Here is my situation. Im tdy, i dont have a car, dude in my class that stays in same building does. I tag along to school and back on his schedule. (15 min walk if no car) i also pay attention to his gas tank and insist to fill it up every time. I make sure i am on his terms and he is not on mine. Your friend needs humbling.
It's not real common to be authorized a rental when TDY for school unless your home unit ponies up. More common for someone to decide to bring their own vehicle to the school, gas for the local area will rarely be reimbursed for a POV while TDY for school.
I've driven my POV to Keesler more than once so I could have wheels while I'm there.
What do the reporting instructions say? If it says anything to the effect of "required" or "highly suggested", there's your justification to put it on your DTS authorization. My A1C troop's first TDY was alone to a location that had exactly this. The unit authorized his rental car.
Edit: and as for getting reimbursed for POV while TDY, see 020212 B3 from the JTR.
AETC will refuse to pay for rental or gas, your orders will need to specifically authorize the use of a personal vehicle for local transportation and then AETC will insist your home unit pays.
AETC doesn't have the funds to pay for rentals or gas. Guardsmen sometimes get their home unit to pay but it is exceedingly rare for active duty.
>AETC will refuse to pay for rental or gas
Show me where I said AETC has to pay for the rental/gas. The RIs I usually see can (and usually do) say rental car required or highly recommended, at the cost of the unit. Our unit (AD, and at an AETC base to boot) has almost always had the funds available for this. Obviously if there's 3 people going to the same TDY location, they share 1 rental car, but there's almost always a rental car.
I don't know what training they're sending yall to but it's literally been once in 9 years I got an auth for a POV, and that was only because it was a 6 month long and the gas to and from the school was cheaper than flights.
And here I thought AETC didn't care about its CE folks. Guess it was just Altus CE they don't care about
For NCOA, they (AETC) said you need to fly, but if you choose to take your POV you're only entitled to whatever the plane ticket would cost.
Makes sense when they have 150 students in a class, 6x a year. If you're stationed at one of the further bases like Camp Bullis or Randolph, then you get reimbursed for mileage to & from Lackland.
>Edit: and as for getting reimbursed for POV while TDY, see 020212 B3 from the JTR.
AETC will say in their reporting instructions that airline is the preferred mode of travel for students and if you decide to take your POV, you're only entitled to reimbursement up to what the plane ticket would be.
I went to the last NCOA and it was part of the reporting instructions.
What may be authorized or approved (after the fact) and what the Approving Official will authorize/approve are different things. The JTR says it's legal to reimburse mileage in and around the TDY area, but it is not an entitlement. Ask the Approving Official before assuming that since it's in the JTR you will automatically be reimbursed.
I didn't read the whole thing.
He is an adult and has the obligation to get to work. He has a salary he can use for such resources. It is not your responsibility as a coworker / wingman to enable and baby him.
In a pinch, it is nice and appropriate to be a team player to help out, but there is a limit to that.
I have seen this before. Moochers are gonna mooch.
It sounds like he needs a polite mature conversation, not dropping hints, not subtleties, but a straightforward notice of the reality of the situation.
I don’t blame you for not reading the whole thing, I apologize for not summing it up, just had a lot on my mind.
And I agree with your response entirely, but I don’t think much is going to change the situation no matter how many conversations I have with the dude.
The point is it is on him to get to work. If you don't give him a ride and he doesn't report to duty then that is failure to go and is a disciplinary matter. If that means he has to get some paperwork to learn about how to be responsible then that is life, and it is his life, not yours. He can learn that lesson or he can get shown the door.
We get looked down at for not "Being a wingman" and shit. I would put it as volunteer work on EPRs. But word it well like helping a disenfranchised youth with transportation. Or go to his supervisor through my supervisor and make him answer for why he doesn't bring him to and from work
Yes he can ride the bus [in civis] and change at work, or purchase other means of transportation like a bicycle or scooter or his own damn feet.
I used to ride my bike or the bus to work prior to the military because I was poor as fuck.
You aren't this dudes daddy/mommy/whatever. If it was like, mutal riding to work and they made sure to be outside at the exact same time you were out there getting in the car, maybe I'd think you were an Ahole for saying no to THAT.
But like anywhere else? meh.
Also dude does NOT get to tell you when you're going to and from work. That's the car owners perogative. He should be grateful for any scrimpings and rides he gets, and also offer up gas money just to be polite.
You're not being rude. This entitled Airman is being rude AF.
Ah a classic conundrum. This should be an ALS question. I dont THINK they can FORCE you to drive him everywhere. Honestly idk bro. You're definitely in the right, I'm pretty positive it can't be a lawful order either to drive him to work every day.
Tell him to kick rocks and get a bike. Say you don't drive to work and get a bike
> but I don’t think much is going to change the situation no matter how many conversations I have with the dude.
You make the change. It's your car. Tell him to piss off and walk, get a bike, or get his own car. In my eyes, it's not even about the money. Dude needs to be more independent. If he keeps riding with others, then it's there problem. You're not his mom, he needs to grow up and take responsibility for getting to work on time.
To dive a little deeper, I would say you should ask yourself why you care so much. To me this is one of those easy relationships to cut off. You don't have to be everyone's friend, and being a people pleaser will open the door for others to take advantage of your kindness.
If people are giving you grief for not helping, they're just virtue signaling. They know the airman doesn't have transportation but are not offering him rides. It's on-base dorms. As if "living in the same area" is so far out of the way that the virtue signalers can't make the long-ass 5-minute drive to the dorms.
Honestly, I think it was just a lot of pent up irritation for some time. I made the post out of irritation before I was released, and I knew what exactly was going to happen. Coworker 1 rejected him from riding, then I followed suit. I watched him walk home and then more replies came in.
I talked to the subject airman before about this, and he told me once that he understood where I was coming from - although I sounded like an asshole about it. Not like I care what he thinks about me, or anyone of that matter. Let alone, not like anything changed if it got to this point. I think what bothers me is that I felt like I was being taken advantage of and despite me being generous and accommodating to him, I never received anything from it. Not even a thanks. Dude’s not of age so he couldn’t even buy me a beer, haha. On top of that, I just remember people telling me what the issue was about me giving him rides since we came from the same place and work at the same place. It’s just about principle. I never wanted to do it other than the times I’ve offered out of generosity or kindness.
I’m sorry for being so bothered about it, really. I’ve talked to him and others for opinions, but I feel like it didn’t get anywhere. I’m putting my foot down for sure.
Learning to say no and to do it tactfully is a good skill to have in life. Just tell him you prefer to drive alone and that you have errands to run and just cut it off right there. Tell him it has nothing to do with him.
If your coworkers give you grief, tell them the same thing...you prefer to drive alone. Be firm and hold your ground.
This. I knew a dude that would bike to work every day. Was like a 4 mile bike ride. Dude didn’t complain about it and it worked out pretty well for the time being (until he got his bike stolen). After that he bought a cheap beater. OP’s airman needs to just save up and get a cheap beater if cash is so tight.
Some of us are willing to pay for entertainment. I'd 100% spot someone living in my building money for a bike to base.
For reference, I work on (Schriever, a 45 min drive from my house with a couple of 6%+ grades and shit winters.
It's also not on him to be passive-aggressive because he doesn't want to help a fellow airman out.
But hey, that's what the Airforce is all about. Every man for himself.
No one is encouraging passive aggression. There needs be a blunt, straightforward discussion about it. But, that means this individual needs to get his own damn ride. He gets paid just like everyone else. Period dot.
Here At my first base I didn’t have a ride but me and my Suitemate came to an agreement that every time I got paid I’d give him 100 bucks for his troubles to covers gas and other expenses that worked until I got my own car
This was going to be my suggestion as well. Just charge him a reasonable amount and if he refuses, stop letting him mooch. If anyone asks, let them know you offered a fair price and he refused and that’s the end of discussion.
So Ive been here when I lived in the dorms. And this is what I told the ncos who expected me to give rides to other Airmen. I was willing to take them to work but I wasn't going to be late to work because of the either and I wasn't their mom so I'm not gonna wake up them up. Basically if they beat me to my car I'd take them to work as I'm already going there. It wasn't my job to take them to appointments or any where they wanted just because I had a car and they didn't. I was also working as a mechanic so I would look over any car they found on marketplace or something and tell them what it would cost to fix anything that was broke, and I'd supervise them doing the repairs and would bring the tools if they paid for parts. Few guys took me up on that and helped them get a $500 car and they drove it for about 2yrs while saving money and building credit to get a nicer one from the dealership.
That is what I did. You could get a ride if you were already ready. I would not wait for anyone ever.
It's honestly not a problem if the people needing rides are cool, but it does suck when it is just some mooch loser that you don't even want to be around ever. I would straight up tell that person I would want like $50 a week if they want more than 1 ride a week.
This is actually what I did when I didn't have a car. I bummed rides, but paid for a tank of gas a month. It's not on me to pay for all the dude's travel expenses, but I can pay my fair share of getting to/from work.
Tell him to get a used car under 4k. Or an electric bike from Amazon or Walmart. Tell him you’re not gonna give him rides all the time you got shit to do. also depends on weather and distance. I have given plenty of airmen rides exclusively everyday to work until they saved up enough to buy a bike or car. nothing wrong with helping out but you ask them for gas money every week they will start looking for cars or bikes trust me
If I have to pass your destination on the way to my destination, then you can ride with me. Otherwise, you're buying me beer or washing my car. Being the nice guy and giving people rides at their every beck and call gets old quick. It's ultimately up the individual to get themselves to and from work.
>If I have to pass your destination on the way to my destination, then you can ride with me.
They have identical destinations - home and work.
OP needs to ask for gas money (something like \~$25 a week) or stop giving the dude rides if it bothers him this much.
Maybe you should be an Uber or Lyft. Then you could charge him for the ride. /s
Just kidding
Seriously though. I had to deal with this for a while in the dorms. When I moved off base the guy asked me if I would come get him everyday. He was upset when I told him no.
He is an adult and should at minimum be respectful of you, your time, and your property. Good luck
I plan on getting a motorcycle anyways. Dude gave a dejected look when I told him that. You’re in the military, it’s up to you to get to work on time and effectively.
Had the same issue with an airman who got a DUI. We lived in the same dorm so they expected me to give them a ride to and from work. Would come knocking on my door in the morning.
Tell their supervisor, that's what I did and it ended on the spot.
BLUF: This is an issue that should be addressed by his supervisor, an NCO, assuming there’s nothing else going on.
First off, no, you don’t owe him. I understand the seasoned airman’s response as an NCO who’s had to hunt people down, but it’s the wrong response. Every airman has a responsibility to get to work on time. I don’t cut slack to NCOs or airmen who choose to live an hour + away from base.
Second off, have you discussed this with him? You’re, presumably, in the same shop. What’s his reasoning, and is he willing to understand that he should be helping you out, as well as others helping him out, if you’re helping him? If he’s entitled, then that needs to be a reality check. If he’s just stupid or ignorant, you gave a wingman a valuable life lesson.
Finally, where the *fuck* are NCOs in this picture? If he’s constantly mooching rides, and (presumably), SrA are bitching you out for not enabling that, where the fuck are they? This is the kind of shit a supervisor should be having a chat with the airman about. One of our fucking jobs is teaching young folks how to adult
Our E5’s are out and we don’t have any E6’s. It’ll be fixed soon, but it’s been like this for a while now.
I’ve had as many discussions with him, I could count them on one hand and have no room to spare. We’ve talked, I went off on him one time and he called me kind of an asshole, but I was trying to tell him that he isn’t entitled to anything free. He told me he understood where I was coming from, but he still asks.
I told him and others that I’ve been giving him rides out of whatever kindness is in my heart, and I’ve been trying to be accommodating to him. But I can’t keep doing this. I don’t give a shit if we live on the same floor level of the same building. Honest to God with my hand on big fucking stack of Bibles, I’ve had conversations with other airmen about who’s gonna take him home. The conversations were ridiculous, and I felt like I was a parent. I shouldn’t feel that way and I hate how the senior airmen were trying to say that me giving him rides wasn’t a big deal. They’re not the ones giving him rides, I was most of the time! And the guy is sick of it too!
On one hand, I fear him getting a car because I’ve seen how he drives. He’s done an illegal U turn in our old NCO’s car when he was on lunch, and my inner former SF self had inner rage when I saw that. Don’t even know why our old NCO gave him his car, but whatever. On the other hand, I want him to just get his own ride because at least it will take some weight off of the other airmen and myself in the shop.
If I had a young school aged kid, I would do anything to make sure he or she is safe and secure. But this isn’t my son, this is some 19 something year old! Hell nah! I actually was able to watch his ass walk home after work today.
Made this post before we were released because I had so much irritation built up, and then he asked me. “You going to the dorms?” Told him yeah, but I’m doing other shit beforehand. (I didn’t.) And the other guy didn’t want to take him either. So satisfying to watch.
Wow, that sounds like a shit show of a shop. If you’ve talked with him before, talk to his supervisor and up channel. It’s good of you, and nice of you, to help him out, but if he’s calling you an asshole for not wanting to nonstop give him rides, that’s crossing lines. And fuck that SrA, I get the impulse, but that’s fucked. Especially if you’re having to coordinate his rides
The SrA only gave me weird looks and negative disposition for saying that I wasn’t entitled to give him a ride. The other SrA was understanding of where I was coming from…
None of this bullshit will matter to me once I get a motorcycle and take my car off insurance to save money. The issue will be on their hands and if they ask me to give the dude a ride, all I have to say is “I rode a motorcycle, I can’t legally drive my car.”
The main thing is that it shouldn’t be an issue at all. I don’t mind giving rides to airmen in need. In need, meaning they don’t have a car BUT are saving for a safe and reliable vehicle, or are legitimately medically impaired, or they’re truly in a shitty situation. But if they can walk or ride a bicycle walk with no issues, then they can do that. Why do I need to be the middle man? They can be their own transportation.
Oh I give airmen rides when it rains all the time. I get it. But that SrA shouldn’t be giving you shade, they should be giving him shade for not doing shit to scratch your back. SrA exist to squash problems like this via social pressure, in addition to ensuring the smoke pit receives a thorough 8 hour long FOD inspection
I agree with what everyone else has been saying, especially since I had my own car since tech school.
I'm not sure what base/ state you are located in, but I wanted to give you a heads up about your "I will be dropping insurance on the car" statement.
Most states will not allow you to renew your registration without at least minimal insurance on your vehicle. Expired plates lead to towing, even on base. I would check your laws before completely dropping your insurance.
Most companies have a really minimum "parked car" fee to keep your insurance active. If you choose that option, though, you could end up busted even using it once for inclement weather. Just some food for thought.
Good luck to you!
I would just talk to him and tell him that if he wants a regular ride to and from work, then he can help pay for your gas. Also that you reserve the right to terminate the verbal agreement at anytime for whatever reason. It is nice to help people out in a pinch, but at some point, he is just taking advantage of you.
I was that airman for about 6 months into my first duty station. Bumming rides the 5 mile trek to the WSA at Whiteman from the dorms. A couple times a week, though, I always insisted on a detour to the shoppette. If he didn't need gas, I bought the Monsters.
If you're gonna be a burden to someone, do your best to be a boon instead. That's advice I'd give this dude. Ya don't gotta divert all of the few hundred bucks you'd spend on car payment, insurance, and gas to helping your benefactor. But a few bucks a week can make all the difference in how people perceive you.
If it isn't an inconvenience then I don't see the issue. Tell him you'll leave at X time and that if he isn't ready then you're leaving. As for going home you go home when you're ready. If you want to stay and BS for 30 minutes or if you get released an hour early, you leave when you want.
That being said, you aren't obligated to give him a ride, but it's nice IF it doesn't mean you're waiting on him, etc.
Also, feel free to ask him for 10/15 dollars a week for rides (still on your schedule) if he's interested, and of he doesn't pay then feel free to stop giving rides. Or just stop either way if you really want, but it could be seen as a "dick move" since you live together (unless he's always coming out late, rushing you to go home, etc)
I understand he’s an adult.
But here’s the best solution I could come up with that might not burn bridges that could affect your work life down the road.
Have you asked him when he plans on getting a vehicle?
Have a conversation about how the way he talks to you and expects instead of being grateful.
If it comes down to gas money and insurance then that’s your personal opinion, but realistically your gas won’t be affected that much.
I used to wake up 30 minutes earlier to pickup new airman from the dorms and take them to work, drop them off at appointments, etc. Best thing I did, those guys are now some of my closest friends and have been there for me countless of times.
You could be petty and just start walking to work yourself “for health reasons”. Yeah, it might suck, but it would prove the point that walking is not impossible. Do it for a week and see what happens.
Or just tell your supervisor/shirt you will not use your personal vehicle to shuttle anyone around without compensation.
I did that at my last base, I walked everywhere I went. (It was a moderately sized Turkish base.) And I agree, it is a perfectly healthy thing to do when you walk. Good for getting those steps in.
And I’ve thought about charging as well. $3 per ride, $5 per ride on weekends in the event where he calls me or knocks on my door. (Coworker said subject airmen did that, he ignored him the entire time.)
Reading that part when he told you to “get the car started” really irks me. That would have been the end of my generosity with a “or how about you fuck off then?”
Best advice is to stop enabling him. If everyone else is so concerned about him, then they can give him rides.
I had no car (and no license, but that's besides the point) for a long time. I was asking for rides, but o was also paying my coworkers back with food/gas money as regularly as they'd accept. I'd even not ask sometimes, because I felt like a burden so I'd walk.
I think the main problem here isn't his requests for rides or expecting them, but rather his lack of care to pay you for your time/energy. Is it out of the way for you? No. But it is your private vehicle, and it is not your job to drive him. Unless you've been explicitly told to make sure he gets to work, you're both adults.
Helping is good wingmanship, but so is him paying you back somehow.
Let him know that if you keep giving him rides you'd like him to help pay for your gas when you fill up. That way he understands that it's a give and take, not a free ride. Others may be kinder and willing to give for free, but that doesn't mean you're unkind.
TLDR; I used to ask for rides, but paid back in food/gas. Tell him you want compensation if he continues to get rides. You're NTA.
I went 2 years at my first duty station without a vehicle. Accepting rides when offered is nice, but relying on others for transportation is a no go. Member needs to work on his time management and get used to walking or pony up a little bit of cash for a bicycle. If The Airman in question isn't personally inconvenienced everyday because they get to rely on others for transportation, it makes it much easier for them to spend money they otherwise would have saved for their vehicle or just put it on a lower priority.
There’s a fine line between helping and enabling poor decision making. OP has gone above and beyond with the help. Good on them. Now it’s time for the other person to be and adult and find an independent way to work. If they can’t figure that out, is that someone you really want to work with/serve with?
This subreddit: the lack of compassion and comraderie is why Airman are so lonely and we need to help each other in times of need.
Also this sub: don't enable your asshole coworker, it's their responsibility to get to work, and you shouldn't help him. Tell him to fuck off and to figure it out. Your coworkers also suck for not agreeing with you. Be selfish.
I had a similar situation with my own troop. Eventually I just had to tell him no, and tell others that they don’t need to feel obligated to provide a ride. Eventually he got his license and car. You should reach out to this person’s supervisor and let them know what’s up. Most importantly, “no” is a complete sentence. Remember that.
Sounds like he has a lot of growing up to do.
You're Not being rude at all but you should always be able to go to your Shirt. If you don't want to have to confront him to be a good wingman, you can explain to the Shirt and he can do the face to face and see what's really going on, financial difficulties or afraid of driving who knows? There's no reason you should be inconvenienced regardless of where you stay. Like someone said on another comment, "moochers are gonna mooch!"
Ah shit, thanks for informing me! I guess it won’t kill me to have two vehicles on the plan then. Though they say to take the insurance for the motorcycle off in the snowy and “insufficient” months. Or if I deploy. I’ll have to read the insurance policy more, but I’m backtracking my initial idea about taking off car insurance now.
Depending on your insurance company, you can put a vehicle in a “storage” or low-use status. I’d suggest giving them call and explaining the situation to see what they can do for you to lower your monthly payment on the car.
Also, for motorcycle insurance, I recommend Progressive. I’ve got two bikes, one is a 2009 HD Softail and the other is a 2021 Indian Challenger, full coverage, including $5K for add-ons (i.e. performance exhaust, special suspension, better handlebars, etc.) and I pay $78 per month combined.
This is a situation that is best resolved with open and honest communication.
"Heya Airman Snuffy. I don't like feeling obligated to provide you with transportation every day. So the obligation ends now. If I give you a ride, it's because I'm being nice. If I don't, then I have reasons to not provide you with a ride."
A very well thought out response. Next time he asks for a ride, which is likely tomorrow, I’ll say something very similar to this. But I’ll be firm this time.
You either start charging him gas money or don't give him ride.
I literally posted this about 6 months ago in the exact same situation.
Our flight taught him how to drive painfully and nearly died 15 times.
he took his test and passed (really unsure how) now has his own vehicle and drives to work.
Please tell your leadership about this, I joked and said it feels like my job isn't 2a**** it's 2aUber1.
Your not his uber or chauffeur.
It’s not on you to get the guy to and from work him and his supervisor should be working on a plan for that until he gets a vehicle. He needs to be humble and offer you or anyone else that give him a ride some gas money
Both are assholes. He’s an adult and needs to find an actual long term solution for transportation. You literally live in the same building and have the same destination. Those questions of who pays for insurance and gas wouldn’t change based on taking him or not.
> You literally live in the same building and have the same destination.
I agree the gas/insurance argument isn’t good but he’s not an assbole because of it. I refuse to be beholden to some other shmucks schedule just because he’s not enough of an adult to get his own transportation. Gas, insurance, car payment be damned. If he ever told me to get my own car started it’s done then and there.
You can be at my car at this time in the morning if you want a ride in, you’re not there at that time you get left.
Going home you can be at my car when I say so, and then I’m leaving. I don’t give half a shit about what time he wants to leave or what I can do for him, OP is trying to be too agreeable. Fuck em
>If he ever told me to get my own car started it’s done then and there.
I feel like the missing part of this statement is that OP didn't *know* they were getting released, so the comment probably was meant more of a "hell yeah dude we're free, let's get out of here" and wasn't quite said the way it should've been
No, you don’t have a moral or legal obligation to help anyone…but damn dude. It literally cost you nothing to be helpful (I know you have expenses, but to/from the dorm and work that you’re already commuting, 0 additional dollars spent).
I think you’re better off developing the relationship with him so you can have better influence and maybe guide him in a better direction.
None of this is “your responsibility” but as an airman (at any rank) you’re a leader. You have an opportunity to lead.
As a man you have an opportunity to provide for someone who could use the help.
As a person who have an opportunity to make the world a little more kind, a little more generous, and a little more friendly.
And you’re using all that opportunity to say “don’t rely on handouts, I’m not Uber, and get your life together.” Do you really think you’re improving anyone’s situation…to include your own? Helping people is super rewarding.
I agree with you. OP has the opportunity to reflect the kind of culture we want in the AF. A culture where everyone helps each when there is a need with boundaries in place of course.
Lol, this subreddit hates helping people out. He says he doesn't care what his co workers say, but comes here to bitch and get validation.
Now he's gonna go to work all smug, saying reddit told him he's not being a dick because it's HIS car and we don't need to help each other out.
hell no, dealt with this at my first shop. i was wasting my own time and money giving rides. it was little bit easier since we were the same rank and i literally just told him to stop being a selfish asshole and get a car. nonetheless, taking advantage of people for rides when you are obligated to be at work is a no go. what happens if he has to be at work alone? you are not responsible to pay with your own time and money for this person
Tell him to get a bike. One time purchase and doesn’t cost a lot. My drives to and from work are my time to clear my head. I’d hate having to be a free Uber.
Super long post but this is a revolving door I've noticed since I've been in. You have no obligation to assist that Airmen to get to work. They can get a bike, a scooter or a skateboard, and if they can't or wont do any of that then they should live in the dorms. You offering a ride is entirely up to you.
But you have every right to set boundaries. This scenario many of us especially in supervisory positions have seen this numerous times. My suggestion would be offer if you're feeling nice & don't when you don't want to. Secondly, if they aren't paying they're bugging. Lastly, if you do extend a ride to work establish times when they need to be waiting ON YOU! If they aren't ther; LEAVE. Not worth the headache and possible discredit to you and or paperwork if it's reoccurring.
If somebody is riding with me to work everyday, they better give me $40 a week for gas. I dont care if we live in the same place or go to the same job, they can easily take an Uber instead and let me ride to & from work in peace, in my car.
Cash gas or ass, if he wants to keep getting rides. If he doesn’t like it then he can grow the fuck up and get a car/bick/moped/way around. That said you have no obligation to give him rides
I know it’s difficult, I’ve had to deal with this too. Really it just came down to setting boundaries. Establish that they are on your schedule, not the other way around. If they line up, then fine but if not then getting to/from work is their problem. Oh and errands beyond work? Yeah that’s a firm no from me dog, unless we’re best friends (which it sounds like you aren’t)
You have every right to refuse rides, regardless of living in the same dorms, same work center, whatever. It is not your responsibility to get anyone besides yourself to and from work. If anyone gives you shit about tell them they are more than welcome to give him rides. This dude needs a reality check; a ride here and there is one thing, but to rely on someone else like he’s doing to you here is just lazy and greedy.
Ether have him walk ESPECIALLY if its nice out, it's fucking great to walk to and from work tbh when it's good weather. He can ask for a ride if the weather gets shitty or whatever because that makes sense.
OR tell him he's going to have to start slipping you money for gas, even if it's just like 5 or 10 bucks or whatever you guesstimate for the distances you drive. A few bucks here and there isn't going to break his bank or savings for his own car.
Obviously just talk to him about it and let him know. If he gives you shit or is an ass, remind him that YOU are doing HIM a service.
You're not being an asshole, your being real.
BLUF: If the Air Force is not paying to put gas in your POV, no one can force you to give this individual rides.
Don’t be afraid to tell your teammate “No, find a different way to work.” You will not face any adverse action and if you do, please use your local chain of command to address.
Source: Dealt with a similar situation before.
Only read the TLDR. He's an adult and if he's required to be to work or an appointment at a specific time then he needs to figure out how to get there and shouldn't be relying on the kindness of others. You, nor anyone in your work center are obligated to give his lazy ass a ride anywhere so tell him to deal with his own self-inflicted predicament.
If anyone else looks down on you for it don't let it bother you. If they want to step up and cart this baby around like they're his parents then more power to him. I wouldn't waste my time or my gas on someone who refuses to fix the situation themselves.
I don’t blame you for not reading the whole thing. I made the post before we were dismissed and I knew exactly what he was going to ask and what he was going to say, and had a lot of pent up irritation.
People probably do look down on me, they can think I’m an asshole or “in it for myself.” Like I give a shit, he’s not my responsibility. I don’t get paid enough to be a personal driver. I get paid enough to survive and that’s it. Peoples opinions won’t affect my well being or my life. Let them think I’m an asshole, at least the subject airman got some decent steps in today.
Sounds like a free loader, using others so he can pocket the savings from not having a car. Might be time to tell him to pay up for gas or start walking.
You're not being rude. Typically, a ride tends to be a one off favor, or, if you're ride sharing, you might alternate you driving and him driving. What does he do when you take leave or go tdy? He's big enough to sign his life away, he can figure out a way to work that doesn't include you mothering him.
You have no obligation, and if you're ordered to drive him then ask for a GOV.
Personally, at this point I would give them a ride on my timeline only. If they're not already at my car when I leave they're not getting a ride. That will put the fault 100% on them when they're late to work.
If you don't want to provide rodes anymore, you don't have to. They are responsible for getting to work. I didn't have a vehicle when I came in, and I walked. Sometimes, people would see me and give me a ride, but my default was to walk unless someone offered.
If your peers get upset, they are more than able to assist the member and take them home. Just let them know you no longer want to provide rides for free and want your space when it's time to clock out.
Don't take your car off insurance. If something happens to it while parked you're fucked. Also your rates will skyrocket when you try to get it insured again.
I used to bike and only bum rides during bad weather, extreme cold, or to and from the chow hall (there were like 9 of us at our work center and we would carpool).
He should be offering to pay some gas, buy you food, or just give you some money.
The person I bummed rides off of the most I ended up rooming with off base for over a year so I made it back up to him later on.
Stand your ground. I was in the same boat as you when I got to my first base, I was one of the few with a car. At one point I had 4 people riding to and from work with me everyday. Inside a month everyone had their own car except one person. I started just leaving him in the mornings so he wouldn’t make us both late. Some people abuse the wingman concept. Those people need to be allowed to fend for themselves for awhile so they can understand what they put other people through.
I didn’t have a car, my best friend moved out and I had to figure out how to get to work. I woke up earlier than everyone and walked the worse thing I did was ask for a ride during the rain or a heat surge. This went on for more than a year,
Then I got a car. So I don’t feel bad for this airman
Then there was a guy who at the unit where, after I figured out where this lost guy was, he decided to take his anger of not listening to my directions on me. I allowed him in my car. He then starts yelling at me threatening to fight.
After he called me a bitch to my face. I dropped his stuff off at the stop sign at the gate and told him to walk.
No one clapped, I had to tell the security forces that I won’t allow him in my car, and we had to have the shirt seperate us.
So in reality, did I win yes? Was it worth having to have a meeting with security and my shirt? No
EDIT: I had to add details to make the story make sense please don’t hit me
Bro needs to pull his legbrogini out of the garage. You’re under no obligation but if you’re doing it to be nice you should have an agreement for like $5-$10 a week
Getting to work is the individuals responsibility. If they don't have a means of transportation besides walking, they can shift the Lamborfeeties into gear, or front the money daily for another method.
I didn't have a car at my first base but ALWAYS offered gas money and didn't assume. I also walked 90% of the time.
As usual, the issue is someone acting entitled to your benevolence here. Feel free to ask for gas money or tell him you have other plans and can't give him a ride when you're not feelin' it.
I agree with you entirely.
Honestly, I don’t even know why it’s an issue. It’s a weird situation when it doesn’t need to be, and I recognize that. I’ve openly told people to fuck off or get lost, go kick rocks. But for whatever reason, in this particular situation, suddenly I care or become more “sensitive” to it. Maybe it’s because the dude is younger, or maybe it’s because he might a rank under, or maybe because it’s something like that, and I feel this strange obligation to help younger/lower ranking people out.
The dude joined the military, he’s an adult. He needs to figure his life out. But yet, I can’t understand why I get so conflicted when it comes to telling him no when it comes to this, but yet I’ve had no issues telling others to piss off when it comes to other situations. The logic makes no sense to me, but I will start to be more firm on it.
It’s silly. It’s a personal vehicle riding dispute, it’s not even that deep. Maybe it’s just the pent up irritation and of me giving in to social expectations or something, or me being told to pick him up when I don’t want to. I don’t thin anyone should be telling me to pick him up with my privately owned vehicle if I don’t want to. Take the GOV for that.
Overall, I certainly agree with your statements though.
Haha, that’s what I was gonna do when I get the motorcycle. 😂 Someone will tell me to go him him, “sorry man, I rode today. You don’t have the required PPE to be a passenger, and I’m not going to drive my car back here.” Obviously, that’s not sole reason why I’m getting one though.
Take him to the lemon lot or local used car dealers to get him to visualize driving one on his own. Best if you can ninja it and make him think it was his idea so he has immediate buy-in on the idea
You're not being rude. Imagine if both of you had cars and you carpooled because gas is expensive, both of you are mutually benefiting from the situation because both of you are paying for your gas, using only half of what you would otherwise use, and your cars depreciating less regardless of whether or not you live in the same building. I was an airman without a car before my first deployment and had to bum rides when it snowed, rained, or if I just didn't feel like riding my bike. The person giving me a ride was still doing me a favor. It doesn't matter that that favor didn't "cost" them anything i.e. they live in the same dorms, I benefited from it so I owed them a favor in return. It doesn't matter if it's paying for a tank of gas every few weeks, or lunch on Saturday he needs to work something out with his coworkers.
When I got to my first duty station, the first thing I was told was that I needed to go get a car. Lo and behold I did just that.
Tell that airman to kick rocks and sort his own shit out. This isn’t a daycare.
It happened to me in the early late 90s walking to work really wasn't an option barksdale is big and we worked like a 10 minute drive from the shop. I started making plans immediately after work that involved not going back to main base that way he could be inconvenienced. Like really ridiculous s*** like saying I was going bird-watching and I would do it and he sat in the car for an hour when I looked at egrets stuff like that he got the hint took about four trips he found other means mooched off of somebody else until they told him I'm not bringing you anymore. Also if you know anything about Louisiana it's hot he expected me to leave the engine running with the air conditioning on.
I used to live in the dorms and would drive an airman on shift to/from work all the time, they didn't have a license but weren't very motivated to get one either. We made the same amount of money so it wasn't a finance problem and it ultimately became an expectation, because when I moved off base they still expected rides. I agree with OP, if they pay for the car/insurance/gas and you're getting a ride daily, you should be giving some gas money.
I am an airman myself and I do not have a car. I have an electric bike that meets most of my needs at a secluded base. There are times when I’ve had to ask for a ride or rent a car so that I can get to an off base appointment or make it to work when it’s raining. My team has been super supportive but I’ve also made sure to only ask when I absolutely have no other option and I’ve paid them for gas. I am doing my best to not be a burden to them. It is my choice to not have a car. I can afford a cheap one but I’m choosing to wait and save so I have enough for a decent one that will last me a long time.
I understand that it is difficult to have empathy for someone who doesn’t seem to be taking responsibility for himself and then expects you to be their chauffeur. That is not a fun place to be. However, I do think that morally, you should be kind and take him especially since it is not inconvenient or making you suffer in any way. If it was out of your way, I would understand and I’d think you’d have reason to say no. But it’s the kind thing to do. You have a chance to reflect a culture in your workplace that takes care of each other. You want this airman to get a car someday and give rides to the new airman from tech school or to you when your car breaks down When I get a car in a few months, I will definitely be giving rides to those who need it because I was there once.
Be kind to the airman but also communicate that he can’t expect you to do this forever and that there are times when you can’t take him home after work. Hopefully, that will stop the comments he’s been making but if not have a conversation with him about it, the shirt or supervisor if needed. Ask him if he’s open to getting a bike or a scooter. Communicate with your team and if it’s not too much, you guys can take turns giving him rides so the burden isn’t all on one person. Make it clear the airman needs to have a timeline, a budget for this future car, in other words, a plan. I think it’s great you asked this question and I appreciate what you’ve done for this airman who obviously has some maturing to do. Your help is making a difference in his life and I hope one day he’ll acknowledge and thank you for it. But do it because it’s the right thing. I’m sure people have helped you or given you something when you didn’t deserve it. I’d be curious to hear if you have any thoughts on what I said.
F’ him. He needs to put his big boy pants on and be an adult.
EDIT: If he gives you gas money, and it isn’t so far out of the way, then I would probably have a different view.
Tell him the rides stop now and don't ask anymore. You aren't his taxi and he can buy a car or bike or whatever.
How is this dude getting to appointments or other obligations or the commissary or anywhere off base?
You just tell him the rides are over. You owe 0 explanation. Call him an freeloader if he gets pissy.
If your chain of command gives you flak for it, go to the shirt.
Had a guy like that in my old shop. I wouldn't mind if he was punctual, but I always have to call to get him to come down. I was glad when he got moved to a different shift because I was so tired of giving him rides. In that same shop, there was a guy that rode is bike to work, rain or shine.
I ask my coworkers for rides because I’m new to Eielson AK and it’s cold as balls and my building is a good 10-15 min car ride there but I still am actively looking for a vehicle and for the people who do drive me I usually give them gas money like if they give me one ride I will give them like $10 in gas but if I’m constantly getting rides from them I usually give them like $30 it’s not much especially for an airman living in the dorms
I'm seeing more Airmen coming in without licenses and have zero motivation to get them. Social media/internet has really killed the motivation for these kids coming in to drive.
I remember being hype about getting my license and a car to go hangout with friends and go on dates or just do whatever I want when I wanted.
I see the bases having to bring back bus services if they don't have them already to accommodate this issue and a ton of Airmen getting paperwork for missing the bus to get them to work on time.
Definitely not reading all of that. It was nice of you to give him a ride every now and then but you wouldn’t be an asshole for telling him that you’re done driving him and that he needs to find another way to get to work.
So for me, I come from a small town and I grew up very poor, so I got my driver's license right before I left for basic training because at 17, I didn't really NEED one. When I got to my first base, I had to get rides everywhere. I hated it. After showing my reliability, my supervisor, who I had built a friendship with (I would watch his dog while him and his wife would go places, and we were from the same area), actually cosigned on a loan for a car for me (at 18 at this point, I didn't have credit at all)(definitely not something I'm saying ANYONE in your chain should do). I paid the loan off months ahead of time because I felt guilty needing help.
Having to get rides all the time, I felt so guilty, and I WANTED to be self-reliant. Maybe it had to do with growing up so poor and being raised to take care of myself. This airman you're talking about doesn't seem like he's getting into the mentality where he feels the need act like an adult. It's time for him to sink or swim, in my opinion. I think he's just so comfortable with help. He feels like, "What's the rush?" What he really needs is to stop having so much reliable help. He has to learn to take care of himself. What happens when any of his people helping PCS/deploy/go TDY? He needs to be sat down and told to find an alternative to getting to work.
It's your car so you can decide what you want or dont want to do. It's not about money, especially cuz you said you would be willing to pitch in for a bike, it's about his attitude. He does sound like he has become a bit entitled, so I would stick to that if you have another conversation with him. Just be straightforward and tell him that he has become too needy and needs to "adult" for himself. If others give you shit for it, tell them you are helping this airman better himself, and are entitled to making decisions about your property and time without interference. If they care so much, they can drive him lol.
1. He is responsible for his own transportation to work and wherever he needs to be. I've had 3 airman do the same thing. Dorms are like 5 miles from work. It sucks but hey there's a bike/running trail all the way from the dorms to our building. The problem wasn't exactly getting to work. It was them taking airmen away from work to get to appointments, lunch, etc. that shit doesn't fly. At that point the supervisor team got involved and got them to sort their shit out with a plan and a cutoff date for during work rides. We even had a mil to mil couple trying to say "they couldn't afford a vehicle". Bruh y'all are getting twice my pay and I'm running a household of 4 with 2 vehicles.
2. As far as getting to work, this sounds like you being bitchy about it saying "gas money". It's not adding cost to your travel to and from work. That's a weak excuse for you being selfish. Yeah you can decide who's allowed in your car but if it's not an actual hindrance... Is the airman causing you to be late? Using you as a ride other than to and from work? Those are different issues. If the fuck can't be ready to go on time, leave em. If they're trashing your vehicle, keep em out. But complaining about gas money to go to the same destination annoys me.
I didn’t read all the details, but echo what some others have said.
Getting to work on time is a fundamental part of having a job. As such, it is a personal responsibility.
It is okay to assist them for a short period of time? Certainly. Should it be a permanent solution? Not at all.
Once upon a time I didn't have a driver's license or a car and my co worker lived next door to me. We carpooled for a few months until one day she said I need to be an adult and get a license and car. She gave me a month to sort my shit out.
The airman sounds entitled. And your schedules may not always line up. What happens when you PCS? He needs to be an adult and get his own form of transportation.
At a certain point you just have to tell these people time to 'adult'. If they don't show up to work they'll get paperwork. If you stop enabling them they'll get it figured out pretty fast.
We have an Amn that been on station for 1.5 years with no car and no plans to get one. He has been hitching rides with an Amn from another squadron. When the Uber Amn can’t pick him up, I’m expected to drive him to the dorms across base. I don’t even live in the dorms. I definitely understand your annoyance. Once he puts on SrA and has to move out of the dorms, hopefully that will give him a reality check.
That being said, I straight up told him that I’m not going to give him rides anymore and he shouldn’t expect it from others either. Putting them in an uncomfortable situation /should/ force them to sack up and figure their shit out. I haven’t been asked to give a ride since. Good luck brother 🫡
Everyone who enlists(and commissions for that matter), is an adult. That means making adult decisions, if he decided to not buy a vehicle that’s on the individual. Making that your problem is being an asshole. Sounds like you have some real piece of work co-workers as well.
Being a wingman is being there for your fellow Airman when they NEED you, not when they want to you give them a ride because they decided to not buy a vehicle. You’ve more than likely done more than enough to help this person.
I don't think you're an asshole or rude either way you choose. If I were in your shoes I 'd set some rules. If you are at my car when I am leaving to go to work or leaving to go home I'll give you a ride. If you're not there for literally any reason, I'm not waiting. I'm not giving rides to any place else.
We had an airman who refused to get a car. He lived in the dorms with like half the shop so it wasn't an issue for awhile, except he started trying to guilt trip people into giving him rides.
The final nail in his coffin was when he showed up late responding to the on-call because it was at night and he didn't want to walk in the rain. He knocked on another person's door (who wasn't on-call) to take him to work. In the middle of the fucking night.
His job is to be at work when he is required to be at work. I don't mind giving people rides, but I won't drive you around until either of us PCS.
“go get your car started and let’s go.” Sounds like he needs to buy a vehicle so he can go whenever he likes. The fact that you're even asking this after someone bumming rides talks to you like this...
NTA.
Tell the Airman to buy a method of transportation. Saw a dude in Ramstein ride one of those onewheel scooters for YEARS.
Not rude. I had a similar situation but they were out of my way. I was okay with it the first week as I was their sponsor, but it is taxing and a burden.
I’d be honest with them. It’s hard to have that convo, but realistically you are not responsible for how they get there. Plus who knows what you have going on before/during/after. You are not obligated to take them to work. They are an adult and they can figure it out.
(I might leave details out. Will reply to replies with additional info)
There are 2 sides to my comment:
1. When I first got on station, I was in a constant dilemma between asking for rides and driving my lamborfeeties. In the first couple months, I would get chewed out for leaving an hour prior for an appointment cause it was clear across base and I was walking. "Why didn't you ask for a ride.?" Probably because I'm considerate for others and always asked for shit growing up. Also was probably too prideful and just didn't want to go thru the hassle of asking in x amount of time before the appointment just to have the ride fall through. Would rather get there myself and not bother anyone for a ride.
2. It's probably just me, but I believe mindsets like the comments should change; to an extent. Be there for your wingman and encourage them to get on their feet, but don't let them take advantage. To and from work, food/supplies, appointments; no problem. Anything else will cost you extra, or just say 'sorry, man. I'm taking the day for myself' if they get salty; oh well 🤷🏽♂️
Bro, we are in a same boat. Exactly same situation, except she don’t even have license. Had her supervisor involved wks ago and nothing happened. I told her many times in many different ways to get a bike or get her drivers license. But seems like she’s not doing anything. Good luck on your situation and mine.
My shop said getting to work is nobody else's responsibility except yourself. We had an airman with the same issue. Leadership said he can purchase a bike or car but chooses not to. Nobody has an obligation to pick up his pieces. Needless to say, he was much walking to work everyday until he did something about it.
I relied on a coworker for rides for a good month at my first duty station. My parents sold my motorcycle while I was in tech school and the other they sent my in hhg had issues and I couldn't get it up and going right away.
We were in a remote area and buying a used car was a major hunt as I didn't want to spend a fortune or get a lemon.
I was however extremely kind to the person who drove me. Took myself to PT, DFAC and Commissary. I also still asked on occasion and paid into gas.
I'd make it clear you aren't denying him because you CAN. You're doing it because he's being ungrateful!
You’re not wrong for how you feel given it’s your resources being taken advantage of… but i’m not sure a novel about a matter this trivial was necessary.
We had somebody do this in my shop and my immediate thought was “what if there’s an emergency and there’s nobody around to give this person a ride?” For example, what if you’re TDY and maybe the other people who he asks for rides from aren’t available and he needs to get to medical? It is important to have your own transportation in situations like these so you can take initiative and not have to wait for someone else assuming they’re even available. The military pays you, it may not be a lot but for an airman in the dorms but a car payment is possible. I mean, don’t get a crazy expensive dream car, just a basic one that gets you from A to B.
If you don’t hate the guy, I don’t see why you would bar him from riding shotgun if you’re heading to the same place. If it’s a regular thing, set boundaries with a timeline. If he’s not there in time that’s on him.
I’ve been in similar situations, some new Airmen are slow to start being adults. My personal rule is new guys have 3 months max to get their own car. At about the 2 and half mark , I have told people that their bus pass expires on X date .
It’s not your job or responsibility to give this person rides. Giving them any rides is you being nice. They need a reality check that they’re a grown up who is responsible for getting themselves to work one way or another.
I would be blunt and give said coworker a hard date that the rides stop. If they don’t take that news well then I would bring it up to your/their supervisor.
If this person wants to carpool, they should be pitching in money to help cover the cost of the vehicle (not just gas, there are additional costs to vehicle ownership/operation). They’re expecting you to own and operate a multi-thousands of dollars piece of equipment, maintaining legal registration, insurance and paying for all required maintenance/repairs/upkeep. That is a service with real value.
Have you tried having a conversation with him like an adult? It doesn’t have to be a shitty conversation. Ask him when he plans on buying vehicle or bicycle? Let him know you can’t give him a ride every day. Work out some kinda deal where he fills up your gas tank on pay days. Does he have any other friends? Maybe he likes your company.
Ultimately, you are grown up and can do whatever you want. But it seems to me like letting someone sit in your car while you go to the places you need to go is no big deal. If you genuinely just don’t like the dude, that’s a different story. But we’re all in weird places with new people and don’t know what hell we are doing. Sometimes a 3min ride to work with a friend is nice. And it’s ok to set boundaries so that you are not taken advantage of.
Here is my situation. Im tdy, i dont have a car, dude in my class that stays in same building does. I tag along to school and back on his schedule. (15 min walk if no car) i also pay attention to his gas tank and insist to fill it up every time. I make sure i am on his terms and he is not on mine. Your friend needs humbling.
^this guy rides.
You sound like a very humbled and considerate person. I’m sure your colleague appreciates you well for that.
This is the way
You dont gas on GTC?
Sounds like the guy drove his POV there. If the government's not willing to pay for a rental, they're not going to pay for gas.
Why would you pay for his gas if you guys are TDY? Assuming he has a rental, the GTC will take care of it.
Its not a rental, rentals were not authorized if you stay on base. He drove here.
It's not real common to be authorized a rental when TDY for school unless your home unit ponies up. More common for someone to decide to bring their own vehicle to the school, gas for the local area will rarely be reimbursed for a POV while TDY for school. I've driven my POV to Keesler more than once so I could have wheels while I'm there.
What do the reporting instructions say? If it says anything to the effect of "required" or "highly suggested", there's your justification to put it on your DTS authorization. My A1C troop's first TDY was alone to a location that had exactly this. The unit authorized his rental car. Edit: and as for getting reimbursed for POV while TDY, see 020212 B3 from the JTR.
AETC will refuse to pay for rental or gas, your orders will need to specifically authorize the use of a personal vehicle for local transportation and then AETC will insist your home unit pays. AETC doesn't have the funds to pay for rentals or gas. Guardsmen sometimes get their home unit to pay but it is exceedingly rare for active duty.
>AETC will refuse to pay for rental or gas Show me where I said AETC has to pay for the rental/gas. The RIs I usually see can (and usually do) say rental car required or highly recommended, at the cost of the unit. Our unit (AD, and at an AETC base to boot) has almost always had the funds available for this. Obviously if there's 3 people going to the same TDY location, they share 1 rental car, but there's almost always a rental car.
I don't know what training they're sending yall to but it's literally been once in 9 years I got an auth for a POV, and that was only because it was a 6 month long and the gas to and from the school was cheaper than flights. And here I thought AETC didn't care about its CE folks. Guess it was just Altus CE they don't care about
For NCOA, they (AETC) said you need to fly, but if you choose to take your POV you're only entitled to whatever the plane ticket would cost. Makes sense when they have 150 students in a class, 6x a year. If you're stationed at one of the further bases like Camp Bullis or Randolph, then you get reimbursed for mileage to & from Lackland.
>Edit: and as for getting reimbursed for POV while TDY, see 020212 B3 from the JTR. AETC will say in their reporting instructions that airline is the preferred mode of travel for students and if you decide to take your POV, you're only entitled to reimbursement up to what the plane ticket would be. I went to the last NCOA and it was part of the reporting instructions.
What may be authorized or approved (after the fact) and what the Approving Official will authorize/approve are different things. The JTR says it's legal to reimburse mileage in and around the TDY area, but it is not an entitlement. Ask the Approving Official before assuming that since it's in the JTR you will automatically be reimbursed.
I didn't read the whole thing. He is an adult and has the obligation to get to work. He has a salary he can use for such resources. It is not your responsibility as a coworker / wingman to enable and baby him. In a pinch, it is nice and appropriate to be a team player to help out, but there is a limit to that. I have seen this before. Moochers are gonna mooch. It sounds like he needs a polite mature conversation, not dropping hints, not subtleties, but a straightforward notice of the reality of the situation.
I don’t blame you for not reading the whole thing, I apologize for not summing it up, just had a lot on my mind. And I agree with your response entirely, but I don’t think much is going to change the situation no matter how many conversations I have with the dude.
The point is it is on him to get to work. If you don't give him a ride and he doesn't report to duty then that is failure to go and is a disciplinary matter. If that means he has to get some paperwork to learn about how to be responsible then that is life, and it is his life, not yours. He can learn that lesson or he can get shown the door.
We get looked down at for not "Being a wingman" and shit. I would put it as volunteer work on EPRs. But word it well like helping a disenfranchised youth with transportation. Or go to his supervisor through my supervisor and make him answer for why he doesn't bring him to and from work
Wingman also don’t enabled bad behavior. Does the person telling you not being a good “wingman” willing to pay for your gas?
Yes he can ride the bus [in civis] and change at work, or purchase other means of transportation like a bicycle or scooter or his own damn feet. I used to ride my bike or the bus to work prior to the military because I was poor as fuck.
Come up with an agreement to have the dude pay you for giving him rides to/from work until he can get his own wheels.
You aren't this dudes daddy/mommy/whatever. If it was like, mutal riding to work and they made sure to be outside at the exact same time you were out there getting in the car, maybe I'd think you were an Ahole for saying no to THAT. But like anywhere else? meh. Also dude does NOT get to tell you when you're going to and from work. That's the car owners perogative. He should be grateful for any scrimpings and rides he gets, and also offer up gas money just to be polite. You're not being rude. This entitled Airman is being rude AF.
Ah a classic conundrum. This should be an ALS question. I dont THINK they can FORCE you to drive him everywhere. Honestly idk bro. You're definitely in the right, I'm pretty positive it can't be a lawful order either to drive him to work every day. Tell him to kick rocks and get a bike. Say you don't drive to work and get a bike
> but I don’t think much is going to change the situation no matter how many conversations I have with the dude. You make the change. It's your car. Tell him to piss off and walk, get a bike, or get his own car. In my eyes, it's not even about the money. Dude needs to be more independent. If he keeps riding with others, then it's there problem. You're not his mom, he needs to grow up and take responsibility for getting to work on time. To dive a little deeper, I would say you should ask yourself why you care so much. To me this is one of those easy relationships to cut off. You don't have to be everyone's friend, and being a people pleaser will open the door for others to take advantage of your kindness. If people are giving you grief for not helping, they're just virtue signaling. They know the airman doesn't have transportation but are not offering him rides. It's on-base dorms. As if "living in the same area" is so far out of the way that the virtue signalers can't make the long-ass 5-minute drive to the dorms.
Honestly, I think it was just a lot of pent up irritation for some time. I made the post out of irritation before I was released, and I knew what exactly was going to happen. Coworker 1 rejected him from riding, then I followed suit. I watched him walk home and then more replies came in. I talked to the subject airman before about this, and he told me once that he understood where I was coming from - although I sounded like an asshole about it. Not like I care what he thinks about me, or anyone of that matter. Let alone, not like anything changed if it got to this point. I think what bothers me is that I felt like I was being taken advantage of and despite me being generous and accommodating to him, I never received anything from it. Not even a thanks. Dude’s not of age so he couldn’t even buy me a beer, haha. On top of that, I just remember people telling me what the issue was about me giving him rides since we came from the same place and work at the same place. It’s just about principle. I never wanted to do it other than the times I’ve offered out of generosity or kindness. I’m sorry for being so bothered about it, really. I’ve talked to him and others for opinions, but I feel like it didn’t get anywhere. I’m putting my foot down for sure.
What's with all the passive aggressive suggestive shit? Just flat out tell him "on X day the ride train ends, so figure your shit out".
Best advice yet. Except call it a “train ride”. It’ll be funny and confusing.
Learning to say no and to do it tactfully is a good skill to have in life. Just tell him you prefer to drive alone and that you have errands to run and just cut it off right there. Tell him it has nothing to do with him. If your coworkers give you grief, tell them the same thing...you prefer to drive alone. Be firm and hold your ground.
Or just tell him no and be done. No reason to not just be up front about it.
If his coworkers give him grief, then he should tell his coworkers that they can give him a ride if it’s such a big deal.
He might find this useful: https://www.walmart.com/cp/bikes/1081404
This. I knew a dude that would bike to work every day. Was like a 4 mile bike ride. Dude didn’t complain about it and it worked out pretty well for the time being (until he got his bike stolen). After that he bought a cheap beater. OP’s airman needs to just save up and get a cheap beater if cash is so tight.
The best response, haha. I have flat out told him that I would be willing to spare him some money to buy a bicycle.
Don’t do that. He needs to get his own transportation with his own money.
Yes. A lesson in accountability and responsibility.
Some of us are willing to pay for entertainment. I'd 100% spot someone living in my building money for a bike to base. For reference, I work on (Schriever, a 45 min drive from my house with a couple of 6%+ grades and shit winters.
Wouldn’t really solve anything that way.
Yeah no, they have a paycheck, it’s not on you to subsidize their means of transportation
It's also not on him to be passive-aggressive because he doesn't want to help a fellow airman out. But hey, that's what the Airforce is all about. Every man for himself.
No one is encouraging passive aggression. There needs be a blunt, straightforward discussion about it. But, that means this individual needs to get his own damn ride. He gets paid just like everyone else. Period dot.
Here At my first base I didn’t have a ride but me and my Suitemate came to an agreement that every time I got paid I’d give him 100 bucks for his troubles to covers gas and other expenses that worked until I got my own car
Now that’s definitely gas and some insurance money right there!
I mean hey it worked since he was taking me off base and stuff as well never made a complaint to me lol
Probably cause the $100 bucks lol
This was going to be my suggestion as well. Just charge him a reasonable amount and if he refuses, stop letting him mooch. If anyone asks, let them know you offered a fair price and he refused and that’s the end of discussion.
So Ive been here when I lived in the dorms. And this is what I told the ncos who expected me to give rides to other Airmen. I was willing to take them to work but I wasn't going to be late to work because of the either and I wasn't their mom so I'm not gonna wake up them up. Basically if they beat me to my car I'd take them to work as I'm already going there. It wasn't my job to take them to appointments or any where they wanted just because I had a car and they didn't. I was also working as a mechanic so I would look over any car they found on marketplace or something and tell them what it would cost to fix anything that was broke, and I'd supervise them doing the repairs and would bring the tools if they paid for parts. Few guys took me up on that and helped them get a $500 car and they drove it for about 2yrs while saving money and building credit to get a nicer one from the dealership.
W airman
That is what I did. You could get a ride if you were already ready. I would not wait for anyone ever. It's honestly not a problem if the people needing rides are cool, but it does suck when it is just some mooch loser that you don't even want to be around ever. I would straight up tell that person I would want like $50 a week if they want more than 1 ride a week.
That’s a great policy.
He's an adult. He's responsible for finding his own wheels. If he wants free rides, he can pay for gas.
You know what they say, nobody rides for free.
I'm not sure what OSI would say about grass and ass so that only leaves cash.
Change grass to Scotch and as far as the other...
Not that there's anything wrong with that....
This is actually what I did when I didn't have a car. I bummed rides, but paid for a tank of gas a month. It's not on me to pay for all the dude's travel expenses, but I can pay my fair share of getting to/from work.
u/valentc
Tell him to get a used car under 4k. Or an electric bike from Amazon or Walmart. Tell him you’re not gonna give him rides all the time you got shit to do. also depends on weather and distance. I have given plenty of airmen rides exclusively everyday to work until they saved up enough to buy a bike or car. nothing wrong with helping out but you ask them for gas money every week they will start looking for cars or bikes trust me
If I have to pass your destination on the way to my destination, then you can ride with me. Otherwise, you're buying me beer or washing my car. Being the nice guy and giving people rides at their every beck and call gets old quick. It's ultimately up the individual to get themselves to and from work.
>If I have to pass your destination on the way to my destination, then you can ride with me. They have identical destinations - home and work. OP needs to ask for gas money (something like \~$25 a week) or stop giving the dude rides if it bothers him this much.
Maybe you should be an Uber or Lyft. Then you could charge him for the ride. /s Just kidding Seriously though. I had to deal with this for a while in the dorms. When I moved off base the guy asked me if I would come get him everyday. He was upset when I told him no. He is an adult and should at minimum be respectful of you, your time, and your property. Good luck
I plan on getting a motorcycle anyways. Dude gave a dejected look when I told him that. You’re in the military, it’s up to you to get to work on time and effectively.
Had the same issue with an airman who got a DUI. We lived in the same dorm so they expected me to give them a ride to and from work. Would come knocking on my door in the morning. Tell their supervisor, that's what I did and it ended on the spot.
That sounds like the worst, man. I’m sorry that was sprung on you like that. What happened it ended up on the spot?
My supervisor talked to their supervisor and that was it. I PCS'd like a month later anyways.
Don't do this. Just talk to the man directly. This is so nonconfrontational and bitchy.
Airman lack balls what else is new
He's an adult. Buy a car, walk, or pay for gas. Sounds like dude needs to go to Korea for a tour.
BLUF: This is an issue that should be addressed by his supervisor, an NCO, assuming there’s nothing else going on. First off, no, you don’t owe him. I understand the seasoned airman’s response as an NCO who’s had to hunt people down, but it’s the wrong response. Every airman has a responsibility to get to work on time. I don’t cut slack to NCOs or airmen who choose to live an hour + away from base. Second off, have you discussed this with him? You’re, presumably, in the same shop. What’s his reasoning, and is he willing to understand that he should be helping you out, as well as others helping him out, if you’re helping him? If he’s entitled, then that needs to be a reality check. If he’s just stupid or ignorant, you gave a wingman a valuable life lesson. Finally, where the *fuck* are NCOs in this picture? If he’s constantly mooching rides, and (presumably), SrA are bitching you out for not enabling that, where the fuck are they? This is the kind of shit a supervisor should be having a chat with the airman about. One of our fucking jobs is teaching young folks how to adult
Our E5’s are out and we don’t have any E6’s. It’ll be fixed soon, but it’s been like this for a while now. I’ve had as many discussions with him, I could count them on one hand and have no room to spare. We’ve talked, I went off on him one time and he called me kind of an asshole, but I was trying to tell him that he isn’t entitled to anything free. He told me he understood where I was coming from, but he still asks. I told him and others that I’ve been giving him rides out of whatever kindness is in my heart, and I’ve been trying to be accommodating to him. But I can’t keep doing this. I don’t give a shit if we live on the same floor level of the same building. Honest to God with my hand on big fucking stack of Bibles, I’ve had conversations with other airmen about who’s gonna take him home. The conversations were ridiculous, and I felt like I was a parent. I shouldn’t feel that way and I hate how the senior airmen were trying to say that me giving him rides wasn’t a big deal. They’re not the ones giving him rides, I was most of the time! And the guy is sick of it too! On one hand, I fear him getting a car because I’ve seen how he drives. He’s done an illegal U turn in our old NCO’s car when he was on lunch, and my inner former SF self had inner rage when I saw that. Don’t even know why our old NCO gave him his car, but whatever. On the other hand, I want him to just get his own ride because at least it will take some weight off of the other airmen and myself in the shop. If I had a young school aged kid, I would do anything to make sure he or she is safe and secure. But this isn’t my son, this is some 19 something year old! Hell nah! I actually was able to watch his ass walk home after work today. Made this post before we were released because I had so much irritation built up, and then he asked me. “You going to the dorms?” Told him yeah, but I’m doing other shit beforehand. (I didn’t.) And the other guy didn’t want to take him either. So satisfying to watch.
Wow, that sounds like a shit show of a shop. If you’ve talked with him before, talk to his supervisor and up channel. It’s good of you, and nice of you, to help him out, but if he’s calling you an asshole for not wanting to nonstop give him rides, that’s crossing lines. And fuck that SrA, I get the impulse, but that’s fucked. Especially if you’re having to coordinate his rides
The SrA only gave me weird looks and negative disposition for saying that I wasn’t entitled to give him a ride. The other SrA was understanding of where I was coming from… None of this bullshit will matter to me once I get a motorcycle and take my car off insurance to save money. The issue will be on their hands and if they ask me to give the dude a ride, all I have to say is “I rode a motorcycle, I can’t legally drive my car.” The main thing is that it shouldn’t be an issue at all. I don’t mind giving rides to airmen in need. In need, meaning they don’t have a car BUT are saving for a safe and reliable vehicle, or are legitimately medically impaired, or they’re truly in a shitty situation. But if they can walk or ride a bicycle walk with no issues, then they can do that. Why do I need to be the middle man? They can be their own transportation.
Oh I give airmen rides when it rains all the time. I get it. But that SrA shouldn’t be giving you shade, they should be giving him shade for not doing shit to scratch your back. SrA exist to squash problems like this via social pressure, in addition to ensuring the smoke pit receives a thorough 8 hour long FOD inspection
I agree with what everyone else has been saying, especially since I had my own car since tech school. I'm not sure what base/ state you are located in, but I wanted to give you a heads up about your "I will be dropping insurance on the car" statement. Most states will not allow you to renew your registration without at least minimal insurance on your vehicle. Expired plates lead to towing, even on base. I would check your laws before completely dropping your insurance. Most companies have a really minimum "parked car" fee to keep your insurance active. If you choose that option, though, you could end up busted even using it once for inclement weather. Just some food for thought. Good luck to you!
I would just talk to him and tell him that if he wants a regular ride to and from work, then he can help pay for your gas. Also that you reserve the right to terminate the verbal agreement at anytime for whatever reason. It is nice to help people out in a pinch, but at some point, he is just taking advantage of you.
Just ask for gas money. Holy shit dude u had to bring this to Reddit. Grow a pair. Get gas or don’t take him to work. Sob
I was that airman for about 6 months into my first duty station. Bumming rides the 5 mile trek to the WSA at Whiteman from the dorms. A couple times a week, though, I always insisted on a detour to the shoppette. If he didn't need gas, I bought the Monsters. If you're gonna be a burden to someone, do your best to be a boon instead. That's advice I'd give this dude. Ya don't gotta divert all of the few hundred bucks you'd spend on car payment, insurance, and gas to helping your benefactor. But a few bucks a week can make all the difference in how people perceive you.
If it isn't an inconvenience then I don't see the issue. Tell him you'll leave at X time and that if he isn't ready then you're leaving. As for going home you go home when you're ready. If you want to stay and BS for 30 minutes or if you get released an hour early, you leave when you want. That being said, you aren't obligated to give him a ride, but it's nice IF it doesn't mean you're waiting on him, etc. Also, feel free to ask him for 10/15 dollars a week for rides (still on your schedule) if he's interested, and of he doesn't pay then feel free to stop giving rides. Or just stop either way if you really want, but it could be seen as a "dick move" since you live together (unless he's always coming out late, rushing you to go home, etc)
I understand he’s an adult. But here’s the best solution I could come up with that might not burn bridges that could affect your work life down the road. Have you asked him when he plans on getting a vehicle? Have a conversation about how the way he talks to you and expects instead of being grateful. If it comes down to gas money and insurance then that’s your personal opinion, but realistically your gas won’t be affected that much. I used to wake up 30 minutes earlier to pickup new airman from the dorms and take them to work, drop them off at appointments, etc. Best thing I did, those guys are now some of my closest friends and have been there for me countless of times.
You could be petty and just start walking to work yourself “for health reasons”. Yeah, it might suck, but it would prove the point that walking is not impossible. Do it for a week and see what happens. Or just tell your supervisor/shirt you will not use your personal vehicle to shuttle anyone around without compensation.
I did that at my last base, I walked everywhere I went. (It was a moderately sized Turkish base.) And I agree, it is a perfectly healthy thing to do when you walk. Good for getting those steps in. And I’ve thought about charging as well. $3 per ride, $5 per ride on weekends in the event where he calls me or knocks on my door. (Coworker said subject airmen did that, he ignored him the entire time.)
Reading that part when he told you to “get the car started” really irks me. That would have been the end of my generosity with a “or how about you fuck off then?” Best advice is to stop enabling him. If everyone else is so concerned about him, then they can give him rides.
I had no car (and no license, but that's besides the point) for a long time. I was asking for rides, but o was also paying my coworkers back with food/gas money as regularly as they'd accept. I'd even not ask sometimes, because I felt like a burden so I'd walk. I think the main problem here isn't his requests for rides or expecting them, but rather his lack of care to pay you for your time/energy. Is it out of the way for you? No. But it is your private vehicle, and it is not your job to drive him. Unless you've been explicitly told to make sure he gets to work, you're both adults. Helping is good wingmanship, but so is him paying you back somehow. Let him know that if you keep giving him rides you'd like him to help pay for your gas when you fill up. That way he understands that it's a give and take, not a free ride. Others may be kinder and willing to give for free, but that doesn't mean you're unkind. TLDR; I used to ask for rides, but paid back in food/gas. Tell him you want compensation if he continues to get rides. You're NTA.
I went 2 years at my first duty station without a vehicle. Accepting rides when offered is nice, but relying on others for transportation is a no go. Member needs to work on his time management and get used to walking or pony up a little bit of cash for a bicycle. If The Airman in question isn't personally inconvenienced everyday because they get to rely on others for transportation, it makes it much easier for them to spend money they otherwise would have saved for their vehicle or just put it on a lower priority.
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There’s a fine line between helping and enabling poor decision making. OP has gone above and beyond with the help. Good on them. Now it’s time for the other person to be and adult and find an independent way to work. If they can’t figure that out, is that someone you really want to work with/serve with?
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This subreddit: the lack of compassion and comraderie is why Airman are so lonely and we need to help each other in times of need. Also this sub: don't enable your asshole coworker, it's their responsibility to get to work, and you shouldn't help him. Tell him to fuck off and to figure it out. Your coworkers also suck for not agreeing with you. Be selfish.
I had a similar situation with my own troop. Eventually I just had to tell him no, and tell others that they don’t need to feel obligated to provide a ride. Eventually he got his license and car. You should reach out to this person’s supervisor and let them know what’s up. Most importantly, “no” is a complete sentence. Remember that. Sounds like he has a lot of growing up to do.
Ass, Cash, or ~~Grass~~
You're Not being rude at all but you should always be able to go to your Shirt. If you don't want to have to confront him to be a good wingman, you can explain to the Shirt and he can do the face to face and see what's really going on, financial difficulties or afraid of driving who knows? There's no reason you should be inconvenienced regardless of where you stay. Like someone said on another comment, "moochers are gonna mooch!"
Canceling your car insurance will most likely get your tags revoked. Most states require notification if vehicle insurance is canceled.
Ah shit, thanks for informing me! I guess it won’t kill me to have two vehicles on the plan then. Though they say to take the insurance for the motorcycle off in the snowy and “insufficient” months. Or if I deploy. I’ll have to read the insurance policy more, but I’m backtracking my initial idea about taking off car insurance now.
Depending on your insurance company, you can put a vehicle in a “storage” or low-use status. I’d suggest giving them call and explaining the situation to see what they can do for you to lower your monthly payment on the car. Also, for motorcycle insurance, I recommend Progressive. I’ve got two bikes, one is a 2009 HD Softail and the other is a 2021 Indian Challenger, full coverage, including $5K for add-ons (i.e. performance exhaust, special suspension, better handlebars, etc.) and I pay $78 per month combined.
This is a situation that is best resolved with open and honest communication. "Heya Airman Snuffy. I don't like feeling obligated to provide you with transportation every day. So the obligation ends now. If I give you a ride, it's because I'm being nice. If I don't, then I have reasons to not provide you with a ride."
A very well thought out response. Next time he asks for a ride, which is likely tomorrow, I’ll say something very similar to this. But I’ll be firm this time.
fuck em. at least chip in something, or get a ride somewhere else
You either start charging him gas money or don't give him ride. I literally posted this about 6 months ago in the exact same situation. Our flight taught him how to drive painfully and nearly died 15 times. he took his test and passed (really unsure how) now has his own vehicle and drives to work. Please tell your leadership about this, I joked and said it feels like my job isn't 2a**** it's 2aUber1. Your not his uber or chauffeur.
It’s not on you to get the guy to and from work him and his supervisor should be working on a plan for that until he gets a vehicle. He needs to be humble and offer you or anyone else that give him a ride some gas money
Ass, gas or grass…nobody rides free!
Both are assholes. He’s an adult and needs to find an actual long term solution for transportation. You literally live in the same building and have the same destination. Those questions of who pays for insurance and gas wouldn’t change based on taking him or not.
> You literally live in the same building and have the same destination. I agree the gas/insurance argument isn’t good but he’s not an assbole because of it. I refuse to be beholden to some other shmucks schedule just because he’s not enough of an adult to get his own transportation. Gas, insurance, car payment be damned. If he ever told me to get my own car started it’s done then and there. You can be at my car at this time in the morning if you want a ride in, you’re not there at that time you get left. Going home you can be at my car when I say so, and then I’m leaving. I don’t give half a shit about what time he wants to leave or what I can do for him, OP is trying to be too agreeable. Fuck em
>If he ever told me to get my own car started it’s done then and there. I feel like the missing part of this statement is that OP didn't *know* they were getting released, so the comment probably was meant more of a "hell yeah dude we're free, let's get out of here" and wasn't quite said the way it should've been
Yes, you're being rude, but you have the right to be.
No, you don’t have a moral or legal obligation to help anyone…but damn dude. It literally cost you nothing to be helpful (I know you have expenses, but to/from the dorm and work that you’re already commuting, 0 additional dollars spent). I think you’re better off developing the relationship with him so you can have better influence and maybe guide him in a better direction. None of this is “your responsibility” but as an airman (at any rank) you’re a leader. You have an opportunity to lead. As a man you have an opportunity to provide for someone who could use the help. As a person who have an opportunity to make the world a little more kind, a little more generous, and a little more friendly. And you’re using all that opportunity to say “don’t rely on handouts, I’m not Uber, and get your life together.” Do you really think you’re improving anyone’s situation…to include your own? Helping people is super rewarding.
I agree with you. OP has the opportunity to reflect the kind of culture we want in the AF. A culture where everyone helps each when there is a need with boundaries in place of course.
Shouts to anyone that hooks it up with a ride
Lol, this subreddit hates helping people out. He says he doesn't care what his co workers say, but comes here to bitch and get validation. Now he's gonna go to work all smug, saying reddit told him he's not being a dick because it's HIS car and we don't need to help each other out.
There’s wingmen, drinking buddies, and there’s house-mouses. The first two break bread and the other taddels behind your back
I had the same experience. Kid would show up late when I picked him up or dropped him off. Just stopped doing it.
hell no, dealt with this at my first shop. i was wasting my own time and money giving rides. it was little bit easier since we were the same rank and i literally just told him to stop being a selfish asshole and get a car. nonetheless, taking advantage of people for rides when you are obligated to be at work is a no go. what happens if he has to be at work alone? you are not responsible to pay with your own time and money for this person
Tell him to get a bike. One time purchase and doesn’t cost a lot. My drives to and from work are my time to clear my head. I’d hate having to be a free Uber.
I think I would hate life slightly less not being a free Uber driver. EDIT: I can’t place words correctly.
Super long post but this is a revolving door I've noticed since I've been in. You have no obligation to assist that Airmen to get to work. They can get a bike, a scooter or a skateboard, and if they can't or wont do any of that then they should live in the dorms. You offering a ride is entirely up to you. But you have every right to set boundaries. This scenario many of us especially in supervisory positions have seen this numerous times. My suggestion would be offer if you're feeling nice & don't when you don't want to. Secondly, if they aren't paying they're bugging. Lastly, if you do extend a ride to work establish times when they need to be waiting ON YOU! If they aren't ther; LEAVE. Not worth the headache and possible discredit to you and or paperwork if it's reoccurring.
Tell him (and everyone else) to eat shit if they have an issue with who you put in your own damn car.
If somebody is riding with me to work everyday, they better give me $40 a week for gas. I dont care if we live in the same place or go to the same job, they can easily take an Uber instead and let me ride to & from work in peace, in my car.
Cash gas or ass, if he wants to keep getting rides. If he doesn’t like it then he can grow the fuck up and get a car/bick/moped/way around. That said you have no obligation to give him rides
😂 classic album
I know it’s difficult, I’ve had to deal with this too. Really it just came down to setting boundaries. Establish that they are on your schedule, not the other way around. If they line up, then fine but if not then getting to/from work is their problem. Oh and errands beyond work? Yeah that’s a firm no from me dog, unless we’re best friends (which it sounds like you aren’t)
You have every right to refuse rides, regardless of living in the same dorms, same work center, whatever. It is not your responsibility to get anyone besides yourself to and from work. If anyone gives you shit about tell them they are more than welcome to give him rides. This dude needs a reality check; a ride here and there is one thing, but to rely on someone else like he’s doing to you here is just lazy and greedy.
He’s an adult, if he’s saving for a car he should buy a bike like a lot of young airmen do in the dorms.
Ether have him walk ESPECIALLY if its nice out, it's fucking great to walk to and from work tbh when it's good weather. He can ask for a ride if the weather gets shitty or whatever because that makes sense. OR tell him he's going to have to start slipping you money for gas, even if it's just like 5 or 10 bucks or whatever you guesstimate for the distances you drive. A few bucks here and there isn't going to break his bank or savings for his own car. Obviously just talk to him about it and let him know. If he gives you shit or is an ass, remind him that YOU are doing HIM a service. You're not being an asshole, your being real.
BLUF: If the Air Force is not paying to put gas in your POV, no one can force you to give this individual rides. Don’t be afraid to tell your teammate “No, find a different way to work.” You will not face any adverse action and if you do, please use your local chain of command to address. Source: Dealt with a similar situation before.
Only read the TLDR. He's an adult and if he's required to be to work or an appointment at a specific time then he needs to figure out how to get there and shouldn't be relying on the kindness of others. You, nor anyone in your work center are obligated to give his lazy ass a ride anywhere so tell him to deal with his own self-inflicted predicament. If anyone else looks down on you for it don't let it bother you. If they want to step up and cart this baby around like they're his parents then more power to him. I wouldn't waste my time or my gas on someone who refuses to fix the situation themselves.
I don’t blame you for not reading the whole thing. I made the post before we were dismissed and I knew exactly what he was going to ask and what he was going to say, and had a lot of pent up irritation. People probably do look down on me, they can think I’m an asshole or “in it for myself.” Like I give a shit, he’s not my responsibility. I don’t get paid enough to be a personal driver. I get paid enough to survive and that’s it. Peoples opinions won’t affect my well being or my life. Let them think I’m an asshole, at least the subject airman got some decent steps in today.
Sounds like a free loader, using others so he can pocket the savings from not having a car. Might be time to tell him to pay up for gas or start walking.
You're not being rude. Typically, a ride tends to be a one off favor, or, if you're ride sharing, you might alternate you driving and him driving. What does he do when you take leave or go tdy? He's big enough to sign his life away, he can figure out a way to work that doesn't include you mothering him.
You have no obligation, and if you're ordered to drive him then ask for a GOV. Personally, at this point I would give them a ride on my timeline only. If they're not already at my car when I leave they're not getting a ride. That will put the fault 100% on them when they're late to work.
If you don't want to provide rodes anymore, you don't have to. They are responsible for getting to work. I didn't have a vehicle when I came in, and I walked. Sometimes, people would see me and give me a ride, but my default was to walk unless someone offered. If your peers get upset, they are more than able to assist the member and take them home. Just let them know you no longer want to provide rides for free and want your space when it's time to clock out.
Don't take your car off insurance. If something happens to it while parked you're fucked. Also your rates will skyrocket when you try to get it insured again.
Charge him money. Just tell me..”look dude, if you want rides all week, I’m gonna $50.00 every Sunday and the week, to and from work, is yours.”
I used to bike and only bum rides during bad weather, extreme cold, or to and from the chow hall (there were like 9 of us at our work center and we would carpool). He should be offering to pay some gas, buy you food, or just give you some money. The person I bummed rides off of the most I ended up rooming with off base for over a year so I made it back up to him later on.
This is what happens when you don’t have DARE. No one told this kid he can “just say no”
> “go get your car started and let’s go.” This right here...nope.
This is a leadership problem, not your problem. If he can't make it to work then the supervisor needs to figure something out.
Stand your ground. I was in the same boat as you when I got to my first base, I was one of the few with a car. At one point I had 4 people riding to and from work with me everyday. Inside a month everyone had their own car except one person. I started just leaving him in the mornings so he wouldn’t make us both late. Some people abuse the wingman concept. Those people need to be allowed to fend for themselves for awhile so they can understand what they put other people through.
Your First Sergeant should be made aware of this.
I didn’t have a car, my best friend moved out and I had to figure out how to get to work. I woke up earlier than everyone and walked the worse thing I did was ask for a ride during the rain or a heat surge. This went on for more than a year, Then I got a car. So I don’t feel bad for this airman
Then there was a guy who at the unit where, after I figured out where this lost guy was, he decided to take his anger of not listening to my directions on me. I allowed him in my car. He then starts yelling at me threatening to fight. After he called me a bitch to my face. I dropped his stuff off at the stop sign at the gate and told him to walk. No one clapped, I had to tell the security forces that I won’t allow him in my car, and we had to have the shirt seperate us. So in reality, did I win yes? Was it worth having to have a meeting with security and my shirt? No EDIT: I had to add details to make the story make sense please don’t hit me
Bro needs to pull his legbrogini out of the garage. You’re under no obligation but if you’re doing it to be nice you should have an agreement for like $5-$10 a week
Getting to work is the individuals responsibility. If they don't have a means of transportation besides walking, they can shift the Lamborfeeties into gear, or front the money daily for another method.
I didn't have a car at my first base but ALWAYS offered gas money and didn't assume. I also walked 90% of the time. As usual, the issue is someone acting entitled to your benevolence here. Feel free to ask for gas money or tell him you have other plans and can't give him a ride when you're not feelin' it.
Maybe he just wants to be in your company. What is the age difference?
Sounds like that dude is a skater 🛹
He looks like one, but not one you’d see in a Tony Hawk game. Maybe a Steam indie skate game.
[удалено]
I agree with you entirely. Honestly, I don’t even know why it’s an issue. It’s a weird situation when it doesn’t need to be, and I recognize that. I’ve openly told people to fuck off or get lost, go kick rocks. But for whatever reason, in this particular situation, suddenly I care or become more “sensitive” to it. Maybe it’s because the dude is younger, or maybe it’s because he might a rank under, or maybe because it’s something like that, and I feel this strange obligation to help younger/lower ranking people out. The dude joined the military, he’s an adult. He needs to figure his life out. But yet, I can’t understand why I get so conflicted when it comes to telling him no when it comes to this, but yet I’ve had no issues telling others to piss off when it comes to other situations. The logic makes no sense to me, but I will start to be more firm on it. It’s silly. It’s a personal vehicle riding dispute, it’s not even that deep. Maybe it’s just the pent up irritation and of me giving in to social expectations or something, or me being told to pick him up when I don’t want to. I don’t thin anyone should be telling me to pick him up with my privately owned vehicle if I don’t want to. Take the GOV for that. Overall, I certainly agree with your statements though.
Throw a curveball and start riding a bicycle for the exercise. If he wants to drive your car say it's illegal bc he's not on the insurance.
Haha, that’s what I was gonna do when I get the motorcycle. 😂 Someone will tell me to go him him, “sorry man, I rode today. You don’t have the required PPE to be a passenger, and I’m not going to drive my car back here.” Obviously, that’s not sole reason why I’m getting one though.
Take him to the lemon lot or local used car dealers to get him to visualize driving one on his own. Best if you can ninja it and make him think it was his idea so he has immediate buy-in on the idea
You're not being rude. Imagine if both of you had cars and you carpooled because gas is expensive, both of you are mutually benefiting from the situation because both of you are paying for your gas, using only half of what you would otherwise use, and your cars depreciating less regardless of whether or not you live in the same building. I was an airman without a car before my first deployment and had to bum rides when it snowed, rained, or if I just didn't feel like riding my bike. The person giving me a ride was still doing me a favor. It doesn't matter that that favor didn't "cost" them anything i.e. they live in the same dorms, I benefited from it so I owed them a favor in return. It doesn't matter if it's paying for a tank of gas every few weeks, or lunch on Saturday he needs to work something out with his coworkers.
When I got to my first duty station, the first thing I was told was that I needed to go get a car. Lo and behold I did just that. Tell that airman to kick rocks and sort his own shit out. This isn’t a daycare.
It happened to me in the early late 90s walking to work really wasn't an option barksdale is big and we worked like a 10 minute drive from the shop. I started making plans immediately after work that involved not going back to main base that way he could be inconvenienced. Like really ridiculous s*** like saying I was going bird-watching and I would do it and he sat in the car for an hour when I looked at egrets stuff like that he got the hint took about four trips he found other means mooched off of somebody else until they told him I'm not bringing you anymore. Also if you know anything about Louisiana it's hot he expected me to leave the engine running with the air conditioning on.
Blast TLC's No Scrubs every time you take him somewhere. See if he picks up on the message.
Weezer made an amazing cover of it back in 2019. Makes me want to listen to it now. That’s actually good comment there.
I used to live in the dorms and would drive an airman on shift to/from work all the time, they didn't have a license but weren't very motivated to get one either. We made the same amount of money so it wasn't a finance problem and it ultimately became an expectation, because when I moved off base they still expected rides. I agree with OP, if they pay for the car/insurance/gas and you're getting a ride daily, you should be giving some gas money.
I am an airman myself and I do not have a car. I have an electric bike that meets most of my needs at a secluded base. There are times when I’ve had to ask for a ride or rent a car so that I can get to an off base appointment or make it to work when it’s raining. My team has been super supportive but I’ve also made sure to only ask when I absolutely have no other option and I’ve paid them for gas. I am doing my best to not be a burden to them. It is my choice to not have a car. I can afford a cheap one but I’m choosing to wait and save so I have enough for a decent one that will last me a long time. I understand that it is difficult to have empathy for someone who doesn’t seem to be taking responsibility for himself and then expects you to be their chauffeur. That is not a fun place to be. However, I do think that morally, you should be kind and take him especially since it is not inconvenient or making you suffer in any way. If it was out of your way, I would understand and I’d think you’d have reason to say no. But it’s the kind thing to do. You have a chance to reflect a culture in your workplace that takes care of each other. You want this airman to get a car someday and give rides to the new airman from tech school or to you when your car breaks down When I get a car in a few months, I will definitely be giving rides to those who need it because I was there once. Be kind to the airman but also communicate that he can’t expect you to do this forever and that there are times when you can’t take him home after work. Hopefully, that will stop the comments he’s been making but if not have a conversation with him about it, the shirt or supervisor if needed. Ask him if he’s open to getting a bike or a scooter. Communicate with your team and if it’s not too much, you guys can take turns giving him rides so the burden isn’t all on one person. Make it clear the airman needs to have a timeline, a budget for this future car, in other words, a plan. I think it’s great you asked this question and I appreciate what you’ve done for this airman who obviously has some maturing to do. Your help is making a difference in his life and I hope one day he’ll acknowledge and thank you for it. But do it because it’s the right thing. I’m sure people have helped you or given you something when you didn’t deserve it. I’d be curious to hear if you have any thoughts on what I said.
F’ him. He needs to put his big boy pants on and be an adult. EDIT: If he gives you gas money, and it isn’t so far out of the way, then I would probably have a different view.
Tell him the rides stop now and don't ask anymore. You aren't his taxi and he can buy a car or bike or whatever. How is this dude getting to appointments or other obligations or the commissary or anywhere off base?
How? That’s up to him to figure out. As long as it’s done safely and legally, that won’t be my concern. If I get flak for it, I’m standing my ground.
You just tell him the rides are over. You owe 0 explanation. Call him an freeloader if he gets pissy. If your chain of command gives you flak for it, go to the shirt.
Had a guy like that in my old shop. I wouldn't mind if he was punctual, but I always have to call to get him to come down. I was glad when he got moved to a different shift because I was so tired of giving him rides. In that same shop, there was a guy that rode is bike to work, rain or shine.
I ask my coworkers for rides because I’m new to Eielson AK and it’s cold as balls and my building is a good 10-15 min car ride there but I still am actively looking for a vehicle and for the people who do drive me I usually give them gas money like if they give me one ride I will give them like $10 in gas but if I’m constantly getting rides from them I usually give them like $30 it’s not much especially for an airman living in the dorms
I'm seeing more Airmen coming in without licenses and have zero motivation to get them. Social media/internet has really killed the motivation for these kids coming in to drive. I remember being hype about getting my license and a car to go hangout with friends and go on dates or just do whatever I want when I wanted. I see the bases having to bring back bus services if they don't have them already to accommodate this issue and a ton of Airmen getting paperwork for missing the bus to get them to work on time.
Definitely not reading all of that. It was nice of you to give him a ride every now and then but you wouldn’t be an asshole for telling him that you’re done driving him and that he needs to find another way to get to work.
First week at new assignment, went to the base's thrift store, got a $10 bike, rode that thing for almost 4 years.
So for me, I come from a small town and I grew up very poor, so I got my driver's license right before I left for basic training because at 17, I didn't really NEED one. When I got to my first base, I had to get rides everywhere. I hated it. After showing my reliability, my supervisor, who I had built a friendship with (I would watch his dog while him and his wife would go places, and we were from the same area), actually cosigned on a loan for a car for me (at 18 at this point, I didn't have credit at all)(definitely not something I'm saying ANYONE in your chain should do). I paid the loan off months ahead of time because I felt guilty needing help. Having to get rides all the time, I felt so guilty, and I WANTED to be self-reliant. Maybe it had to do with growing up so poor and being raised to take care of myself. This airman you're talking about doesn't seem like he's getting into the mentality where he feels the need act like an adult. It's time for him to sink or swim, in my opinion. I think he's just so comfortable with help. He feels like, "What's the rush?" What he really needs is to stop having so much reliable help. He has to learn to take care of himself. What happens when any of his people helping PCS/deploy/go TDY? He needs to be sat down and told to find an alternative to getting to work.
Look at it this way. If for some reason you deployed,PCSed or went on leave. What will he do?
He can chip in gas money, buy a car, or buy a bike. I don't blame you saying know. It's time to be a big kid and get his own transportation.
It's your car so you can decide what you want or dont want to do. It's not about money, especially cuz you said you would be willing to pitch in for a bike, it's about his attitude. He does sound like he has become a bit entitled, so I would stick to that if you have another conversation with him. Just be straightforward and tell him that he has become too needy and needs to "adult" for himself. If others give you shit for it, tell them you are helping this airman better himself, and are entitled to making decisions about your property and time without interference. If they care so much, they can drive him lol.
1. He is responsible for his own transportation to work and wherever he needs to be. I've had 3 airman do the same thing. Dorms are like 5 miles from work. It sucks but hey there's a bike/running trail all the way from the dorms to our building. The problem wasn't exactly getting to work. It was them taking airmen away from work to get to appointments, lunch, etc. that shit doesn't fly. At that point the supervisor team got involved and got them to sort their shit out with a plan and a cutoff date for during work rides. We even had a mil to mil couple trying to say "they couldn't afford a vehicle". Bruh y'all are getting twice my pay and I'm running a household of 4 with 2 vehicles. 2. As far as getting to work, this sounds like you being bitchy about it saying "gas money". It's not adding cost to your travel to and from work. That's a weak excuse for you being selfish. Yeah you can decide who's allowed in your car but if it's not an actual hindrance... Is the airman causing you to be late? Using you as a ride other than to and from work? Those are different issues. If the fuck can't be ready to go on time, leave em. If they're trashing your vehicle, keep em out. But complaining about gas money to go to the same destination annoys me.
I didn’t read all the details, but echo what some others have said. Getting to work on time is a fundamental part of having a job. As such, it is a personal responsibility. It is okay to assist them for a short period of time? Certainly. Should it be a permanent solution? Not at all.
Once upon a time I didn't have a driver's license or a car and my co worker lived next door to me. We carpooled for a few months until one day she said I need to be an adult and get a license and car. She gave me a month to sort my shit out. The airman sounds entitled. And your schedules may not always line up. What happens when you PCS? He needs to be an adult and get his own form of transportation.
At a certain point you just have to tell these people time to 'adult'. If they don't show up to work they'll get paperwork. If you stop enabling them they'll get it figured out pretty fast.
We have an Amn that been on station for 1.5 years with no car and no plans to get one. He has been hitching rides with an Amn from another squadron. When the Uber Amn can’t pick him up, I’m expected to drive him to the dorms across base. I don’t even live in the dorms. I definitely understand your annoyance. Once he puts on SrA and has to move out of the dorms, hopefully that will give him a reality check. That being said, I straight up told him that I’m not going to give him rides anymore and he shouldn’t expect it from others either. Putting them in an uncomfortable situation /should/ force them to sack up and figure their shit out. I haven’t been asked to give a ride since. Good luck brother 🫡
Everyone who enlists(and commissions for that matter), is an adult. That means making adult decisions, if he decided to not buy a vehicle that’s on the individual. Making that your problem is being an asshole. Sounds like you have some real piece of work co-workers as well. Being a wingman is being there for your fellow Airman when they NEED you, not when they want to you give them a ride because they decided to not buy a vehicle. You’ve more than likely done more than enough to help this person.
Idk, I don't personally mind giving new Airmen rides before they get cars, but if that bothers you, you don't have to
Drive him to the bike cycle store and tell Him to pick one.
I don't think you're an asshole or rude either way you choose. If I were in your shoes I 'd set some rules. If you are at my car when I am leaving to go to work or leaving to go home I'll give you a ride. If you're not there for literally any reason, I'm not waiting. I'm not giving rides to any place else.
We had an airman who refused to get a car. He lived in the dorms with like half the shop so it wasn't an issue for awhile, except he started trying to guilt trip people into giving him rides. The final nail in his coffin was when he showed up late responding to the on-call because it was at night and he didn't want to walk in the rain. He knocked on another person's door (who wasn't on-call) to take him to work. In the middle of the fucking night. His job is to be at work when he is required to be at work. I don't mind giving people rides, but I won't drive you around until either of us PCS. “go get your car started and let’s go.” Sounds like he needs to buy a vehicle so he can go whenever he likes. The fact that you're even asking this after someone bumming rides talks to you like this... NTA. Tell the Airman to buy a method of transportation. Saw a dude in Ramstein ride one of those onewheel scooters for YEARS.
Not rude. I had a similar situation but they were out of my way. I was okay with it the first week as I was their sponsor, but it is taxing and a burden. I’d be honest with them. It’s hard to have that convo, but realistically you are not responsible for how they get there. Plus who knows what you have going on before/during/after. You are not obligated to take them to work. They are an adult and they can figure it out.
(I might leave details out. Will reply to replies with additional info) There are 2 sides to my comment: 1. When I first got on station, I was in a constant dilemma between asking for rides and driving my lamborfeeties. In the first couple months, I would get chewed out for leaving an hour prior for an appointment cause it was clear across base and I was walking. "Why didn't you ask for a ride.?" Probably because I'm considerate for others and always asked for shit growing up. Also was probably too prideful and just didn't want to go thru the hassle of asking in x amount of time before the appointment just to have the ride fall through. Would rather get there myself and not bother anyone for a ride. 2. It's probably just me, but I believe mindsets like the comments should change; to an extent. Be there for your wingman and encourage them to get on their feet, but don't let them take advantage. To and from work, food/supplies, appointments; no problem. Anything else will cost you extra, or just say 'sorry, man. I'm taking the day for myself' if they get salty; oh well 🤷🏽♂️
Bro, we are in a same boat. Exactly same situation, except she don’t even have license. Had her supervisor involved wks ago and nothing happened. I told her many times in many different ways to get a bike or get her drivers license. But seems like she’s not doing anything. Good luck on your situation and mine.
My shop said getting to work is nobody else's responsibility except yourself. We had an airman with the same issue. Leadership said he can purchase a bike or car but chooses not to. Nobody has an obligation to pick up his pieces. Needless to say, he was much walking to work everyday until he did something about it.
I relied on a coworker for rides for a good month at my first duty station. My parents sold my motorcycle while I was in tech school and the other they sent my in hhg had issues and I couldn't get it up and going right away. We were in a remote area and buying a used car was a major hunt as I didn't want to spend a fortune or get a lemon. I was however extremely kind to the person who drove me. Took myself to PT, DFAC and Commissary. I also still asked on occasion and paid into gas. I'd make it clear you aren't denying him because you CAN. You're doing it because he's being ungrateful!
You’re not wrong for how you feel given it’s your resources being taken advantage of… but i’m not sure a novel about a matter this trivial was necessary.
We had somebody do this in my shop and my immediate thought was “what if there’s an emergency and there’s nobody around to give this person a ride?” For example, what if you’re TDY and maybe the other people who he asks for rides from aren’t available and he needs to get to medical? It is important to have your own transportation in situations like these so you can take initiative and not have to wait for someone else assuming they’re even available. The military pays you, it may not be a lot but for an airman in the dorms but a car payment is possible. I mean, don’t get a crazy expensive dream car, just a basic one that gets you from A to B.
If you don’t hate the guy, I don’t see why you would bar him from riding shotgun if you’re heading to the same place. If it’s a regular thing, set boundaries with a timeline. If he’s not there in time that’s on him.
I’ve been in similar situations, some new Airmen are slow to start being adults. My personal rule is new guys have 3 months max to get their own car. At about the 2 and half mark , I have told people that their bus pass expires on X date . It’s not your job or responsibility to give this person rides. Giving them any rides is you being nice. They need a reality check that they’re a grown up who is responsible for getting themselves to work one way or another. I would be blunt and give said coworker a hard date that the rides stop. If they don’t take that news well then I would bring it up to your/their supervisor.
If this person wants to carpool, they should be pitching in money to help cover the cost of the vehicle (not just gas, there are additional costs to vehicle ownership/operation). They’re expecting you to own and operate a multi-thousands of dollars piece of equipment, maintaining legal registration, insurance and paying for all required maintenance/repairs/upkeep. That is a service with real value.
I know exactly where you work.
He’s an A1C. He’s poor. What is it hurting to give him a ride. Not rude. Just aita
Have you tried having a conversation with him like an adult? It doesn’t have to be a shitty conversation. Ask him when he plans on buying vehicle or bicycle? Let him know you can’t give him a ride every day. Work out some kinda deal where he fills up your gas tank on pay days. Does he have any other friends? Maybe he likes your company. Ultimately, you are grown up and can do whatever you want. But it seems to me like letting someone sit in your car while you go to the places you need to go is no big deal. If you genuinely just don’t like the dude, that’s a different story. But we’re all in weird places with new people and don’t know what hell we are doing. Sometimes a 3min ride to work with a friend is nice. And it’s ok to set boundaries so that you are not taken advantage of.