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Not all the characters really benefit from the 1 month training period. Yuji and Yuta would, but they've only been sorcerers for a few years. Anyone learning new tricks will get stronger, but what is Kashimo gonna learn. He was undefeated until his old age. He was definitely at nearly 100% of his potential. He has way more experience than anyone else. Unless he learned RCT, there wasn't much to do for him.
He just likely wasn't included in the training.
They don't know him, they don't trust him.
They aren't going to give him info that he may be able to use against them in the future.
It's telling that the only time they show him having discussions with the cast is when they talk about what they were going to do after Kashimo takes his L.
I think it might be likely that he would have refused the switch training even if he was asked. He was very obstinate about fighting Sukuna first and fighting him alone. Using switch training might've meant that the victory wasn't entirely his own.
Nahh he was just excluded. It's not like switch training is the only training they did, and even with switch training they'd have nothing to learn from Kashimo and nothing they'd want to teach him.
They knew he'd die, for them he was cannon fodder.
You want to fight Sukuna? You got it bud.
>They aren't going to give him info that he may be able to use against them in the future.
He would have either fought Gojo or Sukuna depending on who won, not a sorcerer on our side thought Kashimo would survive until the next week so I couldn't see them being worried about future Kashimo.
It'd have been a more reasonable course of action to beef Kashimo up as much as possible because that'd give him the best chance of crippling Sukuna during their 1v1, which would benefit the group.
I see Kashimo rejecting the offer before I see the group rejecting him.
Those panels looks exceptionally crude. It wouldn't surprise me if they got reworked in the official volumes. Also, there's no RCT aura and it's more likely that panel caught the moment his hand was in the middle of healing.
He could swap with Gojo or Yuta for RCT. That would Benedict his MBA state. It could last longer or completly heal to 100%.
He could swap with Kusakabe to get SP. This would literally counter the NET dismantle that killed kashimo.
Mystical Beast: Amber kills him not because he can't heal his body, but because his body is literally surpassing the limits of a 'human'.
His technique reshapes and modifies him to a point of no return. The only way to potentially survive it would be idle-transfiguration, but definitely not RCT
Edit: Typo
Maybe he could use the Technique Reversal from RCT. As the CT modifies him, the reversal could turn him back to normal, so it could be a way to extend his life span and even let him survive after using it, if he use the Technique Reversal to go back completely to his original state before running out of CE
It might work, but only two sorcerers have been shown to use Cursed Technique Reversal and their uses of it are pretty straightforward.
I don't disagree, but sadly we'll never know
>It might work, but **only two sorcerers have been shown to use Cursed Technique Reversal and their uses of it are pretty straightforward.**
I still think it’s kinda sus that Yuji is the perfect vessel, while his biological mother has a technique that makes them the perfect vessel hopper/invader. I think it would be a cool reveal if it turns out that Kenny‘s CT basically just passively turns him into the ultimate vessel, while his vessel hopping is actually their Technique Reversal.
There is so much potential Gege isn’t utilizing with the Reversal concept. For example, Sukuna should be really basic.
He can dismember objects/humans and generate enormous amounts of heat. Going by Gojo‘s logic, where Blue attracts and Red repels, Sukuna should be able to generate negative temperatures and join objects together or at least objects that were one before, like easily reattaching his arm if it gets cut off.
Kenjaku's technique I feel is exactly as explained, the proof I look to is Yuta. Of course, the technique could be more than what we currently know, but I'm under the belief that body hopping is exactly as it sounds
With Shrine, the reversal of Cleave/Dismantle being fusing could be interesting, especially with Sukuna's RCT output dropping.
It's possible Yuji will be the one to do this since his iteration of Shrine is more 'friendly' with the use of scissors instead of invisible slices.
>the proof I look to is Yuta
Which is pretty strong proof right now, that’s why the Kenjaku thing is just a pet theory of mine.
The reason for that is, while Yuji was developed inside Kenny‘s womb (yuck), he somehow didn’t inherit Kaori‘s CT which Kenny ended up obtaining, while still technically receiving an ability (being the umtimate vessel) which apparently is the direct opposite of Kenny‘s own inherent Technique, which storywise could easily be reconciled with Kenny‘s supposed ability actually being its Reversal, something we know they are capable of.
That said, depriving Yuji of inheriting Kaori‘s CT (which also isn’t a given as he could have just naturally not inherited it) doesn’t have to be connected to Kenny receiving it instead, as they are shown to do that independently with Geto‘s CT, although we don’t know for sure if they would also retain it like Kaori’s, after hopping into someone else‘s body.
Like i said, just a fun theory of mine.
I feel like not healing the head scar in his vessel might be the trick to obtaining their technique, it was stated somewhere that keeping the stitches was a binding vow, what if that vow allows him to obtain the vessel's technique for himself once the stitches naturally heal on their own?
For him to return to normal would still be a modification though, so I don't think that it being his reversal makes sense, a reversal of the effect of modifying your body would be to not modify your body.
Like compare to Mahito, he didn't need to learn Technique Reversal to reverse the effect of his technique in someone, he would just do his technique again but to make someone "normal."
Some techniques probably just have no beneficial effect when reversed, or don't even have any effect.
W don’t know that . Cause Bomb guy RCT technique does the same thing . It’s all speculation on weather RCT could or could not heal . I mean a year ago RCT could not heal the souls or CT but out and now it can
RCT not healing souls was due to Mahito and Jogo's words, not some written law.
MBA doesn't damage Kashimo, it does things to his body that's not 'damage'. He gains a third eye, electrical signals in his mind get enhanced, his arms reform from pure energy.
The difference between Hazenoki and Kashimo is that one is clearly damage and the other is actual modifications and a shift in his physical functions, the two are not even comparable.
>RCT not healing souls was due to Mahito and Jogo's words, not some written law.
Does Mahito even 'damage' souls with regular Idle Transfiguration or does he technically just change its shape?
If you could use RCT to reverse however Mahito modified someone‘s soul, then doesn’t it make his technique obsolete, as you would be able to modify (heal) your soul with pure RCT?
Just remembered that Sukuna wasn’t „willing“ to heal Junpei, even though Yuji literally offered him any Binding Vow he desired. I feel like even though he enjoys tormenting Yuji, he is far too pragmatic to let such an opportunity pass if it was actually within his capabilities.
Can’t wait till we learn more about the entire Soul stuff.
Mahito doesn't damage souls you're right.
But I was responding to someone saying souls couldn't be healed a year ago and the only characters to comment on something like this were Jogo and Mahito, not the narrator or someone attempting and failing.
Sukuna not taking the deal could be for a few reasons, but without his confirmation on that ordeal it's speculation, maybe he could've helped Junpei or he couldn't, regardless he went with his plan to swap vessels
Also the soul stuff is very interesting, especially the afterlife talks Sukuna has with people and Gojo's airport scene. The fight with Yujo and Sukuna may shed some light on those things
>Sukuna not taking the deal could be for a few reasons, **but without his confirmation on that ordeal it's speculation**, maybe he could've helped Junpei or he couldn't, **regardless he went with his plan to swap vessels**
Definitely agree, I just think it’s very strong speculation as his plan to swap vessels was an incredibly risky gamble because of the time limit and him technically being unable to hurt someone.
He only acted his plan out after Yuji‘s internal thoughts betrayed that he literally sees himself as a cog in the system, rather than an actual human being, which allowed him to sever his own finger and force feed it to Megumi (which in my book still absolutely qualifies as hurting someone lol).
He doesn’t give a fuck about Junpei or Yuji as long as he isn’t stuck with him and I think Yuji offering literally anything would have been a good opportunity for Sukuna to trick Yuji into losing control or him getting his freedom without the risky gamble, allowing him to then still torment Yuji and Junpei before moving on and doing whatever.
Anyways, only time will tell. Maybe he didn’t because he didn’t yet know how to deal with Gojo who would immediately nuke him before being able to collect enough fingers to defend himself, as he likely didn’t know about the Prison Realm.
Kashimo likely can’t learn reverse cursed technique because it’s literally impossible given his CE trait making his CE practically electricity. This is head canon but it’d make a lot of sense.
Multiplying electricity against itself will make???
y are people acting like some can causally survive sukunas regular attacks when he puts effort into them, the only reason these guys are still alive are because of sukunas diminishing reserves and out put
put any charcter aside from gojo in front a 100% sukuna dismantle and they are getting split in half
not to mention, the attack kashimo took is the largest scale slash attack sukuna has thrown out post gojo
the only difference between a world slash and a regular cleave/dismantle is who the target is, he uses it alot post kashimo because it doesnt matter how weak he gets, you cant defend against a reality cutting attack if you cant manipulate reality yourself
people acting like if they put yuta in fromt of that 50ft net he would swap it away with his hand, this community is cooked
Yuta, Yuji, Gojo, Kusakabe, Ryu and Maki have all survived direct serious Dismantles. The 'net' of them is a similar projection to what Sukuna is normally capable of, and your Output largely determines how well you can survive them.
Nobody is acting like Yuta is gonna just no-diff the wall, but it's already been shown that appropriate amounts of Reinforcement *can* protect you from them. Both he and Rika have survived similar attacks already(hell Yuta survived a Cleave straight to the face, which it shouldn't matter if Sukuna has lowered output)
Yuta- fought sukuna after being weakened by yujis hits and losing an arm from higuruma
Yuji- got turned into a waffle multiple times and spent minutes at a time healing back up until eventually sukunas cuts no longer cut deep
kusakabe- fought the weakest version of sukuna here
ryu- took a casual dismantle and then sukuna apologized and took his head off
maki- fought a weakend sukuna after both yuji and yuta and higurma did a number on him
Kashimo- took a net so large it wasn't even in the pannel and it was RIPPING up the ground as it was coming for him
you cannot compare what he threw at kashimo to anything he threw after lol, look at this thing: [https://prnt.sc/hstWIFW-3zUs](https://prnt.sc/hstWIFW-3zUs)
no one but gojo is walking away alive from that
and yes lowered output does matter, because of u subscribe to cleave = 1 shot, then you also believe with all your heart, if yuji hit a cleave on sukuna he could 1 shot him, same with if yuta hit sukuna with a cleave
You literally can, because the only difference between the attack used against Kashimo and the attack used against the others is the range. But range doesn't even matter if something like CLEAVE is used because Cleave ignores dura.
If Cleave ignored durability, sukuna would have no reason to use World Slash post gojo because it does the exact same thing. Why would he waste his reserves on people so far below him if cleave can just 1 shot all of them?????????????????>>>
he used world slash on Yuta because he no longer has the output to fatality injure him with this normal cleaves and dismantles.
cleave does not ignore durability, it adjusts its strength to the opponent's defense, and that scales with cursed energy output
if dismantle can cut 3 inches into something, cleave can go 8
cleave and dismantle are not two different attacks, they are 2 variations of a single slashing attack
dismantle is default, and cleave is when he "customizes" it to the target he is attacking, which he uses on targets he perceives as tougher. Cleave just uses more CE because of those adjustments
thats why when he uses his domain he has dismantle target things without cursed energy, and cleave target things with, because those most likely have reinforcement
and if cleave was dura negation, gojo would not have been able to survive the domain, he would have been turned to saw dust based on how he was getting barraged from every inch of his body
>cleave does not ignore durability, it adjusts its strength to the opponent's defense, and that scales with cursed energy output
That isn't the description we got so you are wrong, I won't argue for the other points but this one alone is something that you clearly are wrong in.
Dismantle is what scales based on ce output while cleave scales based on ce reserves.
Need I remind you that sorcerers can create programs that can do various things and that means instead of manually using his CT to cut someone(which would limit him by output) he could Instead have a program that scales automatically to how much ever ce is needed in order to oneshot.
Not Yuta.
I never sair Yuta, I Said Yuta post training is below Ryu in CE reinforcement. Yuta would be slashed by a normal Dismantle.
There are 2 more people confirmed to not get slashed by diamantle: Ryu and Yorozu.
Do you even read my post?? I found it strange that Sukuna used his 1 time reicarnation and space dismantle on kashimo and then just killed him with a regular dismantle.
For sure, it is One of the most powerfull atacks in the series, and its aoe is huge. But if he could kill him with Dismantle why didnt he do it has meguna?
The dismantle in question against Ryu didn’t fillet him into 3, but it did leave major slash wounds.
Dismantles of the same strength but of the size that hit Kashimo (encompassing his whole body, likely surpassing it in scale) would likely eviscerate Ryu like it did Kashimo. The same is likely true for Yorozu. Additionally Heian Sukuna likely has a higher max output for his dismantle than Meguna.
Where are you getting this info from?
I would argue the opposite, NET dismantle is less powerfull, or rather, has a lowest ceiling than a normal Dismantle.
And where is it stated that heian Sukuna has a Higher output then meguna?
We know dismantles have a base limit in strength, this limit oils logically likely scale to Sukuna’s own strength or CE, this is supported by the fingers, max dismantle at a 15F Sukuna’s output should be less powerful than max output dismantle from 20F Sukuna, this would mean it likely functions as some sort of scale-up from Sukuna himself, makes sense that his strength with reinforcement would be the scalar for his dismantles. Heian Sukuna has more muscle mass and weight behind him, so his reinforcement would stack on top of that and thereby make him stronger.
This means heian Sukuna is stronger than Meguna in reinforcement, therefore, as the max output of dismantles likely scale to his strength, they’d be stronger when he reincarnated.
Net dismantle is literally the same as dismantle but bigger, Sukuna is just expending more cursed energy to increase his dismantles size. Sukuna is also chanting and signing off-screen to do this, it’s why he throws Kashimo away, this isn’t confirmed but it’s the only logical thing he could be doing, Meguna couldn’t do this as he doesn’t have the number of limbs for it.
>Yorozu
Not confirmed, as she could have died from that Dismantle back then if she had already made a deal with Kenjaku. Why she'd do that before having the motivation of meeting Sukuna again is unclear. Maybe she was bored or wanted more ideas for how to use Construction.
> found it strange that Sukuna used his 1 time reicarnation and space dismantle on kashimo and then just killed him with a regular dismantle.
I think there are a few reasons for this. He was pretty much forced to use his Reincarnation heal, as his RCT output was low and he was about to be hit with sure-hit lightning. Plus, he needed the extra hands and mouth to fulfill the new conditions for World Slash if he ever wanted to use it again.
The use of the World Slash may have been Sukuna confirming that his new activation conditions work with his extra arms and mouth. Basically, it's a test run while also giving Kashimo props for making him transform.
Then, the net attack shows us that Sukuna's Heian Era body makes him even more terrifying, even only using Dismantle. I assumed he used hand signs/chants to restore output for the net attack even if it wasn't a World Slash. I can't confirm this, but I feel as though 100% Meguna Dismantle is weaker than 100% Heian Dismantle. By the time he's fighting Yuta+Yuji, though, he's back down, maybe even below Meguna level because of his damaged arms/mouth/heart/soul. Does that make sense?
>Not confirmed, as she could have died from that Dismantle back then if she had already made a deal with Kenjaku.
* Yorozu would not have known the name of Sukuna's CT if she died from the encounter shown in the flashback. It didn't even seem like she knew about Sukuna prior to that point since she didn't utter his name even once. Edit: I re-read the raws and it's heavily implied that she had no idea who Sukuna was during the flashback based on her dialogue since she referred to Sukuna as その人(that person).
* Kenjaku's statement in Chapter 216 indicates that Yorozu kept pestering Sukuna in a one-sided fashion.
* She could not have accepted Kenjaku's offer prior to her meeting with Sukuna since it requires the user to "die" in order for them to become a Cursed Object, and we have no reason to think that Kenjaku was nearby to turn her into a Cursed Object before she died.
Kashimo also dodges it whilst in a far worse position, he was mid air, firing a electromagnetic wave and curled up like a Shrimp. In both cases they were given information of its activation beforehand
Kashimo did get a warning from sukuna no?
While we, the readers and the scanlators, missed sukuna's chant for maki, we only heard the paired falling stars part before the attack was executed
Yea he did, though this shouldn't de-valje the dodge, everyone else gets a heads up by virtue of being able to see him make the enmaten hand signs, something that was impossible in Kashimos position.
Everyone else got this luxury by virtue of being able to see him preform the hand-signs, something that was physically impossible for Kashimo to see given his position.
yuta also died to regular dismantle (buffed up by chants to restore sukunas output to 100%) so it just seems like sukunas dismantle is also really deadly.
We also didnt really see gojo get hit by a regular dismantle (MS doesnt count since MS with shibuya output in 258 should have disintegrated yuji when his SD went down)
>yuta also died to regular dismantle
Why do you think so? I thought Gege just didnt show the panel where he used the hand sign but it's still a world slash. It makes no sense otherwise because if he could just kill Yuta with chanted dismantle, why did he even stop HWB?
at the end of 251, sukuna has 1 left hand, and 2 right hands (and the lower one is slashed). when we see his hand in the slashing panel, it doesnt have any mark to indicate that it has been cut in half by yuta. therefore, he used his upper right hand to point the trajectory of his slash. so, he could not have done the enmaten hand sign necessary for world cutting slash.
considering in 250, a net of dismantles almost killed both yuta and yuji, a chanted and pointed full output dismantle can definitely cut him in half.
also in the page there is clearly a net of dismantles on yuji and rika too, so dont know how he does that if he is using wcs.
>therefore, he used his upper right hand to point the trajectory of his slash. so, he could not have done the enmaten hand sign necessary for world cutting slash.
That's my point, he may have just used the upper hands to do the sign and then use the same hand to point the direction.
>considering in 250, a net of dismantles almost killed both yuta and yuji, a chanted and pointed full output dismantle can definitely cut him in half.
No it didn't almost kill them off. They healed it off immediately, Sukuna even noticed that their RCT technique has been improved because of that.
>also in the page there is clearly a net of dismantles on yuji and rika too, so dont know how he does that if he is using wcs.
That doesnt mean anything. He could use normal dismantle on Yuji and Rika before or right after the world slash. Sukuna can use dismantle without any physical movement after all. The types of slash indicated separated attacks as well. Yuta got one clean cut while the others got shallow net cut. Wouldn't make sense if that's from the same attack.
Also, still the same question: why did he even stop HWB if an amped dismantle can kill Yuta anytime? And where did you get the "chanted to restore to 100% output" from? Was that ever shown before? The best thing we saw about chant was only to raise power by 120% and that was with two more ppl
Doesn't matter, he still was about to die from it.
Also for anyone reading this, remember: Yuta didn't "give up his future" to get a better chance at killing Sukuna. He already had no future. Even if it's 5 minutes, the body swap is actually enlarging his lifespan.
Since you moved this post over here, I'd like to respond with my same points (few minor adjustments too)
I have a plethora of problems and issues with this, and I'll outline a few of them here:
1. We can't judge the power of the dismantle net since we have no information on the attack nor its function or setup. We've only seen it once, so no proper assessment can be made. I don't believe it's a WCS, but we can't comment on its nature outside of that.
2. I have never (and I've argued this with people before) been presented with a single piece of evidence that supports dismantle always being at max output, or not being able to have its output increased. Unlike cleave, it can't be adjusted to an opponents body and CE, but I do not recall a statement about dismantle's output ever being made (correct me and provide evidence if I'm wrong).
3. Just a minor thing, but Ryu doesn't necessarily have a great quality of CE reinforcement. He has an insane durability due to his high output. What's the difference? Well, it's more like having extra layers of armor, as opposed to just better quality armor. It's evident that Ryu has the highest basic durability in the series due to this. That's why Sukuna used cleave so he could take the high CE output into account and adjust for it. This is not stated to change the output of cleave, but more its nature. I'd say that Ryu couldn't survive something like HP in the same way as Sukuna, even if he should have a higher typical durability, due to Sukuna likely having just better CE reinforcement quality
4. There are various reasons why I don't think Kashimo would have participated in the training. Firstly, it doesn't match his intent. He has always been stronger than others and wanted to fight Sukuna for answers to his struggles. It doesn't make much sense for him to train, as it wasn't about defeating Sukuna but more using him. Secondly, we don't know if he could even perform swap training due to his position as an incarnated sorcerer. We can't be sure how that would function, even if he wanted to do it for some reason.
5. There's no reason to assume that MBA would boost reinforcement or even durability. In fact, I'd argue that it might make sense for MBA to lower durability since it converts his body and flesh into his CE trait.
6. Why wouldn't Sukuna have used cleave on Kashimo in one of their physical clashes? Why did he instead use an attack that looks like it would have consumed far more CE to make? My theory is that it may be related to the threat of Kashimo's lightning and how it bypasses CE reinforcement and also his sure-hit attack. Sukuna probably saw these as troublesome, so he used a powerful ranged attack to finish him, which cleave cannot do. Recognising Kashimo's power, he utilised the strongest dismantle attack he could muster and used a net arrangement to make dodging basically impossible.
7. We can only verify the usage of WCS 3 times in the fight. Against Gojo, Higurama, and Kashimo. In Yuta's DE, it seems unlikely but hard to tell due to the panelling. Against Maki, Sukuna's hands wouldn't have been able to complete it, iirc.
8. When you ask about Sukuna in Megumi's body, it's simple. He was getting his ass kicked by Kashimo due to his weakened state and would have died to Kashimo's sure-hit if he didn't incarnate. That's made pretty obvious in the manga.
Sorry, i was meant to post here 🙃
I Will respond to your points exactly as you did.
1/2- the narrator says Dismantle is the default Slash. And that cleave adjusts to the target. When Sukuna couldnt Kill Ryu with Dismantle, he didnt fired another stronger Dismantle, he went for cleave. I assume dismantle has a ceiling. My head cannon is that the original CT is cleave, and through a binding vow:" i Will have a ceiling for my range cleave output" dismantle was born. This is supported, but not confirmed, through Yuji using cleave and not Dismantle. But I totally understand your point. Still, i believe otherwise. And according to this line of thought a NET dismantle can ONLY BE as powerfull as a normal Dismantle, if not, it is weaker, + aoe, - output..
3- when i talked about CE reinforcement i was talking about CE reinforcement + natural durability. This was my mistake, i should had phrase it as durability since it is natural durability + CE reinforcement. Maki > durability than Kusakabe but less CE reinforcement (since She got 0 CE). When i talk about CE reinforcement you can imply it is durability as a while.
4- I think you have a valid point about intent. But still, learnig RCT would be good for him since he could probably get more time in MBA. And kashimo looks more to me like a battle hungr guy than a proud guy that Will not train because he wants to test is current strengh. He didnt kill Hakari with his CT...
And through SP he could stop the very same atack that killed him.
Incarnaited sorcerers could do it, i think, since choso is in a similar position and he could do it, but that is just head cannon. It could go both ways.
5- nothing to add here, just head cannons for us fans.
6- completly agree.
7- I dont know about Yuta. The story implies he did it but the paneling says otherwise.
8- agree again. BUT, kashimo arrives, Sukuna: NET dismantle! What is kashimo gonna do?
> 1/2- the narrator says Dismantle is the default Slash. And that cleave adjusts to the target...
Yes but my point is that this doesn't mean that there is a specific limit to dismantle, but more so that it has a solid amount of damage, dependent on it's output, that doesn't account for the individual target, unlike cleave. It's not about output, but the actual function of the attack. Cleave accounts for the body and CE of the target, dismantle doesn't. We know that dismantle can still be amped with hand signs and chants, for instance. This has been done against Yuta (presumably) and Maki, for instance. It makes more sense to use an attack that's a proper counter for Ryu against him then to try and amp a dismantle as much as possible, when it doesn't even make sense to. Again, we can't properly interpret anything from this, imo.
> Yuji using cleave and not Dismantle
Yuji has freshly awakened Shrine and has a lower proficiency for it. This can be seen in his weaker output and he hasn't even used cleave again since, even when it would've made sense to when he destroyed Sukuna's heart.
> I think you have a valid point about intent. But still, learning RCT would be good for him...
Again, I don't know how it would work with incarnated sorcerers since we haven't seen any of them do it. I don't view that as an action Kashimo would take since it just doesn't fit much with his character. He didn't get the easy kill on Hakari by waiting for JP's expiry so I don't think he'd take easy shortcuts.
> I dont know about Yuta. The story implies he did it but the paneling says otherwise.
The paneling doesn't show Sukuna even having the 3 required hands free at the time of the slash, which suggests that it couldn't be WCS. This isn't 100% definitive, but it seems unlikely to be WCS.
> agree again. BUT, kashimo arrives, Sukuna: NET dismantle! What is kashimo gonna do?
Kashimo was blitzing Sukuna and brutalizing him, I don't think he could get the attack off even if he was capable of it. Also, if it required a hand sign, for instance, he couldn't have done it due to only having one hand at the time. Sukuna was in far too shabby of a state and it wasn't long before Kashimo launched his sure-hit which would have killed Sukuna, if not for the incarnation.
I think you are wrong about Dismantle. But either way, it is my opinion. It could go both ways.
I agree with you on the Yuta dismantle scene.
As soon as kashimo arrived Sukuna used kamutoke on him. So, we can assume he wanted to kill kashimo right away. Kashimo was not blitzing Sukuna. They were matched at best. Only when kashimo used his CT the blitzing began. I am looking at the panels and Sukuna didnt used any sign to do NET dismantle, but that could be off panel. If i were Sukuna i would NET dismantle as soon as kamutoke didnt work, since that is the smartest thing to do. But I Guess not.
I agree that after kashimo started MBA Sukuna had no other option than reicarnation. But that does not align with the strategic mind of Sukuna for me, he should drop kashimo before that.
OR, i get the same feeling, for the end of this fight, as for the Sukuna x Gojo fight. Something is missing. And we know we got info of that fight a lot of chapters after its conclusion. I think we will get some more info on kashimo x Sukuna in a few chapters.
My head cannon ofc.
Omg ONLY now I saw your name... Kashimo ❤️❤️
Sukuna's output was shot and he couldn't keep up with Kashimo in Megumi's body due to him not being able to RCT properly, that's why he full heals his physicals with reincarnation. The physical full heal doesn't resolve his shot output though, that's what his hand signs/chanting are for. It's a safe assumption that every single attack slash against kashimo was, at the bare minimum, amped to make up for his post gojo weakness.
So he needed to reincarnated to heal + get back attack power. MBA kashimo is easily the third strongest in the verse.
Sukuna's RCT output was low, not his normal output. That is the thing.
Kashimo could arrive, and Sukuna was like:" nop, I will save the incarnation. Take a NET dismantle". And drop kashimo right there. We could argue that he was so damaged that he could not use NET dismantle, but he used space dismantle on Gojo. How could he not use NET dismantle on kashimo?
Instead, he went to fight kashimo, let him use MBA and then got no other option than to use reicarnation.
Although that aligns with Sukuna's overall playfull nature it does not align with his strategic capabilities. He didnt know higuruma's confiscation process. For all he knew, higuruma could permanently confiscate his CT. Why take it to the extreme and not try to kill kashimo on the spot? He shot dismantle to kill Ryu on the spot, since he was surprised for his innate durability and in the next panel he used cleave to finish the battle quickly. Ofc we could argue that he wanted to fight Yorozu as well, but he could try some Ten Shadows stuff on Ryu first, but he didnt.
No, where did you get this? It was specifically mentioned in the Gojp vs Sukuna portion that their overall outputs were dropping which was getting their attack power lower. If they'd kept going without BF amps, they'd of gotten to Yuta/Hakari levels.
Sukuna transformed because he had no choice, he has nothing he could do against MBA Kashimo until he transformed. You watch MBA kashimo smack him up and down the field until he reincarnates for a reason.
>We know that dismantle is a default Slash so, we know it doesnt get stronger by applying more CE. It can get weaker, but it cannot get stronger
It can reach it's full potential through handsigns, and likely there is a chant that most likely similar to the chant of world slash. As we see from gojo at the start of his fight with sukuna. He increases the output of his purple through handsigns or chants.
Sukuna uses an output increasing handsign against both Higurama and kashimo. The handsign for regular dismantle is not enmaten, as there is a slight alteration where the fingers are placed.
Now this next part is conjecture, but I assumed that when sukuna does this the output is returned to near enough full potential.
>Ryu cannot be killed by an 100% output dismantle.
From a 16f sukuna who by his own admission had not yet fully harmonised with Megumi's soul. But seeing as Sukuna in the moment decides to compare yuta and Yuji to Ryu from that time, let's work with the idea that 16f sukuna and sukuna at that point in the fight are similar levels.
>kashimo has one of the most powerfull CE reinforcement of the series.
Not sure that he was hit with anything that can prove that, nor can we compare to the hits Hakari's other opponents received which consist of Uraume, Charles and a culling game yuji who wasn't trying to defend himself.
>Ryu >> kashimo in CE reinforcement.
Yes. But we cannot measure if we don't have realistic idea of how far A and B are from each other.
>Did Sukuna used an 100% NET dismantle on kashimo or lower
Very likely imo it was close to full potential since he used the handsign.
Normal dismantle I feel are being undervalued here.
Sukuna cut off Higurama's arms with both a world slash and a regular dismantle. Even after Yuji's output lowering soul punches Sukuna is capable of felling a parking complex building right in half. I think it's best to assume when sukuna uses those huge slashes, that he is working with more output than normal.
>What was Gege trying to prove in the way he killed kashimo?
That sukuna is strategic fighter that takes everything about the opponent into account. Sukuna knows that kashimo's agility in that mode is suped up, so he gets him off of his feet before firing the dismantle so he can't avoid it.
>Did Sukuna used a binding vow to use space dismantle in a NET and we will discover in a few chapters? Does MBA does not give the user more CE reinforcement?
99% sure it isn't a space dismantle. And MBA is just a cursed technique. No reason to assume that kashimo has better reinforcement than normal tbh.
>I find it hard to believe that Sukuna found kashimo such a threat, that he didnt wait for his RCE output to grow, keep the reicarnation card on his backpocket, try to use the 10 Shadows to play around kashimo and keep megumi body. He also used space dismantle against kashimo, and he ONLY uses it when the oponent is worhty or he has no other option. And then, he jus Kills kashimo with a NET of normal dismantles.
I mean sukuna was literally getting overwhelmed and would have gotten hit by kashimo's lightning had he not transformed put off the poor state he was in.
I hope Gege does a running commentary of the fight in the next fanbook, so he can clear things up.
You give very good arguments but, if Sukuna is such a good strategist why didnt he killed kashimo with NET dismantle before? And got pushed to use is ONLY incarnation heal. And loose Ten Shadows. Remember Sukuna, at this point, didnt know higuruma domain would confiscate the Curse tool. Having a second CT would be super use full.
I agree with you that we need an explanation for this fight. ONLY if the anime could be a better cannon than the manga, like the new seasons of Bleach. But no, jjk anime is big booms lasers Sukuna God boom boom 🙂↕️
I interpret their fight as not Sakuna taking Kashimo super seriously, but rather respecting him enough to go all out. Sakuna has said that love is fighting someone and killing them or dying to them. He didn’t toy with Kashimo because that would have been disrespectful and unloving. That’s perhaps the reason he cant seem to tryhard against Yuji, it would be showing him respect.
This dragon ball scaling where Kashimo is linked with Yuta using Hakari because of a refuted statement that predates Yuta Sendai-colony buffs is insanity..
Yuta defeated Ryu using Uro's technique to redirect Ryu's attack back at him, That's why linking characters to Yuta who gets stronger in battle via copy doesn't work well. Durability is based on CE output, Ryu has the highest CE output out of everyone, Kashimo doesn't compare to Ryu's durability nor CE output.
Hakari has been noted as special based on having the best RCT
Ryu has been noted as special since he has the highest CE output
Makes sense.
Dudes only W was against Panda, and he lost to the punch kick merchant that was Hakari.
Anyone who thought Kashimo would perform well or have any lasting impact was fooling themselves.
Especially since he was lined up to fight after Gojo.
That's unfair to kashimo. narratively he was being built up to fight sukuna, stronger than Ryu(who was boxing with yuta, another top tier), and then showed up on the battlefield Extremely confident. In any other manga, he would have had an actual fight even if he lost. It was gege narratively dropping the ball to job for a character we already knew was the strongest.
All the "narrative" is fans hyping themselves up.
No Kashimo isn't stronger than Ryu, if they met in the Edo period either Ryu would kill Kashimo if he didn't use MBA, and if he did at best there would be two dead bodies on the battlefield.
Confidence doesn't really mean much, if Kashimo was really that confident he'd have insisted on fighting Sukuna first instead of waiting for Gojo to wear him down and reveal his cards.
Again wasn't really dropping the ball, if Kashimo were set up to fight Sukuna before Gojo sure I'd say it's a different story but given the fact Kashimo already lost to Hakari and he was fighting Sukuna after Gojo anyone who thought Kashimo would perform well was fooling themselves because there was 0 chance Kashimo can be/show anything impressive after Gojo
Lol narrative doesn't show shit.
Sukuna immediately went for the kill on Ryu twice, literally everyone in the series aside from Gojo would've died if Sukuna went at them like he went at Ryu, except Kashimo wouldn't have made it past the first Dismantle to chest.
Again Ryu beats base Kashimo 10/10, Kashimo only has a chance with MBA
Which brings me back to my original comment, if Ryu & Kashimo fought in the Edo period either Ryu would beat base Kashimo or at best Kashimo uses MBA and there are two bodies left on the battlefield.
I really do not think that Sukuna had enough output to do the net of dismantles before incarnating again. That’s why he was hoping to use kamutoke to kill him instead of dismantling right away. That didn’t work and 10S were all gone, (he really only needed them for killing Gojo) so there was really no need to stay as Meguna especially since Kashimo was about to hit him with a sure hit lighting that would kill him
I hope the anime extends the severity of Kashimo’s damage to Meguna, maybe make him lose a limb or two before reincarnating and washing Kashimo.
It's up to interpretation obviously but
Sukuna bull-rushing Kashimo and finishing him as fast as possible means the utmost respect to Kashimo strength lol
Doesn't state it but Sukuna did not want to tank another sure-hit lightning. The very attack that triggered him fully reincarnate and use that physical heal.
Keep in mind Sukuna still had low RCT and couldn't DE so Kashimo is a threat if not taken seriously.
A little disclaimer, this post kind of doesn’t respond to the post as a whole, I am just commenting on the Space Slash.
I don’t think the Space Dismantle required chants and pointing, rather it only required the pointing part just like how Mahoraga did it.
What Sukuna sacrificed was his ability to use this Hax with only one restriction/pre-requisite, but n order to acquire the element of surprise (maybe even boosting its effects to 120%? But that’s just head-cannon). So by restricting his Hax ability to have 3 pre-requisites (chant, pointing, and hand sign), he gained the capacity to use it only once without any pre-requisites.
Adding to that, when a person makes a Binding Bow on himself, what he looses is what he essentially restricted. In that sense, I do believe that since Sukuna put 3 pre-requisites on his technique, in order to use once without any pre-requisites (which in this context was 1; namely, the pointing), him using his Space Slash in Yuta’s Domain without those 3 pre-requisites ultimately lead to him loosing his ability to even conjure the Space Slash.
What that means is that Sukuna found himself in death door twice and made very harsh decisions to escape death. The first was to put 3 pre-requisites as a BV on his Space Slash to kill Gojo, and the second was to disregard those pre-requisites, and use the Space Slash to escape the Domain, in exchange for loosing forever the ability to use the Space Slash.
And I truly believe this last part, not once how he not even once used it, even he did in the DE. And in those two cases, he does not have the capacity to fulfill the 3 pre-requisites. So how could he have used it in the DE, but doesn’t want to use it afterwards? Well because he lost it, because Yuta and Yuji were in the process of fucking up a heavily injured and tired Sukuna.
I know I'm going to get down votes for this but...
Ryu can totally tank a 15 finger sukuna dismantle
Kashimo died to around a 10 finger sukuna dismantle
Also kashimo doesn't have top tier reinforcement. Nowhere is that stated. Reinforcement is directly tied to a sorcerer's cursed energy pool.
So in just reinforcement it goes Sukuna, Yuta and then probably like gojo or something.
Maybe you meant CE efficency or output but kashimo has neither of these statements either.
Also Hakari in JP is not relative to Yutas durability nor ap/dp. Hakari hits like a wet noodle through the dismantle scaling you brought up
It's a statement while sukuna and yuta are fighting. I believe it's sukunas inner monolog where he comments that his CE reserve is around the "cursed brat" who we know as Yuta.
Previously it was established that Yuta has half of sukunas reserves (meaning around 10 fingers worth of CE).
Additionally yuta got hit by the world slash as he had already shrugged off cleaves and dismantles.
There are 4 things that go into durability in jjk (really these things make up all of someone's base stats but whatever):
A sorcerer's physician build
CE Reinforcement (how much CE someone has)
CE Output (how much CE someone can use at one time)
CE Manipulation (How efficient someone is at using CE)
Sukuna has the best reinforcement followed by Yuta
Ryu has the best output (followed maybe by yuta, this is a lot more unclear tho)
Gojo has the best manipulation followed by sukuna
Kashimo, is not ever mentioned in any of these categories.
CE reinforcement is not refleted by the amount of CE. Where is that statement? CE reinforcement is most likely connected to output, almost 100%. CE reinforcement is a sorcerer applying CE to their body. It does not matter if you have a lot of CE if your output is low. The perfect example is Hakari, in jackpot he has infinite CE, but his reinforcement is rather low. If what you say is true, jackpot Hakari should have one of the highest, if not the hightest, reinforcement of the manga.
CE reinforcement is diferente than CE amount.
Sukuna does not have the hightest reinforcement. Ryu is one of the highest tho. When kenjaku is talking to kashimo he says that Ryu has the Higher output, EVER (until that point). Ever means that no One until that moment had a Higher CE output, including Sukuna.
Even if you dont believe that, (pay attention), Sukuna states that Ryu has a better CE reinforcement than Yuta post training. So Ryu > Yuta in durability.
When i say kashimo has one of the best durabilities is because of his battle against panda and Hakari. Panda has a durability negation atack and, most of all, is a brawler type Fighter, kashimo took his atack like it was nothing.
To further my point, Yuta has One of the highest durabilities in the show, and he says Hakari punches are hurting like hell (not because of output, because of his special trait). Kashimo took hakari's punches like they were nothing. That is how i figured kashimo's durability must be insanly high. But, i could be wrong ofc.
I believe the reinforcement statement is from the Yuji execution arc.
Hakari has infinite CE in the sense that it's constantly refilling. He doesn't actually have access to infinite CE reserves.
Additionally there are a plethora of jjk content creators that have broken down all the different CE "things" including reinforcement.
Kashimo was strong but pridefully alone. He got clapped for that. Sukuna understood he was strong, but nowhere near him, just prideful. He didn't use Megumis body because it was mauled, his CT was half baked at that point and didn't have most shadows that would be useful in that situation left, nor would he probably've been able to deal with Kashimo as he was in the moment, there's no reason for him to not reincarnate at that point, he knew what he was in for with the rest of the cast.
I don't think Kashimo was weak, he was just dumb & prideful. Wanted the 1v1. He got what he wanted and more.
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Not all the characters really benefit from the 1 month training period. Yuji and Yuta would, but they've only been sorcerers for a few years. Anyone learning new tricks will get stronger, but what is Kashimo gonna learn. He was undefeated until his old age. He was definitely at nearly 100% of his potential. He has way more experience than anyone else. Unless he learned RCT, there wasn't much to do for him.
He just likely wasn't included in the training. They don't know him, they don't trust him. They aren't going to give him info that he may be able to use against them in the future. It's telling that the only time they show him having discussions with the cast is when they talk about what they were going to do after Kashimo takes his L.
I think it might be likely that he would have refused the switch training even if he was asked. He was very obstinate about fighting Sukuna first and fighting him alone. Using switch training might've meant that the victory wasn't entirely his own.
Nahh he was just excluded. It's not like switch training is the only training they did, and even with switch training they'd have nothing to learn from Kashimo and nothing they'd want to teach him. They knew he'd die, for them he was cannon fodder. You want to fight Sukuna? You got it bud.
>They aren't going to give him info that he may be able to use against them in the future. He would have either fought Gojo or Sukuna depending on who won, not a sorcerer on our side thought Kashimo would survive until the next week so I couldn't see them being worried about future Kashimo. It'd have been a more reasonable course of action to beef Kashimo up as much as possible because that'd give him the best chance of crippling Sukuna during their 1v1, which would benefit the group. I see Kashimo rejecting the offer before I see the group rejecting him.
Again he likely was just excluded.
Why does everyone say he doesn’t know RCT? His hand was healed in the last panel before he got diced.
He used his CT to create his arm back
[удалено]
Those panels looks exceptionally crude. It wouldn't surprise me if they got reworked in the official volumes. Also, there's no RCT aura and it's more likely that panel caught the moment his hand was in the middle of healing.
Yuji at the beginning of training had only been a sorcerer for like 4-6 months right?
He could swap with Gojo or Yuta for RCT. That would Benedict his MBA state. It could last longer or completly heal to 100%. He could swap with Kusakabe to get SP. This would literally counter the NET dismantle that killed kashimo.
Mystical Beast: Amber kills him not because he can't heal his body, but because his body is literally surpassing the limits of a 'human'. His technique reshapes and modifies him to a point of no return. The only way to potentially survive it would be idle-transfiguration, but definitely not RCT Edit: Typo
Maybe he could use the Technique Reversal from RCT. As the CT modifies him, the reversal could turn him back to normal, so it could be a way to extend his life span and even let him survive after using it, if he use the Technique Reversal to go back completely to his original state before running out of CE
It might work, but only two sorcerers have been shown to use Cursed Technique Reversal and their uses of it are pretty straightforward. I don't disagree, but sadly we'll never know
>It might work, but **only two sorcerers have been shown to use Cursed Technique Reversal and their uses of it are pretty straightforward.** I still think it’s kinda sus that Yuji is the perfect vessel, while his biological mother has a technique that makes them the perfect vessel hopper/invader. I think it would be a cool reveal if it turns out that Kenny‘s CT basically just passively turns him into the ultimate vessel, while his vessel hopping is actually their Technique Reversal. There is so much potential Gege isn’t utilizing with the Reversal concept. For example, Sukuna should be really basic. He can dismember objects/humans and generate enormous amounts of heat. Going by Gojo‘s logic, where Blue attracts and Red repels, Sukuna should be able to generate negative temperatures and join objects together or at least objects that were one before, like easily reattaching his arm if it gets cut off.
Kenjaku's technique I feel is exactly as explained, the proof I look to is Yuta. Of course, the technique could be more than what we currently know, but I'm under the belief that body hopping is exactly as it sounds With Shrine, the reversal of Cleave/Dismantle being fusing could be interesting, especially with Sukuna's RCT output dropping. It's possible Yuji will be the one to do this since his iteration of Shrine is more 'friendly' with the use of scissors instead of invisible slices.
>the proof I look to is Yuta Which is pretty strong proof right now, that’s why the Kenjaku thing is just a pet theory of mine. The reason for that is, while Yuji was developed inside Kenny‘s womb (yuck), he somehow didn’t inherit Kaori‘s CT which Kenny ended up obtaining, while still technically receiving an ability (being the umtimate vessel) which apparently is the direct opposite of Kenny‘s own inherent Technique, which storywise could easily be reconciled with Kenny‘s supposed ability actually being its Reversal, something we know they are capable of. That said, depriving Yuji of inheriting Kaori‘s CT (which also isn’t a given as he could have just naturally not inherited it) doesn’t have to be connected to Kenny receiving it instead, as they are shown to do that independently with Geto‘s CT, although we don’t know for sure if they would also retain it like Kaori’s, after hopping into someone else‘s body. Like i said, just a fun theory of mine.
Fun theory
I feel like not healing the head scar in his vessel might be the trick to obtaining their technique, it was stated somewhere that keeping the stitches was a binding vow, what if that vow allows him to obtain the vessel's technique for himself once the stitches naturally heal on their own?
For him to return to normal would still be a modification though, so I don't think that it being his reversal makes sense, a reversal of the effect of modifying your body would be to not modify your body. Like compare to Mahito, he didn't need to learn Technique Reversal to reverse the effect of his technique in someone, he would just do his technique again but to make someone "normal." Some techniques probably just have no beneficial effect when reversed, or don't even have any effect.
W don’t know that . Cause Bomb guy RCT technique does the same thing . It’s all speculation on weather RCT could or could not heal . I mean a year ago RCT could not heal the souls or CT but out and now it can
RCT not healing souls was due to Mahito and Jogo's words, not some written law. MBA doesn't damage Kashimo, it does things to his body that's not 'damage'. He gains a third eye, electrical signals in his mind get enhanced, his arms reform from pure energy. The difference between Hazenoki and Kashimo is that one is clearly damage and the other is actual modifications and a shift in his physical functions, the two are not even comparable.
>RCT not healing souls was due to Mahito and Jogo's words, not some written law. Does Mahito even 'damage' souls with regular Idle Transfiguration or does he technically just change its shape? If you could use RCT to reverse however Mahito modified someone‘s soul, then doesn’t it make his technique obsolete, as you would be able to modify (heal) your soul with pure RCT? Just remembered that Sukuna wasn’t „willing“ to heal Junpei, even though Yuji literally offered him any Binding Vow he desired. I feel like even though he enjoys tormenting Yuji, he is far too pragmatic to let such an opportunity pass if it was actually within his capabilities. Can’t wait till we learn more about the entire Soul stuff.
Mahito doesn't damage souls you're right. But I was responding to someone saying souls couldn't be healed a year ago and the only characters to comment on something like this were Jogo and Mahito, not the narrator or someone attempting and failing. Sukuna not taking the deal could be for a few reasons, but without his confirmation on that ordeal it's speculation, maybe he could've helped Junpei or he couldn't, regardless he went with his plan to swap vessels Also the soul stuff is very interesting, especially the afterlife talks Sukuna has with people and Gojo's airport scene. The fight with Yujo and Sukuna may shed some light on those things
>Sukuna not taking the deal could be for a few reasons, **but without his confirmation on that ordeal it's speculation**, maybe he could've helped Junpei or he couldn't, **regardless he went with his plan to swap vessels** Definitely agree, I just think it’s very strong speculation as his plan to swap vessels was an incredibly risky gamble because of the time limit and him technically being unable to hurt someone. He only acted his plan out after Yuji‘s internal thoughts betrayed that he literally sees himself as a cog in the system, rather than an actual human being, which allowed him to sever his own finger and force feed it to Megumi (which in my book still absolutely qualifies as hurting someone lol). He doesn’t give a fuck about Junpei or Yuji as long as he isn’t stuck with him and I think Yuji offering literally anything would have been a good opportunity for Sukuna to trick Yuji into losing control or him getting his freedom without the risky gamble, allowing him to then still torment Yuji and Junpei before moving on and doing whatever. Anyways, only time will tell. Maybe he didn’t because he didn’t yet know how to deal with Gojo who would immediately nuke him before being able to collect enough fingers to defend himself, as he likely didn’t know about the Prison Realm.
Bro, RCT takes more cursed energy than normal to use. It might actually shorten his lifespan rather than boost it lol
Kashimo likely can’t learn reverse cursed technique because it’s literally impossible given his CE trait making his CE practically electricity. This is head canon but it’d make a lot of sense. Multiplying electricity against itself will make???
y are people acting like some can causally survive sukunas regular attacks when he puts effort into them, the only reason these guys are still alive are because of sukunas diminishing reserves and out put put any charcter aside from gojo in front a 100% sukuna dismantle and they are getting split in half not to mention, the attack kashimo took is the largest scale slash attack sukuna has thrown out post gojo the only difference between a world slash and a regular cleave/dismantle is who the target is, he uses it alot post kashimo because it doesnt matter how weak he gets, you cant defend against a reality cutting attack if you cant manipulate reality yourself people acting like if they put yuta in fromt of that 50ft net he would swap it away with his hand, this community is cooked
Yuta, Yuji, Gojo, Kusakabe, Ryu and Maki have all survived direct serious Dismantles. The 'net' of them is a similar projection to what Sukuna is normally capable of, and your Output largely determines how well you can survive them. Nobody is acting like Yuta is gonna just no-diff the wall, but it's already been shown that appropriate amounts of Reinforcement *can* protect you from them. Both he and Rika have survived similar attacks already(hell Yuta survived a Cleave straight to the face, which it shouldn't matter if Sukuna has lowered output)
Yuta- fought sukuna after being weakened by yujis hits and losing an arm from higuruma Yuji- got turned into a waffle multiple times and spent minutes at a time healing back up until eventually sukunas cuts no longer cut deep kusakabe- fought the weakest version of sukuna here ryu- took a casual dismantle and then sukuna apologized and took his head off maki- fought a weakend sukuna after both yuji and yuta and higurma did a number on him Kashimo- took a net so large it wasn't even in the pannel and it was RIPPING up the ground as it was coming for him you cannot compare what he threw at kashimo to anything he threw after lol, look at this thing: [https://prnt.sc/hstWIFW-3zUs](https://prnt.sc/hstWIFW-3zUs) no one but gojo is walking away alive from that and yes lowered output does matter, because of u subscribe to cleave = 1 shot, then you also believe with all your heart, if yuji hit a cleave on sukuna he could 1 shot him, same with if yuta hit sukuna with a cleave
You literally can, because the only difference between the attack used against Kashimo and the attack used against the others is the range. But range doesn't even matter if something like CLEAVE is used because Cleave ignores dura.
If Cleave ignored durability, sukuna would have no reason to use World Slash post gojo because it does the exact same thing. Why would he waste his reserves on people so far below him if cleave can just 1 shot all of them?????????????????>>> he used world slash on Yuta because he no longer has the output to fatality injure him with this normal cleaves and dismantles. cleave does not ignore durability, it adjusts its strength to the opponent's defense, and that scales with cursed energy output if dismantle can cut 3 inches into something, cleave can go 8 cleave and dismantle are not two different attacks, they are 2 variations of a single slashing attack dismantle is default, and cleave is when he "customizes" it to the target he is attacking, which he uses on targets he perceives as tougher. Cleave just uses more CE because of those adjustments thats why when he uses his domain he has dismantle target things without cursed energy, and cleave target things with, because those most likely have reinforcement and if cleave was dura negation, gojo would not have been able to survive the domain, he would have been turned to saw dust based on how he was getting barraged from every inch of his body
>cleave does not ignore durability, it adjusts its strength to the opponent's defense, and that scales with cursed energy output That isn't the description we got so you are wrong, I won't argue for the other points but this one alone is something that you clearly are wrong in. Dismantle is what scales based on ce output while cleave scales based on ce reserves. Need I remind you that sorcerers can create programs that can do various things and that means instead of manually using his CT to cut someone(which would limit him by output) he could Instead have a program that scales automatically to how much ever ce is needed in order to oneshot.
Not Yuta. I never sair Yuta, I Said Yuta post training is below Ryu in CE reinforcement. Yuta would be slashed by a normal Dismantle. There are 2 more people confirmed to not get slashed by diamantle: Ryu and Yorozu. Do you even read my post?? I found it strange that Sukuna used his 1 time reicarnation and space dismantle on kashimo and then just killed him with a regular dismantle. For sure, it is One of the most powerfull atacks in the series, and its aoe is huge. But if he could kill him with Dismantle why didnt he do it has meguna?
The dismantle in question against Ryu didn’t fillet him into 3, but it did leave major slash wounds. Dismantles of the same strength but of the size that hit Kashimo (encompassing his whole body, likely surpassing it in scale) would likely eviscerate Ryu like it did Kashimo. The same is likely true for Yorozu. Additionally Heian Sukuna likely has a higher max output for his dismantle than Meguna.
Where are you getting this info from? I would argue the opposite, NET dismantle is less powerfull, or rather, has a lowest ceiling than a normal Dismantle. And where is it stated that heian Sukuna has a Higher output then meguna?
We know dismantles have a base limit in strength, this limit oils logically likely scale to Sukuna’s own strength or CE, this is supported by the fingers, max dismantle at a 15F Sukuna’s output should be less powerful than max output dismantle from 20F Sukuna, this would mean it likely functions as some sort of scale-up from Sukuna himself, makes sense that his strength with reinforcement would be the scalar for his dismantles. Heian Sukuna has more muscle mass and weight behind him, so his reinforcement would stack on top of that and thereby make him stronger. This means heian Sukuna is stronger than Meguna in reinforcement, therefore, as the max output of dismantles likely scale to his strength, they’d be stronger when he reincarnated. Net dismantle is literally the same as dismantle but bigger, Sukuna is just expending more cursed energy to increase his dismantles size. Sukuna is also chanting and signing off-screen to do this, it’s why he throws Kashimo away, this isn’t confirmed but it’s the only logical thing he could be doing, Meguna couldn’t do this as he doesn’t have the number of limbs for it.
>Yorozu Not confirmed, as she could have died from that Dismantle back then if she had already made a deal with Kenjaku. Why she'd do that before having the motivation of meeting Sukuna again is unclear. Maybe she was bored or wanted more ideas for how to use Construction. > found it strange that Sukuna used his 1 time reicarnation and space dismantle on kashimo and then just killed him with a regular dismantle. I think there are a few reasons for this. He was pretty much forced to use his Reincarnation heal, as his RCT output was low and he was about to be hit with sure-hit lightning. Plus, he needed the extra hands and mouth to fulfill the new conditions for World Slash if he ever wanted to use it again. The use of the World Slash may have been Sukuna confirming that his new activation conditions work with his extra arms and mouth. Basically, it's a test run while also giving Kashimo props for making him transform. Then, the net attack shows us that Sukuna's Heian Era body makes him even more terrifying, even only using Dismantle. I assumed he used hand signs/chants to restore output for the net attack even if it wasn't a World Slash. I can't confirm this, but I feel as though 100% Meguna Dismantle is weaker than 100% Heian Dismantle. By the time he's fighting Yuta+Yuji, though, he's back down, maybe even below Meguna level because of his damaged arms/mouth/heart/soul. Does that make sense?
>Not confirmed, as she could have died from that Dismantle back then if she had already made a deal with Kenjaku. * Yorozu would not have known the name of Sukuna's CT if she died from the encounter shown in the flashback. It didn't even seem like she knew about Sukuna prior to that point since she didn't utter his name even once. Edit: I re-read the raws and it's heavily implied that she had no idea who Sukuna was during the flashback based on her dialogue since she referred to Sukuna as その人(that person). * Kenjaku's statement in Chapter 216 indicates that Yorozu kept pestering Sukuna in a one-sided fashion. * She could not have accepted Kenjaku's offer prior to her meeting with Sukuna since it requires the user to "die" in order for them to become a Cursed Object, and we have no reason to think that Kenjaku was nearby to turn her into a Cursed Object before she died.
This
Pretty sure Maki/Toji can survive a 100% dismantle.
Bro what
Delulu
Arent maki/toji the only one to dodge world dismantle?
Kashimo also dodges it whilst in a far worse position, he was mid air, firing a electromagnetic wave and curled up like a Shrimp. In both cases they were given information of its activation beforehand
Kashimo did get a warning from sukuna no? While we, the readers and the scanlators, missed sukuna's chant for maki, we only heard the paired falling stars part before the attack was executed
Yea he did, though this shouldn't de-valje the dodge, everyone else gets a heads up by virtue of being able to see him make the enmaten hand signs, something that was impossible in Kashimos position.
Sukuna gave him a heads up, no one else has gotten that luxury
Everyone else got this luxury by virtue of being able to see him preform the hand-signs, something that was physically impossible for Kashimo to see given his position.
yuta also died to regular dismantle (buffed up by chants to restore sukunas output to 100%) so it just seems like sukunas dismantle is also really deadly. We also didnt really see gojo get hit by a regular dismantle (MS doesnt count since MS with shibuya output in 258 should have disintegrated yuji when his SD went down)
>yuta also died to regular dismantle Why do you think so? I thought Gege just didnt show the panel where he used the hand sign but it's still a world slash. It makes no sense otherwise because if he could just kill Yuta with chanted dismantle, why did he even stop HWB?
at the end of 251, sukuna has 1 left hand, and 2 right hands (and the lower one is slashed). when we see his hand in the slashing panel, it doesnt have any mark to indicate that it has been cut in half by yuta. therefore, he used his upper right hand to point the trajectory of his slash. so, he could not have done the enmaten hand sign necessary for world cutting slash. considering in 250, a net of dismantles almost killed both yuta and yuji, a chanted and pointed full output dismantle can definitely cut him in half. also in the page there is clearly a net of dismantles on yuji and rika too, so dont know how he does that if he is using wcs.
>therefore, he used his upper right hand to point the trajectory of his slash. so, he could not have done the enmaten hand sign necessary for world cutting slash. That's my point, he may have just used the upper hands to do the sign and then use the same hand to point the direction. >considering in 250, a net of dismantles almost killed both yuta and yuji, a chanted and pointed full output dismantle can definitely cut him in half. No it didn't almost kill them off. They healed it off immediately, Sukuna even noticed that their RCT technique has been improved because of that. >also in the page there is clearly a net of dismantles on yuji and rika too, so dont know how he does that if he is using wcs. That doesnt mean anything. He could use normal dismantle on Yuji and Rika before or right after the world slash. Sukuna can use dismantle without any physical movement after all. The types of slash indicated separated attacks as well. Yuta got one clean cut while the others got shallow net cut. Wouldn't make sense if that's from the same attack. Also, still the same question: why did he even stop HWB if an amped dismantle can kill Yuta anytime? And where did you get the "chanted to restore to 100% output" from? Was that ever shown before? The best thing we saw about chant was only to raise power by 120% and that was with two more ppl
Yuta is Alive, carefull with what you wish for. The cat has years everywhere.
Doesn't matter, he still was about to die from it. Also for anyone reading this, remember: Yuta didn't "give up his future" to get a better chance at killing Sukuna. He already had no future. Even if it's 5 minutes, the body swap is actually enlarging his lifespan.
Yup totally agree. His original body must be in a suspended state, until the 5 min are Over. Something like megumi in shibuya.
Since you moved this post over here, I'd like to respond with my same points (few minor adjustments too) I have a plethora of problems and issues with this, and I'll outline a few of them here: 1. We can't judge the power of the dismantle net since we have no information on the attack nor its function or setup. We've only seen it once, so no proper assessment can be made. I don't believe it's a WCS, but we can't comment on its nature outside of that. 2. I have never (and I've argued this with people before) been presented with a single piece of evidence that supports dismantle always being at max output, or not being able to have its output increased. Unlike cleave, it can't be adjusted to an opponents body and CE, but I do not recall a statement about dismantle's output ever being made (correct me and provide evidence if I'm wrong). 3. Just a minor thing, but Ryu doesn't necessarily have a great quality of CE reinforcement. He has an insane durability due to his high output. What's the difference? Well, it's more like having extra layers of armor, as opposed to just better quality armor. It's evident that Ryu has the highest basic durability in the series due to this. That's why Sukuna used cleave so he could take the high CE output into account and adjust for it. This is not stated to change the output of cleave, but more its nature. I'd say that Ryu couldn't survive something like HP in the same way as Sukuna, even if he should have a higher typical durability, due to Sukuna likely having just better CE reinforcement quality 4. There are various reasons why I don't think Kashimo would have participated in the training. Firstly, it doesn't match his intent. He has always been stronger than others and wanted to fight Sukuna for answers to his struggles. It doesn't make much sense for him to train, as it wasn't about defeating Sukuna but more using him. Secondly, we don't know if he could even perform swap training due to his position as an incarnated sorcerer. We can't be sure how that would function, even if he wanted to do it for some reason. 5. There's no reason to assume that MBA would boost reinforcement or even durability. In fact, I'd argue that it might make sense for MBA to lower durability since it converts his body and flesh into his CE trait. 6. Why wouldn't Sukuna have used cleave on Kashimo in one of their physical clashes? Why did he instead use an attack that looks like it would have consumed far more CE to make? My theory is that it may be related to the threat of Kashimo's lightning and how it bypasses CE reinforcement and also his sure-hit attack. Sukuna probably saw these as troublesome, so he used a powerful ranged attack to finish him, which cleave cannot do. Recognising Kashimo's power, he utilised the strongest dismantle attack he could muster and used a net arrangement to make dodging basically impossible. 7. We can only verify the usage of WCS 3 times in the fight. Against Gojo, Higurama, and Kashimo. In Yuta's DE, it seems unlikely but hard to tell due to the panelling. Against Maki, Sukuna's hands wouldn't have been able to complete it, iirc. 8. When you ask about Sukuna in Megumi's body, it's simple. He was getting his ass kicked by Kashimo due to his weakened state and would have died to Kashimo's sure-hit if he didn't incarnate. That's made pretty obvious in the manga.
Sorry, i was meant to post here 🙃 I Will respond to your points exactly as you did. 1/2- the narrator says Dismantle is the default Slash. And that cleave adjusts to the target. When Sukuna couldnt Kill Ryu with Dismantle, he didnt fired another stronger Dismantle, he went for cleave. I assume dismantle has a ceiling. My head cannon is that the original CT is cleave, and through a binding vow:" i Will have a ceiling for my range cleave output" dismantle was born. This is supported, but not confirmed, through Yuji using cleave and not Dismantle. But I totally understand your point. Still, i believe otherwise. And according to this line of thought a NET dismantle can ONLY BE as powerfull as a normal Dismantle, if not, it is weaker, + aoe, - output.. 3- when i talked about CE reinforcement i was talking about CE reinforcement + natural durability. This was my mistake, i should had phrase it as durability since it is natural durability + CE reinforcement. Maki > durability than Kusakabe but less CE reinforcement (since She got 0 CE). When i talk about CE reinforcement you can imply it is durability as a while. 4- I think you have a valid point about intent. But still, learnig RCT would be good for him since he could probably get more time in MBA. And kashimo looks more to me like a battle hungr guy than a proud guy that Will not train because he wants to test is current strengh. He didnt kill Hakari with his CT... And through SP he could stop the very same atack that killed him. Incarnaited sorcerers could do it, i think, since choso is in a similar position and he could do it, but that is just head cannon. It could go both ways. 5- nothing to add here, just head cannons for us fans. 6- completly agree. 7- I dont know about Yuta. The story implies he did it but the paneling says otherwise. 8- agree again. BUT, kashimo arrives, Sukuna: NET dismantle! What is kashimo gonna do?
> 1/2- the narrator says Dismantle is the default Slash. And that cleave adjusts to the target... Yes but my point is that this doesn't mean that there is a specific limit to dismantle, but more so that it has a solid amount of damage, dependent on it's output, that doesn't account for the individual target, unlike cleave. It's not about output, but the actual function of the attack. Cleave accounts for the body and CE of the target, dismantle doesn't. We know that dismantle can still be amped with hand signs and chants, for instance. This has been done against Yuta (presumably) and Maki, for instance. It makes more sense to use an attack that's a proper counter for Ryu against him then to try and amp a dismantle as much as possible, when it doesn't even make sense to. Again, we can't properly interpret anything from this, imo. > Yuji using cleave and not Dismantle Yuji has freshly awakened Shrine and has a lower proficiency for it. This can be seen in his weaker output and he hasn't even used cleave again since, even when it would've made sense to when he destroyed Sukuna's heart. > I think you have a valid point about intent. But still, learning RCT would be good for him... Again, I don't know how it would work with incarnated sorcerers since we haven't seen any of them do it. I don't view that as an action Kashimo would take since it just doesn't fit much with his character. He didn't get the easy kill on Hakari by waiting for JP's expiry so I don't think he'd take easy shortcuts. > I dont know about Yuta. The story implies he did it but the paneling says otherwise. The paneling doesn't show Sukuna even having the 3 required hands free at the time of the slash, which suggests that it couldn't be WCS. This isn't 100% definitive, but it seems unlikely to be WCS. > agree again. BUT, kashimo arrives, Sukuna: NET dismantle! What is kashimo gonna do? Kashimo was blitzing Sukuna and brutalizing him, I don't think he could get the attack off even if he was capable of it. Also, if it required a hand sign, for instance, he couldn't have done it due to only having one hand at the time. Sukuna was in far too shabby of a state and it wasn't long before Kashimo launched his sure-hit which would have killed Sukuna, if not for the incarnation.
I think you are wrong about Dismantle. But either way, it is my opinion. It could go both ways. I agree with you on the Yuta dismantle scene. As soon as kashimo arrived Sukuna used kamutoke on him. So, we can assume he wanted to kill kashimo right away. Kashimo was not blitzing Sukuna. They were matched at best. Only when kashimo used his CT the blitzing began. I am looking at the panels and Sukuna didnt used any sign to do NET dismantle, but that could be off panel. If i were Sukuna i would NET dismantle as soon as kamutoke didnt work, since that is the smartest thing to do. But I Guess not. I agree that after kashimo started MBA Sukuna had no other option than reicarnation. But that does not align with the strategic mind of Sukuna for me, he should drop kashimo before that. OR, i get the same feeling, for the end of this fight, as for the Sukuna x Gojo fight. Something is missing. And we know we got info of that fight a lot of chapters after its conclusion. I think we will get some more info on kashimo x Sukuna in a few chapters. My head cannon ofc. Omg ONLY now I saw your name... Kashimo ❤️❤️
Welp, I’m not even part of jujutsushi and yet I got this notification and it spoiled the Jjk manga for me.
I am sorry for that, really. I hate when that happens. But this sub reddit is for manga discussions, so dont Blame me.
All it spoils is that Kashimo is a character that is would’ve had to read the thread to learn any more than that.
Sukuna's output was shot and he couldn't keep up with Kashimo in Megumi's body due to him not being able to RCT properly, that's why he full heals his physicals with reincarnation. The physical full heal doesn't resolve his shot output though, that's what his hand signs/chanting are for. It's a safe assumption that every single attack slash against kashimo was, at the bare minimum, amped to make up for his post gojo weakness. So he needed to reincarnated to heal + get back attack power. MBA kashimo is easily the third strongest in the verse.
Sukuna's RCT output was low, not his normal output. That is the thing. Kashimo could arrive, and Sukuna was like:" nop, I will save the incarnation. Take a NET dismantle". And drop kashimo right there. We could argue that he was so damaged that he could not use NET dismantle, but he used space dismantle on Gojo. How could he not use NET dismantle on kashimo? Instead, he went to fight kashimo, let him use MBA and then got no other option than to use reicarnation. Although that aligns with Sukuna's overall playfull nature it does not align with his strategic capabilities. He didnt know higuruma's confiscation process. For all he knew, higuruma could permanently confiscate his CT. Why take it to the extreme and not try to kill kashimo on the spot? He shot dismantle to kill Ryu on the spot, since he was surprised for his innate durability and in the next panel he used cleave to finish the battle quickly. Ofc we could argue that he wanted to fight Yorozu as well, but he could try some Ten Shadows stuff on Ryu first, but he didnt.
No, where did you get this? It was specifically mentioned in the Gojp vs Sukuna portion that their overall outputs were dropping which was getting their attack power lower. If they'd kept going without BF amps, they'd of gotten to Yuta/Hakari levels. Sukuna transformed because he had no choice, he has nothing he could do against MBA Kashimo until he transformed. You watch MBA kashimo smack him up and down the field until he reincarnates for a reason.
Go read the fight again..everytime they talk about outputs they are talking about RCT output.
>We know that dismantle is a default Slash so, we know it doesnt get stronger by applying more CE. It can get weaker, but it cannot get stronger It can reach it's full potential through handsigns, and likely there is a chant that most likely similar to the chant of world slash. As we see from gojo at the start of his fight with sukuna. He increases the output of his purple through handsigns or chants. Sukuna uses an output increasing handsign against both Higurama and kashimo. The handsign for regular dismantle is not enmaten, as there is a slight alteration where the fingers are placed. Now this next part is conjecture, but I assumed that when sukuna does this the output is returned to near enough full potential. >Ryu cannot be killed by an 100% output dismantle. From a 16f sukuna who by his own admission had not yet fully harmonised with Megumi's soul. But seeing as Sukuna in the moment decides to compare yuta and Yuji to Ryu from that time, let's work with the idea that 16f sukuna and sukuna at that point in the fight are similar levels. >kashimo has one of the most powerfull CE reinforcement of the series. Not sure that he was hit with anything that can prove that, nor can we compare to the hits Hakari's other opponents received which consist of Uraume, Charles and a culling game yuji who wasn't trying to defend himself. >Ryu >> kashimo in CE reinforcement. Yes. But we cannot measure if we don't have realistic idea of how far A and B are from each other. >Did Sukuna used an 100% NET dismantle on kashimo or lower Very likely imo it was close to full potential since he used the handsign. Normal dismantle I feel are being undervalued here. Sukuna cut off Higurama's arms with both a world slash and a regular dismantle. Even after Yuji's output lowering soul punches Sukuna is capable of felling a parking complex building right in half. I think it's best to assume when sukuna uses those huge slashes, that he is working with more output than normal. >What was Gege trying to prove in the way he killed kashimo? That sukuna is strategic fighter that takes everything about the opponent into account. Sukuna knows that kashimo's agility in that mode is suped up, so he gets him off of his feet before firing the dismantle so he can't avoid it. >Did Sukuna used a binding vow to use space dismantle in a NET and we will discover in a few chapters? Does MBA does not give the user more CE reinforcement? 99% sure it isn't a space dismantle. And MBA is just a cursed technique. No reason to assume that kashimo has better reinforcement than normal tbh. >I find it hard to believe that Sukuna found kashimo such a threat, that he didnt wait for his RCE output to grow, keep the reicarnation card on his backpocket, try to use the 10 Shadows to play around kashimo and keep megumi body. He also used space dismantle against kashimo, and he ONLY uses it when the oponent is worhty or he has no other option. And then, he jus Kills kashimo with a NET of normal dismantles. I mean sukuna was literally getting overwhelmed and would have gotten hit by kashimo's lightning had he not transformed put off the poor state he was in. I hope Gege does a running commentary of the fight in the next fanbook, so he can clear things up.
You give very good arguments but, if Sukuna is such a good strategist why didnt he killed kashimo with NET dismantle before? And got pushed to use is ONLY incarnation heal. And loose Ten Shadows. Remember Sukuna, at this point, didnt know higuruma domain would confiscate the Curse tool. Having a second CT would be super use full. I agree with you that we need an explanation for this fight. ONLY if the anime could be a better cannon than the manga, like the new seasons of Bleach. But no, jjk anime is big booms lasers Sukuna God boom boom 🙂↕️
I interpret their fight as not Sakuna taking Kashimo super seriously, but rather respecting him enough to go all out. Sakuna has said that love is fighting someone and killing them or dying to them. He didn’t toy with Kashimo because that would have been disrespectful and unloving. That’s perhaps the reason he cant seem to tryhard against Yuji, it would be showing him respect.
This dragon ball scaling where Kashimo is linked with Yuta using Hakari because of a refuted statement that predates Yuta Sendai-colony buffs is insanity.. Yuta defeated Ryu using Uro's technique to redirect Ryu's attack back at him, That's why linking characters to Yuta who gets stronger in battle via copy doesn't work well. Durability is based on CE output, Ryu has the highest CE output out of everyone, Kashimo doesn't compare to Ryu's durability nor CE output. Hakari has been noted as special based on having the best RCT Ryu has been noted as special since he has the highest CE output
Makes sense. Dudes only W was against Panda, and he lost to the punch kick merchant that was Hakari. Anyone who thought Kashimo would perform well or have any lasting impact was fooling themselves. Especially since he was lined up to fight after Gojo.
That's unfair to kashimo. narratively he was being built up to fight sukuna, stronger than Ryu(who was boxing with yuta, another top tier), and then showed up on the battlefield Extremely confident. In any other manga, he would have had an actual fight even if he lost. It was gege narratively dropping the ball to job for a character we already knew was the strongest.
All the "narrative" is fans hyping themselves up. No Kashimo isn't stronger than Ryu, if they met in the Edo period either Ryu would kill Kashimo if he didn't use MBA, and if he did at best there would be two dead bodies on the battlefield. Confidence doesn't really mean much, if Kashimo was really that confident he'd have insisted on fighting Sukuna first instead of waiting for Gojo to wear him down and reveal his cards. Again wasn't really dropping the ball, if Kashimo were set up to fight Sukuna before Gojo sure I'd say it's a different story but given the fact Kashimo already lost to Hakari and he was fighting Sukuna after Gojo anyone who thought Kashimo would perform well was fooling themselves because there was 0 chance Kashimo can be/show anything impressive after Gojo
Kashimo is 100% stronger than Ryu and the narrative shows that with Ryu getting killed off without a second thought.
Lol narrative doesn't show shit. Sukuna immediately went for the kill on Ryu twice, literally everyone in the series aside from Gojo would've died if Sukuna went at them like he went at Ryu, except Kashimo wouldn't have made it past the first Dismantle to chest. Again Ryu beats base Kashimo 10/10, Kashimo only has a chance with MBA
Kashimo slaughters Ryu with MBA
Which brings me back to my original comment, if Ryu & Kashimo fought in the Edo period either Ryu would beat base Kashimo or at best Kashimo uses MBA and there are two bodies left on the battlefield.
Problem is I don’t see Ryu beating base Kashimo. MBA just makes it a stomp.
You not seeing it is irrelevant and just shows your bias. There's alot of characters who beat base Kashimo more often than not and Ryu is one of them
And then the anime makes it space dismantled
I really do not think that Sukuna had enough output to do the net of dismantles before incarnating again. That’s why he was hoping to use kamutoke to kill him instead of dismantling right away. That didn’t work and 10S were all gone, (he really only needed them for killing Gojo) so there was really no need to stay as Meguna especially since Kashimo was about to hit him with a sure hit lighting that would kill him I hope the anime extends the severity of Kashimo’s damage to Meguna, maybe make him lose a limb or two before reincarnating and washing Kashimo.
It's up to interpretation obviously but Sukuna bull-rushing Kashimo and finishing him as fast as possible means the utmost respect to Kashimo strength lol Doesn't state it but Sukuna did not want to tank another sure-hit lightning. The very attack that triggered him fully reincarnate and use that physical heal. Keep in mind Sukuna still had low RCT and couldn't DE so Kashimo is a threat if not taken seriously.
Sukuna absolutely changes the output of dismantle. See him using tiny slashes to grab yutas blade.
Sukuna absolutely changes the output of dismantle. See him using tiny dismantles to grab yutas blade.
A little disclaimer, this post kind of doesn’t respond to the post as a whole, I am just commenting on the Space Slash. I don’t think the Space Dismantle required chants and pointing, rather it only required the pointing part just like how Mahoraga did it. What Sukuna sacrificed was his ability to use this Hax with only one restriction/pre-requisite, but n order to acquire the element of surprise (maybe even boosting its effects to 120%? But that’s just head-cannon). So by restricting his Hax ability to have 3 pre-requisites (chant, pointing, and hand sign), he gained the capacity to use it only once without any pre-requisites. Adding to that, when a person makes a Binding Bow on himself, what he looses is what he essentially restricted. In that sense, I do believe that since Sukuna put 3 pre-requisites on his technique, in order to use once without any pre-requisites (which in this context was 1; namely, the pointing), him using his Space Slash in Yuta’s Domain without those 3 pre-requisites ultimately lead to him loosing his ability to even conjure the Space Slash. What that means is that Sukuna found himself in death door twice and made very harsh decisions to escape death. The first was to put 3 pre-requisites as a BV on his Space Slash to kill Gojo, and the second was to disregard those pre-requisites, and use the Space Slash to escape the Domain, in exchange for loosing forever the ability to use the Space Slash. And I truly believe this last part, not once how he not even once used it, even he did in the DE. And in those two cases, he does not have the capacity to fulfill the 3 pre-requisites. So how could he have used it in the DE, but doesn’t want to use it afterwards? Well because he lost it, because Yuta and Yuji were in the process of fucking up a heavily injured and tired Sukuna.
I know I'm going to get down votes for this but... Ryu can totally tank a 15 finger sukuna dismantle Kashimo died to around a 10 finger sukuna dismantle Also kashimo doesn't have top tier reinforcement. Nowhere is that stated. Reinforcement is directly tied to a sorcerer's cursed energy pool. So in just reinforcement it goes Sukuna, Yuta and then probably like gojo or something. Maybe you meant CE efficency or output but kashimo has neither of these statements either. Also Hakari in JP is not relative to Yutas durability nor ap/dp. Hakari hits like a wet noodle through the dismantle scaling you brought up
Where'd you get 10 fingers from??? By that logic yuta died to like a 5 finger dismantle because yuji was nerfing sukuna in their fight.
It's a statement while sukuna and yuta are fighting. I believe it's sukunas inner monolog where he comments that his CE reserve is around the "cursed brat" who we know as Yuta. Previously it was established that Yuta has half of sukunas reserves (meaning around 10 fingers worth of CE). Additionally yuta got hit by the world slash as he had already shrugged off cleaves and dismantles.
I didnt meant reinforcement i meant durability
There are 4 things that go into durability in jjk (really these things make up all of someone's base stats but whatever): A sorcerer's physician build CE Reinforcement (how much CE someone has) CE Output (how much CE someone can use at one time) CE Manipulation (How efficient someone is at using CE) Sukuna has the best reinforcement followed by Yuta Ryu has the best output (followed maybe by yuta, this is a lot more unclear tho) Gojo has the best manipulation followed by sukuna Kashimo, is not ever mentioned in any of these categories.
CE reinforcement is not refleted by the amount of CE. Where is that statement? CE reinforcement is most likely connected to output, almost 100%. CE reinforcement is a sorcerer applying CE to their body. It does not matter if you have a lot of CE if your output is low. The perfect example is Hakari, in jackpot he has infinite CE, but his reinforcement is rather low. If what you say is true, jackpot Hakari should have one of the highest, if not the hightest, reinforcement of the manga. CE reinforcement is diferente than CE amount. Sukuna does not have the hightest reinforcement. Ryu is one of the highest tho. When kenjaku is talking to kashimo he says that Ryu has the Higher output, EVER (until that point). Ever means that no One until that moment had a Higher CE output, including Sukuna. Even if you dont believe that, (pay attention), Sukuna states that Ryu has a better CE reinforcement than Yuta post training. So Ryu > Yuta in durability. When i say kashimo has one of the best durabilities is because of his battle against panda and Hakari. Panda has a durability negation atack and, most of all, is a brawler type Fighter, kashimo took his atack like it was nothing. To further my point, Yuta has One of the highest durabilities in the show, and he says Hakari punches are hurting like hell (not because of output, because of his special trait). Kashimo took hakari's punches like they were nothing. That is how i figured kashimo's durability must be insanly high. But, i could be wrong ofc.
I believe the reinforcement statement is from the Yuji execution arc. Hakari has infinite CE in the sense that it's constantly refilling. He doesn't actually have access to infinite CE reserves. Additionally there are a plethora of jjk content creators that have broken down all the different CE "things" including reinforcement.
Kashimo was strong but pridefully alone. He got clapped for that. Sukuna understood he was strong, but nowhere near him, just prideful. He didn't use Megumis body because it was mauled, his CT was half baked at that point and didn't have most shadows that would be useful in that situation left, nor would he probably've been able to deal with Kashimo as he was in the moment, there's no reason for him to not reincarnate at that point, he knew what he was in for with the rest of the cast. I don't think Kashimo was weak, he was just dumb & prideful. Wanted the 1v1. He got what he wanted and more.