Pray if you want, but if you donāt get off of your knees and connect that man with resources, your prayers are more about alleviating your own suffering that arises from knowing that your acquaintance is subject to the winds and rain of nature when it comes than anything else.
So next time you run into him, instead of using your phone to take a picture of him to post on social media, use it to find mental health and housing resources in the community and see to it that he gets there. If there are none, thatās a whole other issue.
Yeah, carry on water with you too. Many homeless are severely dehydrated and this is the first most important problem because, especially if drinking alcohol, are treading very dangerous territory.
thank you for what you do, I also volunteer at my local food bank, donate money, and also pray for the people I come across. So presumptuous that the commenter assumed you were not doing anything directly for him.
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I was not asking for your judgment. I was asking for your compassion. If you were judging you are not being mindful you are not practicing the path so it is my job to correct you there is the start. There is the end that is it.
Being mindful also requires humility and Iād categorize arguing w/strangers on an internet discussion board as an unskillful way to live.
Take a deep breath, refocus, and realize that the individuals who have commented above me are trying to provide you with advice on how to help your friend. Your anger towards them is unproductive.
I donāt think he was judging you other than making a comment that is mostly accurate when talking about social media. We are on social media.
I would also say that you didnāt tell us anything about this man. Not even his name.
It would be helpful to know his circumstances. Did you ask why he disappears for months at a time? Does he have disabilities? Does he have a job? What did he used to do? Why not? Why did he say he was on the street? Did you give him anything?
I guess you havenāt even told us if you got to know this man or if it was just a friendly passing.
You weren't being judged. You were being provided with advice on how to really help your friend. His words are true, and perhaps hit a chord within you that your defenses and hackles were raised.Ā
Hmmm seems to me that acually letting him sleep on your couch from time to time would be a much better solution that empty prayers. How did we come to be a prayer group. Is actual down to earth real life assistance just to much to hope for?
You can simultaneously provide practical assistance and then Buddhist prayers. Providing someone with their material needs is a form of Dana, but not enough. The person also needs the blessings and protection of good karma that can come from people like us, and the blessings and protection of deities, spirits, and especially Buddhas and Bodhisattvas.
May Avalokiteshvara help this man, and all homeless people. May they attain swift rebirth in Sukhavati.
Namu Amida Butsu š
The blessings and protections ARE us giving practical assistance.
By what magical means do you suggest deities and spirits offer assistance?
We are spirit, deity, and because we are bodhisattvas we offer to help alleviate the suffering of others in a practical manner. There is no "other" there's only us. Thaughts and preyers are just a means of defering responcability to "other".
Buddhism believes in magic like all religions, it's as simple as that. You can call it whatever you like, but Buddhism makes supernatural claims, there's no avoiding that.
Yes they do. If they don't, it's just distorted secularized versions of Buddhism made up by Westerners that are completely divorced from the core Buddhist teachings.
Nothing in the actual, Four Noble Truths, the Eight fold path, or the three jewels specifies belief in in magic. Nothing in the core requires Magical thinking.
Your's is a "No true Scotsman" falicy along with an argumentum ad antiquitatem falicy.
Secular Buddhism is a well established and regarded form of buddhism. Who would you suggest is qualified to reject it as not "Real" buddhism. You Perhaps? That would be opinion. I suspect you're mistaking tradition for truth. If buddhism isn't progressive it fails to be living and simply becomes a tradition, a dead religion. Since acnowledgement of change itself is a cornerstone of buddhism it's essential to the teachings. It's a progressive process based on fixed truths and magical ideas aren't part of those fixed truths.
Do not go upon what has been acquired by repeated hearing; nor upon tradition; nor upon rumor; nor upon what is in a scripture; nor upon surmise; nor upon an axiom; nor upon specious reasoning; nor upon a bias towards a notion that has been pondered over; nor upon another's seeming ability; nor upon the consideration, 'The monk is our teacher.' Kalamas, when you yourselves know: 'These things are good; these things are not blamable; these things are praised by the wise; undertaken and observed, these things lead to benefit and happiness,' enter on and abide in them.
Assumptions Assumptions I happen to work with people sleeping rough myself. No God in Buddhism. So practical help is useful. Some food, a spare sleeping bag, a bit of a chat. All of these things are more real than prayer. Whatever you can do to help a friend.
He is connected with local resources. I really apologize. I shouldāve put that in here. I work at the homeless shelter. I do social workā¦ this picture was taken in Alexandria, Virginia if thatās anybody.
The amount of judgement youāre getting is crazy. Without the context of your job, people went ahead and assumed the worst of you. The job you do is incredibly important and taxing work. Itās easy to get on the internet and say, āwhy donāt you let him sleep on your couch!ā Providing long term, sustainable support for the unhoused population? Not so easy, and not so common. There will *always* be another person in need of shelter, and part of the emotional burden of your job is fully internalizing that you cannot personally feed, shelter, and clothe them all. I worked with foster children who lived in a residential facility. Did I want to foster them all? Make sure they were all well fed when the kitchens made something unappetizing to eat? Of course I did. Now I work with a lot of homeless kids, among other low income children. Do I want to let them sleep in my house? Buy them things to make them feel like theyāre just like their classmates? I sure fucking do. But itās not feasible. And if you try to be a personal savior to every one of them, you *will* burn out, and thatās one less person in the field making a large-scale impact. Iām willing to bet many judgmental commenters do not work in jobs that are half as impactful as yours. Thank you for doing what you do!
I am an accountant working on local, state, and federal grants helping the unhoused, the elderly,
persons with AIDS, childcare nutrition, medicine for seniors, etc.
Without the actions of social workers, the money would not flow.
Thank you for this reminder of dharma.
Hi, wishing your friend shelter and happiness. The hangups people have about words like "prayer" in this sub is kind of absurd. I think that reflects more on Reddit than Buddhism.
Friend I have no idea what you are talking about. Praying for wish-fulfilment, health, protection etc are one of the most common buddhist practices ACROSS ALL SCHOOLS. You are theravada, I am sure you know of parittas prayers or the amulets lay people in theravada countries wear for protection.
We DO in fact wish for protection and help from Arhats, Buddhas, Bodhisattvas and even unenlightened deities like local spirits or gods. In fact, so many suttas and sutras are chanted for by lay people for the specific reason to seek protection against both supernatural and wordly harm. Buddha himself taught in the pali canon which prayers to do in order to receive benefits and so many mahayana sutras list worldly protection as one of the benefits of reciting/copying them.
Many buddhists around the world will pray to their Buddha/Bodhisattva of choosing every other day to wish for health and protection. There exists buddhas and bodhisattvas whose purpose (in traditions) is to be used as a deity that grants protection/worldy salvation/health etc.
On top of these we also regularly dedicate merit to loved ones in trouble to grant them merit in hopes that can elevate them from their current situation. Buddhists ask each other to dedicate merits to their loved ones in bad times all the time. So I don't know where your confusion comes from
Do you have a text where the Buddha explicitly states that parittas can help people at a distance who are unaware that a paritta is being made for them? For me, the important thing is what the Buddha says, not what the traditions say.
>Do you have a text where the Buddha explicitly states that parittas can help people at a distance who are unaware that a paritta is being made for them? For me, the important thing is what the Buddha says, not what the traditions say.
Hi this comment will be a bit direct. It's not a roast/critique of you personally, but there are key points that I feel are worth pondering. So... there are a few problems with your ask:
* We can lead you to texts, but you will most likely just reject them anyway.
* You pit *the living tradition against the textual* when convenient. When this is never how we relate to our traditions as a whole. The living tradition *informs our understanding* of the texts etc.
* There is no unmediated experience of a Buddhist text. No human can bypass the hundreds of generations of people who collated, edited and preserved the texts you refer to. If you are such a human, please report to the closest lab to be studied :)
* You only know what the Buddha said, *because of tradition*. And that tradition, *gave birth to those texts*. There is no other possibility for a human being.
> We can lead you to texts, but you will most likely just reject them anyway.
Not if it's Pali canon.
Yes if it's mahayana/vajrayana.
> You pit the living tradition against the textual when convenient. When this is never how we relate to our traditions as a whole. The living tradition informs our understanding of the texts etc.
Popular, scholastic and comentary traditions regularly distort the Buddha's teachings. Take Channa's suicide, for example, where commentaries reinvent his death from scratch. For me, tradition is not authoritative. What is authoritative are the words of the Buddha.
And there are plenty of Buddhists who think like me. Don't think that all Buddhists think like you. What I'm saying is actually very old ; the Sautrantika already said that (long before Protestantism existed - here I'm referring to some people who believe that Buddhist commentaries are rejected because of Protestantism).
> There is no unmediated experience of a Buddhist text. No human can bypass the hundreds of generations of people who collated, edited and preserved the texts you refer to. If you are such a human, please report to the closest lab to be studied :)
> You only know what the Buddha said, because of tradition. And that tradition, gave birth to those texts. There is no other possibility for a human being.
I agree that the texts we have are partly corrupted. But that doesn't mean I have to trust what tradition tells me. To be clear, when I talk about tradition, I'm talking about the commentary tradition, the scholastic tradition and the popular tradition.
But beyond this specific meaning, of course, I believe that the tipitaka is on the whole authentic (despite some corruptions), and so in a sense it can be said that I accept part of the tradition.
>Not if it's Pali canon. Yes if it's mahayana/vajrayana.
You initial question was already a kind of sea-lioning. You should already know the Pali sources. But if you actually don't know, then that's even more shocking.
>What is authoritative are the words of the Buddha.
You only have buddhavacana because of tradition. You only know of buddhavacana because of tradition.
>To be clear, when I talk about tradition, I'm talking about the commentary tradition, the scholastic tradition and the popular tradition.
All of the above is the reason you have the texts to begin with.
>I believe that the tipitaka is on the whole authentic
What does "authentic" mean here?
>long before Protestantism existed - here I'm referring to some people who believe that Buddhist commentaries are rejected because of Protestantism
It would be an awful waste of time if you were just a Protestant with extra steps...
> You initial question was already a kind of sea-lioning.
No, it's an honest question, there's nothing malicious about it.
> You should already know the Pali sources. But if you actually don't know, then that's even more shocking.
The reason I ask is precisely because I don't know if there's a passage mentioning the "remote effect of parittas on people who don't even know they're being prayed for".
> You only have buddhavacana because of tradition. You only know of buddhavacana because of tradition.
-
> All of the above is the reason you have the texts to begin with.
I don't see how that answers my point.
> What does "authentic" mean here?
Corresponding to what the Buddha thought.
> It would be an awful waste of time if you were just a Protestant with extra steps...
Please rephrase, I didn't understand.
SN 35.87 ( Ven. Bodhi)
> 54 Spk: He cut his jugular vein and just then the fear of death entered him. As the sign of his rebirth destiny appeared, he realized he was still a worldling and his mind became agitated. He set up insight, discerned the formations, and reaching arahantship, he attained final NibbaĢna as a āsame-headerā (samasıĢsıĢ; see I, n. 312).
> 55 Spk: Although this declaration (of blamelessness) was made while Channa was still a worldling, as his attainment of final NibbaĢna followed immediately, the Buddha answered by referring to that very declaration.
> It should be noted that this commentarial interpretation is imposed on the text from the outside, as it were. If one sticks to the actual wording of the text it seems that Channa was already an arahant when he made his declaration, the dramatic punch being delivered by the failure of his two brother-monks to recognize this. The implication, of course, is that excruciating pain might motivate even an arahant to take his own lifeānot from aversion but simply from a wish to be free from unbearable pain.
I recently attended a Buddhist center that took prayer requests. It was one of the reasons I decided that attendance wouldnāt be beneficial to my practice. I donāt know who they would pray to but I suspect itās a more common practice than many of us expect. It was a vajrayana center.
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Namu Amida Butsu šš
May this man be blessed by the deities and Buddhas. May Guanyin never abandon all people that are suffering and lacking in material comforts. Amen.
Buddhism is not the type of religon that do prayers just like that. See the sutta below.
[https://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/an/an05/an05.043.than.html](https://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/an/an05/an05.043.than.html)
"Long life is welcome, agreeable, pleasant, & hard to obtain in the world.
"Beauty is welcome, agreeable, pleasant, & hard to obtain in the world.
"Happiness is welcome, agreeable, pleasant, & hard to obtain in the world.
"Status is welcome, agreeable, pleasant, & hard to obtain in the world.
"Rebirth in heaven is welcome, agreeable, pleasant, & hard to obtain in the world.
"Now, I tell you, these five things are not to be obtained by reason of prayers or wishes. If they were to be obtained by reason of prayers or wishes, who here would lack them? It's not fitting for the disciple of the noble ones who desires long life to pray for it or to delight in doing so. Instead, the disciple of the noble ones who desires long life should follow the path of practice leading to long life. In so doing, he will attain long life, either human or divine.
Thank you very much Bhante, that's very interesting.
However, in a way the "prayers" can be part of the practice no? For example, when we practice metta, we "pray" that certain people will be happy. And metta is one of the practices taught by the Buddha.
So I suppose that in the sutta you're quoting, the Buddha means that simply praying doesn't help. However, prayer articulated in the eightfold path can be useful?
On the other hand, it seems to me that practising metta mainly has a power over ourselves (it purifies our own mind), but it's not going to remotely improve the life of someone who doesn't even know we're practising metta for them.
What do you think Bhante?
Thanks in advance
Spreading metta is not praying. The 11 benefits of metta meditation doesn't seem to cover those people whom the metta is spread to, but more for the one who practises the metta meditation.
> Spreading metta is not praying.
What's the difference? You mean that "to pray" means "to ask deferentially" while "metta" means "wish for a being to be happy, safe, etc."?
> The 11 benefits of metta meditation doesn't seem to cover those people whom the metta is spread to, but more for the one who practises the metta meditation.
Thanks.
According to this [Wikipedia ](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paritta) article, the Buddha recommended giving a kind of blessing to a suffering mother. This might suggest that metta can have an effect on others.
> Another type of paritta relies on the virtue of the individual who is ascribed as reciting the paritta in the Canon, rather than making reference to the virtues of the Buddha. This type of paritta can be seen in the Angulimala [Sutta ](https://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/mn/mn.086.than.html), the story of the murderer-turned-monk Angulimala. On passing a pregnant woman experiencing a difficult labor, Angulimala is moved to provide assistance. Asking the Buddha how he can help, the Buddha tells him to provide a sort of blessing to the woman by reciting a short verse proclaiming his own virtue:
>> Sister, since I was born in the noble birth, I do not recall intentionally killing a living being. Through this truth may there be wellbeing for you, wellbeing for your fetus.
I don't know what to think. In the sutta the Buddha doesn't say that speech will have an effect on the mother.
This might be a good topic for sutta central forum. Do post there and get more monastic inputs from there.
Metta has no expectations (compared to praying). If there's expectation, there is attachment, then there is suffering.
With a mind of metta, we act for the happiness of all beings. When we see them in suffering, we help with compassion. When we see them in happiness, we rejoice in mudita. When we cannot help people in suffering, we maintain our peace of mind with equanimity.
It could be possible that the positive mind states of metta/karuna does help directly those who are sick to be less sick. It might work by the materiality generated by mind, and one would meditate on the body of another. This is healing meditation for others. But from reading Burgs, doing this too much can be dangerous for one's own body. Better to just stick to our own body and imagine metta as a laser of goodness towards others.
For angulimara case, it's called invoking an act of truth. One should speak the truth, maybe due to one's own unbroken, pure morality and say one's wishes.
I think it's a form of miracle and it's not as passive as just praying, but an active sincere act of truth. You can try, I dunno if it will be successful everytime.
Regardless, all these are planting causes to change the results. Not that results will always just follow one's wishes.
Humans praying to gods, one can imagine ants praying to humans, and we put an ant translator machine. Maybe some humans can have some free time to help some ants to move home faster, by transportation, but somethings we cannot help, and most of the time we don't bother to help. Devas maybe like that as well towards humans. It's not reliable. Regardless, ratana sutta did asked the gods to protect the humans who offer things to the gods. And many other chantings as well.
But ultimately, they are all not reliable. Only NibbÄna is the ultimate happiness.
While I do not disagree, I would simply add that anyone can pray.š prayer is common to all religion. I post this to several different forums on this website, not just the Buddhism one. Iām also gonna add that my Jetsumna encourages prayerā¦ you should open your heart, my friend
Listen, I donāt care what your feelings about God. Iām asking you to just send some loving kindness to this poor guy and Iām getting bombarded with all these messages about God this and God that yāall really need to go back and really think about what the Buddha said.
I donāt actually know what your religious beliefs are, as they appear to be a hodgepodge of monotheist beliefs mixed with a dash of Buddhism. While there is nothing inherently wrong with that, I donāt believe either belief system would encourage you to shout down at people for offering advice or offering constructive criticism.
As far as reading what the Buddha said, physician heal thyself. You are asking for prayers in one breath, and yelling at people in the next. It might be time to log off reddit for the day, or maybe meditate for a bit because you appear to be working yourself up with all this shadow boxing youāre doing. Remember, Right Speech.
You mistake me. I was once helping a young lady who was giving birth in a crack house. She was in a lot of pain and was crying out for god. I told her, āGod is not coming. He sent me.ā
What will your friend gain by prayers? God knows his need. You know his need. Why do you not alleviate his suffering if you know it? Be the answer.
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Hello, if you feel compelled to tell me that there is no God or if you feel compelled to tell me that I should not have posted this because yada, yada, yada, yada, yada. My friend gave me permission. I asked if I could he said yes I asked people to simply pray for him. That doesnāt mean you have to convert to Christianity or or whatever religion youāre just just sending loving kindness. Next time you read it, I will be sure to include all relevant information to make sure you sensitive folks out there no that yeah your Buddhist and you donāt believe in God and yeah, I should get him help. My God people are such a joke sometimes grow upā¦. š
May everyone have the basic needs they require to survive. Namo Amida Butsu šā¤ļø
Pray if you want, but if you donāt get off of your knees and connect that man with resources, your prayers are more about alleviating your own suffering that arises from knowing that your acquaintance is subject to the winds and rain of nature when it comes than anything else. So next time you run into him, instead of using your phone to take a picture of him to post on social media, use it to find mental health and housing resources in the community and see to it that he gets there. If there are none, thatās a whole other issue.
Yeah, carry on water with you too. Many homeless are severely dehydrated and this is the first most important problem because, especially if drinking alcohol, are treading very dangerous territory.
[:P](https://www.reddit.com/media?url=https%3A%2F%2Fexternal-preview.redd.it%2FIY9Yb1Ip7SxqhJF3KLJzkTmcFN8lf6b1f7TmjUQiLrU.png%3Fauto%3Dwebp%26s%3D1c2aebb0e26b4ec9a444b5f0be7e10f47ff2f2c5)
I find that there are judgements and assumptions in your comment that are unnecessary. OP mentioned elsewhere that they are a social worker.
Ok. šš¾
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My only recommendation is just provide more info. Clearly you are awesome individual, I donāt think anyone questions that.
thank you for what you do, I also volunteer at my local food bank, donate money, and also pray for the people I come across. So presumptuous that the commenter assumed you were not doing anything directly for him.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
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I was not asking for your judgment. I was asking for your compassion. If you were judging you are not being mindful you are not practicing the path so it is my job to correct you there is the start. There is the end that is it.
Being mindful also requires humility and Iād categorize arguing w/strangers on an internet discussion board as an unskillful way to live. Take a deep breath, refocus, and realize that the individuals who have commented above me are trying to provide you with advice on how to help your friend. Your anger towards them is unproductive.
Itās so funny and sad how this sub specifically has so much bickering, denigrating language, etc.
I donāt think he was judging you other than making a comment that is mostly accurate when talking about social media. We are on social media. I would also say that you didnāt tell us anything about this man. Not even his name. It would be helpful to know his circumstances. Did you ask why he disappears for months at a time? Does he have disabilities? Does he have a job? What did he used to do? Why not? Why did he say he was on the street? Did you give him anything? I guess you havenāt even told us if you got to know this man or if it was just a friendly passing.
they were making assumptions that OP was doing nothing to help him other than this post. I do feel that the comment had judgemental undertones
OP is a rock star for sure. Very few of us have worked at a homeless shelter.
You weren't being judged. You were being provided with advice on how to really help your friend. His words are true, and perhaps hit a chord within you that your defenses and hackles were raised.Ā
I disagree, I do feel like the words were judgemental
Sometimes I run it to him sometimes I donāt see him for a months. šššā„ļøš
Manifest a new reality, change your beliefs, your mindset, your ego, and the mirror will change.
This is not Buddhism. This is some new age mumbo jumbo.
don't you know bro, you can manifest enlightenment if you really want to! /s
Be one with yuri
May the causes and conditions for him to be happy, healthy, and free ripen for the benefit of all beings
Namo Amituofo for your friend
OM TARE TUTTARE TURE SOJA - May all beings be free of suffering.
Sending Prayers
Hmmm seems to me that acually letting him sleep on your couch from time to time would be a much better solution that empty prayers. How did we come to be a prayer group. Is actual down to earth real life assistance just to much to hope for?
"How did we come to be a prayer group?" You are on a religious subreddit. Of course we will advocate prayer.
To whom are you preying?
You can simultaneously provide practical assistance and then Buddhist prayers. Providing someone with their material needs is a form of Dana, but not enough. The person also needs the blessings and protection of good karma that can come from people like us, and the blessings and protection of deities, spirits, and especially Buddhas and Bodhisattvas. May Avalokiteshvara help this man, and all homeless people. May they attain swift rebirth in Sukhavati. Namu Amida Butsu š
The blessings and protections ARE us giving practical assistance. By what magical means do you suggest deities and spirits offer assistance? We are spirit, deity, and because we are bodhisattvas we offer to help alleviate the suffering of others in a practical manner. There is no "other" there's only us. Thaughts and preyers are just a means of defering responcability to "other".
Buddhism believes in magic like all religions, it's as simple as that. You can call it whatever you like, but Buddhism makes supernatural claims, there's no avoiding that.
It depends on the type of buddhism. Not all buddhist hold to magical ideas.
Yes they do. If they don't, it's just distorted secularized versions of Buddhism made up by Westerners that are completely divorced from the core Buddhist teachings.
Nothing in the actual, Four Noble Truths, the Eight fold path, or the three jewels specifies belief in in magic. Nothing in the core requires Magical thinking. Your's is a "No true Scotsman" falicy along with an argumentum ad antiquitatem falicy. Secular Buddhism is a well established and regarded form of buddhism. Who would you suggest is qualified to reject it as not "Real" buddhism. You Perhaps? That would be opinion. I suspect you're mistaking tradition for truth. If buddhism isn't progressive it fails to be living and simply becomes a tradition, a dead religion. Since acnowledgement of change itself is a cornerstone of buddhism it's essential to the teachings. It's a progressive process based on fixed truths and magical ideas aren't part of those fixed truths. Do not go upon what has been acquired by repeated hearing; nor upon tradition; nor upon rumor; nor upon what is in a scripture; nor upon surmise; nor upon an axiom; nor upon specious reasoning; nor upon a bias towards a notion that has been pondered over; nor upon another's seeming ability; nor upon the consideration, 'The monk is our teacher.' Kalamas, when you yourselves know: 'These things are good; these things are not blamable; these things are praised by the wise; undertaken and observed, these things lead to benefit and happiness,' enter on and abide in them.
Please read the comment section before you post my God I work at the homeless shelterā¦ do a little bit of research posting oh my God
Assumptions Assumptions I happen to work with people sleeping rough myself. No God in Buddhism. So practical help is useful. Some food, a spare sleeping bag, a bit of a chat. All of these things are more real than prayer. Whatever you can do to help a friend.
You canā¦do both of those things.
Where are you guys located? Maybe we could help connect him to some local resources
He is connected with local resources. I really apologize. I shouldāve put that in here. I work at the homeless shelter. I do social workā¦ this picture was taken in Alexandria, Virginia if thatās anybody.
The amount of judgement youāre getting is crazy. Without the context of your job, people went ahead and assumed the worst of you. The job you do is incredibly important and taxing work. Itās easy to get on the internet and say, āwhy donāt you let him sleep on your couch!ā Providing long term, sustainable support for the unhoused population? Not so easy, and not so common. There will *always* be another person in need of shelter, and part of the emotional burden of your job is fully internalizing that you cannot personally feed, shelter, and clothe them all. I worked with foster children who lived in a residential facility. Did I want to foster them all? Make sure they were all well fed when the kitchens made something unappetizing to eat? Of course I did. Now I work with a lot of homeless kids, among other low income children. Do I want to let them sleep in my house? Buy them things to make them feel like theyāre just like their classmates? I sure fucking do. But itās not feasible. And if you try to be a personal savior to every one of them, you *will* burn out, and thatās one less person in the field making a large-scale impact. Iām willing to bet many judgmental commenters do not work in jobs that are half as impactful as yours. Thank you for doing what you do!
Heās in my thoughts!
I am an accountant working on local, state, and federal grants helping the unhoused, the elderly, persons with AIDS, childcare nutrition, medicine for seniors, etc. Without the actions of social workers, the money would not flow. Thank you for this reminder of dharma.
Hi, wishing your friend shelter and happiness. The hangups people have about words like "prayer" in this sub is kind of absurd. I think that reflects more on Reddit than Buddhism.
Reddit buddhism. Asian Buddhists and most likely ancient Buddhists have always prayed. Western Buddhism is only meditation and kumbaya I suppose.
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Your intention and points are fantastic.
Let him come live with you.
Prayer said, I hope he finds his way to a good solution
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Friend I have no idea what you are talking about. Praying for wish-fulfilment, health, protection etc are one of the most common buddhist practices ACROSS ALL SCHOOLS. You are theravada, I am sure you know of parittas prayers or the amulets lay people in theravada countries wear for protection. We DO in fact wish for protection and help from Arhats, Buddhas, Bodhisattvas and even unenlightened deities like local spirits or gods. In fact, so many suttas and sutras are chanted for by lay people for the specific reason to seek protection against both supernatural and wordly harm. Buddha himself taught in the pali canon which prayers to do in order to receive benefits and so many mahayana sutras list worldly protection as one of the benefits of reciting/copying them. Many buddhists around the world will pray to their Buddha/Bodhisattva of choosing every other day to wish for health and protection. There exists buddhas and bodhisattvas whose purpose (in traditions) is to be used as a deity that grants protection/worldy salvation/health etc. On top of these we also regularly dedicate merit to loved ones in trouble to grant them merit in hopes that can elevate them from their current situation. Buddhists ask each other to dedicate merits to their loved ones in bad times all the time. So I don't know where your confusion comes from
Do you have a text where the Buddha explicitly states that parittas can help people at a distance who are unaware that a paritta is being made for them? For me, the important thing is what the Buddha says, not what the traditions say.
>Do you have a text where the Buddha explicitly states that parittas can help people at a distance who are unaware that a paritta is being made for them? For me, the important thing is what the Buddha says, not what the traditions say. Hi this comment will be a bit direct. It's not a roast/critique of you personally, but there are key points that I feel are worth pondering. So... there are a few problems with your ask: * We can lead you to texts, but you will most likely just reject them anyway. * You pit *the living tradition against the textual* when convenient. When this is never how we relate to our traditions as a whole. The living tradition *informs our understanding* of the texts etc. * There is no unmediated experience of a Buddhist text. No human can bypass the hundreds of generations of people who collated, edited and preserved the texts you refer to. If you are such a human, please report to the closest lab to be studied :) * You only know what the Buddha said, *because of tradition*. And that tradition, *gave birth to those texts*. There is no other possibility for a human being.
> We can lead you to texts, but you will most likely just reject them anyway. Not if it's Pali canon. Yes if it's mahayana/vajrayana. > You pit the living tradition against the textual when convenient. When this is never how we relate to our traditions as a whole. The living tradition informs our understanding of the texts etc. Popular, scholastic and comentary traditions regularly distort the Buddha's teachings. Take Channa's suicide, for example, where commentaries reinvent his death from scratch. For me, tradition is not authoritative. What is authoritative are the words of the Buddha. And there are plenty of Buddhists who think like me. Don't think that all Buddhists think like you. What I'm saying is actually very old ; the Sautrantika already said that (long before Protestantism existed - here I'm referring to some people who believe that Buddhist commentaries are rejected because of Protestantism). > There is no unmediated experience of a Buddhist text. No human can bypass the hundreds of generations of people who collated, edited and preserved the texts you refer to. If you are such a human, please report to the closest lab to be studied :) > You only know what the Buddha said, because of tradition. And that tradition, gave birth to those texts. There is no other possibility for a human being. I agree that the texts we have are partly corrupted. But that doesn't mean I have to trust what tradition tells me. To be clear, when I talk about tradition, I'm talking about the commentary tradition, the scholastic tradition and the popular tradition. But beyond this specific meaning, of course, I believe that the tipitaka is on the whole authentic (despite some corruptions), and so in a sense it can be said that I accept part of the tradition.
>Not if it's Pali canon. Yes if it's mahayana/vajrayana. You initial question was already a kind of sea-lioning. You should already know the Pali sources. But if you actually don't know, then that's even more shocking. >What is authoritative are the words of the Buddha. You only have buddhavacana because of tradition. You only know of buddhavacana because of tradition. >To be clear, when I talk about tradition, I'm talking about the commentary tradition, the scholastic tradition and the popular tradition. All of the above is the reason you have the texts to begin with. >I believe that the tipitaka is on the whole authentic What does "authentic" mean here? >long before Protestantism existed - here I'm referring to some people who believe that Buddhist commentaries are rejected because of Protestantism It would be an awful waste of time if you were just a Protestant with extra steps...
> You initial question was already a kind of sea-lioning. No, it's an honest question, there's nothing malicious about it. > You should already know the Pali sources. But if you actually don't know, then that's even more shocking. The reason I ask is precisely because I don't know if there's a passage mentioning the "remote effect of parittas on people who don't even know they're being prayed for". > You only have buddhavacana because of tradition. You only know of buddhavacana because of tradition. - > All of the above is the reason you have the texts to begin with. I don't see how that answers my point. > What does "authentic" mean here? Corresponding to what the Buddha thought. > It would be an awful waste of time if you were just a Protestant with extra steps... Please rephrase, I didn't understand.
How do the commentaries represent Channa's suicide?
SN 35.87 ( Ven. Bodhi) > 54 Spk: He cut his jugular vein and just then the fear of death entered him. As the sign of his rebirth destiny appeared, he realized he was still a worldling and his mind became agitated. He set up insight, discerned the formations, and reaching arahantship, he attained final NibbaĢna as a āsame-headerā (samasıĢsıĢ; see I, n. 312). > 55 Spk: Although this declaration (of blamelessness) was made while Channa was still a worldling, as his attainment of final NibbaĢna followed immediately, the Buddha answered by referring to that very declaration. > It should be noted that this commentarial interpretation is imposed on the text from the outside, as it were. If one sticks to the actual wording of the text it seems that Channa was already an arahant when he made his declaration, the dramatic punch being delivered by the failure of his two brother-monks to recognize this. The implication, of course, is that excruciating pain might motivate even an arahant to take his own lifeānot from aversion but simply from a wish to be free from unbearable pain.
Thanks.
Iām confused, I thought we as Buddhist do prayers and chanting? And this is common throughout the Theravada and Mahayana traditions?
Thereās chanting and meditation but I never heard of prayers
Maybe itās our individual definition of the word āprayersā?
I recently attended a Buddhist center that took prayer requests. It was one of the reasons I decided that attendance wouldnāt be beneficial to my practice. I donāt know who they would pray to but I suspect itās a more common practice than many of us expect. It was a vajrayana center.
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Any jobs in the area? what city maybe we can help with that
Sending love and strength to your friend Could anyone please guide me to a prayer group here on Reddit.. thank you
Namu Amida Butsu šš May this man be blessed by the deities and Buddhas. May Guanyin never abandon all people that are suffering and lacking in material comforts. Amen.
May all beings be free of suffering and the causes of suffering! May all beings be safe! May all beings never be separated from happiness!
What prayers do you even do in Buddhism? Who do you pray to?
Buddhism is not the type of religon that do prayers just like that. See the sutta below. [https://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/an/an05/an05.043.than.html](https://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/an/an05/an05.043.than.html) "Long life is welcome, agreeable, pleasant, & hard to obtain in the world. "Beauty is welcome, agreeable, pleasant, & hard to obtain in the world. "Happiness is welcome, agreeable, pleasant, & hard to obtain in the world. "Status is welcome, agreeable, pleasant, & hard to obtain in the world. "Rebirth in heaven is welcome, agreeable, pleasant, & hard to obtain in the world. "Now, I tell you, these five things are not to be obtained by reason of prayers or wishes. If they were to be obtained by reason of prayers or wishes, who here would lack them? It's not fitting for the disciple of the noble ones who desires long life to pray for it or to delight in doing so. Instead, the disciple of the noble ones who desires long life should follow the path of practice leading to long life. In so doing, he will attain long life, either human or divine.
Thank you very much Bhante, that's very interesting. However, in a way the "prayers" can be part of the practice no? For example, when we practice metta, we "pray" that certain people will be happy. And metta is one of the practices taught by the Buddha. So I suppose that in the sutta you're quoting, the Buddha means that simply praying doesn't help. However, prayer articulated in the eightfold path can be useful? On the other hand, it seems to me that practising metta mainly has a power over ourselves (it purifies our own mind), but it's not going to remotely improve the life of someone who doesn't even know we're practising metta for them. What do you think Bhante? Thanks in advance
Spreading metta is not praying. The 11 benefits of metta meditation doesn't seem to cover those people whom the metta is spread to, but more for the one who practises the metta meditation.
> Spreading metta is not praying. What's the difference? You mean that "to pray" means "to ask deferentially" while "metta" means "wish for a being to be happy, safe, etc."? > The 11 benefits of metta meditation doesn't seem to cover those people whom the metta is spread to, but more for the one who practises the metta meditation. Thanks. According to this [Wikipedia ](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paritta) article, the Buddha recommended giving a kind of blessing to a suffering mother. This might suggest that metta can have an effect on others. > Another type of paritta relies on the virtue of the individual who is ascribed as reciting the paritta in the Canon, rather than making reference to the virtues of the Buddha. This type of paritta can be seen in the Angulimala [Sutta ](https://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/mn/mn.086.than.html), the story of the murderer-turned-monk Angulimala. On passing a pregnant woman experiencing a difficult labor, Angulimala is moved to provide assistance. Asking the Buddha how he can help, the Buddha tells him to provide a sort of blessing to the woman by reciting a short verse proclaiming his own virtue: >> Sister, since I was born in the noble birth, I do not recall intentionally killing a living being. Through this truth may there be wellbeing for you, wellbeing for your fetus. I don't know what to think. In the sutta the Buddha doesn't say that speech will have an effect on the mother.
This might be a good topic for sutta central forum. Do post there and get more monastic inputs from there. Metta has no expectations (compared to praying). If there's expectation, there is attachment, then there is suffering. With a mind of metta, we act for the happiness of all beings. When we see them in suffering, we help with compassion. When we see them in happiness, we rejoice in mudita. When we cannot help people in suffering, we maintain our peace of mind with equanimity. It could be possible that the positive mind states of metta/karuna does help directly those who are sick to be less sick. It might work by the materiality generated by mind, and one would meditate on the body of another. This is healing meditation for others. But from reading Burgs, doing this too much can be dangerous for one's own body. Better to just stick to our own body and imagine metta as a laser of goodness towards others. For angulimara case, it's called invoking an act of truth. One should speak the truth, maybe due to one's own unbroken, pure morality and say one's wishes. I think it's a form of miracle and it's not as passive as just praying, but an active sincere act of truth. You can try, I dunno if it will be successful everytime. Regardless, all these are planting causes to change the results. Not that results will always just follow one's wishes. Humans praying to gods, one can imagine ants praying to humans, and we put an ant translator machine. Maybe some humans can have some free time to help some ants to move home faster, by transportation, but somethings we cannot help, and most of the time we don't bother to help. Devas maybe like that as well towards humans. It's not reliable. Regardless, ratana sutta did asked the gods to protect the humans who offer things to the gods. And many other chantings as well. But ultimately, they are all not reliable. Only NibbÄna is the ultimate happiness.
While I do not disagree, I would simply add that anyone can pray.š prayer is common to all religion. I post this to several different forums on this website, not just the Buddhism one. Iām also gonna add that my Jetsumna encourages prayerā¦ you should open your heart, my friend
Does god not already know of his need?
Listen, I donāt care what your feelings about God. Iām asking you to just send some loving kindness to this poor guy and Iām getting bombarded with all these messages about God this and God that yāall really need to go back and really think about what the Buddha said.
I donāt actually know what your religious beliefs are, as they appear to be a hodgepodge of monotheist beliefs mixed with a dash of Buddhism. While there is nothing inherently wrong with that, I donāt believe either belief system would encourage you to shout down at people for offering advice or offering constructive criticism. As far as reading what the Buddha said, physician heal thyself. You are asking for prayers in one breath, and yelling at people in the next. It might be time to log off reddit for the day, or maybe meditate for a bit because you appear to be working yourself up with all this shadow boxing youāre doing. Remember, Right Speech.
You mistake me. I was once helping a young lady who was giving birth in a crack house. She was in a lot of pain and was crying out for god. I told her, āGod is not coming. He sent me.ā What will your friend gain by prayers? God knows his need. You know his need. Why do you not alleviate his suffering if you know it? Be the answer.
That quote goes so fuckin hard
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
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i'll keep him in my thoughts
I don't pray to a person person or a god. I chant NamMyohoRengeKyo, while focusing on a mandala called a gohonzon.
Nano Amituofuo
there is no God to answer you so prayer is useless
Hello, if you feel compelled to tell me that there is no God or if you feel compelled to tell me that I should not have posted this because yada, yada, yada, yada, yada. My friend gave me permission. I asked if I could he said yes I asked people to simply pray for him. That doesnāt mean you have to convert to Christianity or or whatever religion youāre just just sending loving kindness. Next time you read it, I will be sure to include all relevant information to make sure you sensitive folks out there no that yeah your Buddhist and you donāt believe in God and yeah, I should get him help. My God people are such a joke sometimes grow upā¦. š