrant, but has a bit of right-leaning grow irritated with Trump repeating talking points. Biden being an ancient fossil is expected, but Trump's whole stick is also not as appealing especially if one doesn't click with it. Think the closet anger I can compare it to is to a soccer (futbol in his own words) and yelling about the dumbest plays, but even more enraged by Trump's repetition and not actually answering the questions.
There are SO many who let perfection shit in the mouth of progress. Biden might not get everything or even most things done, but it’s infinitely better than the absolute shit blasting that everyone but the rich will get from Trump. Honestly horrific optics for the Biden admin doing this debate, but there is an obvious better choice, even if he looks like a nursing home puppet.
I think Carter would have sounded more alive
But I'm also refusing to overreact to a debate held in *June* featuring candidates most people already have a set opinion on. That being said, if the DNC wants to replace Biden with Gretchen Whitmer, I would be quite ecstatic
I honestly just feel bad for the guy at this point, bro should be in a nursing home living out his final years in peace and instead he's been shoved up by his party to be the only thing preventing the richest country in the world from completely falling to fascism
Yes, that’s true. He isn’t blameless. But through the whole Trump presidency, the media propped him up as a potential candidate. The Dems just needed someone who they could count on to beat Trump in 2020, and he was the guy. And when he announced his campaign he literally said he did it out of a sense of duty. So while in the end it was his decision, in reality it’s really not so simple, and I can only imagine he felt an enormous amount of pressure to run, like the whole country was counting on him. So I really don’t feel like it’s fair to put the blame entirely or even primarily on him. I mostly blame the Democratic Party for putting their next eight years of eggs in the basket of a 78-year-old man
I doubt there’s that many people that are undecided at this point anyway, so I don’t care that much. Better to have a bloated corpse as a president than a conservative.
Im watching the debate... We're so cooked.. They're both idiots but biden just talked about trillionaires. Dems didnt give him ennough drugs to not get numbers wrong by a factor of 1000.
we're cooked.
"our guy" is melting,
idk I think he probably will, he's old but doesn't have any illnesses or other physical health issues, and even if he developed something he has access to the best medical care in the world
hey everyone I feel it is important to inform you all that [biden is a stutterer](https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/frontline/article/bidens-stutter-how-a-childhood-battle-shaped-his-approach-to-life-and-politics/) and one of the tactics they teach you in order to not stutter is to speak SLOWLY and more carefully
I know it’s “haha funny old man” but like there’s an actual reason for the way he speaks
come on, that is clearly not what happened here. it's not that he spoke slowly, he spaced out for seconds on end and couldn't form coherent sentences.
this is an issue that you're not gonna change by convincing people that biden's brain isn't fucking cooked, because it is. it's about the circumstances that led to these two being your only options
i mean no disrespect to your country, but this was pathetic to see
Same, my stutter can be frustrating at times. Sometimes I get stuck in a stutter loop, where I have to stop for a moment, rethink what I'm going to say, and begin again.
People don't realize that if you have a stutter, it requires you to put in additional effort when you're talking. Normally speaking should come naturally as talking, but if you have a stutter, imagine if you had to put in effort when breathing.
Also if you have other speech impediments like a lisp or a slur, two additional conditions I have, it can make talking clearly really hard. Sometimes you have to repeat a lot of stuff again because nobody understood what you just said
While that is true, just listen to him talking in the last election cycle. It was not nearly this bad. Clearly it’s not all the stutter, he had that 4 years ago too.
[he didn’t stutter in 2008](https://youtu.be/XAOOv4wvT7Y?si=ZSn4UGZAiVyHefXn) he seems I dunno- lucid? There is no stuttering, speaking slowly, or like seconds of buffering.
It’s kinda funny that Joe Biden is only a stutterer once he’s an ancient mummy and his brain is melting out of his head. The media is very eager to cover for him.
Thats funny because you can actually find plenty of his speeches going back decades, and he never sounded like that even during Obama's term. It's almost like he's incredibly old or something, weird
Didn’t watch the debate as I don’t want to listen to two geriatrics argue about golf so what were the major points brought up and who would you say has more traction
I didn’t watch the whole thing but it essentially boils down to Biden making solid points but not talking all that well and trump confidently spouting bold-faced lies over and over again (for example he claimed that under roe v wade there were supposedly people killing children after they were born and calling them abortions which just is not true whatsoever)
what's funny is trump challenged biden to a game of golf because apparently he's (trump) really good at golf or something and that would prove who's more capable. and biden accepted and was notably smiling/laughing during trump's segment.
sorry, the trolley doesn't have any tracks without people on them this time. all you can do now is pick the track with less people on it and remember this feeling next time the primaries roll around.
only 50% of 18-29s voted in 2020... 11% higher than usual.
not even half the people who voted in the general vote in the primary, and I bet youth turnout is even worse for primaries than it is in the general... but that's where we could've chosen someone else.
“‘That's the real issue this time,’ he said. ‘Beating Nixon. It's hard to even guess how much damage those bastards will do if they get in for another four years.’
The argument was familiar. I had even made it myself, here and there, but I was beginning to sense something very depressing about it. How many more of these goddamn elections are we going to have to write off as lame, but ‘regrettably necessary’ holding actions? And how many more of these stinking double-downer sideshows will we have to go through before we can get ourselves straight enough to put together some kind of national election that will give me and the at least 20 million people I tend to agree with a chance to vote for something, instead of always being faced with that old familiar choice between the lesser of two evils?
Now with another one of these big bogus showdowns looming down on us, I can already pick up the stench of another bummer. I understand, along with a lot of other people, that the big thing this year is Beating Nixon. But that was also the big thing, as I recall, twelve years ago in 1960—and as far as I can tell, we’ve gone from bad to worse to rotten since then, and the outlook is for more of the same.”
—Hunter S. Thompson, 1972
We are not going to die. Remember Trump is 2 years younger than biden and his health is also failing. The likelyhood of him winning has also declined after being found guilty. Things may seem scary but they are far from hopeless and its important to remember that now more than ever
Yes im fully aware of project 2025 but its largely red meat for his followers. It would require a total republican victory to pull off which is near impossible. Doesnt mean you shouldnt vote though
In what sane world is someone like trump even ELIGIBLE to run as president again?
Did everyone forget he told people to DRINK BLEACH because it was the cure to Covid? Was January 6th not a wake up call to how insane his party is? How is him now being a literal CONVICTED FELON not enough to disqualify him? Is Project 2025 not the literal nail in the coffin to guarantee that any psycho attached to that document should be seen as a genuine fucking traitor to America? How much horrible shit has his entire party done that so many people have genuinely just become numb to it all because the pile of garbage has become an endless landfill?
It’s complete insanity, I can’t reasonably look at the people who vote for him like they’re an actual human being. They’re a threat to everyone else’s safety & I have to avoid them because I’m scared they’ll hurt me when given an excuse to.
Thank fucking god a bunch of people within the Democratic party are calling for Joe to step down, literally any other politician would have been able to cook Trump tonight with how much BS he was spewing. Basically everyone thinks Trump is dangerous and a bad pick for the presidency if the Dems put literally anyone else up it will be an easy clap I guarantee it.
Biden is a poopy pants and Trump is a Liar Liar pants on fire. Put them in a ring together WWE style to see who becomes president. Our country is fucked either way.
what if instead of the presidential debate it was a freakiential debate and instead of talking about politics they explored each others bodies
https://preview.redd.it/4aw6pv67u79d1.jpeg?width=640&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b51b3e7eec17d7f11f1918c4f6ac322b3709bda2
Why do you have this
bcus\_y\_not
BostonDynamicSexBot
https://preview.redd.it/egs5kmx9989d1.jpeg?width=420&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=6026b5572ce25980a90902e94180daaf37d86024
Actually lemme not be a hater
Character growth
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MtwaFpoVS8M](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MtwaFpoVS8M)
biden big naturals
I think this image has singlehandedly made my day worse
jorkin it, and by it i mean hello my fellow Americans
Straight up jorkin my fellow Americans rn frfr
https://preview.redd.it/0k7u4hnl7a9d1.jpeg?width=1284&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=5304751cbfedfa2669bae6efc2a600e4c244c337
Politics but political (it has women in it)
Why are Bidens tits so ginormous???? Absolute BOULDERS (not to objectify her or anything. I respect all women).
https://preview.redd.it/7tozb7i2h89d1.jpeg?width=109&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=bafb72395ff034ba0691a24b2c270b54a6c6bce5
Absolutely cursed. Where is this from?
@McLinskeyArt, but this appears to be from 2020 and their accounts seem deactivated since then.
https://preview.redd.it/9at17q036e9d1.jpeg?width=1125&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=9bb061819439bec818e63dd0e48de20733dc90b4
https://preview.redd.it/9rafolud0a9d1.jpeg?width=195&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=ba4cefc64bd45169255712a98536b2982b260333
https://preview.redd.it/5navedhrf99d1.jpeg?width=480&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=47d69011eb49813b3d3b97d08a08061b47f2bd91
https://preview.redd.it/t5c1ds7jna9d1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e3e1feb132f31364ad08e446a71119a54445834f
Malarkey!
Actually delete this
Would.
Somehow reminds me of the "Biden vs Trump vs Obama" comic
👀👀👀 BOOBIES?!?!
BOOBIES!!!!
https://preview.redd.it/hyz59q9teb9d1.png?width=639&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d884096ebd19b246fd7bcd34668b54009d4408ea
I don't know what everyone's on about, I've been staring at this image for 5 minutes now.
Danielle vs Josephine
I'm gonna save it. You know, for the même, not because I now ship them into a Yuri ennemies-to-lovers trope
Smash
this would make politics infinitely more based
I can't think of a valid reason not to jerk off to this
Politics if they were fucking awesome
I’m not proud of the nut I nutted
Cover them in mayonnaise for added effect
Mayonnaise is the sauce of the aristocrats
The Yard viewer spotted
can we turn this comment section into a chat about the debate
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you got the wrong user name I think cause facts
God John Stewart was so fucking right and liberals got so mad at him for pointing out that Biden does *not* have the mental capacity left for this.
He might die in office
God please don't let Kamala Harris be the first woman president, she's like an even more unlikable Ellen DeGeneres 😭🙏
I deadass wish she'd swap spots with Biden right fucking now
She’s still better than Hillary would’ve been tbh even though she’s a fucking cop
See, this is how people felt about the incoming-Mexican president. She’s our first woman president, but she’s also playing into AMLO’s dissolution of government safeguards
So might Trump, but with different causes
Jon doesn't understand basic political strategy. If he keeps yelling about Biden's mental state, that'll dissuade people from voting blue and we'll have a fascist in the White House. The game plan at this point is for Biden to win and step down in a year or so, passing the reigns to Harris. She's not particularly charismatic but she'll be a decent president. I'd rather have a bland ex-junior-senator president than a fucking dictatorship.
How about the blues realize they need an actual candidate against Trump who isn't 5000 years old with speech impediments? Don't get me wrong, if I were American I'd still vote blue because it would only take one day from my life, but this "vote blue no matter who" tactic shouldn't shield the democratic party from all critique because it "dissuades" people from voting for them. You know what actually dissuades people? Their candidates. We're at a point where the establishment parties worldwide think that just because their main opposition is made out of fascist loonies they can do anything they want with no consequences because the alternative is worse (which is correct, but I hope you see where this leads).
>We're at a point where the establishment parties worldwide think that just because their main opposition is made out of fascist loonies they can do anything they want with no consequences because the alternative is worse (which is correct, but I hope you see where this leads). I don't think that's exactly right. Biden most likely got chosen because he's a safe choice between the more popular candidates and make Republicans vote for him. 2020 was a different time lol
Which tells me they learned nothing from Trump getting elected. People don't want the safe choice
Right, but I think that criticism is more pertinent after beating Trump, not before. Anything that could dissuade voters from voting for Biden at this point is only helping Trump.
That might have been true before, but tonight put a larger spotlight on Biden's mental faculties than Jon ever could
Exactly. Did the vote blue no matter who crowd think that if they just stomped out all criticism about Biden's mental well-being, people would never notice?
HUH? I would like to see a source, because that's wild.
They said that Biden will be a one term president, and step down for this election. Give you five guesses how that worked out.
Political strategy is never criticizing the geriatric pro-genocide dipshit president, because the other geriatric pro-genocide dipshit president is somehow much worse? Sounds like shit
This is the weird way of thinking I've been seeing for the last 4 years. This idea that it's not democrats or the president's responsibility to persuade anyone to vote for them, but instead it's the people's responsibility to silence any criticism and just hope that voters don't realize how glaringly obviously shit they are. And then they act all shocked when they lose a bunch of undecided voters and swing states who never took the "vote blue no matter who" pledge. Last nights debate was the logical result of this thinking. People were always eventually gonna notice that Biden isn't mentally fit for this. All the "vote blue no matter who" crowd have done is kick the can so far down the road that it's too late for another candidate to start campaigning, and we just have to pray that we don't get another 4 years of fascism because the dems decided the to run the worst candidate imaginable. People who criticize Biden don't want Donald Trump to win, they want him to lose and they don't think geriatric old man on deaths door is a good last line of defense against fascism.
Mixing up pursued with persuade is one my favorite typos I've ever seen because of how understandable it is. Like... damn. The letters do match up perfectly with the phonemes.
We've all been saying this shit for over a year now and every time it was brought up Libs shouted us down and people in this sub have been extremely militant against any criticisms. I can't say this outcome is surprising whatsoever since Libs have clearly been fumbling so fucking hard when *everything is in their favor*. This election should be an easy clap. At least this is somewhat of a wake up call, finally, since Libs have had cotton in their ears for months.
And then they’re going to decide the solution is to stuff more cotton.
You say libs a lot
You seem defensive
I'm gonna be honest, Biden wasn't at his absolute best, but at least he could stay on topic most of the time. He still brought out statistics, and he managed to answer the questions with solid points. At one point they gave Trump 3 or 4 opportunities in a row to answer a simple yes or no question, and he used every single opportunity to rant about whatever he had on his mind Edit: To expand on what I mean, it doesn't really feel like he's confused or anything. He misunderstood a question at one point, but he was very clearly listening to the questions and Trump's responses and responding accordingly. It really just sounds like he's having trouble putting thoughts to words, doesn't he have a stutter that he's struggled with since school? My man isn't lost at all, it just takes him a second to speak
it was actually kinda painful to watch myself, biden seemed like he could barely even speak. the stutter wasn’t the issue, it was how he spoke at a whisper for the whole thing. it was how slow his body language was. it’s how he looks a decade older than trump w/ only a 4 year difference. trump is a bullshitter, and while biden can keep up sentence by sentence that’s not how the guy wins. it should be simple to call his bluff, refocusing when he flips the topic & baiting him where possible. i don’t think biden lacked the drive to do so, it seemed like he lacked the energy to play hardball like that. like he could only go sentence for sentence, playing defense. i know the bar’s on the floor here but it really seems like something’s wrong. even in 2020 he could at least make trump look like an ass (more than normal) too. it’s not the speech impediment, and fucking hell I just can’t see a real silver lining here
We're doomed :(
hehe i'm going to fucking die :3
It's because incumbents get a very large advantage in elections. That's basically it. Biden is the most likely Democrat to win simply because of his last 4 years in office.
My personal favourite was a question about US citizens and drug addiction rehabilitation. Trump spiraled off talking about human trafficking and immigration and other alt-right talking points, and Biden mumbled about "fentanol boxes" for 60 seconds
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Communists would simply overthrow the government and establish a one party dictatorship. You know, like they always do.
Socialists or even social democrats, then.
Social democrats def.
One of the historical issue with socialism/communism is that most attempts at reaching it were met with great violence from outside forces, with coups and death squads and all. Such that we now only think about the USSR or Mao's China when we think of communism, when there were also democratic and constitutional attempts, like in Chile, or pretty peaceful attempts, like in 1918 Germany or the Paris Commune. I think they're reason enough to not equate communism with authoritarianism, since it doesn't also engage with any political goals and just depends on a generalization, Marx was a big fan of the democratic process and not a big fan of centralizing all powers under an all-encompassing state. At least I think you're not gonna find an end to exploitation and oppression as long as you have a state or a capitalist mode of production in general, the alternative isn't to be a tankie
That's not communists.
Genuinely what do you think communists could do? Save a magical mass opinion shift how would they make their views palettable to the average American. Progress is progressive. Things in politics happen slowly. That's why we have to fight the long game, not daydream about a revolution that will never happen.
I really don't understand how Biden got the nomination even last time, let alone this time. Who the fuck likes this guy? Man I wanted Big Booty Buttigieg but apparently he's "fake" whatever that means.
Biden is a centrist that appeases the institution and he was VP under Obama so he is more appealing to minorities, at least in theory.
The controlled opposition is what this is :/
good idea
it’s super worrying to see how biden is moving through this debate. i know that if i was a moderate just the difference in surface level coherency would make me vote trump. on the other hand, trumps lying out of his ass about after birth abortions and bidens barely calling him out
This debate absolutely is terrible PR for Biden but Trump isn't coming off like a saint either. To anyone with any sense it's an obvious fascist spewing nonsense and nazi rhetoric with the word Jew replaced with the word Immigrant, talking to a very old, tired, and not very politically savvy man. We just have to hope that at least alittle over half the country has sense. But even than things like the Dobbs decision make it look good for biden. Man if only the Democrats had fucking let bernie win the primary in 2016
My biggest concern is the people who aren't necessarily tankies but will fall for tankie rhetoric and choose not to vote because that sounds like a better option than choosing the senile mumbling or the Nazis who will do everything in their power to take their ability to vote away Like I get why they'd do that, but oh my god if trump becomes president we will all suffer, while if Biden gets elected it'll just be a little boring
Got banned from a communist sub for saying voting for Biden is the only choice. Marx and Engels clearly told is to form wide coalitions where possible and when possible. During the Weimar republic the Communists refused to work with the Social Democrats, and that allowed the Naz#@ to advance bit by bit. (Yes, the Social Democrats crushed the 1919 revolution and killed Rosa Luxemburg, but sometimes you have to compromise to stopped the worst people from gaining power.) Online communists are most of the time a joke.
Honestly almost every election in American and Europe recently gives me extreme KPD vs SPD vibes and its extremely frustrating because we quite literally went trough this before. My question to "voting doesn't matter fuck the system" people is how come, without fail, the people that gain the most from you not voting, are fascists? Fascists **always vote**, without fail, and there's not enough support/solidarity from the general public for revolution or anything like that so not voting is one of the worst things one that's an antifascist can do.
I got permanently banned from WorkersStrikeBack because I said how voting third party or not voting only helps fascists this election. We need ranked choice voting in place before a third party becomes viable because of this two party bullshit that's been established in our country. It's frustrating but that's the system we have and the alternative is societal collapse with millions of unnecessary deaths. I feel like ripping my hair out trying to get through to these apathetic people Please eligible voters, I'm not a fan of Biden but if we don't keep Trump out of office we are fucked. Especially minorities like POC and LGBTQ. It's Mr. Mumbles or the loss of our freedom, democracy, and for many their lives. I don't like it but that's where we are.
I'm not American so please bear with me but it seems like you don't have a two party system, you have a two presidential candidate system. Which from the outside looks kind of weird. If you think of the election involved voting for a whole party of politicians, each competent in their own area, does that make it easier? Or is the president really that powerful? Because that doesn't seem very democratic at all?
>If you think of the election involved voting for a whole party of politicians, each competent in their own area, does that make it easier? Not sure what you mean by "make it easier" but it's assumed that if you're voting for the Democratic presidential candidate that you'd also vote for the other Democrats on the ballot. It's not just the president that we vote for, it's also members of Congress and local politicians as well. >Or is the president really that powerful? Because that doesn't seem very democratic at all? I feel like I'm not understanding your question tbh, the president is indeed powerful as head of the executive branch but he's not a dictator. Although the power that is there as president coupled with a judicial branch already compromised and a legislative branch overtaken by blood thirsty sycophants could very easily turn it into a dictatorship. Which is why it's so important to vote for Biden (as well as voting for the other Democratic candidates over the Republican candidates down the ballot as well).
Think the oddest part for me was listening to my father who is an immigrant, but has a bit of right-leaning grow irritated with Trump repeating talking points. Biden being an ancient fossil is expected, but Trump's whole stick is also not as appealing especially if one doesn't click with it. Think the closet anger I can compare it to is to a soccer (futbol in his own words) and yelling about the dumbest plays, but even more enraged by Trump's repetition and not actually answering the questions.
There are SO many who let perfection shit in the mouth of progress. Biden might not get everything or even most things done, but it’s infinitely better than the absolute shit blasting that everyone but the rich will get from Trump. Honestly horrific optics for the Biden admin doing this debate, but there is an obvious better choice, even if he looks like a nursing home puppet.
The number of people that fall for the nirvana fallacy is staggering
That's *actually* your biggest concern? What kind if influence do you think tankies in the US have lmao
thanks for this, it makes me a lot more hopeful
JUST KIDDING, I HAVE A SUPER BOMB AND WILL KILL EVERYONE HHAHAHHAHHAHHEFHWPEIPF
Having rights for like 9 years was fun ig, too bad we're gonna lose them now 🤷
If you close your eyes he sounds like current day Jimmy Carter 😭 dude needed to retire
I think Carter would have sounded more alive But I'm also refusing to overreact to a debate held in *June* featuring candidates most people already have a set opinion on. That being said, if the DNC wants to replace Biden with Gretchen Whitmer, I would be quite ecstatic
look biden couldve been a lot better but trump straight up did not answer shit he kept avoiding the questions
I honestly just feel bad for the guy at this point, bro should be in a nursing home living out his final years in peace and instead he's been shoved up by his party to be the only thing preventing the richest country in the world from completely falling to fascism
He was the one who decided to run four years ago...
Yes, that’s true. He isn’t blameless. But through the whole Trump presidency, the media propped him up as a potential candidate. The Dems just needed someone who they could count on to beat Trump in 2020, and he was the guy. And when he announced his campaign he literally said he did it out of a sense of duty. So while in the end it was his decision, in reality it’s really not so simple, and I can only imagine he felt an enormous amount of pressure to run, like the whole country was counting on him. So I really don’t feel like it’s fair to put the blame entirely or even primarily on him. I mostly blame the Democratic Party for putting their next eight years of eggs in the basket of a 78-year-old man
Wtf is an after birth abortion? Is it straight up adrenochrome blood libel?
trump said that abortions happen all the time, through all 9 months and after birth in the democrat cities
It’s like Biden is begging for project 2025 to happen. Haha I’m so gonna lose access to HRT in a few months…..
I doubt there’s that many people that are undecided at this point anyway, so I don’t care that much. Better to have a bloated corpse as a president than a conservative.
ok
I wish there was a counter in the corner of the screen that tallied how many times trump said “Billion”
https://preview.redd.it/3u7r8c5t489d1.jpeg?width=750&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=704501cc56732f71a24c7ba71614c86300ce89b5
Ehehege looks like he's got A Splitting Headache Ehehehhehe
GET OFF THE STAGE! https://preview.redd.it/4nlekt572a9d1.jpeg?width=718&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c4890e021b9ff8b62e42fa9551bf96252383866d
https://preview.redd.it/2j14rji82a9d1.jpeg?width=679&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=954bce27d3644f5e9a154e8a8b81ce7431ca49b8
https://preview.redd.it/giua99c92a9d1.jpeg?width=899&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=77e251742c3b269976e85b3849810295e57c9370
https://preview.redd.it/6vdcdnca2a9d1.jpeg?width=896&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=2ab0410b8e6add444bc29ff8ea7186a4fa31ac20
\*opens wide* tamater
Im watching the debate... We're so cooked.. They're both idiots but biden just talked about trillionaires. Dems didnt give him ennough drugs to not get numbers wrong by a factor of 1000. we're cooked. "our guy" is melting,
I stopped watching when Biden just spaced out for like 5 whole seconds. There is no fucking way that dude is going to live another four years.
idk I think he probably will, he's old but doesn't have any illnesses or other physical health issues, and even if he developed something he has access to the best medical care in the world
I guess at this point we are just hoping for both of them to die?
Yeah.. Old men that are just trojan horses for younger VPs apparently..
god im still gonna vote for biden but i really really dont want kamala harris to be president
The bar has been set so low I much prefer just grabbing any random person from jail to put in the White House.
If that would happen trump could pull a pro gamer move
Unless it’s a different part of the debate he literally corrected himself within seconds saying he meant billionaires instead of trillionaires
Why does everyone keep saying cooked. It’s trending on twitter
Cause we're cooked XD
google slang
He should have said gazillionaires
That would have been based.
hey everyone I feel it is important to inform you all that [biden is a stutterer](https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/frontline/article/bidens-stutter-how-a-childhood-battle-shaped-his-approach-to-life-and-politics/) and one of the tactics they teach you in order to not stutter is to speak SLOWLY and more carefully I know it’s “haha funny old man” but like there’s an actual reason for the way he speaks
come on, that is clearly not what happened here. it's not that he spoke slowly, he spaced out for seconds on end and couldn't form coherent sentences. this is an issue that you're not gonna change by convincing people that biden's brain isn't fucking cooked, because it is. it's about the circumstances that led to these two being your only options i mean no disrespect to your country, but this was pathetic to see
True, I stutter a fuck ton and sometimes I’ll just sit there with this word I’m trying to say stuck in my throat for a few seconds. I fucking hate it
Same, my stutter can be frustrating at times. Sometimes I get stuck in a stutter loop, where I have to stop for a moment, rethink what I'm going to say, and begin again. People don't realize that if you have a stutter, it requires you to put in additional effort when you're talking. Normally speaking should come naturally as talking, but if you have a stutter, imagine if you had to put in effort when breathing.
Also if you have other speech impediments like a lisp or a slur, two additional conditions I have, it can make talking clearly really hard. Sometimes you have to repeat a lot of stuff again because nobody understood what you just said
I slur my words some and have had to repeat myself but I guess I’m lucky it’s never been a huge problem, the stutter is the big one for me
TIL
While that is true, just listen to him talking in the last election cycle. It was not nearly this bad. Clearly it’s not all the stutter, he had that 4 years ago too.
[he didn’t stutter in 2008](https://youtu.be/XAOOv4wvT7Y?si=ZSn4UGZAiVyHefXn) he seems I dunno- lucid? There is no stuttering, speaking slowly, or like seconds of buffering. It’s kinda funny that Joe Biden is only a stutterer once he’s an ancient mummy and his brain is melting out of his head. The media is very eager to cover for him.
It gets worse with age. It takes more mental energy to keep from doing so, which diminishes with age. But also, yes, he's also way too old
He doesnt speak slowly though
Thats funny because you can actually find plenty of his speeches going back decades, and he never sounded like that even during Obama's term. It's almost like he's incredibly old or something, weird
As soon as biden spoke I was like "get this man a glass of water"
a glass of cocaine might work
They forgot to give him the mysterious orange drink (Yikes!)
Ice cream
Didn’t watch the debate as I don’t want to listen to two geriatrics argue about golf so what were the major points brought up and who would you say has more traction
I didn’t watch the whole thing but it essentially boils down to Biden making solid points but not talking all that well and trump confidently spouting bold-faced lies over and over again (for example he claimed that under roe v wade there were supposedly people killing children after they were born and calling them abortions which just is not true whatsoever)
Trump lying his ass off and Biden trying and failing to call him on it.
nah he called him on it once or twice, which isn't enough but if i was 80 idve just given up too
what's funny is trump challenged biden to a game of golf because apparently he's (trump) really good at golf or something and that would prove who's more capable. and biden accepted and was notably smiling/laughing during trump's segment.
[удалено]
sorry, the trolley doesn't have any tracks without people on them this time. all you can do now is pick the track with less people on it and remember this feeling next time the primaries roll around. only 50% of 18-29s voted in 2020... 11% higher than usual. not even half the people who voted in the general vote in the primary, and I bet youth turnout is even worse for primaries than it is in the general... but that's where we could've chosen someone else.
“‘That's the real issue this time,’ he said. ‘Beating Nixon. It's hard to even guess how much damage those bastards will do if they get in for another four years.’ The argument was familiar. I had even made it myself, here and there, but I was beginning to sense something very depressing about it. How many more of these goddamn elections are we going to have to write off as lame, but ‘regrettably necessary’ holding actions? And how many more of these stinking double-downer sideshows will we have to go through before we can get ourselves straight enough to put together some kind of national election that will give me and the at least 20 million people I tend to agree with a chance to vote for something, instead of always being faced with that old familiar choice between the lesser of two evils? Now with another one of these big bogus showdowns looming down on us, I can already pick up the stench of another bummer. I understand, along with a lot of other people, that the big thing this year is Beating Nixon. But that was also the big thing, as I recall, twelve years ago in 1960—and as far as I can tell, we’ve gone from bad to worse to rotten since then, and the outlook is for more of the same.” —Hunter S. Thompson, 1972
Democrats are controlled opposition, there to placate us with the hope of some table scraps from the rich to keep us from rebelling
damn I thought the second paragraph was something written today until I saw Nixon mentioned again in the third paragraph
Stop joking about this, trump is going to win and then we're all going to die. So depressed I can't even think rn
That's not guaranteed, and even if he does win, we're not gonna die. It might suck, but we can fight like all hell.
i mean... some of us are going to die. probably not me, and probably not you, but people will die from trump winning.
We are not going to die. Remember Trump is 2 years younger than biden and his health is also failing. The likelyhood of him winning has also declined after being found guilty. Things may seem scary but they are far from hopeless and its important to remember that now more than ever
Do you know what project 2025 is?
Yes im fully aware of project 2025 but its largely red meat for his followers. It would require a total republican victory to pull off which is near impossible. Doesnt mean you shouldnt vote though
the debat.
In what sane world is someone like trump even ELIGIBLE to run as president again? Did everyone forget he told people to DRINK BLEACH because it was the cure to Covid? Was January 6th not a wake up call to how insane his party is? How is him now being a literal CONVICTED FELON not enough to disqualify him? Is Project 2025 not the literal nail in the coffin to guarantee that any psycho attached to that document should be seen as a genuine fucking traitor to America? How much horrible shit has his entire party done that so many people have genuinely just become numb to it all because the pile of garbage has become an endless landfill? It’s complete insanity, I can’t reasonably look at the people who vote for him like they’re an actual human being. They’re a threat to everyone else’s safety & I have to avoid them because I’m scared they’ll hurt me when given an excuse to.
How scared and anxious should I be?
People will say i'm "fearmongering" but fuck it. If you're trans, or care about lgbt rights, you should be afraid.
Incorrect. If you're trans you should arm yourself. We're going to make it :) you deserve to live and you will
I really hope so. I still have hope even if i'm afraid for the future.
Yeah, fuck it. Second American Civil War. Democracy has failed America, it needs a hard reset if it wants to continue with the support of the people.
do you want America to stop being democratic?
an unarmed populace is easier to oppress. get the shit you need before November.
Or if you're Ukrainian)))))))) I hate that we have to rely on the US so much, god fucking damn it I hate it so much
*sad British noises*
not at all. Hang out with your friends or go play video games or something
Thank fucking god a bunch of people within the Democratic party are calling for Joe to step down, literally any other politician would have been able to cook Trump tonight with how much BS he was spewing. Basically everyone thinks Trump is dangerous and a bad pick for the presidency if the Dems put literally anyone else up it will be an easy clap I guarantee it.
We could dig up Teddy Roosevelt's corpse to run for president and he'd beat Trump by at least 4 points in the popular vote.
Biden is a poopy pants and Trump is a Liar Liar pants on fire. Put them in a ring together WWE style to see who becomes president. Our country is fucked either way.
i am ready to die haha wheeeeee everything is so fun here rn
So like it's Joever right?
Why are they both so squinty?
They’re ancient and saggy
what does this even mean
That trump isn’t mewing and Brandon is a soy boy as presented by his wojack
Mfw they gave him the coughing meds instead of adderal
Debate, debate, if you think about it that's a funny word
USA bros... we're cooked
Best case scenario: They both die campaigning.
haha i am not feeling good about this
Wasnt everyone saying biden would serve 4 years and then another candidate would step up back in 2020
That was before the republicans’ hit list on human rights
Literally anybody else, why in the fuck is it still somehow Joe Biden?
https://preview.redd.it/08enp60dla9d1.png?width=153&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=1f1f53676a042fa331d0143ceac5c29f60c776ed
Biden looks like he’s about to die and Trump has a dent on the side of his fucking head😭
I'm trans and I'm scared.