Yes though always context and level dependent. Stuff like 《非常勿扰》and 《虎妈猫爸》I mostly understand. Some novels require me to look some stuff up because once language gets figurative it's harder. News articles are actually a lot easier IMO.
In 4 years you probably will only know moderate Chinese and possibly reading beginner to moderate level words. I'm not kidding it's that hard. It's my 2nd language. I seriously doubt you would be able to do translation in 4 years but possibly you could if you are a genius and gifted.
Source: Native English speaker but Chinese Is my second language. I used to suck at in in school but gradually improved while learning it in my adult life.
> my plan is study traslation in university where I will learn chinese. In 4 years, how much can I advance?
I'll just point you to a comment I made in r/languagelearning about learning languages in general. The salient point is this:
>[[T]he **total number of hours** spent studying matters, not the **total number of years**, because the same total number of hours can be spread out over a different number of years when you change the number of hours per week.](https://www.reddit.com/r/languagelearning/comments/1dstvro/what_is_a_common_misconception_about_language/lb8qhwl/)
In that comment, I also worked out an example showing how the number of years can change depending on the intensity you study. If you're studying the language full-time, as you presumably would be if you're in university, it's probably not that hard to be able to study 20 hours/week.
Thus, if you're doing your studies consistently, you'd have studied Mandarin for several thousand hours after 4 years at university, which is quite enough to acquire a good reading knowledge of the language for the purposes of translation.
However, it probably won't be easy, and you can expect to spend a lot of time learning the language itself. On the other hand, the demands of translation itself (being able to translate well requires a good knowledge of the source language) would probably be a good motivation for you to learn the language well.
Personal anecdote: spent almost a decade in China without actively trying to learn and maybe learned 30 words in total, and basically zero characters. A few months ago, I started studying every day (using HelloChinese) and am now solidly in HSK 4 territory (1000+ words plus their characters).
Not that person, but if you study a lesson or two a day, you can go up to their HSK 4 materials in a few months. It and SuperChinese are some of the best language learning apps I’ve used/examined. They both have a very good mix of reading, listening, writing, and speaking exercises.
I liked HC (especially the video clips of actual Chinese people speaking), but I decided to go with SC because it was more cost effective for me. I also wanted to try it out since I’d already used HC before (got through level 2 at that time)
> I'm curious about your experience living there and the reasons behind it.
Don't want to go into too much details, but mostly because I like living in China, as simple as that.
> That's a long time to live somewhere without learning the language.
Indeed but it's surprisingly not that uncommon among expats. I know people who have lived even longer in China and who still can't speak Chinese, let alone read/write it. If you don't make active efforts to learn it, you're not magically going to learn it just by living there (especially if you have no solid base).
I would assume that knowing the local language would make time in foreign country much more enjoyable, especially in China where not many can speak English. But then again if you have people around you who you can communicate I guess it won’t make that much of a difference if you’re not able to have a chat with cashier etc.
Just something I’ve noticed when traveling solo through China and not knowing Chinese, it makes connecting with people quite a bit harder. But people are still very friendly and helpful, and they love when you try to make an effort speaking Chinese.
So I think you've received a lot more comments now.
One of the things that I assumed in my answer is that you'll ONLY be studying Mandarin, and that the translation coursework will come towards the end of your degree. That is actually a rather optimistic assumption about the structure of your degree. For the translation degree programs you're considering, what are their structures like?
If that's true, then being able to study Mandarin 20h per week is a reasonable expectation. However, if [what Zagrycha said](https://www.reddit.com/r/ChineseLanguage/comments/1dx8ja3/how_many_years_can_it_take_to_learn_mandarin/lc0ebwy/) is true, and you have to do other classes in addition to your Chinese or translation classes, then you may have to put in extra hours to get to 20h/wk.
Mandarin also has a much steeper learning curve than English or Spanish. There are a lot of things in Mandarin that you may not have encountered in Spanish or English, and many people often struggle with these seemingly basic things, so it's quite easy to get discouraged or frustrated in your quest to learn Mandarin. With good teachers at university, many of these difficulties can eventually be overcome, but you can still expect to put in a lot of work.
You can go to school and don't learn much language. You despair because it has been few years. Then you realize it was only 180hours.
The key to learning language is making habits (as for anything lol). Learn from what interests you, use whole sentences not just words to learn and fck grammar 👍
I think the biggest predictor is how much you use it. I know people who just do flashcards, watch shows, and read for years but can't speak much/well. I also know people who jump in and spend more time on output and using the language who are conversational in under a year.
It's how you use those hours. Personally, I feel an hour of output is worth many hours of passive input. Flashcards are ok, but too many people seem to base all their studies on recognizing characters and not using those characters. Of course, people need a foundation and SRS are good, but check out Paul Nation's Four Strands. I see most people spending the majority of their time in the first strand (meaning-focused input) where he says only spend 25%, but few people spend anywhere close to half their study time on meaning-focused output and fluency development. That is where I see the people who learn more/fast spend their time.
I've met quite a few expats in Beijing that struggle speaking after years, so immersion needs to be output and not just listening.
It depends on you. If you’re gonna work hard, you will learn a lot in 4 years and you will be fluent. If you kept procrastinating, even after 10 years you will learn nothing
I moved to China when I was 24. I'd say that after about 10 months, I was beginning to get pretty fluent and could start working in Chinese. After a year, I was very confident in my Chinese. After 14 months, I went home. Six months later, I returned to China, and for most of my work, I had to use Chinese for reading, writing, and speaking. After another year, I started teaching Chinese to other foreigners. Years later, I no longer live in China but still use Chinese every day to deal with customers.
From day one, I immersed myself in the language and rarely spent any time with other English-speaking foreigners. It can be done quite quickly, but honestly, it requires a lot of dedication. Never translate full sentences; always translate individual characters and learn every meaning and how to use the character. Also, be strict with tones from day one.
I'll be honest I've never really met another "foreigner" that has become fluent at Chinese, so this is just what I did, and it worked for me, it may be different for other people.
The idea of learning characters again from scratch scares me haha
You can do that, but you'd probably end up learning a lot of archaic and very contextual meanings that you don't need to know. Not to mention the characters that don't really mean anything by themselves. I think words are a lot better way to learn, because Chinese people don't think in sentences character by character, it's always words or word clusters.
My first language is English and I grew up in England, but growing up my mum used to always speak to me in Filipino, and my wife now is also Filipino, so we speak bisaya at home. But I'd say my Chinese and my Filipino are pretty close in proficiency.
Think about time spent with the language in hours, not years.
For getting to a high competency, the number that floats about online is 1000 hours for very closely related languages, 2000 hours for somewhat related languages and 4000 hours for languages that are totally unrelated or very distant to your native language.
From anecdotal account it seems to be fairly accurate imo. So over 4 years you should be aiming for like 2-3 hours a day on average.
There's people who have really put the time in and got to a very high level in a year. If you're studying full time and build good habits, doing lots of stuff in addition to your classes, you'll advance very quickly.
this is the only correct answer. measure in hours, not years. lots of people saying 20+ years are probably assuming you’re studying like 30 minutes a day. make it a priority and put in the hours and you can absolutely get to a high level in 4 years. obviously it’s a lifelong endeavor, but if you’re serious about it you can make crazy progress in a relatively short amount of time.
Lot of weird answers on here to be honest that don't really answer OP's question. It's not hard to look up what the general expectations are for students of Chinese foreign language programs.
4 years of full-time studying intelligently with a good language program and you should be a solid C1 which should be perfectly fine for translation. If you slack off you should still be at least B2 (\~HSK6).
Question since you seem to know you're stuff. I'm heading to China right now at around HSK 3 / HSK 4 level and will be taking a Chinese language program at a university for about a year - and I will not cocoon myself with English speakers outside of classes haha.
Do you have an estimate on where I might land at the end of this? B2?
B2 is somewhere around HSK 6 and there's a lot of vocabulary between HSK 3/4 and HSK 6.
I doubt you'll make up the ~3000 difference in a year via classes so it's a question of how much you want to study on your own. Being in China will be good for gaining exposure and you're probably better off talking to people than cramming vocabulary.
>Do you have an estimate on where I might land at the end of this?
If I were to assume best case scenario, you're starting at a solid A2 (\~HSK4) and you do everything right, studying 40+ hours a week, I think achieving B2 (\~HSK6) in a year is doable. Is this a likely scenario for most people? Probably not. I think a more realistic scenario is aiming to be a a very strong B1 (HSK5).
If you go study in China, I think 4 years will be more than enough. If you're just taking classes in your home country, I'm not so sure. I know people who "studied" a language for years but can't even do proper pronunciation.
+1 on this. I study in China, and my Chinese is leagues better than my friends who have studied it for much longer back in my home country. Having an environment where you are constantly exposed to it actively is worth everything.
in four years of university language class people normally get a firm foundation that sets them up for success to continue learning the language in depth after college.
It is totally possible to get an extremely high level in a language in four years. Its not realistic in school though, unless you plan to ignore and fail all your other classes etc for that language learning experience. University language classes are ((usually)) paced with the specific understanding that the students have three or four other classes worth of homework and tests at any given time.
Studied for 12, speak like a 3 year old. Had enough of the adventure and went back to learning Japanese and other languages that will allow me to communicate faster.
Wow you will make me cry. It's been less than a month since I started and I'm able to read HSK 1 passages. I read like 5 of them last night, didn't face much problem. Now idk what to believe 💀
I wouldn’t worry about them. They’re probably taking their time or not making it a priority. There are only 300 words between HSK 1 and 2, at least in the 2nd version of the exam, so it would be trivial to learn those words in 3-6 months if you wanted. You just have to put in the effort
Those first 400 or so words are the most difficult ones, not only because the language is new and very different, but also because it reveals people's learning habits. Chinese really requires people to be dedicated and consistent over long time periods; it's just not going to work out otherwise. Not necessarily decades, but definitely months and years.
Depends how much you study per day and how many opportunities you have to use it. I have a Taiwanese girlfriend for 1.5 years and would probably speak and listen to Chinese for 4 to 6 hours per day. I also studied abroad in Taiwan for 10 months where I was studying for four hours per day after going to class for four hours per day And then I would go and talk with strangers and friends and Chinese so probably using it gor 12 hours a day
So for me after three years, I would say I am completely fluent. I can do everything casual, and even formal. I think my only area for improvement right now is learning more of the book language and also incorporating formal language more into my daily life in the event I need to use it for work
I’ve also seen people study for 8 to 12 years to have reached level lower than me. It really just depends how many hours a day you put in and if use software like anki to remember vocab
I learnt mandarin in Taiwan & worked there, so picked n learnt via practical experience, at end of 5 yrs, could communicate perfectly & even now after 23 yrs, I can talk so fluently that people mistake me for a Chinese when I talk over phone
It all depends on your area where you studying, practical usage s most important. If u study daily only 1 hr n dont practice, then it wl take forever. By the way am an Indian.
Some of my classmates (from Nepal and Korea) in college studied Chinese in preparatory schools for a year and a half to two years fulltime before entering our university in China.
Took about 10 years for me but I wasn't learning seriously for the first 5 (Middle / Highschool). Once I started studying in uni from years 5-9 and studied abroad in year 6 then that's when my Mandarin really improved and I fixed my pronunciation. The next barrier was literacy and I started reading novels my last year of uni and kept it up after I started working. After book 3 or 4 that's when I felt that my Mandarin was very solid and I felt that I could claim proficiency. Knowing what I know now, if I went back I could get to the same level in 4-5 years of serious study
>In 4 years, how much can I advance?
See copy/paste below about "newspaper proficiency". I doesn't answer your question, but it gives you a sense of the level of effort (LOE) needed to reach high proficiency in one area of Mandarin language learning. (For some, reading Chinese is the hardest aspect of the language, for others, not at all. It varies by individual).
>my plan is study traslation in university where I will learn chinese
What are the career prospects for someone interested in Mandarin translation today? Be sure you have a very good idea of what those prospects are, and how AI has, and will, affect those prospects in the future. While the best human translator is still better than the best LLM today, that gap is presumably narrowing. Like in many industries, opportunities for entry-level translation work - the kind of work you need to build a career and improve your skills - has likely already been, or will be, affected by the rise of AI. (Even if the AI-based translation is demonstrably inferior to that of a human translator, for many customers, it won't matter as long as it's "good enough" and/or the cost is lower than a human).
-----------
Read *[The Actual Worth of Chinese Language Proficiency](https://supchina.com/2019/03/20/the-actual-worth-of-chinese-language-proficiency/)* on supchina.com and the comments in [this post](https://www.reddit.com/r/ChineseLanguage/comments/b3ozmw/the_actual_worth_of_chinese_language_proficiency/). You can also listen to the episode *[Is Learning a Foreign Language Really Worth It?](http://freakonomics.com/podcast/is-learning-a-foreign-language-really-worth-it-a-new-freakonomics-radio-podcast/)* by the Freakonomics podcast. Finally, [this Post](https://www.reddit.com/r/ChineseLanguage/comments/e88uba/laowai_who_use_chinese_in_a_professional_setting/) has responses from non-natives who use Mandarin in a professional setting. You can also read the comments in these Posts:
* [Post 1](https://www.reddit.com/r/ChineseLanguage/comments/fgbwxw/professional_opportunities_for_mandarin/), [Post 2](https://www.reddit.com/r/ChineseLanguage/comments/gy6ktl/people_who_put_chinese_on_their_resume_did_it_help/), [Post 3](https://www.reddit.com/r/ChineseLanguage/comments/hgx7pf/question_do_you_think_learning_chinese_has_given/), [Post 4](https://www.reddit.com/r/ChineseLanguage/comments/r1259z/stem_degree_chinese/), [Post 5](https://www.reddit.com/r/ChineseLanguage/comments/rk836r/dont_major_in_chinese_lanaguage/), [Post 6](https://www.reddit.com/r/ChineseLanguage/comments/u4mwu8/is_chinese_interpretation_worth_as_a_major_in_2022/), [Post 7](https://www.reddit.com/r/ChineseLanguage/comments/14pq20f/is_learning_chinese_worth_it_as_a_westener/), [Post 8](https://www.reddit.com/r/ChineseLanguage/comments/14vt05y/foreigners_who_learned_really_good_chinese_how/), [Post 9](https://www.reddit.com/r/ChineseLanguage/comments/17bklmq/how_useful_would_a_bachelor_degree_in_chinese_be/)
------------
I'll define "newspaper proficiency" as being able to smoothly read an average article, of average length, not knowing ~2-5 words/phrases per article. This is a high level of proficiency, especially in Mandarin.
After a lot of gnashing of teeth, I came up with this estimate: 3.5 to 4 years, 3,380-4,680 hours of study.
**Classroom Instruction Phase (1.5 years)**
* Classroom instruction: 2hrs/day, 5 days/week: 780hrs
* Supplemental study: 4hrs/day, 5 days/week: 1,560 hours (6hrs/day, 5 days/week: 2,340 hours)
**Self Study Phase (2 years)**
* Self study: 2hrs/day, 5 days/week: 1,040 hours (3hrs/day, 5 days/week: 1,560 hours)
The 4,680 total uses the larger of the figures above. Using round numbers, it's essentially 1,000hrs/year of study.
**Comments**
* You don't need to invest ~3,300 hours before you can read *any* article. There will be some articles you can read, albeit with greater difficulty, after 1k/2k/2.5k hours of study.
* The Classroom Instruction Phase is only realistic for students or those who have large amounts of free time. Squeezing in just 1-2hrs/day would be a challenge for most who work full time (let alone those who have children).
At the very very beginning please spend your first and second months massively drilling your pronunciation in addition to whatever else you do. use FSI, LINGQ, CHINESE POD etc to first hyper load your listening and speaking at A1- A2 so that you develop a base core vocabulary and can cover basic interactions. drill drill drill.
When you're ready to start with characters, I highly recommend "Remembering the Hanzi." If you learn the Trad version first, it will be super easy to learn the simplified, but the other way around is harder for non natives. drill drill drill, write out characters, learn the ones in order in the book, because it will give you a really strong foundation. The problem with Chinese is that learning to read as a foreigner is really hard. You need to connect both to the meaning and to the sound. In an alphabet you can decode the symbols into sound, and from the sound you can recall the meaning. But in Chinese most characters are a combo of sound and meaning. If you're a native speaker, it's like being given clues towards a word that you already know how to say because you already have a vocabulary. But if you're a foreigner you're both meaning blind AND sound blind. Remembering the Hanzi teaches you the meanings of the characters, which you can then build upon. Doing these things will help you a lot. But I strongly recommend highly leveraging listening over and over to comprehensible input for an extended period of time and weighting that as a priority. Don't fall for "do all four skills equally" that works just find for an orthographically straightforward language like Spanish or Italian, but it's bot optimal for orthographically deep languages like Chinese or English. Prioritise speaking and listening.
This doesn't answer how far you can get with 4 years of learning per se (will let others handle that question), but previous discussions can get you an idea of how long it might take to get to various levels of fluency:
https://old.reddit.com/r/ChineseLanguage/search?q=how+long+learn+chinese&restrict_sr=on
Maybe I am the wrong person to ask, but I would just start and see how it goes from there. You will have enough to do once you have enrolled in your university.
I would say with intense training (4 hours a day tutor, 4 hours self study) you could get around and do most basic things in about six months, and by the end of a year be conversationally fluent. In my experience, it’s better to have a short, intense period as opposed to a sporadic, drawn out learning experience
Hi! I taught myself mandarin Chinese and moved to China (Taiwan, specifically). I lived there for about a year. You can become "functionally" fluent in one or two years. By functionally, I mean you can do the things you need to do as an adult well enough to live on your own. After that, the better your chinese gets, the better your life gets.
So I've had 10 years on and off. It depends on your environment and your definition of "learned"
Functional mandarin, where you can *verbally* navigate daily life in Taiwan? (Going to work, basic transactions, small talk with neighbours?) Probably you could get there with a year of daily practice, not just listening, but forcing yourself to talk too (this is key, you won't really internalize the language until you use it). 9 months if you're actually *in* the environment.
Functional verbal mandarin, with basic reading? Two years. You can get about a thousand characters in two years, more if you're really dedicated, but learning the characters will take time from practicing verbal skills, so the whole process does get slowed down.
Not unless you’re immersed in the language. College sometimes isn’t a get way to learn it in the real world.
Practice it in your daily life. And study 2 hours a day and you could become fluent in 1-3 years. It really depends if you have native speaker friends who you get along with.
Measure in hours, not years. It’s a huge difference to study 1 year at 3-4h a day and 15 min a day. That said, 4 years at 4h a day will bring you quite far.
Not sure about translation, as it’s very topic specific. If you have a limited range of topics it sounds doable, but maybe not every possible topic. Just make sure to study that topic in particular, as any general course is usually too general.
Oh hey, I've been studying for maybe 4.5 years! I can currently: Have long conversations and genuine friendships with my Taiwanese friends (who don't speak English) with relative ease, I can go by in daily life fairly smoothly, and I can watch anime and some TV shows with understanding most of what's going on. I can also read novels, so long as they are written in a way that isn't complicated and poetic. I currently know ~10 000 words
What I CAN'T do: I really struggle with conversations when I'm in a group and I'm the only foreigner. I still struggle with most TV shows tbh, people just talk too fast and there are so many words to know. Even regular daily interactions, I have no idea what's going on fairly often, even after all this time.
So, I guess you could say I'm somewhat fluent, but definitely have so, so far to go
Obviously, your experience will be completely different depending on how hard you study. I did 1 full year of intensive Mandarin and study almost every day, and also live in Taiwan... so if you're not doing these things, you're probably not going to make it this far. But you can definitely get very far in 4 years!
If you only study in classroomm situations?
In 4 years you get get to a level of being able to read a fair amount in a newspaper (but still need to look up some characters for certain topics), and you should be able to write resonable texts in certain topics. Listening and speaking will be mostly useful for classroom setting only.
Learning Conversation? Go somewhere where they speak Mandarin! If you start with some basics from the classroom, like a year of study, then in 6 months you can learn to hold an everyday conversation, chat with people in a bar etc.
Depending ofcourse on your own social skills AND how willing you are to constantly make mistakes, saying stupid things by accident. Being ok with that last part is one of the most important things in language learning.
I’ve been studying Chinese for a year and a half now and I’d say I’m at a pretty good conversational and listening comprehension level. I followed the HSK system (currently on 4 out of 6) and it’s been really smooth and straightforward. I highly recommend watching Chinese TV shows and writing characters as much as you can! There are also so many YouTube channels that help you understand grammar. Oh! And I downloaded a Chinese social media app called 小红书 (xiao hong shu, little red book) and it’s been great for getting used to a more fast paced way of talking and getting to know Chinese culture. Good luck! And just enjoy it, Chinese is such a fun language, I’ve really come to love it 😊
I recommend an intensive Chinese program at a university if you really want to get to a point of fluency in four years. The fact of the matter is, whether or not you can actually do that is entirely dependent on the quality of your university program, your personal effort in self study, and whether or not you’ve got the right stuff for language learning in general. Different folks are skilled at different things, and I’ve seen tons of people that had the heart for learning Chinese but simply did not possess the brain for it.
I don’t know where you live, but in the US there are several Chinese language flagship programs funded by the DOD at public universities across the country. Some are better than others, but they generally require at least one summer spent studying abroad and a final fifth year spent entirely abroad to graduate. The classes are intensive and demanding, but if you want to learn Chinese, you’d be hard pressed to find a better way outside of just up and moving to Asia.
It depends. There’s no definite answer as it depends on various factors such as interest, motivation, time, exposure etc. I know people who started learning Chinese less than 2 years ago and they’re already upper intermediate, but I’ve met people who’ve been learning it for over 5 years and they can barely order food in Chinese. Don’t give up! 加油！
It depends at which level you mean. I can speak all day long in Mandarin Chinese, but I don’t know 🤷♂️ most of the technical words in ANY subject like I might in English or some animal names like “raccoon”, etc. So I am not fluent, in my mind, but when non-Chinese-speaking people hear me speaking Mandarin Chinese with natives like someone did yesterday at a Las Vegas Chinese Community church, they think I speak it well. So it’s all dependent on what you mean.
After four years I moved to China and worked there without issue; but I studied \*a lot\*.
I was in a Chinese flagship program at my university, which is funded by the Dept. of Defense and required class *every day* with tutoring twice a week on top of that. I also was in China for every break - winter and summer. The goal of the flagship program is "professional fluency" after 4 years, and they do a pretty good job of it - though it's a lot of work.
First two years were general language, third year was Chinese-cultural classes taught in Mandarin (history, classical Chinese) and my 4th year I attended university in China and took classes for my major (anthropology) in Mandarin.
Flagship programs in Mandarin are only offered at a handful of schools; but there's no additional cost or anything (or at least, there wasn't at mine). It's also not a degree program; my major was anthropology even though I took a BA in Chinese worth of classes.
I think it takes a minimum of three to four years to learn any language, especially Mandarin. To become fluent, I believe it would take four to five years.
They said for an native English speaker Chinese was around 1200 hours. Obviously not set in stone but it is a bit harder than learning other European languages. The key is to shamelessly practice practice practice
I feel like though it is probably worth highlighting that you should do as much as you can within reason. The language learning side of the internet seems so stressed about efficiencies. You can sometimes get obsessed with being efficient you forget the joys of learning a language.
That's true to an extent, not gonna lie learning Mandarin as a kid especially with Trad Asian parents did take any joy out of it xD you will find that many of us had to get a few smackeroos as a kid to learn it
It’s over 2000 hours of **class** time according to the US state department, and that’s with the best training the government can give. That’s not even including outside study hours.
Definitely more than 1200
From experience, I put forward that even the foreign service guide of 2000 hours isn’t even enough to become an official translator. Those who went through that training still have ‘real-life situational’ leaning curb to adapt to, and that can take years after.
For sure, that’s 2000 hrs for working/professional proficiency in very tailored situations.
And being a translator or interpreter requires very specific training on top of language proficiency. I’m proficient in Japanese and English, doesn’t mean I’m a very good translator.
Yaaa not gonna lie I would've given up on day one if it wasn't for my family friends the fly swat, metal chopsticks, broom stick, wet towel and general "verbal persuasion" xD
Just let me do the ordering at Chinese restaurant and you can do the eating mate
Having worked with DLI students in the USA, people with a bachelor's in Chinese often sucked at Chinese, and the DLI course would surpass their college education within 6 months.
Meanwhile, you could find hobby speakers that could read incredibly well and have good reading skills through the entire 2 year course, and just struggle with listening.
This is all to say that university won't get you far. 90% of your learning is going to come from your own personal effort. Colleges teach you fundamentals, buy actually using and honing your Chinese will come from you.
Learning Chinese can take from 2 to 1000 years.
It very much depends on your commitment and circumstances. For the amount of time I spent in China (couple of weeks every 10 or 5 years travelling) and for the amount of time I truly practice, I am quite good, but in total I suck when it comes to having a routine and sticking to it, so here I am with something like 10y+ and being merely OK at speaking it. If you however had true immersion, living in China, potentially having a Chinese partner or many Chinese friends who talk Chinese with you, you could easily surpass my level within 1.5y or 2y, I think.
I started sometime in 2021, i am barely an HSK1-2 because of my inconsistency and low efforts and I have seen people who started much later but are much ahead. in conclusion I want to say this depends on you and your goals !
Idk. For me it's been barely over 2 years and I somehow got put into an HSK 6 class so with enough grinding you can definitely pass HSK6 in 3 years of study
I got to a level 6/10 within 1 year of 45 min conversation practice per day.
I can’t read or write that well but who cares? In my opinion you gotta focus on the base of conversation before doing anything else. I think that in another year I will be a 7.5 or 8/10.
It takes years to MASTERS any language but you can get a pretty high level in one year with consistent practice if you focus on conversation. All bets are off though for “normal” study methods.
I’m at 12 years so far with Mandarin. I’ll let you know when I think I’ve learned it
Are you able to hold a decent conversation, read novels, watch TV?
Yes though always context and level dependent. Stuff like 《非常勿扰》and 《虎妈猫爸》I mostly understand. Some novels require me to look some stuff up because once language gets figurative it's harder. News articles are actually a lot easier IMO.
Omg! Yes please let me know hehe
In 4 years you probably will only know moderate Chinese and possibly reading beginner to moderate level words. I'm not kidding it's that hard. It's my 2nd language. I seriously doubt you would be able to do translation in 4 years but possibly you could if you are a genius and gifted. Source: Native English speaker but Chinese Is my second language. I used to suck at in in school but gradually improved while learning it in my adult life.
> my plan is study traslation in university where I will learn chinese. In 4 years, how much can I advance? I'll just point you to a comment I made in r/languagelearning about learning languages in general. The salient point is this: >[[T]he **total number of hours** spent studying matters, not the **total number of years**, because the same total number of hours can be spread out over a different number of years when you change the number of hours per week.](https://www.reddit.com/r/languagelearning/comments/1dstvro/what_is_a_common_misconception_about_language/lb8qhwl/) In that comment, I also worked out an example showing how the number of years can change depending on the intensity you study. If you're studying the language full-time, as you presumably would be if you're in university, it's probably not that hard to be able to study 20 hours/week. Thus, if you're doing your studies consistently, you'd have studied Mandarin for several thousand hours after 4 years at university, which is quite enough to acquire a good reading knowledge of the language for the purposes of translation. However, it probably won't be easy, and you can expect to spend a lot of time learning the language itself. On the other hand, the demands of translation itself (being able to translate well requires a good knowledge of the source language) would probably be a good motivation for you to learn the language well.
Personal anecdote: spent almost a decade in China without actively trying to learn and maybe learned 30 words in total, and basically zero characters. A few months ago, I started studying every day (using HelloChinese) and am now solidly in HSK 4 territory (1000+ words plus their characters).
I think your comment speaks for itself, but please tell us more about your experience with HelloChinese.
Not that person, but if you study a lesson or two a day, you can go up to their HSK 4 materials in a few months. It and SuperChinese are some of the best language learning apps I’ve used/examined. They both have a very good mix of reading, listening, writing, and speaking exercises. I liked HC (especially the video clips of actual Chinese people speaking), but I decided to go with SC because it was more cost effective for me. I also wanted to try it out since I’d already used HC before (got through level 2 at that time)
Really helpful, thanks!
I'm curious about your experience living there and the reasons behind it. That's a long time to live somewhere without learning the language.
> I'm curious about your experience living there and the reasons behind it. Don't want to go into too much details, but mostly because I like living in China, as simple as that. > That's a long time to live somewhere without learning the language. Indeed but it's surprisingly not that uncommon among expats. I know people who have lived even longer in China and who still can't speak Chinese, let alone read/write it. If you don't make active efforts to learn it, you're not magically going to learn it just by living there (especially if you have no solid base).
I would assume that knowing the local language would make time in foreign country much more enjoyable, especially in China where not many can speak English. But then again if you have people around you who you can communicate I guess it won’t make that much of a difference if you’re not able to have a chat with cashier etc. Just something I’ve noticed when traveling solo through China and not knowing Chinese, it makes connecting with people quite a bit harder. But people are still very friendly and helpful, and they love when you try to make an effort speaking Chinese.
How much a day in time and what lessons? Like review, story, quest daily? Half hour?
I like a lot this answer! Thank you!
So I think you've received a lot more comments now. One of the things that I assumed in my answer is that you'll ONLY be studying Mandarin, and that the translation coursework will come towards the end of your degree. That is actually a rather optimistic assumption about the structure of your degree. For the translation degree programs you're considering, what are their structures like? If that's true, then being able to study Mandarin 20h per week is a reasonable expectation. However, if [what Zagrycha said](https://www.reddit.com/r/ChineseLanguage/comments/1dx8ja3/how_many_years_can_it_take_to_learn_mandarin/lc0ebwy/) is true, and you have to do other classes in addition to your Chinese or translation classes, then you may have to put in extra hours to get to 20h/wk. Mandarin also has a much steeper learning curve than English or Spanish. There are a lot of things in Mandarin that you may not have encountered in Spanish or English, and many people often struggle with these seemingly basic things, so it's quite easy to get discouraged or frustrated in your quest to learn Mandarin. With good teachers at university, many of these difficulties can eventually be overcome, but you can still expect to put in a lot of work.
You can go to school and don't learn much language. You despair because it has been few years. Then you realize it was only 180hours. The key to learning language is making habits (as for anything lol). Learn from what interests you, use whole sentences not just words to learn and fck grammar 👍
If you study every day, after 4 years you will definitively have a Level of fluency that is above that of most learners.
The rest of your life
I think the biggest predictor is how much you use it. I know people who just do flashcards, watch shows, and read for years but can't speak much/well. I also know people who jump in and spend more time on output and using the language who are conversational in under a year. It's how you use those hours. Personally, I feel an hour of output is worth many hours of passive input. Flashcards are ok, but too many people seem to base all their studies on recognizing characters and not using those characters. Of course, people need a foundation and SRS are good, but check out Paul Nation's Four Strands. I see most people spending the majority of their time in the first strand (meaning-focused input) where he says only spend 25%, but few people spend anywhere close to half their study time on meaning-focused output and fluency development. That is where I see the people who learn more/fast spend their time. I've met quite a few expats in Beijing that struggle speaking after years, so immersion needs to be output and not just listening.
It depends on you. If you’re gonna work hard, you will learn a lot in 4 years and you will be fluent. If you kept procrastinating, even after 10 years you will learn nothing
I moved to China when I was 24. I'd say that after about 10 months, I was beginning to get pretty fluent and could start working in Chinese. After a year, I was very confident in my Chinese. After 14 months, I went home. Six months later, I returned to China, and for most of my work, I had to use Chinese for reading, writing, and speaking. After another year, I started teaching Chinese to other foreigners. Years later, I no longer live in China but still use Chinese every day to deal with customers. From day one, I immersed myself in the language and rarely spent any time with other English-speaking foreigners. It can be done quite quickly, but honestly, it requires a lot of dedication. Never translate full sentences; always translate individual characters and learn every meaning and how to use the character. Also, be strict with tones from day one.
I would give the opposite advice. Don't focus on the characters and all their specific meanings. Learn by words and learn words from real sentences.
I'll be honest I've never really met another "foreigner" that has become fluent at Chinese, so this is just what I did, and it worked for me, it may be different for other people. The idea of learning characters again from scratch scares me haha
You can do that, but you'd probably end up learning a lot of archaic and very contextual meanings that you don't need to know. Not to mention the characters that don't really mean anything by themselves. I think words are a lot better way to learn, because Chinese people don't think in sentences character by character, it's always words or word clusters.
i think it does help with remembering characters, when you know the characters within the characters, but i guess that also comes with time.
I'm curious, what is your native language? If it's english, have you already learnt another language to a proficient level?
My first language is English and I grew up in England, but growing up my mum used to always speak to me in Filipino, and my wife now is also Filipino, so we speak bisaya at home. But I'd say my Chinese and my Filipino are pretty close in proficiency.
Yours is a rare case don't give false hope lol.
Think about time spent with the language in hours, not years. For getting to a high competency, the number that floats about online is 1000 hours for very closely related languages, 2000 hours for somewhat related languages and 4000 hours for languages that are totally unrelated or very distant to your native language. From anecdotal account it seems to be fairly accurate imo. So over 4 years you should be aiming for like 2-3 hours a day on average. There's people who have really put the time in and got to a very high level in a year. If you're studying full time and build good habits, doing lots of stuff in addition to your classes, you'll advance very quickly.
this is the only correct answer. measure in hours, not years. lots of people saying 20+ years are probably assuming you’re studying like 30 minutes a day. make it a priority and put in the hours and you can absolutely get to a high level in 4 years. obviously it’s a lifelong endeavor, but if you’re serious about it you can make crazy progress in a relatively short amount of time.
Lot of weird answers on here to be honest that don't really answer OP's question. It's not hard to look up what the general expectations are for students of Chinese foreign language programs. 4 years of full-time studying intelligently with a good language program and you should be a solid C1 which should be perfectly fine for translation. If you slack off you should still be at least B2 (\~HSK6).
Question since you seem to know you're stuff. I'm heading to China right now at around HSK 3 / HSK 4 level and will be taking a Chinese language program at a university for about a year - and I will not cocoon myself with English speakers outside of classes haha. Do you have an estimate on where I might land at the end of this? B2?
B2 is somewhere around HSK 6 and there's a lot of vocabulary between HSK 3/4 and HSK 6. I doubt you'll make up the ~3000 difference in a year via classes so it's a question of how much you want to study on your own. Being in China will be good for gaining exposure and you're probably better off talking to people than cramming vocabulary.
>Do you have an estimate on where I might land at the end of this? If I were to assume best case scenario, you're starting at a solid A2 (\~HSK4) and you do everything right, studying 40+ hours a week, I think achieving B2 (\~HSK6) in a year is doable. Is this a likely scenario for most people? Probably not. I think a more realistic scenario is aiming to be a a very strong B1 (HSK5).
If you go study in China, I think 4 years will be more than enough. If you're just taking classes in your home country, I'm not so sure. I know people who "studied" a language for years but can't even do proper pronunciation.
+1 on this. I study in China, and my Chinese is leagues better than my friends who have studied it for much longer back in my home country. Having an environment where you are constantly exposed to it actively is worth everything.
in four years of university language class people normally get a firm foundation that sets them up for success to continue learning the language in depth after college. It is totally possible to get an extremely high level in a language in four years. Its not realistic in school though, unless you plan to ignore and fail all your other classes etc for that language learning experience. University language classes are ((usually)) paced with the specific understanding that the students have three or four other classes worth of homework and tests at any given time.
That's a good point to take into consideration!
Studied for 12, speak like a 3 year old. Had enough of the adventure and went back to learning Japanese and other languages that will allow me to communicate faster.
to be fair if you can read and understand everything, i wouldnt mind speaking like a 3 year old xD
You have a point
I'm in year 3 now and can speak about any daily conversation topics and watch pretty a lot of native content. Still struggle with the news.
im about 10 years in and only hsk2, ofc i dont study nearly as hard as i should but i dont talk to as many chinese anymore
Wow you will make me cry. It's been less than a month since I started and I'm able to read HSK 1 passages. I read like 5 of them last night, didn't face much problem. Now idk what to believe 💀
I wouldn’t worry about them. They’re probably taking their time or not making it a priority. There are only 300 words between HSK 1 and 2, at least in the 2nd version of the exam, so it would be trivial to learn those words in 3-6 months if you wanted. You just have to put in the effort
ya, i barely even put effort in anymore sadly, it should not take 10 years to reach hsk3
Those first 400 or so words are the most difficult ones, not only because the language is new and very different, but also because it reveals people's learning habits. Chinese really requires people to be dedicated and consistent over long time periods; it's just not going to work out otherwise. Not necessarily decades, but definitely months and years.
As a native it takes 10years
Depends how much you study per day and how many opportunities you have to use it. I have a Taiwanese girlfriend for 1.5 years and would probably speak and listen to Chinese for 4 to 6 hours per day. I also studied abroad in Taiwan for 10 months where I was studying for four hours per day after going to class for four hours per day And then I would go and talk with strangers and friends and Chinese so probably using it gor 12 hours a day So for me after three years, I would say I am completely fluent. I can do everything casual, and even formal. I think my only area for improvement right now is learning more of the book language and also incorporating formal language more into my daily life in the event I need to use it for work I’ve also seen people study for 8 to 12 years to have reached level lower than me. It really just depends how many hours a day you put in and if use software like anki to remember vocab
I learnt mandarin in Taiwan & worked there, so picked n learnt via practical experience, at end of 5 yrs, could communicate perfectly & even now after 23 yrs, I can talk so fluently that people mistake me for a Chinese when I talk over phone It all depends on your area where you studying, practical usage s most important. If u study daily only 1 hr n dont practice, then it wl take forever. By the way am an Indian.
A1-C2, it’s on you. Language doesn’t just come to you except your native one
Some of my classmates (from Nepal and Korea) in college studied Chinese in preparatory schools for a year and a half to two years fulltime before entering our university in China.
I speak decent Chinese and understand the character system, and the tone system after about a year of practice
Took about 10 years for me but I wasn't learning seriously for the first 5 (Middle / Highschool). Once I started studying in uni from years 5-9 and studied abroad in year 6 then that's when my Mandarin really improved and I fixed my pronunciation. The next barrier was literacy and I started reading novels my last year of uni and kept it up after I started working. After book 3 or 4 that's when I felt that my Mandarin was very solid and I felt that I could claim proficiency. Knowing what I know now, if I went back I could get to the same level in 4-5 years of serious study
>In 4 years, how much can I advance? See copy/paste below about "newspaper proficiency". I doesn't answer your question, but it gives you a sense of the level of effort (LOE) needed to reach high proficiency in one area of Mandarin language learning. (For some, reading Chinese is the hardest aspect of the language, for others, not at all. It varies by individual). >my plan is study traslation in university where I will learn chinese What are the career prospects for someone interested in Mandarin translation today? Be sure you have a very good idea of what those prospects are, and how AI has, and will, affect those prospects in the future. While the best human translator is still better than the best LLM today, that gap is presumably narrowing. Like in many industries, opportunities for entry-level translation work - the kind of work you need to build a career and improve your skills - has likely already been, or will be, affected by the rise of AI. (Even if the AI-based translation is demonstrably inferior to that of a human translator, for many customers, it won't matter as long as it's "good enough" and/or the cost is lower than a human). ----------- Read *[The Actual Worth of Chinese Language Proficiency](https://supchina.com/2019/03/20/the-actual-worth-of-chinese-language-proficiency/)* on supchina.com and the comments in [this post](https://www.reddit.com/r/ChineseLanguage/comments/b3ozmw/the_actual_worth_of_chinese_language_proficiency/). You can also listen to the episode *[Is Learning a Foreign Language Really Worth It?](http://freakonomics.com/podcast/is-learning-a-foreign-language-really-worth-it-a-new-freakonomics-radio-podcast/)* by the Freakonomics podcast. Finally, [this Post](https://www.reddit.com/r/ChineseLanguage/comments/e88uba/laowai_who_use_chinese_in_a_professional_setting/) has responses from non-natives who use Mandarin in a professional setting. You can also read the comments in these Posts: * [Post 1](https://www.reddit.com/r/ChineseLanguage/comments/fgbwxw/professional_opportunities_for_mandarin/), [Post 2](https://www.reddit.com/r/ChineseLanguage/comments/gy6ktl/people_who_put_chinese_on_their_resume_did_it_help/), [Post 3](https://www.reddit.com/r/ChineseLanguage/comments/hgx7pf/question_do_you_think_learning_chinese_has_given/), [Post 4](https://www.reddit.com/r/ChineseLanguage/comments/r1259z/stem_degree_chinese/), [Post 5](https://www.reddit.com/r/ChineseLanguage/comments/rk836r/dont_major_in_chinese_lanaguage/), [Post 6](https://www.reddit.com/r/ChineseLanguage/comments/u4mwu8/is_chinese_interpretation_worth_as_a_major_in_2022/), [Post 7](https://www.reddit.com/r/ChineseLanguage/comments/14pq20f/is_learning_chinese_worth_it_as_a_westener/), [Post 8](https://www.reddit.com/r/ChineseLanguage/comments/14vt05y/foreigners_who_learned_really_good_chinese_how/), [Post 9](https://www.reddit.com/r/ChineseLanguage/comments/17bklmq/how_useful_would_a_bachelor_degree_in_chinese_be/) ------------ I'll define "newspaper proficiency" as being able to smoothly read an average article, of average length, not knowing ~2-5 words/phrases per article. This is a high level of proficiency, especially in Mandarin. After a lot of gnashing of teeth, I came up with this estimate: 3.5 to 4 years, 3,380-4,680 hours of study. **Classroom Instruction Phase (1.5 years)** * Classroom instruction: 2hrs/day, 5 days/week: 780hrs * Supplemental study: 4hrs/day, 5 days/week: 1,560 hours (6hrs/day, 5 days/week: 2,340 hours) **Self Study Phase (2 years)** * Self study: 2hrs/day, 5 days/week: 1,040 hours (3hrs/day, 5 days/week: 1,560 hours) The 4,680 total uses the larger of the figures above. Using round numbers, it's essentially 1,000hrs/year of study. **Comments** * You don't need to invest ~3,300 hours before you can read *any* article. There will be some articles you can read, albeit with greater difficulty, after 1k/2k/2.5k hours of study. * The Classroom Instruction Phase is only realistic for students or those who have large amounts of free time. Squeezing in just 1-2hrs/day would be a challenge for most who work full time (let alone those who have children).
This is amazing! Thank you so much.
At the very very beginning please spend your first and second months massively drilling your pronunciation in addition to whatever else you do. use FSI, LINGQ, CHINESE POD etc to first hyper load your listening and speaking at A1- A2 so that you develop a base core vocabulary and can cover basic interactions. drill drill drill. When you're ready to start with characters, I highly recommend "Remembering the Hanzi." If you learn the Trad version first, it will be super easy to learn the simplified, but the other way around is harder for non natives. drill drill drill, write out characters, learn the ones in order in the book, because it will give you a really strong foundation. The problem with Chinese is that learning to read as a foreigner is really hard. You need to connect both to the meaning and to the sound. In an alphabet you can decode the symbols into sound, and from the sound you can recall the meaning. But in Chinese most characters are a combo of sound and meaning. If you're a native speaker, it's like being given clues towards a word that you already know how to say because you already have a vocabulary. But if you're a foreigner you're both meaning blind AND sound blind. Remembering the Hanzi teaches you the meanings of the characters, which you can then build upon. Doing these things will help you a lot. But I strongly recommend highly leveraging listening over and over to comprehensible input for an extended period of time and weighting that as a priority. Don't fall for "do all four skills equally" that works just find for an orthographically straightforward language like Spanish or Italian, but it's bot optimal for orthographically deep languages like Chinese or English. Prioritise speaking and listening.
This doesn't answer how far you can get with 4 years of learning per se (will let others handle that question), but previous discussions can get you an idea of how long it might take to get to various levels of fluency: https://old.reddit.com/r/ChineseLanguage/search?q=how+long+learn+chinese&restrict_sr=on
Maybe I am the wrong person to ask, but I would just start and see how it goes from there. You will have enough to do once you have enrolled in your university.
I red story a lot about ppl who learn mandarin. And I can say the average is 5-10 years for really get HSK 6
If you do it full-time in China or Taiwan, about 4-5 years. And I mean full-time as in 6+ hours a day.
I would say with intense training (4 hours a day tutor, 4 hours self study) you could get around and do most basic things in about six months, and by the end of a year be conversationally fluent. In my experience, it’s better to have a short, intense period as opposed to a sporadic, drawn out learning experience
I already knew how to speak cantonese but not mandarin. I learnt mandarin by speaking with my gf who is from mainland china. That was the best way.
Hi! I taught myself mandarin Chinese and moved to China (Taiwan, specifically). I lived there for about a year. You can become "functionally" fluent in one or two years. By functionally, I mean you can do the things you need to do as an adult well enough to live on your own. After that, the better your chinese gets, the better your life gets.
So I've had 10 years on and off. It depends on your environment and your definition of "learned" Functional mandarin, where you can *verbally* navigate daily life in Taiwan? (Going to work, basic transactions, small talk with neighbours?) Probably you could get there with a year of daily practice, not just listening, but forcing yourself to talk too (this is key, you won't really internalize the language until you use it). 9 months if you're actually *in* the environment. Functional verbal mandarin, with basic reading? Two years. You can get about a thousand characters in two years, more if you're really dedicated, but learning the characters will take time from practicing verbal skills, so the whole process does get slowed down.
Not unless you’re immersed in the language. College sometimes isn’t a get way to learn it in the real world. Practice it in your daily life. And study 2 hours a day and you could become fluent in 1-3 years. It really depends if you have native speaker friends who you get along with.
Measure in hours, not years. It’s a huge difference to study 1 year at 3-4h a day and 15 min a day. That said, 4 years at 4h a day will bring you quite far. Not sure about translation, as it’s very topic specific. If you have a limited range of topics it sounds doable, but maybe not every possible topic. Just make sure to study that topic in particular, as any general course is usually too general.
Oh hey, I've been studying for maybe 4.5 years! I can currently: Have long conversations and genuine friendships with my Taiwanese friends (who don't speak English) with relative ease, I can go by in daily life fairly smoothly, and I can watch anime and some TV shows with understanding most of what's going on. I can also read novels, so long as they are written in a way that isn't complicated and poetic. I currently know ~10 000 words What I CAN'T do: I really struggle with conversations when I'm in a group and I'm the only foreigner. I still struggle with most TV shows tbh, people just talk too fast and there are so many words to know. Even regular daily interactions, I have no idea what's going on fairly often, even after all this time. So, I guess you could say I'm somewhat fluent, but definitely have so, so far to go Obviously, your experience will be completely different depending on how hard you study. I did 1 full year of intensive Mandarin and study almost every day, and also live in Taiwan... so if you're not doing these things, you're probably not going to make it this far. But you can definitely get very far in 4 years!
If you only study in classroomm situations? In 4 years you get get to a level of being able to read a fair amount in a newspaper (but still need to look up some characters for certain topics), and you should be able to write resonable texts in certain topics. Listening and speaking will be mostly useful for classroom setting only. Learning Conversation? Go somewhere where they speak Mandarin! If you start with some basics from the classroom, like a year of study, then in 6 months you can learn to hold an everyday conversation, chat with people in a bar etc. Depending ofcourse on your own social skills AND how willing you are to constantly make mistakes, saying stupid things by accident. Being ok with that last part is one of the most important things in language learning.
I’ve been studying Chinese for a year and a half now and I’d say I’m at a pretty good conversational and listening comprehension level. I followed the HSK system (currently on 4 out of 6) and it’s been really smooth and straightforward. I highly recommend watching Chinese TV shows and writing characters as much as you can! There are also so many YouTube channels that help you understand grammar. Oh! And I downloaded a Chinese social media app called 小红书 (xiao hong shu, little red book) and it’s been great for getting used to a more fast paced way of talking and getting to know Chinese culture. Good luck! And just enjoy it, Chinese is such a fun language, I’ve really come to love it 😊
I recommend an intensive Chinese program at a university if you really want to get to a point of fluency in four years. The fact of the matter is, whether or not you can actually do that is entirely dependent on the quality of your university program, your personal effort in self study, and whether or not you’ve got the right stuff for language learning in general. Different folks are skilled at different things, and I’ve seen tons of people that had the heart for learning Chinese but simply did not possess the brain for it. I don’t know where you live, but in the US there are several Chinese language flagship programs funded by the DOD at public universities across the country. Some are better than others, but they generally require at least one summer spent studying abroad and a final fifth year spent entirely abroad to graduate. The classes are intensive and demanding, but if you want to learn Chinese, you’d be hard pressed to find a better way outside of just up and moving to Asia.
It depends. There’s no definite answer as it depends on various factors such as interest, motivation, time, exposure etc. I know people who started learning Chinese less than 2 years ago and they’re already upper intermediate, but I’ve met people who’ve been learning it for over 5 years and they can barely order food in Chinese. Don’t give up! 加油！
It depends at which level you mean. I can speak all day long in Mandarin Chinese, but I don’t know 🤷♂️ most of the technical words in ANY subject like I might in English or some animal names like “raccoon”, etc. So I am not fluent, in my mind, but when non-Chinese-speaking people hear me speaking Mandarin Chinese with natives like someone did yesterday at a Las Vegas Chinese Community church, they think I speak it well. So it’s all dependent on what you mean.
I'm Chinese and I still find mandarin difficult to learn
I get it! I feel like this with my native language 😅
After four years I moved to China and worked there without issue; but I studied \*a lot\*. I was in a Chinese flagship program at my university, which is funded by the Dept. of Defense and required class *every day* with tutoring twice a week on top of that. I also was in China for every break - winter and summer. The goal of the flagship program is "professional fluency" after 4 years, and they do a pretty good job of it - though it's a lot of work. First two years were general language, third year was Chinese-cultural classes taught in Mandarin (history, classical Chinese) and my 4th year I attended university in China and took classes for my major (anthropology) in Mandarin. Flagship programs in Mandarin are only offered at a handful of schools; but there's no additional cost or anything (or at least, there wasn't at mine). It's also not a degree program; my major was anthropology even though I took a BA in Chinese worth of classes.
That program sounds really cool!! 🥹
I think it takes a minimum of three to four years to learn any language, especially Mandarin. To become fluent, I believe it would take four to five years.
They said for an native English speaker Chinese was around 1200 hours. Obviously not set in stone but it is a bit harder than learning other European languages. The key is to shamelessly practice practice practice
1200 is definitely incorrect
Maybe it's higher, but you get the point Mandarin is different to English and other European languages
I feel like though it is probably worth highlighting that you should do as much as you can within reason. The language learning side of the internet seems so stressed about efficiencies. You can sometimes get obsessed with being efficient you forget the joys of learning a language.
That's true to an extent, not gonna lie learning Mandarin as a kid especially with Trad Asian parents did take any joy out of it xD you will find that many of us had to get a few smackeroos as a kid to learn it
It’s over 2000 hours of **class** time according to the US state department, and that’s with the best training the government can give. That’s not even including outside study hours. Definitely more than 1200
From experience, I put forward that even the foreign service guide of 2000 hours isn’t even enough to become an official translator. Those who went through that training still have ‘real-life situational’ leaning curb to adapt to, and that can take years after.
For sure, that’s 2000 hrs for working/professional proficiency in very tailored situations. And being a translator or interpreter requires very specific training on top of language proficiency. I’m proficient in Japanese and English, doesn’t mean I’m a very good translator.
2200? 🤨
Maybe haha Mandarin is definitely hard and nothing like english
I know😞 i already gave up on it long time ago
Yaaa not gonna lie I would've given up on day one if it wasn't for my family friends the fly swat, metal chopsticks, broom stick, wet towel and general "verbal persuasion" xD Just let me do the ordering at Chinese restaurant and you can do the eating mate
I did 4 years I college and a summer abroad. I have lived in Taiwan for 5 months and still rely a lot on Google translate and gestures. 💀
Having worked with DLI students in the USA, people with a bachelor's in Chinese often sucked at Chinese, and the DLI course would surpass their college education within 6 months. Meanwhile, you could find hobby speakers that could read incredibly well and have good reading skills through the entire 2 year course, and just struggle with listening. This is all to say that university won't get you far. 90% of your learning is going to come from your own personal effort. Colleges teach you fundamentals, buy actually using and honing your Chinese will come from you. Learning Chinese can take from 2 to 1000 years.
B
It very much depends on your commitment and circumstances. For the amount of time I spent in China (couple of weeks every 10 or 5 years travelling) and for the amount of time I truly practice, I am quite good, but in total I suck when it comes to having a routine and sticking to it, so here I am with something like 10y+ and being merely OK at speaking it. If you however had true immersion, living in China, potentially having a Chinese partner or many Chinese friends who talk Chinese with you, you could easily surpass my level within 1.5y or 2y, I think.
I started sometime in 2021, i am barely an HSK1-2 because of my inconsistency and low efforts and I have seen people who started much later but are much ahead. in conclusion I want to say this depends on you and your goals !
Idk. For me it's been barely over 2 years and I somehow got put into an HSK 6 class so with enough grinding you can definitely pass HSK6 in 3 years of study
I learnt it in half a year you can do it
I got to a level 6/10 within 1 year of 45 min conversation practice per day. I can’t read or write that well but who cares? In my opinion you gotta focus on the base of conversation before doing anything else. I think that in another year I will be a 7.5 or 8/10. It takes years to MASTERS any language but you can get a pretty high level in one year with consistent practice if you focus on conversation. All bets are off though for “normal” study methods.
I’ve been learning it my whole life
I was conversational in about a year. The problem I have (ten years in) is the lack of motivation. Chinese media is just… bad.