He has his fair share of warts, but the only reason a 26 year old 6'5" forward with 40 goal and PPG upside is available is because he has those warts.
We know Hughes likes reclamation projects and Laine is like the final boss of reclamation projects, the upside could be massive
To be fair, with only 2 years left on his current contract the upside far outweighs any downside. We would probably clear up the log jam at D and utilize some of the picks we have been stockpiling as well. Could be a win/win for both sides.
His last couple years were rough:
2021 - Traded to Columbus;
2021 - Passing of his father;
2022 - Covid, several injuries;
2023 - Clavicle fracture (out for season);
2024 - NHL assistance program (suicide).
He is still young and very salvageable. He can definitely be a HuGo project.
> NHL assistance program (suicide)
Hoo boy this feels like the *worst* market possible for a player with that on his alternate c.v.
(Actually, second worst. Toronto's weird fans would be pushing him to do it.)
He had a 40 goal season once which was 7 years ago. He's never hit PPG in 8 years of playing and he hasn't played more than 60 games in a season in 6 years.
Totally agree. CBJ's management style isn't probably the most efficient or successful: 23 seasons (since 2000) with only 6 playoffs qualification, and they've never gone through past 10 postseason games.
The way they handled past NHL players who were more successful once they left Columbus: Panarin, Brobovsky, Duchene, Jeff Carter, Voracek, etc. Or, in some cases, being less successful once with CBJ: Gaudreau.
There's been talk about him for a long time now which has got nothing to do with his dad and maybe those 2 teams weren't the best but somehow 95+% of the players had no issues so ....
He makes sense on a couple levels.
- likely won't re-sign for same price when contract is up
- have fellow rehabbed Finn in Armia
- cost to acquire doesn't break the build
- Hughes can check off the "Joueurs pur Laine" box
Armia could attest that our staff is really good too for psychological help
Not that Laine will need it, but that it did wonders for Armia's well being
well i agree, but both of them would collide better with our rebuild timing. I see us contending in 4-7 years and at that time Laine will be 30-33, which is really on the edge for big forward.
However i would still go for it if the price is right. Its the same situation as with Zecas, no need to overpay.
I think people are seriously undervaluing him here. Even with his troubles he still put up 138 points in 174 games with an absolute dogshit Columbus team. We're not getting him for a couple prospects and a late first round pick. I'd love to have him, I just don't know if I want to give up what it's going to take to get him.
Some people are insane. Laine could be a top-5 goal scorer next season, he's that elite. It's not like he forgot how to shoot, he just has to stay healthy. We should be ecstatic if we can land him.
> he just has to stay healthy
The hugest *if* statement for the Habs! I'm an atheist but I genuinely think we should do an exorcism before next season. Especially after last season's start.
Here is why this makes sense for me.
If you’re looking at acquiring any player, the obvious question is, “does he make our team better” once you decide to try to acquire that player, it is clear that you believe the answer to that question to be “yes.”
The next question is, “even if he makes us better. Does the overall cost hurt us down the road?” Like, you don’t want to give up five incredible prospects for one year, unless maybe that’s your push for a cup. But if you decide this acquisition will not hurt you down the road, there is one question left over, which is:
“If this player doesn’t pan out, is it a totally sunk cost that has massive implications?”
In the line, a case, all of these answers seem to line up for the Habs.
He probably makes us better.
The cost is not so exorbitant that it will likely have a major impact on the long-term future of the organization, it might just determined some future draft picks or trades
We have a lot of room and our window is different. He has two years left on his contract. If it doesn’t work out, it’s not hurting our ability to do things when our contention window begins.
So, I think it’s a good idea to take a swing. If it doesn’t work out, there’s a cost, but it doesn’t hurt the rebuild, and even if it fails, it’s more of a setback than a reset.
C'mon now, you know 1 GM is going all in for millions on him & to you he should be free?
Maybe the medical staff in Columbus is horrible for all you know...or other issues, he's a proven ppg player avg 50gp over last 4yrs with a crazy good shot & a desire to win.
edit: asked a Columbus fan...Turns out he was dealing with the death of his father. That's free info btw, no charge.
I agree with you.
It's like the Pacioretty trade.
If the Habs are taking on $8.7M of salary cap without any salary going the other way, why the fuck would the Habs give up anything of value?
they can at anytime besides the christmas holiday break roster freeze
But out of respect for the teams competing in the playoffs and for the stanley cup they usually wait till the cups been handed out.
Just make handshake agreement i can't remember the last playoff trade big trades are usually to the week leading to the draft or draft day besides trade deadline.
I can imagine that, but not this year. The Oilers are reminding me of our Cup run - battling through three tough series only to run out of gas in the final.
I was actually gonna write Harris, Halak and a 2nd. To be honest though, I just checked his stats and he’s got way more production than I thought he did.
Ya I think for it to happen we give up something like
Beck, struble and our 26th first.
It's a volume trade but beck is one of our top prospects, struble is better than harris and they get a first round pick.
It's the equivalent of a first and 2 seconds, with beck being a very high second.
If they take mesar over beck or harris or barron over struble, great. But those pieces fit will with adding legit depth to Columbus as beck looks to be a good 3rd C with 20 goal upside and Struble could be a 5th dman for a decade.
Those two contracts are not the same kind of lousy. Dvo might actually have positive value; at a bare minimum I'm sure you could give him away. I don't think you could give away Andy even at 50% retained, you'd still need a sweetener.
Makes a lot more sense than Necas and Zegras.
Poor guys have played in a dysfunctional Winnipeg and then a very dysfunctional Columbus.
He is a star and a personality, he is a player for a big market. He would be an instant star in Montreal and he would not have all the pressure on him.
I think our market would do to Laine what it did to Kovalev.
> He would be an instant star in Montreal and he would not have all the pressure on him.
I don't know if either of those thoughts are compatible. Instant star usually creates more pressure, not less.
The main reason why this might not happen is Waddel. I think that he’s still sour on the whole offer sheet thing. With how Kotkaniemi went, I would understand if he would want to avoid a deal with Montreal in case Laine pops off and he looks foolish again. I know that this was mostly their idiot owner’s doing, but it all fell on Waddel. I’m sure that Waddel left because of the extremely intrusive owner.
The story at the time was that Habs ownership tipped hockey ops that Dundon might not have been able to pay the signing bonuses for Aho. The NHL governors had just done a deep dive into Dundon's finances in order to approve the sale of the team to him. And that obviously ticked Dundon off badly. So the bad blood is at the ownership level.
We ended up looking like asses when that fell through. It was the most weak sauce attempt at looking like we tried. Either Bergevin was played with the misinformation or he didn’t actually want it to go through. You either go for it or you don’t, and I always thought that the offer was not aggressive enough. If he really wanted it to go through, why offer the lowest amount that you think Dundon can’t afford?
Where Waddell looks bad is in the “revenge”. Dundon’s fingerprints are all over it, I agree entirely with you, but it still impacts Waddell’s track record. At the end of the day, they went after the wrong player, signed him to a ridiculous overpay (they were more willing to go for it than Bergevin had been with Aho), and had a handshake deal to re-sign him for less. Also, that signing bonus was flat out stupid.
we kinda have the cap space to make it work, such a high salary would bring the asset cost down, then you have the opportunity to renegotiate a better deal down the line, I guess we'll see and let Hughes cook
Exactly what our top 6 needs, give up trade harris and second or Winnipegs first if the offers are competitive. I’d also be willing to toss mesar in if needed
I’m not even sure Harris beats out Jake Bean for the 3rd LD and they have like 4 or 5 forward prospects better than Mesar.
I feel like Columbus is looking for a hockey trade or one quality piece, rather than a package of futures and scrap parts.
I agree that Harris has more upside since he’s younger. But they already have Werenski and Provorov on the left side. So they just need to fill the 3LD spot with some training camp competition between, Bean, free agents, etc.
And then for longer term then have Mateychuk coming up. Who looks legit.
I mean it’s possible they take him just for depth/small upside but I just don’t see the fit.
I definitely agree with that advantage.
There’s a few other teams that have the cap space though and that also have assets. Utah, in particular, would make a lot of sense.
The cost might not be as cheap as we’d like to believe.
I disagree with this solely based on the fact that he was in the players assistance program. Look at the return on Kuznetsov or Jakub Vrana whom were both traded on the cheap after entering the program.
Kuzy was older when traded and Vrana was less proven/productive so I don’t see some of these offers of a late first + B-level prospect + roster player as way off in terms of value
Laines value is low as low goes. High cap hit in terms of production. Yes I think it may take a little more but I think harris+meser+winnipeg 1st is perfect
If we’re acquiring Laine, one of our bigger contracts like Andy, Gally or Dvo absolutely needs to be going the other way. I’d pay more in futures if they’re willing to take the extra year of Anderson
Gally's play picked up huge after his stupid move and suspension. If he can keep playing like that I wouldn't be averse to holding him longer. At this point, he should retire as a Hab.
UFA, sure.
A trade ? The Jackets would start a bidding war, and we're not at the point where he would move the needle significantly to justify the cost.
I say pass.
Being an NHL player in Montreal is alot more than fan pressure. Not to mention a player paid 9 million a year and expected to score 40-50 goals. Let's be real.
Caufield doesn't have an extensive injury history including mental illness, is drafted (pick 15) and developed by montreal and can handle the pressure of our market. He's also 22 (not 26). Caufield did not cost assets to acquire.
Laine was a 2nd overall pick, is soft, unreliable and assuredly unable to handle our market. Why am I giving away 1st rounders to a fellow lottery team exactly?
This is the same discourse that has surrounded Zegras, Necas and now Laine. Trade for am impact player, i'm not interested in flawed players. Why are you?
I’m not saying we should trade for him just your logic that if he makes 9 min he should score 50 goals is not true.
Well no teams are giving up there best players for trade so unless you want to just keep finishing in the bottom 5 and hope the picks pan out we will need to trade for a player another team finds expandable
> 9 min he should score 50 goals is not true.
I'm saying that the expectation is there because he's already done it and is advertised as a goal scorer. He scores at a 43 goal/82 game pace thus far in his career.
> Well no teams are giving up there best players for trade
I'm just asking for core/established players. We already have Dach who can't even complete a season and we traded a 13th overall pick + 3rd rounder for him. How many of these guys do we need to collect?
Agreed I like him a lot (even considered getting a jersey) but until he can complete a full 82 game season, it’ll be a bad trade. But it’s bad business if FO can’t recognize the risk aspect of acquiring Laine.
Mental illness was him dealing with the death of a loved one. Hard to blame the guy for that. To be fair, Laine has been stuck in two really shit organizations. If he came to our team and was a second line guy with second PP minutes, I can easily see him giving us 30 goals and 50 points. With the cap going up, I’m not too worried about his salary. We would have to pay that much for a free agent if not more. I don’t think that we are going to be contenders before the end of his deal but he would be very useful in secondary scoring.
I’m not blaming him (mental illness). But I’m not going to pretend it doesn’t exist.
I wouldn’t say Winnipeg is a shit organization. They’ve developed many great talents.
Ultimately this is a business, you would hope an employee is available to work.
Winnipeg was a shit organization when he was there. They were not winning and it was well known that their room was pure poison.
I work in a call center and have had many employees go on leave for mental health and there is never a point where I was like, “if only this employee was available to work”. The NHL is just now catching up to the reality of mental health and I fully support athletes needing to step away.
But either way, for a 2nd and Harris or something similar, I would think that it’s worth the risk. At worst, he goes on the IR and he is a non-factor and we didn’t lose all that much. At best, he scores 40 goals and takes ice time away from Anderson and Gallagher.
I'll put this into context for you. It would take you 175-200 years to make what he makes per year. He is not a normal person, and should be demanded to perform.
I've had a hand in running a business, while the human in me cares for the person. It won't help me run my business. Shouldn't be my burden as a fan to coddle him.
Yes I agree Harris + 2nd is cheap enough. But it will surely cost (alot) more. Many playoff team would take him retained for a 2 year window.
Taking salary as the only anchor for point production will probably lead to skewed expectations. I get the point your making about pressure based off his salary. I just think this reasoning is often applied to underperforming players (e.g. Gallagher and Anderson) and not to overperforming players (e.g. Newhook and Dach) to establish expectations, which to me seems unfair.
Right, but a history of mental illness is a risk factor for another crisis. (I realize these factors are sometimes out of his control). Montreal is a pressure cooker, it's not for him.
If the Habs are willing to take the full cap hit without a contract going back, I think they could be able to get him for free.
References: Monahan and Pacioretty trades
There's a difference: Calgary and Vegas were looking to remain competitive and needed to get rid of the contract. CBJ are not looking to compete this season (they shouldn't after finishing 4th) so they aren't pressed to get rid of Laine at all costs.
If they think Laine has negative value and they've had him on the team for a few years, maybe there's something we don't know.
If he's free I'd take him, but I don't think CBJ is letting him go for nothing. And their GM is the former canes GM that did the KK deal. Don't think he's lining up to fumble a trade and do the Habs any favors in the process.
Giving a player for free doesn't mean they have negative value IMO. It just means they're value is is the same as the cap space.
Taking Laine's full cap without returning any salary has a lot of value for CBJ, we'd almost be doing them favour.
He has his fair share of warts, but the only reason a 26 year old 6'5" forward with 40 goal and PPG upside is available is because he has those warts. We know Hughes likes reclamation projects and Laine is like the final boss of reclamation projects, the upside could be massive
Martin St-Louis will fix him
To be fair, with only 2 years left on his current contract the upside far outweighs any downside. We would probably clear up the log jam at D and utilize some of the picks we have been stockpiling as well. Could be a win/win for both sides.
"Final Boss" loving it
His last couple years were rough: 2021 - Traded to Columbus; 2021 - Passing of his father; 2022 - Covid, several injuries; 2023 - Clavicle fracture (out for season); 2024 - NHL assistance program (suicide). He is still young and very salvageable. He can definitely be a HuGo project.
> NHL assistance program (suicide) Hoo boy this feels like the *worst* market possible for a player with that on his alternate c.v. (Actually, second worst. Toronto's weird fans would be pushing him to do it.)
Weirdass Toronto fans would be be pushing him to do it even more if he came to Montreal...
LOL true.
He had a 40 goal season once which was 7 years ago. He's never hit PPG in 8 years of playing and he hasn't played more than 60 games in a season in 6 years.
im sorry what, he hit 56 pts in 56 games and 52 in 55 with CBJ
56 in 56 games for Columbus a then 52 in 55 the following year…
Should really highlight FOR COLUMBUS. Likely he'd have 5-10 more points on a better team. With him on board, Montreal could be that better team.
Yep, his career pace is more like 35 goals / 65-70 points, which is still very good, but saying ppg and 49 goal is not true.
Warts?
Rough patches.
Max coming back, you say?!
Not at that price
Is he a locker room cancer though? Management seems to take pride in building a great culture
WPG was toxic as fuck, CBJ has questionable management, and his dad passed away this year, so I give the guy the benefit of the doubt.
Totally agree. CBJ's management style isn't probably the most efficient or successful: 23 seasons (since 2000) with only 6 playoffs qualification, and they've never gone through past 10 postseason games. The way they handled past NHL players who were more successful once they left Columbus: Panarin, Brobovsky, Duchene, Jeff Carter, Voracek, etc. Or, in some cases, being less successful once with CBJ: Gaudreau.
There's been talk about him for a long time now which has got nothing to do with his dad and maybe those 2 teams weren't the best but somehow 95+% of the players had no issues so ....
Seems like the only player who had the same issues was PLD haha
Maybe you create the culture so that it can absorb a tempermental talent like Laine? Just spit-balling here...
You risk that that carefully curated locker room could be *undone* by him, though.
He makes sense on a couple levels. - likely won't re-sign for same price when contract is up - have fellow rehabbed Finn in Armia - cost to acquire doesn't break the build - Hughes can check off the "Joueurs pur Laine" box
Ok pur Laine is funny.
Come to reHab Patrik
Armia could attest that our staff is really good too for psychological help Not that Laine will need it, but that it did wonders for Armia's well being
....what about Drouin?
Drouin was just never actually very good.
He's 19-37-56 and +12 in 79 games. Where does the "very good" threshold start?
Joueur pur Laine... https://youtu.be/DYiata4w6dk?si=eJk6WpOXPgXxnJYw Timer à 0:25
That last one was awesome, updoot
Newhook-Dach-Laine reclaimation line.
The castaways
Newhook is hardly a reclamation project, but I like where your head is at
The misfit toys
Oh I like this one.
For what the acquisition cost will be, I'd rather trade for him than Zecas
Is that a result of Zegras and Necas doing the fusion dance? I wonder how that would work under the CBA.
Until one of them gets traded, any speculation with them might as well be referred to as "Zecas".
I like it. Strong Bennifer or Brangelina vibes.
Use the potaras instead then
100%
well i agree, but both of them would collide better with our rebuild timing. I see us contending in 4-7 years and at that time Laine will be 30-33, which is really on the edge for big forward. However i would still go for it if the price is right. Its the same situation as with Zecas, no need to overpay.
Patrik Laine is signing with the Montreal Canadiens Just doing my part for the algorithm to make this happen
Tell AI! Tell AI harder!
Gimme Laine so we can play Slaf - Laine - Dach together and call them the 1-2-3 train.
The 1-2-3-Go!s.
Slaf dach laine. Tell me that doesn’t work.
I’d rather keep the Caufield - Suzuki - Slafkovsky line intact. HOWEVER Demidov - Dach - Laine Now that’s a cash money line!
💦💦💦💦
😮💨😮💨😮💨😮💨
Well it ruins the first line for sure lol. No board presence.
I think suz and caufield would work with Newhook but I could be wrong.
Shortest line in the league. Hard to go 4 rounds like this.
Shortest AND tallest lines in the league?? Now we’re cookin’ with gas
If we could find a Zach Hyman type player for that line, it’d be great! Wish Anderson could be that guy.
Cayden Lindstrom / Sennecke ?
😩😩😩
what do you mean lol.. Slaf is doing all the board pressence already..
Yes, if you take him off the line, Suz and Cauf will have none
oh ya..
Hands off my Slafzukifield line pal.
So nasty
It makes sense
Josh Anderson dust off your Columbus apartment key! /s I actually really like Anderson and hope he can bounce back next year.
Can Anderson go back?
depends if he has a no-trade clause
I think people are seriously undervaluing him here. Even with his troubles he still put up 138 points in 174 games with an absolute dogshit Columbus team. We're not getting him for a couple prospects and a late first round pick. I'd love to have him, I just don't know if I want to give up what it's going to take to get him.
He’s had a rough go. I don’t know everything, but I feel like a lot of his production problems can be chalked up to legitimate personal issues.
Some people are insane. Laine could be a top-5 goal scorer next season, he's that elite. It's not like he forgot how to shoot, he just has to stay healthy. We should be ecstatic if we can land him.
> he just has to stay healthy The hugest *if* statement for the Habs! I'm an atheist but I genuinely think we should do an exorcism before next season. Especially after last season's start.
he could also get injured and have another down season
Yes, and so could anyone else
I hope Hughes puts a competitive offer on the table, Laine would be a huge acquisition.
It most likely comes down to cost, if it's not crazy this makes a good deal of sense.
Laine is ahead of Zegras and Necas on my wishlist by a mile.
Here is why this makes sense for me. If you’re looking at acquiring any player, the obvious question is, “does he make our team better” once you decide to try to acquire that player, it is clear that you believe the answer to that question to be “yes.” The next question is, “even if he makes us better. Does the overall cost hurt us down the road?” Like, you don’t want to give up five incredible prospects for one year, unless maybe that’s your push for a cup. But if you decide this acquisition will not hurt you down the road, there is one question left over, which is: “If this player doesn’t pan out, is it a totally sunk cost that has massive implications?” In the line, a case, all of these answers seem to line up for the Habs. He probably makes us better. The cost is not so exorbitant that it will likely have a major impact on the long-term future of the organization, it might just determined some future draft picks or trades We have a lot of room and our window is different. He has two years left on his contract. If it doesn’t work out, it’s not hurting our ability to do things when our contention window begins. So, I think it’s a good idea to take a swing. If it doesn’t work out, there’s a cost, but it doesn’t hurt the rebuild, and even if it fails, it’s more of a setback than a reset.
I’d give Winnipeg’s first and an uncertain prospect like Kidney or else.
I’d give my kidney
For 8.7 million / 2 years and coming off a 9-point season while not having played more than 60 games since he got to Columbus, he should be free.
C'mon now, you know 1 GM is going all in for millions on him & to you he should be free? Maybe the medical staff in Columbus is horrible for all you know...or other issues, he's a proven ppg player avg 50gp over last 4yrs with a crazy good shot & a desire to win. edit: asked a Columbus fan...Turns out he was dealing with the death of his father. That's free info btw, no charge.
I agree with you. It's like the Pacioretty trade. If the Habs are taking on $8.7M of salary cap without any salary going the other way, why the fuck would the Habs give up anything of value?
Er correct Me if I'm wrong but didn't we trade Max for Suzuki and a second round pick, plus something else I forgot?
Tatar
I'm referring to the Pacioretty trade from Vegas to Carolina
Legit question (dont down vote me), can teams make trades right now or do they need to wait for the Cup final to be over?
they can at anytime besides the christmas holiday break roster freeze But out of respect for the teams competing in the playoffs and for the stanley cup they usually wait till the cups been handed out. Just make handshake agreement i can't remember the last playoff trade big trades are usually to the week leading to the draft or draft day besides trade deadline.
Can you imagine announcing a blockbuster trade during the 2nd intermission of game 7 though? Can't deny it would be entertaining.
I would enjoy even more announcing a trade with fourth liners
I can imagine that, but not this year. The Oilers are reminding me of our Cup run - battling through three tough series only to run out of gas in the final.
lol probably think you have major fleece on your hands and dont want the other guy to wisen up
Not sure it needs to be added, but of course the teams involved can't be currently playing.
It's all good, McDonagh was traded a few weeks ago. Even the teams still playing can trade, the players just can't play
Yes that’s true, Thanks I forgot about that! I heard on the radio some transaction had to wait but they didn’t elaborate on which.
Cole the Golden Retriever would cheer that guy right back up! Let's make the trade!
That's a no thanks from me.
I’d do Harris and 2nd but not more
May need to add Michael Ryder or Halak to get it to go.
I was actually gonna write Harris, Halak and a 2nd. To be honest though, I just checked his stats and he’s got way more production than I thought he did.
Ya I think for it to happen we give up something like Beck, struble and our 26th first. It's a volume trade but beck is one of our top prospects, struble is better than harris and they get a first round pick. It's the equivalent of a first and 2 seconds, with beck being a very high second. If they take mesar over beck or harris or barron over struble, great. But those pieces fit will with adding legit depth to Columbus as beck looks to be a good 3rd C with 20 goal upside and Struble could be a 5th dman for a decade.
This is the way.
I would add Mesar or Kidney if they want to
Y'all understand these are scraps, right? The late first is a must, and expect much more than Harris or kidney if you want to move the needle.
This is pure hopium I know
Only if they take back a lousy contract from us or retain
Dvo or Andy?
Those two contracts are not the same kind of lousy. Dvo might actually have positive value; at a bare minimum I'm sure you could give him away. I don't think you could give away Andy even at 50% retained, you'd still need a sweetener.
Probably Andy if I could pick, but would CBJ want him back?
Maybe Waddell likes him
Gonna be interesting to see if the Canes' stroppiness was a joint effort between Dundon and Waddell, or if it was Dundon alone.
Makes a lot more sense than Necas and Zegras. Poor guys have played in a dysfunctional Winnipeg and then a very dysfunctional Columbus. He is a star and a personality, he is a player for a big market. He would be an instant star in Montreal and he would not have all the pressure on him. I think our market would do to Laine what it did to Kovalev.
> He would be an instant star in Montreal and he would not have all the pressure on him. I don't know if either of those thoughts are compatible. Instant star usually creates more pressure, not less.
Another FRESH start?
[*Justonemorela(i)neandIllfixtrafficIswearbro*](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0dKrUE_O0VE)
The main reason why this might not happen is Waddel. I think that he’s still sour on the whole offer sheet thing. With how Kotkaniemi went, I would understand if he would want to avoid a deal with Montreal in case Laine pops off and he looks foolish again. I know that this was mostly their idiot owner’s doing, but it all fell on Waddel. I’m sure that Waddel left because of the extremely intrusive owner.
The joke is Carolina is cash strapped this year and has a bunch of key vets to sign. I say we push the boat out and offer-sheet Jarvis. XD
The story at the time was that Habs ownership tipped hockey ops that Dundon might not have been able to pay the signing bonuses for Aho. The NHL governors had just done a deep dive into Dundon's finances in order to approve the sale of the team to him. And that obviously ticked Dundon off badly. So the bad blood is at the ownership level.
We ended up looking like asses when that fell through. It was the most weak sauce attempt at looking like we tried. Either Bergevin was played with the misinformation or he didn’t actually want it to go through. You either go for it or you don’t, and I always thought that the offer was not aggressive enough. If he really wanted it to go through, why offer the lowest amount that you think Dundon can’t afford? Where Waddell looks bad is in the “revenge”. Dundon’s fingerprints are all over it, I agree entirely with you, but it still impacts Waddell’s track record. At the end of the day, they went after the wrong player, signed him to a ridiculous overpay (they were more willing to go for it than Bergevin had been with Aho), and had a handshake deal to re-sign him for less. Also, that signing bonus was flat out stupid.
It would have to be a trade for no more than his TDL value in two years assuming he bounces back. i.e. a late first and a mid-prospect.
I wonder if Anaheim and Columbus would work a trade around Laine-Zegras. That's probably better than anything we could realistically muster.
Marty knows how to put goal scorers in position to succeed.
8.7 million for 2 more years is rough, but I'd be okay with it if the cost wasn't high.
If we sink Anderson and Dvorak with whatever valuable asset we trade for Laine, we wouldn’t have to ask them to retain salary.
If Anderson’s going the other way tho… 🤑🤑🤑
Anderson + WPG 1st + Mesar
Or Harris instead of Mesar. I'd do it.
Maybe if they ate like half the salary
CBJ wouldn’t do it and we wouldn’t pay the extra assets it would take
or we can offload a bad contract
we kinda have the cap space to make it work, such a high salary would bring the asset cost down, then you have the opportunity to renegotiate a better deal down the line, I guess we'll see and let Hughes cook
Exactly what our top 6 needs, give up trade harris and second or Winnipegs first if the offers are competitive. I’d also be willing to toss mesar in if needed
I’m not even sure Harris beats out Jake Bean for the 3rd LD and they have like 4 or 5 forward prospects better than Mesar. I feel like Columbus is looking for a hockey trade or one quality piece, rather than a package of futures and scrap parts.
Gudbranson is horrendous tho, and harris I’d argue has better upside then bean
I agree that Harris has more upside since he’s younger. But they already have Werenski and Provorov on the left side. So they just need to fill the 3LD spot with some training camp competition between, Bean, free agents, etc. And then for longer term then have Mateychuk coming up. Who looks legit. I mean it’s possible they take him just for depth/small upside but I just don’t see the fit.
Anderson could be an add for them as well. He played well there too
Well what the Habs can offer that others can't is to take on the full contact. A lot of teams involved would not be able to do that.
I definitely agree with that advantage. There’s a few other teams that have the cap space though and that also have assets. Utah, in particular, would make a lot of sense. The cost might not be as cheap as we’d like to believe.
I disagree with this solely based on the fact that he was in the players assistance program. Look at the return on Kuznetsov or Jakub Vrana whom were both traded on the cheap after entering the program. Kuzy was older when traded and Vrana was less proven/productive so I don’t see some of these offers of a late first + B-level prospect + roster player as way off in terms of value
That's not gonna scratch the surface to get a deal done ...
Not sure about that. CBJ clears a shit ton of cap space and picks up a roster player and a 1st.
it's not that far off, the salary is a huge burden with every team being cash-strapped
Laines value is low as low goes. High cap hit in terms of production. Yes I think it may take a little more but I think harris+meser+winnipeg 1st is perfect
I'd do it for a 2nd round pick.
If we’re acquiring Laine, one of our bigger contracts like Andy, Gally or Dvo absolutely needs to be going the other way. I’d pay more in futures if they’re willing to take the extra year of Anderson
Gally's play picked up huge after his stupid move and suspension. If he can keep playing like that I wouldn't be averse to holding him longer. At this point, he should retire as a Hab.
10000% yes.
Holy fuck can we PLEASE get him
https://youtu.be/nDY9Lw25wvA?si=qZvtEX6AaCX94Gvm
I want to be wrong, but this guy is not what our locker room needs, even if he might be what our scoresheet demands.
I don't mind the locker room aspect, but does he contribute to winning hockey games? No doubt he has a wicked shot.
arguably the best one timer in the world
Want him on our team so bad.
UFA, sure. A trade ? The Jackets would start a bidding war, and we're not at the point where he would move the needle significantly to justify the cost. I say pass.
He couldn't handle two tiny Markets. You expect him to survive here?
It doesn't seem like fan pressure was the problem in either location
Being an NHL player in Montreal is alot more than fan pressure. Not to mention a player paid 9 million a year and expected to score 40-50 goals. Let's be real.
Caufield makes 8 min and scored 28 and everybody loves him. What are you talking about?
Caufield doesn't have an extensive injury history including mental illness, is drafted (pick 15) and developed by montreal and can handle the pressure of our market. He's also 22 (not 26). Caufield did not cost assets to acquire. Laine was a 2nd overall pick, is soft, unreliable and assuredly unable to handle our market. Why am I giving away 1st rounders to a fellow lottery team exactly? This is the same discourse that has surrounded Zegras, Necas and now Laine. Trade for am impact player, i'm not interested in flawed players. Why are you?
I’m not saying we should trade for him just your logic that if he makes 9 min he should score 50 goals is not true. Well no teams are giving up there best players for trade so unless you want to just keep finishing in the bottom 5 and hope the picks pan out we will need to trade for a player another team finds expandable
> 9 min he should score 50 goals is not true. I'm saying that the expectation is there because he's already done it and is advertised as a goal scorer. He scores at a 43 goal/82 game pace thus far in his career. > Well no teams are giving up there best players for trade I'm just asking for core/established players. We already have Dach who can't even complete a season and we traded a 13th overall pick + 3rd rounder for him. How many of these guys do we need to collect?
Until one works out I guess. I like Dach and I hope he can stay healthy but man did we over pay for him so far
Agreed I like him a lot (even considered getting a jersey) but until he can complete a full 82 game season, it’ll be a bad trade. But it’s bad business if FO can’t recognize the risk aspect of acquiring Laine.
Mental illness was him dealing with the death of a loved one. Hard to blame the guy for that. To be fair, Laine has been stuck in two really shit organizations. If he came to our team and was a second line guy with second PP minutes, I can easily see him giving us 30 goals and 50 points. With the cap going up, I’m not too worried about his salary. We would have to pay that much for a free agent if not more. I don’t think that we are going to be contenders before the end of his deal but he would be very useful in secondary scoring.
I’m not blaming him (mental illness). But I’m not going to pretend it doesn’t exist. I wouldn’t say Winnipeg is a shit organization. They’ve developed many great talents. Ultimately this is a business, you would hope an employee is available to work.
Winnipeg was a shit organization when he was there. They were not winning and it was well known that their room was pure poison. I work in a call center and have had many employees go on leave for mental health and there is never a point where I was like, “if only this employee was available to work”. The NHL is just now catching up to the reality of mental health and I fully support athletes needing to step away. But either way, for a 2nd and Harris or something similar, I would think that it’s worth the risk. At worst, he goes on the IR and he is a non-factor and we didn’t lose all that much. At best, he scores 40 goals and takes ice time away from Anderson and Gallagher.
I'll put this into context for you. It would take you 175-200 years to make what he makes per year. He is not a normal person, and should be demanded to perform. I've had a hand in running a business, while the human in me cares for the person. It won't help me run my business. Shouldn't be my burden as a fan to coddle him. Yes I agree Harris + 2nd is cheap enough. But it will surely cost (alot) more. Many playoff team would take him retained for a 2 year window.
>Why am I giving away 1st rounders to a fellow lottery team exactly? Who's saying 1st rounders? A 2nd and Harris at best
Wishful thinking. Laine won't be that cheap.
Then I don't think he'll be playing in MTL next year
the expections would never be that high at the start, the fanbase is smart enought to recognize that move as a reclamation project
And guys saying we'd have to give up a lot to get him...which is it
If that's your reasoning, do you also expect Armia to produce like Dach?
I don’t get the point you’re making. We got Armia as a throw in for spare parts. Not every players value can be found on hockeydb
Taking salary as the only anchor for point production will probably lead to skewed expectations. I get the point your making about pressure based off his salary. I just think this reasoning is often applied to underperforming players (e.g. Gallagher and Anderson) and not to overperforming players (e.g. Newhook and Dach) to establish expectations, which to me seems unfair.
Just saying that his problems have been personal and haven't had any relevance to the market he's in.
Right, but a history of mental illness is a risk factor for another crisis. (I realize these factors are sometimes out of his control). Montreal is a pressure cooker, it's not for him.
He did lose his father during that stretch, probably didn't help.
Why not? the fanbase has been very tolerant of the rebuild these past years
Did the markets kill him or the teams/organizations? Or just himself and he needs a fresh start anywhere?
Do we want to find out?
Maybe? It depends on the price, the cap value going back and forth, and the due diligence they allow us to do on his mental health.
No thank you. If it didn't work in Peg and Lumbus it's definitely not going to work here.
Maybe I am out of the loop on Laine but he screams like a problem case to me. If the price is low I guess that it is worth the risk
Habs could use him .The culture is right for home to succeed.
crazy how some of our fans want laine but not zegras lol
Well Laine is a 6’5 30-35 goal scorer
and his best season was like 6 years ago, meanwhile zegras has put up two 60 point seasons in the last 3 years and is healthier
Ca sent la coupe!
Yesser mon chum
If the Habs are willing to take the full cap hit without a contract going back, I think they could be able to get him for free. References: Monahan and Pacioretty trades
There's a difference: Calgary and Vegas were looking to remain competitive and needed to get rid of the contract. CBJ are not looking to compete this season (they shouldn't after finishing 4th) so they aren't pressed to get rid of Laine at all costs. If they think Laine has negative value and they've had him on the team for a few years, maybe there's something we don't know. If he's free I'd take him, but I don't think CBJ is letting him go for nothing. And their GM is the former canes GM that did the KK deal. Don't think he's lining up to fumble a trade and do the Habs any favors in the process.
Giving a player for free doesn't mean they have negative value IMO. It just means they're value is is the same as the cap space. Taking Laine's full cap without returning any salary has a lot of value for CBJ, we'd almost be doing them favour.
Hard no.
No fucking thanks
Add Price’s LTIR to the deal?