I think Dr Champ is a bad person but the amount of hate he gets on this sub versus how much overall harm he does, and how short of a time he’s in the show is funny to me.
I think the fact that he's supposed to be a therapist and lets himself fall into all these traps of blaming other people... He should know better ya know.
I agree with you but I think that’s the humor of his character. Maybe I would hate hime more too if his actions had worse consequences for more people? unless i’m forgetting something
Considering Bojack only had the vodka in his room because he was helping someone else out and no one _made_ Dr Champ drink it, certainly not Bojack; Dr Champ is the one person whose downfall Bojack ultimately had _zero_ responsibility in.
But can we talk about how, yes, it *was* wrong to be holding onto alcohol in rehab, but when Dr Champ started drinking it, he didn’t say to himself on the first sip “WAIT THIS ISN’T WATER”, he just kept drinking it. To me, that feels like Dr Champ deep down was hoping for an opportunity to drink again. It was going to happen at some point, and Bojack happened to be the unlucky guy whose fault it was.
Bojack then tried to get him sober but he wouldn’t cooperate. Dr Champ was waiting for the chance to relapse.
So no, vodka shouldn’t be in a rehabilitation center. But neither should Dr Champ.
Yeah, honestly I kinda wondered that too. When Bojack tried a sip of vodka after detoxing, he couldn’t stand it anymore and immediately threw it out the window. That’s literally how it ended up in Dr Champ’s hands in the first place. You could argue it was just kinda convenient for the plot, if he stopped drinking after one sip then obviously that plot line couldn’t have moved forward.
I think Dr Champ was someone who tried to help people, and did genuinely good work, until Bojack fucked with his sobriety. Which he did. If Bojack hadn’t come into the picture, Dr Champ probably at LEAST wouldn’t have drank again for a long time, if ever. I think his character is a lesson about how small decisions can have big consequences, but also that you can’t be held responsible for changing the course of someone’s life with a small, unintentional decision.
My only real complaint with Diane is her actions in Int Sub. Not once did she consider that penny easily could have seen that on live tv and think that bojack was trying to fuck with her. What the fuck was penny supposed to think? If you were in her position and you saw your exact trauma being laid out on tv followed up with the state you live in just to confirm, while the actual offender is on live tv, the only logical explanation you could come up with is that Bojack was toying with you.
Her friends might’ve watched it, it could’ve been playing on the tv at the shop she works in, she could’ve been told about it, her dad watches Birthday Dad and I believe they were on the same network so it’s not a stretch to say he watched Philbert, and finally social media.
Idk how I forgot about WTIIRN. One of my favorite gags in seeing Flip pull out his phone to check the time and go to the app even though you can see the time at the top of his phone and I’m pretty sure it even changes before he opens the app.
People are still gonna talk about it, so even if she avoids the show itself like the plague, she might find out from a friend who watched the show or even just from overhearing a conversation.
I believe taking revenge because Bojack didn't tell her something, not just in public, but on the teleplay of their show, was an arsehole move regardless by Diane, but, that aside, many people were bound to know that Bojack lived with Penny's family for a month while she was a senior, he even went to prom, and she's a dear, it's not that hard for any of her acquaintances to figure out it's her they're talking about.
That's why you don't tell stories that are not yours to tell, because you may ignore very important variables. Well, that's one reason why.
Exactly, and I don’t think any of her friends would have connected the dots except for maybe Pete/Peter and Maddie. I doubt they’d have brought it up with Penny, and even if they had, those are the two people she’d trust the most to talk about it with. I don’t think it was any worse than what Bojack had already done.
Diane isn't written to be a perfect character whose actions are all justified. She did something out of spite, she could have definitely been a better person in that specific situation, but from the outside looking in we can see why she does it even if we recognize it wasn't the right thing.
You can't say the same thing for other characters, namely Bojack
I relate the most to Diane and I’m a dude so it’s kinda weird. I’m just saying what she did was HIGHLY irresponsible and seemed like she only wanted to hurt bojack but didn’t consider the actual victim
The silly gimmick goes away about two thirds in when the therapists realize their stories are interconnected and thus drop the confidentiality rule. Then the plot becomes serious as we start to dive into Diane catching onto Bojack's trip to New Mexico.
Bojack was CONSTANTLY telling people about Penny, he just didn’t like it when someone he actually respected threw it in his face to make a point. The reason Diane did that was bc he was so unrepentant specifically about Penny’s story, that was Diane’s whole issue - he didn’t give a shit about what he did to Penny. Bojack was the one who refused to take it seriously, refused to get therapy to deal with his own issues. Sometimes we can make the right decision, but it still hurts people. That’s kinda just life.
Honestly I don’t fault her for it, Bojack deserved it and I think he needed a friend like Diane pushing him to do better. I think if she hadn’t done that, he would have only gotten more comfortable with what he did to Penny.
I didnt know she was controversial! She definitely reminds me of myself. Like yeah, she makes so many mistakes and some of them are very painful and cringe-worthy but she does everything she can to work through those issues.
Every so often people post on this thread and they're like "My boyfriend hates Diane" and "I find Diane's character annoying" and I get sad cos she's very clearly trying her best and wrangling with a lot of complex issues (moral & political but also her own mental health and happiness).
Honestly, as charcaters, I enjoy the entire bojack cast and wouldnt change a thing. I know a lot of people find pickles and Joey pogo annoying, but I enjoyed them too (I really like pickles tbh). In general, I think hollyhock is the least dislikeable character in the show
i think that's the point. they're annoying WITH each other and i love it. plus pogo isn't a 50 year old man so that's a plus ! i'm with you on the hollyhock comment
Hollyhock was probably the best and most accurate example of an actual healthy person who does the right thing both logically and emotionally. And maybe her turning out the opposite of BoJack was actually the point. This show has so many layers.
Due to the nature of the show’s content I imagine that there must be quite a few unhealthy minded people here as well. I always question those posts or comments about people who watch the show multiple times, and claim to sympathize with Bo more as time goes on.
I wouldn’t change it. All of the different mental health perspectives trying to defend the characters that they relate to the most. It makes for some very interesting discussion. And that’s why this is one of my favorite subs.
as a mid Gen Z college student I feel like Pickles’ character pokes fun at my age group while still recognizing how vulnerable young people are by their nature. I like her a lot
Pickles. And I will die on this hill. I didn’t find her annoying. Just immature. And that’s the whole point. It’s meant to really make PB feel like a creep for dating her.
This is the only one of the top ~10 answers who it feels like people are actually trying to get me to hate lmao, like who hates Princess Carolyn or Mr. Peanutbutter?
Bojack himself. Profoundly flawed, deeply wounded, floundering under the surface we get to see glimpses of a kind heart that wasn’t allowed to thrive.
I hold hope that his unknown future will be filled with healing and redemption.
I know, I’m terribly idealistic.
mr. peanut butter. i’ve ran into countless scenarios where i’ve been told why i should dislike him, but i just can’t bring myself to. he’s so ignorantly optimistic and social. i love his character.
I’ve always thought of Peanut Butter as a “bad person” but still a great character personally- he’s done plenty wrong and I blame him more for how his relationship ended than Diane, but never thought he was badly written for it. Feel it’s kinda weird how OFFENSIVE people can get over PB sometimes
i totally get it. he’s realistic and well written i feel. he reminds me of someone i’m very close to which is maybe why i admire his character so much. i feel like one of pb’s faults is that he’s so optimistic he doesn’t understand other people’s perspectives or feelings, which is one of the reasons why him and diane split. they say opposites attract (diane and pb) but they repel more when the two don’t see each other’s perspectives (pb obliviously throwing diane large parties, and the grand gesture/belle room.) all in all, i personally like peanut butter because he reminds me of someone im very close to. even though flawed, i love his character.
his ignorance is his sin, yes it benefitted him but also to the loss of all his s/o's. He is ignorantly optimistic but he is also at the same time apathetic.
I will die on this hill, but if you genuinely like Bojack and see him as the hero of the story, you are most likely not a good person. I've met plenty of people who've watched the show and those who related to Bojack proved to be the worst human beings - narcissists who feel like the world is against them and take 0 accountability for anything.
Bojack is like top 10 most vile characters ever written, he's very interesting and I love the show, but as a person, he's evil and his actions throughout the show are inexcusable.
(sorry for the rant, this one came with some emotional baggage attached)
I had a friend who said she related to Bojack, it always made me feel a little uncomfortable the way she said it. She was definitely the friend always in crisis (to be fair, she very much had reasons to be that way i.e. extremely homophobic parents). She did try hard to be a better person, but also gave herself passes to neglect the people who loved her and didn’t really think too deeply about her own actions. I definitely wasn’t a perfect friend either, I had my own shit going on as we all do. Last I checked she became a TERF 🤷♀️
If the show wasn't called Bojack horseman, some people would dislike him as a character. It's only because we got a backdoor access to his mind, only those that could empathise or understand the trauma behind his actions could partly justify him spreading pain amongst the people around him.
The show is about Bojack being broken however. And thus anyone who is able to underground the depth to it wony "dislike" Bojack.
>She will always put everyone else’s needs before hers no matter how bad she needs to do her own thing.
Unless it gets in the way of what her own superiors want her to do for her business, or what she herself decides will keep business moving more smoothly.
Seriously, I love PC but the idolization of her ignores some really important aspects of her character. She's a huge enabler and that part of her character is not admirable. Her "giving" nature is a double-edged sword because she "gives" to a very corrupt industry.
True. We can enjoy a character whilst still acknowledging that they have questionable traits and morals. She's a great friend, that's true, but she's also a workaholic who is willing step on innocent people, manipulate celebrities, and taint the media to get to her pillar of success. We can still appreciate her good traits, but she's far from perfect. She's committed her fair share of sins.
The scene in "sunk cost and all that" when Bojack walks out the door to read the class their superlatives, I have watched just Diane and just PC while he's doing his little speech. Diane is full of "I wish I could believe that what he's saying means anything at this point" but PC's face is "he's changed so much so he deserves a chance." The fact its animated but their faces are telling two ways that women sometimes sit on the enabler spectrum gets me every fucking time. They both have moments of "oh Bojack get real" and both have moments of "poor Bojack." But the difference is PC really digs her heels into helping Bojack at this moment and you kind of see Diane disconnect once again because of her strong sense of justice. It's really exemplary of PC being so flawed but wanting to give people a fighting chance.
Yes I’ve noticed this as well. Same concept in her relationships. She’s too giving to the point of enabling and always was ultimately taken advantage of
Mr. Peanut Butter, Hollyhock, Sarah Lynn... and Bojack.
Pb for his endless optimism
Hollyhock: "That voice that tells you you're stupid and worthless and ugly... ... That goes away, right?..."
Sarah Lynn "When I get older *yawn* I wanna be an arcitect." >!(I've never cried harder over a character death).!<
Bohack: "Nobody ever told me when your mom dies you get a free churro."
PC & Todd 💓 they’re both such genuine, caring, giving people regardless of how the other characters act towards them. i love that they end up developing a closer friendship in the later seasons when Todd becomes PC’s nanny!
You may enjoy this if you haven't already seen it.
[Princess Carolyn Timeline](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xBm3PhzpVRE)
He does these videos for a few other different characters as well.
Sarah Lynn. Her story is so tragic, and every now and then I'll read in the news about a situation that feels painfully like hers. She bares some responsibility for how her life turned out, but every adult that had authority over her as a child abused that power.
Her character design is beautiful too. The artists somehow managed to make an entire group of people feel turned on by an cartoon pig. The animators on the other hand did an excellent job with animating her movements. They made her big and obnoxious whilst still retaining an air of elegance and pride. She exudes ego simply through her body movements. I also find it smart that they didn't just make her a journalist chasing a case but also gave her a full story-line; she is affianced and has to put off her marriage for work, but we as the viewers are unsure of what will happen to her marriage. Will her fiance pull out of the wedding as he can no longer deal with her failing to prioritize him? Or will the marriage be called off when she realizes she has a thing for her co-worker? She has to wrap up her project quickly, so she pursues it aggressively. It being her last project also makes it so much more important to her to get it done well and on time. The constant phone calls to her fiance also add a sense of urgency to the case. It makes everything feel rushed, creating the illusion that time is running out for Bojack. So well done, honestly.
It doesn’t hurt that she’s voiced by Paget Brewster either!
Btw, if you like Page Sinclaire, you might enjoy the podcast “Thrilling Adventure Hour”. It’s got a regular segment called Beyond Belief where Paget Brewster and Paul F. Tompkins play a married couple who solve comedic supernatural problems each episode.
honestly, diane and mr. peanutbutter. the more i rewatched the show the more i resonated with both of them as characters. i can relate deeply to their flaws and i see myself in that.
and ive seen some ppl hate on todd but they could never make me hate todd <3
Bojack himself. Even when the writers were actively trying to make me. I know he's a bad person and he's done awful things, I'm not defending any of that, but I've still never completely hated him. I've never stopped hoping that he would genuinely change and get better.
Hollyhock. I’m not even going to attempt to type out her last name, too exhausting and I only remember parts of it anyway after numerous watches. But I adore that girl. Every single scene she’s in is great.
controversial but, Bojack. i hated him at first until I got my bpd diagnosis and realized how similar I am to him. he makes me realize the flaws in myself and I appreciate that, plus I'll always have a soft spot for him. people don't understand that sometimes when you have mental illness you're predispositioned to be the bad guy and that's that
I feel like PC and Diane get a lot of hate but the one I could never hate is that chinchilla interviewer that ruins his life in season six. She finally made Bojack pay for all his actions, she didn't make him look bad she just repeated what he did back to him but publicly. Also, without her we wouldn't have that perfect last couple episodes
Honestly we need people like her in real life so really grill awful people like Dan Schneider in interviews to really make them feel as ashamed as he should be
pc and todd - i love both so much separately and even as a duo they’re so wholesome together esp when they lived together and todd was ruthie’s nanny (one of my fave moments in bjh was when pc asked todd if he wanted to be ruthie’s nanny)
almost every character, i know they’ve all done bad things but i’m just too affectionate to dislike them.
on the other hand there are characters who aren’t “bad” that i can’t stand like pickles and the howl bojack got with
For me, it’s Todd. And I know that a lot of people dislike him because he can be pretty clueless, like for example the whole Cabracadabra thing was initially super feminist but ended up being the total opposite. I think it’s because he’s so good-hearted. He does stupid things but not because he means to, he just doesn’t get it. His intentions are always pure.
Honestly princess carolyn, because I deeply admire her ambition and get to it attitude and aspire to be like that and have big goals in life but I also deeply admire bojack in the sense that I can relate to his trauma and past on a very personal level and feel almost connected to him, especially in Free Churro where he discusses his parents and it’s a sad speech laced with the passive aggressiveness of a neglected child at heart and I feel seen when these deeper episodes come on
Mr Peanutbutter, I’ve seen analysis after analysis trying to convince me that he’s the devil but I still think he’s hilarious, I understand why some people despise the character though, I just think the absurdity of his endless positivity never gets old
Beatrice Horseman. I know she was a shitty mom and Bojack deserved better, but after her flashback episodes all I feel is sorry for her. I want to punch her dad in the face, put her mom in therapy and get her some Plan B (sorry Bojack) so she can marry that nice goat guy 😭
Bojack. Despite all the shitty things he does, I relate to him too much to hate him. Weird, because I hate myself for having a lot of the same tendencies,
Out of they 5 main characters I truly never hated any of them, I get the most annoyed with Diane, but that's probably because, until S6 at least, some of her flaws I could see in myself.
I dislike Hollyhock and I can't figure out why, I know everyone loves her, so there must be a specific reason, I just can't figure it out.
Definitelly Judah, because it felt peaceful anywhere he was. Guy, because he saved Diane in every possibile way. And Todd, even if he left BJ at some point, in the final episode he helped him. He got him out of the party, had a deeptalk and it was just like in the first few episode. Todd's innocence and the fact that he was basically a man-child (Toddler haha) makes it so calm. He is just a little sunshine
diane. of course she did and said things that pissed me off but it’s because she’s such a real character. i relate to her so much, i am a daughter of 2 immigrant parents (one being asian), but i was born in australia. i don’t feel any connection to my nationality and no matter how hard i try to connect to my heritage, i feel like a fake and an imposter. i think that people are much too harsh on diane. but i think she’s a badass and she’s authentic (especially in the later seasons, leaving LA was great for her).
Really unpopular opinion but Todd and Mr.PB. Idk I feel like I love the naivety and Innocence they brought to the show. And bojack himself no matter how much of a terrible person he is, I love him wholeheartedly
Diane Nguyen, Sarah Lynn, Todd Chavez, Esteemed Character Actress and Fugitive from the law Margo Martindale, and Bojack Horseman.
Diane is perfect, Sarah Lynn is a tragedy, Todd is carefree and fun, Margo is so insane she makes perfect sense and Bojack is so flawed and traumatized but every once in a while you see him try and I just relate to him and understand him too much to ever hate him.
theres really no reason i don't see PC as an untouchable character is I don't really resonate with her as much. I love her but she just doesn't pull on my heart strings as much as the others.
as for Mr peanut butter, I don't like him at all. he's toxicly positive, ignores others needs and makes things about himself. and on top of all of that, people think that he's a good person just cause he's optimistic and kind, but they don't see through the ruse, leading the people he hurts feeling isolated and invalidated.
diane. also todd. like the only bad things i can think of him doing are making cabracadabra accessible to men and maybe some shit from season 1 that are mostly played for laughs like him joining the aryans and latin kings in prison to name an example.
Judah, Guy
Guy is TOO perfect.
You just know he runs a meth cartel with a fried chicken franchise as a front
That saying "I know a Guy" was about him you know?
He's not a Gus, he's just a Guy
Margot Martindale the true GOAT
You mean esteemed character actress and fugitive from the law Margo Martindale?
Dr Champ. he's a skilled therapy horse. jk. Dr Champ is a huge piece of shit.
i was shocked for a second there.
Yeah fuck that guy though right
Glad we can all agree on that much. *Fuck* that guy.
He's not even a real doctor!
I think Dr Champ is a bad person but the amount of hate he gets on this sub versus how much overall harm he does, and how short of a time he’s in the show is funny to me.
I think the fact that he's supposed to be a therapist and lets himself fall into all these traps of blaming other people... He should know better ya know.
I agree with you but I think that’s the humor of his character. Maybe I would hate hime more too if his actions had worse consequences for more people? unless i’m forgetting something
Why? I felt sorry for Dr Champ. BoJ crashed his career and put him back on the booze, so he harboured a grudge.
Considering Bojack only had the vodka in his room because he was helping someone else out and no one _made_ Dr Champ drink it, certainly not Bojack; Dr Champ is the one person whose downfall Bojack ultimately had _zero_ responsibility in.
It was rehab. BoJ should have flushed it immediately.
Doesn’t change the fact that Dr Champ ruined his own career and refused to take accountability for that.
He kept it as a reminder or a warning.
But can we talk about how, yes, it *was* wrong to be holding onto alcohol in rehab, but when Dr Champ started drinking it, he didn’t say to himself on the first sip “WAIT THIS ISN’T WATER”, he just kept drinking it. To me, that feels like Dr Champ deep down was hoping for an opportunity to drink again. It was going to happen at some point, and Bojack happened to be the unlucky guy whose fault it was. Bojack then tried to get him sober but he wouldn’t cooperate. Dr Champ was waiting for the chance to relapse. So no, vodka shouldn’t be in a rehabilitation center. But neither should Dr Champ.
Yeah, honestly I kinda wondered that too. When Bojack tried a sip of vodka after detoxing, he couldn’t stand it anymore and immediately threw it out the window. That’s literally how it ended up in Dr Champ’s hands in the first place. You could argue it was just kinda convenient for the plot, if he stopped drinking after one sip then obviously that plot line couldn’t have moved forward. I think Dr Champ was someone who tried to help people, and did genuinely good work, until Bojack fucked with his sobriety. Which he did. If Bojack hadn’t come into the picture, Dr Champ probably at LEAST wouldn’t have drank again for a long time, if ever. I think his character is a lesson about how small decisions can have big consequences, but also that you can’t be held responsible for changing the course of someone’s life with a small, unintentional decision.
PC. no matter if she isn't totally perfect either. shes a broken soul who just wants love and happiness ! ❤️❤️
Yeah, definitely not perfect, but she'd be boring if she was
and thats why i love her! nobodies perfect :D
Diane, they can never make me hate you
My only real complaint with Diane is her actions in Int Sub. Not once did she consider that penny easily could have seen that on live tv and think that bojack was trying to fuck with her. What the fuck was penny supposed to think? If you were in her position and you saw your exact trauma being laid out on tv followed up with the state you live in just to confirm, while the actual offender is on live tv, the only logical explanation you could come up with is that Bojack was toying with you.
To be honest, I don't think Penny would've watched Philbert anyway considering Bojack was in it.
Her friends might’ve watched it, it could’ve been playing on the tv at the shop she works in, she could’ve been told about it, her dad watches Birthday Dad and I believe they were on the same network so it’s not a stretch to say he watched Philbert, and finally social media.
Philbert was not on TV. It was a what time is it now exclusive. Birthday dad is ABC
Idk how I forgot about WTIIRN. One of my favorite gags in seeing Flip pull out his phone to check the time and go to the app even though you can see the time at the top of his phone and I’m pretty sure it even changes before he opens the app.
People are still gonna talk about it, so even if she avoids the show itself like the plague, she might find out from a friend who watched the show or even just from overhearing a conversation.
I believe taking revenge because Bojack didn't tell her something, not just in public, but on the teleplay of their show, was an arsehole move regardless by Diane, but, that aside, many people were bound to know that Bojack lived with Penny's family for a month while she was a senior, he even went to prom, and she's a dear, it's not that hard for any of her acquaintances to figure out it's her they're talking about. That's why you don't tell stories that are not yours to tell, because you may ignore very important variables. Well, that's one reason why.
Exactly, and I don’t think any of her friends would have connected the dots except for maybe Pete/Peter and Maddie. I doubt they’d have brought it up with Penny, and even if they had, those are the two people she’d trust the most to talk about it with. I don’t think it was any worse than what Bojack had already done.
Diane isn't written to be a perfect character whose actions are all justified. She did something out of spite, she could have definitely been a better person in that specific situation, but from the outside looking in we can see why she does it even if we recognize it wasn't the right thing. You can't say the same thing for other characters, namely Bojack
I relate the most to Diane and I’m a dude so it’s kinda weird. I’m just saying what she did was HIGHLY irresponsible and seemed like she only wanted to hurt bojack but didn’t consider the actual victim
Huh, I just finished a rewatch of the series but I guess I must have missed this episode on the rewatch cuz I totally don’t remember this episode
S5 EP7 Int Sub. Half of the episode is told from the pov of two therapists. Poor Mr Chocolate Hazelnut Spread…
The silly gimmick goes away about two thirds in when the therapists realize their stories are interconnected and thus drop the confidentiality rule. Then the plot becomes serious as we start to dive into Diane catching onto Bojack's trip to New Mexico.
It’s a great episode, in my top 5. It’s funny and very serious at the same time.
Bojack was CONSTANTLY telling people about Penny, he just didn’t like it when someone he actually respected threw it in his face to make a point. The reason Diane did that was bc he was so unrepentant specifically about Penny’s story, that was Diane’s whole issue - he didn’t give a shit about what he did to Penny. Bojack was the one who refused to take it seriously, refused to get therapy to deal with his own issues. Sometimes we can make the right decision, but it still hurts people. That’s kinda just life. Honestly I don’t fault her for it, Bojack deserved it and I think he needed a friend like Diane pushing him to do better. I think if she hadn’t done that, he would have only gotten more comfortable with what he did to Penny.
Also even if she didn't see it just talking about someone else trauma on TV is shitty it's not your place to tell another victims story.
Though as Philbert was clearly the bad guy in that scene, Penny might have decided that BoJ was trying to understand his wrongdoing.
Bojack wasn’t on tv. He was on what time is it now
6:13AM eastern.
NO LITERALLLY. And she's one of the more "controversial" characters... I see you baby they could NEVER make me hate you.
I didnt know she was controversial! She definitely reminds me of myself. Like yeah, she makes so many mistakes and some of them are very painful and cringe-worthy but she does everything she can to work through those issues.
Every so often people post on this thread and they're like "My boyfriend hates Diane" and "I find Diane's character annoying" and I get sad cos she's very clearly trying her best and wrangling with a lot of complex issues (moral & political but also her own mental health and happiness).
This is legit.
Yeah I was so surprised the first time I heard her getting hate-- couldn't fathom it
✨Misogyny✨
Diane is my choice too 🥲❤️
Seconded
Yeyeyeye
Same here! PC is the real MVP in the series. Also I’d add Maude and Todd :) But virtually no one and nothing can make me hate the characters I love.
Honestly, as charcaters, I enjoy the entire bojack cast and wouldnt change a thing. I know a lot of people find pickles and Joey pogo annoying, but I enjoyed them too (I really like pickles tbh). In general, I think hollyhock is the least dislikeable character in the show
i think that's the point. they're annoying WITH each other and i love it. plus pogo isn't a 50 year old man so that's a plus ! i'm with you on the hollyhock comment
Hollyhock was probably the best and most accurate example of an actual healthy person who does the right thing both logically and emotionally. And maybe her turning out the opposite of BoJack was actually the point. This show has so many layers. Due to the nature of the show’s content I imagine that there must be quite a few unhealthy minded people here as well. I always question those posts or comments about people who watch the show multiple times, and claim to sympathize with Bo more as time goes on. I wouldn’t change it. All of the different mental health perspectives trying to defend the characters that they relate to the most. It makes for some very interesting discussion. And that’s why this is one of my favorite subs.
as a mid Gen Z college student I feel like Pickles’ character pokes fun at my age group while still recognizing how vulnerable young people are by their nature. I like her a lot
Pickles. And I will die on this hill. I didn’t find her annoying. Just immature. And that’s the whole point. It’s meant to really make PB feel like a creep for dating her.
hard agree! she didn’t annoy me at all, she’s so silly and fun! it makes me sad that she gets so much hate lol
Thank you!! Couldn’t agree more.
i totally agree!! pickles is just so bubbly and cutesy, i see why other’s find her annoying but i myself think she’s just a fun character.
agreed i love her so much
And she’s not throwing away her shot!
Perfect pug energy
This is the only one of the top ~10 answers who it feels like people are actually trying to get me to hate lmao, like who hates Princess Carolyn or Mr. Peanutbutter?
YES! I WILL DIE ON THIS HILL W U
The possum who said, "Typical BoSchwack."
Young Beatrice Horseman, as she gets older and more toxic the harder it is to excuse her actions but she had such potential to be happy
"just making sure I don't fit it"
PC. She could run over a family of 8 with a ford suv and her tounge twisters and attitude would be able to write it off for me.
PC, who is a super catwoman, and Todd, who really does have such an adorable face.
Someone should get that guy a cookie
Vincent Adultman. He just wanted to skip childhood and do business at the business factory. Couldn't we all aspire to want such a simple life?
Bojack himself. Profoundly flawed, deeply wounded, floundering under the surface we get to see glimpses of a kind heart that wasn’t allowed to thrive. I hold hope that his unknown future will be filled with healing and redemption. I know, I’m terribly idealistic.
Same here. I root for Bojack having a peaceful, low profile and quietly enjoyable life harming no one including himself, after the show ends.
mr. peanut butter. i’ve ran into countless scenarios where i’ve been told why i should dislike him, but i just can’t bring myself to. he’s so ignorantly optimistic and social. i love his character.
I’ve always thought of Peanut Butter as a “bad person” but still a great character personally- he’s done plenty wrong and I blame him more for how his relationship ended than Diane, but never thought he was badly written for it. Feel it’s kinda weird how OFFENSIVE people can get over PB sometimes
i totally get it. he’s realistic and well written i feel. he reminds me of someone i’m very close to which is maybe why i admire his character so much. i feel like one of pb’s faults is that he’s so optimistic he doesn’t understand other people’s perspectives or feelings, which is one of the reasons why him and diane split. they say opposites attract (diane and pb) but they repel more when the two don’t see each other’s perspectives (pb obliviously throwing diane large parties, and the grand gesture/belle room.) all in all, i personally like peanut butter because he reminds me of someone im very close to. even though flawed, i love his character.
He's a perfect representation of a labrador. I could no more hate him than I could the dog on which he is based.
PB might be overzealous and not listen sometimes but he’s happy go lucky and also Paul F. Tompkins.
his ignorance is his sin, yes it benefitted him but also to the loss of all his s/o's. He is ignorantly optimistic but he is also at the same time apathetic.
entirely agree. apathetic is a great way to describe his actions to any conflict, in my opinion.
I love him too!
me too
He's the smartest character-____-
I find PB annoying but I don’t dislike him. He’s basically a well-meaning idiot who keeps failing upwards.
Meow Meow Fuzzyface
IS meow meow fuzzyface a loose cannon?
Diane Nguyen they could never make me hate you.
Bojack. I definitely can't hate on him, if you hate on him why you watching the show anyway?
hate the sin, love the sinner?
More like hate the sinner, love the sin
I will die on this hill, but if you genuinely like Bojack and see him as the hero of the story, you are most likely not a good person. I've met plenty of people who've watched the show and those who related to Bojack proved to be the worst human beings - narcissists who feel like the world is against them and take 0 accountability for anything. Bojack is like top 10 most vile characters ever written, he's very interesting and I love the show, but as a person, he's evil and his actions throughout the show are inexcusable. (sorry for the rant, this one came with some emotional baggage attached)
I mean, I feel sorry for him and kinda understand why he does shitty things. I just can't hate him. (Also no problem)
I had a friend who said she related to Bojack, it always made me feel a little uncomfortable the way she said it. She was definitely the friend always in crisis (to be fair, she very much had reasons to be that way i.e. extremely homophobic parents). She did try hard to be a better person, but also gave herself passes to neglect the people who loved her and didn’t really think too deeply about her own actions. I definitely wasn’t a perfect friend either, I had my own shit going on as we all do. Last I checked she became a TERF 🤷♀️
If the show wasn't called Bojack horseman, some people would dislike him as a character. It's only because we got a backdoor access to his mind, only those that could empathise or understand the trauma behind his actions could partly justify him spreading pain amongst the people around him. The show is about Bojack being broken however. And thus anyone who is able to underground the depth to it wony "dislike" Bojack.
Agree. I love BoJack. He is Everyman. People just don’t realize it.
hollyhock and todd :( they both need a little more love
I agree I love hollyhock!!
>She will always put everyone else’s needs before hers no matter how bad she needs to do her own thing. Unless it gets in the way of what her own superiors want her to do for her business, or what she herself decides will keep business moving more smoothly. Seriously, I love PC but the idolization of her ignores some really important aspects of her character. She's a huge enabler and that part of her character is not admirable. Her "giving" nature is a double-edged sword because she "gives" to a very corrupt industry.
True. We can enjoy a character whilst still acknowledging that they have questionable traits and morals. She's a great friend, that's true, but she's also a workaholic who is willing step on innocent people, manipulate celebrities, and taint the media to get to her pillar of success. We can still appreciate her good traits, but she's far from perfect. She's committed her fair share of sins.
The scene in "sunk cost and all that" when Bojack walks out the door to read the class their superlatives, I have watched just Diane and just PC while he's doing his little speech. Diane is full of "I wish I could believe that what he's saying means anything at this point" but PC's face is "he's changed so much so he deserves a chance." The fact its animated but their faces are telling two ways that women sometimes sit on the enabler spectrum gets me every fucking time. They both have moments of "oh Bojack get real" and both have moments of "poor Bojack." But the difference is PC really digs her heels into helping Bojack at this moment and you kind of see Diane disconnect once again because of her strong sense of justice. It's really exemplary of PC being so flawed but wanting to give people a fighting chance.
Yes I’ve noticed this as well. Same concept in her relationships. She’s too giving to the point of enabling and always was ultimately taken advantage of
Diane Nguyen. Todd Chazev. Princess Caroline.
Mr. Peanut Butter, Hollyhock, Sarah Lynn... and Bojack. Pb for his endless optimism Hollyhock: "That voice that tells you you're stupid and worthless and ugly... ... That goes away, right?..." Sarah Lynn "When I get older *yawn* I wanna be an arcitect." >!(I've never cried harder over a character death).!< Bohack: "Nobody ever told me when your mom dies you get a free churro."
yes!! peanut butter’s optimism is what makes him one of my favorites. it’s almost admirable.
Bojack. Hate him as a person, LOVE him as a character.
diane. turtletaub because he’s hilarious, kelsey, charlotte and penny, sextina aquafina, jill pill
PC & Todd 💓 they’re both such genuine, caring, giving people regardless of how the other characters act towards them. i love that they end up developing a closer friendship in the later seasons when Todd becomes PC’s nanny!
Diane
PC and Diane for sure. Idc idc I love them.
You may enjoy this if you haven't already seen it. [Princess Carolyn Timeline](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xBm3PhzpVRE) He does these videos for a few other different characters as well.
Joey Pogo. Dude is funny af and I never understood the hate for him.
Sarah Lynn. Her story is so tragic, and every now and then I'll read in the news about a situation that feels painfully like hers. She bares some responsibility for how her life turned out, but every adult that had authority over her as a child abused that power.
Todd. He is the cutest, and his face is just so cute ugh
not enough Todd appreciation here. I could never hate that face. someone should give this guy a cookie
I love Paige Sinclaire and her amazing dialogue, they do such a good job with the Transatlantic affect
Her character design is beautiful too. The artists somehow managed to make an entire group of people feel turned on by an cartoon pig. The animators on the other hand did an excellent job with animating her movements. They made her big and obnoxious whilst still retaining an air of elegance and pride. She exudes ego simply through her body movements. I also find it smart that they didn't just make her a journalist chasing a case but also gave her a full story-line; she is affianced and has to put off her marriage for work, but we as the viewers are unsure of what will happen to her marriage. Will her fiance pull out of the wedding as he can no longer deal with her failing to prioritize him? Or will the marriage be called off when she realizes she has a thing for her co-worker? She has to wrap up her project quickly, so she pursues it aggressively. It being her last project also makes it so much more important to her to get it done well and on time. The constant phone calls to her fiance also add a sense of urgency to the case. It makes everything feel rushed, creating the illusion that time is running out for Bojack. So well done, honestly.
It doesn’t hurt that she’s voiced by Paget Brewster either! Btw, if you like Page Sinclaire, you might enjoy the podcast “Thrilling Adventure Hour”. It’s got a regular segment called Beyond Belief where Paget Brewster and Paul F. Tompkins play a married couple who solve comedic supernatural problems each episode.
Page Sinclaire and Mr Peanutbutter on the same podcast, what is this a crossover episode
I'll always love Todd's wacky shenanigans. Never change buddy, keep doing your thing!
Bojack himself.
Same, PC for me. For every reason that you said.
BoJack Horseman.
princess carolynn
Diane. I understand her on so many levels.
Sharona
honestly, diane and mr. peanutbutter. the more i rewatched the show the more i resonated with both of them as characters. i can relate deeply to their flaws and i see myself in that. and ive seen some ppl hate on todd but they could never make me hate todd <3
diane, todd, pc, pinky penguin, hollyhock, character actress margo martindale
Bojack himself. Even when the writers were actively trying to make me. I know he's a bad person and he's done awful things, I'm not defending any of that, but I've still never completely hated him. I've never stopped hoping that he would genuinely change and get better.
Diane. maybe it's because of our trauma similarities, but I never got why some people hated her
Diane 😍😍😍
Hollyhock. I’m not even going to attempt to type out her last name, too exhausting and I only remember parts of it anyway after numerous watches. But I adore that girl. Every single scene she’s in is great.
Do you think I'm a blob? That shit gets me. Poor baby! 😭
controversial but, Bojack. i hated him at first until I got my bpd diagnosis and realized how similar I am to him. he makes me realize the flaws in myself and I appreciate that, plus I'll always have a soft spot for him. people don't understand that sometimes when you have mental illness you're predispositioned to be the bad guy and that's that
Erica!
Todd
I feel like PC and Diane get a lot of hate but the one I could never hate is that chinchilla interviewer that ruins his life in season six. She finally made Bojack pay for all his actions, she didn't make him look bad she just repeated what he did back to him but publicly. Also, without her we wouldn't have that perfect last couple episodes
W biscuits braxby
Honestly we need people like her in real life so really grill awful people like Dan Schneider in interviews to really make them feel as ashamed as he should be
diane and todd because we are truly the same
Mr. Peanutbutter
Todd and PC.
Todd is an obvious choice 4 me
Mr. Peanutbutter
Todd and Judah.
Diane
Tom Jumbo.
pc and todd - i love both so much separately and even as a duo they’re so wholesome together esp when they lived together and todd was ruthie’s nanny (one of my fave moments in bjh was when pc asked todd if he wanted to be ruthie’s nanny)
This may be a hot take but Ralph. Penny as well!
Put your shit together! PC.
Todd and Princess Carolyn<3
almost every character, i know they’ve all done bad things but i’m just too affectionate to dislike them. on the other hand there are characters who aren’t “bad” that i can’t stand like pickles and the howl bojack got with
Beatrice , pickles , and hollyhock are my main favorites, I love them
Todd. I love how he's able move up in the world whilst still keeping his fun personality.
Princess Carolyn, and I'd like to say BoJack but y'all would attack me😭😭
Honestly she’s nowhere near my favourite but I’ve never thought Paige Sinclair is worthy of hate or disdain
Todd, hooray!!
Todd, PC and Judah✨
For me, it’s Todd. And I know that a lot of people dislike him because he can be pretty clueless, like for example the whole Cabracadabra thing was initially super feminist but ended up being the total opposite. I think it’s because he’s so good-hearted. He does stupid things but not because he means to, he just doesn’t get it. His intentions are always pure.
Mr Peanutbutter. I don't care. People only hate him so much because his toxic traits weren't so obvious at the start of the show
Corduroy Jackson. He died doing what he loved. Rest in peace, sweet angel.
For me PC too.
Seahorse dad
PC 💖
Honestly princess carolyn, because I deeply admire her ambition and get to it attitude and aspire to be like that and have big goals in life but I also deeply admire bojack in the sense that I can relate to his trauma and past on a very personal level and feel almost connected to him, especially in Free Churro where he discusses his parents and it’s a sad speech laced with the passive aggressiveness of a neglected child at heart and I feel seen when these deeper episodes come on
Diane
Probably Bojack.
If we're only talking main characters, Todd. PC is my favorite, but I could never hate Todd. If we're talking all characters, Judah
Theres nothing you can do or say that would make me hate Mr Peanut Butter
Mr Peanutbutter, I’ve seen analysis after analysis trying to convince me that he’s the devil but I still think he’s hilarious, I understand why some people despise the character though, I just think the absurdity of his endless positivity never gets old
Beatrice Horseman. I know she was a shitty mom and Bojack deserved better, but after her flashback episodes all I feel is sorry for her. I want to punch her dad in the face, put her mom in therapy and get her some Plan B (sorry Bojack) so she can marry that nice goat guy 😭
Bojack. Despite all the shitty things he does, I relate to him too much to hate him. Weird, because I hate myself for having a lot of the same tendencies,
Out of they 5 main characters I truly never hated any of them, I get the most annoyed with Diane, but that's probably because, until S6 at least, some of her flaws I could see in myself. I dislike Hollyhock and I can't figure out why, I know everyone loves her, so there must be a specific reason, I just can't figure it out.
PC and Diane, if the Diane has no fans then I’m dead
Honey Sugarman. She deserved so much better.
Definitelly Judah, because it felt peaceful anywhere he was. Guy, because he saved Diane in every possibile way. And Todd, even if he left BJ at some point, in the final episode he helped him. He got him out of the party, had a deeptalk and it was just like in the first few episode. Todd's innocence and the fact that he was basically a man-child (Toddler haha) makes it so calm. He is just a little sunshine
Mr. Peanutbutter. The man saved an entire city.
DEFINITELY Hollyhock Manheim-Mannheim-Guerrero-Robinson-Zilberschlag-Hsung-Fonzerelli-McQuack. I love her so much❤️❤️
diane. of course she did and said things that pissed me off but it’s because she’s such a real character. i relate to her so much, i am a daughter of 2 immigrant parents (one being asian), but i was born in australia. i don’t feel any connection to my nationality and no matter how hard i try to connect to my heritage, i feel like a fake and an imposter. i think that people are much too harsh on diane. but i think she’s a badass and she’s authentic (especially in the later seasons, leaving LA was great for her).
I agree- Princess Carolyn for me. As flawed as all of the characters are, she's my favorite, I just love her.
Diane, PC, Guy, Hollyhock
Really unpopular opinion but Todd and Mr.PB. Idk I feel like I love the naivety and Innocence they brought to the show. And bojack himself no matter how much of a terrible person he is, I love him wholeheartedly
Oxnard. The meerkat “accountant” for PB Livin.
Bojack
Yes love PC, also Hollyhock and Diane!!!
PC and peanut butter
PC all the way, I know she’s morally grey sometimes to get ahead “but it’s feminist because I’m a woman!”
bojack. they can never make me hate him
i am a diane defender first, human being second
PC
Todd and PC. I relate to them a lotttt. Judah also. He was so sexy
Diane Nguyen, Sarah Lynn, Todd Chavez, Esteemed Character Actress and Fugitive from the law Margo Martindale, and Bojack Horseman. Diane is perfect, Sarah Lynn is a tragedy, Todd is carefree and fun, Margo is so insane she makes perfect sense and Bojack is so flawed and traumatized but every once in a while you see him try and I just relate to him and understand him too much to ever hate him. theres really no reason i don't see PC as an untouchable character is I don't really resonate with her as much. I love her but she just doesn't pull on my heart strings as much as the others. as for Mr peanut butter, I don't like him at all. he's toxicly positive, ignores others needs and makes things about himself. and on top of all of that, people think that he's a good person just cause he's optimistic and kind, but they don't see through the ruse, leading the people he hurts feeling isolated and invalidated.
they could NEVER make me hate sarah lynn, judah, or pinky
vincent adult man.
diane. also todd. like the only bad things i can think of him doing are making cabracadabra accessible to men and maybe some shit from season 1 that are mostly played for laughs like him joining the aryans and latin kings in prison to name an example.
The two reporters from the last season. I don't care what anyone says. Their back and forth was so funny.