Yikes on bikes. What a mess.
Find an attorney that deals with family and adoption law in your county.
The birth mom is a pos, sorry you stuck your dick in that. Really shitty to not tell you if it’s proven the little girl is your daughter.
Please think of the little girl. You said you want your daughter if it’s confirmed she’s yours. I totally get that. But keep in mind what will be best for her. If she’s been with that family since birth they’re all she knows. I’m not an expert but I feel like taking her away from them will mess with her forever. Hopefully some sort of arrangement can be made that makes everyone happy and above all has her best interest at heart.
You realize she will probably be five or six by the time this is all done and you would be yanking that child from the only family she’s ever known.
Be a real father and leave her be with her parents, the only parents she’s ever known.
If she is even your daughter, she is with a family that loves her and all she knows is them as mom and dad.
Private adoptions are not illegal.
Please don’t traumatize the child. Think of the child’s best interest you don’t rip a child away from the only parents they’ve ever known.
Lawyer. You need one asap to establish paternity and your intent to seek custody. Steel yourself, you’re in for a long battle. You can do it.
Adding: so there’s a litany of crazy people in this thread right now. Their immediate assumptions that you somehow did something wrong without any case fact is pretty disgusting in my opinion.
Father’s have parental rights too. I’m a mother but trust me I would assist any parent in their valid and legal right to care and be responsible for their own child.
The people in this thread, suggesting that parents should not pursue their legal parental rights are in fact, ignorant and have probably never stepped foot inside of a custody court room.
You will have to prove to the court that you are a stable parent and can support the child but other opinions of your speculated past behavior is not even going to matter unless they can prove you’re doing something wrong right now and would be a danger to the child.
Uhhhh this screams toxic. The girl has already got a family who probably adores her. Don't mess that up. Especially if they can give her more than you can.
If you can’t tell by the name that I chose for my whatever it’s called on Reddit, I don’t really care. I am a birth mom to an almost 6 year old little boy that I put up for an open adoption without my sons fathers consent because at the time, my son‘s father was abusive, on meth, and alcoholic, had no morals for life, except for stealing, and doing bad things to everything around him. I understand that you are not my son’s biological father, or any type of way like that, but I could never ever think of my son being stripped, ripped, torn away from his parents. The parents that I chose for him. I know you’re only thinking about yourself and your feelings right now, but how are you not thinking about the child’s birthmother and how her feelings were during a certain timeframe in her like, how could you not feel like this is not what she thought was best for her and what she thought was best for her child. (For what I’m fixing to say might offend you, but the child grew in her body. It was her choice. I don’t care how many negative likes I get from this because I got so many negative likes on Facebook. I got so many negative likes on Reddit, Snapchat Instagram, literally every single platform possible whenever I shared my story with the world. I don’t care because I knew what was right for myself, and I knew what was right for my child, because my child could grow up in a better household than what I could give him.) I wish I was able to send a voice message to you so you can feel and hear the anger I feel in the message I am telling you right now. You have no right to judge your (possible) child’s mother for doing what she thought was right. My son looks at me like I am a family member, but nothing else he doesn’t know what kind of family member I am he knows he came for me. He knows I held him in my tummy for eight months and a week. He calls me his little hotel because that’s where he stayed for a little while; he knows that my nephews are his cousins. He knows that my mom is his grandmother. He knows that my sister is his aunt etc. etc. but when you know nothing about adoption and how the adoption process works and how the adoption life is you aren’t angry you are upset and confused. Do your research before you do any of this.
Edit: just read a few of your comments. Please explain more of what your wanting to do. In some cases in adoption when the adoptive parents adopt a child, it’s a closed adoption, which means you can’t meet the child on the other hand if it’s an open adoption, then you’re able to, but there may be legal things that you cannot do because of the circumstances that happened. He does know me as his birthmom but he fully doesn’t know what that word means yet.
You don’t know how this guy is in real life, so how could you judge someone based off of post? You don’t know why his possible baby mama decided that this is what was best for their child?
There’s an argument to be made that paid surrogacy is the equivalent of that, yes. Especially when it bypasses the rights of BOTH people involved.
The deduction OP made may/may not be the case, but that’s a valid concern that they’ve brought up.
Private adoptions are not illegal. If I were pregnant and wanted a coworker to adopt my baby and that happened and money changed hands that would not be illegal.
1) Apparently, your reading comprehension is lacking. I never asserted that it *is* trafficking, just that it would be a valid argument that it could be. Especially when parents are left out of the equation.
2) Again with the comprehension, OP absolutely stated that there were motives in play that could lead an average person to consider the “sold surrogacy” angle.
3) Wasn’t talking about you, or lack of surrogacy situation. Not part of the conversation.
When father’s permission is not sought, yes honey it is. I realize you want to justify your own choices and *maybe* YOU *were* justified in your own case to do something shitty bc something worse would have happened to your child. But there is NOTHING in this post to indicate this guy is not a loving and concerned father. Stop trying to apply your own feelings/experiences to what this poor man is going through.
i’m not downvoting you but you are just speaking as mother and downplaying a father love for their offspring this man has a right to connect and know if this child is his, afterwards a decision can be made about what’s best for the child but he has an absolute right to know he has a child. What you are saying is that a woman has all the right just because she carried the baby, that’s horrible way to think because it just takes away any feeling a man would feel for his biological child.
I’m not saying that he shouldn’t get a chance to know his child. I completely agree with it. I don’t know him as a person, so I don’t know what he is like in real life. We have an agreement with the open adoption, if you are in a good place in your life, (meaning you aren’t on drugs/an alcoholic) when my son’s biological father is 10 years sober than he is able to meet our child. My son’s biological father is almost 4 years sober which means he will be able to meet our son when he is about 12 years old. My son hasn’t asked why he has a birth mom and a regular mom and why he only has one dad yet, but I know when the time frame comes, I will be more than happy to explain it to him.
There are certain states where it is a mother state which means that the mother has 100% full rights of the child. Not sure if you’ve heard the saying that history repeats itself, but I didn’t meet my father until I was seven years old on my seventh birthday. I didn’t even know my dad existed. I was always told that my dad wasn’t ready to be a father, which that was true yes but my dad‘s family hated my mom because my mom was not a good person at the time but she is now over 16 1/2 years sober and my dad is still an alcoholic and a drug addict.
I kind of went on a little tangent with that first comment and I apologize to OP most of that I didn’t mean that in a rude/disrespectful way.
The baby is placed, and the birth mother was desperate to get AWAY from you. Your current unhinged behavior is exactly why. You're possessive & obsessive in *owning* what you consider 'yours', when nothing could be further from the case.
Rather than fucking up a bunch of settled lives to soothe your bratty, grabby, deranged fee-fees, just fucking move on with your life.
you could see it as owning what you consider yours sure.. or a father looking out for his child lmfao😭 don’t we want involved fathers like 🤣y’all are crazy. children get placed in negative foster situations constantly.. constantly. we have zero clue really any details in this situation. that baby is half his, if i had my child put up for adoption without my consent i would be ALSO trying to figure it out. it’s deluded to say it’s obsessive & possessive to CARE about their potential child.
Yall assuming a lot he does not sound unhinged…. As a mom to 4 if I found out any of mine had been swapped at birth (they weren’t ) I’d want to find out first where my bio child was and second if it was a good home…. Someone doing as he is…. It would be very hard to stop myself from reaching out after I found them…. But I’d also not want to give up the child I raised but I’d also wants its parents to know they are loved…..
It’s in most humans dna to want to find a child they have out there…..
You made a choice op and it was right in your case…. But op does not sound like your abusive ex by the little I read…. So it sounds like you’re projecting…..
She made an ILLEGAL unilateral decision…. She had no legal right….. and unless he was abusive no moral one to give away his child (by her choice the child is no longer hers….. but he never had that choice)
I thought I was pregnant when my abusive ex and I split and I was considering adoption….. no I would not have informed him(and while I don’t know if he still abuses his current wife but he’s been married 5 times sense he and i divorced so I’m going out on the limb and saying he hasn’t changed too much)
I’m not saying op should rip the child away from a happy healthy home…. But he has a right to find out if the child is even in a happy and healthy home…. Not all adopted kids are
If I adopted a child and 4 years later found out the father had never been told I’d try to co parent if he was a decent person, or have him be ‘uncle fun’ or something…. A child can’t have too much love
I’m sorry but I have to disagree with the ones telling you to leave her alone. If it was their kid LF they would do the same. First, you need to make sure that if she is your daughter you are 100% prepared to raise her before you even make contact in order to do a DNA test. If you aren’t, what are you looking for; are you willing to leave her with the adoptive parents and just have visitation? If you are sure about either of those options then making contact to do the test is next. If either of those options don’t work for you, then yes you need to leave the child where she is and leave her be.
If you do all that and the DNA test reveals she is yours, you cannot just take her away because you are a stranger to her as that could be detrimental to her. You need to slowly start seeing her maybe for the first bit an hour each time at their place and then maybe taking her to the park. Then up it to two hours etc and eventually where you have her full days and then over nights until finally she comes home with you.
As she is only 3.5 she is still young and I don’t believe she will even remember this when she is older.
All that being said, you also have to ask yourself if you are wanting this because you just found out and are hurt/angry that you weren’t given the respect of knowing from the beginning. If you find out the these are good parents and she is happy do you think you could let her be? Maybe make a deal with the adoptive parents that when she turns 16-18 they will give her a letter you have written to her and then let her decide if she wants to be a part of your life or not.
Whatever decision you make it has to be 100% what’s in the best interests of “your baby girl” and not yours. If you do choose to have contact in anyway, you will need to have a lawyer as you cannot make contact on your own.
I’m with you on the slow transition. I’m of the opinion that some of the best and healthiest relationships we form, don’t always happen at birth. There is a lot of potential in this situation to successfully co-parent with the adoptive parents if they’re amicable.
A child is not property. She’s her own person. She’s also already living a life, with people she’s knows and loves as her parents.
Just because you think she could biologically be related to you, does not mean you should just rip her from her whole world. That’s not what’s best for her. If you want to be a real father to her, you can’t do what’s best for you, you have to do what’s best for her.
Hypothetical question based off your statement. If your child was kidnapped at birth, then "legally" adopted to another family, that had no idea that they were adopting a stolen baby. 4 years later, the PI you have hired finds your baby living in a loving home. Would you let your child go?
That bond with whom that child believes is their natural parent (adopted at birth), is probably pretty strong considering the child is almost 4 years old and has an established family.
My advice is to definitely get in contact with adoptive parents about a DNA test and if the child truly is yours, to be in their life as a "family friend" or "uncle" so you can have that familial relationship that you want without traumatizing them by taking them away from everything they've ever known. Then when they're 18, graduated from school (so it won't effect them in school life) and can make their own decisions, tell them the truth.
Why? Birthmom was desperate to get away from OP. That should figure in your thinking. OP probably just wants to use toddler to re-ensnare / 'punish' birthmom, it's obvious.
None of what op has said indicates this at all….. this happens more often. Then people think… women adopting a baby out without dad’s consent without any abuse or legit reason at all…. Sometimes the reason is ‘I don’t want to tell him or he’ll have to consent’ sometimes it’s cause they don’t want the child but they don’t want to be tied to another oerson sometimes they worry they’d have to pay the dad child support sometimes the women are the ones with the control issue and if they don’t want the child well then he won’t get it either sometimes they have financial incentive sometimes family pressure to give birth and act like it never happens
(Edit cause I wasn’t done )
What kind of thought process is this? Her biological father clearly wants her and wants to take care of her.
How are people not related to her a better option? Especially when he doesn't even know them or how they are treating her.
She is 3, she will barely remember those people as she grows up.
Having cared for many kids with trauma from a young age (3 and under, often under a year) let me assure you that ripping her away from the family she knows would absolutely be harmful and traumatic and likely to cause lifelong issues. Specifically I have seen it with kids ages 3-7 who have been with foster parents their whole lives, or most of their lives, and then been returned to their parents. Even though reunification was always the plan, even though visitation and therapy have been part of the process, and even though they are statistically best off in the longterm with bio parents, severing that bond with the person or people who have raised them causes considerable and lasting trauma.
This doesn’t mean kids shouldn’t be reunified and it doesn’t mean OP shouldn’t find out of she’s his and get involved in her life and possibly even seek custody, but it’s not as simple as saying “she’s three, she won’t remember these people.” At three, she will remember them, and even if she were younger, the change would be traumatic.
Whatever OP does (assuming she IS his child) has to be done with caution, care, and counseling for all involved.
Of course you will have so.e memories but they are not as vivid as you say.
You have some, there are many people and things you don't remember, you can ask older siblings or parents.
Except you have a photographic memory or something like that.
I think kid remember more good memories than traumatic ones.
I have some very fun memories of around that age, but I had a traumatic incident that still affects me till today, but no memory of it, my parents are the ones who reminder me.
Trauma can form memories also but my memories are not super exciting from that age or necessarily
good or bad. They just are. And formed an impression.
Things like, my Uncle gave me a five pound note to share with my brother, so I ripped it in half.
Or my Nans house was near the river and it was common that the Spa next door got water in. So i went in my wellies and slipped because there was an inch or more of water on it and my pants got wet. So when we finished shopping we went back next door.
The memories, all of them are very very vivid.
They’re far more related to her. They have cared for her and loved her as their child everyday for her entire life.
Op is a complete and total stranger, who may or may not be biologically related to her but doesn’t even know and already wants to tear her life apart.
You know that allegorical story about the women fighting over a baby, where the king says he’ll split the baby and the fake parents agrees but the real parent would rather give up their child than hurt it? Op would rather split the baby and hurt his child.
And if the child’s being neglected or abused? You have no idea….. adouotive family’s can be awesome….. but they aren’t all….. and it may be his child…
If my baby was kidnapped and raised by someone else for 4 years should I just give up looking? If found should I not fight for my child?
That's why he is doing a paternity test, so he doesn't rip a stranger away from her parents.
You are forgetting OP did not have a choice in the adoption.
I know the biblical story. The other mother who wanted to spilt the baby was spiteful and jealous, and that doesn't sound like OP, that's mostly the ex.
Children make connections with lots of people, even strangers. But won't remember them as they grow, even us adults do the same.
Take the ancestry dna test. Upload it to GED match.
Wait 15 years, maybe longer, probably the longer.
There are registries that you can put your name on as “open to contact.”
You should be able to register with the adoption agency as open to contact if she ever comes looking.
Make it easy to find you.
I just held my breath as I read your post. The mother of our "grandchild" (long horridvstory) put our grandchild up for adoption. We were not allowed to adopt as the mother lied about us and said we had no right to adopt the child. I kinda freaked, hoping you were the father. Then, I read further, and that's not a possibility. Good luck to you. Please understand that they don't know you, and will be scared.
You need to be careful about this. Even if she’s your daughter she’s been with her parents for 3.5 years. I personally think that right thing to do after you confirm that she’s your daughter is to have a meeting with her parents about wanting to be involved in her life.
Hey Info, how are you even sure this kid is yours? Like. What if you're barging into this family's life and threatening to take their kid, and their kid they've raised is not biologically yours?
Also Info: Are you even prepared to raise a 3.5 year old who's just been removed from everyone and everything they've ever known? They might not understand, no matter how much you try, that "oh yeah I removed you from your loving parents because they're not related by blood!!" reasoning you try. And if you lie to them they also might not understand or would absolutely be traumatized if you lie to them. They're not going to be comfortable with you, essentially a stranger, who forced your way into their life.
I'm not even touching the legal stuff or if it's morally right or wrong, I'm thinking of this poor kid getting uprooted, and if you're prepared to deal with the kid you're possibly signing up to take. Custody arrangements like this usually snap to an instant changing schedule if you do manage to get custody, and undoubtedly the kid wouldn't be happy to see you at all and might grow up to hate you even if you're the perfect father from day 1
Imagine being a child and losing the only parents you have ever known because someone who is biologically your father wants you. Even at 3.5 the bond is extremely strong. Think of what would be best for her. Maybe getting to have partial custody with her parents?
How do you expect to get DNA of their child when they know your intentions?
If your child was adopted as an infant, I doubt that the court would take her from her adoptive parents at her age. In court, decisions are made based on the best interest of the child. You would be doing your daughter a major disservice if you pursue this. You’re only thinking about yourself and NOT about the child. Try not to rush into making a decision based on your own ego and emotions. Your child’s parents are the folks that adopted her. You are the bio dad, and should not be hasty to make claims about the child who knows nothing about you.
Technically it’s an illegal adoption if he didn’t sign his parental rights away. If he’s smart he’ll work with the family to try and figure out the best solution.
My opinion is what will be best for baby. Sometimes it’s better to let kids stay with their adoptive parents if they are treated good and first introduce you semi slowly. I think if all parents (adoptive and possible biodad )worked together this child would be very fortunate to have a group of parents that make sure the child comes first because that is who matters The Child!!!
First thing to do is to find out if she went through an adoption agency. There are laws that require a woman to notify the father before an adoption… usually an ad in the newspaper. “So and so gave birth on this date and will be putting the baby up for adoption. Speak now or forever hold your peace.”
Contact Saving our Sisters. They are experts and can help get you on the right path. But be warned, this will not be an easy road. Best chance you have is if you have any Native American blood in you. There are strict rules about adopting out babies with native blood to non natives.
I’m so sorry this happened to you. What a tragedy.
Anybody remember the name of the movie in the 80’s where this exact thing happened. Adoptive parents had to give up their 5 year old child to the father. He didn’t know about the pregnancy, but once he did, he went to court to get her and he won. True story and terribly sad. At work the next day we were all talking about it, how we thought it was unfair to remove this child from her adoptive parents. As I recall, there wasn’t a dry eye in the house.
Incorrect 2000000%. Adopted person here so I can speak first hand. Adoption can be great and give kids a life that they wouldn’t have normally gotten to live (ie me). Unless you know first hand, stay in your lane (ie not talking out of your ass with fake studies that aren’t based on real information).
No way, not all children are better off with their biological parents. I don’t need sources either. I have seen it myself. Parents had children taken away for a number of reasons, but after fighting to get them back, the child ends up dead by their biological parents. This isn’t just once, but many times.
How would I feel if I was adopted and grew up to find my biological family wanted me. I guess it depends how I was brought up. In some cases the biological parents have issues, chronic unemployment, drugs, alcoholism, poverty and you may call me a snob, but that is not a good life for a child. Just because they are your biological parents does not make them suitable.
Have you heard of The Turpin family or Ruby Franke? These are the biological parents of children that were starved, beaten and abused. Do you really think an adoptive family wouldn’t have done a better job? These cases may be high profile, but there are many cases like this found every day.
Studies do NOT show that “A child is always better with her biological parent.” Yes it is usually good for children to be raised by their biological parents or at least retain some connection with their biological family but the idea that that children are better off with biological parents who are horribly abusive, or don’t want them is completely ridiculous. Cite/ link your sources if I’m wrong.
I don't understand the comments saying you'd be cruel if you try to figure out what's going because she's in a loving adopted home. Are we all psychics? How do we know the adopted baby is treated well? How do we know they're providing a better, more love filled life than OP will? I've seen adopted kids with amazing adopted families and adopted kids who were treated like slaves. No one has any idea what's happening.
This could've been an illegal adoption where a family threw money at a woman to buy her baby, it could've been a legal adoption, the family could be amazing, the family could be a bunch of Brad Pitts, the child could be OP's, and the child might not be OPs. I just do not get the assumptions most of the commenters are making as if they know the adopted family personally.
How do you know that??? This sounds like another psychic reading. Just like how it's possible OP is a bad person, his ex could be too. How in the world do we know that OP ran his ex off instead of his ex getting offered a good deal of money to hand her child over? Or maybe even that OP is thrown off by looks but it's not actually his child?
Wow this is a potential massive can of worms.
Are you imagining that this woman was using you, planned to have you ejaculate in her on the day/surrounding days she got artificially inseminated by a paying couple? Then pretended ignorance when pregnant? And you found out the paternity through another party? Three 1/2 yrs later?
That is quite a stretch. But holy crud is it Reddit worthy. And True Crime worthy. And politics worthy (think abortion rights and paternity rights).
So much there. You have to be certain.
Do you honestly think it would be in the best interests of a nearly 4 year old to take her away from the only family she has ever known? I think this is a moment to put her needs ahead of your own.
Really? Law is what it is and he should have been notified. Obviously it's an illegal adoption. Put the lawyers and mom in jail for falsifying the records. He deserves the chance with his child.
And this child deserves to be left in peace with her family. And, assuming the parents were unaware there was anything shady going on, they deserve to live in peace with *their child*. The cruelty to both the parents and the child is just nauseating. God, to have your preschooler ripped from you after nearly four years… That’s utterly disgusting.
Then the family who did not obtain the child through proper means would recognize their responsibility and fault in the process that brought them the child in the first place.
Sad note on society when we condone the behavior of the mom and taker of someone else's child. So the Dugard girl should have stayed and the kids she had with her captor should stay because that's the family they know?
Oh, it would be easy to say regardless. See, I don’t think that having unprotected sex four years ago entitles me to rip a family apart just because I share DNA with the child. I would want to make sure they were happy and healthy and loved. I would ideally like to be updated on their well-being occasionally. And if their parents were amiable to it, I *might* like to get to know them when they’re a bit older, though that wouldn’t be a dealbreaker. As long as they’re safe and cared for, anything else is gravy. There is no universe where I would take a child away from good, loving parents just because had a genetic “claim” to them. That’s gross.
A judge doesn’t grant an adoption unless they know legal rules were followed. You can absolutely get a lawyer but it’s very possible this was all above board due to individual state legislation.
“She” didn’t bother to find you but to grant an adoption, the judge, the court, and lawyers need to be involved. They’d all have some kind of issue with the situation if the rules weren’t being followed.
Maybe she forged the birth certificate and lied about paternity? Maybe in her state “notification” counts as a newspaper ad. That is the case in some jurisdictions.
In my case, I didn’t have to serve the father if his name wasn’t on the birth certificate and I didn’t know where he lived. Some judges would have asked for us to do more to prove that we attempted to contact, but my lawyer cited precedent in previous cases and the judge granted it.
Yes get a lawyer, but I have a hard time believing that a judge granted an adoption without the law being followed.
Okay but even if the law was followed. Like let's say she said I don't know who the father is, so that would fall inside the she can't notify him type of clause. Now that he's "found" can he actually get this adoption reversed? And will she get In some kind of trouble for this?
No. Husband's are automatically assumed to be the father even if the wife/ biirth mother cheated on him.
So OP doesn't have a leg to stand on if he's NOT on the birth cert.
Also if you knew she was pregnant and moved away, why didn’t you go ahead and hire a lawyer anyway? They have PIs you know. That’s like a huge part of their job. She would have been easily found and made to submit to a paternity test. You didn’t do that for 4 years. Not a good look.
Why is she so adamant about hiding from you? Is she evil, or maybe was she scared? My partner was abusive and even without medical records proving it, I saved every text and documented every instance of his scary threatening behavior. There was clearly a reason why she moved out of town.
Where did she move to? Would it really have been that hard to figure out at least what state she was in?
You failed in every front as a bio parent here, sorry. You’re looking at a long uphill road if you want to take this on.
Why disrupt a child’s life? They are happy and with stable parents, no?
Again I am not the original poster I just had questions and thought you might know the answer. This is very dear to my heart as it happened to my closest friend and she's 42 And this still shapes a big part of her life.
I can only speak on what I was told in my situation in my jurisdiction: if the fathers name is not on the birth certificate, it was possible to grant an adoption (in my case a step parent adoption) without notification and no i couldn’t get in trouble and the adoption is irrevocable.
In a situation like yours where it sounds like bio mom signed her right away, my understanding is that this process is even longer, more expensive, and more intense.
But I was told in my jurisdiction that even if he contested the adoption if he found out, the lack of contact, monetary support, etc was a very strong case against the biodad but that is also because he knew I was pregnant with his child.
So again, hiring a lawyer is fine, and they will clarify all these things for you and let you know if you have a case or not. I’m simply correcting your assertion that she has done something wrong or illegal because it’s very possible that she did not violate the law.
Are you even sure this adoption was done thru the courts?
Did you know she was pregnant? Did she know it was yours, was there violence involved, etc etc.
It just really depends on your circumstances and the jurisdiction. I was told by my lawyer that in my specific situation of stepparent adoption where there were no parental rights needing to be taken away, the adoption is sealed and done.
In her jurisdiction and because she potentially had to sign her rights away, I’d assume the bar was set even higher before an adoption was granted. But I can’t speak on how sealed the decision is.
Generally I don’t think courts casually reverse adoptions.
You’d have a very high burden of evidence: you’d have to prove that she took steps to evade you. You have to provide receipts of that.
Where did she move to? I moved back to my parents house and he threatened to get lawyers involved. When I told my attorney this, she laughed. “You didn’t move to Russia honey”. Which means that you could absolutely have hired a lawyer in the meantime and had a PI track her down and chose not to.
My bio parent did not do that either. He would have been shit out of luck if he contested.
Just to be clear I'm not op. My dearest friend in this world grew up in the foster system. Her mom was a crackhead. I mean legit tin foil on the windows, eating cold hot dogs for dinner and not having electric most days. So obviously my friend was taken by the system. And her mother said she didn't know who the father was. So there was nobody for her to go to because all the other family was deceased or too old.
Flash forward to when she's 18... Six foster homes between age 12 and 18, and she still had some contact with her mother when her mother would have periods of being clean from drugs. Mother finally admits who her father is. Tells her that "I'll be damned if that man would get my kid!"
So my friend did reach out to her dad, DNA test confirmed it and they did have a relationship for the next 10 years before he died. Unfortunately he was already sick by the time she found him right before she was 20.
That woman hated her ex so much that she punished her child, because those foster homes are no Cakewalk! And the only reason she did it was because he would have "won" over her If he got custody since she couldn't keep custody.
So I have a big problem with this whole situation because my friend would have done anything to be able to get out of the system and live with her father. And her father would have been fighting for her if he even knew about her!
But it just seems really messed up that a woman can lie and if it's proven later that she lied she doesn't face any consequences? And it's really messed up for the poor child! We don't know if she's in good situation or a bad situation! We don't know if she's happy. And it's not fair to her when she has one parent that desperately is trying to get her back, but obviously these new people want her too! And of course she's way too young to make any decisions. It's just a mess and there's no clear-cut answer!
It reminds me also of those switched at birth babies. There was one set that the one family wanted both kids! They wanted the one they've been raising as their own but they also wanted the one that's genetically theirs! LOL but in most of these cases the kids end up dealing with the worst of it because they have two families fighting over them. Like this girl.
I feel bad because her dad should have the right to raise her. And I understand what he said about now that he found out he only has a short amount of time to take action before his inaction can be used against him.
Don't know I'm probably rambling now sorry! This one's just really getting to me.
That's terrible, but OP said this child was adopted, so the child is not in any foster care system. I would go by best interests of the child. If she's with a loving family, it would be cruel and harmful to just rip her away from the only family she's known since birth.
I’m truly sorry your friend went through that, but her situation was nothing like what OP is describing. OP said that the child was adopted, not in the foster system. He gave no indication that he had reason to believe the child was being mistreated in any way. As far as we know, this child is being raised in a loving family. Why should she be subjected to the trauma of being ripped away from them?
If any parent cared enough they could have easily hired a lawyer, found her, and established contact. It’s not hard.
I’m a teacher and have seen trauma kids in my classroom whose moms prevent family from finding them. To the point of telling the kids to spend 8 hours in the trunk of a car to hide.
One student came to me after being found walking into a gas station, barefoot and with a toddler sibling in tow, asking for food because they were hungry. His mom evaded authorities for years.
You know who DIDNT do ANYTHING to try and find his kids? You guessed it. The fucking parent.
Yes your friends mom is shitty. But so was her biodad. The mom could have been found and her biodad also failed her. This isn’t a situation of one evil woman lying and therefore the courts just punish everyone. It takes two. If you want your kids, hire a lawyer. Especially if they end up in foster it’s even easier for a bio parent to find them!!!
No excuse for the father here.
Actually he didn't know. They were together and dating and then she just disappeared and he thought she was going on one of her binges and figured that was enough he's done! He didn't hear from her for a while and he just quit trying.
He was quite surprised to find out he had a 18-19 year-old kid!
🙋🏽 I am, and this little girl absolutely should stay with “these people”. “These people” are her *parents*. She’s nearly four!! “These people” are her entire world.
I remember being four. I remember how the only people in the universe I wanted when I was sick or scared or tired or just wanted a cuddle were my parents. I remember crying myself to sleep because they had one single date night and a babysitter had to tuck me in, and I remember waking up and crawling into their bed when they got home. If some stranger tried to take me from them just because he shared some DNA with me, I probably would’ve gone feral. People talk about adoption trauma, but *that* is the only thing that would have traumatized me. Genetics don’t matter, *family* matters. And if this little girl’s family loves her half as much as mine loved me and my siblings, taking her from them would be the cruelest torture.
And now that I’m an adult and have a four year old nephew…god help anyone who tried to take him from me. We may not share a shred of DNA, but that little boy is my everything. There is *nothing* I wouldn’t do to hold onto him, and I’m just the cool aunt who spoils him on the weekends. I can’t imagine how his *parents* would feel.
OP is trying to get full custody. That isnt in the childs best interest and it demonstrates that he isnt fit to be a good parent to her bc hes putting his desires first.
I’m sorry that was your experience and that you feel that way, but I think your perception is skewed. I’ve been active in the adoption community my entire life. I’ve been part of groups dedicated to locating biological relatives, which I participated in to support a close friend who felt that way. I’ve counseled parents considering adoption, and I’ve counseled adopted kids of all ages. I’ve been part of groups who feel like they adoption trauma and groups that feel nothing of the sort. In my own family (one bio kid, the other siblings and cousins all adopted), I have a cousin who is mildly interested in learning about his heritage, another who really doesn’t give a crap either way, a brother who did genetic testing to find out his medical background but refused to share his results publicly because he doesn’t want to risk randos contacting him claiming to be “family” because they have overlapping genetics. And in my lifelong experience with the wider adoption community, I’ve seen much the same distribution of feelings, with a similarly sized subset that is actively looking for biological relatives, though most of them are looking to *add* to their family, not replace their adopted family.
Having passively watched in the groups geared toward adoptees with trauma who may or may not be trying to find their bio relations, I can see how being exposed to that population would give you the sense that “most” adoptees feel that way.
I had a great life. I also work with thousands of adoptees and most of them say the same thing. But this is Reddit where nobody thinks a man can take care of a child.
His gender doesnt matter. my view would be very different if this was a 6 month old baby. this child has a l9ng, established relationship with her parents and he wants full custody, which is cruel.
If she has a wonderful family who love her and take care of her why would you want to uproot her entire life and all she knows? This will be very traumatic for her. You are a stranger to her. That’s really unfair. You’re the adult and need to come to terms with this for her sake. Stop all legal action. Get therapy. You are reacting to being lied to and not considering what’s is best for this child. If you continue this pursuit it really just says everything about what kind of person you are.
I am adopted and my oldest is adopted. I personally have no interest in seeking out my biological family. My parents are beyond amazing and I am perfectly happy. However my 4 year old has an amazing relationship with his maternal siblings. His Biomom is an active drug addict. She claimed to not know who bio dad was. Before we finalized, we had to post in the paper her name along with son’s birthdate and possible time frame of conception. It literally said if you think you may be the father of this child please contact “lawyer.” It is probably all above board.
My husband is adopted and feels the same way. He showed me the paperwork his birth mother filled out and she provided a lot of detail. Reading it you could tell it broke her heart to have to give him up. She was a widow and he was her fifth child. The child born previous to him had a lot of heath problems and was confined to a wheelchair. She just could not care for an infant on top of everything going on in her life. He never was interested in finding her, as his family was a typical upper-middle class highly educated family. The social worker wrote a detailed description of bio-mom. I imagine that our daughter looks a lot like her, as our daughter favors her father. He has strong Mediterranean genes and is a very handsome intelligent man. As are both of our children. I pray for her, even though she may no longer be alive. I can understand only in that just prior to losing my parents in my 20s I was told that my father was not my bio-dad. I never had any idea. How loved was I, that both of my parents held on to this without me knowing for all of those years? My father (regardless) was the most special man in my life. Both of my parents were just the best people, the whole town thought very highly of them. I feel blessed that I was put first, at the worst time of their marriage. My father stayed for all of us, he also adored my mother (who had a momentary lapse in judgement, she’s human.) I’m glad you and your son have loving families. ❤️
Absolutely wrong. Speaking as an adoptee, who was wanted by my biological parents, this child needs to be with her biological father. He has rights. His rights supersede the adoptive parents right to this child. They don’t get to make a family by taking away someone else’s kid. If he is the biological father and he wants his child, he should not have her taken from him like this.
There’s plenty of data about adoption trauma - which begins at birth - and the need for and undeniable benefit of biological ties.
More mansplaining 'property rights' bullshit.
OP had fun having sex & squirted, and birthmom fled him.
And now, FOUR FUCKING YEARS LATER, OP decides to do something about it.
Talking property rights, the adoptive parents win by adverse possession & maintenance.
Wouldn't it be best for them to work it out so that the child could have adoptive family and bio dad in her life? These are human beings - can you imagine if your 4 year old was taken from you?
She’s his child. Adoptive parents aren’t entitled to someone else’s child to build their families. I can sympathise with them, but if what OP says is true, they were also screwed by the birth mother. From what my biological parents told me, losing me at birth was devastating. It destroyed their family. It destroyed several families as the trauma was unresolved and my biological parents both had deep wounds. Have. My biological siblings, some of whom didn’t know about me until recently, have had to wrestle with the grief and loss they felt as well.
My biological parents were manipulated by the agency to give me up for the benefit of the intended adoptive parents.
That’s what my biological parents said, and I believe them based upon the actions of my adoptive parents. This child deserves to know her family.
I have to wonder though: if OP is not sharing the entire story. Why was the mother so insistent on keeping/ hiding the child from him? Was there some sort of abuse situation?
Well there is a blatant answer that you seem to easily avoid and could very easily be some mixture of greed, selfishness and image.
You see if she had told him that she was pregnant and he was willing to do the work and raise the child she could very easily be on the hook to pay him child support for 18 years.
Giving up the baby to others, even if she wasn't paid a penny, absolves her of financial responsibilities and even having anything else to do with it.
If it's known by family or friends, PUBLICLY, that she has a kid but has no part in raising it could be labeled a DEADBEAT MOTHER.
And of course could just be a pure money grab where she was given money or gifts.
There’s a blatant bias. But most of the internet seems to have a positive opinion about adoption and a negative opinion on adoptees sharing their experiences with or opinions of adoption.
As a paralegal, not giving you legal advice, I can tell you that this will cost you a boatload of money and will be very hard to prove.
I strongly suggest that you discuss this with at least three actual family law attorneys licensed to practice in your state. They can give you better advice than anyone on Reddit. You’d better be all in, too. These bitches ain’t cheap.
Someone shared the FL one above, here’s one [from Michigan](https://www.mlive.com/news/grand-rapids/2022/06/boy-to-remain-with-adoptive-parents-over-birth-father-based-on-michigan-supreme-court-ruling.html?outputType=amp) that wasn’t that long ago.
[This article](https://www.abc4.com/news/digital-exclusives/no-consent-from-fathers-required-man-speaks-out-about-utahs-adoption-laws/) from 2022 points out the laws in Utah that allow unmarried women to place their babies up for adoption without the consent of the father if the baby is under 6 months of age.
There ARE cases of pending adoptions being stopped, the most widely known is the [baby Jessica case](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baby_Jessica_case) (Wikipedia because of the age of the case predating consistent internet news article uploads) and a more recent one being [Christopher Emmanuel’s case](https://wach.com/amp/news/wachfox-investigates/sc-man-wins-custody-of-his-daughter-after-she-was-adopted-without-his-permission). But in both cases, even though the fight took years, the adoptions were never finalized. In Emmanuel’s case, there was a failure in the putative father registry in notifying him of both the birth and start of the adoption process of his child. And even that is a toss up, [Andrew Myers](https://www.wbtv.com/story/38152690/5-year-old-rock-hill-girl-to-stay-with-adoptive-parents-likely-ending-custody-battle/?outputType=amp) was in jail for fraud at the time his child was born and the adoption was started. His crimes did not indicate he was a danger to his child or would be in jail for an extended period of time that would warrant termination of his rights but despite that his rights were terminated because he did not meet the child or provide financial support to the child (who was born while he was in jail). The state Supreme Court held up the adoption in 2018.
[This is a recent case from Florida.](https://www.abcactionnews.com/news/local-news/i-team-investigates/father-fights-for-baby-girl-placed-for-adoption-without-his-knowledge-consent)
But there are many like this. Turning over adoptions are very very difficult.
You should talk to a lawyer. I doubt that you will be able to claim a child that was adopted 3.5 years ago. Courts rule in the best interest of the child, not what adults think is “fair.” What information did you recently receive about the child, and from who?
And there is plenty of research on adoption trauma showing it is in the best interest of the child to maintain biological ties - the American adoption system is set up for profit, not best interest. It’s actually likely in the best interest of the child at this point to have a split custody arrangement with the biological father.
I am unsure how you think you'll be able to get the DNA of a child that isn't legally yours.
If some stranger contacted me and said they wanted DNA from my legally adopted child, I would call the cops on them.
I have empathy for OP but… doing what is best for the baby is the most important objective. If OP can afford a lawyer they have the means to get a DNA test.
The kid is 3.5 years old. Unless OP lives in a state with weird laws, I think it would be really difficult to get a judge to agree. It's too emotionally damaging for the kid.
When I was pregnant with my first child I was offered a lot of money to give her up. I wasn't sure what I wanted to do and I talked to a friend who had adopted out her children and she got me in touch with some people and even though it's illegal they offered me a huge amount of money for"care" during pregnancy. But of course I would give the child to them at the end to adopt it. I chose not to, But I found out it's a whole thing. The richer the person is the more they are okay with throwing at you to get what they want.
OP says that she had talked about being a surrogate so I wonder if she knew of a family that wanted a baby and she purposely got knocked up so she could get paid to be a surrogate? Or just to make them a baby?
Leave her alone.
You were with a woman to conceive a child but you didn’t keep in touch enough to know whether she conceived your child?
The ship has sailed. Leave the kid alone and don’t mess with her life.
That child deserves to know her bio family, especially if she grows up to believe her bio father didn’t want her. What a disgusting thing to say. Men get stiffed for child support but aren’t supposed to want to know their own child! Wow.
Men get told they are deadbeats for not being involved but, when they get involved, people like those in this comment section, ask why he is disrupting the child's life m
Yikes on bikes. What a mess. Find an attorney that deals with family and adoption law in your county. The birth mom is a pos, sorry you stuck your dick in that. Really shitty to not tell you if it’s proven the little girl is your daughter. Please think of the little girl. You said you want your daughter if it’s confirmed she’s yours. I totally get that. But keep in mind what will be best for her. If she’s been with that family since birth they’re all she knows. I’m not an expert but I feel like taking her away from them will mess with her forever. Hopefully some sort of arrangement can be made that makes everyone happy and above all has her best interest at heart.
You realize she will probably be five or six by the time this is all done and you would be yanking that child from the only family she’s ever known. Be a real father and leave her be with her parents, the only parents she’s ever known.
If she is even your daughter, she is with a family that loves her and all she knows is them as mom and dad. Private adoptions are not illegal. Please don’t traumatize the child. Think of the child’s best interest you don’t rip a child away from the only parents they’ve ever known.
Private adoption without the permission of both parents is illegal though
Agree. I asked OP how he even found that information out. I’ll be curious to see if he even replies.
Lawyer. ASAP. Fight to get your child back.
Yeah! Cause drama in her life and rip her from the only parents she's ever known! It's totally within your rights to destroy this child's life. /s
Lawyer. You need one asap to establish paternity and your intent to seek custody. Steel yourself, you’re in for a long battle. You can do it. Adding: so there’s a litany of crazy people in this thread right now. Their immediate assumptions that you somehow did something wrong without any case fact is pretty disgusting in my opinion. Father’s have parental rights too. I’m a mother but trust me I would assist any parent in their valid and legal right to care and be responsible for their own child. The people in this thread, suggesting that parents should not pursue their legal parental rights are in fact, ignorant and have probably never stepped foot inside of a custody court room. You will have to prove to the court that you are a stable parent and can support the child but other opinions of your speculated past behavior is not even going to matter unless they can prove you’re doing something wrong right now and would be a danger to the child.
All this girl knows is her family she's been with since birth. Think about the best interests of the child.
Uhhhh this screams toxic. The girl has already got a family who probably adores her. Don't mess that up. Especially if they can give her more than you can.
? A man wanting to be responsible for his bio child is toxic? Color me neon green then baby
INFO: Why do *you* think this child's mother went to these lengths to keep you ignorant of the pregnancy and her decision to relinquish the baby?
Info: unless there was abuse, which will need to be proven, then her magical reasons do not matter to the court.
If you can’t tell by the name that I chose for my whatever it’s called on Reddit, I don’t really care. I am a birth mom to an almost 6 year old little boy that I put up for an open adoption without my sons fathers consent because at the time, my son‘s father was abusive, on meth, and alcoholic, had no morals for life, except for stealing, and doing bad things to everything around him. I understand that you are not my son’s biological father, or any type of way like that, but I could never ever think of my son being stripped, ripped, torn away from his parents. The parents that I chose for him. I know you’re only thinking about yourself and your feelings right now, but how are you not thinking about the child’s birthmother and how her feelings were during a certain timeframe in her like, how could you not feel like this is not what she thought was best for her and what she thought was best for her child. (For what I’m fixing to say might offend you, but the child grew in her body. It was her choice. I don’t care how many negative likes I get from this because I got so many negative likes on Facebook. I got so many negative likes on Reddit, Snapchat Instagram, literally every single platform possible whenever I shared my story with the world. I don’t care because I knew what was right for myself, and I knew what was right for my child, because my child could grow up in a better household than what I could give him.) I wish I was able to send a voice message to you so you can feel and hear the anger I feel in the message I am telling you right now. You have no right to judge your (possible) child’s mother for doing what she thought was right. My son looks at me like I am a family member, but nothing else he doesn’t know what kind of family member I am he knows he came for me. He knows I held him in my tummy for eight months and a week. He calls me his little hotel because that’s where he stayed for a little while; he knows that my nephews are his cousins. He knows that my mom is his grandmother. He knows that my sister is his aunt etc. etc. but when you know nothing about adoption and how the adoption process works and how the adoption life is you aren’t angry you are upset and confused. Do your research before you do any of this. Edit: just read a few of your comments. Please explain more of what your wanting to do. In some cases in adoption when the adoptive parents adopt a child, it’s a closed adoption, which means you can’t meet the child on the other hand if it’s an open adoption, then you’re able to, but there may be legal things that you cannot do because of the circumstances that happened. He does know me as his birthmom but he fully doesn’t know what that word means yet.
How could SHE not think of HIM when she was doing this objectively shitty thing?
You don’t know how this guy is in real life, so how could you judge someone based off of post? You don’t know why his possible baby mama decided that this is what was best for their child?
You dont know how this broad is in real life. She may have SOLD his baby. Wtf is wrong with you?
From what I’m hearing is you think adoption is child trafficking?
There’s an argument to be made that paid surrogacy is the equivalent of that, yes. Especially when it bypasses the rights of BOTH people involved. The deduction OP made may/may not be the case, but that’s a valid concern that they’ve brought up.
Private adoptions are not illegal. If I were pregnant and wanted a coworker to adopt my baby and that happened and money changed hands that would not be illegal.
That in and of itself is not, but (if they were known), do you think you should be able to circumvent the other contributors parental rights?
No. I’m just saying private adoptions are not illegal.
*when done correctly.
Can I ask, what are your resources that “paid surrogacy is basically child trafficking”
Neither was OPs (POSSIBLE) child
My situation wasn’t a paid surrogacy tho.
1) Apparently, your reading comprehension is lacking. I never asserted that it *is* trafficking, just that it would be a valid argument that it could be. Especially when parents are left out of the equation. 2) Again with the comprehension, OP absolutely stated that there were motives in play that could lead an average person to consider the “sold surrogacy” angle. 3) Wasn’t talking about you, or lack of surrogacy situation. Not part of the conversation.
I would like to note that I am on the spectrum so some things I don’t fully understand that’s why I asked.
Correct. It must at least be investigated.
When father’s permission is not sought, yes honey it is. I realize you want to justify your own choices and *maybe* YOU *were* justified in your own case to do something shitty bc something worse would have happened to your child. But there is NOTHING in this post to indicate this guy is not a loving and concerned father. Stop trying to apply your own feelings/experiences to what this poor man is going through.
i’m not downvoting you but you are just speaking as mother and downplaying a father love for their offspring this man has a right to connect and know if this child is his, afterwards a decision can be made about what’s best for the child but he has an absolute right to know he has a child. What you are saying is that a woman has all the right just because she carried the baby, that’s horrible way to think because it just takes away any feeling a man would feel for his biological child.
I’m not saying that he shouldn’t get a chance to know his child. I completely agree with it. I don’t know him as a person, so I don’t know what he is like in real life. We have an agreement with the open adoption, if you are in a good place in your life, (meaning you aren’t on drugs/an alcoholic) when my son’s biological father is 10 years sober than he is able to meet our child. My son’s biological father is almost 4 years sober which means he will be able to meet our son when he is about 12 years old. My son hasn’t asked why he has a birth mom and a regular mom and why he only has one dad yet, but I know when the time frame comes, I will be more than happy to explain it to him. There are certain states where it is a mother state which means that the mother has 100% full rights of the child. Not sure if you’ve heard the saying that history repeats itself, but I didn’t meet my father until I was seven years old on my seventh birthday. I didn’t even know my dad existed. I was always told that my dad wasn’t ready to be a father, which that was true yes but my dad‘s family hated my mom because my mom was not a good person at the time but she is now over 16 1/2 years sober and my dad is still an alcoholic and a drug addict. I kind of went on a little tangent with that first comment and I apologize to OP most of that I didn’t mean that in a rude/disrespectful way.
The baby is placed, and the birth mother was desperate to get AWAY from you. Your current unhinged behavior is exactly why. You're possessive & obsessive in *owning* what you consider 'yours', when nothing could be further from the case. Rather than fucking up a bunch of settled lives to soothe your bratty, grabby, deranged fee-fees, just fucking move on with your life.
you could see it as owning what you consider yours sure.. or a father looking out for his child lmfao😭 don’t we want involved fathers like 🤣y’all are crazy. children get placed in negative foster situations constantly.. constantly. we have zero clue really any details in this situation. that baby is half his, if i had my child put up for adoption without my consent i would be ALSO trying to figure it out. it’s deluded to say it’s obsessive & possessive to CARE about their potential child.
!!!!! The only person I can actually agree with!
Yall assuming a lot he does not sound unhinged…. As a mom to 4 if I found out any of mine had been swapped at birth (they weren’t ) I’d want to find out first where my bio child was and second if it was a good home…. Someone doing as he is…. It would be very hard to stop myself from reaching out after I found them…. But I’d also not want to give up the child I raised but I’d also wants its parents to know they are loved….. It’s in most humans dna to want to find a child they have out there….. You made a choice op and it was right in your case…. But op does not sound like your abusive ex by the little I read…. So it sounds like you’re projecting….. She made an ILLEGAL unilateral decision…. She had no legal right….. and unless he was abusive no moral one to give away his child (by her choice the child is no longer hers….. but he never had that choice) I thought I was pregnant when my abusive ex and I split and I was considering adoption….. no I would not have informed him(and while I don’t know if he still abuses his current wife but he’s been married 5 times sense he and i divorced so I’m going out on the limb and saying he hasn’t changed too much) I’m not saying op should rip the child away from a happy healthy home…. But he has a right to find out if the child is even in a happy and healthy home…. Not all adopted kids are If I adopted a child and 4 years later found out the father had never been told I’d try to co parent if he was a decent person, or have him be ‘uncle fun’ or something…. A child can’t have too much love
I’m sorry but I have to disagree with the ones telling you to leave her alone. If it was their kid LF they would do the same. First, you need to make sure that if she is your daughter you are 100% prepared to raise her before you even make contact in order to do a DNA test. If you aren’t, what are you looking for; are you willing to leave her with the adoptive parents and just have visitation? If you are sure about either of those options then making contact to do the test is next. If either of those options don’t work for you, then yes you need to leave the child where she is and leave her be. If you do all that and the DNA test reveals she is yours, you cannot just take her away because you are a stranger to her as that could be detrimental to her. You need to slowly start seeing her maybe for the first bit an hour each time at their place and then maybe taking her to the park. Then up it to two hours etc and eventually where you have her full days and then over nights until finally she comes home with you. As she is only 3.5 she is still young and I don’t believe she will even remember this when she is older. All that being said, you also have to ask yourself if you are wanting this because you just found out and are hurt/angry that you weren’t given the respect of knowing from the beginning. If you find out the these are good parents and she is happy do you think you could let her be? Maybe make a deal with the adoptive parents that when she turns 16-18 they will give her a letter you have written to her and then let her decide if she wants to be a part of your life or not. Whatever decision you make it has to be 100% what’s in the best interests of “your baby girl” and not yours. If you do choose to have contact in anyway, you will need to have a lawyer as you cannot make contact on your own.
I’m with you on the slow transition. I’m of the opinion that some of the best and healthiest relationships we form, don’t always happen at birth. There is a lot of potential in this situation to successfully co-parent with the adoptive parents if they’re amicable.
A child is not property. She’s her own person. She’s also already living a life, with people she’s knows and loves as her parents. Just because you think she could biologically be related to you, does not mean you should just rip her from her whole world. That’s not what’s best for her. If you want to be a real father to her, you can’t do what’s best for you, you have to do what’s best for her.
Hypothetical question based off your statement. If your child was kidnapped at birth, then "legally" adopted to another family, that had no idea that they were adopting a stolen baby. 4 years later, the PI you have hired finds your baby living in a loving home. Would you let your child go?
That bond with whom that child believes is their natural parent (adopted at birth), is probably pretty strong considering the child is almost 4 years old and has an established family. My advice is to definitely get in contact with adoptive parents about a DNA test and if the child truly is yours, to be in their life as a "family friend" or "uncle" so you can have that familial relationship that you want without traumatizing them by taking them away from everything they've ever known. Then when they're 18, graduated from school (so it won't effect them in school life) and can make their own decisions, tell them the truth.
Why? Birthmom was desperate to get away from OP. That should figure in your thinking. OP probably just wants to use toddler to re-ensnare / 'punish' birthmom, it's obvious.
None of what op has said indicates this at all….. this happens more often. Then people think… women adopting a baby out without dad’s consent without any abuse or legit reason at all…. Sometimes the reason is ‘I don’t want to tell him or he’ll have to consent’ sometimes it’s cause they don’t want the child but they don’t want to be tied to another oerson sometimes they worry they’d have to pay the dad child support sometimes the women are the ones with the control issue and if they don’t want the child well then he won’t get it either sometimes they have financial incentive sometimes family pressure to give birth and act like it never happens (Edit cause I wasn’t done )
What kind of thought process is this? Her biological father clearly wants her and wants to take care of her. How are people not related to her a better option? Especially when he doesn't even know them or how they are treating her. She is 3, she will barely remember those people as she grows up.
Having cared for many kids with trauma from a young age (3 and under, often under a year) let me assure you that ripping her away from the family she knows would absolutely be harmful and traumatic and likely to cause lifelong issues. Specifically I have seen it with kids ages 3-7 who have been with foster parents their whole lives, or most of their lives, and then been returned to their parents. Even though reunification was always the plan, even though visitation and therapy have been part of the process, and even though they are statistically best off in the longterm with bio parents, severing that bond with the person or people who have raised them causes considerable and lasting trauma. This doesn’t mean kids shouldn’t be reunified and it doesn’t mean OP shouldn’t find out of she’s his and get involved in her life and possibly even seek custody, but it’s not as simple as saying “she’s three, she won’t remember these people.” At three, she will remember them, and even if she were younger, the change would be traumatic. Whatever OP does (assuming she IS his child) has to be done with caution, care, and counseling for all involved.
Easy. Adoptive family CHOSE her.
And dad didn’t get a choice at all
I have very many vivid and strong memories from being 3.
So do I-mostly traumatic. At the same time as an NPE, I would love to know that my biofather cared, but I doubt he ever knew.
Of course you will have so.e memories but they are not as vivid as you say. You have some, there are many people and things you don't remember, you can ask older siblings or parents. Except you have a photographic memory or something like that.
Are you really saying that it's ok to do traumatic things to children because they won't remember it??? That's your position?
A 3 1/2-year-old will remember. This is not a two month old. And by the time this gets all settled, the daughter will be five or six . This is tragic
When did I say that? We are talking about memories, not the child of OP.
Nope. no photographic memory but I remember many things very clearly from that age. Without a traumatic incident.
I think kid remember more good memories than traumatic ones. I have some very fun memories of around that age, but I had a traumatic incident that still affects me till today, but no memory of it, my parents are the ones who reminder me.
Trauma can form memories also but my memories are not super exciting from that age or necessarily good or bad. They just are. And formed an impression. Things like, my Uncle gave me a five pound note to share with my brother, so I ripped it in half. Or my Nans house was near the river and it was common that the Spa next door got water in. So i went in my wellies and slipped because there was an inch or more of water on it and my pants got wet. So when we finished shopping we went back next door. The memories, all of them are very very vivid.
They’re far more related to her. They have cared for her and loved her as their child everyday for her entire life. Op is a complete and total stranger, who may or may not be biologically related to her but doesn’t even know and already wants to tear her life apart. You know that allegorical story about the women fighting over a baby, where the king says he’ll split the baby and the fake parents agrees but the real parent would rather give up their child than hurt it? Op would rather split the baby and hurt his child.
And if the child’s being neglected or abused? You have no idea….. adouotive family’s can be awesome….. but they aren’t all….. and it may be his child… If my baby was kidnapped and raised by someone else for 4 years should I just give up looking? If found should I not fight for my child?
That's why he is doing a paternity test, so he doesn't rip a stranger away from her parents. You are forgetting OP did not have a choice in the adoption. I know the biblical story. The other mother who wanted to spilt the baby was spiteful and jealous, and that doesn't sound like OP, that's mostly the ex. Children make connections with lots of people, even strangers. But won't remember them as they grow, even us adults do the same.
OP *is* the stranger, and a fucking child thief-wannabe at this point.
Take the ancestry dna test. Upload it to GED match. Wait 15 years, maybe longer, probably the longer. There are registries that you can put your name on as “open to contact.” You should be able to register with the adoption agency as open to contact if she ever comes looking. Make it easy to find you.
I just held my breath as I read your post. The mother of our "grandchild" (long horridvstory) put our grandchild up for adoption. We were not allowed to adopt as the mother lied about us and said we had no right to adopt the child. I kinda freaked, hoping you were the father. Then, I read further, and that's not a possibility. Good luck to you. Please understand that they don't know you, and will be scared.
Sounds like you're shitting all over your own daughter. Gee, I wonder *why* she wouldn't want her baby going to you.
I question your reading comprehension because I took her to be writing about her son's ex.
You need to be careful about this. Even if she’s your daughter she’s been with her parents for 3.5 years. I personally think that right thing to do after you confirm that she’s your daughter is to have a meeting with her parents about wanting to be involved in her life.
This!
This!!
To be honest I got this idea from one of the TV shows I watch (I need to catch up on it). It was a slightly different situation.
Hey Info, how are you even sure this kid is yours? Like. What if you're barging into this family's life and threatening to take their kid, and their kid they've raised is not biologically yours? Also Info: Are you even prepared to raise a 3.5 year old who's just been removed from everyone and everything they've ever known? They might not understand, no matter how much you try, that "oh yeah I removed you from your loving parents because they're not related by blood!!" reasoning you try. And if you lie to them they also might not understand or would absolutely be traumatized if you lie to them. They're not going to be comfortable with you, essentially a stranger, who forced your way into their life. I'm not even touching the legal stuff or if it's morally right or wrong, I'm thinking of this poor kid getting uprooted, and if you're prepared to deal with the kid you're possibly signing up to take. Custody arrangements like this usually snap to an instant changing schedule if you do manage to get custody, and undoubtedly the kid wouldn't be happy to see you at all and might grow up to hate you even if you're the perfect father from day 1
Well said. OP sounds enraged & aggrieved, NOT interested in the CHILD'S best interests.
Imagine being a child and losing the only parents you have ever known because someone who is biologically your father wants you. Even at 3.5 the bond is extremely strong. Think of what would be best for her. Maybe getting to have partial custody with her parents? How do you expect to get DNA of their child when they know your intentions?
He can get a DNA test done by a court order.
I have very many strong memories from being 3.
Irrelevant to that comment.
If your child was adopted as an infant, I doubt that the court would take her from her adoptive parents at her age. In court, decisions are made based on the best interest of the child. You would be doing your daughter a major disservice if you pursue this. You’re only thinking about yourself and NOT about the child. Try not to rush into making a decision based on your own ego and emotions. Your child’s parents are the folks that adopted her. You are the bio dad, and should not be hasty to make claims about the child who knows nothing about you.
He should stand his ground to be involved if he wishes to do so. Maybe not have her move or take the child away
Typical machismo alpha male bullshit. Break things then claim his intentions were good.
Technically it’s an illegal adoption if he didn’t sign his parental rights away. If he’s smart he’ll work with the family to try and figure out the best solution.
Who's to say he's even on the birth certificate? As written, birth mother FLED from him long before delivery.
True.
My opinion is what will be best for baby. Sometimes it’s better to let kids stay with their adoptive parents if they are treated good and first introduce you semi slowly. I think if all parents (adoptive and possible biodad )worked together this child would be very fortunate to have a group of parents that make sure the child comes first because that is who matters The Child!!!
First thing to do is to find out if she went through an adoption agency. There are laws that require a woman to notify the father before an adoption… usually an ad in the newspaper. “So and so gave birth on this date and will be putting the baby up for adoption. Speak now or forever hold your peace.” Contact Saving our Sisters. They are experts and can help get you on the right path. But be warned, this will not be an easy road. Best chance you have is if you have any Native American blood in you. There are strict rules about adopting out babies with native blood to non natives. I’m so sorry this happened to you. What a tragedy.
IF the father is listed on the birth certificate, no?
No. If the father was listed on the birth certificate, he would have been required to be contacted and sign off on the adoption.
The DNA test has to come first.
Anybody remember the name of the movie in the 80’s where this exact thing happened. Adoptive parents had to give up their 5 year old child to the father. He didn’t know about the pregnancy, but once he did, he went to court to get her and he won. True story and terribly sad. At work the next day we were all talking about it, how we thought it was unfair to remove this child from her adoptive parents. As I recall, there wasn’t a dry eye in the house.
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Incorrect 2000000%. Adopted person here so I can speak first hand. Adoption can be great and give kids a life that they wouldn’t have normally gotten to live (ie me). Unless you know first hand, stay in your lane (ie not talking out of your ass with fake studies that aren’t based on real information).
No they do not. Do you know how often a biological parent is abusive, a drug addict, or even not emotionally prepared to be a parent?!?
Mine ^ and I met him at 22, and uffda
You can have your opinion but you can't have your own facts. Let's see these imaginary studies.
No way, not all children are better off with their biological parents. I don’t need sources either. I have seen it myself. Parents had children taken away for a number of reasons, but after fighting to get them back, the child ends up dead by their biological parents. This isn’t just once, but many times. How would I feel if I was adopted and grew up to find my biological family wanted me. I guess it depends how I was brought up. In some cases the biological parents have issues, chronic unemployment, drugs, alcoholism, poverty and you may call me a snob, but that is not a good life for a child. Just because they are your biological parents does not make them suitable. Have you heard of The Turpin family or Ruby Franke? These are the biological parents of children that were starved, beaten and abused. Do you really think an adoptive family wouldn’t have done a better job? These cases may be high profile, but there are many cases like this found every day.
Studies do NOT show that “A child is always better with her biological parent.” Yes it is usually good for children to be raised by their biological parents or at least retain some connection with their biological family but the idea that that children are better off with biological parents who are horribly abusive, or don’t want them is completely ridiculous. Cite/ link your sources if I’m wrong.
I don't understand the comments saying you'd be cruel if you try to figure out what's going because she's in a loving adopted home. Are we all psychics? How do we know the adopted baby is treated well? How do we know they're providing a better, more love filled life than OP will? I've seen adopted kids with amazing adopted families and adopted kids who were treated like slaves. No one has any idea what's happening. This could've been an illegal adoption where a family threw money at a woman to buy her baby, it could've been a legal adoption, the family could be amazing, the family could be a bunch of Brad Pitts, the child could be OP's, and the child might not be OPs. I just do not get the assumptions most of the commenters are making as if they know the adopted family personally.
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How do you know that??? This sounds like another psychic reading. Just like how it's possible OP is a bad person, his ex could be too. How in the world do we know that OP ran his ex off instead of his ex getting offered a good deal of money to hand her child over? Or maybe even that OP is thrown off by looks but it's not actually his child?
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Are you illiterate?
Wow this is a potential massive can of worms. Are you imagining that this woman was using you, planned to have you ejaculate in her on the day/surrounding days she got artificially inseminated by a paying couple? Then pretended ignorance when pregnant? And you found out the paternity through another party? Three 1/2 yrs later? That is quite a stretch. But holy crud is it Reddit worthy. And True Crime worthy. And politics worthy (think abortion rights and paternity rights). So much there. You have to be certain.
You don’t even know if this child is yours. Why are you thinking that now after 3.5 years?
Do you honestly think it would be in the best interests of a nearly 4 year old to take her away from the only family she has ever known? I think this is a moment to put her needs ahead of your own.
Really? Law is what it is and he should have been notified. Obviously it's an illegal adoption. Put the lawyers and mom in jail for falsifying the records. He deserves the chance with his child.
And this child deserves to be left in peace with her family. And, assuming the parents were unaware there was anything shady going on, they deserve to live in peace with *their child*. The cruelty to both the parents and the child is just nauseating. God, to have your preschooler ripped from you after nearly four years… That’s utterly disgusting.
Easy to say when its not your child that was stolen from you.
A real parent is someone that puts their child's happiness and emotional stability before their own wants.
Then the family who did not obtain the child through proper means would recognize their responsibility and fault in the process that brought them the child in the first place. Sad note on society when we condone the behavior of the mom and taker of someone else's child. So the Dugard girl should have stayed and the kids she had with her captor should stay because that's the family they know?
Oh, it would be easy to say regardless. See, I don’t think that having unprotected sex four years ago entitles me to rip a family apart just because I share DNA with the child. I would want to make sure they were happy and healthy and loved. I would ideally like to be updated on their well-being occasionally. And if their parents were amiable to it, I *might* like to get to know them when they’re a bit older, though that wouldn’t be a dealbreaker. As long as they’re safe and cared for, anything else is gravy. There is no universe where I would take a child away from good, loving parents just because had a genetic “claim” to them. That’s gross.
lol “obviously it’s an illegal adoption” ok sure Jan
If the father didn't sign off.....
He has no idea if he's the father.
Untrue. He has at least a suspicion or he would not be here
If he's not on the birth certificate, he's NOT the legal father and can go fuck himself.
Don't talk out of your ass if you don't know what you're talking about.
A judge doesn’t grant an adoption unless they know legal rules were followed. You can absolutely get a lawyer but it’s very possible this was all above board due to individual state legislation. “She” didn’t bother to find you but to grant an adoption, the judge, the court, and lawyers need to be involved. They’d all have some kind of issue with the situation if the rules weren’t being followed. Maybe she forged the birth certificate and lied about paternity? Maybe in her state “notification” counts as a newspaper ad. That is the case in some jurisdictions. In my case, I didn’t have to serve the father if his name wasn’t on the birth certificate and I didn’t know where he lived. Some judges would have asked for us to do more to prove that we attempted to contact, but my lawyer cited precedent in previous cases and the judge granted it. Yes get a lawyer, but I have a hard time believing that a judge granted an adoption without the law being followed.
It's also very possible that the mother didn't know who the father was, so left that blank on the birth certificate.
Okay but even if the law was followed. Like let's say she said I don't know who the father is, so that would fall inside the she can't notify him type of clause. Now that he's "found" can he actually get this adoption reversed? And will she get In some kind of trouble for this?
No. Husband's are automatically assumed to be the father even if the wife/ biirth mother cheated on him. So OP doesn't have a leg to stand on if he's NOT on the birth cert.
no, it wont be reversed, and no, bc she has proved that she made an attempt.
no, it wont be reversed, and no, bc she has proved that she made an attempt.
But he’s NOT “found.” OP is operating purely on assumptions here. He has not a single shred of evidence that he’s actually the father.
Also if you knew she was pregnant and moved away, why didn’t you go ahead and hire a lawyer anyway? They have PIs you know. That’s like a huge part of their job. She would have been easily found and made to submit to a paternity test. You didn’t do that for 4 years. Not a good look. Why is she so adamant about hiding from you? Is she evil, or maybe was she scared? My partner was abusive and even without medical records proving it, I saved every text and documented every instance of his scary threatening behavior. There was clearly a reason why she moved out of town. Where did she move to? Would it really have been that hard to figure out at least what state she was in? You failed in every front as a bio parent here, sorry. You’re looking at a long uphill road if you want to take this on. Why disrupt a child’s life? They are happy and with stable parents, no?
IMHO, asshole OP 'wants his PROPERTY 'rights''
Again I am not the original poster I just had questions and thought you might know the answer. This is very dear to my heart as it happened to my closest friend and she's 42 And this still shapes a big part of her life.
Her father failed her. Yea her mother was terrible but her father chose not to try.
I can only speak on what I was told in my situation in my jurisdiction: if the fathers name is not on the birth certificate, it was possible to grant an adoption (in my case a step parent adoption) without notification and no i couldn’t get in trouble and the adoption is irrevocable. In a situation like yours where it sounds like bio mom signed her right away, my understanding is that this process is even longer, more expensive, and more intense. But I was told in my jurisdiction that even if he contested the adoption if he found out, the lack of contact, monetary support, etc was a very strong case against the biodad but that is also because he knew I was pregnant with his child. So again, hiring a lawyer is fine, and they will clarify all these things for you and let you know if you have a case or not. I’m simply correcting your assertion that she has done something wrong or illegal because it’s very possible that she did not violate the law. Are you even sure this adoption was done thru the courts? Did you know she was pregnant? Did she know it was yours, was there violence involved, etc etc. It just really depends on your circumstances and the jurisdiction. I was told by my lawyer that in my specific situation of stepparent adoption where there were no parental rights needing to be taken away, the adoption is sealed and done. In her jurisdiction and because she potentially had to sign her rights away, I’d assume the bar was set even higher before an adoption was granted. But I can’t speak on how sealed the decision is. Generally I don’t think courts casually reverse adoptions. You’d have a very high burden of evidence: you’d have to prove that she took steps to evade you. You have to provide receipts of that. Where did she move to? I moved back to my parents house and he threatened to get lawyers involved. When I told my attorney this, she laughed. “You didn’t move to Russia honey”. Which means that you could absolutely have hired a lawyer in the meantime and had a PI track her down and chose not to. My bio parent did not do that either. He would have been shit out of luck if he contested.
Just to be clear I'm not op. My dearest friend in this world grew up in the foster system. Her mom was a crackhead. I mean legit tin foil on the windows, eating cold hot dogs for dinner and not having electric most days. So obviously my friend was taken by the system. And her mother said she didn't know who the father was. So there was nobody for her to go to because all the other family was deceased or too old. Flash forward to when she's 18... Six foster homes between age 12 and 18, and she still had some contact with her mother when her mother would have periods of being clean from drugs. Mother finally admits who her father is. Tells her that "I'll be damned if that man would get my kid!" So my friend did reach out to her dad, DNA test confirmed it and they did have a relationship for the next 10 years before he died. Unfortunately he was already sick by the time she found him right before she was 20. That woman hated her ex so much that she punished her child, because those foster homes are no Cakewalk! And the only reason she did it was because he would have "won" over her If he got custody since she couldn't keep custody. So I have a big problem with this whole situation because my friend would have done anything to be able to get out of the system and live with her father. And her father would have been fighting for her if he even knew about her! But it just seems really messed up that a woman can lie and if it's proven later that she lied she doesn't face any consequences? And it's really messed up for the poor child! We don't know if she's in good situation or a bad situation! We don't know if she's happy. And it's not fair to her when she has one parent that desperately is trying to get her back, but obviously these new people want her too! And of course she's way too young to make any decisions. It's just a mess and there's no clear-cut answer! It reminds me also of those switched at birth babies. There was one set that the one family wanted both kids! They wanted the one they've been raising as their own but they also wanted the one that's genetically theirs! LOL but in most of these cases the kids end up dealing with the worst of it because they have two families fighting over them. Like this girl. I feel bad because her dad should have the right to raise her. And I understand what he said about now that he found out he only has a short amount of time to take action before his inaction can be used against him. Don't know I'm probably rambling now sorry! This one's just really getting to me.
That's terrible, but OP said this child was adopted, so the child is not in any foster care system. I would go by best interests of the child. If she's with a loving family, it would be cruel and harmful to just rip her away from the only family she's known since birth.
I’m truly sorry your friend went through that, but her situation was nothing like what OP is describing. OP said that the child was adopted, not in the foster system. He gave no indication that he had reason to believe the child was being mistreated in any way. As far as we know, this child is being raised in a loving family. Why should she be subjected to the trauma of being ripped away from them?
If any parent cared enough they could have easily hired a lawyer, found her, and established contact. It’s not hard. I’m a teacher and have seen trauma kids in my classroom whose moms prevent family from finding them. To the point of telling the kids to spend 8 hours in the trunk of a car to hide. One student came to me after being found walking into a gas station, barefoot and with a toddler sibling in tow, asking for food because they were hungry. His mom evaded authorities for years. You know who DIDNT do ANYTHING to try and find his kids? You guessed it. The fucking parent. Yes your friends mom is shitty. But so was her biodad. The mom could have been found and her biodad also failed her. This isn’t a situation of one evil woman lying and therefore the courts just punish everyone. It takes two. If you want your kids, hire a lawyer. Especially if they end up in foster it’s even easier for a bio parent to find them!!! No excuse for the father here.
Yes because no woman ever has lied about or concealed a pregnancy. You have to know someone exists to attempt to build a relationship with them.
If someone flees to prevent knowledge of pregnancy, that's a helluva hint.
The OP literally says that his ex lied to him and somehow you've decided he fled so she couldn't inform him.
Actually he didn't know. They were together and dating and then she just disappeared and he thought she was going on one of her binges and figured that was enough he's done! He didn't hear from her for a while and he just quit trying. He was quite surprised to find out he had a 18-19 year-old kid!
That makes sense so please ignore my previous comments about it. Sadly this does happen
I wonder how many people saying let this child live with these people are actually adopted.
i am, and i am very pro let her stay. disrupting her life is not good for her.
🙋🏽 I am, and this little girl absolutely should stay with “these people”. “These people” are her *parents*. She’s nearly four!! “These people” are her entire world. I remember being four. I remember how the only people in the universe I wanted when I was sick or scared or tired or just wanted a cuddle were my parents. I remember crying myself to sleep because they had one single date night and a babysitter had to tuck me in, and I remember waking up and crawling into their bed when they got home. If some stranger tried to take me from them just because he shared some DNA with me, I probably would’ve gone feral. People talk about adoption trauma, but *that* is the only thing that would have traumatized me. Genetics don’t matter, *family* matters. And if this little girl’s family loves her half as much as mine loved me and my siblings, taking her from them would be the cruelest torture. And now that I’m an adult and have a four year old nephew…god help anyone who tried to take him from me. We may not share a shred of DNA, but that little boy is my everything. There is *nothing* I wouldn’t do to hold onto him, and I’m just the cool aunt who spoils him on the weekends. I can’t imagine how his *parents* would feel.
Well you are a rare case in the adopted child world. Most of us would have loved to have our father find us if he didn’t know.
OP is trying to get full custody. That isnt in the childs best interest and it demonstrates that he isnt fit to be a good parent to her bc hes putting his desires first.
I’m sorry that was your experience and that you feel that way, but I think your perception is skewed. I’ve been active in the adoption community my entire life. I’ve been part of groups dedicated to locating biological relatives, which I participated in to support a close friend who felt that way. I’ve counseled parents considering adoption, and I’ve counseled adopted kids of all ages. I’ve been part of groups who feel like they adoption trauma and groups that feel nothing of the sort. In my own family (one bio kid, the other siblings and cousins all adopted), I have a cousin who is mildly interested in learning about his heritage, another who really doesn’t give a crap either way, a brother who did genetic testing to find out his medical background but refused to share his results publicly because he doesn’t want to risk randos contacting him claiming to be “family” because they have overlapping genetics. And in my lifelong experience with the wider adoption community, I’ve seen much the same distribution of feelings, with a similarly sized subset that is actively looking for biological relatives, though most of them are looking to *add* to their family, not replace their adopted family. Having passively watched in the groups geared toward adoptees with trauma who may or may not be trying to find their bio relations, I can see how being exposed to that population would give you the sense that “most” adoptees feel that way.
I am adopted. This child needs to be with her biological parent if he is her parent and he wants to parent her.
Right. People that have never been adopted should really stfu. The way we would love to have found our bios.
just bc you had a shitty life doesnt mean youre right. Theres a difference between finding your bios and being ripped away from your families.
I had a great life. I also work with thousands of adoptees and most of them say the same thing. But this is Reddit where nobody thinks a man can take care of a child.
His gender doesnt matter. my view would be very different if this was a 6 month old baby. this child has a l9ng, established relationship with her parents and he wants full custody, which is cruel.
If she has a wonderful family who love her and take care of her why would you want to uproot her entire life and all she knows? This will be very traumatic for her. You are a stranger to her. That’s really unfair. You’re the adult and need to come to terms with this for her sake. Stop all legal action. Get therapy. You are reacting to being lied to and not considering what’s is best for this child. If you continue this pursuit it really just says everything about what kind of person you are.
I am adopted and my oldest is adopted. I personally have no interest in seeking out my biological family. My parents are beyond amazing and I am perfectly happy. However my 4 year old has an amazing relationship with his maternal siblings. His Biomom is an active drug addict. She claimed to not know who bio dad was. Before we finalized, we had to post in the paper her name along with son’s birthdate and possible time frame of conception. It literally said if you think you may be the father of this child please contact “lawyer.” It is probably all above board.
My husband is adopted and feels the same way. He showed me the paperwork his birth mother filled out and she provided a lot of detail. Reading it you could tell it broke her heart to have to give him up. She was a widow and he was her fifth child. The child born previous to him had a lot of heath problems and was confined to a wheelchair. She just could not care for an infant on top of everything going on in her life. He never was interested in finding her, as his family was a typical upper-middle class highly educated family. The social worker wrote a detailed description of bio-mom. I imagine that our daughter looks a lot like her, as our daughter favors her father. He has strong Mediterranean genes and is a very handsome intelligent man. As are both of our children. I pray for her, even though she may no longer be alive. I can understand only in that just prior to losing my parents in my 20s I was told that my father was not my bio-dad. I never had any idea. How loved was I, that both of my parents held on to this without me knowing for all of those years? My father (regardless) was the most special man in my life. Both of my parents were just the best people, the whole town thought very highly of them. I feel blessed that I was put first, at the worst time of their marriage. My father stayed for all of us, he also adored my mother (who had a momentary lapse in judgement, she’s human.) I’m glad you and your son have loving families. ❤️
Absolutely wrong. Speaking as an adoptee, who was wanted by my biological parents, this child needs to be with her biological father. He has rights. His rights supersede the adoptive parents right to this child. They don’t get to make a family by taking away someone else’s kid. If he is the biological father and he wants his child, he should not have her taken from him like this. There’s plenty of data about adoption trauma - which begins at birth - and the need for and undeniable benefit of biological ties.
More mansplaining 'property rights' bullshit. OP had fun having sex & squirted, and birthmom fled him. And now, FOUR FUCKING YEARS LATER, OP decides to do something about it. Talking property rights, the adoptive parents win by adverse possession & maintenance.
having contact is important, but him having full custody isnt ideal right now.
Wouldn't it be best for them to work it out so that the child could have adoptive family and bio dad in her life? These are human beings - can you imagine if your 4 year old was taken from you?
She’s his child. Adoptive parents aren’t entitled to someone else’s child to build their families. I can sympathise with them, but if what OP says is true, they were also screwed by the birth mother. From what my biological parents told me, losing me at birth was devastating. It destroyed their family. It destroyed several families as the trauma was unresolved and my biological parents both had deep wounds. Have. My biological siblings, some of whom didn’t know about me until recently, have had to wrestle with the grief and loss they felt as well. My biological parents were manipulated by the agency to give me up for the benefit of the intended adoptive parents. That’s what my biological parents said, and I believe them based upon the actions of my adoptive parents. This child deserves to know her family.
The child’s best interest is the ONLY thing that anyone should be thinking about.
I have to wonder though: if OP is not sharing the entire story. Why was the mother so insistent on keeping/ hiding the child from him? Was there some sort of abuse situation?
That’s a possibility. It is also possible that she is an awful person who did what OP said.
It would not be Reddit if someone didn't raise the spectre of this on no evidence.
Well there is a blatant answer that you seem to easily avoid and could very easily be some mixture of greed, selfishness and image. You see if she had told him that she was pregnant and he was willing to do the work and raise the child she could very easily be on the hook to pay him child support for 18 years. Giving up the baby to others, even if she wasn't paid a penny, absolves her of financial responsibilities and even having anything else to do with it. If it's known by family or friends, PUBLICLY, that she has a kid but has no part in raising it could be labeled a DEADBEAT MOTHER. And of course could just be a pure money grab where she was given money or gifts.
There’s a blatant bias. But most of the internet seems to have a positive opinion about adoption and a negative opinion on adoptees sharing their experiences with or opinions of adoption.
As a paralegal, not giving you legal advice, I can tell you that this will cost you a boatload of money and will be very hard to prove. I strongly suggest that you discuss this with at least three actual family law attorneys licensed to practice in your state. They can give you better advice than anyone on Reddit. You’d better be all in, too. These bitches ain’t cheap.
Yeah I saw the hourly rates for some. They are killer. I have appointments with about 6 of them to get a Birds Eye view of things.
Just gauge whatever is in your bank account with whatever claim you want to establish because boy your set of facts will be expensive for sure
NAL but simply looking at the history of the public cases that have been similar to yours, you aren’t likely to get any kind of custody.
What public cases are you referring to?
Someone shared the FL one above, here’s one [from Michigan](https://www.mlive.com/news/grand-rapids/2022/06/boy-to-remain-with-adoptive-parents-over-birth-father-based-on-michigan-supreme-court-ruling.html?outputType=amp) that wasn’t that long ago. [This article](https://www.abc4.com/news/digital-exclusives/no-consent-from-fathers-required-man-speaks-out-about-utahs-adoption-laws/) from 2022 points out the laws in Utah that allow unmarried women to place their babies up for adoption without the consent of the father if the baby is under 6 months of age. There ARE cases of pending adoptions being stopped, the most widely known is the [baby Jessica case](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baby_Jessica_case) (Wikipedia because of the age of the case predating consistent internet news article uploads) and a more recent one being [Christopher Emmanuel’s case](https://wach.com/amp/news/wachfox-investigates/sc-man-wins-custody-of-his-daughter-after-she-was-adopted-without-his-permission). But in both cases, even though the fight took years, the adoptions were never finalized. In Emmanuel’s case, there was a failure in the putative father registry in notifying him of both the birth and start of the adoption process of his child. And even that is a toss up, [Andrew Myers](https://www.wbtv.com/story/38152690/5-year-old-rock-hill-girl-to-stay-with-adoptive-parents-likely-ending-custody-battle/?outputType=amp) was in jail for fraud at the time his child was born and the adoption was started. His crimes did not indicate he was a danger to his child or would be in jail for an extended period of time that would warrant termination of his rights but despite that his rights were terminated because he did not meet the child or provide financial support to the child (who was born while he was in jail). The state Supreme Court held up the adoption in 2018.
[This is a recent case from Florida.](https://www.abcactionnews.com/news/local-news/i-team-investigates/father-fights-for-baby-girl-placed-for-adoption-without-his-knowledge-consent) But there are many like this. Turning over adoptions are very very difficult.
Or even a dna test of the baby.
I’m a family law attorney. This is an issue you should heed the advice of an attorney on rather than random Reddit people.
Ditto all of this.
You should talk to a lawyer. I doubt that you will be able to claim a child that was adopted 3.5 years ago. Courts rule in the best interest of the child, not what adults think is “fair.” What information did you recently receive about the child, and from who?
And there is plenty of research on adoption trauma showing it is in the best interest of the child to maintain biological ties - the American adoption system is set up for profit, not best interest. It’s actually likely in the best interest of the child at this point to have a split custody arrangement with the biological father.
Bullshit OR link your source(s)
it is actually in her best interest for her to have an open relationship, not split custody
I am unsure how you think you'll be able to get the DNA of a child that isn't legally yours. If some stranger contacted me and said they wanted DNA from my legally adopted child, I would call the cops on them.
It's called a court order
I have empathy for OP but… doing what is best for the baby is the most important objective. If OP can afford a lawyer they have the means to get a DNA test.
The kid is 3.5 years old. Unless OP lives in a state with weird laws, I think it would be really difficult to get a judge to agree. It's too emotionally damaging for the kid.
I truly hope so
I gotta ask: Why did this woman run so far so fast after you fucked her? What’s your deal, hombré?
That certainly can be answered within the post. OP stated she talked about being paid to be a surrogate. Who tf says that lol
When I was pregnant with my first child I was offered a lot of money to give her up. I wasn't sure what I wanted to do and I talked to a friend who had adopted out her children and she got me in touch with some people and even though it's illegal they offered me a huge amount of money for"care" during pregnancy. But of course I would give the child to them at the end to adopt it. I chose not to, But I found out it's a whole thing. The richer the person is the more they are okay with throwing at you to get what they want. OP says that she had talked about being a surrogate so I wonder if she knew of a family that wanted a baby and she purposely got knocked up so she could get paid to be a surrogate? Or just to make them a baby?
That is not at all how surrogacy works. In fact, that’s not surrogacy at all. It’s…adoption.
Leave her alone. You were with a woman to conceive a child but you didn’t keep in touch enough to know whether she conceived your child? The ship has sailed. Leave the kid alone and don’t mess with her life.
That child deserves to know her bio family, especially if she grows up to believe her bio father didn’t want her. What a disgusting thing to say. Men get stiffed for child support but aren’t supposed to want to know their own child! Wow.
'Bio family' who show up THREE FUCKING YEARS LATER, enraged? Not so much.
Men get told they are deadbeats for not being involved but, when they get involved, people like those in this comment section, ask why he is disrupting the child's life m