'As per the lease agreement...'
You followed the agreement. That's your responsibility done.
If the plumber billed the REA, that's between the two of them.
Your answer is, I acted in accordance with the lease agreement. This demand is invalid. Please do not present any future spurious claims.
I have asked REA to show me any correspondence they received from the plumber, if they didn’t thats between plumbers and them, also i have asked them to tell me where in lease agreement it says i am liable for the hot water repairs.
No, none of that. Don't argue with them. You're not trying to 'win', you're saying 'get stuffed', but politely.
"I followed the procedure as set out in the lease agreement."
That's all there is. You have no liability.
This.. simply say no and don't engage. You go back and ask for this or that you're just getting involved. It's a no and just leave it. He's got no leg to stand on.
No, don't argue, don't engage.
Plumber says rea approved, plumber knew you were not paying, plumber is interested in guarantee of payment from rea. Plumber got that permission and guarantee of payment.
Landlord is typical greedy brain-dead bastard with no chance at the tribunal.
Also, if you think you can demonstrate you're being evicted because of all this, that's a retaliatory eviction which is illegal and you can fight that at the tribunal as well.
Don't talk to the owners, talk to the real estate, that's who you have a contract with.
I mean this is for qld
https://qstars.org.au/tenancies/tenancy-databases/
Its possible, I'm not familiar with that aspect of NSW law. I would ask the nsw equivalent of residential tenancy authority.
Id post that specific question on shitrentals.
Haha fair, i have asked the REA what are my options and they said you can dispute it in Tribunal, i never been to Tribunal before and apparently there’s a fee involved and in person hearing, which is obviously not ideal and i would like to have it as a last option, since i am searching for new rental, i am afraid if going to tribunal will affect my rental history and somehow next REA will know that i have been to Tribunal and will hesitate to give me the lease!!
You aren't from Aus.
Call their bluff and go to the tribunal. Additionally go to the governing body of what ever state you are in.
Hot water is the owners responsibility, additionally I'd call the plumber and ask if he ask correspondence from the REA. When you go to tribunal make sure you ask for compensation for them stuffing you around.
See this comment but additionally take this further and demand compensation for them wasting your time.
https://www.reddit.com/r/AusPropertyChat/s/MztQFcewRG
Thanks for your comment, I am from Aus, been renting in sydney for almost 10 year.i am thinking of going to the Tribunal, but since i have never faced this situation before i am skeptical, will the future REA know i have been to the tribunal? And somehow will refuse the lease thinking i am troublesome tenant.
I went to tribunal over something trivial on a partners lease. Don't stress about going, they will explain things to you clearly and give you a chance to sort it out. Hot water is something that is classified as an emergency repair. And if they didn't fix it you are allowed to spend up to 4 weeks rent without authorisation to fix it. Check your rental agreement as this should be included in it. If the REA authorised it without talking to the owner, that's on them not you.
EDIT: It sounds like the REA authorised the plumber to fix it without talking to the owner, and now the REA are trying to claw back some money. Don't listen to the bullshit about calling the owner, that's literally the REAs job. Most places Ive rented I wouldn't be allowed to call the owner without talking to the REA first.
I'd say it's the owner being a ass hat making the REA do it to try and claw some money back. Remember the owner pays the REA and may force the REA to go to tribunal even if they think its wrong
actually its law. your not to contact them at all you contact the property manager who then liaise on your and the owners behalf.(if their is a property manager)
its what the owners pay the property manager to do, manage the property
technically the owners are not even supposed to drive past unless they have business at another residence in that street they cant do anything to interfere with your quite enjoyment of the premises.
The thing is going to Tribunal also involves and fee and in person hearings, which is a hassle itself as i will have to take days off from work and also to travel to a place where the tribunal is which will be not close to where i live or live in near future. I just wanna get the next lease sorted out before they put me on “rental blacklist” haha
I sent them a reply on their email that i am not going to pay this invoice, leta see if they ever reply to me or not, on call the REA said i have 30 days to pay !
They can't take action for you going to the tribunal, and you can do a video conference if you can't get there in person easily.
The alternative is to just tell the real estate agent No, and see how they deal with it. They will need to take you to the tribunal (not the other way round) if they want you to pay.
I've never heard of that being an issue.
Furthermore its very unlikely this will actually reach tribunal. It costs them money to fight in tribunal and they will/should know they have no chance of winning. So it's a bluff, call their bluff.
All you have to do is not pay.
Someone who has no right yo ask you for money has asked you for money.
If put in your bond return request asap (first day you legally can)with the body that holds it.
They can try to take you to a tribunal to make you pay, but if what you have said is all true, then they probably won't even go that far.
I am charging $1000 for this advice please pay cash (now ignore my request and don't pay me, I have no right to demand money either.) :)
with a pineapple
FURTHER to this... the owner can claim tax... probably on the whole fucken amount lol
you can't
like seriously? they think renters are this dumb???
Tribunal would be on your side.
No hot water for washing is a major fault and must be repaired, as place is not legally habitable / leasable without hot water.
You're in the right.
Check out tenancy laws for urgent repairs etc, leaks or interruption to major service you can call the plumber directly but you *still* involved the rea. You did it all. Take it to tribunal and win.
It just shits me that they expect a tenant to pay extra for things that are the owner's responsibility. WTF!!!
And the amount of times that a tenant has bitched to me about a problem that the REA hasn't told me about. Sometimes it's a year or more older.
Tenants aren't perfect, (I've had some doozers) but geez!!!
as a landlord myself, I agree with the other landlord. you shouldn't have to pay this.
But at the same time, the main issue here might be with the REA instead of the landlord. If the plumber has called the REA and informed them of the damage and the costs to fix, the REA should have contacted the landlord first to get approval.
If the landlord didn't know about any damage and repairs that needed to be done and then they suddenly get an invoice they have to pay, they would be pissed.
On the landlord side I've had a similar situation happen. Tenant contacted REA saying there is damage. REA contacted tradie and got a quote for $150 which they passed on to me. I approved the spending of $150 to fix damage. Invoice comes and it's $350, I questioned the REA and they said the tradie told them the damage was more extensive than it initially appeared so they had to buy extra parts etc. I'm ok with the increased cost of repair, but not ok with the surprise invoice at more than double the initial amount I approved.
That's a good agent. Mine has been up and down because although it's rhe same company the specific person assigned to my property changes every so often. Some are great while others are lax
Tenant goes to REA. Contact with landlord is REAs responsibility. End of story. Tenant should not have to pay for repairs or replacement of property unless they have damaged it
Landlord also. Just say no. Not your responsibility. Also would consider letting the REA know you will be leaving honest negative reviews all over the place as this is not on.
>As a landlord, do not pay. Owner's responsibility, not yours.
\+1
100% it's the owners responsibility.
The only thing I would dispute if you did replace it was trying to contact the LL. In my case I have a plumber friend who would do it prorata. But IMO you did the right thing by contacting the appropriate number they gave.
Let them take it to a tribunal. Pretty damn sure you will win as hot water is one essential that if it stops you should be able to call out a plumber at any time (afterhours/weekends) etc to get it fixed.
I am not sure if they did. This was the plumber’s response “I will run this past the property manager at Ray White on your behalf” i have screenshots of sms conversation
if you have screenshots of your comms with the plumber, then the issues is between the plumber, the REA and the landlord. You should be completely free to go about your own business.
100% mention your ready to take the matter to the tribunal.
Either way sounds like you've kept to the terms outlined in the tenancy agreement & you'll come out on top of the findings.
Sounds like just another greedy owner trying their luck & the REA has no balls to tell them their responsible for necessary repairs ( Hot water is one of them ) after they've had tenants paying their mortgage for........ how long & they don't want any out of pocket, greedy cheap krunts.
Hot water is an emergency repair, tenants can organise that themselves and bill the owner. However, in addition to this, you've said that the plumber got approval from the real estate.
Unless they have a reason to say the hot water broke because of your misuse. This is not your problem, and the real estate should know that. Tell them to take a hike.
You don't need to know more about the plumber, rea, owner correspondence - that's between them. You started the "process" according to instructions you have in writing to call the rea designated plumber. That was the end of your role, responsiblity. If someone sends you an invoice for this / has effectively done so keep a record of that. Say no, not paying you were not the party that authorised the work or was invoiced by the plumber (quite aside from you clearly not being responsible as a tenant). don't say or ask anything else. You don't need to go to tribunal unless the rea and landlord insanely instigate something. If they do they will lose and it will cost them more money.
Get your bond claim in on end of lease asap etc... You are not liable. Do not "engage". You only need "evidence" of what you did (above) not to investigate what idiocy os going on between rea and owner etc.
Nope. Don't pay anything. Your rent covers it. I own 4 houses and have been renting out for over 20 years. Every now and then, you will come across scum owners and their partners in deceit, the shady REA. You have found some.
Do not pay that invoice. You didn’t direct the plumber to replace it and it’s the REA’s job to get landlord approval, not yours. Respond back advising exactly that, to the REA, and when you move out lodge for your bond to be returned in full asap. That way if the REA wants to try and deduct some they will have to contest it with the tenancy board and not you.
Absolutely do not pay for any part of this bill. Take it to tribunal if you need to. Don't give-in to any sort of bullying or intimidation and good for you for getting yourself informed.
Make sure you claim your bond as soon as you finish your lease
Dreamin'It is ridiculous. You won't lose. It's very silly, since it needed to be fixed anyway, what can the harm be the landlord, who has to pay?
As to not calling the owner, what utter rubbish. The landlord appointed the REA as his agent, that's what the A stands for, and that is a formal legal position of delegation (there is an entire body of law about agents in contracts). "Agent" is not a courtesy title, it is a position in law (the owner is the principal) \[[https://sprintlaw.com.au/articles/agency-relationships-and-agreements/](https://sprintlaw.com.au/articles/agency-relationships-and-agreements/)\] , [https://s3.studentvip.com.au/notes/20642-sample.pdf](https://s3.studentvip.com.au/notes/20642-sample.pdf)
You don't need to talk to the owner if there is an agent appointed by the owner, that's what the agent is for.That's also why the plumber sought approval from the agent, not the owner
Also - on a holiday, when the REA is closed, and a critical failure (like hot water) occurs, you’re actually fine calling a plumber directly. That’s why the REA gave you their number!
The REA is responsible for following up with the owner after the plumber called them; presumably they didn’t and are trying to cover that up!
Did the plumber get approval from the REA or owner if they said they were going to and were the ‘approved’ plumber?
Technically you should have gone to the REA rather than the plumber. It’s THEIR job to get approval, not yours.
I called the plumber today, they said they got approval from the senior property Manager, they gave me a name, i said can you send me this in writing, to which they refused, but told me not to pay anything as its the owner trying to squeeze money out of me, they said id owner thought its my responsibility they would have tried to get the whole amount, but they are asking for half says they know its not tenants responsibility, plumber said its not even REA probably its the owner and legally REA are bound to convey the owner’s msg to me. I dont wanna escalate this situation at all as i have been a good tenant, never been late on rent and never ever been refused bond or damaged any property i have been in. If owner wants to escalate this i will take them to tribunal and as other comment said will ask for compensation too for the situation and stress they have put me in !!
talk to the tenancies authority.
it was a emergency repair you contacted the nominated tradesman. the tradesman got authorisation from the property manager before the repairs were done.
tenants can call in a tradesman for emergency repairs your supposed to pay the call out fee and get reimbursed. as he didnt fix anything then and just did a inspection and quote if anything you should only have to pay for the callout fee.
i dont believe the owner has a leg to stand on. but did you send a maintnance request in writing to the property manager on the proper form? if you had they cant do a thing.
The plumber didn’t not even come to check, they asked me to send some photos and then after thay said yup it needs replacing and came out and replaced the thing. After saying to me on sms that dont worry about talking to Agency as it’s holidays and they are closed, “i will talk to Ray White on your behalf” was their reply to me. So they did not even come for an inspection to which i would have paid a call out fee.
Yup i will lodge bond return, but i have been given 90days to end the lease, i am looking at next properties but its gonna take time before i actually move out, can they start claim on my bond as soon as they have given me notice to vacate ?
This doesn't sound right. What state are you in? Standard residential lease agreement in Queensland includes preferred emergency/out of hours repairers.
I am in Queensland :). The Queensland general tenancy agreement also has a section a little bit after which details the process the tenant needs to take before calling said repairers (section 33).
It sounds like the OP has a non-standard lease so it's all moot, but it was worth asking the question.
It was not infact an emergency call, i sent them an sms that come and have a look whenever its easy for you since it was Christmas eve, the plumber said to send them some pictures of the geyser, they later said the geyser is at end of its life without actually seeing it in person, said they will sought approval from REA themselves, later messaged me saying they are coming to change it. And in lease agreement it actually says that emergency or not i should call the plumber directly for any plumbing issues especially if it’s after hours.
All good, I just figured it was worth mentioning as it sounded like an odd agreement. I would suggest you politely ask the REA to read the lease agreement as chances are they haven't read it.
Do you have it in email or SMS that they got the approval of the RE to change it?
Or an email or SMS from you saying that you don't have authority to authorize the work, or authorize payment, and that they must get the approval from the RE?
Yeah i have sms by the plumber saying “will run this past the property manager at Ray White on your behalf” i also have the sms where i said to them just come and have a look whenever its easy for you since its Christmas ever and i dont wanna ruin your holiday, for now i have turned off the geyser and stopped using hot water and i can live without it for few days until after Christmas. They just saw pictures i sent them and said yeah it needs replacing and we will come another day to replace it, they did, it was back in December. Now since owner terminating my lease and REA just told me that they didn’t actually see the invoice from the plumber before last week.
Ok then, you are good.
When you apply to get your full bond back, be short, simple and sweet. Just dates, times, facts, and direct quotes from your lease and communications.
emergency repairs can be arranged directly by the tenant.
hotwater, gas and electrical are considered emergency repairs any time. a property must have working electrical, hotwater and plumbing.
that said a home that has an ensuite and a main bathroom if one has issues then it not urgent cuase you can use the other. unless water wont shut off.
I do not know the laws around this but sounds like you did everything by the book. And if the REA gave permission then they either got it from owner or they made a judgement call. Either way does not sound like your problem.
My guess is its their regular plumber and they acted without permission from the REA, now that the owner’s angry saying tenant i.e me should have called the owner directly, which is obviously not true since the lease agreement REA is responsible for talks between me and the owner. REA just may be putting it on me just because owner don’t wanna pay
yeah you should never have to deal with the owner direct. That is what the property manager is for. Push back on the REA and remind them its not your issue
So did the plumber call the REA and get their approval before attending?
I’d inform the REA that you simply called a tradesperson. There is no charge incurred for that. When the tradesperson turned up on site they advised they had spoken to REA and then replaced it. Say the plumbers number is on the lease agreement and it was during Christmas holidays.
Inform them you will happily attend tribunal. Call their bluff. Get chatgbt to write the email for you and also seek advice from your states tenancy authority to insert into the email.
I’ve got 15 years in the industry, but not in nsw, but I’m happy to help answer any basic questions.
Sounds like the plumber didn’t do his part right in getting approval from the REA. That’s not your problem as it’s the REA’s approved vendor.
I can totally understand why the owner is pissed but his argument is with the REA and their contractor. Don’t pay a cent as it’s not your responsibility
What your lease says goes. Owner can’t override the lease. If you followed the lease then you are fine. Usually if the owner has a real estate agent handling the property then you wouldn’t be able to contact the owner directly anyway, The owner sounds like they are just trying to get out of something that is their responsibility regardless of whether they were contacted directly by you or not.
The fact is that REA seems a nice person, i told them that they should ne telling the owner that its not my responsibility and Instead of saying all these things on a call send me an email like they sent me an invoice telling me why i have to pay and all, but they didn’t said all the things in email and just sent me the invoice sayin “according to you tenancy agreement, please find the attached invoice to pay” which itself id dodgy way of asking something to pay. I sent them a reply asking for where in tenancy agreement it says that i am liable to pay for hot water repairs and all, they have not got back to me with a reply yet.
Sorry I’m confused. As the hot water needed to be fixed either with or without the owners approval, what is their argument exactly? Like they would literally be telling the tribunal, “I have to pay $x but I didn’t approve it, however if I approved it I would be paying $x anyway, so I believe I’m entitled to compensation from the tenant”.
Am I getting this right?
Yup that’s exactly what i get from this, basically the REA said the owner says tenant should have called me in emergency during Christmas holidays and not the plumber directly which was mentioned in the lease agreement that any emergency plumbing issue call this number, i called that number and now owner saying I should have called them first which is incorrect as I should never have to talk to the owner that’s what REA should do !!
REA is either ignorant of their responsibilities or is try to pressure you because they see it as an easier option that educating a shitty landlord who's probably being hostile.
'As per the lease agreement...' You followed the agreement. That's your responsibility done. If the plumber billed the REA, that's between the two of them. Your answer is, I acted in accordance with the lease agreement. This demand is invalid. Please do not present any future spurious claims.
I have asked REA to show me any correspondence they received from the plumber, if they didn’t thats between plumbers and them, also i have asked them to tell me where in lease agreement it says i am liable for the hot water repairs.
No, none of that. Don't argue with them. You're not trying to 'win', you're saying 'get stuffed', but politely. "I followed the procedure as set out in the lease agreement." That's all there is. You have no liability.
This.. simply say no and don't engage. You go back and ask for this or that you're just getting involved. It's a no and just leave it. He's got no leg to stand on.
Exactly this. Don't involve yourself anymore than you have to. It's got fuck all to do with you.
No, don't argue, don't engage. Plumber says rea approved, plumber knew you were not paying, plumber is interested in guarantee of payment from rea. Plumber got that permission and guarantee of payment. Landlord is typical greedy brain-dead bastard with no chance at the tribunal. Also, if you think you can demonstrate you're being evicted because of all this, that's a retaliatory eviction which is illegal and you can fight that at the tribunal as well. Don't talk to the owners, talk to the real estate, that's who you have a contract with.
I mean this is for qld https://qstars.org.au/tenancies/tenancy-databases/ Its possible, I'm not familiar with that aspect of NSW law. I would ask the nsw equivalent of residential tenancy authority. Id post that specific question on shitrentals.
ask the plumber for the correspondence, they are more likely to be honest with you than the REA.
Ask the owner for a share in the house. Fairs fair.
Haha fair, i have asked the REA what are my options and they said you can dispute it in Tribunal, i never been to Tribunal before and apparently there’s a fee involved and in person hearing, which is obviously not ideal and i would like to have it as a last option, since i am searching for new rental, i am afraid if going to tribunal will affect my rental history and somehow next REA will know that i have been to Tribunal and will hesitate to give me the lease!!
You aren't from Aus. Call their bluff and go to the tribunal. Additionally go to the governing body of what ever state you are in. Hot water is the owners responsibility, additionally I'd call the plumber and ask if he ask correspondence from the REA. When you go to tribunal make sure you ask for compensation for them stuffing you around. See this comment but additionally take this further and demand compensation for them wasting your time. https://www.reddit.com/r/AusPropertyChat/s/MztQFcewRG
Thanks for your comment, I am from Aus, been renting in sydney for almost 10 year.i am thinking of going to the Tribunal, but since i have never faced this situation before i am skeptical, will the future REA know i have been to the tribunal? And somehow will refuse the lease thinking i am troublesome tenant.
Go to tribunal, I just went through a similar issue. They will not proceed to it. It's all a bluff to get money from a bond.
I went to tribunal over something trivial on a partners lease. Don't stress about going, they will explain things to you clearly and give you a chance to sort it out. Hot water is something that is classified as an emergency repair. And if they didn't fix it you are allowed to spend up to 4 weeks rent without authorisation to fix it. Check your rental agreement as this should be included in it. If the REA authorised it without talking to the owner, that's on them not you. EDIT: It sounds like the REA authorised the plumber to fix it without talking to the owner, and now the REA are trying to claw back some money. Don't listen to the bullshit about calling the owner, that's literally the REAs job. Most places Ive rented I wouldn't be allowed to call the owner without talking to the REA first.
I'd say it's the owner being a ass hat making the REA do it to try and claw some money back. Remember the owner pays the REA and may force the REA to go to tribunal even if they think its wrong
actually its law. your not to contact them at all you contact the property manager who then liaise on your and the owners behalf.(if their is a property manager) its what the owners pay the property manager to do, manage the property technically the owners are not even supposed to drive past unless they have business at another residence in that street they cant do anything to interfere with your quite enjoyment of the premises.
The thing is going to Tribunal also involves and fee and in person hearings, which is a hassle itself as i will have to take days off from work and also to travel to a place where the tribunal is which will be not close to where i live or live in near future. I just wanna get the next lease sorted out before they put me on “rental blacklist” haha
The REA is bluffing - they never intend to go to tribunal. Tell them you refuse to pay and it will go away.
I sent them a reply on their email that i am not going to pay this invoice, leta see if they ever reply to me or not, on call the REA said i have 30 days to pay !
Don’t give in! They’ll give up before going to Tribunal, at least that’s what usually happens that I’ve heard
They can't take action for you going to the tribunal, and you can do a video conference if you can't get there in person easily. The alternative is to just tell the real estate agent No, and see how they deal with it. They will need to take you to the tribunal (not the other way round) if they want you to pay.
I've never heard of that being an issue. Furthermore its very unlikely this will actually reach tribunal. It costs them money to fight in tribunal and they will/should know they have no chance of winning. So it's a bluff, call their bluff.
I don't think this is the case. I mean its a possibility that REAs search NCAT hearings as they are listed publicly but I doubt it.
not supposed to count against you as you are the complainant not the property manager or owner.
Look up your little red book if you're in Victoria
its a landlord maintenance issue.
All you have to do is not pay. Someone who has no right yo ask you for money has asked you for money. If put in your bond return request asap (first day you legally can)with the body that holds it. They can try to take you to a tribunal to make you pay, but if what you have said is all true, then they probably won't even go that far. I am charging $1000 for this advice please pay cash (now ignore my request and don't pay me, I have no right to demand money either.) :)
Tell em to get fucked
with a pineapple FURTHER to this... the owner can claim tax... probably on the whole fucken amount lol you can't like seriously? they think renters are this dumb???
Tribunal would be on your side. No hot water for washing is a major fault and must be repaired, as place is not legally habitable / leasable without hot water. You're in the right. Check out tenancy laws for urgent repairs etc, leaks or interruption to major service you can call the plumber directly but you *still* involved the rea. You did it all. Take it to tribunal and win.
As a landlord, do not pay. Owner's responsibility, not yours.
Thank you so much for answering this from your “landlord” perspective 🫶🏽
It just shits me that they expect a tenant to pay extra for things that are the owner's responsibility. WTF!!! And the amount of times that a tenant has bitched to me about a problem that the REA hasn't told me about. Sometimes it's a year or more older. Tenants aren't perfect, (I've had some doozers) but geez!!!
some property managers just arent worth thier fees.
Yeah its sad 😞
as a landlord myself, I agree with the other landlord. you shouldn't have to pay this. But at the same time, the main issue here might be with the REA instead of the landlord. If the plumber has called the REA and informed them of the damage and the costs to fix, the REA should have contacted the landlord first to get approval. If the landlord didn't know about any damage and repairs that needed to be done and then they suddenly get an invoice they have to pay, they would be pissed. On the landlord side I've had a similar situation happen. Tenant contacted REA saying there is damage. REA contacted tradie and got a quote for $150 which they passed on to me. I approved the spending of $150 to fix damage. Invoice comes and it's $350, I questioned the REA and they said the tradie told them the damage was more extensive than it initially appeared so they had to buy extra parts etc. I'm ok with the increased cost of repair, but not ok with the surprise invoice at more than double the initial amount I approved.
My letting agent calls me about everything that the tenant asks them about. Even if the cost is $30.
That's a good agent. Mine has been up and down because although it's rhe same company the specific person assigned to my property changes every so often. Some are great while others are lax
Tenant goes to REA. Contact with landlord is REAs responsibility. End of story. Tenant should not have to pay for repairs or replacement of property unless they have damaged it
Landlord also. Just say no. Not your responsibility. Also would consider letting the REA know you will be leaving honest negative reviews all over the place as this is not on.
>As a landlord, do not pay. Owner's responsibility, not yours. \+1 100% it's the owners responsibility. The only thing I would dispute if you did replace it was trying to contact the LL. In my case I have a plumber friend who would do it prorata. But IMO you did the right thing by contacting the appropriate number they gave. Let them take it to a tribunal. Pretty damn sure you will win as hot water is one essential that if it stops you should be able to call out a plumber at any time (afterhours/weekends) etc to get it fixed.
The plumber sought approval from the REA before completing works? If the owner has any gripes for the work going ahead it's with the REA and not you.
I am not sure if they did. This was the plumber’s response “I will run this past the property manager at Ray White on your behalf” i have screenshots of sms conversation
You have no reason to think otherwise and its not your job to check
if you have screenshots of your comms with the plumber, then the issues is between the plumber, the REA and the landlord. You should be completely free to go about your own business.
This. All the LL can do is take it to whatever tribunal (QCAT or REIQ or something) They aren't going to side with the LL on this one.
If they want you to pay half, inform them you will be taking half the hot water system with you when you leave
Half the house*
100% mention your ready to take the matter to the tribunal. Either way sounds like you've kept to the terms outlined in the tenancy agreement & you'll come out on top of the findings. Sounds like just another greedy owner trying their luck & the REA has no balls to tell them their responsible for necessary repairs ( Hot water is one of them ) after they've had tenants paying their mortgage for........ how long & they don't want any out of pocket, greedy cheap krunts.
Hot water is an emergency repair, tenants can organise that themselves and bill the owner. However, in addition to this, you've said that the plumber got approval from the real estate. Unless they have a reason to say the hot water broke because of your misuse. This is not your problem, and the real estate should know that. Tell them to take a hike.
You don't need to know more about the plumber, rea, owner correspondence - that's between them. You started the "process" according to instructions you have in writing to call the rea designated plumber. That was the end of your role, responsiblity. If someone sends you an invoice for this / has effectively done so keep a record of that. Say no, not paying you were not the party that authorised the work or was invoiced by the plumber (quite aside from you clearly not being responsible as a tenant). don't say or ask anything else. You don't need to go to tribunal unless the rea and landlord insanely instigate something. If they do they will lose and it will cost them more money. Get your bond claim in on end of lease asap etc... You are not liable. Do not "engage". You only need "evidence" of what you did (above) not to investigate what idiocy os going on between rea and owner etc.
Nope. Don't pay anything. Your rent covers it. I own 4 houses and have been renting out for over 20 years. Every now and then, you will come across scum owners and their partners in deceit, the shady REA. You have found some.
"If I am paying for the hot water system, I am taking it with me when I am evicted."
Whether you called the agent or not they’d still have to pay for it to be replaced. Don’t pay
That's the landlords bill, you pay rent
Do not pay that invoice. You didn’t direct the plumber to replace it and it’s the REA’s job to get landlord approval, not yours. Respond back advising exactly that, to the REA, and when you move out lodge for your bond to be returned in full asap. That way if the REA wants to try and deduct some they will have to contest it with the tenancy board and not you.
Absolutely do not pay for any part of this bill. Take it to tribunal if you need to. Don't give-in to any sort of bullying or intimidation and good for you for getting yourself informed. Make sure you claim your bond as soon as you finish your lease
OP, please post an update when you have an outcome, really want to know how this dodgy landlord and RE deal with a kick in the teeth they deserve.
Whatever you do, DON’T PAY and, on top of that, tell him to go fuck himself !!!
Dreamin'It is ridiculous. You won't lose. It's very silly, since it needed to be fixed anyway, what can the harm be the landlord, who has to pay? As to not calling the owner, what utter rubbish. The landlord appointed the REA as his agent, that's what the A stands for, and that is a formal legal position of delegation (there is an entire body of law about agents in contracts). "Agent" is not a courtesy title, it is a position in law (the owner is the principal) \[[https://sprintlaw.com.au/articles/agency-relationships-and-agreements/](https://sprintlaw.com.au/articles/agency-relationships-and-agreements/)\] , [https://s3.studentvip.com.au/notes/20642-sample.pdf](https://s3.studentvip.com.au/notes/20642-sample.pdf) You don't need to talk to the owner if there is an agent appointed by the owner, that's what the agent is for.That's also why the plumber sought approval from the agent, not the owner
I think you only need two words. The first is get and the second one is considered unpleasant by some.
not how that works, the owner is fully liable to do any repairs to his property, typical landlord being a scumbag
Tell them to get fucked
Tell the rea to stick it where the sun don't shine.
Also - on a holiday, when the REA is closed, and a critical failure (like hot water) occurs, you’re actually fine calling a plumber directly. That’s why the REA gave you their number! The REA is responsible for following up with the owner after the plumber called them; presumably they didn’t and are trying to cover that up!
Did the plumber get approval from the REA or owner if they said they were going to and were the ‘approved’ plumber? Technically you should have gone to the REA rather than the plumber. It’s THEIR job to get approval, not yours.
I called the plumber today, they said they got approval from the senior property Manager, they gave me a name, i said can you send me this in writing, to which they refused, but told me not to pay anything as its the owner trying to squeeze money out of me, they said id owner thought its my responsibility they would have tried to get the whole amount, but they are asking for half says they know its not tenants responsibility, plumber said its not even REA probably its the owner and legally REA are bound to convey the owner’s msg to me. I dont wanna escalate this situation at all as i have been a good tenant, never been late on rent and never ever been refused bond or damaged any property i have been in. If owner wants to escalate this i will take them to tribunal and as other comment said will ask for compensation too for the situation and stress they have put me in !!
You have zero responsibility ignore the invoice
talk to the tenancies authority. it was a emergency repair you contacted the nominated tradesman. the tradesman got authorisation from the property manager before the repairs were done. tenants can call in a tradesman for emergency repairs your supposed to pay the call out fee and get reimbursed. as he didnt fix anything then and just did a inspection and quote if anything you should only have to pay for the callout fee. i dont believe the owner has a leg to stand on. but did you send a maintnance request in writing to the property manager on the proper form? if you had they cant do a thing.
The plumber didn’t not even come to check, they asked me to send some photos and then after thay said yup it needs replacing and came out and replaced the thing. After saying to me on sms that dont worry about talking to Agency as it’s holidays and they are closed, “i will talk to Ray White on your behalf” was their reply to me. So they did not even come for an inspection to which i would have paid a call out fee.
still its their bill to pay not yours. its your bill not mine go away! and lodge your bond return with the tenancies authority asap.
Yup i will lodge bond return, but i have been given 90days to end the lease, i am looking at next properties but its gonna take time before i actually move out, can they start claim on my bond as soon as they have given me notice to vacate ?
they could try. they probably wont. but lodge yours first. then they have to prove any claim, not you.
[удалено]
This doesn't sound right. What state are you in? Standard residential lease agreement in Queensland includes preferred emergency/out of hours repairers.
I am in Queensland :). The Queensland general tenancy agreement also has a section a little bit after which details the process the tenant needs to take before calling said repairers (section 33). It sounds like the OP has a non-standard lease so it's all moot, but it was worth asking the question.
It was not infact an emergency call, i sent them an sms that come and have a look whenever its easy for you since it was Christmas eve, the plumber said to send them some pictures of the geyser, they later said the geyser is at end of its life without actually seeing it in person, said they will sought approval from REA themselves, later messaged me saying they are coming to change it. And in lease agreement it actually says that emergency or not i should call the plumber directly for any plumbing issues especially if it’s after hours.
All good, I just figured it was worth mentioning as it sounded like an odd agreement. I would suggest you politely ask the REA to read the lease agreement as chances are they haven't read it.
Do you have it in email or SMS that they got the approval of the RE to change it? Or an email or SMS from you saying that you don't have authority to authorize the work, or authorize payment, and that they must get the approval from the RE?
Yeah i have sms by the plumber saying “will run this past the property manager at Ray White on your behalf” i also have the sms where i said to them just come and have a look whenever its easy for you since its Christmas ever and i dont wanna ruin your holiday, for now i have turned off the geyser and stopped using hot water and i can live without it for few days until after Christmas. They just saw pictures i sent them and said yeah it needs replacing and we will come another day to replace it, they did, it was back in December. Now since owner terminating my lease and REA just told me that they didn’t actually see the invoice from the plumber before last week.
Ok then, you are good. When you apply to get your full bond back, be short, simple and sweet. Just dates, times, facts, and direct quotes from your lease and communications.
emergency repairs can be arranged directly by the tenant. hotwater, gas and electrical are considered emergency repairs any time. a property must have working electrical, hotwater and plumbing. that said a home that has an ensuite and a main bathroom if one has issues then it not urgent cuase you can use the other. unless water wont shut off.
I think you missed my point.
I do not know the laws around this but sounds like you did everything by the book. And if the REA gave permission then they either got it from owner or they made a judgement call. Either way does not sound like your problem.
My guess is its their regular plumber and they acted without permission from the REA, now that the owner’s angry saying tenant i.e me should have called the owner directly, which is obviously not true since the lease agreement REA is responsible for talks between me and the owner. REA just may be putting it on me just because owner don’t wanna pay
yeah you should never have to deal with the owner direct. That is what the property manager is for. Push back on the REA and remind them its not your issue
So did the plumber call the REA and get their approval before attending? I’d inform the REA that you simply called a tradesperson. There is no charge incurred for that. When the tradesperson turned up on site they advised they had spoken to REA and then replaced it. Say the plumbers number is on the lease agreement and it was during Christmas holidays. Inform them you will happily attend tribunal. Call their bluff. Get chatgbt to write the email for you and also seek advice from your states tenancy authority to insert into the email. I’ve got 15 years in the industry, but not in nsw, but I’m happy to help answer any basic questions.
They can get fucked, they gave you a number of a plumber to call, you called them, everything else is between themselves.
Sounds like the plumber didn’t do his part right in getting approval from the REA. That’s not your problem as it’s the REA’s approved vendor. I can totally understand why the owner is pissed but his argument is with the REA and their contractor. Don’t pay a cent as it’s not your responsibility
What your lease says goes. Owner can’t override the lease. If you followed the lease then you are fine. Usually if the owner has a real estate agent handling the property then you wouldn’t be able to contact the owner directly anyway, The owner sounds like they are just trying to get out of something that is their responsibility regardless of whether they were contacted directly by you or not.
The cheek of the dirty cunts to even ask.
Tell them to go get fucked
The fact is that REA seems a nice person, i told them that they should ne telling the owner that its not my responsibility and Instead of saying all these things on a call send me an email like they sent me an invoice telling me why i have to pay and all, but they didn’t said all the things in email and just sent me the invoice sayin “according to you tenancy agreement, please find the attached invoice to pay” which itself id dodgy way of asking something to pay. I sent them a reply asking for where in tenancy agreement it says that i am liable to pay for hot water repairs and all, they have not got back to me with a reply yet.
REA made a mistake in not getting authorisation from the owner and asking you to cover their dropping the ball.
Google search fixes this
When you leave take the hot water service with you.
Sorry I’m confused. As the hot water needed to be fixed either with or without the owners approval, what is their argument exactly? Like they would literally be telling the tribunal, “I have to pay $x but I didn’t approve it, however if I approved it I would be paying $x anyway, so I believe I’m entitled to compensation from the tenant”. Am I getting this right?
Yup that’s exactly what i get from this, basically the REA said the owner says tenant should have called me in emergency during Christmas holidays and not the plumber directly which was mentioned in the lease agreement that any emergency plumbing issue call this number, i called that number and now owner saying I should have called them first which is incorrect as I should never have to talk to the owner that’s what REA should do !!
Take the hot water system with you. After all most landlords wants the property returned to the state it was when you moved in.
REA is either ignorant of their responsibilities or is try to pressure you because they see it as an easier option that educating a shitty landlord who's probably being hostile.