This is a post WW2 reproduction meant to look like pre WW2.
Since some countries that weren't a thing pre WW2 are put on the map (Pakistan etc.) meanwhile German Africa is gone so...
UK + Ireland are united so it is supposed to look like pre 1922.
USSR is a thing so 1922 fake remake is my guess.
No, it was Tsaritsyn until 1925 (named after the Tsaritsa river, the name is just a simplified and familiar to ear version of Turk name ‘sary-su’, yellow water). By the way, 1925 was the year Lenin died, and most of the anti-monarchy stuff was made before that. The city was renamed to Stalingrad by the name of Stalin who took the place of Lenin after his death. It’s funny that it happened almost 10 years before Stalin’s cult of personality was a thing. It was named Volgograd (after the Volga river) in 1961, 8 years after Stalin’s death as one of the acts of denouncing his cult of personality.
Newfoundland-the-independent-dominion also included Labrador, just didn’t have it as part of the name. Since the border between Labrador and Quebec is the same as shown for other provincial borders, that implies Newfoundland is part of Canada too.
Also, they chose to highlight the cities of Hiroshima and Nagasaki. Why mark those two specifically when you are only marking like 10 cities in japan total.
Well for the same reason the americans chose them. They are big cities.
In fact the have been in the top 10 biggest cities most of the time before the nukes. Why mark the top 10 cities when you only mark 10 cities🤯
There is Poland, so not before WW1. German borders are post WW1, but before WW2. Pakistan wasn't a country before WW2. So it's an inaccurate globe, sorry
It also shows Turkey, which didn't exist before WW1 (adding this because someone claimed that showing Poland could still be compatible with a pre-WW1 ~~map~~ globe).
German East Africa ("Deutsch-Ostafrika") is missing as well.
Also, after 1918, it became Tanganjika, which is marked on the globe. Another indicator that globe is post WW1.
Yeah, it should, as german borders are definitely not post WW2 (GDR is missing).
As all of europe looks a bit sketchy, I guess that's been the best the artist has been capable of.
Here's what Germany really looked like after WW1:
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/41/Karte_des_Deutschen_Reiches%2C_Weimarer_Republik-Drittes_Reich_1919%E2%80%931937.svg
The German borders are post-Anschluss, but pre Sudetenland/Czech takeover (but it’s tough to tell if it’s before or after the Sudetenland was annexed). I would guess the map is from around 1938.
But then as I look more the map appears to be inaccurate. India/Pakistan/Burma are independent which didn’t exist until 1947, so yeah.
Although with this globe the location of a border is far from conclusive. For example the chalkidice peninsula is visibly separate from the rest of Greece and Yugoslavia seems to have access to the Aegean Sea, neither of which happened in any year, so the Danish-German border might be simply bad accuracy (Berlin is suspiciously close to the coast, as yet another example)
It's more likely to be a newer global that hasn't been kept up to date.
Unless it's an older globe that had knowledge of the future. In which case I want to read about that cartographer.
True but Pakistan is the same color as India which is the same as UK so probably the 30s if it is an actual globe since Pakistan was an idea at least by then
That being said still an inaccurate globe, some bad border drawing here for sure
The word Pakistan wasn't even coined until 1933 (as an abbreviation of Panjab, Afghania, Kashmir, Sindh, and Baluchistan). It seems really unlikely this would be on a map printed before partition.
Not really. The German borders are not correct. Königsberg is in Poland according to this map. Must be after Wwi in any case though. But at least the German borders are very vague
yeah, many maps depicted a united germany, sometimes even in the 1937 borders, up until the 70s, due to the Hallstein Doktrin (pretty much one germany policy)
No, I think I solved it: The Ottoman empire is dissolved, so the globe must be from after 1924. Båhuslen/Bohuslän is part of Norway which is independent from Denmark, so it's before 1380. The continents also look different, so I'm pretty sure it's from the Neogene period. That's about as precise an estimate as I can do.
Before the Chinese invasion, Tibet had been a de facto independent state for 40 years. However, it was not recognised as separate from China by the rest of the world. So, a globe made before WW2 would probably not include Tibet.
Pakistan and India as countries did not exist before 1947 and the German map is Germany before wwii beginning in 1939
So it’s a mishmash of incorrect borders and countries
No Ostpreussen. No control of Pomerania/Westpreussen/Posen. Clearly not the borders from either before or after WWI. It's just some made up crap, or maybe a mishmash between pre- and post-WWII German borders.
"The name Pakistan was coined by Choudhry Rahmat Ali, a Pakistan Movement activist, who in January 1933 first published it (originally as "Pakstan") in a pamphlet Now or Never, using it as an acronym.[31] Rahmat Ali explained: "It is composed of letters taken from the names of all our homelands, Indian and Asian, Panjab, Afghania, Kashmir, Sindh, and Baluchistan." He added, "Pakistan is both a Persian and Urdu word... It means the land of the Paks, the spiritually pure and clean."[32] Etymologists note that پاک pāk, is 'pure' in Persian and Pashto[33] and the Persian suffix ـستان -stan means 'land' or 'place of'.[34][35][36][37]"
[from the country's wiki page](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pakistan)
Reading up on it, the Lahore Resolution of 1940 made it the widely accepted name for the region, but was in occasional use between the two events.
>Reading up on it, the Lahore Resolution of 1940 made it the widely accepted name for the region,
Today's Bangladesh is named Pakistan too here, and I don't know any map who'd use that other than in the time between the foundation of the country Pakistan and the foundation of Bangladesh.
Edit: Also, Italy, Austria, and Yugoslavia have the same color and it's been around 1600 years since all three were part of the same empire :D
That's a good find, i didn't see it written on Bangladesh too. I just wanted to give a reason on why someone would write "Pakistan" on a map before it was an independent country.
I was going to add that most maps and globes from Europe between 1900 and 1940's labeled India as the British Raj or British India. Though maps from Asia and Middle East labeled it simply as India. If this was made in the area it would make sense that Europe is either out dated or inaccurate while using the common place terms for India and Pakistan.
You can find more info about this model of globe
Do a Google search for:
"chad valley" "10174"
(Include the quotes)
https://www.worthpoint.com/worthopedia/vintage-1950s-chad-valley-tin-plate-284602617
The map is dogshit. It can't even properly depict borders (look at how Jugoslavia touches the Adriatic!) or seperate countries by colour (yellow all the way from Poland to China?!)
Based upon the listed countries, it's probably *meant* to be 1947-1949, but what it *is* is a steaming pile of poorly printed garbage.
>it's probably *meant* to be 1947-1949
Can't agree with that - Finland-USSR border shown as pre- Finno-Soviet war ("Winter war") of 1939, also "Baltic" states drawn independent and Moldavia as part of Romania and South Sakhalin island colored as part of Japan - so, i would say it meant to show smth. between 1924-1939. Also, there is no [Manchukuo](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manchukuo) on the globe - japanese puppet state created in 1932. So, if author at least tried to depict some actual historic period, it's also before 1932.
Definitely post WW1. There's a lack of German colonies in Africa nad you can see an independent Poland.
I'd say it's somewhere between the treaty of Riga and the Anschluss.
on behalf of u/husumlasse (OP):
[https://imgur.com/a/gWvvoIn](https://imgur.com/a/gWvvoIn)
OP is not able to post images through their application right now, so I am posting on their behalf.
The inscription on the stem (?) of the globe reads:
"BY APPOINTMENT TOY MAKERS TO HER MAJESTY QUEEN ELIZABETH THE QUEEN MOTHER THE CHAD VALLEY CO. LTD. HARBORNE, ENGLAND
NO. 10174"
It wouldn't surprise me if it was made a bit later than that - its construction looks quite a bit like a globe I had as a child in the 80's; some kind of cheap steel (maybe pressed into shape?), as do the colours and the quality of the printing.
As the other replies have indicated the borders are anachronistic and don't match up with any specific period, so I wouldn't be surprised if it wasn't even intended to be accurate but just a representation of "bygone borders".
Same globe, same serial number:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/325138827850?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0&ssspo=toWEPz1_Q8m&sssrc=4429486&ssuid=FX-1ScOeTv6&var=&widget_ver=artemis&media=MORE
Chad valley co is owned by Sainsbury’s: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chad_Valley_(toy_brand)
It seems to be the same as this globe: https://www.ebay.com/itm/194642031727
Absolutely not. The idea of Pakistan as a country was thought of in 1934 and came into existence in 1947. Pakistan didn't exist till 1947.
And there are many such mistakes here.
It can't be that old, considering Saudi Arabia is there. Sometime in the 1930s, perhaps?
Edit: The boundary of Paraguay looks like it might have been from after the Chaco war.
Edit 2: Germany being undivided but India being partitioned would place this between 1947 and 1949, although it's a bit inconsistent because Germany's border with Poland wouldn't look like that.
The Burma Rd is labeled which was built in 1937-1938 during the Sino-Japanese war. The name Pakistan existed since 1933 long before independence in 1947. It goes with the map makers theme of labeling distinct regions in a country like what it did with Mongolia and Tibet in China.
The name Pakistan appeared in a pamphlet in 1933; that is not widespread or official use and the name was not intended for what is now Bangladesh, which is labelled Pakistan on this globe. The borders of Pakistan were created for the partition in 1947; it is not very distinct in these photos and the globe's been drawn a bit wonkily, but there is a border there.
i’m gonna disagree with some commenters here in that this map isn’t *total* bullshit. If I were to guess it was probably made in that weird post war period between 1946-1947 when india was gaining independence and germany and polands borders were not finally settled yet.
Nah, it’s probably a cheap toy/replica globe made from a mash-up of early 1920s and late 1940s maps. The manufacturer likely didn’t care about the accuracy much (seriously those borders, both political and physical geography-wise, are rubbish). Most of the political geography is early 1920s with some post WW2 (but colonial era) anachronisms. It’s like a freehand drawn version of a bunch of early 20th century maps done cheaply. Could be a recent fake antique thing or an older cheap map done overseas by someone who barely grasped English.
Well... Oslo was named Oslo on January 1st 1925. So no chance that this item was manufactured "before WW1". It should read Christiania if so.
The globe seems to just be some kind of cheap trinket from one of those shops that sell items that are supposed to look old/vintage, but are new. Gonna bet that metal foot is made of aluminum. Just look at the sloppy hand drawn coastal lines and borders, inconsistent use of letter capitalization on countries, capital cities, major cities, etc. Did a kid draw this map? Hmm...
EDIT: lol it's apparently a toy globe from the 50ies. That explains why it looks they way it does
Italy had complete control of Somaliland from 1927-1941. A lot of now-countries are listed here but their colors suggest that they are just named regions, however Finland appears to still be a region of Russia,despite it being independent since 1918, bunch of inaccuracies, it’s likely a cheap old-looking product
[xkcd](https://xkcd.com/1688/large/) says it's 52-53. It's before the independence of Cambodia (1953) and after the unification of Italian Eritrea with Ethiopia (Abysinnia) in 1952
Lmao I love people arguing in the comments about the XKCD chart, the XKCD chart assumes the globe reflects temporal reality, the globe does not by any extent of the word, the so chart is useless
What's the story behind your globe?
I have one that is very identical in a lot of ways. Even the base of your globe looks similar to mine as well. I got it from my great grandfather back in the 90's when I was maybe 10 years old and he had had it in his basement for a really long time and it wasn't until I was older that I had studied history and thought it might be incredibly special. He passed in 2013 and was 102 when he left us. He was born in England and moved to Canada in the 20's. Only went back to the England during WW2 and stayed in Canada the rest of his life after that and I'm assuming he bought the globe while he was in England during the war. Photos in the link.
https://imgur.com/gallery/qdwU1Gv
Even if it's not that old, it was a present from my great grandfather so it's special either way and it was nice to see your globe as well! Thanks for sharing!
It has massive border mistakes, but it's certainly post 1924 (Petrograd was renamed to Leningrad after Lening died in 1924), and before 1938 as the borders of Germany still include Silesia but don't include Austria. Romania also seems to have not lost territories to Hungary and the Soviets yet (as it did in 1938-39) but that could just be another border mistake by the globe maker like the incomprehensible borders depicted in the southern Balkans...
1. Turkey exists, so past WW1
2. Germany has east Prussia so before the end of WW2
3. The Soviet Union has the Baltics, so either before the invasion during WW2 or before the independence after WW1.
4. Leningrad was renamed in 1924, which was after estonias independence during the Russian civil war, so after its annexation during ww2
5. the Soviet unions owns latvia, but not Estonia.
That means it likely was made between 3rd and 5th august of 1940
Unfortunately my friend, the existence of Yugoslavia puts this globe no earlier than 1929
Edit: after reading the comments, it's no wonder I was having trouble pinning down the time period lol
Petrograd is named Leningrad which happened after Lenins death in 1924, so it has to be after that.
Also Persia has changed its name to Iran which happened in 1935, germany did not yet annex the Austria, so before 1938.
India and Pakistan are already decolonised and divided which happened in 1947.
At the same time Germany is not divided(1945), and stills has all of its eastern parts except east prussia and the Memel.
In conclusion, I would say that this globe doesnt make any sense at all, because the borders of the world never looked like this.
Definitely not WW1 era since no German Colonies and Germany doesn't have Ost Preussen. Also the borders look awful, it looks like a post WW2 thing though, dunno why Korea is unified either and judging by the color still under Japanese control, but they don't have Manchuria? idk this map is a mess. Britain still owns Ireland? Like idk this map is bad, really bad.
I didn’t thankfully. But do you have more information about the globe? Like when was it produced or something like that?
I’m also pretty sure that it was made in Britain. I found and inscription on it that says that it was made by appointment of queen elizabeth the queen mother.
Go back to where you got this piece of crap and demand a refund AND compensation for having to look at those poorly drawn borders that aren't even depicting any actual point in time.
This is like Post WWII, but before Israel, right around 1945 maybe near the end of the war as its showing poland as part of the ussr, before Germany was divided, before Israel was a thing, but while they still called Ethiopia Abyssinia.
In my opinion it looks like 1934
Before Libya border change in 1934/35
After the Saudi conquest of Hejaz 1925 and the Saudi-Yemen war in 1934
Independent Ethiopia before 1936
But this map has huge errors like incorrect border in Africa, no Sultanate of Aussa(what exists until 1937 Italy Annexation) or existence of Pakistan what exists after WWII...
This is a post WW2 reproduction meant to look like pre WW2. Since some countries that weren't a thing pre WW2 are put on the map (Pakistan etc.) meanwhile German Africa is gone so... UK + Ireland are united so it is supposed to look like pre 1922. USSR is a thing so 1922 fake remake is my guess.
Tsaritsyn was renamed Stalingrad in 1925, but of course, it’s not the biggest problem of this map
Also Leningrad in '24
Also Desterro in Brazil became Florianópolis in 1894
Didn't know that. I presume they then changed it to Volgograd to avoid association with the old Tsars.
No, it was Tsaritsyn until 1925 (named after the Tsaritsa river, the name is just a simplified and familiar to ear version of Turk name ‘sary-su’, yellow water). By the way, 1925 was the year Lenin died, and most of the anti-monarchy stuff was made before that. The city was renamed to Stalingrad by the name of Stalin who took the place of Lenin after his death. It’s funny that it happened almost 10 years before Stalin’s cult of personality was a thing. It was named Volgograd (after the Volga river) in 1961, 8 years after Stalin’s death as one of the acts of denouncing his cult of personality.
Not to mention that Newfoundland appears to be united with Canada, which would make it post-1949
Where do you see Newfoundland? I only see as far as Labrador.
Newfoundland-the-independent-dominion also included Labrador, just didn’t have it as part of the name. Since the border between Labrador and Quebec is the same as shown for other provincial borders, that implies Newfoundland is part of Canada too.
it’s the kind of map that would happen if you told an AI generator to create an antique globe* map (typo edit)
Has AI gotten better at fingers/hands?
Depends on how long back we look. It's definitely better than it was last year. Honestly ai advances at a very high rate
No
And the southern African setup is dated post WW2 pre 1960!
And isn't this Israel on the map? Which would put this map to be made post WW2 an possibly end 40's/ beginning 50's
Also, they chose to highlight the cities of Hiroshima and Nagasaki. Why mark those two specifically when you are only marking like 10 cities in japan total.
Well for the same reason the americans chose them. They are big cities. In fact the have been in the top 10 biggest cities most of the time before the nukes. Why mark the top 10 cities when you only mark 10 cities🤯
There was no German Africa pre WW2 (only pre WW1)
I was came here to say the same. India/Pakistan is post 1947
There is Poland, so not before WW1. German borders are post WW1, but before WW2. Pakistan wasn't a country before WW2. So it's an inaccurate globe, sorry
It also shows Turkey, which didn't exist before WW1 (adding this because someone claimed that showing Poland could still be compatible with a pre-WW1 ~~map~~ globe).
Also no German colonies in Africa
SW Africa is German sw africa, but Cameroon would’ve been German before ww1
German East Africa ("Deutsch-Ostafrika") is missing as well. Also, after 1918, it became Tanganjika, which is marked on the globe. Another indicator that globe is post WW1.
I would think Prussia should be on the map.
Yeah, it should, as german borders are definitely not post WW2 (GDR is missing). As all of europe looks a bit sketchy, I guess that's been the best the artist has been capable of. Here's what Germany really looked like after WW1: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/41/Karte_des_Deutschen_Reiches%2C_Weimarer_Republik-Drittes_Reich_1919%E2%80%931937.svg
The German borders are post-Anschluss, but pre Sudetenland/Czech takeover (but it’s tough to tell if it’s before or after the Sudetenland was annexed). I would guess the map is from around 1938. But then as I look more the map appears to be inaccurate. India/Pakistan/Burma are independent which didn’t exist until 1947, so yeah.
No, South West Africa is the name for the South African administration of the area post WW1 https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/South_West_Africa
Oh yeah, the coloring there is kinda goofy
Saoudi Arabia was mbt Saoudi Arabia before like 1928-1932.
And did it ever really go to the end of the peninsula? Oman looks pretty weird over there...
Also shows Saudi Arabia which didn't exist before 1932
Also has Hatay in Turkey which didn’t happen before 1939.
has soviet union on it as well so has to be after 1922
No Northern Ireland though so pre-1921. This globe doesn't make any sense.
yea danish german border is pre 1920. Id guess its somewhere around that time period and someone not super updated on matters of borders made it.
Pakistan was formed in 1947, so after that lol. This globe makes no sense.
Likely a globe made to look like an antique for the sake of novelty.
Someone who lived in Pakistan/India in 1948 and only had an old map from 1922 for reference while making this ... clearly.
Although with this globe the location of a border is far from conclusive. For example the chalkidice peninsula is visibly separate from the rest of Greece and Yugoslavia seems to have access to the Aegean Sea, neither of which happened in any year, so the Danish-German border might be simply bad accuracy (Berlin is suspiciously close to the coast, as yet another example)
I'm leaning more towards something made much later just to look old for a desk bauble. '50s or '60s at the earliest.
It's more likely to be a newer global that hasn't been kept up to date. Unless it's an older globe that had knowledge of the future. In which case I want to read about that cartographer.
Ireland looks good without the border
And St. Petersburg didn't become Leningrad until 1924.
But it was Petrograd 1914-1924.
Yet Finland is part of Russia, so prior to 1917/1918. Edit: ah, maybe Finland is separate, even though in same colournas Russia.
yea think finland has a border. I just noticed Danish german border is pre 1920 though.
and Leningrad was only renamed in 1924
Has to be after 1929 since Yugoslavia is called yugoslavia and not SHS
I was suspicious given how inaccurate the landmasses are. It’s like an 18th century map with 20th century states on it.
Which means it was probably made in the 90s to sell at some chintzy home goods shop as a "vintage globe"
Maybe they took like 30 years to finish drawing it?
“Dude, that country’s name changed. You mind starting over?” “Ahhhh, fiddlesticks.”
Yugoslavia is also on the board which means it has to be after WW1
Biggest (by size) issue to show it isn’t pre-WWI is the existence of the Soviet Union which was only formed during WW1.
thailand changed names in 39 tho. it says both names it wouldn't have said thailand pre ww1
Poland actually was often show on pre ww1 maps, since it was technically not part of Russia, but a kingdom under the russian monarch
Only on early ones, but following some years since the partition, it was no longer generally shown
But the globe is showing soviet union, not russia
It shows USSR, so that wouldn't stand. And it also has Czechoslovakia, so whatever
True but Pakistan is the same color as India which is the same as UK so probably the 30s if it is an actual globe since Pakistan was an idea at least by then That being said still an inaccurate globe, some bad border drawing here for sure
also turkey controlls hatay already which didnt happen until like ww2
The word Pakistan wasn't even coined until 1933 (as an abbreviation of Panjab, Afghania, Kashmir, Sindh, and Baluchistan). It seems really unlikely this would be on a map printed before partition.
Not really. The German borders are not correct. Königsberg is in Poland according to this map. Must be after Wwi in any case though. But at least the German borders are very vague
Then he found a globe from a different timeline, even rarer!
It's a bullshit globe. It doesn't fit any period globally. Sorry
yes total bullshit this globe is.
Spoken Yoda has
Goddammit op
This globe is *BULLCREP*!
Bullshit globes can still come from a certain period
yeah, many maps depicted a united germany, sometimes even in the 1937 borders, up until the 70s, due to the Hallstein Doktrin (pretty much one germany policy)
Well sure, but this could have been made last week by somebody attempting to put out old globes.
It'd guess around 1950
You are technically correct (while completely missing the point). Which is the worst kind of correct.
Yep and borders are all wrong/missing. For example, the island of New Guinea has no borders marked.
No, I think I solved it: The Ottoman empire is dissolved, so the globe must be from after 1924. Båhuslen/Bohuslän is part of Norway which is independent from Denmark, so it's before 1380. The continents also look different, so I'm pretty sure it's from the Neogene period. That's about as precise an estimate as I can do.
Tibet is also part of China here.. which didn't happen until after WW2
Before the Chinese invasion, Tibet had been a de facto independent state for 40 years. However, it was not recognised as separate from China by the rest of the world. So, a globe made before WW2 would probably not include Tibet.
Wasn’t it still de jure part of China?
Pakistan and India as countries did not exist before 1947 and the German map is Germany before wwii beginning in 1939 So it’s a mishmash of incorrect borders and countries
No Ostpreussen. No control of Pomerania/Westpreussen/Posen. Clearly not the borders from either before or after WWI. It's just some made up crap, or maybe a mishmash between pre- and post-WWII German borders.
Also Kalingrad isn't marked as German but the baltics are independent and Japan has Korea and Taiwan.
Both East and West Pakistan are simply labeled "Pakistan", so this is definitely post-partition.
but Germany also owns Czechia. I think between the two factors it's just a map that has several periods. Might've been for a game or something
Pakistan and India are the same colour, so I believe they're meant to be one country.
Pakistan was a construct created in 1947. It was carved out of India as a Muslim fundamentalist Indian nation state
"The name Pakistan was coined by Choudhry Rahmat Ali, a Pakistan Movement activist, who in January 1933 first published it (originally as "Pakstan") in a pamphlet Now or Never, using it as an acronym.[31] Rahmat Ali explained: "It is composed of letters taken from the names of all our homelands, Indian and Asian, Panjab, Afghania, Kashmir, Sindh, and Baluchistan." He added, "Pakistan is both a Persian and Urdu word... It means the land of the Paks, the spiritually pure and clean."[32] Etymologists note that پاک pāk, is 'pure' in Persian and Pashto[33] and the Persian suffix ـستان -stan means 'land' or 'place of'.[34][35][36][37]" [from the country's wiki page](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pakistan) Reading up on it, the Lahore Resolution of 1940 made it the widely accepted name for the region, but was in occasional use between the two events.
>Reading up on it, the Lahore Resolution of 1940 made it the widely accepted name for the region, Today's Bangladesh is named Pakistan too here, and I don't know any map who'd use that other than in the time between the foundation of the country Pakistan and the foundation of Bangladesh. Edit: Also, Italy, Austria, and Yugoslavia have the same color and it's been around 1600 years since all three were part of the same empire :D
That's a good find, i didn't see it written on Bangladesh too. I just wanted to give a reason on why someone would write "Pakistan" on a map before it was an independent country.
I was going to add that most maps and globes from Europe between 1900 and 1940's labeled India as the British Raj or British India. Though maps from Asia and Middle East labeled it simply as India. If this was made in the area it would make sense that Europe is either out dated or inaccurate while using the common place terms for India and Pakistan.
It’s very possible you bought a globe made recently that’s trying to pass itself off as antique
This. Exactly.
You can find more info about this model of globe Do a Google search for: "chad valley" "10174" (Include the quotes) https://www.worthpoint.com/worthopedia/vintage-1950s-chad-valley-tin-plate-284602617
Interesting, seems like it was made for children I'm the 50s and I guess they didn't care too much about the details!
Im really impressed with peoples ability to find this shit on reddit. Congrats man
Not to recently, this definitely looks like a 50's era item to me.
It's clearly a fake one. Shows both Pakistan, that means after 1947 but a unified Korea which means pre 1945. That shouldn't exist
Shortly after WW2 Korea was often depicted as united country. Even nowadays North and South dejure dont recognize each other
The map is dogshit. It can't even properly depict borders (look at how Jugoslavia touches the Adriatic!) or seperate countries by colour (yellow all the way from Poland to China?!) Based upon the listed countries, it's probably *meant* to be 1947-1949, but what it *is* is a steaming pile of poorly printed garbage.
Taiwan was still in Japan's rule, so it should be b4 WW2
>it's probably *meant* to be 1947-1949 Can't agree with that - Finland-USSR border shown as pre- Finno-Soviet war ("Winter war") of 1939, also "Baltic" states drawn independent and Moldavia as part of Romania and South Sakhalin island colored as part of Japan - so, i would say it meant to show smth. between 1924-1939. Also, there is no [Manchukuo](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manchukuo) on the globe - japanese puppet state created in 1932. So, if author at least tried to depict some actual historic period, it's also before 1932.
>yellow all the way from Poland to China Jak powiedział stary góral, Polska będzie aż po Ural, Za Uralem będą Chiny, Was nie będzie, skurwysyny
The existence of Syria and Iraq imply that it dates after WW1
As well as Yugoslavia
And the Soviet Union
And Thailand
And my Axe
Same as Turkey [instead](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ottoman_Empire) of the Ottoman Empire
Yeah, but some people (including contemporary writers and historians) also called it either "the Turkish empire" or just "Turkey".
Yes but Ottoman Empire never had those borders specifically
And USSR
Saint Petersburg was renamed Leningrad following Lenin’s death in 1924, so after that.
But there is no independent Ireland, what happened in 1921.
The whole thing is a complete mess and highly inaccurate!
Definitely post WW1. There's a lack of German colonies in Africa nad you can see an independent Poland. I'd say it's somewhere between the treaty of Riga and the Anschluss.
I don't know, what about Pakistan? That wasn't a concept til 1949, so I believe this must be a miss-mash of different timelines.
Oh ye, didn't notice that.
on behalf of u/husumlasse (OP): [https://imgur.com/a/gWvvoIn](https://imgur.com/a/gWvvoIn) OP is not able to post images through their application right now, so I am posting on their behalf. The inscription on the stem (?) of the globe reads: "BY APPOINTMENT TOY MAKERS TO HER MAJESTY QUEEN ELIZABETH THE QUEEN MOTHER THE CHAD VALLEY CO. LTD. HARBORNE, ENGLAND NO. 10174"
The term, Queen Mother for Queen Elizabeth II's mom started in 1952
It wouldn't surprise me if it was made a bit later than that - its construction looks quite a bit like a globe I had as a child in the 80's; some kind of cheap steel (maybe pressed into shape?), as do the colours and the quality of the printing. As the other replies have indicated the borders are anachronistic and don't match up with any specific period, so I wouldn't be surprised if it wasn't even intended to be accurate but just a representation of "bygone borders".
Same globe, same serial number: https://www.ebay.com/itm/325138827850?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0&ssspo=toWEPz1_Q8m&sssrc=4429486&ssuid=FX-1ScOeTv6&var=&widget_ver=artemis&media=MORE
Absolutely fuckin hilarious that that globe is more rust than not and then they also use a rusty ass measuring tape 🤣
Chad valley co is owned by Sainsbury’s: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chad_Valley_(toy_brand) It seems to be the same as this globe: https://www.ebay.com/itm/194642031727
Persia > Iran happened 1935. I'd say around 35-37.
Absolutely not. The idea of Pakistan as a country was thought of in 1934 and came into existence in 1947. Pakistan didn't exist till 1947. And there are many such mistakes here.
It can't be that old, considering Saudi Arabia is there. Sometime in the 1930s, perhaps? Edit: The boundary of Paraguay looks like it might have been from after the Chaco war. Edit 2: Germany being undivided but India being partitioned would place this between 1947 and 1949, although it's a bit inconsistent because Germany's border with Poland wouldn't look like that.
The Burma Rd is labeled which was built in 1937-1938 during the Sino-Japanese war. The name Pakistan existed since 1933 long before independence in 1947. It goes with the map makers theme of labeling distinct regions in a country like what it did with Mongolia and Tibet in China.
The name Pakistan appeared in a pamphlet in 1933; that is not widespread or official use and the name was not intended for what is now Bangladesh, which is labelled Pakistan on this globe. The borders of Pakistan were created for the partition in 1947; it is not very distinct in these photos and the globe's been drawn a bit wonkily, but there is a border there.
There is no Kuwait or Trucal States (UAE). Kuwait has been around since the 19th century and was a British protectorate starting in the 1890s.
i’m gonna disagree with some commenters here in that this map isn’t *total* bullshit. If I were to guess it was probably made in that weird post war period between 1946-1947 when india was gaining independence and germany and polands borders were not finally settled yet.
Nah, it’s probably a cheap toy/replica globe made from a mash-up of early 1920s and late 1940s maps. The manufacturer likely didn’t care about the accuracy much (seriously those borders, both political and physical geography-wise, are rubbish). Most of the political geography is early 1920s with some post WW2 (but colonial era) anachronisms. It’s like a freehand drawn version of a bunch of early 20th century maps done cheaply. Could be a recent fake antique thing or an older cheap map done overseas by someone who barely grasped English.
[удалено]
I don’t feel scammed, it cost less than 5 dollars. But even if it isn’t an accurate map, isn’t it still a cool ( probably old) piece of history?
Here’s map dating fun, courtesy of XKCD: https://xkcd.com/1688/large/
Old sure, but 1970s old, not 1910s.
I think it's cool. Don't let these people ruin your fun. Even if its not 100% correct it still has some story of it's own.
Norway has the area bohuslan in this map, which they lost to the swedes in 1658. I'm sorry, but the map is incorrect.
Not to mention that the coastline of Norway looks like it was drawn from memory by a five-year-old.
Oh my what happened there
Well... Oslo was named Oslo on January 1st 1925. So no chance that this item was manufactured "before WW1". It should read Christiania if so. The globe seems to just be some kind of cheap trinket from one of those shops that sell items that are supposed to look old/vintage, but are new. Gonna bet that metal foot is made of aluminum. Just look at the sloppy hand drawn coastal lines and borders, inconsistent use of letter capitalization on countries, capital cities, major cities, etc. Did a kid draw this map? Hmm... EDIT: lol it's apparently a toy globe from the 50ies. That explains why it looks they way it does
Italy had complete control of Somaliland from 1927-1941. A lot of now-countries are listed here but their colors suggest that they are just named regions, however Finland appears to still be a region of Russia,despite it being independent since 1918, bunch of inaccuracies, it’s likely a cheap old-looking product
Kind of a mismatch. At least after 1960. Probably a 1990 fake globe
[xkcd](https://xkcd.com/1688/large/) says it's 52-53. It's before the independence of Cambodia (1953) and after the unification of Italian Eritrea with Ethiopia (Abysinnia) in 1952
Lmao I love people arguing in the comments about the XKCD chart, the XKCD chart assumes the globe reflects temporal reality, the globe does not by any extent of the word, the so chart is useless
Hoped somebody had referenced xkcd, that would've been my first point of reference too.
What's the story behind your globe? I have one that is very identical in a lot of ways. Even the base of your globe looks similar to mine as well. I got it from my great grandfather back in the 90's when I was maybe 10 years old and he had had it in his basement for a really long time and it wasn't until I was older that I had studied history and thought it might be incredibly special. He passed in 2013 and was 102 when he left us. He was born in England and moved to Canada in the 20's. Only went back to the England during WW2 and stayed in Canada the rest of his life after that and I'm assuming he bought the globe while he was in England during the war. Photos in the link. https://imgur.com/gallery/qdwU1Gv Even if it's not that old, it was a present from my great grandfather so it's special either way and it was nice to see your globe as well! Thanks for sharing!
Czechoslovakia in this shape existed only between WW1 and WW2.
It has massive border mistakes, but it's certainly post 1924 (Petrograd was renamed to Leningrad after Lening died in 1924), and before 1938 as the borders of Germany still include Silesia but don't include Austria. Romania also seems to have not lost territories to Hungary and the Soviets yet (as it did in 1938-39) but that could just be another border mistake by the globe maker like the incomprehensible borders depicted in the southern Balkans...
He definitely meant before WW2, like before Germany annexed Austria. He lied
This globe is wildly inaccurate, with different times for different things. I'd guess post WW2 but it's hard to say.
USSR and Yugoslavia say it's after 1922. I say before WW2.
I also see that "Turkey" is named on the map, even though the Ottoman Empire was still around before WWI
Shit globe as France has Cameroon but not Alsace moselle
The closest time frame I can think of is somewhere 1920s-1930s
Nothing matches up. It’s a fake made to look old. Made in China. Enjoy it for what it is.
Bangladesh labeled as pakistan and borders not defined? I would say around 1947 to 50, might be before 71 but thy would know the borders in 23 years.
It is not before WW1, the Soviet Union exists on this map
You got scammed mate
Yugoslavia somehow cuts Greece in half? Someone had too much fun drawing the balkans.
1. Turkey exists, so past WW1 2. Germany has east Prussia so before the end of WW2 3. The Soviet Union has the Baltics, so either before the invasion during WW2 or before the independence after WW1. 4. Leningrad was renamed in 1924, which was after estonias independence during the Russian civil war, so after its annexation during ww2 5. the Soviet unions owns latvia, but not Estonia. That means it likely was made between 3rd and 5th august of 1940
OP bought a globe from homesense that was passed off as being old. It’s just printed to make it look that eay
Unfortunately my friend, the existence of Yugoslavia puts this globe no earlier than 1929 Edit: after reading the comments, it's no wonder I was having trouble pinning down the time period lol
Petrograd is named Leningrad which happened after Lenins death in 1924, so it has to be after that. Also Persia has changed its name to Iran which happened in 1935, germany did not yet annex the Austria, so before 1938. India and Pakistan are already decolonised and divided which happened in 1947. At the same time Germany is not divided(1945), and stills has all of its eastern parts except east prussia and the Memel. In conclusion, I would say that this globe doesnt make any sense at all, because the borders of the world never looked like this.
The globe shows Yugoslavia, the Soviet Union, Czechoslovakia and Italian Libya. Neither of those existed pre ww1
Going on the map of Papua New Guinea alone, post 1920. Prior to WWI part of New Guinea was a German colony.
Thailand changed names in 39 though it says both names it would not have said Thailand pre ww1
No, it's after ww1 and maybe before ww2. Could be after like 1947.
There is Pakistan and East Pakistan(Now Bangladesh) so it is of somewhere between 1947 and 1971.
There is yugoslavia, so not before WW1.
"Leningrad" so it cannot be pre-1914
Can’t be before WW1 with the USSR there.
Post WWII just because of Pakistan
How the fuck he thinks it can be before ww1 Ottomans are not there lol. Come on man..
The Denmark-German border is pre-1920. Istanbul is mentioned, but wasn’t called so until 1930.
[Map age flowchart](https://www.reddit.com/r/MapPorn/s/IRc1ba6c4p)
USSR happened at the end of WWII.
It’s not, but it is also just wrong about a lot of things. It looks like it’s trying to imitate an old globe maybe?
after wwi before wwii
Weird mix of ww1 and post war Italian Libya borders. This isn’t genuine sadly, you got scammed.
India and Pakistan happened in 1947.
Austria-Hungary is broken up and the Ottoman Empire is gone, so def not pre WW1.
It kinda looks like the USSR is on there and that's post ww1
Norway has Bohuslän, which is now in Sweden. It was within Norway from 1050 to 1658. But fake, as other comments mentions.
Definitely not WW1 era since no German Colonies and Germany doesn't have Ost Preussen. Also the borders look awful, it looks like a post WW2 thing though, dunno why Korea is unified either and judging by the color still under Japanese control, but they don't have Manchuria? idk this map is a mess. Britain still owns Ireland? Like idk this map is bad, really bad.
Surely after 1947, as Pakistan was created in 1947.
It's a vintage globe produced in a mysterious factory in Guangdong, P.R.C. probably. Sorry, OP, if you paid more than $10 you got scammed big.
I didn’t thankfully. But do you have more information about the globe? Like when was it produced or something like that? I’m also pretty sure that it was made in Britain. I found and inscription on it that says that it was made by appointment of queen elizabeth the queen mother.
It’s probably from Home Goods
Go back to where you got this piece of crap and demand a refund AND compensation for having to look at those poorly drawn borders that aren't even depicting any actual point in time.
I’d say around the 1920s. South Africa/ British empire didn’t control Namibia until after WW1.
This is like Post WWII, but before Israel, right around 1945 maybe near the end of the war as its showing poland as part of the ussr, before Germany was divided, before Israel was a thing, but while they still called Ethiopia Abyssinia.
/r/datemymap
By the name transjorden I can say its after 1922 and before 1946
In my opinion it looks like 1934 Before Libya border change in 1934/35 After the Saudi conquest of Hejaz 1925 and the Saudi-Yemen war in 1934 Independent Ethiopia before 1936 But this map has huge errors like incorrect border in Africa, no Sultanate of Aussa(what exists until 1937 Italy Annexation) or existence of Pakistan what exists after WWII...
It is one of the most incorrect globes i have seen, and i have seen around 28
Tanganyika 1876 first know by British travellers, independence in 1961. 1922 first legal date created.
Between WW1 and WW2