Valid. He probably didn’t wanna kill a kid. I typed out a tough lesson, but who knows what I would’ve done instead? Hopefully I can carry this with me.
I can see it. We're all arm chair coaches. I've certainly never had to fight for me life. I'd like to think that, especially with another person present, I wouldn't hesitate to shoot, but we're all fallible.
Hope this serves as a cautionary tale of survival to all people who carry.
One of the first things we were taught when I started defensive handgun courses was that if you are ever forced to pull out upur weapon. That means the situation is to the point that you need to use it as soon as it comes out. Otherwise do not pull it out as simply pointing it at someone is a felony. Unless your life is threatened you do not have a legal reason to pull it out. If your life or someone else's life is threatened to the point you draw your weapon, you are at the point it should be used immediately and without hesitation. We trained lots of different draw and fire drills. It becomes muscle memory that when that weapon comes out your next instict is immediately get on target and fire as quickly and accurately as possible. This man should have put two in this psycho as soon as possible after knowing she was a threat to his life.
This. My father taught me 2 rules.
1. Never point your muzzle at anything you arent willing to put a round through. (Be it the tree, the ground, your fathers leg etc..) number one rule of the muzzle rule is you don't break the muzzle rule. (Sounds insane, but i won't do it w the firearm disassembled and the barrel in my hand. Rules are rules.)
2. If you are justified to pull your firearm its time to use it. You don't threaten, brandish, or fire warning shots. Loads of reasons for this, but the point is if its time for self-defense its time. You can't control others actions or behaviors.
I feel bad for the guy and his family but absolutely fuck that. I’d gladly carry the “burden” of killing someone that is trying to kill me if it means that my family doesn’t have to bury me.
Fuck that. In all likelihood this guy assumed she was using the threat of force to induce compliance just like he was doing. As the previous poster noted, she was crazier than he thought. At the same time it’s also likely she would not have shot him if he didn’t pull his gun and threaten her life back. The headline is not really accurate, it doesn’t appear she lured him to murder him, she lured him to rob him. The murder came as the result of the additional threat.
She deserves the sentence and guns make things worse.
The big problem with your assumptions, she didn't just rob them like some Robinhood.
She marched them into woods toward her camp.... Rule one is never let someone move your location.
You seem to be victim blaming.
It’s not really hindsight. Every concealed carry course worth a damn will tell you that you don’t draw your gun unless you intend to use it. The only acceptable reason to not shoot is if your attacker immediately surrenders upon you drawing, but you don’t ask for a surrender. You aren’t the police and you don’t have a moral or legal obligation to peacefully resolve a situation where someone is threatening your life. You have an obligation to those in your life who need you to survive.
This is not hindsight 20/20. This is a very clear rule for anyone with any firearm knowledge. Do not, ever, pull out a gun you aren’t ready to immediately used if the other person has a weapon. You’ve just escalated that encounter, and if you aren’t ready to take a life leave your gun holstered & hand over whatever they want
Oh so, people don’t just put their hands up like in the movies? I guess that’s what he expected. Then he was going to kick her gun aside and hand it to his partner. Now both of them are pointing guns at the thief. They tell her to get down on her knees and count to twenty while they run off into the sunset like two badasses.
I know it’s easy to say when you’re safe at home on your computer, but god damn i do not care about random people enough to worry about having a life on my hands if they’re threatening me with a gun. Why would I care about their life? They clearly don’t value mine, and I value mine. If I had to kill someone to save my own life, I don’t think it’d bother me outside of the initial shock of and trauma of the experience. But I wouldn’t feel guilty.
I mean he returned fire and shot her 4 times in the abdomen and leg.
Under duress he probably gripped the gun suboptimally causing his shots to hit lower.
I would love to know what kind of bullets they were using. If she had hollow points and he had FMJ, that could explain the discrepancy in survival outcomes
Likely he did it because that's what you see people do in movies and TV. Real life isn't a movie, people aren't magically frozen on the spot just because you're pointing a gun at them and giving them a command.
When I was a kid my dad described this scenario to me along with many others and relayed the widely given rule to cover all: never point a gun at someone unless you're prepared to kill them.
No. In a life or death situation you're not thinking about optics.
He either fell back on shit he always saw on TV and in movies. Or he was unfortunately a good person and didn't want to kill anyone.
i agree with your second point, and very much doubt your first point.
he saw a teenage girl and probably didn’t want to shoot her unless he really really had to (and he should have, nothing of importance would have been lost), and gave her a command to drop the weapon. unfortunately that girl was a monster, and took his life. i think he wanted to resolve the situation peacefully if he could’ve, and it ended with him losing his life unfortunately.
That's why you are trained in CCW classes to not pull out your weapon to resolve situations but to shoot. Some States don't require those classes, but they do try to drill that into your head. Do not use a gun to negotiate
Agreed. I heard this from a real life Chad and it stuck with me: “In a moment of crisis we rarely rise to the level of our expectations. Instead, we fall to the level of our training.”
All the reddits saying otherwise would be saying "WhY dId He sHoOt hEr sHe WaS jUsT gOnNa RoB hIm hEr lIfE iSnT wOrtH lEsS tHaN tHiNgS" if he didnt hesitate and die
No it doesn’t. If the girl pulls a gun on a cop, he’ll say “drop the gun!” as he’s mag dumping. And he would be in the right.
Now, if you’re knocking on someone’s door as a cop and someone answers with a gun to their side and you’re at the wrong house and block their ability to identify you (cover the peephole) then no, you’re not in the right.
Yeah was always taught not to brandish for any reason. If you pull out the gun you should have every intention of using it immediately. You can’t think or react faster than a bullet flies, it’s not hollywood
> At the time of the incident, Hider said the pair lived in a 'base camp' in the woods along with Pinkins' five-year-old child not too far from where Simjee was killed.
> Hider said that the robbery had been Pinkins' plan and the gun belonged to her camp mate.
> After a subsequent six hour search, officers located Pinkins in her 'base camp.' *They were immediately set upon by her five-year-old child who emerged from the woods armed with a loaded shot gun.*
> Authorities were able to disarm the child and give him over to child protective services.
Well shit.
i mean one prob does not one want to murder someone else and they were prob trying to leave the situation with a dead person and hoping to resolve it by just that person giving up or smth
Did the article say that the actual shooter got 35 years and her much older accomplice, who hid in the woods and ran away, get life?
Why did they offer her a plea deal if one of the victims survived? Surely they had the evidence needed to get a guilty verdict
They likely gave her the opportunity to identify the person who ran away because finding that person would otherwise be very difficult. So she likely exchanged that info for a sentence that wasn’t life in prison.
The ‘broken down’ car and the original gun both belonged to the older not present attacker who got a life sentence.
Are we to believe a detective could not find the owner of a registered car and gun? They needed eye witness testimony to get that data?
Finding the owner of the car and gun wouldn't prove that they were the person present during the altercation. I doubt a DA would ever bring about charges if that was all the evidence.
People take plea deals all the time in exchange for information. Sure there is more details but Hilden talking saves everyone a lot of effort and she will still be put away for 35 years. Pilkins was federally charged, convicted and prisoner dilemma dictates the last to roll over has a higher sentence. I dont think it's about an incompetent detective but this is just my reddit armchair impression.
totally agree. Its a lot easier to convict with the testimony and the car registration. Without witness cooperation, the older attacker who owned the car could claim the younger attacker stole it from them.
Well these people are associated with a cult that has at least 6 people, including three kids missing. So something bigger may be happening behind the scenes.
Seemed like a situation of the 37 year old could have been manipulating her to take all the risk. They were homeless, living in the woods together. Not excusing the 19 year old by any means but the article ends in a very sad way -
"Prosecutors agreed to a plea deal after learning that Hider had been living off the grid in the forest with 37-year-old Krystal Pinkins, **who owned both the car used to lure in the couple and the gun used to kill Simjee**, says the agreement.
Pinkins was also sentenced on Thursday, receiving a sentence of life in prison after being convicted of murder, kidnapping and robbery following a federal trial earlier this year.
Hider had told officers Pinkins was nearby when she committed the crime, and had come up with the idea of robbing a motorist, according to the agreement.
That happened while Hider was being treated in the hospital, and the agreement says she also asked about her victim at the time, saying: “Did he die? I didn’t want to hurt anybody.”
When told that he died, Hider said: “I took his whole life away; now he can’t tell his story.”"
Not sadder than the the young man who lost his life. I'm just wondering if she has mental health problems being homeless so young and that a much older adult seems to have been the mastermind behind the idea.
Reading the article it sounds like they offered her a plea deal because she had some sympathy for the victim. Said she didn’t want to hurt nobody or some shit and now he can’t tell his story what that means. Those comments sound like maybe she isn’t all there to me.
she won't be getting out of prison in Alabama, at her age she'll be institutionalized in a few years and that's a wrap for her because she wont become some model prisoner and keep her nose clean. Her accomplice got life, and the only reason she got 35 is from a plea deal to testify against her accomplice
> When told that he died, Hider said: “I took his whole life away; now he can’t tell his story.”
Sociopaths are much more common than we acknowledge.
By the way, If you’re ever in front of a grand jury defending your decision to open fire, just recount this story and how that influenced your views on what happens when you feel your life is in danger and hesitate.
That was the first thing I thought. That is a sociopath style thing to say. Sociopaths are actually all over the place and it seems to be getting worse.
Yeah an attempt to manipulate. She literally said “are you kidding me” before opening fire lol. If you didn’t know that part of the story it would be easy to get taken in by the false show of remorse
Sociopaths are experts at copying other people’s emotions. They are experts at manipulation. They fake emotions decently well. But they really do not feel remorseful at all.
Yeah exactly. This statement feels “wrong” in context for most people, and that’s a telltale sign. Sociopaths can’t actually feel the same emotions, so the only way they learn to hide is by reacting in a way they think a normal person would react. In this case, the statement feels wrong because it doesn’t cross the uncanny valley in mimesis. It sounds like something a new-age person would say about some far away distant death, not something they were directly involved in.
IF someone is threatening you with a gun and they have no idea you have a gun, you shoot them. It is that simple. They will eventually do this to someone else and kill and innocent person. This piece of shit deserved to die instead.
I’ve never been so afraid to be a “Good Samaritan” than I do currently. It’s like taking the ultimate risk now. Stop and help someone in need at the risk of BEING MURDERED for it! It’s sad, and I hate that this is the world we live in. All I ever do now is drive by and say, “man that sucks…been there plenty times before”. Just not worth leaving an entire family behind to be kind.
I remember 20 - 25yrs ago, being young, and actually picking up hitch hikers..... Like, wtf was I thinking? I thought it was just a nice gesture but holy shit I could have been killed
20 years ago my neighbors kid gave a guy a ride. Their son was taken out into the woods put on this knees and shot in the back of the head. I never give anyone a ride. I was a little kid when I found out.
I once gave a lady a ride who was stuck at a gas station about 25 years ago. I was probably 16 at the time.
I drove her home, and her husband/boyfriend/whatever was waiting, and she proceeded to tell me to DRIVE! He chased my car out of the trailer park, country bumpkin style.
Next I drove her to her friend's house, about 10 minutes away. No one home.
She asks me to drive to her other friend's house, which I presumed was similarly close. Nope. It was in a well known meth neighborhood about 30 minutes away. After a very awkward silent trip, she propositions me as we pull up to the the house.
I slowly reached across her lap, maintained soft eye contact, popped open the door and told her to GTFO right now.
I have never entertained picking up someone again.
Helping strangers isn’t worth it, I once *smiled* at a kid and her dad screamed “fuck you bitch! Yeah you heard me!” If you’re gonna act like an ass, you can stay out in the field alone like one
The police have no obligation to stop and help you. I watched two separate police drive right by me one time when I had a flat in a rental car that didn't have a spare. I ended up walking 5 miles to a gas station where luckily there was a guy with a tow truck and the gas station employee knew a guy not far with a tire shop. I was in the middle of nowhere and there was no cell signal where I picked up the flat.
On another note I had a sheriff stop one time on the interstate when I had a mechanical failure not too far from my house. I had already contacted roadside assistance and a tow truck was on the way. Not long after stopping the pig said that he didn't stop for assistance but lied and said it was their policy to search for drugs. He got mad at me when I refused and told him to get a warrant because being a stranded motorist was in no way probable cause for a search.
I do agree though who is going to stop now after reading that story. Kind of sucks because you're really on your own.
I was a kid and got lost on my bike trying to find our families tent/cabin in Yosemite. I had been trying to find them for 4 hours with no luck. I finally saw a cop car, and out of desperation went to his window, got his attention and he didn’t even roll down the window he just pointed forward and gave a motion like he had to go and just left me there. It wasn’t like he was driving to am emergency because he was stopped on the side of the road. I was shocked and remember thinking how messed up he was.
It's sad that complete pieces of shit like this girl make us less trustful and inclined to help each other. I will always be thankful of people who stopped and volunteered to be a witness when I almost got killed by other idiot drivers
No guarantee the person has a working phone, or has service, or that police will actually respond and help them. Why would you go out of your way and tell people to be unempathetic and untrusting in all situations just because this tragedy happened?
What’s the phrase for situations like this - better to be judged by 12 than carried by 6. If someone pulled a gun on you to rob you, that’s all the self defense justification you need. Neutralize the threat.
You got two options sadly. Pull out gun & shoot, or leave the gun in the car & comply with robbery. Personally I’d almost always choose the 2nd. I’d really only ever choose the first if it becomes clear they don’t intend to just rob me
His girlfriend made a series of TikToks talking about this incident. He did fire several times and the woman attacking them was hit a few times. He even hit her first, before she shot him. In a perverse twist of fate, because she had layers of fat and he was physically fit, the bullets didn’t reach her vital organs but they did reach his. She was wearing a bulletproof vest of obesity basically
imagine dying because you were too kind....twice! once by stopping by to help, twice by asking her to drop the gun instead and of shooting right away....the world is effed up.
Man I’m sorry but if I had an opportunity to shoot somebody who had a gun pointed at me, I wouldn’t give them the option to drop the gun. You’ve already proven your intent and I’m not going to play a guessing game as to whether or not you’re going to use it.
You’re right. When the article said she ordered them to “empty their pockets and then walk into the forest” it sent a chill down my spine. If you walk into the woods you’re not walking out.
Just curious. How many people here actually think the perps were ever planning on letting the victims live. Personally, I think that guy saved his girlfriend's life since it looks like they intended on walking them into the forest to kill them.
The only counterpoint I see is the words of the perpetrator after she had already been caught
This makes me never want to stop and help teenagers in a isolated place. Unfortunately you have to use your best judgment to whom you help on the side of the road.
That guy did not appreciate the seriousness of the situation. Hider, who seem a little more aware of the situation, survived while the naïve victim died. I can't remember the source, but I read a quote a long time ago saying to never "Show mercy to those who only see it as weakness"
Or maybe he was too squeamish to shoot. Better to be judged by 12 than carried by 6.
'After the shooting stopped, HIDER said, “Why did you shoot? It wasn’t supposed to be like this.”'
I wonder if Hider meant that her previous murder victims don't usually shoot back or that her previous robbery victims don't usually resist.
No, she 100% was going to murder the both of them. The only reason the GF is alive is because this wretch of a person got shot multiple times and didn't have the capacity to murder the GF. They should both receive the death penalty, it was 100% premeditated.
A sad lesson that we see in this article is that he should have shot her if he pulled the gun out. In most states when you are taking CCW courses you are trained to not pull out your weapon unless you absolutely
1 - Have to to defend yourself and
2 - Shoot
You should never pull your weapon out to disarm, do not believe movies and TV. When she had her gun out, he should have immediately shot center mass to kill when he pulled his gun out. It's not my legal area but I did see more cases like this where someone pulled out a gun in self defense, to only negotiate with the assailant.
In many cases it does end up a shoot out like this. Don't talk, you are not a police officer and movies are fake. You may have to deal with a long trial (certain States that's possible) but at least you're alive.
I watched a water buffalo giving birth and a crocodile jumping out of the water pulling the baby water buffalo out of its mother (while she's giving birth to it) and swims away with it. <---- that's nature.
That's why I don't pullover to help fellow humans, Humans are creepy.
What’s crazy is that bitch survived being shot multiple times in the stomach, which tells you that you just need to keep shooting until they’re not moving anymore.
He fucked up. There are certain situations maybe if he was held at knife point where you can pull the gun out and say some shit like “get on the ground.” And then there are situations like this where you’re being held at gunpoint and you fucking dummy. You pull out the gun and tell her to put her gun down? no one deserves to die, but he didn’t help his case pulling that gun out. He probably would’ve lived if he never pulled the gun out.
Man, I feel bad for the guy, but his mistake was that he didn’t shoot her right away. He wasn’t prepared to use the gun and he should’ve never had one if that’s the case.
When told that he died, Hider (teenager) said: “I took his whole life away; now he can’t tell his story.”
Why only 35 years, which will probably get dropped down to 30, for this premeditated murderer with no ability to show remorse.
1. If you pull a gun in someone you better be ready to use it. This dude pulled his gun and then tried to reason his way out of using it.
2. You are 4x more likely to die in an assault if you are armed. He likely would have survived if he didn't pull it out in the first place, or wasn't carrying at all. She fired because he threatened her. Conceal carry is cope.
3. The wrong person survived and the world is a bit worse because our gun laws cater to the copeaholics rather than any reason or logic whatsoever.
1. Yes he should have used it.
2. He died because he didn't cash the check he wrote by drawing.
3. There are a lot of great reasons for advocating gun control and safe gun ownership. This isn't it.
Insane thing is in some states, he would’ve gone to prison if he had killed HER. Yanno the psycho f*ck that robbed him and killed him? I imagine in Alabama he would’ve been fine, however. But still going to spend a few days in jail because they need to figure out what happened. Not saying for or against, just commenting how crazy it is to be the victim and have to spend a couple days in jail while the police figure out exactly what happened.
Gee, I wonder why he hesitated to kill her. I can't even imagine why. Anyone have any ideas? I mean, he had to have hesitated for a reason but I just can't seem to figure it out. Why in the world would a guy like that hesitate to shoot a woman like her?
Never pull unless you plan to shoot. And if you pull, you don't hesitate. There's no way I'd be giving out warnings to someone who's already pulled on me.
This is why I don’t help people in public.
I’ll even go as far as to not help a drowning child. You think I’m gonna touch a minor? As a 34 year old man, you think I’m going TO PHYSICALLY TOUCH A CHILD??!? LOL! Yeah, no.
[удалено]
[удалено]
Hindsight is always 20/20. He didn't want to have a death on his hands. Unfortunately for him, the person in front of him was crazier than he thought.
Valid. He probably didn’t wanna kill a kid. I typed out a tough lesson, but who knows what I would’ve done instead? Hopefully I can carry this with me.
I can see it. We're all arm chair coaches. I've certainly never had to fight for me life. I'd like to think that, especially with another person present, I wouldn't hesitate to shoot, but we're all fallible. Hope this serves as a cautionary tale of survival to all people who carry.
One of the first things we were taught when I started defensive handgun courses was that if you are ever forced to pull out upur weapon. That means the situation is to the point that you need to use it as soon as it comes out. Otherwise do not pull it out as simply pointing it at someone is a felony. Unless your life is threatened you do not have a legal reason to pull it out. If your life or someone else's life is threatened to the point you draw your weapon, you are at the point it should be used immediately and without hesitation. We trained lots of different draw and fire drills. It becomes muscle memory that when that weapon comes out your next instict is immediately get on target and fire as quickly and accurately as possible. This man should have put two in this psycho as soon as possible after knowing she was a threat to his life.
I appreciate that insight and sharing your training. Valuable stuff.
This is what I assumed they taught during firearm training. Maybe this guy just bought a gun and skipped the good stuff.
This. My father taught me 2 rules. 1. Never point your muzzle at anything you arent willing to put a round through. (Be it the tree, the ground, your fathers leg etc..) number one rule of the muzzle rule is you don't break the muzzle rule. (Sounds insane, but i won't do it w the firearm disassembled and the barrel in my hand. Rules are rules.) 2. If you are justified to pull your firearm its time to use it. You don't threaten, brandish, or fire warning shots. Loads of reasons for this, but the point is if its time for self-defense its time. You can't control others actions or behaviors.
I feel bad for the guy and his family but absolutely fuck that. I’d gladly carry the “burden” of killing someone that is trying to kill me if it means that my family doesn’t have to bury me.
Especially when they’re also threatening your loved one who’s with you
Finally someone with some goddamn sense.
Fuck that. In all likelihood this guy assumed she was using the threat of force to induce compliance just like he was doing. As the previous poster noted, she was crazier than he thought. At the same time it’s also likely she would not have shot him if he didn’t pull his gun and threaten her life back. The headline is not really accurate, it doesn’t appear she lured him to murder him, she lured him to rob him. The murder came as the result of the additional threat. She deserves the sentence and guns make things worse.
[удалено]
keep in mind, there was her collaborator in the woods too. who knows what their intent was.
lol you can gamble on them not shooting you all you want.
The big problem with your assumptions, she didn't just rob them like some Robinhood. She marched them into woods toward her camp.... Rule one is never let someone move your location. You seem to be victim blaming.
lol. You sound like an excellent victim.
Let’s be honest, the headline would’ve been “white man kills black girl” and 16 paragraphs down they’d explain it was a shootout if he had done that.
100%
Don't carry a gun if you're not prepared to use it.
It’s not really hindsight. Every concealed carry course worth a damn will tell you that you don’t draw your gun unless you intend to use it. The only acceptable reason to not shoot is if your attacker immediately surrenders upon you drawing, but you don’t ask for a surrender. You aren’t the police and you don’t have a moral or legal obligation to peacefully resolve a situation where someone is threatening your life. You have an obligation to those in your life who need you to survive.
This is not hindsight 20/20. This is a very clear rule for anyone with any firearm knowledge. Do not, ever, pull out a gun you aren’t ready to immediately used if the other person has a weapon. You’ve just escalated that encounter, and if you aren’t ready to take a life leave your gun holstered & hand over whatever they want
Oh so, people don’t just put their hands up like in the movies? I guess that’s what he expected. Then he was going to kick her gun aside and hand it to his partner. Now both of them are pointing guns at the thief. They tell her to get down on her knees and count to twenty while they run off into the sunset like two badasses.
If you touch a gun death is always the stakes. If you can't accept that you have no business carrying one.
I know it’s easy to say when you’re safe at home on your computer, but god damn i do not care about random people enough to worry about having a life on my hands if they’re threatening me with a gun. Why would I care about their life? They clearly don’t value mine, and I value mine. If I had to kill someone to save my own life, I don’t think it’d bother me outside of the initial shock of and trauma of the experience. But I wouldn’t feel guilty.
I mean he returned fire and shot her 4 times in the abdomen and leg. Under duress he probably gripped the gun suboptimally causing his shots to hit lower. I would love to know what kind of bullets they were using. If she had hollow points and he had FMJ, that could explain the discrepancy in survival outcomes
Likely he did it because that's what you see people do in movies and TV. Real life isn't a movie, people aren't magically frozen on the spot just because you're pointing a gun at them and giving them a command.
It’s the empathy and hope one will listen to reason.
Lmao you mean Darwinism instincts
How many shoot outs with guns pointing at you have you been involved in?
When I was a kid my dad described this scenario to me along with many others and relayed the widely given rule to cover all: never point a gun at someone unless you're prepared to kill them.
As I learned from the game Sekiro “hesitation is defeat”
Sounds like he got himself killed tbh
Better to be judged by 12 than to be carried by 6.
Tuco from The Good, The Bad and The Ugly said it best “when you have to shoot shoot don’t talk”
Didnt want to be labeled a racist probably
No. In a life or death situation you're not thinking about optics. He either fell back on shit he always saw on TV and in movies. Or he was unfortunately a good person and didn't want to kill anyone.
i agree with your second point, and very much doubt your first point. he saw a teenage girl and probably didn’t want to shoot her unless he really really had to (and he should have, nothing of importance would have been lost), and gave her a command to drop the weapon. unfortunately that girl was a monster, and took his life. i think he wanted to resolve the situation peacefully if he could’ve, and it ended with him losing his life unfortunately.
That's why you are trained in CCW classes to not pull out your weapon to resolve situations but to shoot. Some States don't require those classes, but they do try to drill that into your head. Do not use a gun to negotiate
Agreed. I heard this from a real life Chad and it stuck with me: “In a moment of crisis we rarely rise to the level of our expectations. Instead, we fall to the level of our training.”
Lol what? "Excuse me sir I know you're robbing me, and are probably going to kill me, but you're black so please proceed, My apologies"
Can you imagine shooting a POC teen because they had a gun. He would have been in trouble and unable to prove defense.
All the reddits saying otherwise would be saying "WhY dId He sHoOt hEr sHe WaS jUsT gOnNa RoB hIm hEr lIfE iSnT wOrtH lEsS tHaN tHiNgS" if he didnt hesitate and die
Gets kinda muddy when it’s a cop taking this advice though.
No it doesn’t. If the girl pulls a gun on a cop, he’ll say “drop the gun!” as he’s mag dumping. And he would be in the right. Now, if you’re knocking on someone’s door as a cop and someone answers with a gun to their side and you’re at the wrong house and block their ability to identify you (cover the peephole) then no, you’re not in the right.
Yeah was always taught not to brandish for any reason. If you pull out the gun you should have every intention of using it immediately. You can’t think or react faster than a bullet flies, it’s not hollywood
> At the time of the incident, Hider said the pair lived in a 'base camp' in the woods along with Pinkins' five-year-old child not too far from where Simjee was killed. > Hider said that the robbery had been Pinkins' plan and the gun belonged to her camp mate. > After a subsequent six hour search, officers located Pinkins in her 'base camp.' *They were immediately set upon by her five-year-old child who emerged from the woods armed with a loaded shot gun.* > Authorities were able to disarm the child and give him over to child protective services. Well shit.
[удалено]
Pretty sure like 30 states and Puerto Rico have stand your ground laws. Although that number should be 50
i mean one prob does not one want to murder someone else and they were prob trying to leave the situation with a dead person and hoping to resolve it by just that person giving up or smth
It wasn't clear she was planning to murder him. She was trying to rob him and she pled guilty to second degree murder. I.e. no premeditation.
She was gonna force them into the woods, she wasn’t planning a camping trip
I hope that piece of shit rots in jail.
She only got 35 years, so probably not, unfortunately. Should’ve gotten life.
Did the article say that the actual shooter got 35 years and her much older accomplice, who hid in the woods and ran away, get life? Why did they offer her a plea deal if one of the victims survived? Surely they had the evidence needed to get a guilty verdict
They likely gave her the opportunity to identify the person who ran away because finding that person would otherwise be very difficult. So she likely exchanged that info for a sentence that wasn’t life in prison.
The ‘broken down’ car and the original gun both belonged to the older not present attacker who got a life sentence. Are we to believe a detective could not find the owner of a registered car and gun? They needed eye witness testimony to get that data?
Finding the owner of the car and gun wouldn't prove that they were the person present during the altercation. I doubt a DA would ever bring about charges if that was all the evidence.
People take plea deals all the time in exchange for information. Sure there is more details but Hilden talking saves everyone a lot of effort and she will still be put away for 35 years. Pilkins was federally charged, convicted and prisoner dilemma dictates the last to roll over has a higher sentence. I dont think it's about an incompetent detective but this is just my reddit armchair impression.
totally agree. Its a lot easier to convict with the testimony and the car registration. Without witness cooperation, the older attacker who owned the car could claim the younger attacker stole it from them.
I think the life verdict for the accomplice was for another murder.
Well these people are associated with a cult that has at least 6 people, including three kids missing. So something bigger may be happening behind the scenes.
Seemed like a situation of the 37 year old could have been manipulating her to take all the risk. They were homeless, living in the woods together. Not excusing the 19 year old by any means but the article ends in a very sad way - "Prosecutors agreed to a plea deal after learning that Hider had been living off the grid in the forest with 37-year-old Krystal Pinkins, **who owned both the car used to lure in the couple and the gun used to kill Simjee**, says the agreement. Pinkins was also sentenced on Thursday, receiving a sentence of life in prison after being convicted of murder, kidnapping and robbery following a federal trial earlier this year. Hider had told officers Pinkins was nearby when she committed the crime, and had come up with the idea of robbing a motorist, according to the agreement. That happened while Hider was being treated in the hospital, and the agreement says she also asked about her victim at the time, saying: “Did he die? I didn’t want to hurt anybody.” When told that he died, Hider said: “I took his whole life away; now he can’t tell his story.”" Not sadder than the the young man who lost his life. I'm just wondering if she has mental health problems being homeless so young and that a much older adult seems to have been the mastermind behind the idea.
Reading the article it sounds like they offered her a plea deal because she had some sympathy for the victim. Said she didn’t want to hurt nobody or some shit and now he can’t tell his story what that means. Those comments sound like maybe she isn’t all there to me.
she won't be getting out of prison in Alabama, at her age she'll be institutionalized in a few years and that's a wrap for her because she wont become some model prisoner and keep her nose clean. Her accomplice got life, and the only reason she got 35 is from a plea deal to testify against her accomplice
Plenty of child murderers are out today, walking free. You never know. She could find god or something.
I wonder how many years she'll serve.
She will be an old broken down woman when she gets out with a murder conviction. Her life won’t be great if she gets out regardless.
> When told that he died, Hider said: “I took his whole life away; now he can’t tell his story.” Sociopaths are much more common than we acknowledge. By the way, If you’re ever in front of a grand jury defending your decision to open fire, just recount this story and how that influenced your views on what happens when you feel your life is in danger and hesitate.
That was the first thing I thought. That is a sociopath style thing to say. Sociopaths are actually all over the place and it seems to be getting worse.
The amount of people in this world increases so you’re right
I read this as regret, maybe even remorse.
Yeah an attempt to manipulate. She literally said “are you kidding me” before opening fire lol. If you didn’t know that part of the story it would be easy to get taken in by the false show of remorse
Sociopaths are experts at copying other people’s emotions. They are experts at manipulation. They fake emotions decently well. But they really do not feel remorseful at all.
Yeah exactly. This statement feels “wrong” in context for most people, and that’s a telltale sign. Sociopaths can’t actually feel the same emotions, so the only way they learn to hide is by reacting in a way they think a normal person would react. In this case, the statement feels wrong because it doesn’t cross the uncanny valley in mimesis. It sounds like something a new-age person would say about some far away distant death, not something they were directly involved in.
IF someone is threatening you with a gun and they have no idea you have a gun, you shoot them. It is that simple. They will eventually do this to someone else and kill and innocent person. This piece of shit deserved to die instead.
This. It's a tactical mistake to not put down the threat at the first opportunity because you may not get another opportunity.
I’ve never been so afraid to be a “Good Samaritan” than I do currently. It’s like taking the ultimate risk now. Stop and help someone in need at the risk of BEING MURDERED for it! It’s sad, and I hate that this is the world we live in. All I ever do now is drive by and say, “man that sucks…been there plenty times before”. Just not worth leaving an entire family behind to be kind.
It's not my job to be a good Samaritan. Everyone has a cell phone now.
I remember 20 - 25yrs ago, being young, and actually picking up hitch hikers..... Like, wtf was I thinking? I thought it was just a nice gesture but holy shit I could have been killed
20 years ago my neighbors kid gave a guy a ride. Their son was taken out into the woods put on this knees and shot in the back of the head. I never give anyone a ride. I was a little kid when I found out.
If i were the neighbor it would be tough for me to get over the feeling to pull a Gary Plauche
I once gave a lady a ride who was stuck at a gas station about 25 years ago. I was probably 16 at the time. I drove her home, and her husband/boyfriend/whatever was waiting, and she proceeded to tell me to DRIVE! He chased my car out of the trailer park, country bumpkin style. Next I drove her to her friend's house, about 10 minutes away. No one home. She asks me to drive to her other friend's house, which I presumed was similarly close. Nope. It was in a well known meth neighborhood about 30 minutes away. After a very awkward silent trip, she propositions me as we pull up to the the house. I slowly reached across her lap, maintained soft eye contact, popped open the door and told her to GTFO right now. I have never entertained picking up someone again.
You were just young and naive. People have been getting killed by strangers since forever. I think the constant awareness makes it seem worse now.
Helping strangers isn’t worth it, I once *smiled* at a kid and her dad screamed “fuck you bitch! Yeah you heard me!” If you’re gonna act like an ass, you can stay out in the field alone like one
Meh, times are different. 2 people and no cell phone to call for help? I'd never stop, never
Violent crime is currently at or near the lowest it has been in a century. You were in more of risk being a Good Samaritan years ago.
Never stop for anyone on the highway. If they need help the police will be there.
The police have no obligation to stop and help you. I watched two separate police drive right by me one time when I had a flat in a rental car that didn't have a spare. I ended up walking 5 miles to a gas station where luckily there was a guy with a tow truck and the gas station employee knew a guy not far with a tire shop. I was in the middle of nowhere and there was no cell signal where I picked up the flat. On another note I had a sheriff stop one time on the interstate when I had a mechanical failure not too far from my house. I had already contacted roadside assistance and a tow truck was on the way. Not long after stopping the pig said that he didn't stop for assistance but lied and said it was their policy to search for drugs. He got mad at me when I refused and told him to get a warrant because being a stranded motorist was in no way probable cause for a search. I do agree though who is going to stop now after reading that story. Kind of sucks because you're really on your own.
I was a kid and got lost on my bike trying to find our families tent/cabin in Yosemite. I had been trying to find them for 4 hours with no luck. I finally saw a cop car, and out of desperation went to his window, got his attention and he didn’t even roll down the window he just pointed forward and gave a motion like he had to go and just left me there. It wasn’t like he was driving to am emergency because he was stopped on the side of the road. I was shocked and remember thinking how messed up he was.
that's insane, like being lost is scary but imagine if you'd had a life threatening emergency and they'd just pulled off
It's sad that complete pieces of shit like this girl make us less trustful and inclined to help each other. I will always be thankful of people who stopped and volunteered to be a witness when I almost got killed by other idiot drivers
No guarantee the person has a working phone, or has service, or that police will actually respond and help them. Why would you go out of your way and tell people to be unempathetic and untrusting in all situations just because this tragedy happened?
Better to be safe than sorry, and wind up like this poor guy. He could have kept driving, called the cops to let them know, and still be alive
Uh because there’s a chance that something like what happened in this article happening lol
What’s the phrase for situations like this - better to be judged by 12 than carried by 6. If someone pulled a gun on you to rob you, that’s all the self defense justification you need. Neutralize the threat.
Just a PSA, do not ever pull out a gun you aren’t ready to use. The first thing he should have done is pull the trigger.
It's really sad... he wasn't ready to take a life and lost his because of it. But it is easier said than done and he was so young and inexperienced.
You got two options sadly. Pull out gun & shoot, or leave the gun in the car & comply with robbery. Personally I’d almost always choose the 2nd. I’d really only ever choose the first if it becomes clear they don’t intend to just rob me
His girlfriend made a series of TikToks talking about this incident. He did fire several times and the woman attacking them was hit a few times. He even hit her first, before she shot him. In a perverse twist of fate, because she had layers of fat and he was physically fit, the bullets didn’t reach her vital organs but they did reach his. She was wearing a bulletproof vest of obesity basically
Al Sharpton said his own doctors told him his obesity saved his life when he got stabbed in the early 90s
Sad
[удалено]
She was living with a 37 year old woman who came up with the idea. The car and the gun were hers. Her name was pinktin
Pinktin is a woman.
I stand corrected
imagine dying because you were too kind....twice! once by stopping by to help, twice by asking her to drop the gun instead and of shooting right away....the world is effed up.
Man I’m sorry but if I had an opportunity to shoot somebody who had a gun pointed at me, I wouldn’t give them the option to drop the gun. You’ve already proven your intent and I’m not going to play a guessing game as to whether or not you’re going to use it.
That's exactly what you should do. You or them
They'd drop the gun. It would be due to the sudden trauma in their apricot.
You’re right. When the article said she ordered them to “empty their pockets and then walk into the forest” it sent a chill down my spine. If you walk into the woods you’re not walking out.
Cant believe that level of premeditation and cruelty only gets 35yrs
Just curious. How many people here actually think the perps were ever planning on letting the victims live. Personally, I think that guy saved his girlfriend's life since it looks like they intended on walking them into the forest to kill them. The only counterpoint I see is the words of the perpetrator after she had already been caught
This makes me never want to stop and help teenagers in a isolated place. Unfortunately you have to use your best judgment to whom you help on the side of the road.
Another example of a piece of shit human
That guy did not appreciate the seriousness of the situation. Hider, who seem a little more aware of the situation, survived while the naïve victim died. I can't remember the source, but I read a quote a long time ago saying to never "Show mercy to those who only see it as weakness" Or maybe he was too squeamish to shoot. Better to be judged by 12 than carried by 6. 'After the shooting stopped, HIDER said, “Why did you shoot? It wasn’t supposed to be like this.”' I wonder if Hider meant that her previous murder victims don't usually shoot back or that her previous robbery victims don't usually resist.
May she do the hardest time possible. Learn a lesson through suffering
This is fucking terrible
35 years is too light. Should be life with no possibility of parole.
Yeah these are the kind of people who deserve the death penalty.
No, she 100% was going to murder the both of them. The only reason the GF is alive is because this wretch of a person got shot multiple times and didn't have the capacity to murder the GF. They should both receive the death penalty, it was 100% premeditated.
Lives were in danger - you shoot s as soon as you have the opportunity. Don’t carry if you’re not ready to do this. What a tragedy.
35 years isn’t enough. In Canada she would have been out in 5-10 though.
Never ever warn someone if you pull a gun. Just shoot until they aren’t moving
To anyone getting into firearms. When someone has a gun pulled on you. Don’t unholster and negotiate. You’ll die 10/10 times.
A sad lesson that we see in this article is that he should have shot her if he pulled the gun out. In most states when you are taking CCW courses you are trained to not pull out your weapon unless you absolutely 1 - Have to to defend yourself and 2 - Shoot You should never pull your weapon out to disarm, do not believe movies and TV. When she had her gun out, he should have immediately shot center mass to kill when he pulled his gun out. It's not my legal area but I did see more cases like this where someone pulled out a gun in self defense, to only negotiate with the assailant. In many cases it does end up a shoot out like this. Don't talk, you are not a police officer and movies are fake. You may have to deal with a long trial (certain States that's possible) but at least you're alive.
[удалено]
More stupid than evil.
He probably hesitated because he knew the outcome if he killed a black teenager even in self-defense. It’s a lose/lose situation unfortunately.
Hope it’s 35 years of hard labor. Busting rocks into smaller rocks 7 days a week for 35 years.
Don’t be a Good Samaritan in a low-trust society. This poor fellow should have trusted his gut and crime statistics.
He should have blasted her
[удалено]
“Did he die? I didn’t want to hurt anybody.” What a waste.
Ugh this makes me so upset
What a bitch
This is America
I remember hearing this story from the girlfriend’s TikTok, just heartbreaking to hear about how loved he was and how everything unfolded
She deserves life, no parole.
Only 35years????
35 thats it, I believe if your convicted of murder in situations like this and most others straight death penalty
I watched a water buffalo giving birth and a crocodile jumping out of the water pulling the baby water buffalo out of its mother (while she's giving birth to it) and swims away with it. <---- that's nature. That's why I don't pullover to help fellow humans, Humans are creepy.
What’s crazy is that bitch survived being shot multiple times in the stomach, which tells you that you just need to keep shooting until they’re not moving anymore.
This should be the minimum sentence for murderers and rapists.
He fucked up. There are certain situations maybe if he was held at knife point where you can pull the gun out and say some shit like “get on the ground.” And then there are situations like this where you’re being held at gunpoint and you fucking dummy. You pull out the gun and tell her to put her gun down? no one deserves to die, but he didn’t help his case pulling that gun out. He probably would’ve lived if he never pulled the gun out.
Man, I feel bad for the guy, but his mistake was that he didn’t shoot her right away. He wasn’t prepared to use the gun and he should’ve never had one if that’s the case.
Lethal Fucking Injection after 10 miserable years in solitary. Only way justice could ever be served for taking the life of another.
Fuckkkkkkkk her.
Calling a 19-year-old adult a "teenager" is basically a technicality at best. She's an adult woman that willingly and mercilessly killed someone.
When told that he died, Hider (teenager) said: “I took his whole life away; now he can’t tell his story.” Why only 35 years, which will probably get dropped down to 30, for this premeditated murderer with no ability to show remorse.
1. If you pull a gun in someone you better be ready to use it. This dude pulled his gun and then tried to reason his way out of using it. 2. You are 4x more likely to die in an assault if you are armed. He likely would have survived if he didn't pull it out in the first place, or wasn't carrying at all. She fired because he threatened her. Conceal carry is cope. 3. The wrong person survived and the world is a bit worse because our gun laws cater to the copeaholics rather than any reason or logic whatsoever.
1. Yes he should have used it. 2. He died because he didn't cash the check he wrote by drawing. 3. There are a lot of great reasons for advocating gun control and safe gun ownership. This isn't it.
>you're actually better off unarmed when someone is kidnapping you at gunpoint Good luck out there.
Believing no. 2 without any nuance in its application is a 95 IQ tell
Reddit: “but calling someone a slur is worse”
That's cause reddit believes white lives don't matter. They literally want us dead.
Insane thing is in some states, he would’ve gone to prison if he had killed HER. Yanno the psycho f*ck that robbed him and killed him? I imagine in Alabama he would’ve been fine, however. But still going to spend a few days in jail because they need to figure out what happened. Not saying for or against, just commenting how crazy it is to be the victim and have to spend a couple days in jail while the police figure out exactly what happened.
I hope she never gets out!
[удалено]
It's called a plea deal
AllThatIsDepessing strikes again.
More fucking idiots with guns.
Shoot first. Now this absolute loser gets a free ride for the rest of her days.
[удалено]
[удалено]
Humans are gross
Proud grape. Won't get out until she's an old, shriveled raisin. Clownshow.
The take-away from this is if you draw a weapon, use it. He had a deadly threat situation, threatened with a weapon in return, and lost big time.
I want to know why she did not get life like her partner got?
Death sentence or life imprisonment without parole in the hole nothing less is acceptable
Nope. This is why you never stop and try to ‘help’ anyone. Idgaf how bad it looks. Call 911 report what you see and bounce TF out of that situation.
It’s very clear, never stop!
Never help anyone.
That’s not enough
Yeah if I get the drop on someone who had me a gun point I’m just mag dumping no questions asked.
When it comes to me and fam, We got bail money!!
Empathy is an opsec risk.
https://i.redd.it/58rjvuo9h35d1.gif
He should have have shot first
_Q at
Gee, I wonder why he hesitated to kill her. I can't even imagine why. Anyone have any ideas? I mean, he had to have hesitated for a reason but I just can't seem to figure it out. Why in the world would a guy like that hesitate to shoot a woman like her?
Shit like this doesn't deserve jail time just a bullet. There's no fixing that kind of mentality.
Never pull unless you plan to shoot. And if you pull, you don't hesitate. There's no way I'd be giving out warnings to someone who's already pulled on me.
Dudes need to take the cape and underoos off. White knighting literally got this fool killed.
Fdb
This is why I don’t help people in public. I’ll even go as far as to not help a drowning child. You think I’m gonna touch a minor? As a 34 year old man, you think I’m going TO PHYSICALLY TOUCH A CHILD??!? LOL! Yeah, no.