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Global-Zebra7706

Because Lick it Up has Vincent all over it while Creatures does not


thisolddawg

Vinnie plays all over Creatures wym


BEN_BANNED

This. What a clueless comment. Clown probably thought Ace played on Creatures. šŸ™„


Global-Zebra7706

How many cowrites does Cusano have on creatures verses lick it up Junior?


thisolddawg

3-4 if Iā€™m not mistaken and plays guitar on damn near every track. Idk why we getting downvoted?


FrolickWithTony

Lick it Up wouldnā€™t have happened without Vinnieā€™s contributions. Paul no likey that.


ChikaraNZ

It would have happened, but would have been a very different sounding album. Exactly what it would have sounded like, it's impossible to know.


Doomedused85

Because it is


quickpiee

This is the right answer


twills2121

How?


Doomedused85

Creatures of the night feels more like old Kiss. The songs are better. Yeah the production on Lick It Up is better, but most of those songs arenā€™t good and mark a new era of Kiss, one that Iā€™m not all that fond of.


twills2121

Creatures feels NOTHING like old KISS.


Doomedused85

I donā€™t think you know what youā€™re talking about.


twills2121

Really? 1) vibe is dark/gloomy - NOT old Kiss 2) guitars/solos - NOT old Kiss 3) drum sound - DEFINITELY NOT old Kiss What the hell about Creatures reminds you of old Kiss


Doomedused85

The first Kiss album is definitely dark and gloomy, old kiss and all kiss have solos so Iā€™m not sure what the hell youā€™re even saying. Drum sound? Really? Just accept defeat and move on.


twills2121

Wait, you are telling me that COTN isnā€™t notorious for the drums mix?! Jesus, 35 years? Well if thatā€™s supposed to mean something regarding KISS knowledge, Iā€™ve got you beat by about 10 years.


Doomedused85

Itā€™s irrelevant to the conversation


twills2121

Irrelevant, yet you brought it upā€¦..ā€˜Iā€™ve been a Kisstard for 35 years, so Iā€™m an expert!ā€™


Doomedused85

All those years and you still donā€™t know shit šŸ¤£ pathetic


twills2121

Iā€™m thinking the opposite, pal. You prob think Hot In The Shade is one of their best albums and sounds just like Destroyer, lol.


Master_Jellyfish9922

I think lick it up was the start of a period in kiss that a lot of older fans just didnā€™t enjoy a great deal. Gene became less and less involved while pursuing acting and with just Paul doing most of the creating ā€¦ it became a lot more poppy. I have a friend who actually considers unmasked better then lick it upā€¦. I think heā€™s a nut.


TheCAMERA4

IMO, LIU is near the bottom of their 80s no makeup albums


Vambommeled

Not sure why you're getting downvoted. For sure, Creatures is a solid hard rock album, but I doubt too many people here would've immediately thought "Yup, sounds like Kiss" if it wasn't for the vocals...


Doomedused85

Heā€™s getting downvoted because heā€™s wrong. Look Iā€™ve been listening to that band for 35 years now. That album absolutely sounds like a Kiss album musically, maybe you need to go back and listen to it again. I recently picked it up remastered and it sounded killer. Sometimes people are wrong, and in this instance youā€™re both about as wrong as a ā€œfanā€ can be.


twills2121

I think your fixated on one being a ā€˜makeupā€™ album and one not. Besides that, Iā€™d challenge you tell me whatā€™s so different about the two albums??


Doomedused85

Just because someone else commented that doesnā€™t mean thatā€™s my view. I already explained it. Iā€™m done with the conversation at this point. You listen to what you like.


True-Contact2385

My opinion and that's all that really matters now don't it?!


TheCAMERA4

Paul mentioned that at one point, they were going to name the LIU album, COTN 2


Vambommeled

As much as Dynasty, Unmasked, and The Elder were musical missteps, there's still more "Kiss-like" musical snapshots on those three albums than pretty much the majority of COTN. It doesn't take away that it's a great album, but it's pretty rootless compared to Kiss' albums preceding it. Been listening since 76, so I'm sorry to say your sentiments aren't unanimous...


Smubee

Old KISS is absolutely dark and gloomy lol. 100,000 Years, Black Diamond, Parasite, Goin' Blind, Strange Ways, Watching You, She, God of Thunder, etc. etc.


TheCAMERA4

Dark/Gloomy - Entire HTH album Guitars/Solos - ACE...COTN (Session Musicians and Ghost Players) Drums - Destroyer....(People complained about the Big drum sound on Destroyer, but rave about the Thunderous Drums COTN)


petearc

You beat me to it šŸ¤£


Smubee

Lick it Up is substantially better than Creatures. Aside from the title track, I Love it Loud, and I Still Love You, the entire album is filler.


ArjanGameboyman

I also rate creatures way higher than lick it up


phred_666

Me too brother. Amen!


twills2121

I donā€™t get it - I donā€™t think there is another pair of albums in their catalog that are as similar as those two.


ArjanGameboyman

I'm saying that i think the songs on creatures are better. Not talking about pairs.


ArjanGameboyman

Animalize and LIU sound way more simular in terms of production. Creatures doesn't sound all that 80s glam rock like Animalize and LIU sound. Also in terms of song writing I think Animalize and LIU are pretty much more of the same. Creatures imo is like destroyer part 2 but recorded differently


twills2121

Creatures and LIU shared the same producer (Michael James Jackson) and was mastered by the same guy, George Marino.


ArjanGameboyman

Yet they sound different. Weird


twills2121

Christ, people here acting like Iā€™m comparing The Elder to Crazy Nights.


PantherThing

I agree. Creatures and LIU are like sister albums to me. I think the reason people dont think so are 1. because of the makeup change, and 2. The title track LIU is an outlier


ragman999

Rock & Roll Over & Love Gun


Katet-1922

Creatures was a MUCH better album. I still play it frequently while LIU pretty much collects dust. Even after a recent listen, I still am not drawn to it.


Cominghome74

Creatures is great, with better production. All killer, no filler.


Smubee

Over half the album is filler lol.


Cominghome74

Yeah, that's why it's regarded as one of their best albums amongst KISS fans.


Smubee

It shouldn't be. COTN is drastically overrated.


Cominghome74

https://preview.redd.it/zulys12du4ad1.jpeg?width=2400&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e8e5f40d3c13b75bd1344775fcd5675e5b4fee5c


independently_poor

I absolutely love Lick it Up. Creatures is better. Right next to Ace's solo.


stonethecrowbar

I love Creatures much more and I prefer its production.


Malcolmsyoungerbro

Agree. LIU is a very good album and one of my favourites, but COTN is a great album and one of their very best. Itā€™s also their only album to get a rerelease when itā€™s sales didnā€™t match the quality of the record.


ColonelBourbon

Because it is


Exotic-Sea-2767

I like Lick It Up but there is some filler. I think Creatures is best KISS album post 70ā€™s hands down. I was gonna say post Love Gun but over time I appreciate Dynasty more (but frankly COTD is probably the better record. Iā€™m sure some would consider Killer @ Keep Me Cominā€™ to be filler and I know some hate ISLY (and I did not care for it live) but I love EVERY song on Creatures.


ChikaraNZ

COTN also has some filler. Keep Me Comin, Danger, and Killer, I consider the 3 weakest songs on thecalbum and filler. 3 filler out of 9 songs, 33% filler. LIU, I also consider has 3 fillers, Young And Waster, Fits Like A Glove, and Gimme More. 3 fillers out of 10 tracks. Music is subjective though,so just my personal opinion.


mjsarlington

I love those 3 LIU songs but yeah, itā€™s all subjective.


thehumanbaconater

You'd have to ask Paul why he says that, but here's my 2 cents. Creatures had a better feel than LIU. Creatures as a whole have this dark, threatening mood about them. There was also more consistency in the album because of it. It flows. Of course, the drum sound is fantastic, but so is the sound of the guitars and bass. More importantly, Creatures was made while Ace was still their guitar player. Even though he's not on the record beyond that iconic cover, the guitar solos were made to semi-sound like Ace. I mean, they don't. But it was closer to Ace than to VV even when VV was playing the songs. I'm not sure I'm expressing it the best way, but VV had a way of playing that was more evident on LIU. His note choice when he plays fast, an alternative picking style if plucking extra notes not with the pick but his finger on the pick hand. It's used in jazz/fusion/ and even bluegrass country. He was always trying to be fast, but VV was more impressive when he was in a Jeff Beck zone. He didn't do any of that on COTN. We don't get the Ace trills with the bend either so it's not Ace or particularly Aceish. (Certainly not as Aceish as Tommy played on Psycho Circus and even Sonic Boom.) Also, I think that Paul's view of an album are skewed based on how it felt recording it, and I imagine dealing with VV was a pain. There's not a lot of daylight between the 2 and I know a few people who think LIU is better. I think the Paul songs are stronger on LIU than on COTN as a whole. Opposite for Gene, but neither was putting in bad songs.


cabell88

Singles have no bearing to rock fans. Its just better.


Prof_Tickles

Because creatures feels like a makeup album (which it is) whereas lick it up feels like the band isnā€™t being themselves anymore. Makeup, characters, theatrics, and larger than life personas was their identity. The non-makeup years were them doing whatever they needed to survive just a few more years.


twills2121

I believe I read somewhere that LIU was intended to be a 'makeup' album and they basically decided at the photo shoot to do it without it. So, if that's true, your assessment above is wrong. I don't see how lyrically that there's much difference between the two albums. Very dark vibes, apocalyptic tones throughout.


ChikaraNZ

I believe you're correct. If I remember it, this is how Paul explained it in his book. They were thinking about removing the make up while the album was being recorded but only decided fairly late in the process. So COTN was always a 100% make up album, but during LIU they did have that uncertainty.


Short_Elevator_7024

Creatures and LIU are my two top albums by them. Creatures slightly ahead.


Dense-Bodybuilder816

It is because of more hard rock sound, creatures of night proves it I would rather have creatures than lick it up any day


twills2121

I'd argue there's some pretty hard songs on LICK IT UP. Much harder than anything done after it up until Revenge.


bifferoniwithcheese

Cause it is!


Randall_Hickey

I like both albums šŸ¤·ā€ā™‚ļø. I think Creatures is a little better as well but both are great. The two best post Ace albums.


ILikeOasis

i love it loud


ChikaraNZ

Paul probably says that because it was finally a return to a heavier sound, after their diversions todfisco/pop/concept albums. Personally I think COTN and LIU, as far as songwriting quality goes, are about on a,par. As oysters have said, the drum sound on COTN is amazing, but this is due to the producer and engineer, more than Eric. I don't know why they couldn't have the same drum sound on LIU too.


BigD5981

Personally I've never really cared for Lick It Up. It's my least favorite non makeup album. It's not that I think it's bad or anything as it's really just a case of I've never connected with it . But I also haven't listened to it from start to finish in years so I probably need to do that and see how I feel now.


twills2121

Interesting, I think itā€™s their bestā€¦.Revenge, 2nd. HITS - worst


TheDramaScene

Doesnā€™t Paul have a real love for ā€œI Still Love Youā€?


ciricedmansonite

Because... oOOOOOOOH WE'RE CREATURES OF THE NIGHT aAAAAAAAh(?)


Converge241

Lick is amazing but I like Creatures better


Born-Throat-7863

Because it *is* better. Powerful sound, cannon drums (which vanished off of LiU) better songs IMO and an FU attitude that just drips from the songs. *Creatures* is the path that Kiss should have stayed on. Instead, while there is a great song on LiU, its sound is weaker in comparison and *Creatures* just has more better songs overall.


twills2121

They did stay on the 'path' with LIU -- used the same producer, etc. The path changed with Animalize.


Born-Throat-7863

They used the same producer but did not achieve the sound they did on *CotN* for some reason yet to be explained. So, no, not the same same result. *LiU* doesnā€™t have the boom that *Creatures* does and lacks the sane kind of ferocity that its predecessor had. This is not saying *Lick It Up* is a bad album. Itā€™s a good album. But IMO, *Creatures* is superior.


Lassie93

I never Got the hype for LIU. I Think the album is pretty forgettable.


twills2121

it's interesting, with the overwhelming love here for COTN over LIU, the actual sales of the two albums don't pale in comparison: LIU = 1,097,240 COTN = 507,890


Lemonwalker-420

War Machine is better than everything on Lick It Up.


Space_Rabies

They are both equally badass and the 2 best 80s albums. They should have stuck with that producer, who produced both records.


twills2121

They started to for Animalize, worked on it in the early stages, but couldn't complete due to other obligations.


Interesting_Bench922

u/twills2121 um Creatures had more than two singlesā€¦ - I Love It Loud - War Machine - I Still Love You - Creatures Of The Night - Keep Me Comin' - Rock And Roll Hell


twills2121

lol, what's your definition of a single? They had ONE video from that album, I love it Loud. Then, if you want to believe Wikipedia, they had 3 singles: https://preview.redd.it/8kp8ajdnw6ad1.png?width=306&format=png&auto=webp&s=898f54dbac72e7de4baa50ff848e7e1f475e02e9


nekoandCJ

I have "the creatures of the night" album


True-Contact2385

It's true that's why lol


twills2121

ā€˜Not in the same leagueā€™ is fucking ridiculous


True-Contact2385

Um don't really care what you think!


twills2121

Awesome, good talk bud.


True-Contact2385

Let me clarify to those that want to flap their yap .. Creatures is better than lick it up imo.. however the old Kiss that I grew up on yes is far way better n heavier!!!! I know my Kiss so let's not play tht game;) thank you ;)


twills2121

thanks for clarifying that, helps a lot


True-Contact2385

Anytime;)


OtherwiseMemory7372

because cotn was the album before they unmasked(lick it up), and imo they should have never unmasked but itā€™s also because cotn is just better


twills2121

might be 'better' to most, but the idea that it's 'not in the same league' is preposterous.


OtherwiseMemory7372

i guess but i feel like they would have so much more value if they never unmasked until the final years


twills2121

Sorry what does that have to do with the topic?


OtherwiseMemory7372

i was referring back to my original comment ā€œimo they should have never unmaskedā€


TheCAMERA4

Because COTN IS Better...


TheCAMERA4

It's all Subjective.... However, if you want to break it down accordingly, KISS released Three consecutive disappointing albums, Dynasty, Unmasked and The Elder. Fans were turned off and started to move on from them. With the release of COTN, KISS returned to their Basic Roots of Straight ahead R-n-R. LIU may have sold more copies, but it was COTN that brought people back to the fold... Again, it's all Subjective!


twills2121

that was never my point -- my point was that LIU was very similar to COTN. Therefore, why would Paul imply they weren't comparable? It's lame and not true.