I agree, but will say with the exception of when he got addicted to painkillers he did seem to get better over time.
In the same way the only times we see Bojack show motivation to change is when he drastically fucks something up, generally what helps him to sustain those changes in the rare instances he does is his loved ones. So having a kid might motivate him to behave better imo, both by something he could lose if he fucks up and by being a motivation in his life to get better.
That said, that’s not and really shouldn’t be a kid’s responsibility lol. Just that, within his character arc, I think he would try to be a good father and sustain some changes as a result of that, even though he’d still end up a horrible one, especially at first.
It's depressing how right you are, not just about Bojack but people in general. So many people go into parenthood with the mindset of, "I'm gonna be a better parent than my shitty parent" rather than "I'm going to be the best parent I can be, regardless of comparison."
Can't count the number of times I heard as a kid, "Well, at least it's not like when *I* was a kid and would get beaten senseless with a baseball bat!" Stellar observation, dad, but somehow I'm not feeling like that justifies a belt whooping. So many terrible things were "okay" just because he had it worse as a kid (he legitimately did, but that didn't/doesn't make his actions magically okay) and I feel like that's about where Bojack would end up, too.
Well even if they do go in thinking they'll try to be the best parent ever (as opposed to better than their parent) they can still catastrophically fuck up if they don't heal first.
Yup. I grew up with an emotionally abusive parent who had substance abuse issues, and apparently, I have nothing to complain about because that parent grew up with physically abusive parents with worse (doubtful) substance abuse issues. The fact that I wasn't beaten as a child doesn't take away from the trauma I \*did\* experience, and I refuse to be grateful for the bare minimum things like not being beaten.
I had a father like this- he had a physically and verbally abusive father with a bad drinking habit and a nasty temper. The two barely spoke for decades. And my dad thought he was being the parent he wanted to have by not hitting his kids, not being a drunkard, and buying us extravagant gifts and luxury experiences.
What he didn’t realize is that he was so focused on those aspects that he started falling back on the other faults his dad had- being verbally abusive and having a nasty temper. In the end, while I had a kinder father than he did, he still couldn’t succeed with his children because despite all of the gift giving, it never made up for the insults and vitriol he’d spit at us all his life. His attempt to escape the cycle without truly learning new behaviors only perpetuated it.
I certainly think he would try to be a good father. Ultimately, though, with his alcoholism and narcissistic tendencies, it wouldn’t work the way he’d hoped.
he'd have caused devastating long term issues in any child. my dad was/is an alcoholic, that is not a fun environment to grow up in. kids are also stressful, bojack's lack of healthy coping mechanisms would make this even worse.
and there's no guarantee that he doesn't become a mean addict as a parent. my dad was a fun drunk around others, not so much around us
me too. I think in this episode he cared for the baby because no one else was there to help it but him and he knew he couldn’t just leave it because it wouldn’t let him 😭😭. yes he seems like he would be a good dad but in reality he would scar it the same way that his parents scarred him this is why I think hollyhock being his (half) sister was so much better than him being her father. he got to give her love from being a brother but didn’t have the weight of her being his daughter whenever she was living with him.
yeah same. this is such a small snapshot of him trying to do the right and good thing and putting in the effort out of like 18+ years of a child's lifetime that he would need to do that.
18+ years of a child growing into a separate person who will naturally leave him and who can’t love him in a way that would magically undo his childhood trauma. That child would be born with an impossible job. And the moments when BoJack might be able to act like a good parent would only help a little, but would otherwise confuse the kid and turn their world upside down over and over, leaving them with the impression that they didn’t deserve consistent parental love — causing them to be at risk of being abused, or continuing the pattern of abuse in their adult relationships, or avoiding close relationships entirely because they’ve learned that love is annihilating.
Not that I’m speaking from personal experience or anything.
Well, at least he was an awesome caretaker in this episode. I dont think there was a single thing he did wrong, he really cared for the little guy, and did very well with him! I'd like to think he'd be a good dad, but it's hard to tell for sure, considering the way bojack is, and the amount of trauma he has, and how that trauma has made him behave terribly in dozens of ways.
He *could* have been a good Dad, if he'd worked on all his issues. But as it was, *would* is incorrect.
He says it himself during the eulogy:
> All I know about being good, I learned from TV. And in TV, flawed characters are constantly showing people they care with these surprising grand gestures. And I think that part of me still believes that’s what love is. But in real life, the big gesture isn’t enough. You need to be consistent, you need to be dependably good. You can’t just screw everything up and then take a boat out into the ocean to save your best friend, or solve a mystery, and fly to Kansas. You need to do it every day, which is so… hard.
BoJack would have been able, as a father, to do the grand gesture. He absolutely could not have been dependably good.
I feel like he would project his toxic personality to the kid a little bit but he would be trying to change like a struggle like what he did to hollyhock
I actually think he'd be a lot worse with his own kid. Hollyhock has already been raised, she has a solid, loving, supportive foundation built by her Dads.
BJs own kid wouldn't get that, their foundation would have cracks. BJ would be the best Dad ever for the first two weeks and then get bored, feel trapped and start dipping out. Relationship with the mother would go down the hill as BJ can't hold his abusive tongue anymore and from there BJ would barely see the kid, touting some excuse about "I'm not good enough" or "I'll just mess them up". By the time the kid is 10 BJ has scandalised them by banging their teacher or nanny or something. Kid has seen Dad drunk more times than BJ knows. Once the kid hits pre-teen/early-teen age and starts to develop their ability to question his authority/behaviour it's only a matter of time before they get the BJ verbal abuse treatment.
BJ would try to be the greatest dad ever a couple times a year to try to make up for not being present, being toxic, mistreating the kids mother etc but contact is gonna be limited by the time they go off to college.
I think he COULD have been a great dad, had he dealt with his childhood trauma, did the work and had he decided to go for the girl and the normal life instead of chasing a career as an actor. But would he have been a good dad? No, not in the life he chose. In a different life, yes I think so. He has a caring side and he's fundamentally someone who wants to be good, but he's his own biggest enemy.
He’d have had good moments and good spells but is ultimately too selfish and flawed to be a consistent care giver. Look at his relationship with Hollyhock
That’s a key theme of the show. Poor guy is tortured because he badly desires the life of having a wife and kids and a loving family. But he has no idea how to love or receive love because of his toxic upbringing and all the sycophants who try to worm into celebrities’ lives. Sifting through those sycophants to find your real friends is hard to do. This is illustrated nicely when you take the four purest relationships Bojack had that we see: Herb and Charlotte, who were his friends before he was famous. Wanda, who just got out of a coma and didn’t know Bojack was a celebrity. And the seahorse baby, who was a baby. He had a chance despite his upbringing but his low emotional intelligence made it impossible once he became famous.
Compare with Vance Wagoner who is seemingly happy living his worst life. Bojack is stuck in that life and desperately wishes to escape and change and experience normal life but cannot do so.
That’s why I consider the fact that his Hollywood friends are turning the page from him and his reputation is completely irreconcilably ruined to be a happy ending. He will finally and permanently Escape from LA and have a chance to work on his real dream, which is to find a loving partner.
I think when he's focused he could be a good anything, the problem is he rarely ever focused on anything beyond himself long enough. Fatherhood requires a lot more attention than Bojack could ever muster.
Can you imagine if his son started to be successful at all? And was looking like he’s going to be more successful than BoJack? Nearly no chance he’d be good.
He would be a good babysitter, when he isn't busy doing anything else, doesn't get distracted, didn't know in advance that he would be asked to baby sit and in general isn't asked to baby sit. He needs a situation that demands temporarily his protection skills. He needs to know that he won't need to sacrifice a lot of time (as in several days) and he needs to know that it's a one time thing. Bojack is selfish but when he knows this is his mission of the day and there is literally no other person to do this exact job, then he might do Allright
Also important that he was kinda unable to drink or taking drugs easily in this situation, hell he couldn't even talk. There were soooo many restrictions in place so that he was barely able to do one nice thing for a short amount of time
Maybe with decades of therapy. Also, narcissistic parents absolutely love children when they're under about 2 years old. That love diminishes when the child is old enough to start having their own opinions, developing their own distinct personality, and acting contrary to the wishes of their parents.
OMG excellent point. A lot of people point to a character with a baby as evidence that they'd be a good parent long-term. But nobody romanticizes parenting a tween because they can't accept the reality of living with someone developing a distinct sense of identity. BoJack would suck at that, given his track record with healthy boundaries around teenagers.
I really think he could go either way. Some people get motivated to clean up their lives when they have kids. Others fall back into their worst tendencies and take it out on their children. There are many possibilities.
I had a father with serious addiction issues, and no, he wouldn’t. He was a very loving father, but addiction makes someone unable to show that love in a consistent and reliable way.
Depends on which season he starts being a dad. But, we are talking to the dude who left hollyhock to drink for days at a time. I don't think it would be that bad since his mom wouldn't be in his house while he raised a kid. But he's an alcoholic. Unless this is pretty much the last season, the disease is going to take over, and the kid will suffer. Maybe not outright neglect, but eventually, the kid will figure out they're being ditched for alcohol, and that does a number on a kid. Plus, this is the dude who gave teenagers alcohol and gave them stronger stuff than they'd originally intended to drink. How soon will he give his kids alcohol? Or will he not outright give it to them but ignore it when they drink at 7 because he started sooner?
This hasn't even gotten into what behavior bojack is modeling for his kid. For starters, he's showing a very unhealthy mindset about alcohol that's being passed to the kid. Then we got all his other toxic behaviors, such as his attachment issues (todd), his self-esteem issues, and just how he sees people in general. Remember how he told hollyhock to treat her friend in the episode right before he became a teacher? Or what about the episode where he shows up to an engagement party and gives horrible advice about love? All those things are going to be said to his kid, and the kid won't have the stable upbringing hollyhock had to realize that's wrong.
All in all, maybe one day bojakc could be a decent parent. But not the bojack we see in the show. Bojack still has ork to do on himself that would be passed down to the kid.
I have some much younger siblings, so I grew up babysitting them, changing their diapers, feeding them, etc. The way I describe the responsibilities of a parent and the responsibilities of an older sibling is that all an older sibling has to do is make sure the kids don't die, whereas the parents' job is to make sure the kids grow up to be good people. Bojack can sometimes do the job of an older sibling. He hasn't shown that he's capable of doing the job of a parent.
He could have been, but he'd need to have done so much work on himself before he could be a good dad in all conditions.
Being a parent is hard, there's lots of ups and downs and as we see throughout the show BoJack can't handle lots of different situations. Seeing him try and help the seahorse kid and seeing his own imagination with Charlotte and their child, I agree that he had potential to be a great dad. I like to pretend after the show ended he found his way, maybe not becoming a parent but a teacher.
I think he would try and it would go horribly. He has been incapable of putting someone else above himself which is what he needs to do to raise a kid. And now that he’s recovering, any slightly difficult thing is likely to send him off the edge since he’s barely gotten better
As the show itself says, the grand gesture is not enough, you have to be consistent.
Bojack was good with the baby for one episode, but I disagree that he would be able to rein in his worst impulses long enough to actually raise a child.
Oh dear God no, it's like whomever said it's not about the grand gestures about the everyday. Bojack could be a good dad at moments but he was still a drug addicted, alcoholic, neglectful mess.
Definitely disagree, mostly when I remember that "if you're raised with an abusive man in your house, there'll always be an abusive man in your house."
There's one episode where the bus comes to pick up spongebob and keeps leaving him unhumanly quickly, and in hilarious ways. They referenced that when the bus driver dropped of bojack, and then came back WICKED quickly to throw the book at bojack that he used to help the seahorse father give birth. In the same spongebob episode, there's a bunch of eyes in the dark, and spogebob and Patrick are terrified, only for the lights to be turned on and we are shown it's one person with a BUNCH of eyes. They referenced that when bojack and the baby were in the underground cave, and the eyes were just one guy drinking a soda, and if I remember correctly, he was even drinking a soda in the spongebob version. And the last one that I noticed (I may have missed some of the spongebob references) was the spongebob episode where a jelly fish that spongebob had caught and then let go, wouldn't leave spongebob's side. Spogebob procedes to use an actual slingshot (😂) to sling the jellyfish away. He pats his hands as people do when they do something that was easy, and when spongebob turns away from the camara to walk away, we see that somehow, even tho spongebob literally slingshotted him away, he is attached to spongebob's back. We see this referenced when bojack sits the seahorse down, tells him to stay, and as he's walking away, the seahorse somehow emerges from bojack's jacket 😂😂 and all of these spongebob episodes where from the golden era of spongebob, when the original spongebob creator was still in charge, and before he passed away.
No he wouldn't. BoJack was nice to a baby for a day, just like Beatrice.
But BoJack also had a somewhat of a father-son relationship with Todd, and he wasn't nice to him.
Besides, he has a problem with alcohol with an drugs.
Maybe just an uncle who’s good at babysitting? The whole grand gesture but being consistent is hard thing, consistency is important when raising children id imagine, but nothing is black and white maybe he could be, I didn’t write the show
if he dealt with his issues and stopped drinking and the drugs and everything else then yes. he was briefly to the little seahorse. he wasn't HORRIBLE to hollyhock and i personally will NOT blame bojack for beatrice basically drugging hollyhock but he was a bit of a mess with hollyhock, but i personally didn't think it was too bad.
long term though i dunno. i am in the middle of season 5 rn so yeah lol.
We saw what BoJack was like when he thought he was a dad. Within the first week, he
* told Hollyhock that he would've aborted her if he could go back in time
* had sex in front of her and climaxed when she called him disgusting
* told her the boy she liked wouldn't wanna be with her because she looks like a blob
And then over the next two months or so, he allowed her to get drugged without noticing any of the warning signs.
I'm gonna go out on a limb and say no, I don't think he would be a really good dad.
he would have been a great dad in a world without chaos. in a world without alcohol, drugs, fame and attention and just without things really going wrong. if it was just him and his kid with everything stable and all he had to focus on was his child, he would have been a good dad. we see this when he's in Wesleyan, sober, away from fame, in a routine, secluded, and with a healthy support system, with little conflict. he consistently shows up for hollyhock and is actually a very good father figure. learning her interests, being involved in a healthy way and most notably, when she quicks, he just accepts it and wants to find a new way to bond, something most parents wouldn't do. also, when Hollyhock pushes him away, he doesn't spin out like he normally does, he stays for her and is still healthy for her. fish out of water is a good example of him overcoming conflicts for a child-figure, but it doesn't show consistentency. at Wesleyan he's healthy, strong and a really really good brother, friend and teacher. but when conflict hits and the prospect of fame return, he lacks the stability and confidence to withstand it, and reverts to his old toxic patterns.
If by “good dad” you mean “fun, barely-involved father that’s the ‘fun parent’ only cause they only see the kid once a month for a couple hours”, then yes I agree.
I feel like he could capably care for a child in small doses, but as a full or even half-time parent, he would not be a good parental figure. He’s more of the fun uncle type.
Bojack's tried acting like a parent a few times, with various levels of success. But Bojack's relationships tend to have a lot of blurred lines.
With Sarah Lynn, he literally played her father while taking on a (very bad) mentor role with her off camera. When she's grown up, he doesn't treat her like a daughter. That makes it easier to go on benders with her, and you know the rest.
With Penny, she was the daughter he imagined he could have with Charlotte, but she was also a prom date, and also the spitting image of his longtime crush. So it made it possible for him to cross that line.
With Hollyhock, she was nearly an adult with plenty of baggage of her own, and she straight up told him she wasn't looking for another dad. That was always going to be a blurry relationship, but when Bojack was acting more like a father with her, it mostly worked. And in the end, it was severed by an external situation.
But when his relationships are less complicated, like with the seahorse baby and his students at Wesleyan, that's when he excels. We've seen that he can be proud and protective and supportive, without succumbing to his baggage. He has it in him to break the cycle.
So maybe a younger kid would have kept him grounded and on the wagon. Or maybe his narcissism would have pressured his kid to overachieve to feed his own ego. Or maybe he would have relied on the kid for his own emotional needs and made another blurry relationship - like a son but also a friend/peer. But that would have been something to see.
If u mean the letter in S6, I’m guessing yea. All the writers want us to see is Bojack is severed from Hollyhock’s life (at least in that point in the show). There’s no telling what’ll happen later on.
And Bojack wouldve reacted differently if the letter said she died lol
My take:
We see his relationship with Todd to show that Bojack can be a dick of a roommate, but ultimately there’s no “scarring” abuse beyond the constant “shut up Todd” or being a dick occassionally. Point is, Todd is fed up with Bojack but not traumatized. If there’s someone in a house with Bojack, thru Todd we see of taste of what that’s like.
Then there’s Hollyhock. At first Bojack displays no connection with her and saw her as just another roadblock he should go through but towards the end grew closer to her. And Beatrice was a wrench in their dynamic. Bojack grows to be a little more protective (Miles) and careless with how he handles things (the doll). But as we approach end of s4, its fair to say he’s a little “influenced” by the entire arc with hollyhock.
Like it helps answer, if Bojack had a relationship, how would he handle it? Maybe not perfectly, but he certainly wouldn’t wreck havoc.
S6 Bojack shows how affectionate he can be as a professor, showing genuine connection with his students and Hollyhock. He’s the closest we can see of Bojack being an outright father-figure to ppl around him. Some would say the “happiness” wouldn’t have lasted long regardless of the 2nd interview. Others may say that could’ve been enough for Bojack to reform.
Bojack before S6 has a pattern of selfishness and putting his needs before others and seeking instant gratification despite how it may hurt others. His concern for his own well-being would wreck those around him (including Todd). S6 Bojack, irdk how it woulda gone. What if Hollyhock didnt meet Pete repeat? How would things have ended btwn them if not for the 2nd interview?
Anyway, my answer is “s6 bojack would’ve maybe probably not been a horrible horrible father and he WOULD’VE certainly been better than Butterscotch”
If bojack had a wife who was responsible who could do most of the heavily lifting I’d say him as a dad could work, just don’t let him be fully responsible for the kid or you’ll get home one day and the house will be burned down
I believe if Bojack left his other life above ground and stayed with that child and kept it he could have been a good dad because he already had a connection to the kid. But really in any other circumstance I feel like Bojack would be bad
So Bojack and I have a lot in common (you might be thinking to yourself: "Oh, so you're a shitty person?" and the answer is yes) and I legit think he approaches it the same way I do. You really, really want to be a dad but know you need to get your shit together. So when opportunities to be a father figure emerge you actually do AMAZING but you aren't willing to inflict the pain of having a father who doesn't have their shit together on someone. Because you had a shitty parent or parents.
The seahorse episode really breaks me because I know that feeling of just. . .looking on that family who is so stressed and annoyed and working and like "what the fuck did I get into" and just wanting it so bad and knowing you aren't fit enough. Knowing you are a hedonistic asshole but having just the bare minimum amount of compassion and love for others to know you shouldn't inflict that on someone innocent and pure. But when you get the chance to father, to nurture, you take it.
Bojack, as in the show (as opposed to what, IRL, stupid phrasing. Whatever), would NOT have been a good dad. And he knew that. But he wished he could have been a good dad. And he could've been a good dad. You just have to work really hard to become that sort of person and he knew that.
BoJack would try, but as we know him through most of the series he would fail.
BoJack self sabotages, he would try, sincerely and earnestly, but the entire time he would be looking for the child to turn on him, to see him as a stupid piece of shit, and to leave him. If this doesn’t happen BoJack would begin to view the child with contempt, as stupid because the child cannot see that he is a stupid piece of shit. From there it’s the yo-yo of BoJacks relationships, push away, pull back in, push away, pull back in. The kid would become seriously fucked up.
Eventually the relationship would probably devolve into BoJacks relationship with Todd, hating them to stay, dreading them to leave. Build up, sabotage, build up, sabotage. And the child would most likely leave. Would eventually go no contact and BoJack would get the answer he wants:
That he is a stupid piece of shit unworthy of love.
“Sometimes, you open up a wall and it’s INCREDIBLE.” -Princess Caroline
He definitely shows flashes of being a good dad, and a good person, but they were few and far between.
The one we see in the show, probably not super awesome. But if he'd ever met someone to settle down and have kids with earlier in life, I think he absolutely would have gotten his shit together. I long for the life he could have had with someone who completes him and without alcoholism and Herb getting fired.
No
Bojack would do just enough for long enough to feel good about himself, and he'd overcome *some* obstacles, but as soon as he realized it would be years of toil and struggle it would start to pile up and he'd end up hurting or letting down his child in one way or another.
I'm so glad this many agree with me BoJack would have been a terrible father. He did fine job caring for that seahorse baby momentarily but actual parenting requires you to be that top quality caretaker (or at least doing your best at it) for much longer time and every single day, even when it is the most ungrateful job in the world.
This is why I don't find his first season fantasy about quiet family life with Charlotte in Maine all that wholesome. He only pictures heavily idealized best snippets of that life: the picturesque snowy scenery, happy romantic moments, only those times when his beautiful daughter adores him and is happy... It's natural to mostly focus on just the nice parts of a life goal of course, but what would have the reality been like? How would he have handled rockier times in Charlotte and his relationship? What would have happened when the child would have thrown a tantrum as children do? Or when they simply would have grown up into someone who couldn't perfectly meet his vision of an ideal child? Also, I'm pretty sure if he actually had left Hollywood for Charlotte in his youth his wife and child(ren) would have become constant targets of his bitter rants "I could have been a world famous star if I hadn't been stuck with you! You forced me to give up on my dreams!"
Bojack clearly thinks kids are adorable and likes the idea of being a good father (see Fish Out of Water and the episode in which he imagines he and Charlotte have a daughter.)
If you want a real look at what Bojack would be like as a father, see how he behaves towards Sarah Lynn and Hollyhock. Those were the two children to whom he tried to show emotional support and failed miserably.
I think I agree with you purely because of Bojack's friends.
PC would arrange for playdates and force Bojack to devote a day or two every week for family friendly events
Mister would shower them with gifts
Todd would encourage spontaneity and point out when Bojack needs to let the kid be independent
Dianne would be sensitive to the kid's mental health needs and acknowledge their inevitable neurodivergence (idk what the stupid pos syndrome is but it's obviously a paternal trait)
Some of the minor characters' struggles would potentially provide insight as well such as the Penguin Publishing Penguin not getting to be around his kids
I know some might disagree because of the stupid decisions he kept making, but having a family might have distracted him from being toxic…? Possibly? He pretty much mentions how worthless he thinks he is, and I know people who have felt the same, but surprisingly becoming a parent changed them for the better but who knows.
I don't think a good one is a word to describe it, but I don't think he'll be a TERRIBLE one as well. I feel like he'd be pretty decent IF he works on himself and sobers up. I can tell he would be a little affectionate at times.
This episode was remarkable. It’s the moment I stopped watching by myself and told my wife we were starting together from the beginning. And now she loves it.
Nope because unlike the running every day it gets harder, and you still have to do it every day.
Bojack would head for the hills the first time things got hard and PC wasn't there to bail him out.
The entire point of the show is the importance of consistency, and how you have to be consistently good. Raising a child is the pinnacle of this. Anyone could have a moment where they seem like a good parent but it’s the times where it is difficult to be a parent when you see if you really would be
He would have been a good uncle. Not a primary provider. He was good to the little seahorse but good with someone else’s kid does not necessarily make a good parent imo
in the episode where he goes on the writing bender with sarah lynn and todd…and we see the “what could have been” with charlotte in maine, i absolutely agree.
End of the series bojack could be an uncle, i think if he didn’t see the kids that much he’d be able to compose himself for their visits and keep himself in check. For short periods of time bj can show his gentle and responsible side, such as with the seahorse kid, but he needs to be limited to short interactions
Let's see how he treated his half sister
The only day they got to spend the day together after a long time, he ruined it by dragging her along in search of drugs, that he really didn't need, and when she asked him to only take them if she needs them, he got himself into a car accident.
He had good intentions with Hollyhock but good intentions don't make a good father or brother.
U can’t really take this episode as an example because he was only with this random kid for a few hours and was helping him get back to his dad if Bojack was with a kid that he couldn’t drop on someone else for years he would treat it terribly
I think he would try to be a good dad. Try more than anything else. But I don't think anything we've seen in the show supports that he would be a good dad. He's too self centered and self destructive.
I think he could be a good uncle. He can have fun adventures but couldn’t be a main caretaker because he wouldn’t show up every day or put someone else above himself on a day to day basis
Bojack always gets in his own head when he thinks about his own genetics and upbringing. He didn't have any reason to think about those things with the seahorse child so he didn't overthink it. He definitely overthought it with Hollyhock. It's a 50/50 for me. He has the potential but not the mentality needed to move out of his own way.
He might make a really good horseman after doing time. I like to think that would have given him the reset he often needed, to put things in perspective.
Probably not though. Assholes gonna asshole.
I think had he gotten clean and went to therapy way early on to deal with his trauma and became a better person sooner, I agree he would've been a good dad.
My dad had some childhood issues but nothing anywhere near the issues Bojack had and he’s still an absolute shit father. I would say with 100% certainty that Bojack would leave his kids traumatised, with an unhealthy attachment style and an absolutely crippled self-esteem.
Fish out of water is one of my favorite episodes, and it is extremely heartwarming. But this is probably on of the worst takes I've seen here in a while.
Maybe if things were different I can see him being a really good dad but him not holding himself accountable for past mistakes always seem to hold him back maybe if he had the same fate as hollyhock he would have been different
Er, no. He'll be an improvement over his POS parents, but not by much. Look at how he treated his metaphorical children in the show itself: Sarah Lynn, his oft-stated to be daughter figure? He was a neglectful dick to her in their Horsin' Around years and let's not get into what happens between during the series itself before that unforgiveable little whammy Bojack's responsible for. Todd, the closest thing he has to a son? Bojack abuses him and treats him like dirt, almost the same way Butterscotch used to treat him as a kid. Let's not forget the time he was mistaken as Hollyhock's father and we all know how that turned out.
Unless Bojack resolves his personal issues, neediness, addictions, and selfishness, and until he personally grows up mentally and emotionally, all he'd do is just pass on the damage his parents inflicted on him to any potential children he could have, intentionally or not, just like how he treats his friends in the series. To his credit though, unlike Beatrice and Butterscotch, Bojack at least never gave up on *trying* to be the decent person he's always wanted to be and that he's more than capable of demonstrating selfless kindness and a caring heart for his loved ones every once in a while, but he *really* needs to overcome himself, his past, and his vices more for that positive side of himself to show up more so he can qualify as a potentially good father to any potential child he could have.
yeah, I think the disconnection actually helped him in this episode. since it's just some random baby, it's not related to him and he doesn't have to constantly feel guilty and project his self-hatred.
He would be a good dad in the way Walter White is a good dad, not at all. He would be proficient at changing diapers and doing the manual labor but when it comes to emotional issues and support HELL NO!
No, but he would be a well meaning dad. In practice he would love his kid but be extremely emotionally hot and cold, super inconsistent and possibly verbally abusive. Maybe when he has like 10 years sober but by then he’ll be in his 60s.
He definitely likes the idea of having something not only cling onto him as a responsible figure for support, moral guidance and more, possibly seeing him as their personal hero or their favourite person, but he also likes the idea of having something to watch over and take care of. That is also shown with his cactus when he goes to rehab. He says, “do you think my cactus will be okay if I’m not there for 6 weeks?”, maybe it’s a stretch but he definitely loves taking care of things and people and watching them grow, and it also makes him feel much less alone. But, in retrospect, and in the troubles that come with having a child, he would spiral. He is very much better off as a plant dad.
I do not.
There's a huge difference between taking care of a child for an afternoon and parenting.
Bojack had problematic relationships with everyone in his life. Putting that shit on a kid who's trying to grow up themselves would have been horrible.
Not to trauma dump; but as a kid who was self isolated, I don't think Bojack would make an effort to make a connection at least in a constant or special way, where my paranoid brain would think be loves me. I love this show and I completely get what you mean, and people can be different under different circumstances
Personally I don't think I'm even close to being a parent myself, you have to be emotionally there, and I think Bojack has been emotionally lost.... For a long time Bojack has been dazing into that emotional abyss of pain, depression, and remorse, it is hard to fake it till you make it. And I think it's sometimes possible for him to say the right things at the right moments, but for how long, and would that result in a child that had a net benefit from hit parenting.
I could totally be off, would love to hear other perspectives
He was, briefly, thought to be Hollyhock's dad and he was a disaster
I agree, but will say with the exception of when he got addicted to painkillers he did seem to get better over time. In the same way the only times we see Bojack show motivation to change is when he drastically fucks something up, generally what helps him to sustain those changes in the rare instances he does is his loved ones. So having a kid might motivate him to behave better imo, both by something he could lose if he fucks up and by being a motivation in his life to get better. That said, that’s not and really shouldn’t be a kid’s responsibility lol. Just that, within his character arc, I think he would try to be a good father and sustain some changes as a result of that, even though he’d still end up a horrible one, especially at first.
I disagree fundamentally
Yeah, I think he'd be a better dad than *his* dad but not a good one, and I'm not setting the bar that low.
It's depressing how right you are, not just about Bojack but people in general. So many people go into parenthood with the mindset of, "I'm gonna be a better parent than my shitty parent" rather than "I'm going to be the best parent I can be, regardless of comparison." Can't count the number of times I heard as a kid, "Well, at least it's not like when *I* was a kid and would get beaten senseless with a baseball bat!" Stellar observation, dad, but somehow I'm not feeling like that justifies a belt whooping. So many terrible things were "okay" just because he had it worse as a kid (he legitimately did, but that didn't/doesn't make his actions magically okay) and I feel like that's about where Bojack would end up, too.
Well even if they do go in thinking they'll try to be the best parent ever (as opposed to better than their parent) they can still catastrophically fuck up if they don't heal first.
Yup. I grew up with an emotionally abusive parent who had substance abuse issues, and apparently, I have nothing to complain about because that parent grew up with physically abusive parents with worse (doubtful) substance abuse issues. The fact that I wasn't beaten as a child doesn't take away from the trauma I \*did\* experience, and I refuse to be grateful for the bare minimum things like not being beaten.
I had a father like this- he had a physically and verbally abusive father with a bad drinking habit and a nasty temper. The two barely spoke for decades. And my dad thought he was being the parent he wanted to have by not hitting his kids, not being a drunkard, and buying us extravagant gifts and luxury experiences. What he didn’t realize is that he was so focused on those aspects that he started falling back on the other faults his dad had- being verbally abusive and having a nasty temper. In the end, while I had a kinder father than he did, he still couldn’t succeed with his children because despite all of the gift giving, it never made up for the insults and vitriol he’d spit at us all his life. His attempt to escape the cycle without truly learning new behaviors only perpetuated it.
At least it’s directionally correct. 🤷♂️
[relevant](https://www.reddit.com/r/TikTokCringe/s/8iUsfpljWM)
The Rusty Venture effect.
I certainly think he would try to be a good father. Ultimately, though, with his alcoholism and narcissistic tendencies, it wouldn’t work the way he’d hoped.
he'd have caused devastating long term issues in any child. my dad was/is an alcoholic, that is not a fun environment to grow up in. kids are also stressful, bojack's lack of healthy coping mechanisms would make this even worse. and there's no guarantee that he doesn't become a mean addict as a parent. my dad was a fun drunk around others, not so much around us
Same. No he would not.
me too. I think in this episode he cared for the baby because no one else was there to help it but him and he knew he couldn’t just leave it because it wouldn’t let him 😭😭. yes he seems like he would be a good dad but in reality he would scar it the same way that his parents scarred him this is why I think hollyhock being his (half) sister was so much better than him being her father. he got to give her love from being a brother but didn’t have the weight of her being his daughter whenever she was living with him.
yeah same. this is such a small snapshot of him trying to do the right and good thing and putting in the effort out of like 18+ years of a child's lifetime that he would need to do that.
18+ years of a child growing into a separate person who will naturally leave him and who can’t love him in a way that would magically undo his childhood trauma. That child would be born with an impossible job. And the moments when BoJack might be able to act like a good parent would only help a little, but would otherwise confuse the kid and turn their world upside down over and over, leaving them with the impression that they didn’t deserve consistent parental love — causing them to be at risk of being abused, or continuing the pattern of abuse in their adult relationships, or avoiding close relationships entirely because they’ve learned that love is annihilating. Not that I’m speaking from personal experience or anything.
lol Bojack is essentially my dad too so ... yeah, personal experience and what not.
I disagree *viscerally*
Well, at least he was an awesome caretaker in this episode. I dont think there was a single thing he did wrong, he really cared for the little guy, and did very well with him! I'd like to think he'd be a good dad, but it's hard to tell for sure, considering the way bojack is, and the amount of trauma he has, and how that trauma has made him behave terribly in dozens of ways.
Upvoting both the original post and this comment... But upvoting this *harder*
I disagree momentarily
i agree with you fundamentally
Came here to say exactly this. Am not disappointed that it's top comment. Thank you for your service.
Just look at his relationship with hollyhock and Sarah Lynn
He should be resigned to the "weird uncle who may or may not be a predator" Stereotype for the rest tof his life, as a condition for parole.
He *could* have been a good Dad, if he'd worked on all his issues. But as it was, *would* is incorrect. He says it himself during the eulogy: > All I know about being good, I learned from TV. And in TV, flawed characters are constantly showing people they care with these surprising grand gestures. And I think that part of me still believes that’s what love is. But in real life, the big gesture isn’t enough. You need to be consistent, you need to be dependably good. You can’t just screw everything up and then take a boat out into the ocean to save your best friend, or solve a mystery, and fly to Kansas. You need to do it every day, which is so… hard. BoJack would have been able, as a father, to do the grand gesture. He absolutely could not have been dependably good.
Press X to Doubt
He would be a cool uncle - that is as far as it goes.
I don’t even trust him with that lmao 😭😭
he was basically penny’s cool uncle and we know how that turned out
yikes 😭😭
Yes yes yes
[Actual video of Funcle Bojack at the kids birthday party](https://youtube.com/shorts/B_CG6pNdzTw?si=SmH3nJ_Mcv-oCeay)
I feel like he would project his toxic personality to the kid a little bit but he would be trying to change like a struggle like what he did to hollyhock
basically him with hollyhock, maybe a tiny teeny tad mature version
I actually think he'd be a lot worse with his own kid. Hollyhock has already been raised, she has a solid, loving, supportive foundation built by her Dads. BJs own kid wouldn't get that, their foundation would have cracks. BJ would be the best Dad ever for the first two weeks and then get bored, feel trapped and start dipping out. Relationship with the mother would go down the hill as BJ can't hold his abusive tongue anymore and from there BJ would barely see the kid, touting some excuse about "I'm not good enough" or "I'll just mess them up". By the time the kid is 10 BJ has scandalised them by banging their teacher or nanny or something. Kid has seen Dad drunk more times than BJ knows. Once the kid hits pre-teen/early-teen age and starts to develop their ability to question his authority/behaviour it's only a matter of time before they get the BJ verbal abuse treatment. BJ would try to be the greatest dad ever a couple times a year to try to make up for not being present, being toxic, mistreating the kids mother etc but contact is gonna be limited by the time they go off to college.
I think he COULD have been a great dad, had he dealt with his childhood trauma, did the work and had he decided to go for the girl and the normal life instead of chasing a career as an actor. But would he have been a good dad? No, not in the life he chose. In a different life, yes I think so. He has a caring side and he's fundamentally someone who wants to be good, but he's his own biggest enemy.
He’d have had good moments and good spells but is ultimately too selfish and flawed to be a consistent care giver. Look at his relationship with Hollyhock
That's a terrible thing to say to a baby!
That’s a key theme of the show. Poor guy is tortured because he badly desires the life of having a wife and kids and a loving family. But he has no idea how to love or receive love because of his toxic upbringing and all the sycophants who try to worm into celebrities’ lives. Sifting through those sycophants to find your real friends is hard to do. This is illustrated nicely when you take the four purest relationships Bojack had that we see: Herb and Charlotte, who were his friends before he was famous. Wanda, who just got out of a coma and didn’t know Bojack was a celebrity. And the seahorse baby, who was a baby. He had a chance despite his upbringing but his low emotional intelligence made it impossible once he became famous. Compare with Vance Wagoner who is seemingly happy living his worst life. Bojack is stuck in that life and desperately wishes to escape and change and experience normal life but cannot do so. That’s why I consider the fact that his Hollywood friends are turning the page from him and his reputation is completely irreconcilably ruined to be a happy ending. He will finally and permanently Escape from LA and have a chance to work on his real dream, which is to find a loving partner.
He'd have good intentions but we all know he'd scar the hell out of a child
You have to be consistently good, that's the hard part.
Absolutely not
Don’t forget that he was basically forced to be sober during this episode. That had an effect on how he acted for sure.
oh my god. i just realized. it’s a sea HORSE. it’s a SEA horse. it’s the undersea equivalent of a horse. boatjack horseman…
Interacting once with a kid doesnt turn you into a good dad
I think when he's focused he could be a good anything, the problem is he rarely ever focused on anything beyond himself long enough. Fatherhood requires a lot more attention than Bojack could ever muster.
Can you imagine if his son started to be successful at all? And was looking like he’s going to be more successful than BoJack? Nearly no chance he’d be good.
He would be a good babysitter, when he isn't busy doing anything else, doesn't get distracted, didn't know in advance that he would be asked to baby sit and in general isn't asked to baby sit. He needs a situation that demands temporarily his protection skills. He needs to know that he won't need to sacrifice a lot of time (as in several days) and he needs to know that it's a one time thing. Bojack is selfish but when he knows this is his mission of the day and there is literally no other person to do this exact job, then he might do Allright
Also important that he was kinda unable to drink or taking drugs easily in this situation, hell he couldn't even talk. There were soooo many restrictions in place so that he was barely able to do one nice thing for a short amount of time
I think the best decision he ever made was not having any children of his own
for a day
He really wouldn’t
Maybe with decades of therapy. Also, narcissistic parents absolutely love children when they're under about 2 years old. That love diminishes when the child is old enough to start having their own opinions, developing their own distinct personality, and acting contrary to the wishes of their parents.
OMG excellent point. A lot of people point to a character with a baby as evidence that they'd be a good parent long-term. But nobody romanticizes parenting a tween because they can't accept the reality of living with someone developing a distinct sense of identity. BoJack would suck at that, given his track record with healthy boundaries around teenagers.
Maybe after the show, but not during the time he fantasized about it
I really think he could go either way. Some people get motivated to clean up their lives when they have kids. Others fall back into their worst tendencies and take it out on their children. There are many possibilities.
I had a father with serious addiction issues, and no, he wouldn’t. He was a very loving father, but addiction makes someone unable to show that love in a consistent and reliable way.
i feel like a big reason for making this specific episode was to show that he does have that side to him
If he stayed clean and didn’t relapse, then yes. He could’ve been.
Depends on which season he starts being a dad. But, we are talking to the dude who left hollyhock to drink for days at a time. I don't think it would be that bad since his mom wouldn't be in his house while he raised a kid. But he's an alcoholic. Unless this is pretty much the last season, the disease is going to take over, and the kid will suffer. Maybe not outright neglect, but eventually, the kid will figure out they're being ditched for alcohol, and that does a number on a kid. Plus, this is the dude who gave teenagers alcohol and gave them stronger stuff than they'd originally intended to drink. How soon will he give his kids alcohol? Or will he not outright give it to them but ignore it when they drink at 7 because he started sooner? This hasn't even gotten into what behavior bojack is modeling for his kid. For starters, he's showing a very unhealthy mindset about alcohol that's being passed to the kid. Then we got all his other toxic behaviors, such as his attachment issues (todd), his self-esteem issues, and just how he sees people in general. Remember how he told hollyhock to treat her friend in the episode right before he became a teacher? Or what about the episode where he shows up to an engagement party and gives horrible advice about love? All those things are going to be said to his kid, and the kid won't have the stable upbringing hollyhock had to realize that's wrong. All in all, maybe one day bojakc could be a decent parent. But not the bojack we see in the show. Bojack still has ork to do on himself that would be passed down to the kid.
I have some much younger siblings, so I grew up babysitting them, changing their diapers, feeding them, etc. The way I describe the responsibilities of a parent and the responsibilities of an older sibling is that all an older sibling has to do is make sure the kids don't die, whereas the parents' job is to make sure the kids grow up to be good people. Bojack can sometimes do the job of an older sibling. He hasn't shown that he's capable of doing the job of a parent.
I can see him honestly trying his best, but I also can see him getting arrested for fucking his 16 yo daughters best friends.
Then you immensely misunderstood the show
Did we watch the same show?
Dawg, take a look at every moment with Bojack and Sarah Lynn
If he breaks the cycle would this be possible. Otherwise we'd have Bojack 2.0
Nope
You can't be serious +1*1000
He could have been, but he'd need to have done so much work on himself before he could be a good dad in all conditions. Being a parent is hard, there's lots of ups and downs and as we see throughout the show BoJack can't handle lots of different situations. Seeing him try and help the seahorse kid and seeing his own imagination with Charlotte and their child, I agree that he had potential to be a great dad. I like to pretend after the show ended he found his way, maybe not becoming a parent but a teacher.
I think he would try and it would go horribly. He has been incapable of putting someone else above himself which is what he needs to do to raise a kid. And now that he’s recovering, any slightly difficult thing is likely to send him off the edge since he’s barely gotten better
As the show itself says, the grand gesture is not enough, you have to be consistent. Bojack was good with the baby for one episode, but I disagree that he would be able to rein in his worst impulses long enough to actually raise a child.
Oh dear God no, it's like whomever said it's not about the grand gestures about the everyday. Bojack could be a good dad at moments but he was still a drug addicted, alcoholic, neglectful mess.
Definitely disagree, mostly when I remember that "if you're raised with an abusive man in your house, there'll always be an abusive man in your house."
I think you should watch the rest of the show then
Doubt intensfies
I mean, perhaps, if he got real help for his issues.
The amount of spongebob references in this episode are SO cool.
I haven't watched spongebob in over a decade so I definitely didn't catch any references. Do you have examples?
There's one episode where the bus comes to pick up spongebob and keeps leaving him unhumanly quickly, and in hilarious ways. They referenced that when the bus driver dropped of bojack, and then came back WICKED quickly to throw the book at bojack that he used to help the seahorse father give birth. In the same spongebob episode, there's a bunch of eyes in the dark, and spogebob and Patrick are terrified, only for the lights to be turned on and we are shown it's one person with a BUNCH of eyes. They referenced that when bojack and the baby were in the underground cave, and the eyes were just one guy drinking a soda, and if I remember correctly, he was even drinking a soda in the spongebob version. And the last one that I noticed (I may have missed some of the spongebob references) was the spongebob episode where a jelly fish that spongebob had caught and then let go, wouldn't leave spongebob's side. Spogebob procedes to use an actual slingshot (😂) to sling the jellyfish away. He pats his hands as people do when they do something that was easy, and when spongebob turns away from the camara to walk away, we see that somehow, even tho spongebob literally slingshotted him away, he is attached to spongebob's back. We see this referenced when bojack sits the seahorse down, tells him to stay, and as he's walking away, the seahorse somehow emerges from bojack's jacket 😂😂 and all of these spongebob episodes where from the golden era of spongebob, when the original spongebob creator was still in charge, and before he passed away.
That is hilarious! Thank you.
Of course!
Say sike.
Maybe for the first week but it wouldn't last
Bojack would’ve been a great uncle for sure, but definitely not a good father
Maybe for an afternoon
No he wouldn't. BoJack was nice to a baby for a day, just like Beatrice. But BoJack also had a somewhat of a father-son relationship with Todd, and he wasn't nice to him. Besides, he has a problem with alcohol with an drugs.
Maybe just an uncle who’s good at babysitting? The whole grand gesture but being consistent is hard thing, consistency is important when raising children id imagine, but nothing is black and white maybe he could be, I didn’t write the show
Didn’t he initially try to abandon even this kid tho?
if he dealt with his issues and stopped drinking and the drugs and everything else then yes. he was briefly to the little seahorse. he wasn't HORRIBLE to hollyhock and i personally will NOT blame bojack for beatrice basically drugging hollyhock but he was a bit of a mess with hollyhock, but i personally didn't think it was too bad. long term though i dunno. i am in the middle of season 5 rn so yeah lol.
he was a father figure to sarah lynn and he had sex with her…then let her die.
We saw what BoJack was like when he thought he was a dad. Within the first week, he * told Hollyhock that he would've aborted her if he could go back in time * had sex in front of her and climaxed when she called him disgusting * told her the boy she liked wouldn't wanna be with her because she looks like a blob And then over the next two months or so, he allowed her to get drugged without noticing any of the warning signs. I'm gonna go out on a limb and say no, I don't think he would be a really good dad.
>" >I think Bojack would’ve actually been a really good dad" did we watch the same show? are you actually retarded?
Did we watch the same show?
he would have been a great dad in a world without chaos. in a world without alcohol, drugs, fame and attention and just without things really going wrong. if it was just him and his kid with everything stable and all he had to focus on was his child, he would have been a good dad. we see this when he's in Wesleyan, sober, away from fame, in a routine, secluded, and with a healthy support system, with little conflict. he consistently shows up for hollyhock and is actually a very good father figure. learning her interests, being involved in a healthy way and most notably, when she quicks, he just accepts it and wants to find a new way to bond, something most parents wouldn't do. also, when Hollyhock pushes him away, he doesn't spin out like he normally does, he stays for her and is still healthy for her. fish out of water is a good example of him overcoming conflicts for a child-figure, but it doesn't show consistentency. at Wesleyan he's healthy, strong and a really really good brother, friend and teacher. but when conflict hits and the prospect of fame return, he lacks the stability and confidence to withstand it, and reverts to his old toxic patterns.
If by “good dad” you mean “fun, barely-involved father that’s the ‘fun parent’ only cause they only see the kid once a month for a couple hours”, then yes I agree. I feel like he could capably care for a child in small doses, but as a full or even half-time parent, he would not be a good parental figure. He’s more of the fun uncle type.
Bojack's tried acting like a parent a few times, with various levels of success. But Bojack's relationships tend to have a lot of blurred lines. With Sarah Lynn, he literally played her father while taking on a (very bad) mentor role with her off camera. When she's grown up, he doesn't treat her like a daughter. That makes it easier to go on benders with her, and you know the rest. With Penny, she was the daughter he imagined he could have with Charlotte, but she was also a prom date, and also the spitting image of his longtime crush. So it made it possible for him to cross that line. With Hollyhock, she was nearly an adult with plenty of baggage of her own, and she straight up told him she wasn't looking for another dad. That was always going to be a blurry relationship, but when Bojack was acting more like a father with her, it mostly worked. And in the end, it was severed by an external situation. But when his relationships are less complicated, like with the seahorse baby and his students at Wesleyan, that's when he excels. We've seen that he can be proud and protective and supportive, without succumbing to his baggage. He has it in him to break the cycle. So maybe a younger kid would have kept him grounded and on the wagon. Or maybe his narcissism would have pressured his kid to overachieve to feed his own ego. Or maybe he would have relied on the kid for his own emotional needs and made another blurry relationship - like a son but also a friend/peer. But that would have been something to see.
he would be incredibly neglectful
Imagine looking at the Penny incident and then saying that.
I think he would get there eventually, he would roller coaster on his parenting quality for a good few years
He would *try* to be a good parent, but fail...a lot... comically at times. He'd be a decent uncle though
If he got help sooner, I geniunely think he would've been a decent father.
Is the point of hollyhock for us to not know what happened to her, like she could’ve died or said I don’t ever want to see you again.
If u mean the letter in S6, I’m guessing yea. All the writers want us to see is Bojack is severed from Hollyhock’s life (at least in that point in the show). There’s no telling what’ll happen later on. And Bojack wouldve reacted differently if the letter said she died lol
I loved this episode. Great joke at the end of the episode!
My take: We see his relationship with Todd to show that Bojack can be a dick of a roommate, but ultimately there’s no “scarring” abuse beyond the constant “shut up Todd” or being a dick occassionally. Point is, Todd is fed up with Bojack but not traumatized. If there’s someone in a house with Bojack, thru Todd we see of taste of what that’s like. Then there’s Hollyhock. At first Bojack displays no connection with her and saw her as just another roadblock he should go through but towards the end grew closer to her. And Beatrice was a wrench in their dynamic. Bojack grows to be a little more protective (Miles) and careless with how he handles things (the doll). But as we approach end of s4, its fair to say he’s a little “influenced” by the entire arc with hollyhock. Like it helps answer, if Bojack had a relationship, how would he handle it? Maybe not perfectly, but he certainly wouldn’t wreck havoc. S6 Bojack shows how affectionate he can be as a professor, showing genuine connection with his students and Hollyhock. He’s the closest we can see of Bojack being an outright father-figure to ppl around him. Some would say the “happiness” wouldn’t have lasted long regardless of the 2nd interview. Others may say that could’ve been enough for Bojack to reform. Bojack before S6 has a pattern of selfishness and putting his needs before others and seeking instant gratification despite how it may hurt others. His concern for his own well-being would wreck those around him (including Todd). S6 Bojack, irdk how it woulda gone. What if Hollyhock didnt meet Pete repeat? How would things have ended btwn them if not for the 2nd interview? Anyway, my answer is “s6 bojack would’ve maybe probably not been a horrible horrible father and he WOULD’VE certainly been better than Butterscotch”
No lol
babysitter? perhaps but definitely not a dad
If bojack had a wife who was responsible who could do most of the heavily lifting I’d say him as a dad could work, just don’t let him be fully responsible for the kid or you’ll get home one day and the house will be burned down
Todd would be best
He probably would've if he got his act together sooner instead of letting the worst parts of him consume him.
I feel he's actively demonstrated the completely opposite on at least 2 different occasions.
I think he would have if he got the help he needed.
I believe if Bojack left his other life above ground and stayed with that child and kept it he could have been a good dad because he already had a connection to the kid. But really in any other circumstance I feel like Bojack would be bad
He's be a decent Gaurdian, not a Parent
lol I have my doubts 😂😂
Do you?
So Bojack and I have a lot in common (you might be thinking to yourself: "Oh, so you're a shitty person?" and the answer is yes) and I legit think he approaches it the same way I do. You really, really want to be a dad but know you need to get your shit together. So when opportunities to be a father figure emerge you actually do AMAZING but you aren't willing to inflict the pain of having a father who doesn't have their shit together on someone. Because you had a shitty parent or parents. The seahorse episode really breaks me because I know that feeling of just. . .looking on that family who is so stressed and annoyed and working and like "what the fuck did I get into" and just wanting it so bad and knowing you aren't fit enough. Knowing you are a hedonistic asshole but having just the bare minimum amount of compassion and love for others to know you shouldn't inflict that on someone innocent and pure. But when you get the chance to father, to nurture, you take it. Bojack, as in the show (as opposed to what, IRL, stupid phrasing. Whatever), would NOT have been a good dad. And he knew that. But he wished he could have been a good dad. And he could've been a good dad. You just have to work really hard to become that sort of person and he knew that.
Hell. Fucking. No.
this is an insane take
BoJack would try, but as we know him through most of the series he would fail. BoJack self sabotages, he would try, sincerely and earnestly, but the entire time he would be looking for the child to turn on him, to see him as a stupid piece of shit, and to leave him. If this doesn’t happen BoJack would begin to view the child with contempt, as stupid because the child cannot see that he is a stupid piece of shit. From there it’s the yo-yo of BoJacks relationships, push away, pull back in, push away, pull back in. The kid would become seriously fucked up. Eventually the relationship would probably devolve into BoJacks relationship with Todd, hating them to stay, dreading them to leave. Build up, sabotage, build up, sabotage. And the child would most likely leave. Would eventually go no contact and BoJack would get the answer he wants: That he is a stupid piece of shit unworthy of love.
Hollyhock
“Sometimes, you open up a wall and it’s INCREDIBLE.” -Princess Caroline He definitely shows flashes of being a good dad, and a good person, but they were few and far between.
Well, no…
The one we see in the show, probably not super awesome. But if he'd ever met someone to settle down and have kids with earlier in life, I think he absolutely would have gotten his shit together. I long for the life he could have had with someone who completes him and without alcoholism and Herb getting fired.
Insanely, universally, astronomically difference between "being a dad" and "making sure a random lost kid doesn't kill themselves"
We saw him as a dad when he thought hollyhawk was his daughter. He was bad at it.
He would get anxious about screwing up and then use that as an excuse to drink until he actually screws up.
You either have to be smoking crack, or you are genuinely just as terrible and sociopathic as Bojack to think he'd be a good dad.
No Bojack would do just enough for long enough to feel good about himself, and he'd overcome *some* obstacles, but as soon as he realized it would be years of toil and struggle it would start to pile up and he'd end up hurting or letting down his child in one way or another.
I'm so glad this many agree with me BoJack would have been a terrible father. He did fine job caring for that seahorse baby momentarily but actual parenting requires you to be that top quality caretaker (or at least doing your best at it) for much longer time and every single day, even when it is the most ungrateful job in the world. This is why I don't find his first season fantasy about quiet family life with Charlotte in Maine all that wholesome. He only pictures heavily idealized best snippets of that life: the picturesque snowy scenery, happy romantic moments, only those times when his beautiful daughter adores him and is happy... It's natural to mostly focus on just the nice parts of a life goal of course, but what would have the reality been like? How would he have handled rockier times in Charlotte and his relationship? What would have happened when the child would have thrown a tantrum as children do? Or when they simply would have grown up into someone who couldn't perfectly meet his vision of an ideal child? Also, I'm pretty sure if he actually had left Hollywood for Charlotte in his youth his wife and child(ren) would have become constant targets of his bitter rants "I could have been a world famous star if I hadn't been stuck with you! You forced me to give up on my dreams!"
He gave her a cigarette to chew on
Bojack clearly thinks kids are adorable and likes the idea of being a good father (see Fish Out of Water and the episode in which he imagines he and Charlotte have a daughter.) If you want a real look at what Bojack would be like as a father, see how he behaves towards Sarah Lynn and Hollyhock. Those were the two children to whom he tried to show emotional support and failed miserably.
I think I agree with you purely because of Bojack's friends. PC would arrange for playdates and force Bojack to devote a day or two every week for family friendly events Mister would shower them with gifts Todd would encourage spontaneity and point out when Bojack needs to let the kid be independent Dianne would be sensitive to the kid's mental health needs and acknowledge their inevitable neurodivergence (idk what the stupid pos syndrome is but it's obviously a paternal trait) Some of the minor characters' struggles would potentially provide insight as well such as the Penguin Publishing Penguin not getting to be around his kids
I know some might disagree because of the stupid decisions he kept making, but having a family might have distracted him from being toxic…? Possibly? He pretty much mentions how worthless he thinks he is, and I know people who have felt the same, but surprisingly becoming a parent changed them for the better but who knows.
He’s a good babysitter when there’s literally no other option and it only lasts a few hours but a good dad? Idk.
He would have been a horrible father? I- the fact people think otherwise is insane
I don't think a good one is a word to describe it, but I don't think he'll be a TERRIBLE one as well. I feel like he'd be pretty decent IF he works on himself and sobers up. I can tell he would be a little affectionate at times.
I think he would have been a loving dad but he's too inconsistent and unreliable to be a good parent
This episode was remarkable. It’s the moment I stopped watching by myself and told my wife we were starting together from the beginning. And now she loves it.
No I don't you're right at all
Uhh he literally tried to feed that baby a cigarette. In what world would that make him a good dad?? 😭
Nope because unlike the running every day it gets harder, and you still have to do it every day. Bojack would head for the hills the first time things got hard and PC wasn't there to bail him out.
😭😭
Nah
I don’t lol
geez no he wouldn’t he failed to take care and recognize his ‘daughter’ at like 17-18. how the hell would he take care of a baby
I agree. For like 15-20 minutes
Maybe after rehab, therapy, etc. Before that? Absolutely not, he was an active addict with severe psychological problems!
Did you watch the show?
absolutely not
This episode is probably my fave still makes me sad but reminds me of the underwater highway in omori
for like a day I’m sure of it
The entire point of the show is the importance of consistency, and how you have to be consistently good. Raising a child is the pinnacle of this. Anyone could have a moment where they seem like a good parent but it’s the times where it is difficult to be a parent when you see if you really would be
Yeah. totally should trust the guy that got a bunch of highschoolers drunk in his car and then tried to sleep with one of em have kids 👍
He would have been a good uncle. Not a primary provider. He was good to the little seahorse but good with someone else’s kid does not necessarily make a good parent imo
in the episode where he goes on the writing bender with sarah lynn and todd…and we see the “what could have been” with charlotte in maine, i absolutely agree.
End of the series bojack could be an uncle, i think if he didn’t see the kids that much he’d be able to compose himself for their visits and keep himself in check. For short periods of time bj can show his gentle and responsible side, such as with the seahorse kid, but he needs to be limited to short interactions
I could not disagree with you more
bro did not watch bojack horseman
Let's see how he treated his half sister The only day they got to spend the day together after a long time, he ruined it by dragging her along in search of drugs, that he really didn't need, and when she asked him to only take them if she needs them, he got himself into a car accident. He had good intentions with Hollyhock but good intentions don't make a good father or brother.
U can’t really take this episode as an example because he was only with this random kid for a few hours and was helping him get back to his dad if Bojack was with a kid that he couldn’t drop on someone else for years he would treat it terribly
in that he probably wouldn’t like hit the kid i guess
Absolutely not
I think he would try to be a good dad. Try more than anything else. But I don't think anything we've seen in the show supports that he would be a good dad. He's too self centered and self destructive.
I think that’s extremely naive
I think he could be a good uncle. He can have fun adventures but couldn’t be a main caretaker because he wouldn’t show up every day or put someone else above himself on a day to day basis
Not really. To do something right once in a while is a different story than doing it every day.
Bojack in fact would not have been a good father. He would also be keenly aware he was a bad father and it would cause him to hate himself more.
Bojack always gets in his own head when he thinks about his own genetics and upbringing. He didn't have any reason to think about those things with the seahorse child so he didn't overthink it. He definitely overthought it with Hollyhock. It's a 50/50 for me. He has the potential but not the mentality needed to move out of his own way.
He might make a really good horseman after doing time. I like to think that would have given him the reset he often needed, to put things in perspective. Probably not though. Assholes gonna asshole.
You find me, in a sea of dreams, where no one cares about my words
Nah the issue is that he'd fuck up like everyone does. Then he'd spiral and it would all be downhill from there.
I think had he gotten clean and went to therapy way early on to deal with his trauma and became a better person sooner, I agree he would've been a good dad.
My dad had some childhood issues but nothing anywhere near the issues Bojack had and he’s still an absolute shit father. I would say with 100% certainty that Bojack would leave his kids traumatised, with an unhealthy attachment style and an absolutely crippled self-esteem.
Friendly reminder he took 6 seasons to give me a crossover episode. 😤
Fish out of water is one of my favorite episodes, and it is extremely heartwarming. But this is probably on of the worst takes I've seen here in a while.
I'd explain to you why you're wrong, but instead I'll just link you to episode 1 to the series finale for cititation
you’re not a smart a person then
Maybe if things were different I can see him being a really good dad but him not holding himself accountable for past mistakes always seem to hold him back maybe if he had the same fate as hollyhock he would have been different
Brother did you watch the show?
Er, no. He'll be an improvement over his POS parents, but not by much. Look at how he treated his metaphorical children in the show itself: Sarah Lynn, his oft-stated to be daughter figure? He was a neglectful dick to her in their Horsin' Around years and let's not get into what happens between during the series itself before that unforgiveable little whammy Bojack's responsible for. Todd, the closest thing he has to a son? Bojack abuses him and treats him like dirt, almost the same way Butterscotch used to treat him as a kid. Let's not forget the time he was mistaken as Hollyhock's father and we all know how that turned out. Unless Bojack resolves his personal issues, neediness, addictions, and selfishness, and until he personally grows up mentally and emotionally, all he'd do is just pass on the damage his parents inflicted on him to any potential children he could have, intentionally or not, just like how he treats his friends in the series. To his credit though, unlike Beatrice and Butterscotch, Bojack at least never gave up on *trying* to be the decent person he's always wanted to be and that he's more than capable of demonstrating selfless kindness and a caring heart for his loved ones every once in a while, but he *really* needs to overcome himself, his past, and his vices more for that positive side of himself to show up more so he can qualify as a potentially good father to any potential child he could have.
he would be… until he wouldn’t be
Nah
yeah, I think the disconnection actually helped him in this episode. since it's just some random baby, it's not related to him and he doesn't have to constantly feel guilty and project his self-hatred.
This is probably my second favourite episode
to be fair, in this scene i also thought so but with hollyhock he was a complete disaster.
No, completely and emphatically no.
He would be a good dad in the way Walter White is a good dad, not at all. He would be proficient at changing diapers and doing the manual labor but when it comes to emotional issues and support HELL NO!
No, but he would be a well meaning dad. In practice he would love his kid but be extremely emotionally hot and cold, super inconsistent and possibly verbally abusive. Maybe when he has like 10 years sober but by then he’ll be in his 60s.
He definitely likes the idea of having something not only cling onto him as a responsible figure for support, moral guidance and more, possibly seeing him as their personal hero or their favourite person, but he also likes the idea of having something to watch over and take care of. That is also shown with his cactus when he goes to rehab. He says, “do you think my cactus will be okay if I’m not there for 6 weeks?”, maybe it’s a stretch but he definitely loves taking care of things and people and watching them grow, and it also makes him feel much less alone. But, in retrospect, and in the troubles that come with having a child, he would spiral. He is very much better off as a plant dad.
I do not. There's a huge difference between taking care of a child for an afternoon and parenting. Bojack had problematic relationships with everyone in his life. Putting that shit on a kid who's trying to grow up themselves would have been horrible.
This is the same episode where he gave the baby seahorse a cig to calm down
Hes a rapist pedophile
I'm still sad we didn't get more of this show
Not to trauma dump; but as a kid who was self isolated, I don't think Bojack would make an effort to make a connection at least in a constant or special way, where my paranoid brain would think be loves me. I love this show and I completely get what you mean, and people can be different under different circumstances Personally I don't think I'm even close to being a parent myself, you have to be emotionally there, and I think Bojack has been emotionally lost.... For a long time Bojack has been dazing into that emotional abyss of pain, depression, and remorse, it is hard to fake it till you make it. And I think it's sometimes possible for him to say the right things at the right moments, but for how long, and would that result in a child that had a net benefit from hit parenting. I could totally be off, would love to hear other perspectives