He is still playing without camera but it does not matter. You guys have no idea how easy it is to cheat. There are literally chrome extensions in browser you can just have on second monitor. Let us see him play IRL. That would be fun.
He will never hit 1200
He will never hit 1300
He will never hit 1400
He will never hit 1500
He will never hit 1600
He will never hit 1700
He will never hit 1800
He will never hit 2000 <- you are here
He will never hit 2500
He will never hit 2800
He won't make tournaments
He won't make it to the finals
He won't thrash the current world champion to take his rightful place
Never doubt a competition between brothers. Look at so many great players in the nba a lot of them only started pro cuz their brother provoked them when they were little
It's not theoretically possible. He's 1800 rapid, which is like 1400 -1600 FIDE classical. He'd have to gain ~1500 rating points + get his GM norms.
All that aside, nobody has ever started chess as an adult and gotten the GM title. The closest I've ever seen is people starting in their late teens, which is extremely uncommon and possibly misleading. Such as Ye Jiangchuan. He "started" at 17, but there is probably a good chance he was at least introduced the the very basics before that. Which is an incredibly helpful basis when learning chess, even at a more advanced age.
He will never hit 1200
He will never hit 1300
He will never hit 1400
He will never hit 1500
He will never hit 1600
He will never hit 1700
He will never hit 1800
He will never hit 2000 <- you are here
He will never hit 2500
He will never hit 2800
He won't make tournaments
He won't make it to the finals
He won't thrash the current world champion to take his rightful place
Well IM is definitely a possibility, and if he legit spends 12h+ daily, maybe he could get GM, although unlikely. And idk if tyler is even interested in playing otb chess, which is quite different to normal chess.
I barely have any hours of league study because I'm lazy af and I'm still GM.
You don't have to study to improve in league, and I'd bet that the vast majority of people below chall or pro only just played the game (a lot)
You mean after he plays chess for 3k hours right. If you were new in league and you played 8 hours you would think that "d1 is too hard even with thousands of hours". I guarantee you that you won't say the same after 3k hours.
IMO absolutely not.
Obviously it's how you invest your time to improve. But I hit 2029 elo on lichess within a year of playing it (should be close to 1800 chess.com?), while I only recently hit diamond 1 after playing it for 12 years.
And the 2 achievements don't feel comparable in difficulty in the slightest.
For chess I did focus way more on improving (doing puzzles and checking out openings) than I do in league, but even so.
If I had to give my guess I would say 2k+ lichess would be equivelant to emerald 1 ish.
I think a big reason in the difference is that you can't just step into a ranked game of LoL and get a rating. You need to level up wich already takes a lot of time and commitment while many people just play a few chess games get a rank and inflate the % rankings.
*edit: Oops I thought you meant diamond 1 but I just noticed you only mentioned diamond. That probably would be quite close.
Rapid, I know it's bloated as is everything on lichess iirc?
But rapid was the widely recommended time control for improvement (and is also what T1 is focussing on right now and the topic is about)
Yeah I think bullet and blitz are less bloated than rapid simply because more people play it on both sites so less variance. blitz can be useful for trying different opening ideas though.
Is the rapid difference more than 250 between lichess and chess.com? I was pretty sure I remembered seeing something like being 99 percentile on lichess... but I can't find it anymore.
Could also be because i'm provisional ranked now due to being inactive.
I definitely did not spend more time on improving chess than LoL. But in percentage wise wile playing I would be focusing more on puzzles/openings/analysing than I was with LoL.
But that also has to do with it being much more suitable to learn chess outside of spaming games compared to LoL.
And lastly, most people won't reach diamond 1 in 10 years either. So that's also the exception and not the norm.
But my view is just a 1 person view
The biggest difference is that chess is a solo game, so as you learn and practice you can directly see your improvement. In league you need to work on your own gameplay but also your ability to babysit 4 other clowns as you do it
Nah i got it under a year in league, 700 hours that year. Took me way longer to 2k in lichess, because i didnt study chess just played, but i hard studied league, switched champs on every meta shift, trained on every champ/role to learn cds and matchups and read every patch note. Its more about intention with the time you put into it, i just hate dedicating my time to learn chess openings so it took me over a decade to "learn by osmosis" and reach 2k, but learning league was fun so i did that more than playing and climbed very easily
If you really went from brand new in league to d1 in under a year you should've quit whatever you were doing and gone pro
Everyone who did what you're saying are all pros or chall++. It's like saying chess is ez because magnus carlsen got to 2.5k elo or whatever in a year, like yeah he's him.
Even a lot of pros or some dudes in chall that I knew that I thought had "talent" took longer than a year to reach d1.
thats unlikely.
you are just discounting how many hours are "normal" to spend on league.
most people (starting from 0 RTS / MOBA experience) would have to play 300-1000 hrs of league (or a game with transferable skills) to be around diamond. Many people play more hours than that without reaching diamond.
Playing 300-1000 hrs of chess will probably take most people to 1800 on chess.com. its just not very common to spend that many hours on chess as an average / bad player
idk i gave a wide range. i think 300 is on the lower end of possible but i would not be surprised if there is an example of someone doing it with focused practice + tips +getting lucky in placements or using an imbalanced strong character
ever heard of a range? i estimated 300-1000 explicitly to avoid a bunch of debate about the numbers. make the number 1000 to 20000 if it makes your low elo brain feel better
It's definitely literally impossible for someone who has never played a moba to get d1 in 300 hours. I mean takes almost 100 to just get level 30 lol. And you think someone will get D1 starting ranked with 200 hours playing LoL for the first time?
If they were good in Dota2 or another moba then sure I guess. But not really the question.
Original comment said “around diamond.” I do think playing 300 hours d4 is achievable and also playing 300 hours does not include time put into studying the game. It’s not easy or attainable for most people, but some people are very talented and learn information very optimally!
youre missing the point by 10 miles. the point is that it takes a LOT of hours to hit diamond 1 in league (i was responding to someone claiming it is easy)
300 hours is less than 2 work months. That doesn't get you 1800 in 99.999999% of cases especially as an adult learner. Not sure how many hours has he spent but I am pretty sure it's a huge anomaly, worthy of a study/investigation.
i don't play league but 1800 elo is at 99.16 percentile on [chess.com](http://chess.com) [https://www.reddit.com/r/chess/comments/12vd1xe/chesscom\_percentiles\_april\_2023/](https://www.reddit.com/r/chess/comments/12vd1xe/chesscom_percentiles_april_2023/)
how many times will we learn to never doubt the 6'5" 250 lb best league of legends (challenger all roles) player recently discovered 30 year old chess savant bouta do what most chess player coulda never did their entire lives hobo has been streamer from bumfuckville missouri freak of nature had a child out of wedlock but still looks like a god chiseled outta marble lookin ass?
when will we stop doubting
Can't wait to see the cope in the chess reddit. It quickly turned from "Aww, great job little guy!" to "H-he's only climbing because he doesn't have anything else to do...!". Kneel before your new, vertically challenged Godking before it's too late.
After he hit 1700 I noticed there was a tone change. The chess subreddit is heavily skewed to people like 1500 and up. Now he's better than most of them you don't see shit talking as much.
Tbf most of them were shitposting his openings. Haven’t kept up with him but from what I read most of them were saying he takes unsound openings. His mid/endgame is great if he gets advantage but his book openings are mediocre. (Fwiw 1000elo andy just seeing comments.)
It's not even unsound openings. He plays one bad opening on both sides called The Cow that's a meme opening. But it's actually solid enough that most people dont know what to do against it. He gets playable games from it often. And yes he's good at middle and end games but I don't think he'd improve faster if he learned more meta openings. He knows the cow so well now that it's probably an advantage against most players in the pool since none of them are masters they won't play engine lines.
>The Cow
I was hoping someone that wasn't a casual observer could explain this to someone.
Mastering a single opening in chess against opponents who come into each game thinking "What's my plan?", against someone who says "This is my plan." is an advantage in a game as deterministic as chess.
And before engines this was the mindset. Now that positions aren't as arbitrary and can be given a numeric value the mindset changed to "this is the way you do things". That's why I like following T1's progress as a chess fan/player. You just need a system that works for you instead of working with a meta (unless you want to be WCC).
Most memes openings sacrifice some positional strength to put ppl in an unfamiliar situation. I’d wager by book (just guessing) it’s maybe -0.3. Prolly works better for him than meta openings but at theres always a limit
It's worse than that, I believe it's about -1.0 as white (and so a little worse as black), so a pretty significant disadvantage. Still, it's clearly difficult to punish even for 1800s, because it doesn't give any obvious weak points to attack.
Looks like someone even [checked the reasons for his last 70 losses](https://www.reddit.com/r/chess/comments/1c8ocij/the_reason_for_tyler1s_last_70_losses/)
well... to be fair, if he's hated nowadays it's not really the same, there was a reason he was hated, and ID banned by riot lol
he's gotten a lot better though, even if he's still pretty toxic sometimes.
He was in the 200s when he started playing in the Twitch event 8/9 months ago. Insane progress, but since then he has played the amount of chess that a 'normal' person would do in years.
"Okay but he'll NEVER reach 1900!"
Face it. Accept it. Tyler1 is going to be a grandmaster. He now has the powerful father energy buff. 12-4. This is the hardest working man in America.
French Streamer (and Pogchamps winner) Sardoche. His peak rating in rapid is 1906.
In terms of games played Tyler has 5000 rapid and 800 blitz games. Sardoche has 8000 rapid and 11000 blitz (since he started in 2021 with Pogchamps).
This is proof to all the people saying he needs to learn a real opening. Spending time learning opening theory yields much less improvement than simply playing the game. People rated 700 are the ones saying he needs to learn a "real" opening.
Tyler has played more games played than me, but I started playing 5 years ago, so it's not about playing 12 hours a day. I'm 1750~ and spend no time learning theory because the concepts can be learned by playing games. I think low level players think they need to learn openings, when in reality they're just making an opening blunder that they'd make at any point in the game. When you say opening theory, what you're really saying is learning a bunch of obscure lines relying on a bunch of hypotheticals, but what happens if your opponent doesn't play the common moves to your opening that you studied? Learning concepts is much better for improvement than studying opening lines.
You don't need deep obscure lines.
Just a few lines to the most common responses to a move where you know it will give you a solid advantage. And a couple of gambits just for fun
So this is why I said "what you really mean"...
Everyone that is convinced Tyler needs to study for the reason you listed, doesn't understand that by simply playing the game, you begin to understand why the most common responses work. You don't need to study theory to figure out the most common moves... you figure out the most common moves by soaking in what your opponents are commonly playing against you. So yes, when you say study openings, what I'm hearing and what you really mean is to go far deeper in obscure lines because he's already familiar with the common lines that he has played against 5,108 times.
Not what I'm saying at all.
Playing the cow as white 100% puts you into a - position within a few moves. Skipping that will just mean on average you win more games. Sure, you can brute force past any of that, but not intentionally gimping yourself will lets you climb at a faster rate. It only works for T1 because hes playing thousands of games.
For normal lower elo player, learning a bit of opening theory is a no brainer.
I think I've laid out my argument clearly. I know exactly what you're saying, and I'm telling you why the logic is flawed and redundant. This seems like another case where a lower-level player is telling a higher-level player how to improve. Tyler and I are both around the same rating, we improved at about the same rate (games played), so why would Tyler need to study opening theory to improve when he's already displayed improvement regardless? At what point should he have started learning theory because he's clearly well past the novice level where you're recommending theory? I say **he's not** at the level to start learning theory, yet. And please don't say it's because he plays 12 hours a day, and you can't, it's not about that... when you look at the big picture, he's improved at a very normal rate. You will find a lot of players with 5k rapid games at the same rating as tyler, and they don't play 12 hours a day.
I know literally zero theory, don't know the names or moves of a single opening, need to count 1 by 1 from a to h and 1 to 8 when finding a specific square, and still managed to hit 2060 with just brute force. But it's been a year of fluctuating between 1800 and 2050 and can't break 2100. It definitely feels like I've hit a wall because of my lack of theory/memorization.
It's still pattern recognition at the end of the day, and he plays way more games, so maybe he can breech it. But at some point theory is gonna produce better results than raw games.
Theory in chess is really weird.
By not knowing theory, you escape your opponent's preparation very early. Theoretically that would put you in a worse position, but it probably takes a GM level to turn an error in opening theory into a demolishing win.
If you do know theory, you're basically just playing memorized moves until one of you doesn't know the sequence anymore. At the point, the position should be relatively equal but the person with better prep should have a time advantage, but it's no guarantee of victory. Every now and then, you might trick your opponent with some weird trap but that's a very short-sighted way of gaining elo.
Just like videogames, meta (theory) only matters at top level play, below that it's just about fundamentals.
So yeah, I agree, 2000~ is generally where you'll have to study theory, and tyler might find himself hitting that same wall. I've always been able to feel where my game lacks the most. When you start dropping games in the opening, that's a pretty good indicator where you need to spend some time.
His puzzle rating is a lot higher than mine though which makes me think his brute force ceiling will be higher than mine. But I don't have premium so I can't do more than 5 puzzles a day and he did 800 in one day once, so it's hard to gauge.
You can do unlimited puzzles for free on other sites like lichess. Thats what I did, even though I played on chess dot com I would do my puzzles on lichess.
Opening theory is massively overblown in importance outside the very top levels but it seems a natural starting point for new players so people get kinda baited into studying it way way too deeply despite being at a level that can't even begin to properly utilize that level of prep. For any prospective beginners who think they might also be built in an alternative manner just learn the basic opening principles to guide you instead of trying to memorize a whole bunch of actual proper opening theory that you won't be able to properly understand without years of effort anyway. I've seen a crazy number of new players play a very solid opening end up with a superior position and instantly blow their advantage doing some weird stuff that doesn't make any sense once they are out of book moves.
Endgames are actually where its at for new players wanting to study theory and will be the determining factor in most games past the low/mid ranges where games get decided by who makes the most (or last) catastrophic blunders. There really are a whole bunch of endgames that are objectively winning but without at least some basis in theory to know how to approach them the chances of figuring out how to do it over the board aren't great. The same goes for drawing endgames too on the other side of things where holding the draw is only possible if you do it exactly right and even a slight deviation and its over.
If she has an ounce of her dad's work ethic, she can almost surely become at least an IM. I think the biggest factor is if chess will interest her. Hikaru's old brother comes to mind. One of the, if not the best kid chess players in the nation, but just lost interest while Hikaru remained obsessed and eventually skyrocketed in rating.
She's 1978 on rapid chesscom, but just 170 games; she doesn't play it. Tyler1 has 5100 rapid matches for comparison. In 9 months.
she's unrated FIDE rapid as well, but 1879 classical (not to be compared to chesscom rating)
she peaked 2126 blitz and 2301 bullet, so my guess is 2100-2200, her FIDE blitz is basically the same as her FIDE classical, so she seems to consistent between time controls to not expect her Rapid to be too different than blitz and bullet.
**🎦 CLIP MIRROR: [Saiyler's father reaches 1800 elo in chess](https://livestreamfails.com/clip/163157)**
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At this point, wouldn't he be able to squeeze a couple of wins against the Botez sisters every now and again? Getting close to that point anyways, crazy.
He would need to expand his opening repertoire since he is only primarily playing one opening, The Cow (that's not a joke, it's actually called the Cow). While it works online against players who aren't ready for it, it can easily be countered if your opponents know that that is your main weapon.
Yea for sure, but like, if he and Andrea played like 40 games back to back, do you not think he would be able to Scamaz a couple of wins? Or maybe I'm underestimating how much 200-300 rating diff actually matters.
First I was going to say "Wow, no loud tag on a T1 clip?"
Then I watched the clip...not only is it not loud he didn't say a single fucking word.
THAT is the most insane thing about this.
[Pepega 📣 How is this a fail](https://i.imgur.com/YEMU30K.png)
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Not exactly but from what I've read they're actually fairly close (within about 100 elo, and that can go either way apparently, so 1800 Chess.com being about 1700-1900 FIDE). It's lichess ratings that are largely over-inflated and sometimes several hundred rating points higher than chess.com or FIDE.
Since nobody has asked in 119 comments so far…
Please explain (1) who this is and what their advancing Elo means (2) the theory behind the win in this specific game.
We can’t all be chess experts!
**CLIP MIRROR: [Saiyler's father reaches 1800 elo in chess](https://arazu.io/t3_1c8du99/)** --- ^(*This is an automated comment*)
Remember guys, never doubt a crazy person
my man's truly built different, and totally out of his fucking mind.
Magnus dont know what's coming
He is still playing without camera but it does not matter. You guys have no idea how easy it is to cheat. There are literally chrome extensions in browser you can just have on second monitor. Let us see him play IRL. That would be fun.
He will never hit 1200 He will never hit 1300 He will never hit 1400 He will never hit 1500 He will never hit 1600 He will never hit 1700 He will never hit 1800 He will never hit 2000 <- you are here He will never hit 2500 He will never hit 2800 He won't make tournaments He won't make it to the finals He won't thrash the current world champion to take his rightful place
didnt all this start because erobb beat him in chess
Yes lol. He lost the games bet so he had to do the 24 hour stream. And became a crack head... I mean chess enthusiast
An older brother losing to a younger sibling hurts the soul, I don't blame him.
Losing to erobb out of all people would make it worse lmao
Losing to Sailyer's father's younger brother would be devastating.
Never doubt a competition between brothers. Look at so many great players in the nba a lot of them only started pro cuz their brother provoked them when they were little
No better motivation than one out of spite
What losing to one eye brother famous for being a Loser does to a mfker .
Two neurodivergent brothers, Tyler used his skill points into league , gym and chess while Erobb used his for Tetris chess and lounging.
He said that he liked chess, but didn't know that you can play online, lol ???
Give him some slack he didn't know what grass was until he got banned from league.
Variety pepehands
erobb beat him in so many games
If this man cracks grandmaster through sheer force of will and anger, I will be thoroughly impressed.
It's theoretically possible, so if anyone can do it
It's not theoretically possible. He's 1800 rapid, which is like 1400 -1600 FIDE classical. He'd have to gain ~1500 rating points + get his GM norms. All that aside, nobody has ever started chess as an adult and gotten the GM title. The closest I've ever seen is people starting in their late teens, which is extremely uncommon and possibly misleading. Such as Ye Jiangchuan. He "started" at 17, but there is probably a good chance he was at least introduced the the very basics before that. Which is an incredibly helpful basis when learning chess, even at a more advanced age.
He will never hit 1200 He will never hit 1300 He will never hit 1400 He will never hit 1500 He will never hit 1600 He will never hit 1700 He will never hit 1800 He will never hit 2000 <- you are here He will never hit 2500 He will never hit 2800 He won't make tournaments He won't make it to the finals He won't thrash the current world champion to take his rightful place
Well IM is definitely a possibility, and if he legit spends 12h+ daily, maybe he could get GM, although unlikely. And idk if tyler is even interested in playing otb chess, which is quite different to normal chess.
Can you even become a GM without playing classical? Cause Tyler is never ever going to play a 6 hour chess match lol
why wouldn't he? He plays chess for like 16+ hours at a time
Yeah and he plays like 80 matches in those 16 hours.
T1 ALPHA AS FUCK
If you study and play you can get to 2000s, maybe 2200s. Past thay is ... impossible for me.
*saves*
That Hikiri guy doesnt know whats coming after him after those remarks Saiyler's father will always prevail
Magnum Carlston, Hikiro and that GoliathGaming guy have been real quiet recently, they know what's coming for them
Exactly!
Materialized discrepantly
Programmed asymmetrically
Forged alternatively
Packaged abnormally
Crafted divergently
Bill Diperly
Produced divergently
That's my Chess Streamer of the Year, can't wait to see him at the 2026 candidates
2025
Candidates happen every other year, but I am sure they will make an exception for him.
How good is 1800 in league terms?
chess.com says 1800 elo is 99th percentile. The 99th percentile in league is Diamond 1: https://www.op.gg/statistics/tiers
Idk how to describe it but IMO 1800 in chess is harder than diamond in league
Remember that this is 1800 on *chess.com*, not 1800 FIDE.
nah most d1 players have like 3000 hours playtime if you spent 3000 hours studying chess and trying to improve you'd easily reach 1800 on c.com too
Most have 5000 hours silver 4 still blaming jungle
tbf 3000 hours play time is *not* equal to "3000 hours studying and trying to improve"
For some it sure isn't.
I barely have any hours of league study because I'm lazy af and I'm still GM. You don't have to study to improve in league, and I'd bet that the vast majority of people below chall or pro only just played the game (a lot)
Come back after you have played chess for 8 hours and type this same comment again.
You mean after he plays chess for 3k hours right. If you were new in league and you played 8 hours you would think that "d1 is too hard even with thousands of hours". I guarantee you that you won't say the same after 3k hours.
IMO absolutely not. Obviously it's how you invest your time to improve. But I hit 2029 elo on lichess within a year of playing it (should be close to 1800 chess.com?), while I only recently hit diamond 1 after playing it for 12 years. And the 2 achievements don't feel comparable in difficulty in the slightest. For chess I did focus way more on improving (doing puzzles and checking out openings) than I do in league, but even so. If I had to give my guess I would say 2k+ lichess would be equivelant to emerald 1 ish. I think a big reason in the difference is that you can't just step into a ranked game of LoL and get a rating. You need to level up wich already takes a lot of time and commitment while many people just play a few chess games get a rank and inflate the % rankings. *edit: Oops I thought you meant diamond 1 but I just noticed you only mentioned diamond. That probably would be quite close.
you hit 2000 lichess in a year of learning the moves? what rating format? Rapid and classical are really bloated.
Rapid, I know it's bloated as is everything on lichess iirc? But rapid was the widely recommended time control for improvement (and is also what T1 is focussing on right now and the topic is about)
Yeah I think bullet and blitz are less bloated than rapid simply because more people play it on both sites so less variance. blitz can be useful for trying different opening ideas though.
[удалено]
Is the rapid difference more than 250 between lichess and chess.com? I was pretty sure I remembered seeing something like being 99 percentile on lichess... but I can't find it anymore. Could also be because i'm provisional ranked now due to being inactive. I definitely did not spend more time on improving chess than LoL. But in percentage wise wile playing I would be focusing more on puzzles/openings/analysing than I was with LoL. But that also has to do with it being much more suitable to learn chess outside of spaming games compared to LoL. And lastly, most people won't reach diamond 1 in 10 years either. So that's also the exception and not the norm. But my view is just a 1 person view
The biggest difference is that chess is a solo game, so as you learn and practice you can directly see your improvement. In league you need to work on your own gameplay but also your ability to babysit 4 other clowns as you do it
lol no, not even close.
I would say it's definitely not, I've been both, you can get to 1800 in chess in a year or 2, you are going to take 3+ to get D1 in League
Nah i got it under a year in league, 700 hours that year. Took me way longer to 2k in lichess, because i didnt study chess just played, but i hard studied league, switched champs on every meta shift, trained on every champ/role to learn cds and matchups and read every patch note. Its more about intention with the time you put into it, i just hate dedicating my time to learn chess openings so it took me over a decade to "learn by osmosis" and reach 2k, but learning league was fun so i did that more than playing and climbed very easily
If you really went from brand new in league to d1 in under a year you should've quit whatever you were doing and gone pro Everyone who did what you're saying are all pros or chall++. It's like saying chess is ez because magnus carlsen got to 2.5k elo or whatever in a year, like yeah he's him. Even a lot of pros or some dudes in chall that I knew that I thought had "talent" took longer than a year to reach d1.
thats unlikely. you are just discounting how many hours are "normal" to spend on league. most people (starting from 0 RTS / MOBA experience) would have to play 300-1000 hrs of league (or a game with transferable skills) to be around diamond. Many people play more hours than that without reaching diamond. Playing 300-1000 hrs of chess will probably take most people to 1800 on chess.com. its just not very common to spend that many hours on chess as an average / bad player
cmon man, someone fresh to MOBA's ain't hitting Diamond 1 in 300 hours
idk i gave a wide range. i think 300 is on the lower end of possible but i would not be surprised if there is an example of someone doing it with focused practice + tips +getting lucky in placements or using an imbalanced strong character
300 hours is approximately 500 games. Nobody is hitting Diamond in that. That's MAYBE enough games to even see all the heroes.
ever heard of a range? i estimated 300-1000 explicitly to avoid a bunch of debate about the numbers. make the number 1000 to 20000 if it makes your low elo brain feel better
Ur downvoted but that’s just low elo people copium
It's definitely literally impossible for someone who has never played a moba to get d1 in 300 hours. I mean takes almost 100 to just get level 30 lol. And you think someone will get D1 starting ranked with 200 hours playing LoL for the first time? If they were good in Dota2 or another moba then sure I guess. But not really the question.
Original comment said “around diamond.” I do think playing 300 hours d4 is achievable and also playing 300 hours does not include time put into studying the game. It’s not easy or attainable for most people, but some people are very talented and learn information very optimally!
youre missing the point by 10 miles. the point is that it takes a LOT of hours to hit diamond 1 in league (i was responding to someone claiming it is easy)
Your whole point was that it doesn't take a lot of hours to hit diamond...... Why has your point shifted?
300 hours is less than 2 work months. That doesn't get you 1800 in 99.999999% of cases especially as an adult learner. Not sure how many hours has he spent but I am pretty sure it's a huge anomaly, worthy of a study/investigation.
how many MFs spending 300 hrs grinding chess without being any good at it? probly not very many. youre just talking out your ass
League probably has way more smurfs than Chess these days. Which would really push 99th percentile to at least past Diamond.
i don't play league but 1800 elo is at 99.16 percentile on [chess.com](http://chess.com) [https://www.reddit.com/r/chess/comments/12vd1xe/chesscom\_percentiles\_april\_2023/](https://www.reddit.com/r/chess/comments/12vd1xe/chesscom_percentiles_april_2023/)
Diamond 1
Plat/emerald maybe?
Low emerald high platinum I think.
Really? That seems very high. Plat 1/Emerald 4 is top 20%. I cannot believe that 20% of the chess population is higher than 1800
The last I checked emerald 4 is the top 13percent and when I was emerald 4 60lp I was top 10 percent….wild
They changed it a bit this season I think, my friend is plat 1 20 lp and according to u.gg is top 20.3%
Its diamond 1. 99.something percentile
percentile wise it's like d4
Tyler1 is like the antithesis of the average Redditor he just keeps grinding and improving
Not having to work really helps
Saiyler’s Uncle’s Wife’s Grandfather-In-Law’s Daughter’s Granddaughter’s Uncle
how many times will we learn to never doubt the 6'5" 250 lb best league of legends (challenger all roles) player recently discovered 30 year old chess savant bouta do what most chess player coulda never did their entire lives hobo has been streamer from bumfuckville missouri freak of nature had a child out of wedlock but still looks like a god chiseled outta marble lookin ass? when will we stop doubting
The universe saw Magnus not defend his title due to motivation and sent Terminator-1 after him.
this dude is truly assembled unconventionally
This motherfucker truly is built different, it's not even a joke anymore at this point.
dad strength
He’s averaged 4.5 hours of chess a day for the past 8 months 💀
Can't wait to see the cope in the chess reddit. It quickly turned from "Aww, great job little guy!" to "H-he's only climbing because he doesn't have anything else to do...!". Kneel before your new, vertically challenged Godking before it's too late.
After he hit 1700 I noticed there was a tone change. The chess subreddit is heavily skewed to people like 1500 and up. Now he's better than most of them you don't see shit talking as much.
Tbf most of them were shitposting his openings. Haven’t kept up with him but from what I read most of them were saying he takes unsound openings. His mid/endgame is great if he gets advantage but his book openings are mediocre. (Fwiw 1000elo andy just seeing comments.)
It's not even unsound openings. He plays one bad opening on both sides called The Cow that's a meme opening. But it's actually solid enough that most people dont know what to do against it. He gets playable games from it often. And yes he's good at middle and end games but I don't think he'd improve faster if he learned more meta openings. He knows the cow so well now that it's probably an advantage against most players in the pool since none of them are masters they won't play engine lines.
>The Cow I was hoping someone that wasn't a casual observer could explain this to someone. Mastering a single opening in chess against opponents who come into each game thinking "What's my plan?", against someone who says "This is my plan." is an advantage in a game as deterministic as chess.
And before engines this was the mindset. Now that positions aren't as arbitrary and can be given a numeric value the mindset changed to "this is the way you do things". That's why I like following T1's progress as a chess fan/player. You just need a system that works for you instead of working with a meta (unless you want to be WCC).
Most memes openings sacrifice some positional strength to put ppl in an unfamiliar situation. I’d wager by book (just guessing) it’s maybe -0.3. Prolly works better for him than meta openings but at theres always a limit
It's worse than that, I believe it's about -1.0 as white (and so a little worse as black), so a pretty significant disadvantage. Still, it's clearly difficult to punish even for 1800s, because it doesn't give any obvious weak points to attack.
Yeah I’d figured 1800’s would be able to capitalize on pawn adv but if the position is tricky then it’s understandable. Gl to t1 on the grind tho lol.
you made me check the chess reddit and legit no one is mad and coping, just posting same memes as here fuck u
Its not baseless. Some users were downplaying his achievement when he hit 1700. Just happy to see the man is still going strong
same as here
that was happening here not on the chess subreddit
seemingly a very small minority, which doesnt really need to be said
google deception
holy lie
As if any high level chess player ever was just getting a couple games in after work. Every good player dedicated their whole life to it.
Looks like someone even [checked the reasons for his last 70 losses](https://www.reddit.com/r/chess/comments/1c8ocij/the_reason_for_tyler1s_last_70_losses/)
They hate him just like the league community did back in the day. In a few years time he’ll be the face of chess.
well... to be fair, if he's hated nowadays it's not really the same, there was a reason he was hated, and ID banned by riot lol he's gotten a lot better though, even if he's still pretty toxic sometimes.
being toxic these days feels like a requirement for lol if you want to still be sane
Nah, the tone already shifted. He's bona fide as far as the chess sub is concerned.
And now comes the inevitable tilt bender down to 1200 before whipsawing back to 1900
Anyone know what rank he was when he lost to xqc?
He was in the 200s when he started playing in the Twitch event 8/9 months ago. Insane progress, but since then he has played the amount of chess that a 'normal' person would do in years.
"Okay but he'll NEVER reach 1900!" Face it. Accept it. Tyler1 is going to be a grandmaster. He now has the powerful father energy buff. 12-4. This is the hardest working man in America.
I have a screenshot of his account at like 180 elo which I sent my friends with the caption "T1 isn't very good at chess" and now we're here
Second highest rating a player participating in Pogchamps got to
Are you not going to tell us who is #1? :<
French Streamer (and Pogchamps winner) Sardoche. His peak rating in rapid is 1906. In terms of games played Tyler has 5000 rapid and 800 blitz games. Sardoche has 8000 rapid and 11000 blitz (since he started in 2021 with Pogchamps).
Aah, thats awesome! T1 has a decent shot at achieving that as well I'd say
bruh how
Did they seriously call their kid saiyler?
has he learned any theory yet or still purely pattern recognition?
This is proof to all the people saying he needs to learn a real opening. Spending time learning opening theory yields much less improvement than simply playing the game. People rated 700 are the ones saying he needs to learn a "real" opening.
For time spent, learning some theory and opening sequences absolutely is worth it. Not everyone can spend 12 hours a day grinding like T1 is
Tyler has played more games played than me, but I started playing 5 years ago, so it's not about playing 12 hours a day. I'm 1750~ and spend no time learning theory because the concepts can be learned by playing games. I think low level players think they need to learn openings, when in reality they're just making an opening blunder that they'd make at any point in the game. When you say opening theory, what you're really saying is learning a bunch of obscure lines relying on a bunch of hypotheticals, but what happens if your opponent doesn't play the common moves to your opening that you studied? Learning concepts is much better for improvement than studying opening lines.
You don't need deep obscure lines. Just a few lines to the most common responses to a move where you know it will give you a solid advantage. And a couple of gambits just for fun
So this is why I said "what you really mean"... Everyone that is convinced Tyler needs to study for the reason you listed, doesn't understand that by simply playing the game, you begin to understand why the most common responses work. You don't need to study theory to figure out the most common moves... you figure out the most common moves by soaking in what your opponents are commonly playing against you. So yes, when you say study openings, what I'm hearing and what you really mean is to go far deeper in obscure lines because he's already familiar with the common lines that he has played against 5,108 times.
Not what I'm saying at all. Playing the cow as white 100% puts you into a - position within a few moves. Skipping that will just mean on average you win more games. Sure, you can brute force past any of that, but not intentionally gimping yourself will lets you climb at a faster rate. It only works for T1 because hes playing thousands of games. For normal lower elo player, learning a bit of opening theory is a no brainer.
I think I've laid out my argument clearly. I know exactly what you're saying, and I'm telling you why the logic is flawed and redundant. This seems like another case where a lower-level player is telling a higher-level player how to improve. Tyler and I are both around the same rating, we improved at about the same rate (games played), so why would Tyler need to study opening theory to improve when he's already displayed improvement regardless? At what point should he have started learning theory because he's clearly well past the novice level where you're recommending theory? I say **he's not** at the level to start learning theory, yet. And please don't say it's because he plays 12 hours a day, and you can't, it's not about that... when you look at the big picture, he's improved at a very normal rate. You will find a lot of players with 5k rapid games at the same rating as tyler, and they don't play 12 hours a day.
Since when were we talking about T1?
Bro you are cooked.
I know literally zero theory, don't know the names or moves of a single opening, need to count 1 by 1 from a to h and 1 to 8 when finding a specific square, and still managed to hit 2060 with just brute force. But it's been a year of fluctuating between 1800 and 2050 and can't break 2100. It definitely feels like I've hit a wall because of my lack of theory/memorization. It's still pattern recognition at the end of the day, and he plays way more games, so maybe he can breech it. But at some point theory is gonna produce better results than raw games.
Theory in chess is really weird. By not knowing theory, you escape your opponent's preparation very early. Theoretically that would put you in a worse position, but it probably takes a GM level to turn an error in opening theory into a demolishing win. If you do know theory, you're basically just playing memorized moves until one of you doesn't know the sequence anymore. At the point, the position should be relatively equal but the person with better prep should have a time advantage, but it's no guarantee of victory. Every now and then, you might trick your opponent with some weird trap but that's a very short-sighted way of gaining elo. Just like videogames, meta (theory) only matters at top level play, below that it's just about fundamentals.
So yeah, I agree, 2000~ is generally where you'll have to study theory, and tyler might find himself hitting that same wall. I've always been able to feel where my game lacks the most. When you start dropping games in the opening, that's a pretty good indicator where you need to spend some time.
His puzzle rating is a lot higher than mine though which makes me think his brute force ceiling will be higher than mine. But I don't have premium so I can't do more than 5 puzzles a day and he did 800 in one day once, so it's hard to gauge.
You can do unlimited puzzles for free on other sites like lichess. Thats what I did, even though I played on chess dot com I would do my puzzles on lichess.
Opening theory is massively overblown in importance outside the very top levels but it seems a natural starting point for new players so people get kinda baited into studying it way way too deeply despite being at a level that can't even begin to properly utilize that level of prep. For any prospective beginners who think they might also be built in an alternative manner just learn the basic opening principles to guide you instead of trying to memorize a whole bunch of actual proper opening theory that you won't be able to properly understand without years of effort anyway. I've seen a crazy number of new players play a very solid opening end up with a superior position and instantly blow their advantage doing some weird stuff that doesn't make any sense once they are out of book moves. Endgames are actually where its at for new players wanting to study theory and will be the determining factor in most games past the low/mid ranges where games get decided by who makes the most (or last) catastrophic blunders. There really are a whole bunch of endgames that are objectively winning but without at least some basis in theory to know how to approach them the chances of figuring out how to do it over the board aren't great. The same goes for drawing endgames too on the other side of things where holding the draw is only possible if you do it exactly right and even a slight deviation and its over.
He told chat does read Chess book, but not sure if he still does
We absolutely need another tournament with streamers. I want to see T1 roll these cats.
This is legitimately mad impressive
Saiyler will be one of these chess Kids at 2k+ with 10 watching her father playing.
If she has an ounce of her dad's work ethic, she can almost surely become at least an IM. I think the biggest factor is if chess will interest her. Hikaru's old brother comes to mind. One of the, if not the best kid chess players in the nation, but just lost interest while Hikaru remained obsessed and eventually skyrocketed in rating.
did they really name child sayler?
Isn't this Andrea Botez elo on chess.com? Or is she 2000?
She's 1978 on rapid chesscom, but just 170 games; she doesn't play it. Tyler1 has 5100 rapid matches for comparison. In 9 months. she's unrated FIDE rapid as well, but 1879 classical (not to be compared to chesscom rating)
So basically if she actually played a decent amount of rapid she would be well over 2k.
she peaked 2126 blitz and 2301 bullet, so my guess is 2100-2200, her FIDE blitz is basically the same as her FIDE classical, so she seems to consistent between time controls to not expect her Rapid to be too different than blitz and bullet.
> Andrea Botez She is around 1825 on classic/FIDE, which is a completly different beast.
saiyler1. If it wasent because her father is rich she would have a rough life with that name.
The cope in here is gonna be good.
Andrea Botez shaking in her boots
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be fun to see him play casual chess streamers and see their assessment of him
It's actually insane how good he has gotten from how little he has played.
Shit man im turning to god
holyy that is impressive
that is actually kinda impressive ... i knew he was a supergrinder when he did the "challenger on every role" thing but wow
Holy fuck he's doing it
This is actually crazy without reading chess books or studying theory wtf
I hope he doesn't stop once he hits a certain #. He clearly can go a lot further with coaching. I'd love to see him in a tournament one day.
Tragedeigh
He's in the top 99.8th percentile. Huge
At this point, wouldn't he be able to squeeze a couple of wins against the Botez sisters every now and again? Getting close to that point anyways, crazy.
He would need to expand his opening repertoire since he is only primarily playing one opening, The Cow (that's not a joke, it's actually called the Cow). While it works online against players who aren't ready for it, it can easily be countered if your opponents know that that is your main weapon.
Yea for sure, but like, if he and Andrea played like 40 games back to back, do you not think he would be able to Scamaz a couple of wins? Or maybe I'm underestimating how much 200-300 rating diff actually matters.
what that's close to botez sisters lul.
First I was going to say "Wow, no loud tag on a T1 clip?" Then I watched the clip...not only is it not loud he didn't say a single fucking word. THAT is the most insane thing about this.
It's not T1's clip, it's a channel that streams Tyler's chess games
How is this a fail? this sub needs to rename itself inb4 Pepega ,........ if you need a bot to explain your incorrect sub name you're doing it wrong.
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Is 1800 on chess.com the same as real fide elo though ?
Not exactly but from what I've read they're actually fairly close (within about 100 elo, and that can go either way apparently, so 1800 Chess.com being about 1700-1900 FIDE). It's lichess ratings that are largely over-inflated and sometimes several hundred rating points higher than chess.com or FIDE.
Since nobody has asked in 119 comments so far… Please explain (1) who this is and what their advancing Elo means (2) the theory behind the win in this specific game. We can’t all be chess experts!