4. Realize a few years in that a modest 6 figure salary job is enough to buy most of your wants snd anything extra doesn’t result in much more happiness. But lifestyle does, therefore you seek a remote individual contributor role and blend into the background.
Haha I started off wanting partner then I saw that basically all of the ones I knew were divorced or worked so much that they had live in nannies. Money is great but who gives a shit if you can't even see your own family.
I've gone this way, remote IC at 6 figures lol.
I used to think this way (if the they can do it I can do it) and if these people are happy doing that then hey more power to them!
But if you (in the general sense) realize that YOU would be unhappy being an accounting partner there is nothing wrong with saying it isn’t for you or that the juice isn’t worth the squeeze.
Also just to play devils advocate - the number of people in unhappy marriages who stay together for the kids or due to finances but put on a good front out in public is not insignificant.
Really? Pretty much every partner I worked with when I was at PwC was married with kids.
Hell, one of the older partners wives would make lunch for him every day.
The people in this sub exaggerate, or flat out lie about everything.
If anyone wants an accurate depiction of this career, Reddit is the last place you'll find it.
I was nervous about getting into this field because of what I read here. Turns out, it's not that bad. There are some rough days/weeks but it's manageable. Most coworkers are decent people and the same goes for Partners.
Accountants/Partners like anyone else can get divorced, I agree. I'm not arguing that any profession is divorce proof. Most partners get married/have kids when they become financially stable so they are less likely to get divorced. Financial problems are the leading cause of divorce in the US.
I just found it funny that this person said all the partners they knew were divorced and worked so much they needed nannies. Most of the male partners I know are married and their wives are stay-at-home moms. They also have good relationships with their children.
There is a sentiment in this sub that if you're successful, you sold your soul to get there. It's not true. Most partners I know average 50-55 hours a week (year-round) and are involved with their families.
I'm MCOL (with Big-4 presence) but maybe it's different in other areas/markets.
How old is that partner?
If older than 60, they still believed in marriage and committment.
Oh you mentionnes old wife...
I would be surprised If they were between 40 and 50 because those are at least a one time divorcé.
And in the future, I d be really surprised to see a wife bringing lunch to her husband. Our generation is too self centered and money orientated 😭😭😭
Yeah he was old like late 50"s, early 60's and this was over a decade ago. Was kinda cute to see him open his lunchbox and take out sandwiches his wife made him. He was a senior partner, easily making over a million a year, could be eating out every day, yet would eat his home made sandwiches.
Man it’s the opposite at my office, BIG4 but my office is a somewhat unique, smaller but very high revenue for its size office.
The partners all have beautiful families, they bring their kids to work sometimes like in the mornings before school starts so they can drop their kids off, their spouses also have good jobs like being Partners at other firms, CEO’s and shit
I talk to them a lot (I graduated at 30 so a little older and I just fit in better with like the senior managers)… They mostly seem to be living the dream, working a lot but they’ll all be retired by 60 and they all go on crazy vacations and shit
I know it’s not everywhere/every partner but man sometimes I wish I had it in me to get that far
This. The same is true in industry, with rare companies actually following through on work-life balance promises. You can build boundaries and, at a certain skill and income level, consciously choose between quality of life and pay. I'm in a small firm now, never in my life thought I'd go back into public and even considered letting my license lapse after talking to someone a Plante Moran who said their billable target was 2400/yr for managers while they try to advertise their QOL on their recruiting page.
I'm sick of the journal articles written by old white men wringing their hands about how they can't recruit and keep talent while changing literally nothing about the industry's work environment or culture.
>My goal is to make great money in this field
This is what op said. You're not listening or responding with the intention to serve OP, but to project your own philosophy and partially justify your own career decisions.
Op didn't imply "wanting enough", he wants to absolutely fucking kill it. Which you can do in accounting, but it won't come from a 9 to 5.
Can't help but notice none of the top replies have mentioned it but... You need the people skills, you need to be charismatic or personable to get to these senior roles.
9/10 times a company wont promote you to these positions just because you work hard and have great experience if you have the personality of a rock.
All good to work hard, but show you're a person too - (where appropriate) share stories, get involved in social events, have a chat with people, etc.
Hot take also - being in the office 3/4 days a week is your friend if your main concern is getting promoted. It's not popular, but it's the truth. Humans are social creatures, the face to face interaction is very important and can't be replaced by a screen.
Fat part is optional but drinking, golfing and making the right connections is the fastest way to move up. When I was younger I got a promotion over two harder working, smarter peers. The only reason was I golfed with the decision maker and we would drink at the clubhouse after where he would make fun of the lack of social skills of those folks…
Make friends in high places is the way to move up.
That in office piece is so incredibly key, lots of statistics to back that up. When promotions are available, nobody thinks about a name on your Teams list, it's the person sitting across the hall in the other office.
This. I had always been extremely introverted and uncomfortable in social situations until I took a customer service position out of necessity after graduating college. That eventually turned into a sales job extending 10 years in total which completely changed my outward personality and comfort in social settings for the better.
I recently shifted gears to an analyst position in a finance role and believe I'll be be able to outshine my peers for promotions because of it, since most of them are introverts who didn't want to deal with people.
I lead a pretty large team and I think the key to success with my team is being genuine and charismatic. I talk to everyone on my team about their personal hobbies and whatever is going on in their life. Despite what people think, the best “people people” aren’t the ones that constantly talk, it’s more about asking the right questions and actively listening. The easiest way to get someone to like you is to talk about them.
Money isn’t everything. It’ll take a few years to come this realization, but for most, what it takes to make the big bucks in accounting isn’t worth the sacrifices. Make your 150k, never worry about money for the rest of your life and just chill with your friends and family. That’s what it’s about.
I just had that conversation with someone who is baffled I’m not staying in the big 4. They argue the 130,000 I’m making white which will be matched in industry “could be like 180,000 in a few years!”
Uh. If I work 40 hours a week and have time to relax,put aside the fact your hourly rate went up…: if you just don’t blow the money…. Compound interest will kick in …. And you’ll
Per year be making a fuck ton.
Could the person working 80 hours a week also be working a fuck ton and investing? Yeah. But honestly? When I’m overworked I spend more money on trying to find some amount of happiness
Yeah....everyone has their own priorities. Some prefer a less stressful/demanding work life and don't mind making less than they could elsewhere. It's a tradeoff,, no doubt.
This is the way.
Realized this at Deloitte on a Sunday and the partner was working with me... I'm aspiring to work 7 days a week? WTF am I doing!! LOL never looked back.
Seconding this. I was pushing for a senior role to make like 120k, but I saw seniors were in the office almost every day 8-8. On seeing this, I'm happy sticking with my 80k and playing runescape from my home office for most of the day.
It's not am exact 1:1 as to the original post, but in the same avenue of "why kill yourself for /slightly/ more money? The amount of additional work =/= the additional pay."
Fwiw, you say you don’t care about work/life balance now and having a family, but I said the same thing at 24. Partner or bust. I’m now almost 30 with a husband and baby on the way. I no longer want the partner track. Don’t feel like your goals can’t change as your personal life changes. Don’t feel like you can’t change your mind. And for god sakes don’t sacrifice your personal happiness just to make a lot of money. It’s really easy to say the goal is to make a ton of money, but I make 6 figures after 7 busy seasons and tbh it’s more than enough.
I still thought I wanted to be a partner until I was like 27. And then I woke up one day after clients were demanding comfort letters with 2 day turn arounds thinking “wtf am I doing.”
Still here, but definitely not sure for how much longer. Waiting out the economy at this point.
Yeah, I think for a lot of us, it takes that one “realization event” to make us rethink everything.
I think yours is a really good example. Eventually you realize how ridiculous it is that you’re sacrificing your life for client work.
And I feel you on the last part. Sometimes it’s better to wait it out and then jump (and I think we’re very fortunate in our line of work with being able to do that, with job security and all).
100000%. At this point I don’t care how much these people pay us, their ridiculous demands are not worth it. I’m perfectly content to hang out as a manager/sr manager for awhile until I know exactly what I want to do and know the economy can support the move. But the partner promotion grind? NOPE lol
I laughed at it too… even Controller candidates are a dime a dozen.
Good roles people stay in, bad ones people specialize in, you’re lucky with a mediocre one.
What does it take to reach that position? Also is there any way to make the range you mentioned without being in a leadership position? I know the average CPA salary in my state is 150k
An insane amount of hard work, luck, and sacrificing your social and family time for most if not all of your career. Without being in a leadership position of any kind you won’t make very much but there’s no reason you can’t work your way up to controller or finance director level jobs and make over 150k. Those generally would be considered leadership positions though.
Do #1, marry a fellow cpa on a similar trajectory and you will clear $300k in household income by your late 20s/early 30s. You will have plenty of options going forward from that point forward.
7-8 years in public accounting you should be a heavy manager or new senior manager. $150k is an absolutely attainable salary in mcol/hcol. Maybe take your own advice and smoke some crack; you clearly need a more open mind.
The sky is the limit. As someone else said, you can make $millions as a CFO, CAO, or senior executive at (some) large multinational F500 companies or startups.
Avoid #1 - you say that you don't care about work life balance, but that's dumb. You're 24 and haven't ever had a real job - you don't know what that means and how mentally and physically taxing that is. Actually, I'd avoid public accounting altogether. #2 is the best and most straightforward path, #3 is good if you have the stomach for it, but I wouldn't recommend it.
So #2 it is. You'll have a lot of competition, but it's the best option if you are able to put in the work and educate yourself extensively.
Don't forget big company mid management. I'm a director of financial reporting at 213k + 30% target bonus (got 60% this year) + 20% equity (starting next year).
Would never say it in real life. With that said there is a reason the chief accounting officer and assistant controller have told me I'm next in line. Also a reason the old controller on the way out told me if I tell the CFO what job I want next to advance my career they will make it happen.
There is absolutely smarter accountants out there than me. Not at my company, though.
I don’t know why people are downvoting your replies. I don’t have enough experience to give you advice, but I’ve noticed that you might be using work as a way to get away from your life, I hope your life gets better until you don’t feel that way
1 is easiest path to 6 figures. 5 years or less.
2 longer to higher salary and luck plays a big factor. Better to do 1 then jump to 2.
3 you need MINIMUM 7-10 years of experience in 1 or 2.
Your internship is likely hourly and they’re having to pay you overtime. They prob max you out at 6 months. So bad comp. If I’m wrong you’re better off staying there because even in hcol a first year senior at big 4 is not making more than 95. Around 98 in SF but that’s VHCOL.
Becoming a partner takes an immense amount of dedication. You have to understand account at an in depth level. You have to be willing to sacrifice most of your personal life for 15 years. Then yes you get paid well. I’d rather make it to a high paid controller or vp of finance position in 10-12 years making half of what a partner is making and also somewhat enjoy my personal life for those years. I know a director who left PWC with 10 years experience and landed a controller role making about 400-450. She left to a client so we had an idea of what she made.
All are do-able.
For 1) the partner comp in the first few years is just above director, but jumps up to over $1m depending on how well you sell and grow the business. If you can't/don't make partner at the firm you are with, need to jump ship and become a direct admit partner at another firm. Don't stay because "it may happen next year."
For 2) a big chunk of comp will likely come from stock comp. It's a wide range...public co CFO will be paid much more than CFO of $100m company. You can look up some public companies to get an idea of the ceiling. For this, don't focus on the technicals, but on the marketing. In other words, make sure people know how much you are contributing and how important it is, rather than being the guy who gets stuff done. Also, job hop every 3-4 years.
For 3), that's going to depend on you and geography the most. Start your own firm in podunk, and you won't make much. But, lower barriers to doing this, and all the margin is yours. This is "the millionaire next door" territory.
For point #2, can you elaborate on “make sure people know how much you’re contributing … rather than being the guy who gets stuff done.”?
What are the pro / cons of both sides and how can you accomplish it successfully?
What I mean is to not be the workhorse. Yes, at the beginning of your career, it helps to learn and do things well. But don't get bogged down in that. Delegate stuff, and then focus on doing things that will put you on people's radar. For example, if there's some project that gets you exposure to higher-ups or people in other depts, that's the project you want to work on rather than trying to finish a reconciliation a day faster.
Is this simply another aspect of playing politics? Yes. But that's what it takes to move up. Jobs at higher levels aren't filled based on competence alone.
I understand your aspiration for an incredibly high income / making Partner. I want to encourage you to make sure you focus on the present & enjoy the road ahead. These positions are 15+ years away.
To give context, as a 24 year old, 15 years of working is roughly 63% of your living experience. It’d be like a 9 year old talking about their goal of becoming a Big 4 intern. Your life is going to evolve in so many ways over the next decade. Take it one step at a time.
I'm a CPA but never worked in public accounting. Wife is an MBA. She owns and we both work in a simple accounting/bookkeeping company. Gross around 250K a year and work maybe 45 hours a week between the two of us. Could easily go chase work and make 300K plus but I prefer not working over working. We don't do any tax work just normal accounting and bookkeeping.
What were your backgrounds prior to starting this business? I think about this all the time as a big 4 auditor, but feel like I need to get some small business accounting/bookkeeping/tax experience
I’ve been industry for 12+ years. Staff up to director. I still do CFO/Controller consulting outside of her company as well. She was F100 accounting for 8 years before starting business. Small business acct is a different world. Def want to get some experience before diving in.
Realistically,
Partner at big 4 - first few years 500k-700k. 5-6 years in as partner low $1M. Rainmakers - $5 to 10M. There are about 20 of them at a big public firm, so very very hard.
CFO - mid market companies - 300K ish all in, your money making opportunity is if your company is bought out by a PE firm or bigger Co. for F500, millions, usually between $5-10M, some big tech or big bank CFO makes 20m+.
Believe me when I say this, you’re usually not making more money being an entrepreneur than being a partner at big 4. However, if you’re the 5% of entrepreneurs that are very successful, realistically speaking you’ll be making $1M-$5M annually, but real money is again, you own a regional consulting firm and is acquired by a bigger one or PE firm. My previous boss did it, his firm was acquired for 30M, taking about a 50 ppl small consulting firm here.
Why do you want a high salary? That’s the first answer we need? If you don’t care about friends or family, what are you going to do with the money? $100k is more than enough in most places to live a great life as a single person
Personally I would retire move to Thailand or Philippines and play videogames all day + bang hotties whenever I want for like $100-200 a pop (can even order them online in those places like food delivery).
Maybe do some island hopping and get a new travel companion whenever I feel like. That's the dream life if you have that kind of savings from working a high pay job. Of course multi millionaires can do this in any country... But for six figure earners LCOL countries are more feasible to have this kind of lifestyle with enough savings
Private company CFO / Controller is your best bet.
It often offers normal work-life balance (try to avoid PE-owned places looking to grow, etc), and pays between 175k->250k base.
Big 4 -> Big 4 Manager -> Private Company Controller is a pretty common route - though I think it's usually only hopping to your clients or if you have a good relationship.
A more common route is probably Big 4 -> Big 4 senior -> Private Accounting Manager -> Private Controller
I was not a great student in college and struggled to find a job. I started at a crap tiny firm (10 people) to build experience. I passed the CPA exam and jumped to a 40-50 person firm. Then I jumped to a 60-70 person firm. That firm began to really grow and I made partner in 2009 as one of the partners I worked under was retiring in 2013.
My income has grown incredibly. I am not even that smart of a guy. I just like serving and helping clients. My income for 2023 was about $700k. We have partners that make over a million. We are a small firm and the work is not all that stressful. You can have a nice career at smaller firms outside the top 100.
Thousands of job openings a day for CFO/controller? In what roaring economy do you think you’re entering?
The paths you’ve laid out, though not incorrect, are not easy and so I would refrain from laying out a long-term plan since I can all but guarantee it won’t shake out the way you thought it would. It’s not school where you just pass the test and then move onto the next grade level. This profession grinds people down in a way they’ve never experienced before. Mentally, physically, emotionally, spiritually…. Anything less than perfection could mean a shitty performance review if your boss simply doesn’t like you as a person. It is not a foregone conclusion that you will be strolling along these tracks ten years down the road. Most people burn out before they break through the ceiling into BIG money, and every individual has their upper limit on how much they can handle.
Slow your roll. It’s one thing to be thinking about money as a student (and pre-internship to boot!) but I bet your tune will change after you’ve got a few busy seasons under your belt. Work life balance isn’t just hours on the clock, it’s also the stress of juggling multiple tasks and clients while also being detail oriented and highly organized, to say nothing of the clients themselves and the personalities you’ll likely encounter. It’s a special kind of hell to be put on a team where the manager doesn’t know how to lead and your client has just issued their fifth version of the trial balance.
Public partners not at big four can be as much as $2m a year. I know that for a fact.
Private is one in a million to come close. I know too many on controller path that never made CFO and are stuck under $250k forever.
Don’t have anything to add beyond what others have said. Just wanted to say that, respectfully, you’re a bitch - get over your three year old ex. I lost a 6 year relationship and life gets better if you want it to. Helps if you’re in a good position financially/professionally but you also need to have a decent personality, hobbies, and attitude in life.
I’ve always been in the private industry and am also a CPA. Took me 9 years to reach Controller level but now make a little under $200k (salary + bonus).
A shitload. More importantly though, you can make a comfortable upper middle class salary for very little actual work and sit on your ass all day at work. That’s why we do this.
1. If you don’t mind longer work hours and client work, then definitely the best path to a big salary.
2. Can be very high paying and rewarding, but it really depends on the industry and size of company. Be careful in this path, once in a particular industry for a while it can be hard to switch industries since more senior roles often require prior experience in the same industry.
3. This is a silly path. New accounting firms and ERP startups are a dime a dozen.
Your first option is probably the best one. I work at a big 4 myself and I’ve talked a lot of partners who told me that it’s a great career path! You get 10% of each contracts so If you have a big client with a contract of 3M, that’s $300,000!! That’s not bad but I will end by saying that work life balance is important! Find a wife and start a family :)
not a lot (like wealthy a lot) while doing it but provides the necessary surplus per paycheck to build up towards wealth if you are relatively careful with spending habits
i'm right below director currently at 160k altogether. Once i'm at director in less than a year, my base will be around 170-180. If all my stock awards vest, in four years i will be making roughly 250-300k per year with an additional 200k base. At that point i will start trying to buy some various businesses that are perfectly fine with absentee owners and then retire in 10 years. If you can find a good publicly traded company this is the way to go imo. I barely work 35 hours a week.
All three will be rewarding in experience, knowledge and pay. I got experience in #2 and then #1 while doing #3 and after 15yrs #3 is the most rewarding and less stressful. As a CPA/Tax Preparer, I generate $450 - $500K in revenue and take a salary of $225K. I control my hours, work, and peace of mind.
HCOL. I make 110k after 5 years and I just wanna cap out here. I live a good life and maybe I want a little more like 150k, but I don't want all the stress and corporate bullshit.
4. Government. I can make 6 figures after a few years, continue to get pension, never get fired, and no stress.
If we’re talking pure accounting only:
Big 4: stay til manager at least exit to 150-180k TC job
Big director: $300k
Big 4 partner: 800-1.2m median by 5 years in partnership
Partner National - 500-1m
Partner Regional - 250-800
Buyout solo tax firm and run a one man band or you+EA and assistant:150-400k
CFO - PE Backed average around 1m - 2m TC, but typically this will be after getting 5 years in public at least, and controller and cfo roles at PE backed firms
CFO - VC startup 1m total comp
CFO small public to F500 - 500k - tens of millions
CFO private midsize 50m-1b rev - 300k-1m
CAO F500 - $500k-1M
Controller range all over the place - 150k-500k depending on company size
Get a T25 MBA along the way full time to pivot to something else that can still enhance your path to high profile CFO, or due PT T25 MBA to not pivot but help go to CFO.
I just hope OP plans to take the constant heathy eating health check ups and other health affirming things in his high stress trek to success. Because it will take its toll.
I’d recommend you just spend some time browsing & exploring big4transparency.com and the spreadsheet to gain an understanding of different markets.
It’s good to form your understanding about tax / audit, versus consulting, versus industry roles. Look at comp but also job satisfaction and weekly hours worked.
In all cases the ceiling is excessively high, consulting brings you more comp earlier, but theres a lot of variation in how happy people are in consulting as well
Also for what it’s worth I’ve done some of all of these. Here’s my journey:
I started in tax, actually quite liked it, got bored after a few years and was really really bothered by low starting comp and firm politics. While at the Big 4 I got loaned out on some consulting initiatives, it was cool, the people were great but the work felt very abstract and a little empty in my short time being there. I struggled not really seeing a real impact from what I was doing.
Next I left to be a “controller” (title inflation but I was the only finance / accounting employee) at a super super tiny startup. Really interesting but hell on earth, no boundaries, working 24/7.
Currently working FP&A in tech and it’s the happiest I’ve been in any role. About 3 years in though and it’s almost time for me to move on.
I’ve always had the entrepreneurial itch, I’m glad I did not go directly into it and have developed industry knowledge, a network, some hard and soft skills before pursuing that. Now not quite time yet, but very soon I plan on transitioning to that full time. It’s scary as hell because I’m making the jump before it’s fully able to fund my lifestyle but I need to be able to dedicate some time to it. I’ve gotten myself to a place where I could very easily find a new role or some contract work to fall back on so it makes sense to make that jump now. I would not advise pursuing that immediately before gaining some experience, BUT some people do and have massive success.
Overall my advice is to take chances and bet on yourself. If you always have something in the back of your mind, make moves toward giving it a try. It’s often possible to go back. If I had to go back to tax, I bet I’d be better off at it now that I understand the buyer’s perspective.
Good luck
I am less than 10 years in and total around 360K base + bonus. I did 6 years of big four and now privately held company. I am the highest up accounting seat in a department of about 15. I’m happy with where I am at and know that there is still upward mobility from a pay perspective.
Currently a controller, always worked at smaller businesses everything under 50 million. Current company is about 8m, but I'm the only person running everything in our department.
Honestly I have a chill gig and I'm in pretty good with the PE company that owns us. I imagine I'll be at CFO within the next ~5 years, bouncing around internally to another company or two. There's plenty of smaller companies that might not need a CFO, but need someone to run the accounting department.
Currently no CPA, but I'm studying for my exams. Did one year in public at a small firm. I've always worked in industry, 8ish years experience, I make ~165k + equity.
This career is more about stability with a solid living and not ridiculously high earnings. Finance is more likely to provide that however the stability in accounting is what makes the field attractive
I don’t even know
I’m 3.5 years in I make right at $100k plus I have a couple of non-accounting side hustles that pulls in about $20k
Started at BIG4, early promoted to senior, job hopped to another BIG4 for a pay bump, can’t find anything else that pays the same atm but I’m looking, even applied to the IRS
Somehow I’m in the system as a remote employee though and I mostly work from home and haven’t faced any backlash on returning to office so it’s like on one hand it sucks ass on the other hand it sucks less than my peers and my flexibility is crazy.
Anyway that’s a lot to say that bro idk I’m so burnt out that I don’t even check what I’m doing tomorrow never-mind in 10 years… There’s a reason not a lot of people make it to Partner or CFO
I fully went into this thinking fuck it I’ll work my ass off and become partner but just working your ass off isn’t enough really. Anyway off to work bro it’s 7:05 and I wanna be done by 7:00 PM
While the sky is the limit, realistically, you’ll top out at or around $150-$200k.
While a lot of people might say they are making xyz, they are seriously limited in number.
U are too optimistic. Other than positive things, you need to include some negative things such as you may burnt out / suffer mental health on the journey to audit partner/ CFO and completely shift your path. You may not care abt work life balance at your young age, but after 30y, you may start to value it.
My old bosses who owned a small public firm in a small town made roughly 325k a year. I know this because one of them accidentally left their payroll report on the printer and one paycheck for them was $13,000
What kinda psycho doesn’t care about work life balance…people like you are what’s wrong with this field accepting ridiculous hours….not to be a dick but do you have 0 friends family and hobbies??
It’s not the salary that makes you rich. Most common occupations of millionaires lists CPA at number 2. Engineers are 1. Teachers are 3. It’s about how you invest your salary.
https://www.rd.com/list/careers-millionaire/
On number 3 , you don’t need to develop a new software solution, you can become an implementation partner for either an ERP or enterprise performance management developer.
I was a controller after 5 years of public accounting and 1 year of industry as an accounting manager. Director of finance by 5 years after that. My title is accurate for what I do on a daily basis but I work for start ups so small companies, nothing public so maybe not as long of a path as others. Path to CFO or further leadership into c level is unsure/not as straightforward I think. Anyway, I make 175k and have some stock from my current and last employer. I did get my cpa when I was in public which helped I think put me on this trajectory but otherwise I just found a niche and I work hard and I like industry/being cross functional.
Tons of opportunities to make a comfortable middle class salary. Few opportunities to make an extraordinary salary, which I'd consider to be $500K+. $100K is very easy. $200K is achievable if you're a high performer. $300K is doable if you're both a high performer and have a good amount of experience. $300K+ is where you start finding fewer and fewer opportunities.
1. You say you don't care about a work life balance, but I would be careful saying that. If you go into it head first and make little time for yourself you're going to burn out very quickly. You have to find some hobbies or something to do outside of work, as tax season can become extremely stressful. Accounting is nothing like they teach you in school. There's much more than reconciling a trial balance and entering adjustments. There's so many compliance forms that go alongside tax deadline which makes getting everything done on time excruciating. And if you don't have some way of letting out stress or some way of having excitement, you're not gonna make it long. Also the stress of a high turnover at these bigger firms can be excruciating to deal with. Which means clients get passed around from person to person, which adds an extra level of frustration from having to constantly deal with irritated clients that have to deal with a new accountant every year. Plus you have to have your CPA, or you'll never get to partner. Can't sign a return without it. Or maybe you're one of that very small percentage who really love just working.
2. Getting into a controller position can be challenging. You really just need to stick around and get some years of experience, making sure to advance every few years. Or else find somewhere else where you can advance. Don't get stuck in an accounts payable role forever.
The most important thing is landing a job after college. I wouldn't worry so much about which field you go into, just as long as you get a well paying job. Get a couple years of experience, then find a job in the field you prefer. It will take a bit to figure out where you belong, and what makes you happy. Life never goes the way you plan it.
the miseducation of OP at their accounting grad school:
CFO/Controller: Slower path… probably most practical cuz there are 1000s of job openings everyday for these kind of positions
no way in hell there are 1,000s of these positions opening every day. take it from someone at this level who rarely if ever sees a decent exit opportunity for something that would be considered a good lateral move. don't be naive.
honestly think it would be faster to hit controller than partner.. also while there are always roles, they’re not always at great companies. you could get a CFO job at a small company and have to work 80+ hour weeks. even if it did take you longer to get to CFO/Controller over a partner, the road there would be much more enjoyable with work/life balance and you might be delayed a few years. Not a big deal.
Its easy to say you don't care about work life balance when you are 24. I didn't either.
It changes when you get a little older and realize great money is not the key to a happy life. I made tons of money working 70+ hours at one point. I found cool stuff I bought still in the box years later because I had not time to enjoy it.
I changed careers, make a decent living (200k+), enjoy my work, and don't kill myself trying to make more.
For ease of getting to those CFO roles I would do 4-5 years in public accounting. Can be even at a top 50 firm doesn’t t need to be big 4. Then leave for the industry you worked the most in. You will have contacts and a reputation already and don’t have to work your way up. You have to job hop in industry to move from staff acct to cfo. Most never make it past assistant controller without switching companies or it takes too long.
The possibilities are limitless. Be good with people, get good with your work, work 80 hour weeks, job hop to positions that are increasingly higher on the ladder, take on lots of responsibility.
I will never do any of that. I would rather make 100-150k and not have to stress too much. Money over about 150k doesn't add much to life unless you are a billionare and then money=power but you will not get there in accounting.
Guy at former employer (mutual/hedge fund manager) got in relatively early in the history of the company, maybe when he was 30-35 and he was now ~50. He was the controller for the funds (not CFO of company) - his job was to sign off each day indicating all the money was there and properly accounted for.
In practice, 80% of this is done by a computer, and you can hire 5-6 CPAs and random interns to do the other 20% under you and double check everyone’s work.
So as far as I could tell, this guy did very little work. Couple calls and a meeting each day, and obviously had to put in time early on to be promoted and build a high trust team of subordinates.
Anyway his salary was like 1.5 million a year with lots of stock and benefits I sometimes think about that and wish i’d studied harder in accounting.
I have no accounting expierence and need to find a bookkeeper because I know so little about accounting, but that's another point. I found the topic interesting so I clicked in. As a current small business owner and someone who has been working in the family business your end points for 1 are way off about family or work life balance. There are a very few amount of people who are capable of keeping up with the work-life balance necessary to do that. I worked 15-16 hours Monday - Saturday for 2 years. I had to stop because I had no time for myself and I was burning myself out. You do need time to recharge your batteries, some more than others, so that is a certain thing to consider.
The other thing is that you're 24 now, and likely won't think of having a family and settling down for another 6-8 years. All of the people I know that are in the upper echelons of C-Suite have to sacrifice lots of family time in order to be there and they always resent their job for that fact. Not to say they don't love what they do, but without fail, they wish it didn't come at the expense of their family. Having a newborn son now, and seeing him smile at me, I know that is what is important to me. So prioritizing your life is critical.
Third thing, the big boy positions come with the big boy problems. They are unrelenting because if it was something easy, someone else further down the food chain would have solved it for you. It takes a person of special temperament, skills, knowledge, intelligence and dedication to be in that role. Not saying that you don't possess all of those attributes or that the pursuit of the position isn't fruitful or worthwhile, it's just something to keep in mind as your work your way up the hierarchy. I would really take a look at where you are at each level and ask yourself, am I making enough money to support myself (or my family if you have one at that time) in my necessities, can I reach my goals for life and retirement, am I happy with the burden of work that I have and the problems that come across my desk, and am I willing to stay in this position for 20 years and still be happy for those 20 years. If the answer to all of those is yes, then you know that is as far as you need to go. As I've gotten into my mid 30's and am continuing to have the worst year + of my life, I have realized that being happy in my position and in work is the most important thing. If you are miserable every day in life, how much money you make doesn't matter. You're just now miserable in a fancy package.
Big 4 partner is equal parts merit and luck. Sometimes they just skip a year when it comes to promoting partners in every specialty in every geographic region. So while you can certainly try, don’t bank on it and be realistic.
I got ‘the message’ my 2nd year as a senior manager that I wasn’t making partner. I did asset management in audit in NYC and they typically promoted two partners per year… they just told me that they were cutting back to one promotion per year, ultimately one every other year. And of the 11 remaining senior managers they liked other people more. They fired me a week later. On the way out the door one partner summed it up pretty well ‘if youre not 1 rated you will eventually be 5 rated.’
Fast forward 4 years, I’ve tripled my salary, have two kids, equity stake, work a gentleman’s 40 hours, everything in my life has improved.
So just keep your options open.
34M here making $275k plus $60k equity as a segment controller at a Fortune 500 company working 40-45 hours per week most weeks. It’s high pressure and stressful but the comp is obviously very rewarding and will only go up more from here.
4. Realize a few years in that a modest 6 figure salary job is enough to buy most of your wants snd anything extra doesn’t result in much more happiness. But lifestyle does, therefore you seek a remote individual contributor role and blend into the background.
Haha I started off wanting partner then I saw that basically all of the ones I knew were divorced or worked so much that they had live in nannies. Money is great but who gives a shit if you can't even see your own family. I've gone this way, remote IC at 6 figures lol.
All the partners I know at smaller national firms are happily married.
Married to their work, spouse, or the money.
First spouse. Sounds like most of the people here just chose the wrong firms. PA can be done and bring significant happiness.
Why not all three tho they’re supposed to intertwine
You can only pick two
I used to think this way (if the they can do it I can do it) and if these people are happy doing that then hey more power to them! But if you (in the general sense) realize that YOU would be unhappy being an accounting partner there is nothing wrong with saying it isn’t for you or that the juice isn’t worth the squeeze. Also just to play devils advocate - the number of people in unhappy marriages who stay together for the kids or due to finances but put on a good front out in public is not insignificant.
To their first spouses?
Yup.
and then the second spouse arrives on the scene after the first divorce.
"All the partners I know..." Cool story. Look at the statistics.
Really? Pretty much every partner I worked with when I was at PwC was married with kids. Hell, one of the older partners wives would make lunch for him every day.
The people in this sub exaggerate, or flat out lie about everything. If anyone wants an accurate depiction of this career, Reddit is the last place you'll find it. I was nervous about getting into this field because of what I read here. Turns out, it's not that bad. There are some rough days/weeks but it's manageable. Most coworkers are decent people and the same goes for Partners.
Divorce rates are over 50% across the population. Might as well say entry level accountants are also redflags!
Drops to 40% for your first marriage
Accountants/Partners like anyone else can get divorced, I agree. I'm not arguing that any profession is divorce proof. Most partners get married/have kids when they become financially stable so they are less likely to get divorced. Financial problems are the leading cause of divorce in the US. I just found it funny that this person said all the partners they knew were divorced and worked so much they needed nannies. Most of the male partners I know are married and their wives are stay-at-home moms. They also have good relationships with their children. There is a sentiment in this sub that if you're successful, you sold your soul to get there. It's not true. Most partners I know average 50-55 hours a week (year-round) and are involved with their families. I'm MCOL (with Big-4 presence) but maybe it's different in other areas/markets.
Sure with wife 2 or 3
How old is that partner? If older than 60, they still believed in marriage and committment. Oh you mentionnes old wife... I would be surprised If they were between 40 and 50 because those are at least a one time divorcé. And in the future, I d be really surprised to see a wife bringing lunch to her husband. Our generation is too self centered and money orientated 😭😭😭
Yeah he was old like late 50"s, early 60's and this was over a decade ago. Was kinda cute to see him open his lunchbox and take out sandwiches his wife made him. He was a senior partner, easily making over a million a year, could be eating out every day, yet would eat his home made sandwiches.
I’m wondering if you can at least afford a nanny for your grown self if you make big girl money in case your executive functioning fails
I wish I could get that type of job. How long did it take you? Do you have your CPA?
Probably about 4 years of experience. I got lucky and actually a client from when I was in public poached me over. Yes I have CPA license
Same
Man it’s the opposite at my office, BIG4 but my office is a somewhat unique, smaller but very high revenue for its size office. The partners all have beautiful families, they bring their kids to work sometimes like in the mornings before school starts so they can drop their kids off, their spouses also have good jobs like being Partners at other firms, CEO’s and shit I talk to them a lot (I graduated at 30 so a little older and I just fit in better with like the senior managers)… They mostly seem to be living the dream, working a lot but they’ll all be retired by 60 and they all go on crazy vacations and shit I know it’s not everywhere/every partner but man sometimes I wish I had it in me to get that far
This. The same is true in industry, with rare companies actually following through on work-life balance promises. You can build boundaries and, at a certain skill and income level, consciously choose between quality of life and pay. I'm in a small firm now, never in my life thought I'd go back into public and even considered letting my license lapse after talking to someone a Plante Moran who said their billable target was 2400/yr for managers while they try to advertise their QOL on their recruiting page. I'm sick of the journal articles written by old white men wringing their hands about how they can't recruit and keep talent while changing literally nothing about the industry's work environment or culture.
This is the one :)
If you can make that salary as an individual contributor without being in a leadership position, that’s amazing imo
When I say modest, like $150k. Yes very possible. Anything above $300k is more luck and being in the right place at the right time.
In this day and age? Or maybe 5 years ago? Feels impossible to buy a house and expenses for every day items just keep going up.
Agreed - my 230 in a rust belt surburb working 35-45 a week has me loving life.
>My goal is to make great money in this field This is what op said. You're not listening or responding with the intention to serve OP, but to project your own philosophy and partially justify your own career decisions. Op didn't imply "wanting enough", he wants to absolutely fucking kill it. Which you can do in accounting, but it won't come from a 9 to 5.
So true. 10 years in. Healthy 6 figures. Work about 20/25 hours a week. Shit load of time to enjoy the money.
Omg this is me 💯
Option 3 has better lifestyle balance because you can grow your book size
What's the path for that?
Das it mane
6 figure job within 5 years of working. Easily attainable.
Can't help but notice none of the top replies have mentioned it but... You need the people skills, you need to be charismatic or personable to get to these senior roles. 9/10 times a company wont promote you to these positions just because you work hard and have great experience if you have the personality of a rock. All good to work hard, but show you're a person too - (where appropriate) share stories, get involved in social events, have a chat with people, etc. Hot take also - being in the office 3/4 days a week is your friend if your main concern is getting promoted. It's not popular, but it's the truth. Humans are social creatures, the face to face interaction is very important and can't be replaced by a screen.
Likeabiliy + Smarts + Drive is a good combination to climb the ladder quickly
So, fat + drunk + stupid is no way to climb the ladder?
You just need to add funny in there and you’re good to go
Fat part is optional but drinking, golfing and making the right connections is the fastest way to move up. When I was younger I got a promotion over two harder working, smarter peers. The only reason was I golfed with the decision maker and we would drink at the clubhouse after where he would make fun of the lack of social skills of those folks… Make friends in high places is the way to move up.
Chris Farley was fat and struggled with addiction but was massively popular and successful because he had a great personality.
No, but once you’ve reached the top of the ladder, you’ll find most people somehow end up fitting that description.
That in office piece is so incredibly key, lots of statistics to back that up. When promotions are available, nobody thinks about a name on your Teams list, it's the person sitting across the hall in the other office.
But god forbid you say that on Reddit anywhere other than here
100% this I make the money I make because of my people skills - not my technical skills.
can you describe a bit about your people skills? can you mention any suggestions/methods for someone who likes to improve his people skills?
Learn to sell
This. I had always been extremely introverted and uncomfortable in social situations until I took a customer service position out of necessity after graduating college. That eventually turned into a sales job extending 10 years in total which completely changed my outward personality and comfort in social settings for the better. I recently shifted gears to an analyst position in a finance role and believe I'll be be able to outshine my peers for promotions because of it, since most of them are introverts who didn't want to deal with people.
I lead a pretty large team and I think the key to success with my team is being genuine and charismatic. I talk to everyone on my team about their personal hobbies and whatever is going on in their life. Despite what people think, the best “people people” aren’t the ones that constantly talk, it’s more about asking the right questions and actively listening. The easiest way to get someone to like you is to talk about them.
This is spot on.
So much this. Have seen technically brilliant people (on paper) but if you can't communicate with your clients then you won't get far.
Technical skills aren’t what hold people back from promotions, people skills are
Money isn’t everything. It’ll take a few years to come this realization, but for most, what it takes to make the big bucks in accounting isn’t worth the sacrifices. Make your 150k, never worry about money for the rest of your life and just chill with your friends and family. That’s what it’s about.
Investing properly with a 150,000 salary into index funds = millions
Smart post here.
I just had that conversation with someone who is baffled I’m not staying in the big 4. They argue the 130,000 I’m making white which will be matched in industry “could be like 180,000 in a few years!” Uh. If I work 40 hours a week and have time to relax,put aside the fact your hourly rate went up…: if you just don’t blow the money…. Compound interest will kick in …. And you’ll Per year be making a fuck ton. Could the person working 80 hours a week also be working a fuck ton and investing? Yeah. But honestly? When I’m overworked I spend more money on trying to find some amount of happiness
Yeah....everyone has their own priorities. Some prefer a less stressful/demanding work life and don't mind making less than they could elsewhere. It's a tradeoff,, no doubt.
This is the way. Even if you’re not planning to FIRE just living frugally and saving as much as you can makes for a blissful life.
Sounds like a good life to me tbf
This is the way. Realized this at Deloitte on a Sunday and the partner was working with me... I'm aspiring to work 7 days a week? WTF am I doing!! LOL never looked back.
Seconding this. I was pushing for a senior role to make like 120k, but I saw seniors were in the office almost every day 8-8. On seeing this, I'm happy sticking with my 80k and playing runescape from my home office for most of the day. It's not am exact 1:1 as to the original post, but in the same avenue of "why kill yourself for /slightly/ more money? The amount of additional work =/= the additional pay."
Wc lvls?
99 haha
Nice
This is my dream
Fwiw, you say you don’t care about work/life balance now and having a family, but I said the same thing at 24. Partner or bust. I’m now almost 30 with a husband and baby on the way. I no longer want the partner track. Don’t feel like your goals can’t change as your personal life changes. Don’t feel like you can’t change your mind. And for god sakes don’t sacrifice your personal happiness just to make a lot of money. It’s really easy to say the goal is to make a ton of money, but I make 6 figures after 7 busy seasons and tbh it’s more than enough.
I think that if you fast forward 15 years you will care about work life balance.
Even just 5. The change in perspective from 24/25 and right out of school to 30 for most people is HUGE.
Yep. I realized I didn’t care about the money when I hit 23.
I still thought I wanted to be a partner until I was like 27. And then I woke up one day after clients were demanding comfort letters with 2 day turn arounds thinking “wtf am I doing.” Still here, but definitely not sure for how much longer. Waiting out the economy at this point.
Yeah, I think for a lot of us, it takes that one “realization event” to make us rethink everything. I think yours is a really good example. Eventually you realize how ridiculous it is that you’re sacrificing your life for client work. And I feel you on the last part. Sometimes it’s better to wait it out and then jump (and I think we’re very fortunate in our line of work with being able to do that, with job security and all).
100000%. At this point I don’t care how much these people pay us, their ridiculous demands are not worth it. I’m perfectly content to hang out as a manager/sr manager for awhile until I know exactly what I want to do and know the economy can support the move. But the partner promotion grind? NOPE lol
I know a ton of CFOs. Their work life balance is way worse than a 20 year experience partner. As long as you don’t go big 4.
There are 1000s of job openings everyday for CFOs? lol.
I laughed at it too… even Controller candidates are a dime a dozen. Good roles people stay in, bad ones people specialize in, you’re lucky with a mediocre one.
i hate to sound uneducated on the topic, just curious. are CFO’s different from controllers?
Controllers are one piece of the puzzle. https://www.cfoselections.com/perspective/how-do-financial-controllers-add-value
As a CFO/partner at a big enough company you can make millions. Realistically you’ll work your way up into the 100-200k range.
What does it take to reach that position? Also is there any way to make the range you mentioned without being in a leadership position? I know the average CPA salary in my state is 150k
An insane amount of hard work, luck, and sacrificing your social and family time for most if not all of your career. Without being in a leadership position of any kind you won’t make very much but there’s no reason you can’t work your way up to controller or finance director level jobs and make over 150k. Those generally would be considered leadership positions though.
Do #1, marry a fellow cpa on a similar trajectory and you will clear $300k in household income by your late 20s/early 30s. You will have plenty of options going forward from that point forward.
marry an accountant? GROSS
Not if she has ass. I'm a controller at an audit firm. The male accountants are boring but the female ones are hot.
Thank you sir!
controller at audit firm? i dont think you're in the US PA firms in the US don't have someone called a "controller"
“Honey can you approve this flight Im booking us via email? I’ll save the evidence in our marriage shared drive”
$150k in your late 20s / early 30s as an accountant 😂 I want what you’re smoking
7-8 years in public accounting you should be a heavy manager or new senior manager. $150k is an absolutely attainable salary in mcol/hcol. Maybe take your own advice and smoke some crack; you clearly need a more open mind.
The sky is the limit. As someone else said, you can make $millions as a CFO, CAO, or senior executive at (some) large multinational F500 companies or startups. Avoid #1 - you say that you don't care about work life balance, but that's dumb. You're 24 and haven't ever had a real job - you don't know what that means and how mentally and physically taxing that is. Actually, I'd avoid public accounting altogether. #2 is the best and most straightforward path, #3 is good if you have the stomach for it, but I wouldn't recommend it. So #2 it is. You'll have a lot of competition, but it's the best option if you are able to put in the work and educate yourself extensively.
You need to be at least borderline psychotic to be in those roles.
Don't forget big company mid management. I'm a director of financial reporting at 213k + 30% target bonus (got 60% this year) + 20% equity (starting next year).
Congrats man. Did / do you ever doubt your abilities? Or is it pretty chill
I know I’m the smartest guy in the room. It was a LOT of work to get here since I started in industry.
I’ve never seen anyone that is actually the smartest person in the room say this.
Would never say it in real life. With that said there is a reason the chief accounting officer and assistant controller have told me I'm next in line. Also a reason the old controller on the way out told me if I tell the CFO what job I want next to advance my career they will make it happen. There is absolutely smarter accountants out there than me. Not at my company, though.
I like the confidence and hope to be in your shoes one day.
$300k total comp this year closing on 14 years of experience. CPA. Big 4 experience. HCOL area. Private industry role.
What job
Technical accounting director.
I don’t know why people are downvoting your replies. I don’t have enough experience to give you advice, but I’ve noticed that you might be using work as a way to get away from your life, I hope your life gets better until you don’t feel that way
I’m 2nd year year big 4 auditor make about $67k. My dad is a SBU Controller with 30+ years experience, no CPA, and makes $350k total comp in Texas.
1 is easiest path to 6 figures. 5 years or less. 2 longer to higher salary and luck plays a big factor. Better to do 1 then jump to 2. 3 you need MINIMUM 7-10 years of experience in 1 or 2.
Tbf my internship pays close to 6 figs for #1. I do live in a HCOL tho. Yea what you said for 2 is the plan but man these partners be ballin
Your internship is likely hourly and they’re having to pay you overtime. They prob max you out at 6 months. So bad comp. If I’m wrong you’re better off staying there because even in hcol a first year senior at big 4 is not making more than 95. Around 98 in SF but that’s VHCOL. Becoming a partner takes an immense amount of dedication. You have to understand account at an in depth level. You have to be willing to sacrifice most of your personal life for 15 years. Then yes you get paid well. I’d rather make it to a high paid controller or vp of finance position in 10-12 years making half of what a partner is making and also somewhat enjoy my personal life for those years. I know a director who left PWC with 10 years experience and landed a controller role making about 400-450. She left to a client so we had an idea of what she made.
All are do-able. For 1) the partner comp in the first few years is just above director, but jumps up to over $1m depending on how well you sell and grow the business. If you can't/don't make partner at the firm you are with, need to jump ship and become a direct admit partner at another firm. Don't stay because "it may happen next year." For 2) a big chunk of comp will likely come from stock comp. It's a wide range...public co CFO will be paid much more than CFO of $100m company. You can look up some public companies to get an idea of the ceiling. For this, don't focus on the technicals, but on the marketing. In other words, make sure people know how much you are contributing and how important it is, rather than being the guy who gets stuff done. Also, job hop every 3-4 years. For 3), that's going to depend on you and geography the most. Start your own firm in podunk, and you won't make much. But, lower barriers to doing this, and all the margin is yours. This is "the millionaire next door" territory.
Thanks. Much appreciated - OP burner
For point #2, can you elaborate on “make sure people know how much you’re contributing … rather than being the guy who gets stuff done.”? What are the pro / cons of both sides and how can you accomplish it successfully?
What I mean is to not be the workhorse. Yes, at the beginning of your career, it helps to learn and do things well. But don't get bogged down in that. Delegate stuff, and then focus on doing things that will put you on people's radar. For example, if there's some project that gets you exposure to higher-ups or people in other depts, that's the project you want to work on rather than trying to finish a reconciliation a day faster. Is this simply another aspect of playing politics? Yes. But that's what it takes to move up. Jobs at higher levels aren't filled based on competence alone.
I understand your aspiration for an incredibly high income / making Partner. I want to encourage you to make sure you focus on the present & enjoy the road ahead. These positions are 15+ years away. To give context, as a 24 year old, 15 years of working is roughly 63% of your living experience. It’d be like a 9 year old talking about their goal of becoming a Big 4 intern. Your life is going to evolve in so many ways over the next decade. Take it one step at a time.
I'm a CPA but never worked in public accounting. Wife is an MBA. She owns and we both work in a simple accounting/bookkeeping company. Gross around 250K a year and work maybe 45 hours a week between the two of us. Could easily go chase work and make 300K plus but I prefer not working over working. We don't do any tax work just normal accounting and bookkeeping.
This is it right here..will be my goal once I get some experience...I want to do some tax tho
What were your backgrounds prior to starting this business? I think about this all the time as a big 4 auditor, but feel like I need to get some small business accounting/bookkeeping/tax experience
I’ve been industry for 12+ years. Staff up to director. I still do CFO/Controller consulting outside of her company as well. She was F100 accounting for 8 years before starting business. Small business acct is a different world. Def want to get some experience before diving in.
Realistically, Partner at big 4 - first few years 500k-700k. 5-6 years in as partner low $1M. Rainmakers - $5 to 10M. There are about 20 of them at a big public firm, so very very hard. CFO - mid market companies - 300K ish all in, your money making opportunity is if your company is bought out by a PE firm or bigger Co. for F500, millions, usually between $5-10M, some big tech or big bank CFO makes 20m+. Believe me when I say this, you’re usually not making more money being an entrepreneur than being a partner at big 4. However, if you’re the 5% of entrepreneurs that are very successful, realistically speaking you’ll be making $1M-$5M annually, but real money is again, you own a regional consulting firm and is acquired by a bigger one or PE firm. My previous boss did it, his firm was acquired for 30M, taking about a 50 ppl small consulting firm here.
I dream to accomplish these numbers
Why do you want a high salary? That’s the first answer we need? If you don’t care about friends or family, what are you going to do with the money? $100k is more than enough in most places to live a great life as a single person
He wants to cry lonely on his yacht instead of being happy in a kayak
Personally I would retire move to Thailand or Philippines and play videogames all day + bang hotties whenever I want for like $100-200 a pop (can even order them online in those places like food delivery). Maybe do some island hopping and get a new travel companion whenever I feel like. That's the dream life if you have that kind of savings from working a high pay job. Of course multi millionaires can do this in any country... But for six figure earners LCOL countries are more feasible to have this kind of lifestyle with enough savings
Private company CFO / Controller is your best bet. It often offers normal work-life balance (try to avoid PE-owned places looking to grow, etc), and pays between 175k->250k base. Big 4 -> Big 4 Manager -> Private Company Controller is a pretty common route - though I think it's usually only hopping to your clients or if you have a good relationship. A more common route is probably Big 4 -> Big 4 senior -> Private Accounting Manager -> Private Controller
I was not a great student in college and struggled to find a job. I started at a crap tiny firm (10 people) to build experience. I passed the CPA exam and jumped to a 40-50 person firm. Then I jumped to a 60-70 person firm. That firm began to really grow and I made partner in 2009 as one of the partners I worked under was retiring in 2013. My income has grown incredibly. I am not even that smart of a guy. I just like serving and helping clients. My income for 2023 was about $700k. We have partners that make over a million. We are a small firm and the work is not all that stressful. You can have a nice career at smaller firms outside the top 100.
Are you in tax?
Audit, tax was too complicated for me lol
Thousands of job openings a day for CFO/controller? In what roaring economy do you think you’re entering? The paths you’ve laid out, though not incorrect, are not easy and so I would refrain from laying out a long-term plan since I can all but guarantee it won’t shake out the way you thought it would. It’s not school where you just pass the test and then move onto the next grade level. This profession grinds people down in a way they’ve never experienced before. Mentally, physically, emotionally, spiritually…. Anything less than perfection could mean a shitty performance review if your boss simply doesn’t like you as a person. It is not a foregone conclusion that you will be strolling along these tracks ten years down the road. Most people burn out before they break through the ceiling into BIG money, and every individual has their upper limit on how much they can handle.
155k in public after 9 years (experienced manager). Still plenty of upward mobility left Not big 4
Nice work man
I would pay 156k for that user name.
Lmao imagine an intern finding out their experienced managers Reddit username
💀💀💀
Easiest path is to start your own firm But yeah it is easy to dream big when you haven't done any serious work or haven't put in serious long hours.
Slow your roll. It’s one thing to be thinking about money as a student (and pre-internship to boot!) but I bet your tune will change after you’ve got a few busy seasons under your belt. Work life balance isn’t just hours on the clock, it’s also the stress of juggling multiple tasks and clients while also being detail oriented and highly organized, to say nothing of the clients themselves and the personalities you’ll likely encounter. It’s a special kind of hell to be put on a team where the manager doesn’t know how to lead and your client has just issued their fifth version of the trial balance.
Public partners not at big four can be as much as $2m a year. I know that for a fact. Private is one in a million to come close. I know too many on controller path that never made CFO and are stuck under $250k forever.
I think you should focus on your internship first
Thought of what to do with the much wanted wealth? Die on a gold pile so others inherit everything?
4. Enough to afford the finest-quality blow for the rest of your life
Don’t have anything to add beyond what others have said. Just wanted to say that, respectfully, you’re a bitch - get over your three year old ex. I lost a 6 year relationship and life gets better if you want it to. Helps if you’re in a good position financially/professionally but you also need to have a decent personality, hobbies, and attitude in life.
A Big 4 partner told me he made a couple million two years ago and that was about average for the partners. A record year, but still enormous pay.
Most big 4 partners make less than but close to $1M. There are a few rainmakers of course, but the avg is not multi-million.
I’ve heard different from my network
Only make 65k
I’ve always been in the private industry and am also a CPA. Took me 9 years to reach Controller level but now make a little under $200k (salary + bonus).
A shitload. More importantly though, you can make a comfortable upper middle class salary for very little actual work and sit on your ass all day at work. That’s why we do this.
1. If you don’t mind longer work hours and client work, then definitely the best path to a big salary. 2. Can be very high paying and rewarding, but it really depends on the industry and size of company. Be careful in this path, once in a particular industry for a while it can be hard to switch industries since more senior roles often require prior experience in the same industry. 3. This is a silly path. New accounting firms and ERP startups are a dime a dozen.
Your first option is probably the best one. I work at a big 4 myself and I’ve talked a lot of partners who told me that it’s a great career path! You get 10% of each contracts so If you have a big client with a contract of 3M, that’s $300,000!! That’s not bad but I will end by saying that work life balance is important! Find a wife and start a family :)
I’d do a deep dive and read up on how transformative Gen AI is next and then reevaluate those first two paths.
not a lot (like wealthy a lot) while doing it but provides the necessary surplus per paycheck to build up towards wealth if you are relatively careful with spending habits
7 figure CPA here. It’s possible to do without working stupid hours.
7 figure? How?
Partner in a national firm as well as entrepreneurial in my investing activities
You show me your pay stub, I quit my job right now and work for you.
i'm right below director currently at 160k altogether. Once i'm at director in less than a year, my base will be around 170-180. If all my stock awards vest, in four years i will be making roughly 250-300k per year with an additional 200k base. At that point i will start trying to buy some various businesses that are perfectly fine with absentee owners and then retire in 10 years. If you can find a good publicly traded company this is the way to go imo. I barely work 35 hours a week.
All three will be rewarding in experience, knowledge and pay. I got experience in #2 and then #1 while doing #3 and after 15yrs #3 is the most rewarding and less stressful. As a CPA/Tax Preparer, I generate $450 - $500K in revenue and take a salary of $225K. I control my hours, work, and peace of mind.
Join big 4, learn enough to become and entrepreneur and title yourself CFO.
HCOL. I make 110k after 5 years and I just wanna cap out here. I live a good life and maybe I want a little more like 150k, but I don't want all the stress and corporate bullshit. 4. Government. I can make 6 figures after a few years, continue to get pension, never get fired, and no stress.
Such a sad way to view the world. Wanting to make as much money as humanly possible never made sense to me. To do what with?
If we’re talking pure accounting only: Big 4: stay til manager at least exit to 150-180k TC job Big director: $300k Big 4 partner: 800-1.2m median by 5 years in partnership Partner National - 500-1m Partner Regional - 250-800 Buyout solo tax firm and run a one man band or you+EA and assistant:150-400k CFO - PE Backed average around 1m - 2m TC, but typically this will be after getting 5 years in public at least, and controller and cfo roles at PE backed firms CFO - VC startup 1m total comp CFO small public to F500 - 500k - tens of millions CFO private midsize 50m-1b rev - 300k-1m CAO F500 - $500k-1M Controller range all over the place - 150k-500k depending on company size Get a T25 MBA along the way full time to pivot to something else that can still enhance your path to high profile CFO, or due PT T25 MBA to not pivot but help go to CFO.
I just hope OP plans to take the constant heathy eating health check ups and other health affirming things in his high stress trek to success. Because it will take its toll.
It depends
I’d recommend you just spend some time browsing & exploring big4transparency.com and the spreadsheet to gain an understanding of different markets. It’s good to form your understanding about tax / audit, versus consulting, versus industry roles. Look at comp but also job satisfaction and weekly hours worked. In all cases the ceiling is excessively high, consulting brings you more comp earlier, but theres a lot of variation in how happy people are in consulting as well
Also for what it’s worth I’ve done some of all of these. Here’s my journey: I started in tax, actually quite liked it, got bored after a few years and was really really bothered by low starting comp and firm politics. While at the Big 4 I got loaned out on some consulting initiatives, it was cool, the people were great but the work felt very abstract and a little empty in my short time being there. I struggled not really seeing a real impact from what I was doing. Next I left to be a “controller” (title inflation but I was the only finance / accounting employee) at a super super tiny startup. Really interesting but hell on earth, no boundaries, working 24/7. Currently working FP&A in tech and it’s the happiest I’ve been in any role. About 3 years in though and it’s almost time for me to move on. I’ve always had the entrepreneurial itch, I’m glad I did not go directly into it and have developed industry knowledge, a network, some hard and soft skills before pursuing that. Now not quite time yet, but very soon I plan on transitioning to that full time. It’s scary as hell because I’m making the jump before it’s fully able to fund my lifestyle but I need to be able to dedicate some time to it. I’ve gotten myself to a place where I could very easily find a new role or some contract work to fall back on so it makes sense to make that jump now. I would not advise pursuing that immediately before gaining some experience, BUT some people do and have massive success. Overall my advice is to take chances and bet on yourself. If you always have something in the back of your mind, make moves toward giving it a try. It’s often possible to go back. If I had to go back to tax, I bet I’d be better off at it now that I understand the buyer’s perspective. Good luck
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Depends where you live but in a bigger city you can make over $200k as a controller or above and still have a life
There are lots of paths. Once you become an owner the sky is the limit for earning potential. Find what you love and LEARN.
I am less than 10 years in and total around 360K base + bonus. I did 6 years of big four and now privately held company. I am the highest up accounting seat in a department of about 15. I’m happy with where I am at and know that there is still upward mobility from a pay perspective.
What type of jump in comp did you see after leaving b4 with 6 yrs exp?
I left big for 120K all in, now 5 years later I am 360K. I’ve worked hard and have pretty good people skills.
Currently a controller, always worked at smaller businesses everything under 50 million. Current company is about 8m, but I'm the only person running everything in our department. Honestly I have a chill gig and I'm in pretty good with the PE company that owns us. I imagine I'll be at CFO within the next ~5 years, bouncing around internally to another company or two. There's plenty of smaller companies that might not need a CFO, but need someone to run the accounting department. Currently no CPA, but I'm studying for my exams. Did one year in public at a small firm. I've always worked in industry, 8ish years experience, I make ~165k + equity.
No idea im getting karma points 5
98k senior 1 in NYC. Started at a tiny local firm (think less then 10 CPAs and even fewer partners), then RSM and now EY
This career is more about stability with a solid living and not ridiculously high earnings. Finance is more likely to provide that however the stability in accounting is what makes the field attractive
I don’t even know I’m 3.5 years in I make right at $100k plus I have a couple of non-accounting side hustles that pulls in about $20k Started at BIG4, early promoted to senior, job hopped to another BIG4 for a pay bump, can’t find anything else that pays the same atm but I’m looking, even applied to the IRS Somehow I’m in the system as a remote employee though and I mostly work from home and haven’t faced any backlash on returning to office so it’s like on one hand it sucks ass on the other hand it sucks less than my peers and my flexibility is crazy. Anyway that’s a lot to say that bro idk I’m so burnt out that I don’t even check what I’m doing tomorrow never-mind in 10 years… There’s a reason not a lot of people make it to Partner or CFO I fully went into this thinking fuck it I’ll work my ass off and become partner but just working your ass off isn’t enough really. Anyway off to work bro it’s 7:05 and I wanna be done by 7:00 PM
While the sky is the limit, realistically, you’ll top out at or around $150-$200k. While a lot of people might say they are making xyz, they are seriously limited in number.
U are too optimistic. Other than positive things, you need to include some negative things such as you may burnt out / suffer mental health on the journey to audit partner/ CFO and completely shift your path. You may not care abt work life balance at your young age, but after 30y, you may start to value it.
1. Assuming the Big4 will still be partnerships with actual partners (not partner-MDs) in the next decade.
My old bosses who owned a small public firm in a small town made roughly 325k a year. I know this because one of them accidentally left their payroll report on the printer and one paycheck for them was $13,000
What kinda psycho doesn’t care about work life balance…people like you are what’s wrong with this field accepting ridiculous hours….not to be a dick but do you have 0 friends family and hobbies??
It’s not the salary that makes you rich. Most common occupations of millionaires lists CPA at number 2. Engineers are 1. Teachers are 3. It’s about how you invest your salary. https://www.rd.com/list/careers-millionaire/
On number 3 , you don’t need to develop a new software solution, you can become an implementation partner for either an ERP or enterprise performance management developer.
I was a controller after 5 years of public accounting and 1 year of industry as an accounting manager. Director of finance by 5 years after that. My title is accurate for what I do on a daily basis but I work for start ups so small companies, nothing public so maybe not as long of a path as others. Path to CFO or further leadership into c level is unsure/not as straightforward I think. Anyway, I make 175k and have some stock from my current and last employer. I did get my cpa when I was in public which helped I think put me on this trajectory but otherwise I just found a niche and I work hard and I like industry/being cross functional.
Also I have always worked in very high or high cost of living areas.
Tons of opportunities to make a comfortable middle class salary. Few opportunities to make an extraordinary salary, which I'd consider to be $500K+. $100K is very easy. $200K is achievable if you're a high performer. $300K is doable if you're both a high performer and have a good amount of experience. $300K+ is where you start finding fewer and fewer opportunities.
1. You say you don't care about a work life balance, but I would be careful saying that. If you go into it head first and make little time for yourself you're going to burn out very quickly. You have to find some hobbies or something to do outside of work, as tax season can become extremely stressful. Accounting is nothing like they teach you in school. There's much more than reconciling a trial balance and entering adjustments. There's so many compliance forms that go alongside tax deadline which makes getting everything done on time excruciating. And if you don't have some way of letting out stress or some way of having excitement, you're not gonna make it long. Also the stress of a high turnover at these bigger firms can be excruciating to deal with. Which means clients get passed around from person to person, which adds an extra level of frustration from having to constantly deal with irritated clients that have to deal with a new accountant every year. Plus you have to have your CPA, or you'll never get to partner. Can't sign a return without it. Or maybe you're one of that very small percentage who really love just working. 2. Getting into a controller position can be challenging. You really just need to stick around and get some years of experience, making sure to advance every few years. Or else find somewhere else where you can advance. Don't get stuck in an accounts payable role forever. The most important thing is landing a job after college. I wouldn't worry so much about which field you go into, just as long as you get a well paying job. Get a couple years of experience, then find a job in the field you prefer. It will take a bit to figure out where you belong, and what makes you happy. Life never goes the way you plan it.
the miseducation of OP at their accounting grad school: CFO/Controller: Slower path… probably most practical cuz there are 1000s of job openings everyday for these kind of positions no way in hell there are 1,000s of these positions opening every day. take it from someone at this level who rarely if ever sees a decent exit opportunity for something that would be considered a good lateral move. don't be naive.
Nobody talks about option 3, thats why I assume its the best risk/reward. You can always bounce back to your old role if you fail.
honestly think it would be faster to hit controller than partner.. also while there are always roles, they’re not always at great companies. you could get a CFO job at a small company and have to work 80+ hour weeks. even if it did take you longer to get to CFO/Controller over a partner, the road there would be much more enjoyable with work/life balance and you might be delayed a few years. Not a big deal.
Its easy to say you don't care about work life balance when you are 24. I didn't either. It changes when you get a little older and realize great money is not the key to a happy life. I made tons of money working 70+ hours at one point. I found cool stuff I bought still in the box years later because I had not time to enjoy it. I changed careers, make a decent living (200k+), enjoy my work, and don't kill myself trying to make more.
Hey by the way, you don’t know what you mean yet by saying you don’t care about work life balance.
For ease of getting to those CFO roles I would do 4-5 years in public accounting. Can be even at a top 50 firm doesn’t t need to be big 4. Then leave for the industry you worked the most in. You will have contacts and a reputation already and don’t have to work your way up. You have to job hop in industry to move from staff acct to cfo. Most never make it past assistant controller without switching companies or it takes too long.
The possibilities are limitless. Be good with people, get good with your work, work 80 hour weeks, job hop to positions that are increasingly higher on the ladder, take on lots of responsibility. I will never do any of that. I would rather make 100-150k and not have to stress too much. Money over about 150k doesn't add much to life unless you are a billionare and then money=power but you will not get there in accounting.
Guy at former employer (mutual/hedge fund manager) got in relatively early in the history of the company, maybe when he was 30-35 and he was now ~50. He was the controller for the funds (not CFO of company) - his job was to sign off each day indicating all the money was there and properly accounted for. In practice, 80% of this is done by a computer, and you can hire 5-6 CPAs and random interns to do the other 20% under you and double check everyone’s work. So as far as I could tell, this guy did very little work. Couple calls and a meeting each day, and obviously had to put in time early on to be promoted and build a high trust team of subordinates. Anyway his salary was like 1.5 million a year with lots of stock and benefits I sometimes think about that and wish i’d studied harder in accounting.
I have no accounting expierence and need to find a bookkeeper because I know so little about accounting, but that's another point. I found the topic interesting so I clicked in. As a current small business owner and someone who has been working in the family business your end points for 1 are way off about family or work life balance. There are a very few amount of people who are capable of keeping up with the work-life balance necessary to do that. I worked 15-16 hours Monday - Saturday for 2 years. I had to stop because I had no time for myself and I was burning myself out. You do need time to recharge your batteries, some more than others, so that is a certain thing to consider. The other thing is that you're 24 now, and likely won't think of having a family and settling down for another 6-8 years. All of the people I know that are in the upper echelons of C-Suite have to sacrifice lots of family time in order to be there and they always resent their job for that fact. Not to say they don't love what they do, but without fail, they wish it didn't come at the expense of their family. Having a newborn son now, and seeing him smile at me, I know that is what is important to me. So prioritizing your life is critical. Third thing, the big boy positions come with the big boy problems. They are unrelenting because if it was something easy, someone else further down the food chain would have solved it for you. It takes a person of special temperament, skills, knowledge, intelligence and dedication to be in that role. Not saying that you don't possess all of those attributes or that the pursuit of the position isn't fruitful or worthwhile, it's just something to keep in mind as your work your way up the hierarchy. I would really take a look at where you are at each level and ask yourself, am I making enough money to support myself (or my family if you have one at that time) in my necessities, can I reach my goals for life and retirement, am I happy with the burden of work that I have and the problems that come across my desk, and am I willing to stay in this position for 20 years and still be happy for those 20 years. If the answer to all of those is yes, then you know that is as far as you need to go. As I've gotten into my mid 30's and am continuing to have the worst year + of my life, I have realized that being happy in my position and in work is the most important thing. If you are miserable every day in life, how much money you make doesn't matter. You're just now miserable in a fancy package.
Big 4 partner is equal parts merit and luck. Sometimes they just skip a year when it comes to promoting partners in every specialty in every geographic region. So while you can certainly try, don’t bank on it and be realistic. I got ‘the message’ my 2nd year as a senior manager that I wasn’t making partner. I did asset management in audit in NYC and they typically promoted two partners per year… they just told me that they were cutting back to one promotion per year, ultimately one every other year. And of the 11 remaining senior managers they liked other people more. They fired me a week later. On the way out the door one partner summed it up pretty well ‘if youre not 1 rated you will eventually be 5 rated.’ Fast forward 4 years, I’ve tripled my salary, have two kids, equity stake, work a gentleman’s 40 hours, everything in my life has improved. So just keep your options open.
34M here making $275k plus $60k equity as a segment controller at a Fortune 500 company working 40-45 hours per week most weeks. It’s high pressure and stressful but the comp is obviously very rewarding and will only go up more from here.