##Welcome to r/LateStageCapitalism
This subreddit is for news, discussion, memes, and links criticizing capitalism and advancing viewpoints that challenge liberal capitalist ideology. That means any support for any liberal capitalist political party (like the Democrats) is strictly prohibited.
LSC is run by communists. This subreddit is not the place to debate socialism. We allow good-faith questions and education but are not a 101 sub; please take 101-style questions elsewhere.
We have a zero-tolerance policy for bigotry. Failure to respect the rules of the subreddit may result in a ban.
***
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/LateStageCapitalism) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Reformation will never work. We can't use bourgeoisie tools to liberate the working class. If we could, it would have happened somewhere, but it hasn't.
Reformation will always be used to give us table scraps. Even if reformation worked, America doesn't have socialist parties running in local elections. I can't find candidates running.
Mccarthyism is still alive to a lot of people. My socialist grandparents are still afraid to talk about their beliefs. People were killed for being leftists. Mccarthyism/ hooverism still exists in the US.
The end of class will only happen by the working class freeing ourselves. If a bourgeoisie liberates us, it'll be through outsourcing human suffering. Welfare states rely on the subjugation of the third world. It's not a real solution. We need to liberate everyone or no one.
This is the way. I'm planning on turning up writing in Optimus Prime for national candidates, researching and emailing my local candidates (might also write in Optimus Prime), and voting to legalize mushrooms.
If you're in a state with ballot measures, please vote for those. They have real effects on your lives and do cool things that cowardly legislators are too chicken shit to do like legalize drugs and make abortion legal
How's it "bad faith"? It's literally what liberals are doing. "Vote for our genocidal fascist or the other one will kill you, and I'll cheer him on as he's doing it".
I mean i think this implies too much specific autonomy/power from the liberals in the scenario thats all.
It implies they’re the reason the right keeps choosing primary contenders that are actively malicious, while also not saying biden is *much* better on human rights, it still is def better at least for my trans ass to not have idk… any more supreme court fuckers appointed by a christofascist.
The reality is, 30% of our country are illiterate christian fundamentalists who will actively choose the worse possible thing.
And liberals are the only current bulwark against it, which sucks bc they do a half assed job on human rights.
Like yeah, i fuckin hate what is happening in palestine. But elections everywhere (even in places with more parties) statistically always boil down to two main competitors, and the other dude 100% *will make the gazan genocide worse and has said so*
I hate the lesser of two evils thing, esp when both are def evil, but i honestly don’t see a way of escaping it without:
Ranked choice (which will take until younger gens vote in more overwhelming #s)
Change within or replacement of one existing party
Or just better education in our country overall.
Also, just fyi, not to be rude, im not gonna sit here and debate you about this either. Ive had so many bad experiences on reddit where ive tried to be good faith in convo, and just get some asshole shitting down my neck for a bunch of arguments i never even meant or said.
I only bring it up bc they always start out the same as this convo has.
> It implies they’re the reason the right keeps choosing primary contenders that are insane
[Its called the pied piper strategy and its how Trump got elected](https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2016/11/hillary-clinton-2016-donald-trump-214428/)
Also, I'm not going to delete the comment I'm replying to because it's in good faith and they're not looking to do an eternal argument about it.
I'm voting 3rd party unless the minimum wage is raised to $15/hr effective 1/1/2025.
No I don't care how petty that sounds.
Biden promised it but as soon as he got 1 iota of pushback abandoned it. Dems will say "but pot is legal what more do you want"
To which I say "f-ck pot I dont smoke it"
and even then, weed's barely even legal tbh. texas of all states keeps it criminalized when they could definitely make big tax money off of it if they really wanted to. but control is the most important thing for the GQP, especially in the bible belt
I mean i think this is where civic literacy comes in (not as a dig against you sorry if it sounds like that)
Something like that has literally never been within the power of the president. So i generally bank “promises” like that more in the camp of “i support this thing but am using it as a promise bc i know congress will never pass it”
Power of the purse is congress thru and thru. And we can agree or disagree about how stupid or not that is for sure, but its just never been a thing i’d actually believe in the first place lol.
Oh but "joe manchin" oh really ?
Then purge him from the party.
"UHH, this is not the ussr"
Correct so why should a dinosaur from the coal mines if West Virginia decide the economic fates of ppl he doesnt represent?
If he wants to he can make it happen.
He send money to ukraine and israel, the whole country is now Sanctuary paradise but wages are too hard?
Yeah ok, I don't care what the excuse is because you are supposed to be the most powerful person in the world. I'm not hearing it about congress this, congress that, if they really want to they would do it.
Dude im not gonna argue basic civics.
You’re making a classic “ought to be” vs “is” and i can’t help u if you don’t understand why thats not logical.
I agree these things *need changed* but you cant change them without participating. And when you participate theres just ways it happens. Like brah its not joe biden’s fault the constitution was written that way lol.
You’re basically arguing the equivalent of a lawyer trying to do brain surgery. Its just not in the job description and never was.
So every presidential promise about anything related to money should be considered not viably within his scope of ability, but rather something the presidential candidate would support *if congress passes it to their desk*
Agree here, we definitely don't want to set the precedent that the president gets to pick the minimum wage. Otherwise what's to stop trump from just like, abolishing the minimum wage?
Before anyone says anything, I'm going to vote, and I think everyone should vote. Especially on local elections. Local elections are arguably more important most of the time. The "voting is the most important thing you can do!" people annoy me and I think voting is just one important thing in a list of good things you can do, and getting out and helping your community where you can is #1.
*that said* I think these memes aren't discouraging voters but rather "uniting" them in frustration over the upcoming election. Now obviously, what do I know. But for me it is a little comforting knowing that a lot of people see how uninspiring and honestly disgusting it is that the democrats campaign strategy is to hope the threat of a conservative administration who romanticizes fascism is enough to win the election. Hopefully, we see more effort in the coming months, but it honestly feels more like 2016 than 2020.
Dems successfully letting conservative extremism thrive to win elections is almost just as scary as the extremism itself.
This post is just you jerking off. Both political parties failed to represent us in any meaningful way. Nobody who wants what we want will be allowed anywhere near the top.
If you want to affect real change you need to get your hands dirty. If you want to affect real change we need to tear down this two-party system with whatever force is necessary and start fresh atop the smoldering bones of our failed democracy.
Like capitalism, our failed democracy is only a few hundred years old. And like capitalism it has proven itself a failure time and time and time again. Yet people like this will have you believe that it is eternal and that nothing can change it. They'll have you believe that change is impossible. But the truth is that change is only impossible so long as brave men and women wring their hands while weak men shout for everyone to follow them.
Rise up and you can change the world. Rise up and you can build a future for your children.
Rise up.
Its implying the dems use the reps as a weapon against voters to get what they want. It doesn’t talk about what reps or the wealthy do. Its not wholistic.
Dems are controlled opposition. They provide just enough pushback and act as the "brakes" so things dont slide too far too fast. They never move the needle meaningfully in the other direction.
This is by design.
Used to be the opposite. Dems were regarded as those pushing for more radical change and Republicans were seen as the slow and steady party.
It’s wild to see those roles reversed and Democrats playing the steady, reliable party.
they dont directly control the GOP, but they have had opportunities to protect the our rights that the GOP wants to take away, to at least make it harder for them to take those rights away, but choose not to. because if the GOP is defanged, dems dont have any platform to run off. literally the entire dem platform is "well if you dont vote for me, republicans will take your rights away", they never actually to anything to materially improve the lives of the american people.
but on a higher level, yes, GOP and democrats are two sides of the same coin for the wealthy.
Trump backed Republican, Bernie’s Merino just won the primary in Ohio… he had backing in the form of campaigning and adds from Democrats to get it. Why? Because Merino is a crazy who the Democrats are much more confident in defeating than the other Republican candidates for the primary.
So in that sense The Democrats are helping the MAGAs take over the Republican party because they know MAGA are destroying it.
One could argue Dems are holding a gun to voters heads. Vote Democrat or get a full shot of MAGAdom.
It feels like this kind of thing is a targeted disinfo campaign, to get as many people as possible to throw away their vote on third parties without first reforming the voting system so that third party votes can actually win.
So much (well deserved) ire on the lesser-of-two-evils voting system, but never any focus on fixing it. It feels intentional in a lot of the spaces I see it in.
Do you have any idea how cheap it is to run a campaign like this on Reddit? It’s basically like making Paranormal Activity for like $50k and then taking it to cinemas and making $100m.
Go ahead and vote, just don't stop there. No one on the ticket is motivated by making your life better, so organize locally and agitate for things that do make your life better. Progress in America has almost never come from politicians, progress happens when people force politicians to yield to their wishes, then history rewrites it to make us think voting is how you get these things.
I really like this answer. I don't like reading that others don't plan on voting at all, or that voting isn't important, or that they are going to throw their vote away with 3rd party on down-ballot races. I think it's important to keep right-wing fascists out of office but then also yes protest, pester, make them do the things we want.
You're not "keeping right-wing fascists out of office", you're just postponing their eventual election, normalizing their stance and making it harder to kick them out of office, while calling it "the lesser evil".
But hey, not my country (thankfully), so you do you... A right-wing fascist (openly or covertly) will be US president either way, that's the way corporations like it.
The problem on this sub is it's all talk and anger, but no strategy. Dems are the weaker enemy. I'd rather be able to choose my enemies. While the Dems may be enablers and in corporate pockets, they also tend to sit on their hands and do nothing. Meanwhile the GOP is actively stripping rights one by one, and is openly hoping/calling for civil war. I think they would be more likely to brutalize large groups of strikers than Dems. Why would you allow a more powerful and organized group with a specific fascist agenda to be in power when you can choose a spineless bunch of status quo Democrats?
Also I don't see anyone doing a general strike or anything direct en masse and that isn't my fault. I have no job to strike from; I'm disabled. So if people want to do something about it, they should. Or they can continue to sit at home and be the same as the rest of the middle class who is content to live like this.
>You're not "keeping right-wing fascists out of office", you're just postponing their eventual election, normalizing their stance and making it harder to kick them out of office, while calling it "the lesser evil".
Postponing means buying more time to organize and get people on board. That's not a bad thing. Keeping them out is not going to make it harder to kick them out if they aren't allowed to get there in the first place.
Both parties normalize the conditions for fascism to take power, so no, you're not choosing enemies more than you're choosing executioners.
And again, I don't envy you, but if I was American, I'd go third party and confront the openly fascist threat in-office. You don't have a democracy anyway, and choosing enemies doesn't make one.
The problem with going 3rd party is that it does not work in our current system. I voted 3rd party until Trump got into office. That's why It's dumb idea in the USA. Even back when Ralph Nader was still getting relatively decent amounts of votes and it still was nothing.
Ok, I grant you may be aware of something I'm not, and I hope that indeed your right, so as I said, you do you.
Just keep in mind, always, the lesser the evil we choose to confront in the short term the greater the evil we allow to grow in the long run.
And I honestly hope someday you get to vote for something you really believe in, because without that, no charade will ever be a democracy.
That's all I'll say about this. Thanks for your time.
Have a good day.
Postponing the election of fascists is still better than electing one tho? What more would legitimize the far-right and make it harder to kick criminals out of office, than literally putting a criminal in office? I don't see what's wrong with saying "vote, but don't stop there." I like that answer too.
This... it's not like they won't blame you anyway. Even if biden wins, people will still say "we almost lost because of these leftists, they are a menace and shouldn't be trusted"
Look at how many rights have been taken away since he's been in office. Democrats aren't doing shit. They're happily standing by while the facists strip us of our rights. A vote for Biden is just kicking the can a tiny bit further down the road. Sure, your rights will be stripped slower, but stripped they will be.
You can vote for a third party candidate who actually represents your values. I’m voting for Claudia de la Cruz from the Party for Socialism and Liberation.
And accomplish what? For president it will be a Republican or a Democrat in the WH come January. It will not be some fantasy 3rd party candidate. That isn't possible without fundamental change that isn't happening any time soon.
Jokes aside, implying that we must support evil to protect ourselves from a greater evil is an authoritarian mindset.
If liberals gave a shit about democracy they would demand that Biden hold a primary so he could win our votes fair and square. If Biden won the primary I would vote for him because at least then we were given a chance to vote for Socialists in the primary. But Dems won't hold a primary because they don't actually respect democracy.
I'm so confused by this mindset. How was it not a fair primary? No one real chose to run against him. Are you going to force other dems to run against the incumbent at gun point?
Biden won his primaries. Dem voters chose him by a landslide. Or are those primary voters not real voters or something?
They should’ve locked up that stupid orange ghoul years ago. The fact that traitor is even allowed to run again is absurd.
At this point no matter who wins we have a fucking problem. If Orange dipshit wins we’ll have a bunch of racists inbred rednecks thinking they matter again, and if he loses they’ll all be butt hurt and probably storm the capitol again.
Anyone with a Trump flag is a traitor and a liability to this country. Burn their flags, send the message to them that they aren’t safe anymore.
I'm not American. But it seems to me this is the third instance of the major parties offering unelectable candidates.
So why is there no discussion on the third party candidates and how they might be not only better than the democrat/republican options, but also send those parties a big "fuck you" and allow for the president to not need to care about the bullshit on both sides?
Because of the First Past the Post system, voting for a third party will simply pull votes from one of the major parties so that the other one wins.
There are fake online campaigns supporting third parties because of this.
This logic kills me. If everyone who didn't vote all voted for the same third party, the major ones wouldn't have a chance. The disenfranchised could be the dominant force.
No dude there are very real structural problems that could be addressed to solve this. If you had say a ranked choice voting system instead of first past the post we could rank any number of candidates from most to least favorite and if our most favorite ends up with the least amount of votes in say the first round than they are no longer considered and your vote is delegated to your second choice. This goes through multiple rounds (although you need only show up to vote once) until one candidate remains.
I love artificially, bourgeoisie manufactured social divisions meant to divide the people’s common interests and keep the ruling class in a constant state of dominance.
I am going to vote for Socialists every chance I get. Biden isn't the only alternative to Trump so I could easily call Biden supporters stupid for not voting for Claudia, but what is truly stupid and insane is that we tolerate our broken 2 party system that forces us to pick between fascism and corrupt, genocide supporting plutocrats.
Good I am glad. There are a lot of people who won’t vote at all because they don’t want to vote Biden.
Which is actually really stupid. There are lots of progressives candidates on ballots.
Have any of you tried campaigning for, idk, some form of referendum process?
Do that and we can get ourselves some rank tiered voting and separate money from politics
We don’t have the numbers for any sort of revolution, so need to find a way to make third parties viable (they currently aren’t because liberals exist)
Unfortunately, the Constitution was written specifically with two-party governance in mind. Yes, it was two different parties at the time, but most of what was built depends on one party having a majority over another, not coalition-style government.
In order to address this issue, we need to amend our constitution to allow for ranked-choice (or another voting methodology more favorable to the formation of minor parties) or rely on both the Democrats and Republicans to pass laws that reduce their power. Even with the people wanting other options, an amendment would also need the cooperation of the two major parties. Those in power almost never want to give it up.
It becomes harder and harder to imagine any substantive change from either party, as they're both right of center with few differences at their core. When Rome falls this time, I fear what will happen to civilization.
Is the point of this post we should always kill the hostages because that's the approach of Israeli defense forces (that we very, very, significantly critize).
So true, we have had some really great candidates in local elections. LA's Controller has cause a lot of headaches for TPTB and it is a blast to watch. If you think all elections don't matter, look at the people the wealthy pour money into fighting.
There are more than two political parties, and there are ballot initiatives that are great, because you don’t have to vote for a person who is voting for specific political agendas. But you should vote in every election regardless.
Im not a liberal, idealistically I would be for the abolishment of nation states and organising society in smaller semi-autonomous communes.
But I am also a realist, seeing very obvious threats to groups that I am not a part of (as a cishet white male). So realistically you won’t get enough people to support a third party candidate to win the election.
So now you have the choice to vote for democrats, which are utter shit and capitalists through and through, and are barely improving anything BUT they are not actively stripping rights from minorities. Or take the risk that republicans win who will actively be working to make anyone that isn’t a cishet white man a second class citizen.
It disgusts me that some people call for people not to vote without being aware of your privilege and not thinking of the disastrous effects this will have on other people.
We are anti capitalist ruled "democracy". The capitalist class in the USA make all the actual decisions. This is not democracy, it is rule by a small, rich elite.
I'll preface this by saying that I'm not American nor a bot paid by America's enemies, but can I ask you where is the lie in the OP?
The Democratic Party has been using republican awfulness as a threat against their voters when they force unpopular candidates down their throat. Even Biden said as much past election: "What are you going to do? Vote for Trump?" or something to that effect.
They benefit for the fascist party being fascist, so they themselves can be fascist-light knowing that voters will have a hard time withdrawing support, since the alternative is still worse.
They are holding their voters hostage and they know it!
do you failures just sit around crying about how youre not gonna vote when you werent gonna leave your neckbeard nest to do so anyways? jesus christ you guys are just insufferable whiners every election term
If you don't support "99% Hitler" (who is actively facilitating genocide right now), then you are by default supporting "100% Hitler".
If you question why your only two options are "99% Hitler" and "100% Hitler" then that means you are supporting "100% Hitler"
If you fully support "99% Hitler" and promise never to oppose anything he does and ask him nicely then maybe he might facilitate genocide just a little bit less.
Thought the same thing. He thought he was being \*real\* slick with that one, didn't he?
Foreign Policy Issues = Unconditional support of mass murder of civilians on a genocidal scale to support a racist, xenofobic colonial state. Widespread destruction of civilian infrastructure needed to sustain human life.
>For now we as Americans have a duty to vote for the people who will protect reproductive healthcare for American women.
And who are these people, exactly?
If the Dems *actually* wanted to protect women's reproductive healthcare they would've codified abortion rights either one of the two times they've had a super-majority in the past decade and change.
But they didn't, *precisely* so they can continue holding the threat over our heads.
>For now we as Americans have a duty to vote for the people who will protect reproductive healthcare for American women.
Ok, who are those people? It's certainly not either of the two major parties
What has genocide Joe ever done for anyone, student loan forgiveness, trans rights, reproductive rights, kids in concentration camps at the boarder.
Look at his policies and tell me how they look different than Trump.
It's sad to say but I wish trump was in office for the last six months, then people like you would agree with me when I say "genocide is bad".
REPUBLICANS HOLD A REPUBLICAN GUN TO VOTERS HEADS EVERY TIME. Feels accurate, but I am tired of these memes constructed to discourage non-republican voters from voting.
I'm not sure if anyone can answer me this, but how are the libs finding specific threads to brigade? Most of the most upvoted posts in this thread are from users who have never posted in this sub. Is there a discord group or something?
Welcome to wizarding wild world of astroturfing! It's kinda on the mods partially by allowing an upvoted lesser of two evils and russia china bot comment fly at the top of the thread. This wesbite will only be more annoying as time goes by but especially because it's an election year and both parties have been on record for using money to influence votes.
You dont need the process to be demonized for people to not vote. Just speaking for my own environment here in California, all the young blue teamers have been staunch anti-Trumpers for most their post-adolescent lives, and theyve also become super anti-zionist and consider a vote for Biden to be a vote for Genocide. This meme is quite literally how a lot of them feel.
I honestly dont know what a lot of people are gonna do lol. I dont think ive seen such disillusion in my age & party group my entire voting life.
Voting for the Democrats is voting for genocide, and at the same time you're allowing them to go even further right by showing them what they can get away with. It's obvious that marginalized people only matter if they're politically beneficial to you.
Also, why are you on a communist sub trying to get people to vote for a right-wing (actually, a self-declared fascist) candidate? A candidate who's openly supporting an apartheid regime and is facilitating and supporting a genocide?
This is a stupid cop out. Anyone who has the capital to run astroturf *absolutely* has a pocketed politician they paid good money for that they would prefer you vote for. Even fucking Russia. The meme might be shit, but it's not fair to down play the legitimate frustration behind it.
That is precisely how I've felt about this Controlled Opposition bullshit since the bribed to treason Turdwookies running the DNC first DEMANDED I vote for Shillary Corporatist Clinton. (Fuck you sideways with a Saguaro cactus Debbie Wasserman Schulz!)
We don’t need a vote over these two clowns. We need an honest to god workers revolution. Out with the conservative Christo-fascists and imperialists republicans. Out with the bourgeois neo-liberals and their genocide. I’m tired of having to pick between two awful choices of parties and their shitty candidates.
This is a stupid naive meme. I agree with the sentiment but at the end of the day if you don’t vote, or don’t vote blue on this election maga wins it all and the shit will hit the fan faster than ever. I still remember those who said the Trump and Hillary were “the same” and didn’t vote back in 2016. I curse them every day still.
I had every intention of voting 3rd party or write in bc I was so angry about it coming down to these two geriatric wealthy status quo corporate puppets again until Trump started saying shit like yeah I'll be a dictator but only as long as I need to to get what I want done and yeah I'm gonna use this position to get back at people who spoke against me and I'll serve more than 2 terms and hell yeah let Russia do whatever etc, the list goes on and on.
Like this fool is a puppet to higher powers and openly telling people that he's going to just be a dictator and do whatever he wants to do and his financers tell him to do but people are ignorant enough to think they'll be able to fight the system and break it down when that type of shit is in power. It's not about lesser of two evils, it's about not electing someone who has such a hard-on for turning this country into a dictatorship that he's already bragging about how he's going to do it before he's in position to do it. I would give anything to have a way to get myself and, or at least, my kid out of this country.
My problem with memes like this and people who say that both parties are the same I feel like don't advocate for any real solutions or meaningful ways to try and make things better. And I also think they're just liars.
It's true the Democrats are by and large representative of their donors, but the idea that they share the same agenda as the Republicans is factually wrong. Secondly, the Democratic voter base IS progressive, or at least liberal. I see nothing wrong with people who want to change things running as Democrat, in fact, I encourage people to do so. The Democratic party doesn't belong to the wealthy, it's our responsibility to take it back from them.
I dislike political nihilism and I feel like a lot of people who write this stuff just want people to think the system is so corrupt and so broken that there's no hope but to not vote, vote third party, or let the opposition party win and let things get so bad that there can be a revolution, which I don't think any of those options would be good. I think there's a lot we can do and people who post stuff like this I feel most of the time are advocating that you give up and act morally superior by abstaining from politics.
Gotta be honest, when I saw the meme, I thought "the masked man could be whatever party that controls the media narrative, so voting seems pointless". I know that it's untrue that voting is pointless, but this is the first election I'd feel truly guilty voting for either candidate. But again, I know that's part of the design.
This sub is for communists you doughnut always has been, why would we ever support a neoliberal, Zionist, or capitalist let alone a geriatric whose all 3.
No matter who wins I just hope to every deity that ever existed or has yet to exist that Trump loses. I shouldn't have to hope this much, we should just have a party that wins because it actually reflects the will of the American people.
Chomsky and Wolff and Einstein all say that pulling the level for the least bad candidate is our responsibility as adults, while conservatives and children globally try to get people not to vote by spreading shit like this.
Break free from these 2 terrorists to be an Independent this year by voting against them. That's all I can say and that's all you can do with your only power of a single vite.
The over-emphasis on the debate on whether to vote or not takes attention away from all the strategies that aren't voting or abstention from voting. You don't want them to hold you hostage? Start resisting.
I’m American and I want to do the right thing. What should I do right now? Is voting useless now?
Edit: As I type this it’s been 17 minutes, I have yet to get a response and the minutes feel like hours. I’m already in a really bad place right now and this certainly isn’t helping.
Edit 2: It’s been at least an hour and still nothing.
##Welcome to r/LateStageCapitalism This subreddit is for news, discussion, memes, and links criticizing capitalism and advancing viewpoints that challenge liberal capitalist ideology. That means any support for any liberal capitalist political party (like the Democrats) is strictly prohibited. LSC is run by communists. This subreddit is not the place to debate socialism. We allow good-faith questions and education but are not a 101 sub; please take 101-style questions elsewhere. We have a zero-tolerance policy for bigotry. Failure to respect the rules of the subreddit may result in a ban. *** *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/LateStageCapitalism) if you have any questions or concerns.*
[удалено]
Reformation will never work. We can't use bourgeoisie tools to liberate the working class. If we could, it would have happened somewhere, but it hasn't. Reformation will always be used to give us table scraps. Even if reformation worked, America doesn't have socialist parties running in local elections. I can't find candidates running. Mccarthyism is still alive to a lot of people. My socialist grandparents are still afraid to talk about their beliefs. People were killed for being leftists. Mccarthyism/ hooverism still exists in the US. The end of class will only happen by the working class freeing ourselves. If a bourgeoisie liberates us, it'll be through outsourcing human suffering. Welfare states rely on the subjugation of the third world. It's not a real solution. We need to liberate everyone or no one.
This is the way. I'm planning on turning up writing in Optimus Prime for national candidates, researching and emailing my local candidates (might also write in Optimus Prime), and voting to legalize mushrooms. If you're in a state with ballot measures, please vote for those. They have real effects on your lives and do cool things that cowardly legislators are too chicken shit to do like legalize drugs and make abortion legal
Remember when anyone wrote down "Deez Nuts" on last election? That was funny
Deez Nutz was an actual candidate lmao
[удалено]
How's it "bad faith"? It's literally what liberals are doing. "Vote for our genocidal fascist or the other one will kill you, and I'll cheer him on as he's doing it".
I mean i think this implies too much specific autonomy/power from the liberals in the scenario thats all. It implies they’re the reason the right keeps choosing primary contenders that are actively malicious, while also not saying biden is *much* better on human rights, it still is def better at least for my trans ass to not have idk… any more supreme court fuckers appointed by a christofascist. The reality is, 30% of our country are illiterate christian fundamentalists who will actively choose the worse possible thing. And liberals are the only current bulwark against it, which sucks bc they do a half assed job on human rights. Like yeah, i fuckin hate what is happening in palestine. But elections everywhere (even in places with more parties) statistically always boil down to two main competitors, and the other dude 100% *will make the gazan genocide worse and has said so* I hate the lesser of two evils thing, esp when both are def evil, but i honestly don’t see a way of escaping it without: Ranked choice (which will take until younger gens vote in more overwhelming #s) Change within or replacement of one existing party Or just better education in our country overall. Also, just fyi, not to be rude, im not gonna sit here and debate you about this either. Ive had so many bad experiences on reddit where ive tried to be good faith in convo, and just get some asshole shitting down my neck for a bunch of arguments i never even meant or said. I only bring it up bc they always start out the same as this convo has.
> It implies they’re the reason the right keeps choosing primary contenders that are insane [Its called the pied piper strategy and its how Trump got elected](https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2016/11/hillary-clinton-2016-donald-trump-214428/) Also, I'm not going to delete the comment I'm replying to because it's in good faith and they're not looking to do an eternal argument about it.
I'm voting 3rd party unless the minimum wage is raised to $15/hr effective 1/1/2025. No I don't care how petty that sounds. Biden promised it but as soon as he got 1 iota of pushback abandoned it. Dems will say "but pot is legal what more do you want" To which I say "f-ck pot I dont smoke it"
and even then, weed's barely even legal tbh. texas of all states keeps it criminalized when they could definitely make big tax money off of it if they really wanted to. but control is the most important thing for the GQP, especially in the bible belt
I mean i think this is where civic literacy comes in (not as a dig against you sorry if it sounds like that) Something like that has literally never been within the power of the president. So i generally bank “promises” like that more in the camp of “i support this thing but am using it as a promise bc i know congress will never pass it” Power of the purse is congress thru and thru. And we can agree or disagree about how stupid or not that is for sure, but its just never been a thing i’d actually believe in the first place lol.
Oh but "joe manchin" oh really ? Then purge him from the party. "UHH, this is not the ussr" Correct so why should a dinosaur from the coal mines if West Virginia decide the economic fates of ppl he doesnt represent?
I didn’t say anything about Joe Manchin? It sounds like you’re arguing with yourself at this point.
If he wants to he can make it happen. He send money to ukraine and israel, the whole country is now Sanctuary paradise but wages are too hard? Yeah ok, I don't care what the excuse is because you are supposed to be the most powerful person in the world. I'm not hearing it about congress this, congress that, if they really want to they would do it.
Dude im not gonna argue basic civics. You’re making a classic “ought to be” vs “is” and i can’t help u if you don’t understand why thats not logical. I agree these things *need changed* but you cant change them without participating. And when you participate theres just ways it happens. Like brah its not joe biden’s fault the constitution was written that way lol. You’re basically arguing the equivalent of a lawyer trying to do brain surgery. Its just not in the job description and never was. So every presidential promise about anything related to money should be considered not viably within his scope of ability, but rather something the presidential candidate would support *if congress passes it to their desk*
Agree here, we definitely don't want to set the precedent that the president gets to pick the minimum wage. Otherwise what's to stop trump from just like, abolishing the minimum wage?
Before anyone says anything, I'm going to vote, and I think everyone should vote. Especially on local elections. Local elections are arguably more important most of the time. The "voting is the most important thing you can do!" people annoy me and I think voting is just one important thing in a list of good things you can do, and getting out and helping your community where you can is #1. *that said* I think these memes aren't discouraging voters but rather "uniting" them in frustration over the upcoming election. Now obviously, what do I know. But for me it is a little comforting knowing that a lot of people see how uninspiring and honestly disgusting it is that the democrats campaign strategy is to hope the threat of a conservative administration who romanticizes fascism is enough to win the election. Hopefully, we see more effort in the coming months, but it honestly feels more like 2016 than 2020. Dems successfully letting conservative extremism thrive to win elections is almost just as scary as the extremism itself.
[удалено]
This post is just you jerking off. Both political parties failed to represent us in any meaningful way. Nobody who wants what we want will be allowed anywhere near the top. If you want to affect real change you need to get your hands dirty. If you want to affect real change we need to tear down this two-party system with whatever force is necessary and start fresh atop the smoldering bones of our failed democracy. Like capitalism, our failed democracy is only a few hundred years old. And like capitalism it has proven itself a failure time and time and time again. Yet people like this will have you believe that it is eternal and that nothing can change it. They'll have you believe that change is impossible. But the truth is that change is only impossible so long as brave men and women wring their hands while weak men shout for everyone to follow them. Rise up and you can change the world. Rise up and you can build a future for your children. Rise up.
I have a problem with this meme. It implies that the Dems control the GOP. The truth is that the wealthy control both parties equally.
Its implying the dems use the reps as a weapon against voters to get what they want. It doesn’t talk about what reps or the wealthy do. Its not wholistic.
Dems are controlled opposition. They provide just enough pushback and act as the "brakes" so things dont slide too far too fast. They never move the needle meaningfully in the other direction. This is by design.
Used to be the opposite. Dems were regarded as those pushing for more radical change and Republicans were seen as the slow and steady party. It’s wild to see those roles reversed and Democrats playing the steady, reliable party.
they dont directly control the GOP, but they have had opportunities to protect the our rights that the GOP wants to take away, to at least make it harder for them to take those rights away, but choose not to. because if the GOP is defanged, dems dont have any platform to run off. literally the entire dem platform is "well if you dont vote for me, republicans will take your rights away", they never actually to anything to materially improve the lives of the american people. but on a higher level, yes, GOP and democrats are two sides of the same coin for the wealthy.
Also, if someone is actually holding a gun to my head, I'm going to do what they tell me, and I don't think that's the intended message here.
Google the "Pied Piper Strategy"
Trump backed Republican, Bernie’s Merino just won the primary in Ohio… he had backing in the form of campaigning and adds from Democrats to get it. Why? Because Merino is a crazy who the Democrats are much more confident in defeating than the other Republican candidates for the primary. So in that sense The Democrats are helping the MAGAs take over the Republican party because they know MAGA are destroying it. One could argue Dems are holding a gun to voters heads. Vote Democrat or get a full shot of MAGAdom.
It feels like this kind of thing is a targeted disinfo campaign, to get as many people as possible to throw away their vote on third parties without first reforming the voting system so that third party votes can actually win. So much (well deserved) ire on the lesser-of-two-evils voting system, but never any focus on fixing it. It feels intentional in a lot of the spaces I see it in.
Do you have any idea how cheap it is to run a campaign like this on Reddit? It’s basically like making Paranormal Activity for like $50k and then taking it to cinemas and making $100m.
What do you do then? Not vote?
Go ahead and vote, just don't stop there. No one on the ticket is motivated by making your life better, so organize locally and agitate for things that do make your life better. Progress in America has almost never come from politicians, progress happens when people force politicians to yield to their wishes, then history rewrites it to make us think voting is how you get these things.
I really like this answer. I don't like reading that others don't plan on voting at all, or that voting isn't important, or that they are going to throw their vote away with 3rd party on down-ballot races. I think it's important to keep right-wing fascists out of office but then also yes protest, pester, make them do the things we want.
You're not "keeping right-wing fascists out of office", you're just postponing their eventual election, normalizing their stance and making it harder to kick them out of office, while calling it "the lesser evil". But hey, not my country (thankfully), so you do you... A right-wing fascist (openly or covertly) will be US president either way, that's the way corporations like it.
The problem on this sub is it's all talk and anger, but no strategy. Dems are the weaker enemy. I'd rather be able to choose my enemies. While the Dems may be enablers and in corporate pockets, they also tend to sit on their hands and do nothing. Meanwhile the GOP is actively stripping rights one by one, and is openly hoping/calling for civil war. I think they would be more likely to brutalize large groups of strikers than Dems. Why would you allow a more powerful and organized group with a specific fascist agenda to be in power when you can choose a spineless bunch of status quo Democrats? Also I don't see anyone doing a general strike or anything direct en masse and that isn't my fault. I have no job to strike from; I'm disabled. So if people want to do something about it, they should. Or they can continue to sit at home and be the same as the rest of the middle class who is content to live like this. >You're not "keeping right-wing fascists out of office", you're just postponing their eventual election, normalizing their stance and making it harder to kick them out of office, while calling it "the lesser evil". Postponing means buying more time to organize and get people on board. That's not a bad thing. Keeping them out is not going to make it harder to kick them out if they aren't allowed to get there in the first place.
Both parties normalize the conditions for fascism to take power, so no, you're not choosing enemies more than you're choosing executioners. And again, I don't envy you, but if I was American, I'd go third party and confront the openly fascist threat in-office. You don't have a democracy anyway, and choosing enemies doesn't make one.
The problem with going 3rd party is that it does not work in our current system. I voted 3rd party until Trump got into office. That's why It's dumb idea in the USA. Even back when Ralph Nader was still getting relatively decent amounts of votes and it still was nothing.
Ok, I grant you may be aware of something I'm not, and I hope that indeed your right, so as I said, you do you. Just keep in mind, always, the lesser the evil we choose to confront in the short term the greater the evil we allow to grow in the long run. And I honestly hope someday you get to vote for something you really believe in, because without that, no charade will ever be a democracy. That's all I'll say about this. Thanks for your time. Have a good day.
You’re naive to think that democrats are the weaker enemy. They are just the one who happen to know that fattened pigs will not revolt.
Postponing the election of fascists is still better than electing one tho? What more would legitimize the far-right and make it harder to kick criminals out of office, than literally putting a criminal in office? I don't see what's wrong with saying "vote, but don't stop there." I like that answer too.
That's what the paid trolls want you to do.
Seriously, the amount of both-sides astroturfing on this sub is ridiculous
Claudia de la Cruz is the only presidential candidate with policies I'm interested in. Vote whoever you like. Liberals will berate you anyways.
This... it's not like they won't blame you anyway. Even if biden wins, people will still say "we almost lost because of these leftists, they are a menace and shouldn't be trusted"
Right, but if Biden wins lgbtq people and reproductive rights are a lot safer.
Look at how many rights have been taken away since he's been in office. Democrats aren't doing shit. They're happily standing by while the facists strip us of our rights. A vote for Biden is just kicking the can a tiny bit further down the road. Sure, your rights will be stripped slower, but stripped they will be.
Vs kicking the can info a trashfire? Yeah I'll vote whatever's going to keep me safer a little longer.
You can vote for a third party candidate who actually represents your values. I’m voting for Claudia de la Cruz from the Party for Socialism and Liberation.
[удалено]
[удалено]
And accomplish what? For president it will be a Republican or a Democrat in the WH come January. It will not be some fantasy 3rd party candidate. That isn't possible without fundamental change that isn't happening any time soon.
[удалено]
Jokes aside, implying that we must support evil to protect ourselves from a greater evil is an authoritarian mindset. If liberals gave a shit about democracy they would demand that Biden hold a primary so he could win our votes fair and square. If Biden won the primary I would vote for him because at least then we were given a chance to vote for Socialists in the primary. But Dems won't hold a primary because they don't actually respect democracy.
I'm so confused by this mindset. How was it not a fair primary? No one real chose to run against him. Are you going to force other dems to run against the incumbent at gun point? Biden won his primaries. Dem voters chose him by a landslide. Or are those primary voters not real voters or something?
Find a better argument. Rule 6 - no lesser evil rhetoric.
They should’ve locked up that stupid orange ghoul years ago. The fact that traitor is even allowed to run again is absurd. At this point no matter who wins we have a fucking problem. If Orange dipshit wins we’ll have a bunch of racists inbred rednecks thinking they matter again, and if he loses they’ll all be butt hurt and probably storm the capitol again. Anyone with a Trump flag is a traitor and a liability to this country. Burn their flags, send the message to them that they aren’t safe anymore.
What benefit do the American People get if Biden wins again? The left is truly delusional.
Bro I was born in that chokehold. They got us. We’re had.
I understand the feeling but without generating an ACTUAL candidate or helping to create an ACTUAL platform you aren't helping
[Claudia de La Cruz](https://votesocialist2024.com)
[удалено]
Read the rules
Exactly
[удалено]
Genocide is a red line. Rule 6 - no lesser evil rhetoric.
The misleading part is that the gun in this picture is sentient and will fire regardless as to whether anyone is holding it or not.
I'm not American. But it seems to me this is the third instance of the major parties offering unelectable candidates. So why is there no discussion on the third party candidates and how they might be not only better than the democrat/republican options, but also send those parties a big "fuck you" and allow for the president to not need to care about the bullshit on both sides?
Because of the First Past the Post system, voting for a third party will simply pull votes from one of the major parties so that the other one wins. There are fake online campaigns supporting third parties because of this.
This logic kills me. If everyone who didn't vote all voted for the same third party, the major ones wouldn't have a chance. The disenfranchised could be the dominant force.
No dude there are very real structural problems that could be addressed to solve this. If you had say a ranked choice voting system instead of first past the post we could rank any number of candidates from most to least favorite and if our most favorite ends up with the least amount of votes in say the first round than they are no longer considered and your vote is delegated to your second choice. This goes through multiple rounds (although you need only show up to vote once) until one candidate remains.
Assuming that everyone who doesn’t vote would want to vote for the same third-party candidate is an astronomical assumption, if you ask me.
Sure. But not any more crazy than people that convince themselves they have to vote for one of two people who will harm them
I love artificially, bourgeoisie manufactured social divisions meant to divide the people’s common interests and keep the ruling class in a constant state of dominance.
[удалено]
I am going to vote for Socialists every chance I get. Biden isn't the only alternative to Trump so I could easily call Biden supporters stupid for not voting for Claudia, but what is truly stupid and insane is that we tolerate our broken 2 party system that forces us to pick between fascism and corrupt, genocide supporting plutocrats.
Good I am glad. There are a lot of people who won’t vote at all because they don’t want to vote Biden. Which is actually really stupid. There are lots of progressives candidates on ballots.
[удалено]
[удалено]
[удалено]
Majority of adults don’t vote
I mean this is a pretty fair representation of the Biden team and his supporter's talking points. "But Trump!"
This meme is incorrect. It should be billionaires holding a gun in each hand, 1 says republicans, the other democrats.
Have any of you tried campaigning for, idk, some form of referendum process? Do that and we can get ourselves some rank tiered voting and separate money from politics We don’t have the numbers for any sort of revolution, so need to find a way to make third parties viable (they currently aren’t because liberals exist)
Unfortunately, the Constitution was written specifically with two-party governance in mind. Yes, it was two different parties at the time, but most of what was built depends on one party having a majority over another, not coalition-style government. In order to address this issue, we need to amend our constitution to allow for ranked-choice (or another voting methodology more favorable to the formation of minor parties) or rely on both the Democrats and Republicans to pass laws that reduce their power. Even with the people wanting other options, an amendment would also need the cooperation of the two major parties. Those in power almost never want to give it up. It becomes harder and harder to imagine any substantive change from either party, as they're both right of center with few differences at their core. When Rome falls this time, I fear what will happen to civilization.
Anti-electoralism feels like ldar
Is the point of this post we should always kill the hostages because that's the approach of Israeli defense forces (that we very, very, significantly critize).
More like the voter in the middle and both hands holding guns labeled both parties.
[удалено]
So true, we have had some really great candidates in local elections. LA's Controller has cause a lot of headaches for TPTB and it is a blast to watch. If you think all elections don't matter, look at the people the wealthy pour money into fighting.
It really feels like Republicans and democrats are just playing good cop and bad cop
Republicans outlawed alternative voting systems in my state.
There are more than two political parties, and there are ballot initiatives that are great, because you don’t have to vote for a person who is voting for specific political agendas. But you should vote in every election regardless.
Im not a liberal, idealistically I would be for the abolishment of nation states and organising society in smaller semi-autonomous communes. But I am also a realist, seeing very obvious threats to groups that I am not a part of (as a cishet white male). So realistically you won’t get enough people to support a third party candidate to win the election. So now you have the choice to vote for democrats, which are utter shit and capitalists through and through, and are barely improving anything BUT they are not actively stripping rights from minorities. Or take the risk that republicans win who will actively be working to make anyone that isn’t a cishet white man a second class citizen. It disgusts me that some people call for people not to vote without being aware of your privilege and not thinking of the disastrous effects this will have on other people.
[удалено]
извинения
We do not permit liberalism here.
[удалено]
We are anti capitalist ruled "democracy". The capitalist class in the USA make all the actual decisions. This is not democracy, it is rule by a small, rich elite.
This is a communist sub, not a sub for liberals larping as leftists.
[удалено]
Biden is actively engaging in a genocide. This is much worse than "not perfect". There are lines that cannot be crossed.
[удалено]
Find a better argument. Rule 6 - no lesser evil rhetoric.
I'll preface this by saying that I'm not American nor a bot paid by America's enemies, but can I ask you where is the lie in the OP? The Democratic Party has been using republican awfulness as a threat against their voters when they force unpopular candidates down their throat. Even Biden said as much past election: "What are you going to do? Vote for Trump?" or something to that effect. They benefit for the fascist party being fascist, so they themselves can be fascist-light knowing that voters will have a hard time withdrawing support, since the alternative is still worse. They are holding their voters hostage and they know it!
Find a better argument. Rule 6 - no lesser evil rhetoric.
Find a better argument. Rule 6 - no lesser evil rhetoric.
Based
Allow US to enable Genocide or…..THEY *WILL* enable Genocide!
"Vote for the genocider or we'll genocide even harder"
do you failures just sit around crying about how youre not gonna vote when you werent gonna leave your neckbeard nest to do so anyways? jesus christ you guys are just insufferable whiners every election term
If you don't support "99% Hitler" (who is actively facilitating genocide right now), then you are by default supporting "100% Hitler". If you question why your only two options are "99% Hitler" and "100% Hitler" then that means you are supporting "100% Hitler" If you fully support "99% Hitler" and promise never to oppose anything he does and ask him nicely then maybe he might facilitate genocide just a little bit less.
[удалено]
Reducing the lives of thousands of innocent people on the business end of US-made missles to "foreign policy issues" is disgusting.
Thought the same thing. He thought he was being \*real\* slick with that one, didn't he? Foreign Policy Issues = Unconditional support of mass murder of civilians on a genocidal scale to support a racist, xenofobic colonial state. Widespread destruction of civilian infrastructure needed to sustain human life.
[удалено]
So some lives matter more than others I suppose, as long as the labor aristocracy in America is stable, imperialism abroad is acceptable
Find a better argument. Rule 6 - no lesser evil rhetoric.
Genocide is a red line. Rule 6 - no lesser evil rhetoric.
>For now we as Americans have a duty to vote for the people who will protect reproductive healthcare for American women. And who are these people, exactly? If the Dems *actually* wanted to protect women's reproductive healthcare they would've codified abortion rights either one of the two times they've had a super-majority in the past decade and change. But they didn't, *precisely* so they can continue holding the threat over our heads.
[удалено]
We do not permit liberalism here.
>For now we as Americans have a duty to vote for the people who will protect reproductive healthcare for American women. Ok, who are those people? It's certainly not either of the two major parties
What has genocide Joe ever done for anyone, student loan forgiveness, trans rights, reproductive rights, kids in concentration camps at the boarder. Look at his policies and tell me how they look different than Trump. It's sad to say but I wish trump was in office for the last six months, then people like you would agree with me when I say "genocide is bad".
Still commenting the same comments from Anarchy4everyone eh?
REPUBLICANS HOLD A REPUBLICAN GUN TO VOTERS HEADS EVERY TIME. Feels accurate, but I am tired of these memes constructed to discourage non-republican voters from voting.
I think it’s more encouraging leftists not to vote for a liberal/capitalist party rather than not voting entirely.
I'm not sure if anyone can answer me this, but how are the libs finding specific threads to brigade? Most of the most upvoted posts in this thread are from users who have never posted in this sub. Is there a discord group or something?
Let me know if you find out
Sure thing!
Please report all comments supporting capitalist political parties.
Welcome to wizarding wild world of astroturfing! It's kinda on the mods partially by allowing an upvoted lesser of two evils and russia china bot comment fly at the top of the thread. This wesbite will only be more annoying as time goes by but especially because it's an election year and both parties have been on record for using money to influence votes.
can you link the comments you’re referring to? I’m doing a once over of this thread, and I think I got the ones you mentioned.
You got the main one I was referring too. Good job! I know it's a thankless job and it's even worse recently so I have to praise good work when due!
[удалено]
I'd say genocide joe is pretty unpopular right now, especially amongst people who are anti-genocide.
Find a better argument. Rule 6 - no lesser evil rhetoric.
[удалено]
eVeRyThInG i dOnT lIkE iZ a rUzZiAn tRoLl!!!!
It doesn't say that you shouldn't vote.
[удалено]
You dont need the process to be demonized for people to not vote. Just speaking for my own environment here in California, all the young blue teamers have been staunch anti-Trumpers for most their post-adolescent lives, and theyve also become super anti-zionist and consider a vote for Biden to be a vote for Genocide. This meme is quite literally how a lot of them feel. I honestly dont know what a lot of people are gonna do lol. I dont think ive seen such disillusion in my age & party group my entire voting life.
The process isn't demonized. The two genocidal parties are. I'm reading this as an appeal to vote for a third-party candidate.
[удалено]
Voting for the Democrats is voting for genocide, and at the same time you're allowing them to go even further right by showing them what they can get away with. It's obvious that marginalized people only matter if they're politically beneficial to you. Also, why are you on a communist sub trying to get people to vote for a right-wing (actually, a self-declared fascist) candidate? A candidate who's openly supporting an apartheid regime and is facilitating and supporting a genocide?
Now who's discouraging voting? lmao
That is the neopolitical argument🤢🤮, but this is latestagecapitalism, neopoliticols aren’t respected or propped up here.
This is a stupid cop out. Anyone who has the capital to run astroturf *absolutely* has a pocketed politician they paid good money for that they would prefer you vote for. Even fucking Russia. The meme might be shit, but it's not fair to down play the legitimate frustration behind it.
That is precisely how I've felt about this Controlled Opposition bullshit since the bribed to treason Turdwookies running the DNC first DEMANDED I vote for Shillary Corporatist Clinton. (Fuck you sideways with a Saguaro cactus Debbie Wasserman Schulz!)
“No lesser of two evils” isn’t that literally all elections under neoliberalism????
We don’t need a vote over these two clowns. We need an honest to god workers revolution. Out with the conservative Christo-fascists and imperialists republicans. Out with the bourgeois neo-liberals and their genocide. I’m tired of having to pick between two awful choices of parties and their shitty candidates.
[удалено]
[удалено]
this image so funny to me lol. love it, dreamstime stock photos are hilarious
It's more likely for another American revolution than having a third party
It’ll get better incrementally guys don’t worry
The fact Biden isn’t even a left winger as far as most countries are concerned is fucked. How is it that the options are right and far right.
This is a stupid naive meme. I agree with the sentiment but at the end of the day if you don’t vote, or don’t vote blue on this election maga wins it all and the shit will hit the fan faster than ever. I still remember those who said the Trump and Hillary were “the same” and didn’t vote back in 2016. I curse them every day still.
I had every intention of voting 3rd party or write in bc I was so angry about it coming down to these two geriatric wealthy status quo corporate puppets again until Trump started saying shit like yeah I'll be a dictator but only as long as I need to to get what I want done and yeah I'm gonna use this position to get back at people who spoke against me and I'll serve more than 2 terms and hell yeah let Russia do whatever etc, the list goes on and on. Like this fool is a puppet to higher powers and openly telling people that he's going to just be a dictator and do whatever he wants to do and his financers tell him to do but people are ignorant enough to think they'll be able to fight the system and break it down when that type of shit is in power. It's not about lesser of two evils, it's about not electing someone who has such a hard-on for turning this country into a dictatorship that he's already bragging about how he's going to do it before he's in position to do it. I would give anything to have a way to get myself and, or at least, my kid out of this country.
They’re essentially the same.
My problem with memes like this and people who say that both parties are the same I feel like don't advocate for any real solutions or meaningful ways to try and make things better. And I also think they're just liars. It's true the Democrats are by and large representative of their donors, but the idea that they share the same agenda as the Republicans is factually wrong. Secondly, the Democratic voter base IS progressive, or at least liberal. I see nothing wrong with people who want to change things running as Democrat, in fact, I encourage people to do so. The Democratic party doesn't belong to the wealthy, it's our responsibility to take it back from them. I dislike political nihilism and I feel like a lot of people who write this stuff just want people to think the system is so corrupt and so broken that there's no hope but to not vote, vote third party, or let the opposition party win and let things get so bad that there can be a revolution, which I don't think any of those options would be good. I think there's a lot we can do and people who post stuff like this I feel most of the time are advocating that you give up and act morally superior by abstaining from politics.
Gotta be honest, when I saw the meme, I thought "the masked man could be whatever party that controls the media narrative, so voting seems pointless". I know that it's untrue that voting is pointless, but this is the first election I'd feel truly guilty voting for either candidate. But again, I know that's part of the design.
[удалено]
Not everyone who opposes genocide is a Russian.
This sub is for communists you doughnut always has been, why would we ever support a neoliberal, Zionist, or capitalist let alone a geriatric whose all 3.
Genocide is a red line - Rule 6. No lesser evil rhetoric.
We think it’s a two party system when it’s a just a system of puppets with corporate overlords. https://www.opensecrets.org
Um.. so what is it that this meme suggests? Because if it's not to vote... that's not the right answer.
Vote for the PSL candidate. Claudia and what’s her name.
Shoot the hostage.
No matter who wins I just hope to every deity that ever existed or has yet to exist that Trump loses. I shouldn't have to hope this much, we should just have a party that wins because it actually reflects the will of the American people.
[удалено]
This ain't it
Chomsky and Wolff and Einstein all say that pulling the level for the least bad candidate is our responsibility as adults, while conservatives and children globally try to get people not to vote by spreading shit like this.
This is exactly how I feel with the davidpakmanshow reddit.
What a stupid fucking image.
I wish this wasn't so fucking true. Not quite as much as I wish that everyone could see that it was true, but close
It puts the lotion on the skin or it gets the fascist again.
Break free from these 2 terrorists to be an Independent this year by voting against them. That's all I can say and that's all you can do with your only power of a single vite.
[удалено]
Vote Vermin Supreme
Wouldn't it be Republicans->Republicans->Voters?
Herbert Dwayne Mountain Dew Alonso Camacho for president 2024!
The over-emphasis on the debate on whether to vote or not takes attention away from all the strategies that aren't voting or abstention from voting. You don't want them to hold you hostage? Start resisting.
I’m American and I want to do the right thing. What should I do right now? Is voting useless now? Edit: As I type this it’s been 17 minutes, I have yet to get a response and the minutes feel like hours. I’m already in a really bad place right now and this certainly isn’t helping. Edit 2: It’s been at least an hour and still nothing.
Anybody except Republicans and Democrats.