nice insight, I am away from the whole cryptosphere, but yea from a 3rd man looking back in seems like it's hard to earn crypto, yet the prices aren't reflecting the cost. The price hasn't gone way up as predicted like they are expecting another recession, but interest rates are up meaning there's no recession at all. I mean feels like another price suppression where prices are kept low for a reason when BTC should be near 100K. Considering food and energy prices haven't gone done since covid, u would think crypto would be up as well.
I was gonna restart my crypto business but if prices don't stay above 50K or go up go 70-80K i don't think I can make a profit.
Meanwhile they are using million dollar excavating machines and GigaWatt of electricity for factories to mine and refine 2% dirt with copper and still make a profit, meanwhile they can't make capitalism to work to earn a penny in crypto, that's just bogus.
Small-scale miners should not have to give up due to decreasing profitability. FoxPool.io was launched to represent the interests of these miners. Mine with FoxPool and significantly improve your profitability through dual mining.
Small miners can still make profit Mining. Doesnt matter if you have 10 ehs or 200TH. You get reward by the pool. So you would need to join the best paying pool per TH. Most off the Pools takes 6% Profit! They claim they take 0.5 to 1.5% but if you compare it with system they take way more than that!
Not true. Many home miners, like me, are having to turn off older machines because the mining reward no longer covers the cost of the electricity they consume.
The new miners are so expensive that over their lifetime you are not likely to recover the cost (it Bitcoin) that you paid for them.
For me, I think this is going to be the last cycle I can participate in, and I have already scaled back. If I wanted to stay in I would have to upgrade my home to 3 phase power.
I made back my s19xp purchase/electricity/install cost in 1 year.... I missed opportunity cost of course in just buying at the time, however, have definitely ROI'd my investment... Not selling only stacking. Literally as of today I'm ROI'd. Everything over the remainder of the life of the miner is profit despite electricity costs.
No way. There are very few places in the world where you can break even on electricity alone, not to mention cost of equipment and any other infrastructure that your operation might need. You either have to be a home miner with super cheap electricity or on a massive scale
The Bitcoin community is failing miners. The overwhelming majority of the community look at it as a ticker symbol on the stock market and ignore the underlying mechanics and work that requires payment, and as such they maintain to never spend it and only buy to park.
Bitcoin *needs* to drop lightning and increase block size so we don't have to worry about this demand for constant doubling in price action to maintain current level of profitability every 4 years. Bitcoin by 2028 will need to be worth 140k(by 2032 280k, and so on) to maintain earning 31m a day in reward subsidy until the subsidy is gone. Fees in comparison generate 2.1m a day. Bitcoin needs more fees and more transactions on chain for it to make sense to continue working as a project. My best sentiment right now is just profit off it while you can.
I'm a small miner.
I run a lightning node.
All my mined Bitcoin sits in cold storage.
I DCA buy SATs with every paycheck.
I advocate for never increasing the block size.
I advocate for more holders holding long term their kyc SATs via lightning channels.
I advocate for MORE small home miners, not fewer.
Kyc-free sats are awesome to have.
As a user/spender of Bitcoin (my kyc SATs get spent and replaced every opportunity I have to support a circular local economy) I love low fees (anti-spam).
As a miner, I love high fees (bring on the spam).
Everything in your comment is objectively false regardless of my perspective 😁 respectfully of course!
Everything you wrote is subjective, where I gave real numbers with date points that can be tracked with the halving schedule, a little math, and information that can be gathered from looking at current blocks, yet you claim everything I wrote is objectively false. Show me where.
Or ya know, just don't say dumb stuff confidently, respectively of course.
Expanding block size will KILL small miners and the network as a whole. You already failed with btrash and bsuckv... Bitcoin is Bitcoin. I'm not necessarily an "ossify now" camp, however, protocol level changes like block sizes or block times CANNOT be manipulated or modified in anyway without having an absolute destructive result.
This community with its park and wait strategy will starve out miners from the expected fee growth (which comes in hand with transaction growth) as miners become more reliant on because the price action cannot sustain doubling every 4 years to offset the subsidy loss, as shown by the math above.
Also, way to completely move on from your initial claim, do the math man, show me where I'm wrong.
I want Bitcoin to succeed, but the BTC community is hellbent on watching it burn for some reason, so I will just profit from it and all the other forks I can until I no longer can.
This isn't an argument. And if the response to "Bitcoin will fail because of these reasons" is "they have this, it's called Bitcoin Cash", then does anyone in the community truly care about BTC? Sounds like they don't. So profit on it while you can, as I said.
Lmao, okay. When the miners are leaving because Bitcoin is no longer profitable because it can't hit certain price actions to maintain current profit levels due to the halvings, nor can it really sustain any stable price (this is only more prone due to ETF investors, they don't care about Bitcoin like you, they like their currency), and transaction fees aren't keeping pace to offset the loss be sure to tell them "the market chose this!"
See how this isn't an argument?
Bitcoin historically has earned the miners more, and more Bitcoin was being issued. The future is not like the past because of this reason. Unless Bitcoin is able to 2x every 4 years, until the subsidy is gone their highest profitable days will be long behind them, so many (think riot, etc) will go under, and with them goes their hash power and with that creates blood in the water and prices will tumble as investors bail and longterm holders get their fiat transferred out and they're left with a digital bag hoping it recovers. Bitcoin needs more transactions on chain or doubling price action and sustained price because mining is a daily, 10 minute game. As price dips they actively lose money in real time.
Bitcoin will surely still exist, but the profitability will never be what it was ever again and the price action won't recover because the project failed to be a usable sustainable currency.
Guys i have question.. I live in Croatia (EU). I am new to whole mining thing but i have some extra money and opportunity to build a small electric plant in Bosnia and Hercegovina-150 kw installed power, which can effectively power 5 of new best bitmain devices for bitcoin that are comming out in October..this would (when taking into account that electricity cost would be zero and if we put that average dificulty in next 3 years would be double of this right now), give me 1 bitcoin in next three years. Initial investment would be:
1.power plant equipement- 50 000 euro
2.power plant installation - 20 000 euro
3.small underground place for devices - 7 000 euro
4.land cost - 20 000 euro
5.bitmain s21 xp hydro *5 - 62 500 euro
6.adittional costs - 10 000 euro
Whole investment would be around 170 000 euro.
If my calculations are right and average difficulty of mining in next three years would be 2x right now i would have one bitcoin in 36 months..
Do you think this investment is valid long term? I mean 10 plus years, how hard would it be to maintain it? Would i need to be there non stop or i could hire some local to take care if anything goes wrong?
I am new to this whole mining thing, but i am very interested in it.. I know that i could just invest 170 000 while bearmarket and sold it on bull run, but I like the idea that i have my own bitcoin production and i can watch it grow every day. Please tell me if this is a good idea, and what are possible downsights..
nice insight, I am away from the whole cryptosphere, but yea from a 3rd man looking back in seems like it's hard to earn crypto, yet the prices aren't reflecting the cost. The price hasn't gone way up as predicted like they are expecting another recession, but interest rates are up meaning there's no recession at all. I mean feels like another price suppression where prices are kept low for a reason when BTC should be near 100K. Considering food and energy prices haven't gone done since covid, u would think crypto would be up as well. I was gonna restart my crypto business but if prices don't stay above 50K or go up go 70-80K i don't think I can make a profit. Meanwhile they are using million dollar excavating machines and GigaWatt of electricity for factories to mine and refine 2% dirt with copper and still make a profit, meanwhile they can't make capitalism to work to earn a penny in crypto, that's just bogus.
Small-scale miners should not have to give up due to decreasing profitability. FoxPool.io was launched to represent the interests of these miners. Mine with FoxPool and significantly improve your profitability through dual mining.
https://x.com/dwarfunion/status/1808424815478616191?s=46&t=0c96QNWKfAxCtEHgnIvcDA
Small miners can still make profit Mining. Doesnt matter if you have 10 ehs or 200TH. You get reward by the pool. So you would need to join the best paying pool per TH. Most off the Pools takes 6% Profit! They claim they take 0.5 to 1.5% but if you compare it with system they take way more than that!
This is correct, ignore the naysayers, stay humble and stack SATs, best way is home mining kyc-free sats. Cheers 👍
Not true. Many home miners, like me, are having to turn off older machines because the mining reward no longer covers the cost of the electricity they consume. The new miners are so expensive that over their lifetime you are not likely to recover the cost (it Bitcoin) that you paid for them. For me, I think this is going to be the last cycle I can participate in, and I have already scaled back. If I wanted to stay in I would have to upgrade my home to 3 phase power.
I made back my s19xp purchase/electricity/install cost in 1 year.... I missed opportunity cost of course in just buying at the time, however, have definitely ROI'd my investment... Not selling only stacking. Literally as of today I'm ROI'd. Everything over the remainder of the life of the miner is profit despite electricity costs.
No way. There are very few places in the world where you can break even on electricity alone, not to mention cost of equipment and any other infrastructure that your operation might need. You either have to be a home miner with super cheap electricity or on a massive scale
False. West coast USA 🤘 still in the green.
The Bitcoin community is failing miners. The overwhelming majority of the community look at it as a ticker symbol on the stock market and ignore the underlying mechanics and work that requires payment, and as such they maintain to never spend it and only buy to park. Bitcoin *needs* to drop lightning and increase block size so we don't have to worry about this demand for constant doubling in price action to maintain current level of profitability every 4 years. Bitcoin by 2028 will need to be worth 140k(by 2032 280k, and so on) to maintain earning 31m a day in reward subsidy until the subsidy is gone. Fees in comparison generate 2.1m a day. Bitcoin needs more fees and more transactions on chain for it to make sense to continue working as a project. My best sentiment right now is just profit off it while you can.
I'm a small miner. I run a lightning node. All my mined Bitcoin sits in cold storage. I DCA buy SATs with every paycheck. I advocate for never increasing the block size. I advocate for more holders holding long term their kyc SATs via lightning channels. I advocate for MORE small home miners, not fewer. Kyc-free sats are awesome to have. As a user/spender of Bitcoin (my kyc SATs get spent and replaced every opportunity I have to support a circular local economy) I love low fees (anti-spam). As a miner, I love high fees (bring on the spam). Everything in your comment is objectively false regardless of my perspective 😁 respectfully of course!
Everything you wrote is subjective, where I gave real numbers with date points that can be tracked with the halving schedule, a little math, and information that can be gathered from looking at current blocks, yet you claim everything I wrote is objectively false. Show me where. Or ya know, just don't say dumb stuff confidently, respectively of course.
Expanding block size will KILL small miners and the network as a whole. You already failed with btrash and bsuckv... Bitcoin is Bitcoin. I'm not necessarily an "ossify now" camp, however, protocol level changes like block sizes or block times CANNOT be manipulated or modified in anyway without having an absolute destructive result.
This community with its park and wait strategy will starve out miners from the expected fee growth (which comes in hand with transaction growth) as miners become more reliant on because the price action cannot sustain doubling every 4 years to offset the subsidy loss, as shown by the math above. Also, way to completely move on from your initial claim, do the math man, show me where I'm wrong. I want Bitcoin to succeed, but the BTC community is hellbent on watching it burn for some reason, so I will just profit from it and all the other forks I can until I no longer can.
How will it kill small miners? Nodes are trivially cheap to run and hardware has gotten even more cheaper and efficient than Moores law has predicted
They have this already it’s called Bitcoin cash.
This isn't an argument. And if the response to "Bitcoin will fail because of these reasons" is "they have this, it's called Bitcoin Cash", then does anyone in the community truly care about BTC? Sounds like they don't. So profit on it while you can, as I said.
It absolutely is an argument. If it was a legitimate solution then the market would recognize it as such. It hasn’t because it isn’t.
Lmao, okay. When the miners are leaving because Bitcoin is no longer profitable because it can't hit certain price actions to maintain current profit levels due to the halvings, nor can it really sustain any stable price (this is only more prone due to ETF investors, they don't care about Bitcoin like you, they like their currency), and transaction fees aren't keeping pace to offset the loss be sure to tell them "the market chose this!" See how this isn't an argument?
This happens every cycle. I have no tears for miners that are unsustainable. Yes there will be capitulation. No it will not be the end of Bitcoin.
Bitcoin historically has earned the miners more, and more Bitcoin was being issued. The future is not like the past because of this reason. Unless Bitcoin is able to 2x every 4 years, until the subsidy is gone their highest profitable days will be long behind them, so many (think riot, etc) will go under, and with them goes their hash power and with that creates blood in the water and prices will tumble as investors bail and longterm holders get their fiat transferred out and they're left with a digital bag hoping it recovers. Bitcoin needs more transactions on chain or doubling price action and sustained price because mining is a daily, 10 minute game. As price dips they actively lose money in real time. Bitcoin will surely still exist, but the profitability will never be what it was ever again and the price action won't recover because the project failed to be a usable sustainable currency.
Is this the long play? Keep price down, control the hashrate, release the market price? Short term about margins, long term about changing core rules?
My 1st gen Apollo BTC is either solo mining or mine in ocean.xyz.
Guys i have question.. I live in Croatia (EU). I am new to whole mining thing but i have some extra money and opportunity to build a small electric plant in Bosnia and Hercegovina-150 kw installed power, which can effectively power 5 of new best bitmain devices for bitcoin that are comming out in October..this would (when taking into account that electricity cost would be zero and if we put that average dificulty in next 3 years would be double of this right now), give me 1 bitcoin in next three years. Initial investment would be: 1.power plant equipement- 50 000 euro 2.power plant installation - 20 000 euro 3.small underground place for devices - 7 000 euro 4.land cost - 20 000 euro 5.bitmain s21 xp hydro *5 - 62 500 euro 6.adittional costs - 10 000 euro Whole investment would be around 170 000 euro. If my calculations are right and average difficulty of mining in next three years would be 2x right now i would have one bitcoin in 36 months.. Do you think this investment is valid long term? I mean 10 plus years, how hard would it be to maintain it? Would i need to be there non stop or i could hire some local to take care if anything goes wrong? I am new to this whole mining thing, but i am very interested in it.. I know that i could just invest 170 000 while bearmarket and sold it on bull run, but I like the idea that i have my own bitcoin production and i can watch it grow every day. Please tell me if this is a good idea, and what are possible downsights..