That 04/05 relegation battle with four teams fighting for seventeenth to avoid relegation was legendary. West Bromwich started the day rock bottom at 20th and ended the day at 17th. The great escape.
I-League promotion race was 🔥 this season. We have to wait till 2026 to get relegation system in ISL.
and we will be having more historical clubs with having organic fanbase, Shillong lajong, Aizwal FC, NEROCA, Churchill etc.
Why do you think the ISL has such low attendance? It is not a year long season, barely any matches and there's no actual consequence for losing. You can't have stories like Wrexham in Indian football. I, for one, feel no allegiance to MCFC or any such teams in the ISL. Even in the IPL, to a lesser extent, they worship the players, not the team. I would love to see if CSK has the same amount of supporters without Dhoni playing. ISL does not even have that advantage of players being fawned over, cause even the play is not enthusing enough.
The only time I torture myself is watching the NT play, even if they continuously draw or lose, hoping for a win somehow
You don't even have to look that far down to be honest. Just look at Luton town.
2007 they were playing in the EFL championship, the second tier of English football. 2014 they were playing in the Conference League, the 5th. Three relegations in seven years. Heartbreaking.
Fast forward to 2023 and they're now in the Premier League. Four promotions in nine years is absolutely mental.
Imagine being a Luton fan and watching your team drop three tiers and climb four in just over a decade and a half. This is what makes club football beautiful.
America will never have this.
What America has is every match that produces anticipation and excitement. Don't act like there isn't any upside to franchise model.
Close games and balanced rosters are major upside that you wouldn't find in any football league. 5 teams have a chance at Premier league title, 2-3 in other Top 5 leagues.
While we can admire no name club getting in premier league all day, truth is domestic viewership of football is down in europe and domestic viewership of NBA and NFL is stable (even up) in US.
Ahh wrexham , so true dude , i just watched the documentary like last year and from then on i am so invested in the team , although efl league 2 is not broadcastes in india ( only a few selected matches on fancode , either ways i didnt buy it ) i would still follow matchdays and stuff , i would literally wake in the middle of the night duri g matches to check if wrexham is doing well , it started as a hobby , now its an obsession or should i say i really like the team lmao .whenever my friends ask me what my favourite english football team is , i say wrexham ( ik its welsh , but the play in the english circuit ) , and they are out of their mind cuz they have never heard of a team like that ever .
Never said anything about them being poor , ofcourse they are rich , they have rich influential owners who have made a small town become relevant to a relative portion of the world , thats what is inspiring , wrexham is a town of working class with their own tragedies and problems , yet they work away that to support their beloved team in numbers regardless if its 5th tier or 4th . Of course they are rich now considering the media attention and clout they get thats what happens when u got hollywood as ur creme de la creme . The documentary was never to show that wrexham is a struggling team , surviving in national league of efl requires more funds than many tier 2 and tier 3 leagues of some countries ( ifykyk ) , it was a testament to the passion of the fans and the whole town , everything is replacable , the players , the managers , heck the owners too , but not the institution . I could relate more because just like wrexham here in kolkata football is the game of working class , most people donot have enough money to buy the expensive ipl tickets , but they would fill up a cfl match or a youth league match in barrackpore , it is how it is .
Your message about the ISL attendance and fan engagement is valid, but it's important to note that these issues are specific to the ISL and not indicative of the American sporting franchise system. The ISL's low attendance, short season, and lack of consequence for losing are inherent to its own structure and operation.
While you mention aspects like team allegiance and player worship, these are influenced by various cultural and organizational factors within Indian sports, rather than characteristics of the American sporting franchise systems. In American sports leagues, such as the NFL, NBA, and MLB, fan engagement, team loyalty are complex dynamics shaped by different historical, social, and economic contexts. Most teams, even in last place, still have big attendances and players putting in a fight, not giving up.
Comparing the ISL to the American sporting franchise system doesn't capture the unique challenges facing Indian football. It's more appropriate to examine ISL within its own framework and consider solutions that align with its specific context, rather than drawing direct parallels to systems from other countries.
Not really, but definitely copied and pasted from other sources while writing this up. I do use Gemini every now and then and sometimes use the same sentence structure from there on occasion.
But, any other thoughts besides dismissing my post?
The problem with Franchise like ISL is their initial Single club per region rule. They really thought having a team per region will have more attendance, but it's simply is not sustainable because States where Football is not popular won't have any fan culture and they are missing out much larger attendances from the regions where it's popular. They should have never limit the teams from Kerala, Bengal and North East. You don't need all the States and Cities to like football. London, Buenos Aires, Rio or north Rhine-westphalia has so many football teams, imagine if someone asks these regions to have a Single team. Franchise model works when there is no football culture but We do have football culture in India to have a good footballing national team.
I might be wrong here but didn’t AIFF release a whole plan on Indian football league system. It’s a long vision document on having multiple tier leagues by 2030.
Biggest element here is investment. Football desperately needed money to kick start something. From business pov, it makes no sense to put money in something which has the risk of getting relegated.Â
I think the current model works fine. We don't need the extra insentive of relegation. We just need better management.Â
Good Indian players, who perform in ISL need a place in NT.Â
If you ignore all the mental gymnastics, the cold hard truth is not a lot of people care about Indian Football.
Before you get the urge to post videos from Kohlapur or a sevens game in Kerala, please dont.
Indian football has already tried every possible model under the sun, the franchise model is only the latest iteration. Sometime in 2008 or 09, there was an interview in Deccan Chronicle by one of the owners of Dempo or Churchill brothers on the sorry state of title sponsorship and funding in the NFL and how it was marginally better with the I - league.
Please see if you can google the article.
Indian football needs to figure out what works for it, doesn't matter if it is a closed league or open league or no relegation tournament. Whatever works should be fine. Who cares if a euro club folds and respawns somewhere else and it did not work.
Neither model has proven effective. Also, the Indian Super League doesn't follow to the American model. Simply lacking relegation and featuring franchise teams doesn't equate to adopting the 'American model.'
The American model entails equitable negotiation and distribution of TV rights and sponsorship, strict adherence to a salary cap, structured game schedules, investment in infrastructure and youth development programs, revenue sharing among teams, collective bargaining agreements (CBAs) between players and the league, and various revenue-generating initiatives like stadium naming rights and jersey sponsorships.
None of these key elements are prevalent in the ISL, further distinguishing it from the American sports franchise systems. Comparing the ISL to the MLS highlights vast differences.
Yet, it seems criticisms of America often grab attention, even when misapplied.
This is exactly right! I thought the OP is delusional.
India barely has a sports culture compared to other countries - wellness is just beginning for the masses - and football is not popular.
Realistically, they should only focus on high density areas like Kerala, Goa and West Bengal. The fact that Delhi had to move and Mumbai barely gets a crowd, speaks volumes.
On point. Greed ruins sporting competitions and kills the league. They need to build up the grass roots teams that already have a local following and invest in them. Market them better.
Your arguments has some good points but your whole premise is based on the idea that indian football needs to be like top 5 league. Some things will work, some won't. Franchise leagues have worked in many sports in India and full pyramid only works when there support at base of pyramid, most state federation suck.
Still, I agree with you mostly and over time changes need to be made. Once ILeague has better support from AIFF from sponsorship to broadcast, ISL should be ready for relegation. It's the current fear of clubs closing down that we don't have relegation.
All that aside, why do you have to organize Football games every day without a proper break between some teams where generally if I talk about European leagues, it's generally from Friday to Monday, with some midweek matches, and then you complain about attendance?
And I believe AIFF plans to introduce relegation in ISL next season onwards. I saw the football calendar for next season, and for now, it seems promising. Let's hope it delivers well.
I fully agree with this. However, for the time being, it is ok. Football is growing QUICKLY in our country and so we'll also start seeing drastic changes in the landscape in the near future, when newer fans start exploring domestic football.
very well said. unfortunately this system affects the performances of our players at international level as well. players didn't care about performing under pressure or about bad forms for the entire season, now they can't perform at the international stage
Let's keep cricket out of this...
As cricket isn't played on the club model but mostly by Country model...
As most of the matches are between nations or state teams
Bro it is a business making model. USA couldn't even qualify because of this shit system and then we went and adopted it. It's another revenue stream and football growth is a side quest.
The US doesn’t care about football at all and they are so so much better than India it’s not even close. I doubt any ISL player would get any significant amount of playing time in the MLS.
Unlike established European leagues where money is being minted, Indian sports leagues need deep sustained investments before they can make money for the owners. This requires a closed league structure as no big pocketed corporate will invest in a league where relegation is a possibility.
It takes out a ton of excitement as well. Some of the most dramatic final days in the Premier League have seen tense battles against relegation.
That 04/05 relegation battle with four teams fighting for seventeenth to avoid relegation was legendary. West Bromwich started the day rock bottom at 20th and ended the day at 17th. The great escape.
I-League promotion race was 🔥 this season. We have to wait till 2026 to get relegation system in ISL. and we will be having more historical clubs with having organic fanbase, Shillong lajong, Aizwal FC, NEROCA, Churchill etc.
Yes, I want traditional clubs inside the ISL to develop it much more. I'm quite happy Mohammedam Sporting won the I-League this year
Why do you think the ISL has such low attendance? It is not a year long season, barely any matches and there's no actual consequence for losing. You can't have stories like Wrexham in Indian football. I, for one, feel no allegiance to MCFC or any such teams in the ISL. Even in the IPL, to a lesser extent, they worship the players, not the team. I would love to see if CSK has the same amount of supporters without Dhoni playing. ISL does not even have that advantage of players being fawned over, cause even the play is not enthusing enough. The only time I torture myself is watching the NT play, even if they continuously draw or lose, hoping for a win somehow
You don't even have to look that far down to be honest. Just look at Luton town. 2007 they were playing in the EFL championship, the second tier of English football. 2014 they were playing in the Conference League, the 5th. Three relegations in seven years. Heartbreaking. Fast forward to 2023 and they're now in the Premier League. Four promotions in nine years is absolutely mental. Imagine being a Luton fan and watching your team drop three tiers and climb four in just over a decade and a half. This is what makes club football beautiful. America will never have this.
What America has is every match that produces anticipation and excitement. Don't act like there isn't any upside to franchise model. Close games and balanced rosters are major upside that you wouldn't find in any football league. 5 teams have a chance at Premier league title, 2-3 in other Top 5 leagues. While we can admire no name club getting in premier league all day, truth is domestic viewership of football is down in europe and domestic viewership of NBA and NFL is stable (even up) in US.
Ahh wrexham , so true dude , i just watched the documentary like last year and from then on i am so invested in the team , although efl league 2 is not broadcastes in india ( only a few selected matches on fancode , either ways i didnt buy it ) i would still follow matchdays and stuff , i would literally wake in the middle of the night duri g matches to check if wrexham is doing well , it started as a hobby , now its an obsession or should i say i really like the team lmao .whenever my friends ask me what my favourite english football team is , i say wrexham ( ik its welsh , but the play in the english circuit ) , and they are out of their mind cuz they have never heard of a team like that ever .
Wrexham is very rich compared to other teams in League 1 and 2. They are far from an inspiring story.
Never said anything about them being poor , ofcourse they are rich , they have rich influential owners who have made a small town become relevant to a relative portion of the world , thats what is inspiring , wrexham is a town of working class with their own tragedies and problems , yet they work away that to support their beloved team in numbers regardless if its 5th tier or 4th . Of course they are rich now considering the media attention and clout they get thats what happens when u got hollywood as ur creme de la creme . The documentary was never to show that wrexham is a struggling team , surviving in national league of efl requires more funds than many tier 2 and tier 3 leagues of some countries ( ifykyk ) , it was a testament to the passion of the fans and the whole town , everything is replacable , the players , the managers , heck the owners too , but not the institution . I could relate more because just like wrexham here in kolkata football is the game of working class , most people donot have enough money to buy the expensive ipl tickets , but they would fill up a cfl match or a youth league match in barrackpore , it is how it is .
Your message about the ISL attendance and fan engagement is valid, but it's important to note that these issues are specific to the ISL and not indicative of the American sporting franchise system. The ISL's low attendance, short season, and lack of consequence for losing are inherent to its own structure and operation. While you mention aspects like team allegiance and player worship, these are influenced by various cultural and organizational factors within Indian sports, rather than characteristics of the American sporting franchise systems. In American sports leagues, such as the NFL, NBA, and MLB, fan engagement, team loyalty are complex dynamics shaped by different historical, social, and economic contexts. Most teams, even in last place, still have big attendances and players putting in a fight, not giving up. Comparing the ISL to the American sporting franchise system doesn't capture the unique challenges facing Indian football. It's more appropriate to examine ISL within its own framework and consider solutions that align with its specific context, rather than drawing direct parallels to systems from other countries.
This reeks of Chatgpt.
Not really, but definitely copied and pasted from other sources while writing this up. I do use Gemini every now and then and sometimes use the same sentence structure from there on occasion. But, any other thoughts besides dismissing my post?
Yet another episode of Indian football structure is shit and how to improve it.
The problem with Franchise like ISL is their initial Single club per region rule. They really thought having a team per region will have more attendance, but it's simply is not sustainable because States where Football is not popular won't have any fan culture and they are missing out much larger attendances from the regions where it's popular. They should have never limit the teams from Kerala, Bengal and North East. You don't need all the States and Cities to like football. London, Buenos Aires, Rio or north Rhine-westphalia has so many football teams, imagine if someone asks these regions to have a Single team. Franchise model works when there is no football culture but We do have football culture in India to have a good footballing national team.
It's going to take a lot of time for this to be implemented but just fucking atleast start something where we can see the progress.
I might be wrong here but didn’t AIFF release a whole plan on Indian football league system. It’s a long vision document on having multiple tier leagues by 2030.
https://www.the-aiff.com/media/uploads/2023/01/Vision-2047-The-Indian-Football-Strategic-Roadmap-2023-2047.pdf
Biggest element here is investment. Football desperately needed money to kick start something. From business pov, it makes no sense to put money in something which has the risk of getting relegated. I think the current model works fine. We don't need the extra insentive of relegation. We just need better management. Good Indian players, who perform in ISL need a place in NT.Â
If you ignore all the mental gymnastics, the cold hard truth is not a lot of people care about Indian Football. Before you get the urge to post videos from Kohlapur or a sevens game in Kerala, please dont. Indian football has already tried every possible model under the sun, the franchise model is only the latest iteration. Sometime in 2008 or 09, there was an interview in Deccan Chronicle by one of the owners of Dempo or Churchill brothers on the sorry state of title sponsorship and funding in the NFL and how it was marginally better with the I - league. Please see if you can google the article. Indian football needs to figure out what works for it, doesn't matter if it is a closed league or open league or no relegation tournament. Whatever works should be fine. Who cares if a euro club folds and respawns somewhere else and it did not work.
Neither model has proven effective. Also, the Indian Super League doesn't follow to the American model. Simply lacking relegation and featuring franchise teams doesn't equate to adopting the 'American model.' The American model entails equitable negotiation and distribution of TV rights and sponsorship, strict adherence to a salary cap, structured game schedules, investment in infrastructure and youth development programs, revenue sharing among teams, collective bargaining agreements (CBAs) between players and the league, and various revenue-generating initiatives like stadium naming rights and jersey sponsorships. None of these key elements are prevalent in the ISL, further distinguishing it from the American sports franchise systems. Comparing the ISL to the MLS highlights vast differences. Yet, it seems criticisms of America often grab attention, even when misapplied.
This is exactly right! I thought the OP is delusional. India barely has a sports culture compared to other countries - wellness is just beginning for the masses - and football is not popular. Realistically, they should only focus on high density areas like Kerala, Goa and West Bengal. The fact that Delhi had to move and Mumbai barely gets a crowd, speaks volumes.
On point. Greed ruins sporting competitions and kills the league. They need to build up the grass roots teams that already have a local following and invest in them. Market them better.
Your arguments has some good points but your whole premise is based on the idea that indian football needs to be like top 5 league. Some things will work, some won't. Franchise leagues have worked in many sports in India and full pyramid only works when there support at base of pyramid, most state federation suck. Still, I agree with you mostly and over time changes need to be made. Once ILeague has better support from AIFF from sponsorship to broadcast, ISL should be ready for relegation. It's the current fear of clubs closing down that we don't have relegation.
I think ISL has copy pasted the A league format. Nevertheless it's shit.
All that aside, why do you have to organize Football games every day without a proper break between some teams where generally if I talk about European leagues, it's generally from Friday to Monday, with some midweek matches, and then you complain about attendance? And I believe AIFF plans to introduce relegation in ISL next season onwards. I saw the football calendar for next season, and for now, it seems promising. Let's hope it delivers well.
I fully agree with this. However, for the time being, it is ok. Football is growing QUICKLY in our country and so we'll also start seeing drastic changes in the landscape in the near future, when newer fans start exploring domestic football.
very well said. unfortunately this system affects the performances of our players at international level as well. players didn't care about performing under pressure or about bad forms for the entire season, now they can't perform at the international stage
Let's keep cricket out of this... As cricket isn't played on the club model but mostly by Country model... As most of the matches are between nations or state teams
This or nothing. Loved your message man, well said
Bro it is a business making model. USA couldn't even qualify because of this shit system and then we went and adopted it. It's another revenue stream and football growth is a side quest.
The US doesn’t care about football at all and they are so so much better than India it’s not even close. I doubt any ISL player would get any significant amount of playing time in the MLS.
That's not what I meant. We are following their model even when that said model is not working.
Unlike established European leagues where money is being minted, Indian sports leagues need deep sustained investments before they can make money for the owners. This requires a closed league structure as no big pocketed corporate will invest in a league where relegation is a possibility.