I mean it would be a SB card in 60 card formats like modern, probably a 1-2 of that can do well vs tron (which is getting a lot of new toys) and in commander it would be a meta call, yeah it would be funny against a t1 sol ring or equivalent but you would likely only run it in heavy CS decks or if you regularly play against heavy artifact decks (as an artifact player that hurts lol)
It’s good in commander just as an anti artifact card that can flex into hating ETBs and such. Good, but not great, but for 1 mana that might be enough.
It counters the etb but not the attack trigger, if they have a way to give it haste they can probably still do they're thing, better to just hard counter or remove it
Not saying it is worse, just has less application. The word niche means exactly that. It does not do the same. Defabricate gives you also enchantments, but colorless spells as legal targets will be only artifacts, but instead of only being able to counter triggered abilities it also can hit activated. There are only 5 blue stifle instant spells rn so easy to compare.
Colorless doesn't affect only artifacts it also affects eldrazi or similar colorless creatures (probably the intended use) as well as any devoid spells (ironic) colorless spells like [[all is dust]] and can also work with mycosynth lattice which makes everything colorless and yeah it can't hit actived but it can hit *multiple* triggered abilities like storm (triggered), etbs, etc. so it's much better then you're giving credit for, and the CS you mentioned probably sees no or little competitive play and i wouldn't be surprised if this sees play even if it's only a few copies
And if I have amulet of vigor? 🙂 Turn 2 lotus field, counter on trigger, in to untap with vizier or another spell, in to time warp or one ring. Turn 2.
I imagine this is intended to be a [[Stiffle]] for Modern, that can't counter Fetch lands.
As for EDH, I'll try to cram in a few decks. There are plenty of commander abilities worth countering, and worse case scenario, 1 mana counter mana rock lol.
It’s also a great counterspell for limited being able to counter an eldrazi and its ability for 1U while still having some utility against non-eldrazi decks
I'm honestly really interested in this countering the second stage on Creation of Avacyn. It's not as good as instant speed proliferate for CoA, but it is interesting
Why counter the second stage and not the third? Let them lose the life, counter the third stage and strand the card. Or are you intending to make CoA a slow three mana tutor effect?
Yeah I'm talking about doing it to your own CoA. It's much better with the proliferate plan where you can, in response to the second stage, proliferate to the third, getting the creature out before losing life to CoA. That way you can get a turn 4 Atraxa or Grislebrand without life loss in a way that dodges graveyard hate.
This counter would be mostly for other things if the meta can justify running maindeck colorless counters, but it works as a back up plan for if you can't proliferate (because there just aren't enough instant speed ways to proliferate).
I still think it's just not a viable strategy until we get something better than [[Whisper of the Dross]] though. Something like U or UU: Instant, draw a card, proliferate could make this viable but for now I think it's something that just exists in theory that I'll revisit whenever proliferate is a relevant mechanic. Or if they finally give us stifle.
Since the card would be face down when the third trigger resolves, I don’t believe it would go to the battlefield, since the fact it is a creature would not be public information.
Oh that's a good point... Honestly might ask in the judge subreddit cause that's an interesting rules question. If that doesn't work than creation will likely never be worth considering for modern.
406.3a A card exiled face down has no characteristics, but the spell or ability that exiled it may allow it to be played from exile. Unless that card is being cast face down (see rule 708.4), the card is turned face up just before the player announces that they are playing the card (see rule 601.2).
This should be the relevant rule since the triggered ability in the third chapter references a characteristic of the card to see where it goes, and as a face down card it would have no characteristics, it would not be put into the battlefield, so you would follow the “If you don’t put onto the battlefield, put it into it’s owner’s hand.” Instruction.
Ah yes anti-ulamog
Dam that's wild 2 mana counter ulamog
The trade-off is running this incredibly narrow piece of interaction.
I mean it would be a SB card in 60 card formats like modern, probably a 1-2 of that can do well vs tron (which is getting a lot of new toys) and in commander it would be a meta call, yeah it would be funny against a t1 sol ring or equivalent but you would likely only run it in heavy CS decks or if you regularly play against heavy artifact decks (as an artifact player that hurts lol)
It’s good in commander just as an anti artifact card that can flex into hating ETBs and such. Good, but not great, but for 1 mana that might be enough.
Doesn’t it also work well against prime time in modern?
It counters the etb but not the attack trigger, if they have a way to give it haste they can probably still do they're thing, better to just hard counter or remove it
[[Defabricate]] exists so this is just for eldrazi and cast trigger hence more niche than defabricate
Yeah but that's 2 mana do one *or* the other, this one is 2 mana do *both* or 1 mana do one which is way better in 60 card
Not saying it is worse, just has less application. The word niche means exactly that. It does not do the same. Defabricate gives you also enchantments, but colorless spells as legal targets will be only artifacts, but instead of only being able to counter triggered abilities it also can hit activated. There are only 5 blue stifle instant spells rn so easy to compare.
Colorless doesn't affect only artifacts it also affects eldrazi or similar colorless creatures (probably the intended use) as well as any devoid spells (ironic) colorless spells like [[all is dust]] and can also work with mycosynth lattice which makes everything colorless and yeah it can't hit actived but it can hit *multiple* triggered abilities like storm (triggered), etbs, etc. so it's much better then you're giving credit for, and the CS you mentioned probably sees no or little competitive play and i wouldn't be surprised if this sees play even if it's only a few copies
[all is dust](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/4/2/4210c54e-89fd-4971-ab6a-ca8f4e7fe97a.jpg?1691924662) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=all%20is%20dust) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/cmm/800/all-is-dust?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/4210c54e-89fd-4971-ab6a-ca8f4e7fe97a?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Dude literally what I said. I refer to defabricate. -.-
[Defabricate](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/7/d/7dd32168-0b9c-4633-adec-d41cf125cc35.jpg?1674420469) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Defabricate) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/bro/45/defabricate?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/7dd32168-0b9c-4633-adec-d41cf125cc35?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Okay so, turn 2 lotus field it's okay now?
Oh shit yeah, hadn't even realized it doesn't specify spells and abilities your opponent controls. This is just turn 2 negate lotus field downside.
And if I have amulet of vigor? 🙂 Turn 2 lotus field, counter on trigger, in to untap with vizier or another spell, in to time warp or one ring. Turn 2.
I imagine this is intended to be a [[Stiffle]] for Modern, that can't counter Fetch lands. As for EDH, I'll try to cram in a few decks. There are plenty of commander abilities worth countering, and worse case scenario, 1 mana counter mana rock lol.
It’s also a great counterspell for limited being able to counter an eldrazi and its ability for 1U while still having some utility against non-eldrazi decks
Your spelling makes me wonder how you pronounce "Stifle".
I thought it was written just like "Shuffle" lol
But you know it rhymes with "rifle", not "Wiffle", right?
But rifle rhymes with shuffle. Like Orange and Door Hinge.
1 mana counter t1 Sol Ring (if you go first) or counter an aether flux or something later
[Stiffle](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/6/1/616d1b20-61c1-4d39-a9b5-ad9fd61699e4.jpg?1562865442) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Stifle) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/cns/108/stifle?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/616d1b20-61c1-4d39-a9b5-ad9fd61699e4?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
I'm surprised they didn't just do "Counter target activated or triggered ability with a nonland source + some upside" for U.
That's probably the closest to Stifle Modern could get (except for the upside, unless it were for the opponent).
Thats it boys, the final leak 🥲
Wow, this is great
Is this what destroyed the spec of that guy in /r/MTGFinance ?
Another thing for Uros Trick chest!
I'm honestly really interested in this countering the second stage on Creation of Avacyn. It's not as good as instant speed proliferate for CoA, but it is interesting
Why counter the second stage and not the third? Let them lose the life, counter the third stage and strand the card. Or are you intending to make CoA a slow three mana tutor effect?
Yeah I'm talking about doing it to your own CoA. It's much better with the proliferate plan where you can, in response to the second stage, proliferate to the third, getting the creature out before losing life to CoA. That way you can get a turn 4 Atraxa or Grislebrand without life loss in a way that dodges graveyard hate. This counter would be mostly for other things if the meta can justify running maindeck colorless counters, but it works as a back up plan for if you can't proliferate (because there just aren't enough instant speed ways to proliferate). I still think it's just not a viable strategy until we get something better than [[Whisper of the Dross]] though. Something like U or UU: Instant, draw a card, proliferate could make this viable but for now I think it's something that just exists in theory that I'll revisit whenever proliferate is a relevant mechanic. Or if they finally give us stifle.
[Whisper of the Dross](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/5/8/58d287e8-5297-415a-97d5-02002470c52b.jpg?1675957064) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Whisper%20of%20the%20Dross) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/one/117/whisper-of-the-dross?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/58d287e8-5297-415a-97d5-02002470c52b?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Since the card would be face down when the third trigger resolves, I don’t believe it would go to the battlefield, since the fact it is a creature would not be public information.
Oh that's a good point... Honestly might ask in the judge subreddit cause that's an interesting rules question. If that doesn't work than creation will likely never be worth considering for modern.
406.3a A card exiled face down has no characteristics, but the spell or ability that exiled it may allow it to be played from exile. Unless that card is being cast face down (see rule 708.4), the card is turned face up just before the player announces that they are playing the card (see rule 601.2). This should be the relevant rule since the triggered ability in the third chapter references a characteristic of the card to see where it goes, and as a face down card it would have no characteristics, it would not be put into the battlefield, so you would follow the “If you don’t put onto the battlefield, put it into it’s owner’s hand.” Instruction.
Ah what a bummer. This cards potential just plummeted.
Triggered abilities? Huh. I guess the other comments were right, anti-eldrazi tech.
Would've been way more interesting if it had demonstrate instead