I’m guessing you supported this yourself? You have a lot of straight supports, your supports need supports too so they don’t bend. Also it’s a heavy model a few heavy supports will also help.
Thanks for the advice sounds solid. Im definitly going to learn to support myslef. I just assumed it would be ok since it was built into the model and it was printwd sucessfully. I wont make that assumption again and take your advice.
You can also still use the pre-supported model but add all the bracing between those supports yourself. Just add LOTS of angled cross-supports (braces) to the model you have.
Those supports look like a forest. Strong into the sky, but getting bend by the smallest breeze.
Needs A LOT of struts.
Lot of supports create a nice smooth surface, but it also needs some heavy ones to keep the model in place - that will also prevent the two horizontal lines in there, your model shifted.
Try to experiment with heavy/sturdy tree supports.
Why are people downvoting this post? I got into resin printing a couple months ago and I've noticed that the 3D printing community can be fucking weird and elitist in certain areas. Cut the shit, people. OP is just trying to learn.
EDIT: It's interesting that all of the comments have been nice so far. It makes no sense lol.
People down vote because anonymity shows their true self and some people are just not nice.
As for the OP's question, this is more a 'beginner 3D printing' question than a Saturn question. The subreddit for beginner 3D printing is much nicer in general to newbie questions. That's not a justification for down-votes here, just an explanation.
Thanks ill keep that in mind. I only put it here because the printer has the capability of much faster speeds. I have got some good advice so far and lots of stuff to try.
The supports were designed into the model and printed sucessfully by the creater using the same printer. Only thing unknown is his confg. What went wrong in your opinion?
There can be many factors when the supports are this badly done. My first instinct is that he used a resin with better dimensional accuracy. When the resin is cured there are different levels of shrinking and expansion based on exposure time and type of resin used. With super long supports with no struts as they grow longer and weight is added more flexible resins or resins that expand more than others will pick up very minute angles that will be exacerbated with every layer.
This looks like a very large object that will have a increased force on long thin supports. Imagine a weight on the end of a short plastic pole, as the pole gets longer it will bend more, if you use multiple poles and tie them together then it will not bend as much, the weight will keep getting larger with every layer while the extra supports won't help until there is something joining them together.
The printer would need to be dead on calibrated with very accurate resin in order to print this right, there is a lot of opportunities for this print to go wrong.
Calibrate your exposure time for this resin. Add struts between the supports at 45* angles every inch like a shoelace zipper pattern to make a lattice. That will correct for expansion and support warping.
Have you calibrated your printer at all for the resin you are using? Also ambient temperature?
Also the supports look like my infant daughter designed those.
It looks like you got mostly heavy supports. Which should be few also use med supports and cover the outsides with light supports. I suggest have a few heavy supports for the corners of the design. and med surrounding the base. and light on the out sides
Despite what people are saying, it’s well and truly supported from the bottom, aside from that gap in the middle. Struts would certainly help.
Assuming it’s hollowed, the real problem I reckon is your lack of infill or internal supports - that’s why the warping is happening.
Internal supports are probably the most overlooked supports by beginner 3d printers… I know it was for me.
When hollowing, you need a combination of infill (via 2D hollowing in Lychee, or the stand hollowing with 12% infill in Chitubox).
After you’ve done your external supports, drag the side slider up so you only see the “ceilings” of the model. From below, add in internal supports. This will prevent that warping furthered from the baseplate. At the same time, place internal supports for internal islands - yes islands occur internally and externally.
Sadly, you cannot do this in lychee, even in the paid version… due to not being able to add internal supports to 2D hollowing, and due to lychee’s 3D hollowing not supporting infill.
However chitubox does this like a boss, so I only use it… in know people love lychee, but it simply can’t do infill + additional internal supports.
Also something which could increase that warping is suction. When hollowing, make sure you place holes for each volume as close to the build place as possible.
In chitubox 2.0 free, turn on the suction / cavity detection (whatever it’s called), down the bottom right of screen. This will show areas of suction in yellow on your model. (Lychee has this too, but I think it’s stuck behind their paywall).
It was printed 100% solid it had many internal supports. The supports were built into the model. It was printed sucessfully for him on the same printer model.
The internal supports are for model features. When you ask if it was hollowed i assumed you were referring the the feature in the slicer that allows you to save resin.
So if it’s solid, Does it need to be solid? The problem with solid prints, is that the surface area for each layer is much higher, meaning that the peel force for each layer is higher, meaning it takes more force to detach it from the fep. This force is pulling on the print, creating the warp.
What you want to do is have the supports take the brunt of that pulling force, not the printed layers themselves.
To stop the warping, you’ll want to put supports spaced out vertically along the walls. Also a line of supports along the top edges furtherest from the baseplate. Basically wherever it’s warping, that’s where you want more supports.
When a model is hollow with infill and internal supports, the infill and supports alleviate the pull force.
Since a solid model cannot have internal supports or infill, you need to place supports spaced out vertically on the outside.
I use Chitubox, 75% fill auto supports as a starting point then I add/adjust from there. There are a lot of good YouTube videos on how to properly support resin 3D prints. Definitely a level up or two that can be gained by viewing them. That's how I learned.
I abandoned Chitubox supports, honestly going to Lychee just to support the model with the magic button was my biggest jump in getting successful manually supported prints. I have a few optimizations I have started using but that button is SUCH a big help when you don't know what you are doing.
Single button. Free edition. It automatically rotated the object to an angle with the least number of supports required, adds rafts, adds supports, adds struts, reduces redundant struts by combining several into a single tree support, choose pillar size for light or heavy etc. all with a single magic button (green button bottom left labeled Magic Button)
If you go to the supports tab you can change the auto support density for each pillar size. I prefer normal density light supports for small things like 25mm miniatures and just increase density but keep the pillars light for larger models for minimal scaring unless the object will be very heavy.
If an option on the magic button isn't wanted, such as you have already selected an orientation that keeps the supports going into an underside and auto rotate tries to place it face down to reduce support pillar numbers you can toggle that 1 option off easily. I like to use the rotate tool Auto Rotate by itself a few times, it will do a different option each time, to find a nice compromise. Then turn it off in the magic button to support it in my chosen orientation.
May have to give lychee a try! No problem digging holes or anything? And if you decide to go full manual does it have anything that speed the process up (selecting 2 points and filling the line between with a pre-selected spacing of sprues??)
I am no expert on the software, I just got it to do what I needed to help me go from unsupported to printed and haven't gone past that. I have used it to add interpillar supports manually but not something like what you have described. Doesn't mean it isnt there the software is FAR more customizable and has more options than chitubox, if you pay for the pro version there are a wealth of niche power tools that I have never tried as I only use it to find optimal rotation, add rafts and supports then export it and print from Chitubox. I have a friend that uses Lychee for everything start to finish but I just use it for making supports. For adding holes to stls or as I have started doing adding magnet recesses for limbs/weapons on my models I actually use Windows 3d Builder. Its a free piece of software included in windows (pro?) that is to blender what MSPaint is to Photoshop. Its far simpler and easy for me to use without requiring a 4 month correspondence course to figure out how to add a hole or delete the overlapping area between two shapes (ie magnet cylinder). I recommend searching youtube as there are a lot of tutorials. In my opinion Chitubox is the MSPaint of the printing world it does its job but is extremely limited in options and auto-magical solutions while Lychee is the Photoshop with hundreds of tools and streamlining, many of which are included in the free version. If it was a one time fee instead of a subscription I would happily pay 60$ for Lychee pro just to see what it can do but I plan to print for years and don't like subscription models.
I hated manually supporting stuff. Kept falling on me in dozens of ways and damaged my release film etc. I dreaded anything that didn't just print. Getting better at understanding why and how they failed took a few months but honestly lychee magic with extra attention to the settings for how dense I wanted my support forest has made printing very fun and easy. Now I enjoy kitbashing files together and editing them in 3d Builder to make my own versions. I find I love it now and it's my favorite part of the miniatures hobby.
Good luck, have fun.
If you're still having any issues with your supports, or you just want to try a potentially optimized setup, I highly recommend checking out 3D Printing Pro on YouTube. He has a few different videos on his "insane support settings" and how to decide which supports to place where. I'm not sure how many of those videos he's done, but I know he at least has a couple for chitubox and one for lychee.
He's spent a ridiculous amount of time dialing in the settings to the point that I (and everyone I know who has tried them) have never gone back. Supports pop off so smoothly with almost no damage!
Yeah, those lines say it was struggling to pull it up in time/too fast/too much weight.. they can also be caused by vibrations, etc. Load it up in a slicer and look at those particular layers where the biggest lines are ... see if you can see where the problem is. Probably some mix of suction/speed/weight.
See how some supports are bent, that tells you the part it too heavy for the supports. Try making some heavy supports to support your supports. Also you can add some more inter-support bracing. Finally, those are very long supports. I'm assuming that's because the back of the part is closer to the build plate. If it's not, get it as close to the plate as you can but still angle. If it is the case, the longer supports need support themselves so they don't bend.
Supports all wrong; especially given that fire part of the print you’re engaging the majority of the FEP, which is putting a lot of mechanical forces on your model
What slicer are you using? In lychee. There should be (under the manual support section of the support tab) a bracing option that works really well for me. I use the free version so take that for what you will.
Everyone is talking about the supports, which could be the issue, but you said it printed fine for the person who made it. Question though: did they use a resin printer, too?
Something that could cause warping aside from support issues is if your exposure times are off. If you haven't already, I would suggest finding an exposure test to try so you can dial in your speeds. I've been using one I found on Siryah Tech's site where they include info on what each part means, but there are a ton out there. Find one that makes sense to you. Most only take a few minutes to print and have all kinds of specific details to help you understand which settings might be off.
I usually do a new round of exposure tests any time I switch resins, replace the FEP or do any maintenance on my printer, if it's been a little while since I printed anything, if the weather is changing, if I'm printing something that I haven't printed successfully before and I haven't done exposure tests recently, or really any time I don't 100% "trust" my print and don't want to waste time/money printing the whole thing only for it to fail when I could have spent a fraction of the time doing some exposure tests first.
One last thing, if you want to learn to do your own supports, I highly recommend checking out 3DPrintingPro's YouTube channel. He has a few videos from 2 or 3 years ago (I'd link, but he has ones for different slicers and idk what you're using) called "insane printing supports" or something like that. I know he has one for lychee and at least two for chitubox, one is the "updated insane support settings" or something like that. I started using his settings (and advice for how to lay them out) a couple years ago, and I haven't had any support-related failures since. Even better, the supports come off so easily, and with minimal damage to the print!
I know this is already a couple of weeks old, but i only just saw your reply. Apologies if this is something others have already said, but in case no one has, knowing those details honestly wouldn't be as helpful as you might want them to be. It could be a good starting point, but so many environmental factors come into play with resin that his speeds in his workspace may not work for you in yours. I'd still recommend doing exposure tests if you haven't already
I think the cross section through the model is too big, it needs to be rotated to minimise this and resupported. It might also be an idea to lower the lift speed and increase lift distance to allow resin to move in.
90% of fails are supports, unless you hollowed it, then its lack of drainage and flow AND Support problems. Your supports need supporting. Go watch the 3dprintingpro and you ll understand how to support this
Try to get the main build closer to the actual plate to help with structural integrity. Also, get your supports connecting to each other for more stability.
Lol yeah i really went for it on my first print. Thats why i included thoes numbers i figured thats where i fucked up. And apperently the supports suck. And i agree after watching some YT videos on the princples.
At a guess I'd say you need some bracings in between the supports, looking at some of the supports closer to the print I can see some that almost look dented or bent, suggesting that the layers at those points haven't lined up properly and have kind of wavered around a bit.
I’m guessing you supported this yourself? You have a lot of straight supports, your supports need supports too so they don’t bend. Also it’s a heavy model a few heavy supports will also help.
Thanks! I just used the supports that was built into the model. It printed sucessfully for the creator but i dont know his speeds.
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Thanks for the advice sounds solid. Im definitly going to learn to support myslef. I just assumed it would be ok since it was built into the model and it was printwd sucessfully. I wont make that assumption again and take your advice.
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You can also still use the pre-supported model but add all the bracing between those supports yourself. Just add LOTS of angled cross-supports (braces) to the model you have.
Those supports look like a forest. Strong into the sky, but getting bend by the smallest breeze. Needs A LOT of struts. Lot of supports create a nice smooth surface, but it also needs some heavy ones to keep the model in place - that will also prevent the two horizontal lines in there, your model shifted. Try to experiment with heavy/sturdy tree supports.
Ancient elegoo proverb
Why are people downvoting this post? I got into resin printing a couple months ago and I've noticed that the 3D printing community can be fucking weird and elitist in certain areas. Cut the shit, people. OP is just trying to learn. EDIT: It's interesting that all of the comments have been nice so far. It makes no sense lol.
People down vote because anonymity shows their true self and some people are just not nice. As for the OP's question, this is more a 'beginner 3D printing' question than a Saturn question. The subreddit for beginner 3D printing is much nicer in general to newbie questions. That's not a justification for down-votes here, just an explanation.
Thanks ill keep that in mind. I only put it here because the printer has the capability of much faster speeds. I have got some good advice so far and lots of stuff to try.
Speed has nothing to do with your issue.
The supports were designed into the model and printed sucessfully by the creater using the same printer. Only thing unknown is his confg. What went wrong in your opinion?
There can be many factors when the supports are this badly done. My first instinct is that he used a resin with better dimensional accuracy. When the resin is cured there are different levels of shrinking and expansion based on exposure time and type of resin used. With super long supports with no struts as they grow longer and weight is added more flexible resins or resins that expand more than others will pick up very minute angles that will be exacerbated with every layer. This looks like a very large object that will have a increased force on long thin supports. Imagine a weight on the end of a short plastic pole, as the pole gets longer it will bend more, if you use multiple poles and tie them together then it will not bend as much, the weight will keep getting larger with every layer while the extra supports won't help until there is something joining them together. The printer would need to be dead on calibrated with very accurate resin in order to print this right, there is a lot of opportunities for this print to go wrong. Calibrate your exposure time for this resin. Add struts between the supports at 45* angles every inch like a shoelace zipper pattern to make a lattice. That will correct for expansion and support warping.
Have you calibrated your printer at all for the resin you are using? Also ambient temperature? Also the supports look like my infant daughter designed those.
It's a reddit thing not just in here.
Your supports are way too long. Get your pieces as close as possible to the build plate and add struts.
The supports need cross bracing. So it looks like a bunch of Xs combining the supports together.
It looks like you got mostly heavy supports. Which should be few also use med supports and cover the outsides with light supports. I suggest have a few heavy supports for the corners of the design. and med surrounding the base. and light on the out sides
Despite what people are saying, it’s well and truly supported from the bottom, aside from that gap in the middle. Struts would certainly help. Assuming it’s hollowed, the real problem I reckon is your lack of infill or internal supports - that’s why the warping is happening. Internal supports are probably the most overlooked supports by beginner 3d printers… I know it was for me. When hollowing, you need a combination of infill (via 2D hollowing in Lychee, or the stand hollowing with 12% infill in Chitubox). After you’ve done your external supports, drag the side slider up so you only see the “ceilings” of the model. From below, add in internal supports. This will prevent that warping furthered from the baseplate. At the same time, place internal supports for internal islands - yes islands occur internally and externally. Sadly, you cannot do this in lychee, even in the paid version… due to not being able to add internal supports to 2D hollowing, and due to lychee’s 3D hollowing not supporting infill. However chitubox does this like a boss, so I only use it… in know people love lychee, but it simply can’t do infill + additional internal supports.
Also something which could increase that warping is suction. When hollowing, make sure you place holes for each volume as close to the build place as possible. In chitubox 2.0 free, turn on the suction / cavity detection (whatever it’s called), down the bottom right of screen. This will show areas of suction in yellow on your model. (Lychee has this too, but I think it’s stuck behind their paywall).
It was printed 100% solid it had many internal supports. The supports were built into the model. It was printed sucessfully for him on the same printer model.
How can it be solid with internal supports? Those two things can’t coexist…
The internal supports are for model features. When you ask if it was hollowed i assumed you were referring the the feature in the slicer that allows you to save resin.
So if it’s solid, Does it need to be solid? The problem with solid prints, is that the surface area for each layer is much higher, meaning that the peel force for each layer is higher, meaning it takes more force to detach it from the fep. This force is pulling on the print, creating the warp. What you want to do is have the supports take the brunt of that pulling force, not the printed layers themselves. To stop the warping, you’ll want to put supports spaced out vertically along the walls. Also a line of supports along the top edges furtherest from the baseplate. Basically wherever it’s warping, that’s where you want more supports. When a model is hollow with infill and internal supports, the infill and supports alleviate the pull force. Since a solid model cannot have internal supports or infill, you need to place supports spaced out vertically on the outside.
Finally, over 90% of failures are support issues. Always look there first
How do you support your unsupported stls? What software? What’s your process?
I use Chitubox, 75% fill auto supports as a starting point then I add/adjust from there. There are a lot of good YouTube videos on how to properly support resin 3D prints. Definitely a level up or two that can be gained by viewing them. That's how I learned.
Same process here. Light auto supports then manually add the medium/heavy ones.
Larger models like this I medium auto then add heavy
But it's a judgement call
Gracias!
I abandoned Chitubox supports, honestly going to Lychee just to support the model with the magic button was my biggest jump in getting successful manually supported prints. I have a few optimizations I have started using but that button is SUCH a big help when you don't know what you are doing.
What is this magic button of which you speak?? Lychee pro or free? Are you manually entering each sprue or is it an auto support button?
Single button. Free edition. It automatically rotated the object to an angle with the least number of supports required, adds rafts, adds supports, adds struts, reduces redundant struts by combining several into a single tree support, choose pillar size for light or heavy etc. all with a single magic button (green button bottom left labeled Magic Button) If you go to the supports tab you can change the auto support density for each pillar size. I prefer normal density light supports for small things like 25mm miniatures and just increase density but keep the pillars light for larger models for minimal scaring unless the object will be very heavy. If an option on the magic button isn't wanted, such as you have already selected an orientation that keeps the supports going into an underside and auto rotate tries to place it face down to reduce support pillar numbers you can toggle that 1 option off easily. I like to use the rotate tool Auto Rotate by itself a few times, it will do a different option each time, to find a nice compromise. Then turn it off in the magic button to support it in my chosen orientation.
May have to give lychee a try! No problem digging holes or anything? And if you decide to go full manual does it have anything that speed the process up (selecting 2 points and filling the line between with a pre-selected spacing of sprues??)
I am no expert on the software, I just got it to do what I needed to help me go from unsupported to printed and haven't gone past that. I have used it to add interpillar supports manually but not something like what you have described. Doesn't mean it isnt there the software is FAR more customizable and has more options than chitubox, if you pay for the pro version there are a wealth of niche power tools that I have never tried as I only use it to find optimal rotation, add rafts and supports then export it and print from Chitubox. I have a friend that uses Lychee for everything start to finish but I just use it for making supports. For adding holes to stls or as I have started doing adding magnet recesses for limbs/weapons on my models I actually use Windows 3d Builder. Its a free piece of software included in windows (pro?) that is to blender what MSPaint is to Photoshop. Its far simpler and easy for me to use without requiring a 4 month correspondence course to figure out how to add a hole or delete the overlapping area between two shapes (ie magnet cylinder). I recommend searching youtube as there are a lot of tutorials. In my opinion Chitubox is the MSPaint of the printing world it does its job but is extremely limited in options and auto-magical solutions while Lychee is the Photoshop with hundreds of tools and streamlining, many of which are included in the free version. If it was a one time fee instead of a subscription I would happily pay 60$ for Lychee pro just to see what it can do but I plan to print for years and don't like subscription models.
Word. I’ll give it a try. Thanks for the thoughtful responses man-Preciate it. This hobby is all sorts of frustrating.
I hated manually supporting stuff. Kept falling on me in dozens of ways and damaged my release film etc. I dreaded anything that didn't just print. Getting better at understanding why and how they failed took a few months but honestly lychee magic with extra attention to the settings for how dense I wanted my support forest has made printing very fun and easy. Now I enjoy kitbashing files together and editing them in 3d Builder to make my own versions. I find I love it now and it's my favorite part of the miniatures hobby. Good luck, have fun.
If you're still having any issues with your supports, or you just want to try a potentially optimized setup, I highly recommend checking out 3D Printing Pro on YouTube. He has a few different videos on his "insane support settings" and how to decide which supports to place where. I'm not sure how many of those videos he's done, but I know he at least has a couple for chitubox and one for lychee. He's spent a ridiculous amount of time dialing in the settings to the point that I (and everyone I know who has tried them) have never gone back. Supports pop off so smoothly with almost no damage!
Thanks for the reply!
Yeah, those lines say it was struggling to pull it up in time/too fast/too much weight.. they can also be caused by vibrations, etc. Load it up in a slicer and look at those particular layers where the biggest lines are ... see if you can see where the problem is. Probably some mix of suction/speed/weight.
See how some supports are bent, that tells you the part it too heavy for the supports. Try making some heavy supports to support your supports. Also you can add some more inter-support bracing. Finally, those are very long supports. I'm assuming that's because the back of the part is closer to the build plate. If it's not, get it as close to the plate as you can but still angle. If it is the case, the longer supports need support themselves so they don't bend.
Supports all wrong; especially given that fire part of the print you’re engaging the majority of the FEP, which is putting a lot of mechanical forces on your model
U need braces
Fdm this imho
probably good advice if he has both types of printers. Some people only have the one printer, so don't have that option.
Sometimes you have to "dance with who brung ya"
You said it best, brother!
suction forces too
What slicer are you using? In lychee. There should be (under the manual support section of the support tab) a bracing option that works really well for me. I use the free version so take that for what you will.
Everyone is talking about the supports, which could be the issue, but you said it printed fine for the person who made it. Question though: did they use a resin printer, too? Something that could cause warping aside from support issues is if your exposure times are off. If you haven't already, I would suggest finding an exposure test to try so you can dial in your speeds. I've been using one I found on Siryah Tech's site where they include info on what each part means, but there are a ton out there. Find one that makes sense to you. Most only take a few minutes to print and have all kinds of specific details to help you understand which settings might be off. I usually do a new round of exposure tests any time I switch resins, replace the FEP or do any maintenance on my printer, if it's been a little while since I printed anything, if the weather is changing, if I'm printing something that I haven't printed successfully before and I haven't done exposure tests recently, or really any time I don't 100% "trust" my print and don't want to waste time/money printing the whole thing only for it to fail when I could have spent a fraction of the time doing some exposure tests first. One last thing, if you want to learn to do your own supports, I highly recommend checking out 3DPrintingPro's YouTube channel. He has a few videos from 2 or 3 years ago (I'd link, but he has ones for different slicers and idk what you're using) called "insane printing supports" or something like that. I know he has one for lychee and at least two for chitubox, one is the "updated insane support settings" or something like that. I started using his settings (and advice for how to lay them out) a couple years ago, and I haven't had any support-related failures since. Even better, the supports come off so easily, and with minimal damage to the print!
Printed fine on the exact same printer as mine just dont know his speeds or resin type.
I know this is already a couple of weeks old, but i only just saw your reply. Apologies if this is something others have already said, but in case no one has, knowing those details honestly wouldn't be as helpful as you might want them to be. It could be a good starting point, but so many environmental factors come into play with resin that his speeds in his workspace may not work for you in yours. I'd still recommend doing exposure tests if you haven't already
I think the cross section through the model is too big, it needs to be rotated to minimise this and resupported. It might also be an idea to lower the lift speed and increase lift distance to allow resin to move in.
I would say there's not enough lateral support holding the supports together.
90% of fails are supports, unless you hollowed it, then its lack of drainage and flow AND Support problems. Your supports need supporting. Go watch the 3dprintingpro and you ll understand how to support this
Try to get the main build closer to the actual plate to help with structural integrity. Also, get your supports connecting to each other for more stability.
I bet if I looked you don’t have any holes in the top or bottom for the fluid in the inside to drain out.
300/1000? is that your lift/retract speeds? If so I'd start there.
Lol yeah i really went for it on my first print. Thats why i included thoes numbers i figured thats where i fucked up. And apperently the supports suck. And i agree after watching some YT videos on the princples.
At a guess I'd say you need some bracings in between the supports, looking at some of the supports closer to the print I can see some that almost look dented or bent, suggesting that the layers at those points haven't lined up properly and have kind of wavered around a bit.