So…they’ve missed the point of this sub. In arguments between two adults on equal footing, sure, usually both parties are at fault. If a 40-year-old is screaming at a 15-year-old, it’s on the adult. In ANY CASE, the abusive party is at fault. The non-abusive party does not need to take any accountability for “causing the other person to abuse them” or whatever.
They just assumed my life. Also turned around and said if the abuser has no recollection then they feel like they are taking accountability for no reason and will feel attacked.
Ugh, that bothered me too!! My mom remembered so few of the things that are burned into my brain…how bad of a person do you have to be that you forget how you abused your kids? YES, you still have to apologize if you forgot about it!!
It's strange how people don't remember. Because I definitely remember if I was being unnecessarily mean to someone. Like the time I shouted NOT NOW to the coworker who's hovering over my shoulder while I was chasing deadlines. That was three years ago and I think about it every day.
The thing that most confuses me about that kind of dipshittery is that if you truly cared about the person who says you did something that hurt them that you don't remember, wouldn't you just say you're sorry anyway? Like "I'm so sorry, I truly don't remember that but I hear that I hurt you and I wish I could undo it" is a thing that's possible to say.
Right? Wanting an "I'm sorry" is wanting someone to sit with you in your feelings and the hurt they caused. It's also a request for behavioral change - "can you please not do this series of things again, that hurt me last time".
You don't need to remember doing something to sit with someone else's pain, and to think about what actions you could take next time to avoid doing whatever hurt them again.
Which is bullshit and just a way for harmful people to deflect what they don't want to face. Someone who wants to repair relationships and has done their work would be able to say something like- "I don't recall that specific event AND I believe you experienced something I did as harmful. For that I am sorry. Regardless of my intentions, you were harmed. I will keep learning and work to do better."
Exactly. The follow through is so important. I don't expect perfection, I don't expect complete agreement on all issues, I do however expect that people who want to remain in relationship with me agree on basic levels of mutual respect and treatment of each other.
I would bet $200 that this person either
(a) keeps themselves in an abusive family system because they are too scared to leave and hate seeing others making a different choice
...or, more likely...
(b) is someone whose adult kids have asked them to be accountable for abusive behavior from 20 years ago and is estranged from their kids when they refused to do so
*edit: it's (b). they have left scathing comments about their kids cutting them off from their grandkids.*
When ever someone says something as ignorant as that, I usually ask them would they feel the same for a murderer? Does a judge just throw up their hands and dismiss the case just because the murderer can't remember?
"I can't remember" is such a worthless and useless defense. It's actually offensive, because it minimizes and dismisses the victims experiences.
Oh, I'm sure she remembers. My "mom" is the same way - claims it didn't happen or she doesn't remember (as if that means it didn't happen), but I ***know*** she remembers based on the way she speaks to me, treats me, and her body language. It's all about rug sweeping with narcs.
My mother reinvented our life and "didn't recollect" what happened. The person who wrote you doesn't understand that abusive people **voluntarily** push that part of their past away to avoid feeling bad about it. They normalize, they blame generational culture, etc. all in the effort of not being painted as bad--they want "everyone did it" to be what excuses them from harmed they caused, and yes, that includes harm they didn't know they were causing.
Somehow people out there believe that involuntary harm is not harm at all.
It's true they don't recollect--a lot of them avoid remembering like the plague to preserve their egos. They will suppress and repress until "it never happened".
Whoever wrote you hasn't done their research and is among those "people peddling all the wrong information", they're perpetuating the damage and don't realize this.
I hope they read this and learn something.
---
**That didn't happen.**
And if it did, it wasn't that bad.
And if it was, that's not a big deal.
And if it is, that's not my fault.
And if it was, I didn't mean it.
And if I did, you deserved it.
- Dayna Craig, the Narcissist's Prayer
"Any reputable therapists would tell you the past is the past."
🤣 Wtf?! What do they think therapists do exactly? LMFAO! An entire profession built on explaining how past experiences shape who we are and what, you go in weekly and they end each session with, "too bad so sad, get over it, that'll be $200." Someone's reached a new level of stupidity and it's not you OP.
Right? My therapist told me the opposite of this. A decade of experience, and she has two teenagers. When I told her about my estrangement, she helped me write a letter to my parents after I told her that writing helped me collect myself emotionally. Then she had me read it aloud (after asking if I was comfortable doing so and saying I could stop whenever I wanted). Together, we also wrote a list of pros and cons about my estrangement and went over each and how I would deal with the cons (not being able to get financial assistance from my parents, losing an entire social group etc.)
Never once did she say: "You have to reconnect with your parents."
A good therapist is like a passenger while you sit in the driver's seat. They may guide you and offer advice, but they're supposed to leave their biases and beliefs at the door.
Hey u/sea-size-2305, how big a loser do you have to be to harass people who were abused as children? One can only assume you do this because you’re estranged from your own kids so you’re harassing by proxy. Good for your kids. Go work on yourself, you old double spacing fool.
Part of a comment from their recent history:
“I am shocked at the number of parents that think it is ok to cut off their children's contact with a grandparent, just because the adults don't get along. That is how you teach a child they can't count on any of their relationships to be permanent. No child can feel secure after that happens. I won't even get in to what the child thinks when they see their parent cut off their own parent.”
_Ding ding ding_ you’ve hit the nail on the head.
I mean like..... *ARE* relationships "permanent"???? All relationships rely on the good faith, fair treatment, and loving support of each person in the relationship. Friendships, familial relationships, romantic entanglements, marriage/long term commitments.
I can't believe how giant an inflated wanker that user is.
The only people that think they should be, are abusers who want attention from others without consequences for the way they treat them. I think it's why they have kids in the first place.
🤢🤢🤢. Man they’re gross. This is how you teach a child that respect and safety are crucial to relationships. This is how you teach a child to break generational abuse. I hope their eyes burn when they read this.
It teaches the child their parents can be counted on to protect them from bullies. Including adult bullies. It gives the child a safer upbringing free from unnecessary stress.
This is a wonderful way to build trust between parent and child. And quite valuable, considering how many predatory adults try to target children.
Yeah seriously. They probably abused/neglected their own kids and now that their kids cut contact all they can do is harass random people online. I would say that they need a therapist but at this point, it's more like an exorcist.
Yeah, I’m kinda confused as why they’re not banned from this community? This seems to be one of their favorite haunts to tell abused kids it’s their fault they don’t have a relationship with their parents. The child abuse apologists are really something else.
Some users are banned, some shadow banned, some get caught in auto mod removal.
I let them shout into the ether sometimes - they have 66 comments auto removed.
Well, that’s delightful. I love the idea of them writing these screeds only for them to be auto removed. Maybe they took to DMing because they weren’t getting the reactions they needed.
Disgusting people, definitely was or is an abuser.
#PSA to everyone here:
Professional counselling and even multiple psychiatrists and psychologists have told me boundaries and no contact is important and okay for you to do and often necessary to keep yourself safe and sane.
Everything that person said is bull.
I’m bored this Easter so I sent messages; maybe I can scare them into leaving people here alone. They suck for harassing people trying to heal and being judgmental harpies
It’s not a great look. It’s bizarre people like them and my mom would rather literally die alone than say “I’m sorry I beat you as a small child.” But, everybody gets to choose their path in life.
Thank you OP for letting us know that u/sea-size-2305 is an abuse apologist. They must be a really shitty person to be defending child abusers. It’s wouldn’t surprise me if they’re an abuser themselves who is estranged from their own children. Abuse apologists are usually guilty of the things they try to defend. I’m sorry such a horrible person said that to you, but thank you for publicly calling them out to keep this community safe from people who defend child abusers.
*”I seriously doubt you will find a single article written by a well known credible person in the field of psychology who agrees that a victim should not reconcile until the other person apologizes and takes accountability for the past”*
Found one:
Lindsay C. Gibson, PsyD, is a clinical psychologist and psychotherapist with more than thirty years’ experience working in both public service and private practice. Her books—including the #1 Amazon best seller, Adult Children of Emotionally Immature Parents—have sold more than a million copies, and have been translated into thirty-four languages. In the past, Gibson has served as an adjunct assistant professor, teaching doctoral clinical psychology students clinical theory and psychotherapy techniques. She specializes in therapy and coaching with adults to attain new levels of personal growth, emotional intimacy with others, and confidence in dealing with emotionally immature family members. Her website is available at http://www.lindsaygibsonpsyd.com/. Gibson lives and works in Virginia Beach, VA.
How inappropriate and potentially retraumatizing of them to message you. I'm sorry this happened to you, OP. There are a lot of gray areas in relationships, but this is not one of them. Parents who abuse their children are at fault, full stop. And people are always accountable for the harm they caused, regardless of timeline or intent.
I appreciate it. Honestly this is exactly what my mother and sister would say to me when I would bring my trauma up at all. Although this particular person didn't bother me, I call them out because it might bother someone else.
Here's another statement from sea-size-2305 on another post
>There are people who can't seem to feel love for anyone or anything. With the exception of those people, I think there is a parent/child bond that cannot be broken.
>
>Either the parent or the child can convince themselves they no longer care about the other, but they are only fooling themselves.
>
>Btw, **people who can't say, "I love you" can usually be coaxed into saying it if you insist on it in a humorous way**. It's the intimacy of a serious, "I love you" that they can't handle.
This part in bold made me cringe pretty hard, because my father would always be verbally abusive, then physically tickle us or force us to say "we love you too" back while he was doing a funny voice and laughing, but we were legitimately scared of his wrath in the moment.
What a horrible take.
Edit: I hope the mods consider permanently banning this person for harassing someone over a post via PM.
OP, I’m so sorry that this person violated boundaries and messaged you this garbage.
Others pointed out, but their comment history shows that they regularly play this “both parties were at fault” card.
Categorically, this is untrue. The people in this sub are people who were (broadly) victimized by our caregivers when we were in their care. It was NOT your fault. Anyone who is unable to see that the responsibility in those moments is on the adult/caregiver is unwell.
Their claim that any “good” therapist will tell people to move on is just wrong. We are people with developmental trauma from being abused by caregivers. And any therapist worth their salt knows that people don’t just “move on” from trauma because it’s in the past. We hold onto it because it’s stored in our bodies and changes literally everything about who we are as people.
This person is obsessed with Jon Benet Ramsay too. I wonder how that child was at fault? (Clearly a small child was not at fault and did not deserve to be murdered)
Bish can’t even keep her prejudiced statements logical
Also: Tell me your kids do not speak to you, nor have you ever met your grandkids without saying your kids never speak to you nor have you ever met your grandkids. n
Someone needs to speak to their own kids instead of taking it out on internet strangers. Writing psycho essays to random people is not going to fix your own life.
I have a strong suspicion they're estranged from their own kids, so can't. I guess trying to project abuse-condoning bullshit onto us is the next best thing.
Anyone here ever screw up, feel remorse, sincerely apologize to the wronged party, and then change your behavior for the better?
Yeah, me too. That's the difference between abusers and emotionally mature people. We are capable of being accountable, and don't insist on both-sidesing everything. It is absolutely possible for one person to be responsible for a conflict, and for that person to take accountability and change.
It's just not possible for our estranged parents, which most of have learned over several decades of trauma.
>It is absolutely possible for one person to be responsible for a conflict, and for that person to take accountability and change.
But you looked grumpy that one time I'd been screaming for an hour, therefore we've both contributed! And now it's ambiguous I can make it about emotions, make my emotions seem the biggest, make it seem the biggest emotions are the only ones that matter and now you're the one who is wrong.
Or we could do your thing. But I like exploding so we'll do my thing.
/jokingofcourse
I did it last Thursday with my son because I lost my shit & behaved very badly.
Thankfully, he forgave me & we have moved on.
Edit: I'm doing my best to do better.
1. Mods, thank you
2. Bitch no. My husband did not make any mistakes nor did he say or do ANYTHING for my mother (who has never met him) to be unnecessarily cruel when talking about him because he was having issues with his father abusing him.
3. I did NOTHING wrong in moving away to follow my dreams. I did not deserve to be manipulated from 1200 miles away. I did not deserve to be punished just because I wanted to follow a dream that involved moving away. I did NOTHING to deserve 30 years of manipulation and mental abuse just because I DARED go against my mother's wishes and plans.
4. You can go fuck yourself from one end of the galaxy to another, at 1 mile per hour.
I need to walk away. I want to slap this bitch so hard.
Sorry, obviously, I am very triggered. Going to go look at jewelry.
This is so rude of them. Who are they to think they have even a sliver of understanding to your personal experience and lived life? Are they your therapist? Pastor? Anything to you? No, they are not.
Every time they say accountability, it’s in quotes. Like they don’t even think that’s an actual word. But it’s clearly a word that’s been said to *them* many, many times. And they appear to have yet to take any actual accountability in their own life, which seems to be why they’re on the receiving end of a (deserved) estrangement. Since they’re probably blocked from their own family, they’re here spouting off nonsense instead. Preposterous.
Good job with your response, OP, and thanks for banning them, mods. 🙌
I'm just wondering what my "big mistakes" were when I was 10 and my mother broke my front tooth in half. Or when I was 5 and she'd tell me "you'll always be fat and ugly and no one will ever love you." I'm supposed to feel sorry for her "baggage?" Nope. I have more than baggage, I have a whole matching set of luggage and a trunk, and guess what? I've never abused my child. I've never told her that I hate her. I've never called her a fat bitch. I will not reconcile with her and I have zero remorse.
This person's comments are nauseating and I'm sorry they messaged you. Obviously boundaries are not a thing for them so you know how they treat their children. "I can't help myself". Try harder. Telling people they must remain in abusive relationships, unless the person was convicted in court, is adding to what those people have suffered. Get out of here with that nonsense. Ugh.
My favorite part is where they’re concerned that apologizing is harmful to the relationship.
Y’all, apparently apologizing to someone you’ve hurt could cause your relationship to become “severely strained.” I guess the abuser’s behavior couldn’t possibly be to blame. LoL.
There's an assumption here that estranged adults "demand" something, but the point is... we usually don't.
Sure it'd be nice if my mother apologised for all the crap she did to me, but she can't. She can't do it in herself and she has no avenue left as she doesn't know where I am or how to contact me. And even if she did, I'm pretty sure I wouldn't welcome it. I don't want pulling back into participation in my own abuse ever again. I've had enough.
No contact and estrangement means: it's over. Nothing else. No contact, no dialogue, no knowing about each other, no reconciliation, no nothing.
It's not a power play, though I'm not surprised a toxic person sees it that way. Even if my mother woke up with a normal functioning empathic brain, she has no way to contact me to say those things. It's done. I'm gone. For the rest of her life... and mine.
I was a little shocked the day it dawned on me that there was no point in asking for an apology, bc there truly is no possible apology that could possibly even begin to scratch the surface of fixing the mess they created.
There is no possible set of words that would ever make me think, "okay, let's reestablish contact".
The sheer scale of their cruelty cannot be fixed or healed or made better in the slightest.
They could apologize non-stop between now and the day they die and it wouldn't make the slightest dent in their debt.
So sorry they sent that and glad to read they have been banned.
Those of us who have been abused are damned if we do and damned if we don't. How dare we remove ourselves from an unhealthy situation. Right? It's not fair to the abusers!?!They don't owe us an apology because they can't remember what they did to us? We are forcing them to grovel? That is somehow supposed to convince us we have a duty to just sweep it all under the bridge as a big misunderstanding.
I can't speak for anyone else, but I seriously don't want a relationship with my FOO, even if an apology and accountability was offered up. Not a hint of a healthy relationship ever existed from the beginning until I went No Contact. There is nothing to restore and repair.
u/fancydang thank you for posting this OP. especially since it didn't bother you (great healing work!), but you didn't want this person bothering others (if i'm remember the comments correctly).
a second positive outcome for others that resulted from you taking time to post this...you helped me feel more confident in my intuition b/c it took very little time for my body to signal to my inner voice to say, "ick" while reading this. i got to grow from your post, so thank you!!
WTAFing audacity.
Many of us on this sub were abused - emotionally, sexually, psychologically, financially - as children and/or neglected. To assert that both the abuser and the abused contributed to a conflict is just breathtaking.
And the notion that a helpless dependent minor child carries any culpability is beyond absurd.
I detest the moral laziness and sheer cowardice of assigning adult motivations to children.
I love the 'premise then no supporting evidence' structure. Like 'Very few conflicts are ever resolved by someone apologizing and taking accountability'...then they just go on to both sides having made mistakes. There's a premise, then there's no evidence, they just change topics. Then again, the premise that if one party insists reconciliation is impossible unless the other apologizes then it is unlikely to happen...and no evidence, just saying both sides have been hurt. Again the next sentence has nothing to do with the previous one.
The structure always seems to go A: Premise then B: Emotive statement that both sides are hurt, as if emotions dictate reality somehow. I guess it leads into 'we're both hurt, and I declare I'm the most hurt so I win and you should shut up' territory.
I wont read further, picking through the poison isn't safe.
One takeaway from this nonsense was that it sounded to me like they were typing out the rationalizations in their head, one after another.
They know perfectly well that they ought to be apologizing and making amends, but they don't want to admit culpability, so they've come up with invented reassuring mantras they have to keep repeating to themselves to feel like they still have the high ground.
Yeah, I just think that what they try to do is to engage our emotions when our emotions can be not literate in this kind of scam talking (or that's how I would describe it). So, I try and figure the structure (the structure being they give a premise/argument but then they don't give any evidence and just make an emotive claim) as a way of figuring out what to educate my own emotions on. Have to go by evidence, because they are basically masters of having big emotions and trying to force things by big emotions.
Yeaaaah, no. You might be sure that "both sides contributed" to the situation but if I recall correctly I was three and the asshole beating me with his belt was 32 and outweighed me by 180 pounds.
Fuck that guy if he can't take accountability for that.
Somethings something glass houses something something boulders...?
Seriously. If you're here to harass folks for refusing to follow your perceptions of family and how much should be tolerated in the name of blood, kindly f@ck right on outta here.
Looks like the message of a person who’s feeling the consequences of their actions very viscerally, it’s so bad they’re trying to externalize to strangers on the internet so you know they’re suffering and rightfully so lol
Ahh, yes the 'ol "it takes two!"
Parent child relationships are not ever equal.
When parents abuse children, knowingly or not, it means children cannot ever develop normal relationships with their parents.
This is just another demand to do what parents want and think the way they demand we think. They get to tell us what feelings and circumstances are real. Forever.....
🤮
they have several more comments in this subreddit (with just the first bits since theyve been blocked from the sub) and they for sure are enablers/weirdos
"Any GOOD therapist will tell you that the past is the past"
That's when I knew for sure this was *unhinged*
Any actually good therapist looks to see if there were past traumas informing current otherwise-unexplained challenges.
But an abuser's idea of a "good" therapist is a therapist the abuser can manipulate, whom the abuser can get on their side to then gang up on the victim, who never holds the abuser accountable.
Im convince it's my mother secretly on a sub reddit. The countless times I've heard the past is the past I can't change it. No bitch hut you can take accountability, apologize, oh and not continue the same behavior.
I didn’t read all of it but that’s not how conflict always work with parents.
It’s the parents’ responsibility to be loving, kind and supportive and teach them how to survive as an adult.
If a parent was a 💩 parent because of being selfish and lazy and not getting help for any mental illness or addictions they deserve nothing
I’m sorry you got this message. I recommend turning the chat and message options off for your own mental safety. Getting weird stuff like this unprompted is absolutely menacing.
The Miami Dolphins beat the Denver Broncos 70-20 last NFL season. According to this relationship expert, it was a really close game right down to the end. GTHAFMWTS
I often have to ask what abbreviations mean, but I read that like a complete sentence! Lol
Actually, this moron is positive the Dolphins didn't mean it and Denver should apologize for dirtying their uniforms. 🙄
I think most of us are realistic enough to understand that we'll never get an apology. We might get non-apologies like "I'm sorry that you misunderstood me" or "I'm sorry that you took that comment in the way you did" but those aren't real.
I think a lot of us set a low bar for our parents-I wanted my mother to be less aggressive and angry, and to think about what she said to me (the old 'if you can't say anything nice, don't say anything at all'). I wanted her to stop relentlessly criticising everything-it got to the stage where her reflexive automatic response was negative, even over the most prosaic subject. I mentioned once I was going to get the pavior blocks on my drive cleaned and sealed, because I was tired of having to continually clean them and scrape up weeds from the gaps. Her response to that wasn't 'that sounds useful, I'm sure it'll look well' or anything, it was a stream of invective about how I was wasting money on something unnecessary, why was I so lazy-it didn't sound a complex task so why was I paying someone to do it, and name-calling and body-shaming saying no wonder I needed to get a company in, I'd put on so much weight that no doubt I found it too difficult.
I'm not asking for an apology for the incalculable number of insults and criticism that she threw at me over the years, but I wanted her acknowledgement that it was uncalled for and she would make an attempt to be more approachable. Individually, these little insults don't amount to much, but when you've had 45 years of them, and every interaction with her followed the same critical, negative, depressing pathway, it wears you out. She isn't going to change, so all I can do is change the way I respond to her.
I disagree with that user completely. I'm 60 now, and when I was young, there was no SM, no Internet, nowhere really I could turn to find support and it wasvery isolating. These days, thankfully, there is support readily available. Talking about this isn't whining or feeling sorry for yourself. I suspect that person likes the term 'snowflake' but standing up for yourself, acknowledging the harm you've suffered and taking steps to come to terms with that isn't being a snowflake-it shows a lot of insight and strength to say "this happened to me and I'm not going to accept that any longer." Saying that because the abuser doesn't remember the insult or behaviour that means it didn't happen the way the victim said it did is absolute tosh.
There's some real twisted logic in that diatribe. I suppose someone whose actions unwittingly kill another is innocent because they didn't know they did it and only guilty when a court decides it.
Appropriate that they send this Easter weekend as they are expecting you to crucify yourself for the sake of keeping the peace with "family".
There are so many things that I want to say about this post, but I’m sure that you already know them all, and it’s not like this person would listen to anything that I had to say.
If I came up to you and punched you in the face, it’s partially your fault. And the past is in the past so…
Seriously, what in confirmation bias hell is this “any reputable psychologist” shit? There’s literally *hundreds* of books written by incredibly *reputable* psychologists that say accountability and penitentiaries are the basic backbones of forgiveness. Anyone with an undergrad degree in psychology can tell you that, they don’t even have to be famous or published!
Somebody has been left with no contact and is *desperately* trying to *still* not take accountability. Their own family won’t talk to them so they feel the need to plead their sorry, pathetic case to a stranger.
If you’re reading this, you fucked up. Own it. If you honestly don’t remember what you did, listen to people when they tell you and believe them. Nobody just decides one day “hey, you know what will totally ruin my life and upend my whole family? If I make shit up and cut my family member off. That’ll be a real hoot!” For once in your whole life, try some introspection. Think about what the *other* person is going through, put your ego in check, and if you really care about them, ask yourself: why are they upset and what can you do to help them? It doesn’t matter who’s “right” and who’s “wrong,” what matters is that you hurt them. Do better.
The funny thing is, while I would like a sincere message of apology and accountability from my parent, that’s actually NOT what I want most. What I want is change in behaviour! If he said to me, “I’m sorry I ignored you for all those years,” and meant it, yes that might feel good. But what I want him to do now is take a sincere interest in me as a person, not just as a lackey to do things for him.
It's funny that they don't remember what they did to you, but remember every single perceived slight, even if it was a sigh, that you've made against them. I didn't even read half of the response OP was given. There's just no reason for both parties to agree to have amnesia so that the abuser can feel comfortable.
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They are missing a very important point. I'm not sitting here wanting to hold my family accountable. I can only speak for myself but that was never my goal. My goal was for the abuse to stop and to have a healthier relationship but the abuse never stopped and now today we don't have any relationship.
That username has been banned.
So…they’ve missed the point of this sub. In arguments between two adults on equal footing, sure, usually both parties are at fault. If a 40-year-old is screaming at a 15-year-old, it’s on the adult. In ANY CASE, the abusive party is at fault. The non-abusive party does not need to take any accountability for “causing the other person to abuse them” or whatever.
They just assumed my life. Also turned around and said if the abuser has no recollection then they feel like they are taking accountability for no reason and will feel attacked.
Ugh, that bothered me too!! My mom remembered so few of the things that are burned into my brain…how bad of a person do you have to be that you forget how you abused your kids? YES, you still have to apologize if you forgot about it!!
The axe forgets but the tree remembers.
[удалено]
It's strange how people don't remember. Because I definitely remember if I was being unnecessarily mean to someone. Like the time I shouted NOT NOW to the coworker who's hovering over my shoulder while I was chasing deadlines. That was three years ago and I think about it every day.
That’s because you are a decent person. Decent people feel bad when they hurt others…
The thing that most confuses me about that kind of dipshittery is that if you truly cared about the person who says you did something that hurt them that you don't remember, wouldn't you just say you're sorry anyway? Like "I'm so sorry, I truly don't remember that but I hear that I hurt you and I wish I could undo it" is a thing that's possible to say.
Well no because then they feel attacked which makes you wrong /s
Right? Wanting an "I'm sorry" is wanting someone to sit with you in your feelings and the hurt they caused. It's also a request for behavioral change - "can you please not do this series of things again, that hurt me last time". You don't need to remember doing something to sit with someone else's pain, and to think about what actions you could take next time to avoid doing whatever hurt them again.
Which is bullshit and just a way for harmful people to deflect what they don't want to face. Someone who wants to repair relationships and has done their work would be able to say something like- "I don't recall that specific event AND I believe you experienced something I did as harmful. For that I am sorry. Regardless of my intentions, you were harmed. I will keep learning and work to do better."
Yes, and then they actually changed their behaviors!
Exactly. The follow through is so important. I don't expect perfection, I don't expect complete agreement on all issues, I do however expect that people who want to remain in relationship with me agree on basic levels of mutual respect and treatment of each other.
I would bet $200 that this person either (a) keeps themselves in an abusive family system because they are too scared to leave and hate seeing others making a different choice ...or, more likely... (b) is someone whose adult kids have asked them to be accountable for abusive behavior from 20 years ago and is estranged from their kids when they refused to do so *edit: it's (b). they have left scathing comments about their kids cutting them off from their grandkids.*
When ever someone says something as ignorant as that, I usually ask them would they feel the same for a murderer? Does a judge just throw up their hands and dismiss the case just because the murderer can't remember? "I can't remember" is such a worthless and useless defense. It's actually offensive, because it minimizes and dismisses the victims experiences.
My mother has always said "you remember things wrong" her saying she doesn't remember at all would be more validating but these people don't see it.
Oh, I'm sure she remembers. My "mom" is the same way - claims it didn't happen or she doesn't remember (as if that means it didn't happen), but I ***know*** she remembers based on the way she speaks to me, treats me, and her body language. It's all about rug sweeping with narcs.
My mother reinvented our life and "didn't recollect" what happened. The person who wrote you doesn't understand that abusive people **voluntarily** push that part of their past away to avoid feeling bad about it. They normalize, they blame generational culture, etc. all in the effort of not being painted as bad--they want "everyone did it" to be what excuses them from harmed they caused, and yes, that includes harm they didn't know they were causing. Somehow people out there believe that involuntary harm is not harm at all. It's true they don't recollect--a lot of them avoid remembering like the plague to preserve their egos. They will suppress and repress until "it never happened". Whoever wrote you hasn't done their research and is among those "people peddling all the wrong information", they're perpetuating the damage and don't realize this. I hope they read this and learn something. --- **That didn't happen.** And if it did, it wasn't that bad. And if it was, that's not a big deal. And if it is, that's not my fault. And if it was, I didn't mean it. And if I did, you deserved it. - Dayna Craig, the Narcissist's Prayer
This is the best answer all day!
"Any reputable therapists would tell you the past is the past." 🤣 Wtf?! What do they think therapists do exactly? LMFAO! An entire profession built on explaining how past experiences shape who we are and what, you go in weekly and they end each session with, "too bad so sad, get over it, that'll be $200." Someone's reached a new level of stupidity and it's not you OP.
Right? My therapist told me the opposite of this. A decade of experience, and she has two teenagers. When I told her about my estrangement, she helped me write a letter to my parents after I told her that writing helped me collect myself emotionally. Then she had me read it aloud (after asking if I was comfortable doing so and saying I could stop whenever I wanted). Together, we also wrote a list of pros and cons about my estrangement and went over each and how I would deal with the cons (not being able to get financial assistance from my parents, losing an entire social group etc.) Never once did she say: "You have to reconnect with your parents." A good therapist is like a passenger while you sit in the driver's seat. They may guide you and offer advice, but they're supposed to leave their biases and beliefs at the door.
Right!? 💯% bullshit is what that is... 🤯
Sounds like their kids have healthy boundaries and they don't like it 😂
100%. Nobody with a happy relationship with their kids throws this kind of tantrum over other people having boundaries.
Hey u/sea-size-2305, how big a loser do you have to be to harass people who were abused as children? One can only assume you do this because you’re estranged from your own kids so you’re harassing by proxy. Good for your kids. Go work on yourself, you old double spacing fool.
Part of a comment from their recent history: “I am shocked at the number of parents that think it is ok to cut off their children's contact with a grandparent, just because the adults don't get along. That is how you teach a child they can't count on any of their relationships to be permanent. No child can feel secure after that happens. I won't even get in to what the child thinks when they see their parent cut off their own parent.” _Ding ding ding_ you’ve hit the nail on the head.
I mean like..... *ARE* relationships "permanent"???? All relationships rely on the good faith, fair treatment, and loving support of each person in the relationship. Friendships, familial relationships, romantic entanglements, marriage/long term commitments. I can't believe how giant an inflated wanker that user is.
The only people that think they should be, are abusers who want attention from others without consequences for the way they treat them. I think it's why they have kids in the first place.
🤢🤢🤢. Man they’re gross. This is how you teach a child that respect and safety are crucial to relationships. This is how you teach a child to break generational abuse. I hope their eyes burn when they read this.
It teaches the child their parents can be counted on to protect them from bullies. Including adult bullies. It gives the child a safer upbringing free from unnecessary stress. This is a wonderful way to build trust between parent and child. And quite valuable, considering how many predatory adults try to target children.
This is such a great comment!
Yeah seriously. They probably abused/neglected their own kids and now that their kids cut contact all they can do is harass random people online. I would say that they need a therapist but at this point, it's more like an exorcist.
We’re gonna need a whole lot of holy water for this one boys!
Amen👍
A lot of their comments seem to be defending abusers.
Yeah, I’m kinda confused as why they’re not banned from this community? This seems to be one of their favorite haunts to tell abused kids it’s their fault they don’t have a relationship with their parents. The child abuse apologists are really something else.
They are banned. This is the first time I've seen their comments/messages.
Awesome! Thanks. 💚
Some users are banned, some shadow banned, some get caught in auto mod removal. I let them shout into the ether sometimes - they have 66 comments auto removed.
Well, that’s delightful. I love the idea of them writing these screeds only for them to be auto removed. Maybe they took to DMing because they weren’t getting the reactions they needed.
Yeah she has a whole comment whinging about this sub and how “only hateful takes are allowed”. Actual delusion
Thank you
Disgusting people, definitely was or is an abuser. #PSA to everyone here: Professional counselling and even multiple psychiatrists and psychologists have told me boundaries and no contact is important and okay for you to do and often necessary to keep yourself safe and sane. Everything that person said is bull.
She uses the word ‘victim’ to describe people who have been abused, but refers to the abuser as ‘a person’.
Noticed that, not a single use of the word abuse/abuser. Incredible mental gymnastics from an abuser as usual
I’m bored this Easter so I sent messages; maybe I can scare them into leaving people here alone. They suck for harassing people trying to heal and being judgmental harpies
It’s not a great look. It’s bizarre people like them and my mom would rather literally die alone than say “I’m sorry I beat you as a small child.” But, everybody gets to choose their path in life.
I misread harpies as herpes! Now I can't stop laughing 😆 🤣
Thank you OP for letting us know that u/sea-size-2305 is an abuse apologist. They must be a really shitty person to be defending child abusers. It’s wouldn’t surprise me if they’re an abuser themselves who is estranged from their own children. Abuse apologists are usually guilty of the things they try to defend. I’m sorry such a horrible person said that to you, but thank you for publicly calling them out to keep this community safe from people who defend child abusers.
Absolutely!
*”I seriously doubt you will find a single article written by a well known credible person in the field of psychology who agrees that a victim should not reconcile until the other person apologizes and takes accountability for the past”* Found one: Lindsay C. Gibson, PsyD, is a clinical psychologist and psychotherapist with more than thirty years’ experience working in both public service and private practice. Her books—including the #1 Amazon best seller, Adult Children of Emotionally Immature Parents—have sold more than a million copies, and have been translated into thirty-four languages. In the past, Gibson has served as an adjunct assistant professor, teaching doctoral clinical psychology students clinical theory and psychotherapy techniques. She specializes in therapy and coaching with adults to attain new levels of personal growth, emotional intimacy with others, and confidence in dealing with emotionally immature family members. Her website is available at http://www.lindsaygibsonpsyd.com/. Gibson lives and works in Virginia Beach, VA.
Good eye. Well done.
"They aren't real, they are make believe psychologist" Ie, anything that gets in the way of the narrative is deemed to be fake news.
I love a good refutation with bibliography Also, I think it’s part of any 12- step programme like AA - make amends?
Seems like most of their comments are defending abusers.
Just commented this as well!
How inappropriate and potentially retraumatizing of them to message you. I'm sorry this happened to you, OP. There are a lot of gray areas in relationships, but this is not one of them. Parents who abuse their children are at fault, full stop. And people are always accountable for the harm they caused, regardless of timeline or intent.
I appreciate it. Honestly this is exactly what my mother and sister would say to me when I would bring my trauma up at all. Although this particular person didn't bother me, I call them out because it might bother someone else.
Thank you for calling them out.
Here's another statement from sea-size-2305 on another post >There are people who can't seem to feel love for anyone or anything. With the exception of those people, I think there is a parent/child bond that cannot be broken. > >Either the parent or the child can convince themselves they no longer care about the other, but they are only fooling themselves. > >Btw, **people who can't say, "I love you" can usually be coaxed into saying it if you insist on it in a humorous way**. It's the intimacy of a serious, "I love you" that they can't handle. This part in bold made me cringe pretty hard, because my father would always be verbally abusive, then physically tickle us or force us to say "we love you too" back while he was doing a funny voice and laughing, but we were legitimately scared of his wrath in the moment. What a horrible take. Edit: I hope the mods consider permanently banning this person for harassing someone over a post via PM.
Thanks for your example… it really helps to show how deranged that poster is.
My dad used to tickle me until I lost control of my bladder. This post is bringing back memories that reinforce my decision to be NC.
That was considered hilarious in my family. 😌
OP, I’m so sorry that this person violated boundaries and messaged you this garbage. Others pointed out, but their comment history shows that they regularly play this “both parties were at fault” card. Categorically, this is untrue. The people in this sub are people who were (broadly) victimized by our caregivers when we were in their care. It was NOT your fault. Anyone who is unable to see that the responsibility in those moments is on the adult/caregiver is unwell. Their claim that any “good” therapist will tell people to move on is just wrong. We are people with developmental trauma from being abused by caregivers. And any therapist worth their salt knows that people don’t just “move on” from trauma because it’s in the past. We hold onto it because it’s stored in our bodies and changes literally everything about who we are as people.
This person is obsessed with Jon Benet Ramsay too. I wonder how that child was at fault? (Clearly a small child was not at fault and did not deserve to be murdered) Bish can’t even keep her prejudiced statements logical
Probably standing up for the mom who has frequently been called abusive.
Aah. Well that tracks
Oooof this was a tough read. Tell me you were the abuser without telling me you were the abuser energy…
Also: Tell me your kids do not speak to you, nor have you ever met your grandkids without saying your kids never speak to you nor have you ever met your grandkids. n
Someone needs to speak to their own kids instead of taking it out on internet strangers. Writing psycho essays to random people is not going to fix your own life.
I have a strong suspicion they're estranged from their own kids, so can't. I guess trying to project abuse-condoning bullshit onto us is the next best thing.
Looks like this person literally just comments on posts about estrangement. Projecting??
Anyone here ever screw up, feel remorse, sincerely apologize to the wronged party, and then change your behavior for the better? Yeah, me too. That's the difference between abusers and emotionally mature people. We are capable of being accountable, and don't insist on both-sidesing everything. It is absolutely possible for one person to be responsible for a conflict, and for that person to take accountability and change. It's just not possible for our estranged parents, which most of have learned over several decades of trauma.
>It is absolutely possible for one person to be responsible for a conflict, and for that person to take accountability and change. But you looked grumpy that one time I'd been screaming for an hour, therefore we've both contributed! And now it's ambiguous I can make it about emotions, make my emotions seem the biggest, make it seem the biggest emotions are the only ones that matter and now you're the one who is wrong. Or we could do your thing. But I like exploding so we'll do my thing. /jokingofcourse
I did it last Thursday with my son because I lost my shit & behaved very badly. Thankfully, he forgave me & we have moved on. Edit: I'm doing my best to do better.
I'm proud of you for taking responsibility to address your behavior. You'll do better next time. Hugs if they'll help 💜
1. Mods, thank you 2. Bitch no. My husband did not make any mistakes nor did he say or do ANYTHING for my mother (who has never met him) to be unnecessarily cruel when talking about him because he was having issues with his father abusing him. 3. I did NOTHING wrong in moving away to follow my dreams. I did not deserve to be manipulated from 1200 miles away. I did not deserve to be punished just because I wanted to follow a dream that involved moving away. I did NOTHING to deserve 30 years of manipulation and mental abuse just because I DARED go against my mother's wishes and plans. 4. You can go fuck yourself from one end of the galaxy to another, at 1 mile per hour. I need to walk away. I want to slap this bitch so hard. Sorry, obviously, I am very triggered. Going to go look at jewelry.
Hi estranged parent!
Right! Talk about projection!
This is so rude of them. Who are they to think they have even a sliver of understanding to your personal experience and lived life? Are they your therapist? Pastor? Anything to you? No, they are not.
I just saw their comment history. This person is... man, I can't even describe how gross and just plain wrong they were.
Every time they say accountability, it’s in quotes. Like they don’t even think that’s an actual word. But it’s clearly a word that’s been said to *them* many, many times. And they appear to have yet to take any actual accountability in their own life, which seems to be why they’re on the receiving end of a (deserved) estrangement. Since they’re probably blocked from their own family, they’re here spouting off nonsense instead. Preposterous. Good job with your response, OP, and thanks for banning them, mods. 🙌
*that’s not my mom that’s not my mom that’s not my mom*
I had to remind myself it wasn't either
They all operate in the same way. There’s nothing special about an abusive narcissist, just awful. Big hugs to you both (with consent)
I'm just wondering what my "big mistakes" were when I was 10 and my mother broke my front tooth in half. Or when I was 5 and she'd tell me "you'll always be fat and ugly and no one will ever love you." I'm supposed to feel sorry for her "baggage?" Nope. I have more than baggage, I have a whole matching set of luggage and a trunk, and guess what? I've never abused my child. I've never told her that I hate her. I've never called her a fat bitch. I will not reconcile with her and I have zero remorse.
As it should be!
This person's comments are nauseating and I'm sorry they messaged you. Obviously boundaries are not a thing for them so you know how they treat their children. "I can't help myself". Try harder. Telling people they must remain in abusive relationships, unless the person was convicted in court, is adding to what those people have suffered. Get out of here with that nonsense. Ugh.
Yeah, that was some serious gaslighting! Really makes me wonder what they did to their kids if conviction has to be the standard!
I don't allow people to send me messages on here. It's for the best.
The abusers always out themselves. They can’t help it, clearly 🙄
My favorite part is where they’re concerned that apologizing is harmful to the relationship. Y’all, apparently apologizing to someone you’ve hurt could cause your relationship to become “severely strained.” I guess the abuser’s behavior couldn’t possibly be to blame. LoL.
There's an assumption here that estranged adults "demand" something, but the point is... we usually don't. Sure it'd be nice if my mother apologised for all the crap she did to me, but she can't. She can't do it in herself and she has no avenue left as she doesn't know where I am or how to contact me. And even if she did, I'm pretty sure I wouldn't welcome it. I don't want pulling back into participation in my own abuse ever again. I've had enough. No contact and estrangement means: it's over. Nothing else. No contact, no dialogue, no knowing about each other, no reconciliation, no nothing. It's not a power play, though I'm not surprised a toxic person sees it that way. Even if my mother woke up with a normal functioning empathic brain, she has no way to contact me to say those things. It's done. I'm gone. For the rest of her life... and mine.
I was a little shocked the day it dawned on me that there was no point in asking for an apology, bc there truly is no possible apology that could possibly even begin to scratch the surface of fixing the mess they created. There is no possible set of words that would ever make me think, "okay, let's reestablish contact". The sheer scale of their cruelty cannot be fixed or healed or made better in the slightest. They could apologize non-stop between now and the day they die and it wouldn't make the slightest dent in their debt.
I...I feel like I wrote this! 😥
Just reply “I ain’t reading allat.”
Send that middle finger emoji
TLDR
So sorry they sent that and glad to read they have been banned. Those of us who have been abused are damned if we do and damned if we don't. How dare we remove ourselves from an unhealthy situation. Right? It's not fair to the abusers!?!They don't owe us an apology because they can't remember what they did to us? We are forcing them to grovel? That is somehow supposed to convince us we have a duty to just sweep it all under the bridge as a big misunderstanding. I can't speak for anyone else, but I seriously don't want a relationship with my FOO, even if an apology and accountability was offered up. Not a hint of a healthy relationship ever existed from the beginning until I went No Contact. There is nothing to restore and repair.
Who else here feels like their toxic family member could have written that? I’m sorry you received that.
*raises hand*
People gaslighting strangers now?
F*CK THAT PERSON.
u/fancydang thank you for posting this OP. especially since it didn't bother you (great healing work!), but you didn't want this person bothering others (if i'm remember the comments correctly). a second positive outcome for others that resulted from you taking time to post this...you helped me feel more confident in my intuition b/c it took very little time for my body to signal to my inner voice to say, "ick" while reading this. i got to grow from your post, so thank you!!
Seconded. It was very helpful.
Whoa, that is someone who really doesn't want to take accountability for harm. Fuck them
Their profile appears to reflect someone who is obsessed with Jon Benet Ramsay and minimizing others' trauma. Quite a combo
Euwwwwwwuh
WTAFing audacity. Many of us on this sub were abused - emotionally, sexually, psychologically, financially - as children and/or neglected. To assert that both the abuser and the abused contributed to a conflict is just breathtaking.
And the notion that a helpless dependent minor child carries any culpability is beyond absurd. I detest the moral laziness and sheer cowardice of assigning adult motivations to children.
They do know we were kids when this all happened and our parents were adults right
That’s a lot of words to say, “but FA-A-A-A-MILY!”
I love the 'premise then no supporting evidence' structure. Like 'Very few conflicts are ever resolved by someone apologizing and taking accountability'...then they just go on to both sides having made mistakes. There's a premise, then there's no evidence, they just change topics. Then again, the premise that if one party insists reconciliation is impossible unless the other apologizes then it is unlikely to happen...and no evidence, just saying both sides have been hurt. Again the next sentence has nothing to do with the previous one. The structure always seems to go A: Premise then B: Emotive statement that both sides are hurt, as if emotions dictate reality somehow. I guess it leads into 'we're both hurt, and I declare I'm the most hurt so I win and you should shut up' territory. I wont read further, picking through the poison isn't safe.
One takeaway from this nonsense was that it sounded to me like they were typing out the rationalizations in their head, one after another. They know perfectly well that they ought to be apologizing and making amends, but they don't want to admit culpability, so they've come up with invented reassuring mantras they have to keep repeating to themselves to feel like they still have the high ground.
Yeah, I just think that what they try to do is to engage our emotions when our emotions can be not literate in this kind of scam talking (or that's how I would describe it). So, I try and figure the structure (the structure being they give a premise/argument but then they don't give any evidence and just make an emotive claim) as a way of figuring out what to educate my own emotions on. Have to go by evidence, because they are basically masters of having big emotions and trying to force things by big emotions.
Scam talking is soooo accurate!
Yeaaaah, no. You might be sure that "both sides contributed" to the situation but if I recall correctly I was three and the asshole beating me with his belt was 32 and outweighed me by 180 pounds. Fuck that guy if he can't take accountability for that.
Somethings something glass houses something something boulders...? Seriously. If you're here to harass folks for refusing to follow your perceptions of family and how much should be tolerated in the name of blood, kindly f@ck right on outta here.
This is one big guilt trip
Looks like the message of a person who’s feeling the consequences of their actions very viscerally, it’s so bad they’re trying to externalize to strangers on the internet so you know they’re suffering and rightfully so lol
Wow of course flying monkey strangers exist. 🤦
Ahh, yes the 'ol "it takes two!" Parent child relationships are not ever equal. When parents abuse children, knowingly or not, it means children cannot ever develop normal relationships with their parents. This is just another demand to do what parents want and think the way they demand we think. They get to tell us what feelings and circumstances are real. Forever..... 🤮
they have several more comments in this subreddit (with just the first bits since theyve been blocked from the sub) and they for sure are enablers/weirdos
"Any GOOD therapist will tell you that the past is the past" That's when I knew for sure this was *unhinged* Any actually good therapist looks to see if there were past traumas informing current otherwise-unexplained challenges. But an abuser's idea of a "good" therapist is a therapist the abuser can manipulate, whom the abuser can get on their side to then gang up on the victim, who never holds the abuser accountable.
Im convince it's my mother secretly on a sub reddit. The countless times I've heard the past is the past I can't change it. No bitch hut you can take accountability, apologize, oh and not continue the same behavior.
I've never heard anyone use that phrase unless they were trying to cover up something ugly and strongarm others into agreeing.
Ummm I don’t think a conflict with a child has 2 sides. It’s a adult having a conflict with a kid, like get over yourself
Triggered parent
I went through her comment history and got nasty. Couldn’t help myself. Her comments on a lot of post are still up and they’re all vile. Have fun.
I didn’t read all of it but that’s not how conflict always work with parents. It’s the parents’ responsibility to be loving, kind and supportive and teach them how to survive as an adult. If a parent was a 💩 parent because of being selfish and lazy and not getting help for any mental illness or addictions they deserve nothing
What a toxic mess they are! I pity their kids and grandchildren (who are all hopefully estranged).
I’m sorry you got this message. I recommend turning the chat and message options off for your own mental safety. Getting weird stuff like this unprompted is absolutely menacing.
The Miami Dolphins beat the Denver Broncos 70-20 last NFL season. According to this relationship expert, it was a really close game right down to the end. GTHAFMWTS
I often have to ask what abbreviations mean, but I read that like a complete sentence! Lol Actually, this moron is positive the Dolphins didn't mean it and Denver should apologize for dirtying their uniforms. 🙄
Okay, I'm gonna ask... what does it mean? I don't get it.
Get the hell away from me with this shit (assuming I'm correct)
Many thanks.
Ooh I was so close. Missed the W and T.
What did you have with W and T? Don't forget I could be wrong!
What the shit. It doesn’t fit as well as what you had. I’m going with yours.
It's like a puzzle lol
I think most of us are realistic enough to understand that we'll never get an apology. We might get non-apologies like "I'm sorry that you misunderstood me" or "I'm sorry that you took that comment in the way you did" but those aren't real. I think a lot of us set a low bar for our parents-I wanted my mother to be less aggressive and angry, and to think about what she said to me (the old 'if you can't say anything nice, don't say anything at all'). I wanted her to stop relentlessly criticising everything-it got to the stage where her reflexive automatic response was negative, even over the most prosaic subject. I mentioned once I was going to get the pavior blocks on my drive cleaned and sealed, because I was tired of having to continually clean them and scrape up weeds from the gaps. Her response to that wasn't 'that sounds useful, I'm sure it'll look well' or anything, it was a stream of invective about how I was wasting money on something unnecessary, why was I so lazy-it didn't sound a complex task so why was I paying someone to do it, and name-calling and body-shaming saying no wonder I needed to get a company in, I'd put on so much weight that no doubt I found it too difficult. I'm not asking for an apology for the incalculable number of insults and criticism that she threw at me over the years, but I wanted her acknowledgement that it was uncalled for and she would make an attempt to be more approachable. Individually, these little insults don't amount to much, but when you've had 45 years of them, and every interaction with her followed the same critical, negative, depressing pathway, it wears you out. She isn't going to change, so all I can do is change the way I respond to her. I disagree with that user completely. I'm 60 now, and when I was young, there was no SM, no Internet, nowhere really I could turn to find support and it wasvery isolating. These days, thankfully, there is support readily available. Talking about this isn't whining or feeling sorry for yourself. I suspect that person likes the term 'snowflake' but standing up for yourself, acknowledging the harm you've suffered and taking steps to come to terms with that isn't being a snowflake-it shows a lot of insight and strength to say "this happened to me and I'm not going to accept that any longer." Saying that because the abuser doesn't remember the insult or behaviour that means it didn't happen the way the victim said it did is absolute tosh.
There's some real twisted logic in that diatribe. I suppose someone whose actions unwittingly kill another is innocent because they didn't know they did it and only guilty when a court decides it. Appropriate that they send this Easter weekend as they are expecting you to crucify yourself for the sake of keeping the peace with "family".
It’s an early April Fools joke.
I browsed their comment history and it's apparently always April 1st in their head.
There are so many things that I want to say about this post, but I’m sure that you already know them all, and it’s not like this person would listen to anything that I had to say.
Sounds to me the author was projecting hard.
If I came up to you and punched you in the face, it’s partially your fault. And the past is in the past so… Seriously, what in confirmation bias hell is this “any reputable psychologist” shit? There’s literally *hundreds* of books written by incredibly *reputable* psychologists that say accountability and penitentiaries are the basic backbones of forgiveness. Anyone with an undergrad degree in psychology can tell you that, they don’t even have to be famous or published! Somebody has been left with no contact and is *desperately* trying to *still* not take accountability. Their own family won’t talk to them so they feel the need to plead their sorry, pathetic case to a stranger. If you’re reading this, you fucked up. Own it. If you honestly don’t remember what you did, listen to people when they tell you and believe them. Nobody just decides one day “hey, you know what will totally ruin my life and upend my whole family? If I make shit up and cut my family member off. That’ll be a real hoot!” For once in your whole life, try some introspection. Think about what the *other* person is going through, put your ego in check, and if you really care about them, ask yourself: why are they upset and what can you do to help them? It doesn’t matter who’s “right” and who’s “wrong,” what matters is that you hurt them. Do better.
The funny thing is, while I would like a sincere message of apology and accountability from my parent, that’s actually NOT what I want most. What I want is change in behaviour! If he said to me, “I’m sorry I ignored you for all those years,” and meant it, yes that might feel good. But what I want him to do now is take a sincere interest in me as a person, not just as a lackey to do things for him.
I’m sorry you received that message. It was not fun to read.
It's funny that they don't remember what they did to you, but remember every single perceived slight, even if it was a sigh, that you've made against them. I didn't even read half of the response OP was given. There's just no reason for both parties to agree to have amnesia so that the abuser can feel comfortable.
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They can't MYOB because ...
They are missing a very important point. I'm not sitting here wanting to hold my family accountable. I can only speak for myself but that was never my goal. My goal was for the abuse to stop and to have a healthier relationship but the abuse never stopped and now today we don't have any relationship.