Remember everyone, the people pushing the “Biden must drop out” narrative the hardest are… conservatives.
https://www.reddit.com/r/bestof/comments/1duha5c/umake_us_good_again_shows_who_is_pushing_the/
If they think Biden is so weak, why would they push so hard to get him to drop out? Unless of course, they realize he has the best shot of beating Trump.
Which he does.
Or, that's just normal narative to make Biden look like a weak candidate so of course conservatives are saying that.
And he is a weak candidate. If he wins, he'll win off of the anti-trump vote only.
That's nice and all. But he doesn't look like he'll survive 4 more years as president. If you wouldn't trust someone with that much mental decline to be your doctor, as no one should, why should we elect him again? He has to reside over what is likely to be the most civil unrest we've ever had IF he wins. And I don't trust run a Walgreens with his mental decline. It's not JUST beating Trump in the election. Now we have to get serious about pulling the weeds of rebellion out of our country.
Well, there's a limit to that analogy. Doctors often work independently, especially in the scenario in your analogy. Presidents, on the other hand, have a whole team around them.
A key reason the Biden administration has been so successful in helping average Americans (as opposed to benefiting only the extremely wealthy) is because of his excellent team. Biden has already provided the direction and assembled the team. That will continue even *IF* Biden declines.
Of course, another part of the plan could be for Biden to get re-elected and then at some point during his next term step down so Harris can be the first woman president. She wouldn't necessarily be my first choice for first woman president, but she's far, far better than any Republican president. She would also likely keep going in the same direction Biden set since it had been so successful.
[CNN](https://www.vox.com/2022/8/26/23322761/cnn-john-malone-david-zaslav-chris-licht-brian-stelter-fox-peter-kafka-column), yeah.
CNN of today isn't your Gulf War 1 CNN
DNC rules! Amusing. The DNC that argued in court it, as a private corp, has no obligation to fundamental fairness?
“We could have voluntarily decided that, look, we’re gonna go into the back rooms like they used to and smoke cigars and pick the candidate that way,” he told the court. “And that would have also been their right.”
[https://inthesetimes.com/article/in-its-defense-against-fraud-suit-from-bernie-supporters-the-dnc-just-dug-i](https://inthesetimes.com/article/in-its-defense-against-fraud-suit-from-bernie-supporters-the-dnc-just-dug-i)
This is the point I was going to make. All of this could have been avoided if we had an actual primary and got to decide whether or not Biden would be the man for another 4 years. I realize that the way things happened is normal for Presidents seeking reelection but there's a reason why so many Democrats just wish we had another choice
If you dont think the DNC didnt threaten anyone who wanted to challenge him...all the while hiding his deteriorating mental condition. If trump wins MMW then ..everyone on reddit will pretend they wanted him replaced before the election
To be fair, there wasn't really much of a choice in the primaries. It was him, and one congressman noone had ever heard of and whom the party gave no support. And the guy with a worm in his brain.
It was more of a coronation than a contested primary.
I don’t know about everyone else, but I didn’t get a big feeling of “choice” in the 2024 Dem primary. In fact, many states didn’t hold primaries at all. It’s the party bigwigs and the donors who really decide. In polls, large majorities say they want someone else.
Harris should stay as VP. That will give the new campaign access to the money Biden/Harris has raised, which is considerable. Harris should not be the nominee for the top spot, because the simple fact is, the more people hear from her, the less they like her. She’s cringey, condescending and insincere (even for a politician). She’ll be seen as the “identity politics” choice, and she’ll have all the baggage of Biden’s term to drag around.
If you’re thinking she would make a good choice, go on YouTube and watch her “skit” on the BET awards. Then go check out her awful record on politicking, prosecution and for-profit prisons.
Wow, you guys arent even trying to word it as a mmw anymore lol.
I'm glad you guys started being honest about how you hijacked this sub for gratuitous and desperate political circle jerking.
I hope your self righteous crusade goes well.
She is the one to assume either the Presidency or the nomination. An open convention could be a disaster...just the thought of replacing Harris, and losing a large percentage of voters should give us all pause. This may be on Joe's mind. He could secure the nomination and then retire. She would become Prez for a few months, and would (I think) simply be named the successor to the nomination as well. It's at least semi-important that the campaign cash on hand is for Biden/Harris, not Newsom or Whitmer. Harris gets use of the cash.
I’m going to respectfully disagree on a couple of points.
Does it look good to “pass over” a black woman and pick someone else? No, but anyone who cares about that is already voting blue. Plus, part of the problem voters have with both parties right now is that the candidates are always inevitable and seemingly pre-selected. A big, loud and even ugly battle for the nomination leading to a chaotic but exciting convention might be more good than harm.
The convention is going to be a shitshow no matter what happens- Gaza protesters are going to do their best to disrupt it, and the establishment trying to tamp down dissent is going to look bad, like in 2016z. Honestly I’d rather see the party embrace their differences than try to shove decisions down our throats again. The people were trying to bring over are mostly favoring Trump right now - they’re ok with a bit of chaos.
Heritage Foundation is already readying legal challenges to keep him on the ballot in swing states.
There are rules where only he and Kamala have access to the campaign funds donated to him.
There would be 4 months to raise funds AND awareness of anyone else.
There are way more obstacles to this than the quixotic Just That Simple get a new nominee that people are not thinking of.
One thing I would also like to point out is that a lot of the initial calls for replacing Biden are being echoed on Fox News.
I've been alive for quite some time and recall before Fox News was even a big thing. Pretty much never in their time on air has Fox News ever supported anything that was Pro will of the people or democracy. Or good for the US. And since 2015, they are pretty much just an extension of Russian propaganda
So for the people who lean left saying Biden should withdraw, remember that this is the message being given by Fox News. And I am saying this considering that I would love Pete buttigieg to just fucking take the mantle because running a veteran who has successfully run his Department and is a policy nerd would be the absolute fucking tits
Also remember that he has accomplished quite a bit while in office despite opposition and if he dies the worst thing that would happen is we would have Kamala. If we run a candidate against the Precedence and make the risky choice of switching him out, it is essentially the end of democracy as we know what thanks to agenda 47 and the project 2025 that it parrots.
Fox News says what benefits the Republican Party.
If Biden does get replaced, it makes the Republican Party look strong because Fox News has said that needed to happen and the Democratic Party agreed. If Biden does not get replaced, then it makes the Democratic Party look weak by reinforcing the idea that they are running a demented old man. So saying Biden needs to be replaced is a win-win for them. That doesn’t necessarily mean it isn’t true that he needs to be replaced, though.
Isn't this somewhat lying not relevant? It wouldn't change the fact that if he died we'd be sitting in the same situation no? Then it pretty much has to happen IE this seems more like an assumption than a fact.
Dont think it really nullifies people vote. If someone drops out it's not like the voters can force them to stay in. That's why it would be a mess and likely very contentious if it happened at the convention.
Not to open a can of worms, but the super delegates *might* be able to impact the selection of a nominee—but I think they should respect the will of the voters.
I wasn't allowed to participate in the primary here because I'm not a party member. Even if I could, I'd only have my pick of whomever a private political organization got the most funding from.
The primary with no debates and where lots of states only had one guy on the ballot. This is such a disingenuous argument, that wasn't a real primary.
The only people who voted in that primary are people who will be voting for and democrat as long as they're running against trump. So honestly, who cares if they get pissed off?
I think it’s too late in the game to change horses willingly, but if it can’t race, and drops out, I’d sure like there to be a backup warmed up.
And if he passed, it would “nullify” primary votes too.
Yes you can. It's the same approach as if the Dem candidate died right now. What would you do as a party? Just not have another candidate?
Some people lack the ability to think critically.
Oh boy. The people do not pick their candidates the political party does. Primary elections are just an illusion. Bernie Sanders “won” in 2016. Yet HRC was the candidate because of super delegates already awarded to her without election victory.
I mean, Hilary won the popular vote across the primaries. 16.8 million votes to 13.1 million. But even if we say Bernie was the people’s choice, well, that kind of helps the OPs point that nominating a candidate that didn’t win the primaries is an issue. Because Dems sure as shit didn’t win 2016, in part because Bernie bros felt they were screwed so they sat out, voted 3rd party, or voted Trump. Which is why we find ourselves here right now.
Bernie bros losing the election for Hillary is a story democrats tell themselves when they do not want to take responsibility. The only person who can take responsibility for losing is HRC. As a candidate, it is your responsibility to run on a platform that is popular enough to win and she just didn’t. If she really wanted the progressive vote or if she really cared about the progressive wing of her party, she would have maybe adapted and taken some of those platforms that Bernie wanted. She could’ve even taken some center positions and appealed to some independence or moderate Republicans. But she didn’t. Bernie literally campaigned on her behalf and did all he could to convince his supporters to vote for HRC. At the end of the day you gotta blame camp Hillary for her performance and nobody else’s
Oh, I do blame her for sure. She didn’t run a good campaign. No argument there. Her inability to appease some of Bernie’s supporters was just one part of the issue with her campaign. You laid it out well enough.
This post illustrates why everyone is panicking very well.
Only the few complainers make enough noise to get heard.
Think about it this way. Since the last election, do you think that old Orange tits has made more friends, or enemies?
Just the release of the project 2025 "manifesto" was enough to sink tRump.
Primaries are emirrelevant, it's really just. A poll that the party uses to measure the will of that states constituents. It doesn't have any actual meaning. The delegates at the convention are the ones that formally decide, and they aren't beholden to the primary votes.
It is a right wing talking point.
Biden was sick, exhausted and had jet lag from gong to negotiate at the G7. He looked bad during the debate.
Trump is on the Epstein list it says he raped an underage girl.
RFK ate a dog.
Why is the Biden debate tiredness even still a thing?
G7- Jun 14th
he was tired two weeks later?
and please show where the release said he raped an underaged girl?
Are you talking about the dropped election season charge from 2016? the civil case zero dollars were handed out?
like Biden Tara reade accusation?
Imagine being this lost in the sauce to not see this man has dementia after being all over television for the past 4 years doing the exact same stuff he did during the debate
The White House has announced he is not stepping down. Nor should he.
The man has a stutter. We all know that. His stutter was particularly troublesome the night of the debate.
But big fucking deal.
Everybody wants to throw him out because he stutters!!
Everyone accuses him of being incompetent because he stutters!
He doesn't have dementia...he has a STUTTER!!
Last I heard, it was discrimination to disqualify somebody from a job because they stutter.
Get a fucking grip people
What we saw last week cannot be explained away with a “stutter”. His aides are now leaking to the press that these brain melts are becoming more regular occurrences. The cats out of the bag and there’s no going back now. Its over for Biden.
lolololololol the man has a stutter....we've been hearing that nonsense for years now.
His brain is pudding, just admit it and move on. We can't live in denial about it anymore.
There is no point in pulling him now. Also, I think he will do quite well.
Everyone can see what Trump is at this point and that the only people who really support him are vile snakes that have infiltrated our government patiently and thoroughly.
They can lose this election and just wait for the next opportunity to enact their agenda. Part of it has already been enacted in Trump's name, and they know they will get another chance to enact more and more until they hit a tipping point.
We cannot sit here and pin all of our hopes and dreams on Biden. Biden certainly has a huge role to play, but we need to get Biden into the presidency AND we need to give him the support he needs in congress to drive him and enable him to clean this mess up.
We need to get involved.
We need to vote.
We need to volunteer at polling places.
We need to attend town hall meetings.
We need to attend school board meetings.
We need to get to know our local representatives.
We need to put out the word that this is serious.
Tell that to him:
Biden, speaking to supporters from a middle school gymnasium in Madison, Wisconsin, said: "I'm the nominee of the Democratic Party," adding that "millions of Democrats just like you just voted for me in primaries all across America."
It doesnt matter. Not a traitor is who im voting for. They could run anyone who isnt a traitor or criminal against Trump and Id vote for them given the direct choice between the 2. Frankly Republicans are no longer Americans, they may not realize it yet but they have given up every American ideal in favor of white nationalism and Russia. They have turned traitor and support every classic external enemy of the US and every internal enemy is within them. Republicans are an enemy organization to the USA and if they gain significant power will ENSURE that there is violence as there always is when a small evil corrupt minority tries to control the majority. Fascists can only be removed by one method historically and you are learning why.
What can you do to make sure this guy does not get back in office with full immunity?
[https://www.reddit.com/r/MAGANAZI/comments/1du9uja/donald\_john\_trump\_is\_a\_fucking\_pig\_he\_should\_have/#lightbox](https://www.reddit.com/r/MAGANAZI/comments/1du9uja/donald_john_trump_is_a_fucking_pig_he_should_have/#lightbox)
They absolutely can replace him. And he can be replaced easily.
Even if it was late October and it was too late to remove Biden's name from the ballots it wouldn't be a problem. That's the beauty of the electoral college. You don't vote for Biden, you actually vote for a slate of electors who are chosen by their states party. They would simply go to the electoral colley and vote for the agreed upon Dem replacement for Biden.
Ironically this is the same institution that Democrats have been saying for years that they want to eliminate. It may save their asses this election.
its hard to believe that people want to replace him after one bad debate performance when he was sick. people are so petty, childish and downright ridiculous these days. and the media doesn't help either. i mean would you break up or divorce your partner if they had a bad night when they were sick? give me a break. Yes Biden seems old but guess what HE IS OLD!! but that also comes with years and years of experience. look at how the country is doing, the jobs are up, the economy a steady, inflation is going down etc. Remember you're not just for voting for Biden you're voting for his rocksolid administration as well.
debates mean nothing and polling means nothing. Hillary was polling better than Trump and she won the three debates but yet she lost the election. It's too late in the game for a new candidate in there isn't one that's going to be nationally recognized that people are going to throw as much money at. That's a fact.
Biden dropping out is a guaranteed way to ensure that the redcoats and Traitor Don win the next election. They would love it if Biden dropped out so why would we give them what they want? This is where we are so you either except it like an adult or you cry about it like a child. But please know that bitching and moaning and crying about it is exactly what Traitor Trump does and we need to be better than that.
If the democrats switch Biden out, they will lose ballot access in Nevada, Georgia and Wisconsin. Everyone in those states would have to write-in their preferred candidate.
Also, the replacement better have a shit ton of money stashed away because they have no access to the Biden campaign’s war chest. They need to begin a fund raising team, start from scratch, and hope to raise enough money to drown out Trump’s MAGA megaphone. All this in, what, 100 days?
It would absolutely nullify the votes. That doesn't mean it can't happen. Primaries aren't laid out in the constitution at all. They're just the way we do things, but they aren't required at all. The DNC could put whatever candidate they want in the race and we would have no legal recourse because they're not an official function of the government.
You’ve contradicted yourself. If the will of primary voters is sacrosanct, he shouldn’t be replaced by anyone against his will. Harris did not receive votes for the presidential nomination, so if the premise is that we must respect the primary result, Harris is no better a choice for president than any other Democrat.
I also disagree with the premise that the primary vote should be treated as you describe. First, incumbents almost always clear the primary field (which I think is a terrible precedent). So primary voters did not have anything close to a reasonable alternative.
Second, primary voters thought they were voting for a candidate with the capacity to mount a presidential campaign. There are now serious doubts that President Biden has that capacity.
Primaries that dispositivley choose the nominee are a relatively new concept. They have a lot of upsides compared to brokered conventions. But one downside is that they are on a very early, long timeline and are only as effective at communicating an actual preference as a primary race is competitive among viable opponents.
Ok seeing as it’s not out of the question and Science willing it doesn’t, but what happens if he actually gets sick? Vote for him while he’s unconscious on life support? Just need to know how I should vote in the case
The present system, in which delegates are bound by party bylaws and sometimes state law to abide by the primary vote in their state, is historically recent, dating back to the 1970s. Where there state laws with criminal penalties, there are generally loopholes to deal with situations like the presumptive nominee dying or being incapacitated between the primary election and the general. Eg, the electors become unbound or bound to vote with their state party leadership in their party's national convention.
Open national party conventions and 'smoke filled rooms' to select the nominee were the norm for over 150 years. While they didn't always choose the most qualified or electable nominee, they also didn't lead to national defeats (and SVR RF victories) like the nomination and election of DJT.
Ultimately, the decision is Biden's. I think he's well aware of the gravity of the situation, at least before his 8 PM bed time.
Okay look at it this way: Suppose a non-elderly candidate had a massive medical event that suddenly put them in the condition Joe Biden is in. Nobody ( Republican or Democrat ) would bat an eye if they stepped down and were replaced.
Aging isn't linear. I'm honestly willing to give the benefit of the doubt and say it's likely Biden was more or less fine 6 months ago, but it's clear the dude should drop out. I say this as someone who will vote for him even if he doesn't drop out.
There is a concerted astroturf campaign going on right now. The same thing happened to Hillary. Trump was utterly deranged at the same debate they keep harping Joe for. Epstein grand jury transcripts are also out and trumps name is all over them. Trump appointed Scotus builds a throne, trumps talking executions and camps, removing elections, and it's crickets. I'd say the oligarchs who own the media are making their move, especially with the conservative wipe out in the uk.
Over half the country didn’t even get a voice in the primary though. By the time my state ran primaries only Biden was left. The entire primary system is flawed, everyone should vote on the same day just like the general so we actually get to hear everyone’s votes.
Is it a MMW if everyone acknowledges that the only path forward rests on Biden’s decision? There wouldn’t be a pressure campaign if he could just be replaced despite his delegates.
I can tell you that very few primary voters actually wanted him as he had no real alternatives in almost every state. We would be happy to see him replaced with someone that can truly beat Trump
I guarentee if they had a general vote of democrats with one question, “should Biden step aside,” I’m fairly confident that “yes” would win in a landslide so the “will of the people” argument doesn’t really apply
People should have voted for a younger candidate four years ago guys. You knew or should have if he won the presidency he would not get a primary challenger in 2024.
The opportunity to get younger people on the ballot was missed in favor or biden and if not sanders.
In my state the DNC cancelled the Primary. They won legal battles against doing this by citing that they are a private, not public organization, and the voting is a farce.
Biden, speaking to supporters from a middle school gymnasium in Madison, Wisconsin, said: "I'm the nominee of the Democratic Party," adding that "millions of Democrats just like you just voted for me in primaries all across America."
Don’t give up on your argument.
Biden said in his own letter to Dems today that he received 14 million votes through the primaries, and one challenger left to run as independent.
So yes, tell me what you mean by “effectively” in your statement. Because I do not think you know what that word means. 😂
There were no substantive primaries this year.
Many states outright cancels them, more just had one name.
DNC already took our voice away in the primaries, it's bullshit to worry about the few primary voters now.
Tell that to him:
Biden, speaking to supporters from a middle school gymnasium in Madison, Wisconsin, said: "I'm the nominee of the Democratic Party," adding that "millions of Democrats just like you just voted for me in primaries all across America."
You actually believe that cold BS? He also was just way too tired from his travel 12 days before the debate. Oh, also his team did a bad job of prepping him. The only thing that has been proven here is that narcissism is the norm for anyone who makes it to the top of a presidential ticket. I thought highly of Jill Biden previously, but now I think she is just committing elder abuse.
I don’t think either party has anyone to blame but themselves for letting us get to these two terrible choices.
No, he's way too old and completely.lost his train of thought and ability to make a coherent statement in the first 5 minutes. Trump was a fear mongering liar. The whole thing stinks.
That’s not what happened even ignoring super delegates Hilary did better. She won more states and had a better popular vote too. It was close but she had more support.
As much as I love Bernie and supported him, this is simply true and we need to stop pretending something else happened because we don't like the reality it reflects.
And significantly more of them went to vote for Clinton, despite Clinton running as the antithesis for what Sanders advocated on most subjects.
A significantly higher percentage of Sanders voters went on to vote for Clinton than Clinton voters went on to vote for Obama in 2008.
Everyone agrees on this.
On the other hand, the Democratic party has argued in court before that the DNC chooses the candidate, and they don't have to abide by the primary results or provide visibility into their primary process if they don't want to, so yeah, party elites could give him the hook. They just won't, it would require unanimity and at that point, just use the 25th Amendment to remove him now and promote Kamala.
Not sure it should be Kamala. Her rating may be worse than Biden’s. Also you lose the voters that won’t vote for a woman. You pick a no name 50 year old male and they win in a landslide.
In all honesty Biden will lose, facism will come to pass and its all because biden is too stubborn . Power goes to people's head. They think they are better then they really are. Voters would have looked at the debate and said this yeah Trump lies but atleast he can put a sentence together. That's it. People will vote trump just for the sake of Biden being incoherent. Democracy will die in the Usa and people will remember it being Bidens fault.
Well yes, he would have to make the decision and release his delegates. Those are the DNC rules.
Give us anarchy and give us death!
Wait are you telling me OP doesn’t know fucking shit
I wrote nothing of the sort
Skynet, Skynet, Skynet....I rather have a machine to kill us than old fucjs blahs us to death.
You’ll most likely starve to death.
> and Lol
Wait till post November, it's coming.
[удалено]
So…insurrection? You can’t make this shit up.
The DNC is not legally obligated to follow their own rules. They said so in court.
Remember everyone, the people pushing the “Biden must drop out” narrative the hardest are… conservatives. https://www.reddit.com/r/bestof/comments/1duha5c/umake_us_good_again_shows_who_is_pushing_the/ If they think Biden is so weak, why would they push so hard to get him to drop out? Unless of course, they realize he has the best shot of beating Trump. Which he does.
I’d vote for a broom if the DNC nominated it against Cheeto Man.
I'd vote for a nugget out of my cat's litter box vs "Doe 174"
I’m voting for the inanimate carbon rod.
Are you crazy? A broom? What is wrong with you? Joe's carcass is right there, ready to be elected president.
Or, that's just normal narative to make Biden look like a weak candidate so of course conservatives are saying that. And he is a weak candidate. If he wins, he'll win off of the anti-trump vote only.
I mean, he's had a pretty successful run as president. His tenure has seen the largest upswing in labor power in my lifetime
That's nice and all. But he doesn't look like he'll survive 4 more years as president. If you wouldn't trust someone with that much mental decline to be your doctor, as no one should, why should we elect him again? He has to reside over what is likely to be the most civil unrest we've ever had IF he wins. And I don't trust run a Walgreens with his mental decline. It's not JUST beating Trump in the election. Now we have to get serious about pulling the weeds of rebellion out of our country.
Well, there's a limit to that analogy. Doctors often work independently, especially in the scenario in your analogy. Presidents, on the other hand, have a whole team around them. A key reason the Biden administration has been so successful in helping average Americans (as opposed to benefiting only the extremely wealthy) is because of his excellent team. Biden has already provided the direction and assembled the team. That will continue even *IF* Biden declines. Of course, another part of the plan could be for Biden to get re-elected and then at some point during his next term step down so Harris can be the first woman president. She wouldn't necessarily be my first choice for first woman president, but she's far, far better than any Republican president. She would also likely keep going in the same direction Biden set since it had been so successful.
100%. Best case scenario he wins and immediately steps down..which would piss alot of people off. The extreme worst..well..you know
Nah
CNN and NBC have been putting out stories on it daily
yeah well right wing media will do that
You're calling the CNN and NBC right wing???
[CNN](https://www.vox.com/2022/8/26/23322761/cnn-john-malone-david-zaslav-chris-licht-brian-stelter-fox-peter-kafka-column), yeah. CNN of today isn't your Gulf War 1 CNN
https://www.vox.com/2022/8/26/23322761/cnn-john-malone-david-zaslav-chris-licht-brian-stelter-fox-peter-kafka-column
DNC rules! Amusing. The DNC that argued in court it, as a private corp, has no obligation to fundamental fairness? “We could have voluntarily decided that, look, we’re gonna go into the back rooms like they used to and smoke cigars and pick the candidate that way,” he told the court. “And that would have also been their right.” [https://inthesetimes.com/article/in-its-defense-against-fraud-suit-from-bernie-supporters-the-dnc-just-dug-i](https://inthesetimes.com/article/in-its-defense-against-fraud-suit-from-bernie-supporters-the-dnc-just-dug-i)
What voters during the primaries? Biden was basically unchallenged. Hell, multiple states even refused to have his "challengers" on the ballots.
This is the point I was going to make. All of this could have been avoided if we had an actual primary and got to decide whether or not Biden would be the man for another 4 years. I realize that the way things happened is normal for Presidents seeking reelection but there's a reason why so many Democrats just wish we had another choice
If you dont think the DNC didnt threaten anyone who wanted to challenge him...all the while hiding his deteriorating mental condition. If trump wins MMW then ..everyone on reddit will pretend they wanted him replaced before the election
His main competition was 'undecided'
Lmao what primaries
100% largely because of his own stubbornness. He has to drop out on his own terms or it won’t happen.
To be fair, there wasn't really much of a choice in the primaries. It was him, and one congressman noone had ever heard of and whom the party gave no support. And the guy with a worm in his brain. It was more of a coronation than a contested primary.
BS: Biden’s call completely and then let the DNC vote and decide. Totally up to him.
Watch his interview from yesterday, he's not going anywhere unless Jesus himself comes back
Oh great, RBG v2. The ego and thirst of these ancient boomers is disgusting
He’s not even a boomer 😭 he’s too old for that.
Acting like the primaries were fair and popular is very funny. Also, there is a very clear and easy way to replace biden.
I don’t know about everyone else, but I didn’t get a big feeling of “choice” in the 2024 Dem primary. In fact, many states didn’t hold primaries at all. It’s the party bigwigs and the donors who really decide. In polls, large majorities say they want someone else. Harris should stay as VP. That will give the new campaign access to the money Biden/Harris has raised, which is considerable. Harris should not be the nominee for the top spot, because the simple fact is, the more people hear from her, the less they like her. She’s cringey, condescending and insincere (even for a politician). She’ll be seen as the “identity politics” choice, and she’ll have all the baggage of Biden’s term to drag around. If you’re thinking she would make a good choice, go on YouTube and watch her “skit” on the BET awards. Then go check out her awful record on politicking, prosecution and for-profit prisons.
Wow, you guys arent even trying to word it as a mmw anymore lol. I'm glad you guys started being honest about how you hijacked this sub for gratuitous and desperate political circle jerking. I hope your self righteous crusade goes well.
Biden isn't going to step aside at this point. All the people talking about it are just going to make getting him reelected more difficult.
Trump is just sitting back laughing that the Dems are attacking Biden instead of him.
Ding ding ding Watching people who call themselves Democrats put so much time and energy into rewarding Trump for that debate is fucking disgusting
Pfft. Hard disagree. Biden ran unopposed. As far as I’m concerned he opposed himself in that debate. No reason we need to lose for integrity-sake
She is the one to assume either the Presidency or the nomination. An open convention could be a disaster...just the thought of replacing Harris, and losing a large percentage of voters should give us all pause. This may be on Joe's mind. He could secure the nomination and then retire. She would become Prez for a few months, and would (I think) simply be named the successor to the nomination as well. It's at least semi-important that the campaign cash on hand is for Biden/Harris, not Newsom or Whitmer. Harris gets use of the cash.
I’m going to respectfully disagree on a couple of points. Does it look good to “pass over” a black woman and pick someone else? No, but anyone who cares about that is already voting blue. Plus, part of the problem voters have with both parties right now is that the candidates are always inevitable and seemingly pre-selected. A big, loud and even ugly battle for the nomination leading to a chaotic but exciting convention might be more good than harm. The convention is going to be a shitshow no matter what happens- Gaza protesters are going to do their best to disrupt it, and the establishment trying to tamp down dissent is going to look bad, like in 2016z. Honestly I’d rather see the party embrace their differences than try to shove decisions down our throats again. The people were trying to bring over are mostly favoring Trump right now - they’re ok with a bit of chaos.
Platform any of your coastie Dems and you lose swing states and any chance of the midwest. It's as simple as that
The DNC is all about doing whatever they want despite how people vote.
Heritage Foundation is already readying legal challenges to keep him on the ballot in swing states. There are rules where only he and Kamala have access to the campaign funds donated to him. There would be 4 months to raise funds AND awareness of anyone else. There are way more obstacles to this than the quixotic Just That Simple get a new nominee that people are not thinking of.
No. You are wrong….look at the polling from every single news outlet now. Biden is down in traditionally Democratic states! They must replace him.
One thing I would also like to point out is that a lot of the initial calls for replacing Biden are being echoed on Fox News. I've been alive for quite some time and recall before Fox News was even a big thing. Pretty much never in their time on air has Fox News ever supported anything that was Pro will of the people or democracy. Or good for the US. And since 2015, they are pretty much just an extension of Russian propaganda So for the people who lean left saying Biden should withdraw, remember that this is the message being given by Fox News. And I am saying this considering that I would love Pete buttigieg to just fucking take the mantle because running a veteran who has successfully run his Department and is a policy nerd would be the absolute fucking tits Also remember that he has accomplished quite a bit while in office despite opposition and if he dies the worst thing that would happen is we would have Kamala. If we run a candidate against the Precedence and make the risky choice of switching him out, it is essentially the end of democracy as we know what thanks to agenda 47 and the project 2025 that it parrots.
Fox News says what benefits the Republican Party. If Biden does get replaced, it makes the Republican Party look strong because Fox News has said that needed to happen and the Democratic Party agreed. If Biden does not get replaced, then it makes the Democratic Party look weak by reinforcing the idea that they are running a demented old man. So saying Biden needs to be replaced is a win-win for them. That doesn’t necessarily mean it isn’t true that he needs to be replaced, though.
Isn't this somewhat lying not relevant? It wouldn't change the fact that if he died we'd be sitting in the same situation no? Then it pretty much has to happen IE this seems more like an assumption than a fact. Dont think it really nullifies people vote. If someone drops out it's not like the voters can force them to stay in. That's why it would be a mess and likely very contentious if it happened at the convention.
Not to open a can of worms, but the super delegates *might* be able to impact the selection of a nominee—but I think they should respect the will of the voters.
I wasn't allowed to participate in the primary here because I'm not a party member. Even if I could, I'd only have my pick of whomever a private political organization got the most funding from.
People drop out, people die. It's just something that happens.
Trump and the Republicans tried to nullify 80 million votes in the general election, twice
You mean kinda like they nullified all the voters with Bernie?
They did it to Bernie.
No one said otherwise. If Joe wants it, it’s his. Nothing anyone can do about it. Only person who can stop Joe from being on the ballot, is Joe.
The primary with no debates and where lots of states only had one guy on the ballot. This is such a disingenuous argument, that wasn't a real primary. The only people who voted in that primary are people who will be voting for and democrat as long as they're running against trump. So honestly, who cares if they get pissed off?
Why have a portion of Democrats online decided that being as delusional and hysterical as Magats is a winning formula?
Capitalist depression affects us all. But we can't surrender to it.
the primary was so forgettable the news actully has forgotten the republicans have voted for trump and the democrats have voted for biden.
*superdelegates and the 2016 DNC have entered the chat*
That’s why people want him to step down
Depending on who they choose, I think most voters would welcome this idea.
I think it’s too late in the game to change horses willingly, but if it can’t race, and drops out, I’d sure like there to be a backup warmed up. And if he passed, it would “nullify” primary votes too.
Yes you can. It's the same approach as if the Dem candidate died right now. What would you do as a party? Just not have another candidate? Some people lack the ability to think critically.
Oh boy. The people do not pick their candidates the political party does. Primary elections are just an illusion. Bernie Sanders “won” in 2016. Yet HRC was the candidate because of super delegates already awarded to her without election victory.
I mean, Hilary won the popular vote across the primaries. 16.8 million votes to 13.1 million. But even if we say Bernie was the people’s choice, well, that kind of helps the OPs point that nominating a candidate that didn’t win the primaries is an issue. Because Dems sure as shit didn’t win 2016, in part because Bernie bros felt they were screwed so they sat out, voted 3rd party, or voted Trump. Which is why we find ourselves here right now.
Bernie bros losing the election for Hillary is a story democrats tell themselves when they do not want to take responsibility. The only person who can take responsibility for losing is HRC. As a candidate, it is your responsibility to run on a platform that is popular enough to win and she just didn’t. If she really wanted the progressive vote or if she really cared about the progressive wing of her party, she would have maybe adapted and taken some of those platforms that Bernie wanted. She could’ve even taken some center positions and appealed to some independence or moderate Republicans. But she didn’t. Bernie literally campaigned on her behalf and did all he could to convince his supporters to vote for HRC. At the end of the day you gotta blame camp Hillary for her performance and nobody else’s
Oh, I do blame her for sure. She didn’t run a good campaign. No argument there. Her inability to appease some of Bernie’s supporters was just one part of the issue with her campaign. You laid it out well enough.
exactly
Tell me you don't understand what primaries are without using those worda.
are you implying people who intentionally voted for Biden in the primary would suddenly NOT support a Democrat if another was chosen?
After the Convention, which hasnt happened yet, it would be difficult. Prior to the Convention? Easy. The nominee will be named at the Convention.
Voters don’t pick the nominee, delegates do.
This post illustrates why everyone is panicking very well. Only the few complainers make enough noise to get heard. Think about it this way. Since the last election, do you think that old Orange tits has made more friends, or enemies? Just the release of the project 2025 "manifesto" was enough to sink tRump.
Primaries are emirrelevant, it's really just. A poll that the party uses to measure the will of that states constituents. It doesn't have any actual meaning. The delegates at the convention are the ones that formally decide, and they aren't beholden to the primary votes.
So a comfortable win for Trump is much better than a realpolitik decision OP?
The “realpolitik” decision is definitely _not_ swapping out the incumbent President for some unknown installed by committee fiat.
It is a right wing talking point. Biden was sick, exhausted and had jet lag from gong to negotiate at the G7. He looked bad during the debate. Trump is on the Epstein list it says he raped an underage girl. RFK ate a dog. Why is the Biden debate tiredness even still a thing?
G7- Jun 14th he was tired two weeks later? and please show where the release said he raped an underaged girl? Are you talking about the dropped election season charge from 2016? the civil case zero dollars were handed out? like Biden Tara reade accusation?
Why was Trump falling asleep every day during his trial despite not doing anything to make him tired?
Bc he’s old and it was boring. and not particularly consequential
Imagine being this lost in the sauce to not see this man has dementia after being all over television for the past 4 years doing the exact same stuff he did during the debate
The White House has announced he is not stepping down. Nor should he. The man has a stutter. We all know that. His stutter was particularly troublesome the night of the debate. But big fucking deal. Everybody wants to throw him out because he stutters!! Everyone accuses him of being incompetent because he stutters! He doesn't have dementia...he has a STUTTER!! Last I heard, it was discrimination to disqualify somebody from a job because they stutter. Get a fucking grip people
He is not going to be the candidate.
What we saw last week cannot be explained away with a “stutter”. His aides are now leaking to the press that these brain melts are becoming more regular occurrences. The cats out of the bag and there’s no going back now. Its over for Biden.
lolololololol the man has a stutter....we've been hearing that nonsense for years now. His brain is pudding, just admit it and move on. We can't live in denial about it anymore.
As soon as you all admit that trumps brain is just a filled with holes and do the same.
Did we really have a choice in the primaries? It was Biden or…?
There is no point in pulling him now. Also, I think he will do quite well. Everyone can see what Trump is at this point and that the only people who really support him are vile snakes that have infiltrated our government patiently and thoroughly. They can lose this election and just wait for the next opportunity to enact their agenda. Part of it has already been enacted in Trump's name, and they know they will get another chance to enact more and more until they hit a tipping point. We cannot sit here and pin all of our hopes and dreams on Biden. Biden certainly has a huge role to play, but we need to get Biden into the presidency AND we need to give him the support he needs in congress to drive him and enable him to clean this mess up. We need to get involved. We need to vote. We need to volunteer at polling places. We need to attend town hall meetings. We need to attend school board meetings. We need to get to know our local representatives. We need to put out the word that this is serious.
Biden was already the parties nominee by the time my states primary was held. My vote never counted to begin with
He should resign the day before the election and make them stuck with Harris since they forced Harris on him
Put Kamala Harris in. She’ll destroy Trump.
Lol.
DNC can do whatever they want. They are a private organization and operate as they need to.
Sometimes, to protect democracy, you have to ignore democracy, I guess.
The DNC already went to court and said they're a private corporation and they're not obligated to run fair elections for the primaries.
Sometimes, to protect Democrats, you have to ignore democracy, I guess.
Primaries and political parties have always subverted democracy.
Sometimes, to protect Democrats, you have to ignore Democrats, I guess.
The DNC can't replace him. So what are you on about?
You’re assuming it’s the *votors* who actually pick the president.
There hasn’t been a primary no one picked him
Tell that to him: Biden, speaking to supporters from a middle school gymnasium in Madison, Wisconsin, said: "I'm the nominee of the Democratic Party," adding that "millions of Democrats just like you just voted for me in primaries all across America."
The primaries are all for show. The DNC is a private corporation and has no duty or obligation to select a candidate based on primary voting.
It doesnt matter. Not a traitor is who im voting for. They could run anyone who isnt a traitor or criminal against Trump and Id vote for them given the direct choice between the 2. Frankly Republicans are no longer Americans, they may not realize it yet but they have given up every American ideal in favor of white nationalism and Russia. They have turned traitor and support every classic external enemy of the US and every internal enemy is within them. Republicans are an enemy organization to the USA and if they gain significant power will ENSURE that there is violence as there always is when a small evil corrupt minority tries to control the majority. Fascists can only be removed by one method historically and you are learning why.
What can you do to make sure this guy does not get back in office with full immunity? [https://www.reddit.com/r/MAGANAZI/comments/1du9uja/donald\_john\_trump\_is\_a\_fucking\_pig\_he\_should\_have/#lightbox](https://www.reddit.com/r/MAGANAZI/comments/1du9uja/donald_john_trump_is_a_fucking_pig_he_should_have/#lightbox)
They absolutely can replace him. And he can be replaced easily. Even if it was late October and it was too late to remove Biden's name from the ballots it wouldn't be a problem. That's the beauty of the electoral college. You don't vote for Biden, you actually vote for a slate of electors who are chosen by their states party. They would simply go to the electoral colley and vote for the agreed upon Dem replacement for Biden. Ironically this is the same institution that Democrats have been saying for years that they want to eliminate. It may save their asses this election.
It’s cute you think Democrats have any say in their nominee to begin with.
its hard to believe that people want to replace him after one bad debate performance when he was sick. people are so petty, childish and downright ridiculous these days. and the media doesn't help either. i mean would you break up or divorce your partner if they had a bad night when they were sick? give me a break. Yes Biden seems old but guess what HE IS OLD!! but that also comes with years and years of experience. look at how the country is doing, the jobs are up, the economy a steady, inflation is going down etc. Remember you're not just for voting for Biden you're voting for his rocksolid administration as well. debates mean nothing and polling means nothing. Hillary was polling better than Trump and she won the three debates but yet she lost the election. It's too late in the game for a new candidate in there isn't one that's going to be nationally recognized that people are going to throw as much money at. That's a fact. Biden dropping out is a guaranteed way to ensure that the redcoats and Traitor Don win the next election. They would love it if Biden dropped out so why would we give them what they want? This is where we are so you either except it like an adult or you cry about it like a child. But please know that bitching and moaning and crying about it is exactly what Traitor Trump does and we need to be better than that.
"Sick" lol
Votes in primaries don't determine what your delegate to the convention does. They vote for whomever they want.
If the democrats switch Biden out, they will lose ballot access in Nevada, Georgia and Wisconsin. Everyone in those states would have to write-in their preferred candidate.
Unless Biden drops out. Or the 25th Amendment is used. Or, There is an "unfortunate accident."
Also, the replacement better have a shit ton of money stashed away because they have no access to the Biden campaign’s war chest. They need to begin a fund raising team, start from scratch, and hope to raise enough money to drown out Trump’s MAGA megaphone. All this in, what, 100 days?
Serious question, what if Biden passes before November, who was on the primary ballot and came in 2nd?
It would absolutely nullify the votes. That doesn't mean it can't happen. Primaries aren't laid out in the constitution at all. They're just the way we do things, but they aren't required at all. The DNC could put whatever candidate they want in the race and we would have no legal recourse because they're not an official function of the government.
Most of these comments are made by peak redditers. Smh
You’ve contradicted yourself. If the will of primary voters is sacrosanct, he shouldn’t be replaced by anyone against his will. Harris did not receive votes for the presidential nomination, so if the premise is that we must respect the primary result, Harris is no better a choice for president than any other Democrat. I also disagree with the premise that the primary vote should be treated as you describe. First, incumbents almost always clear the primary field (which I think is a terrible precedent). So primary voters did not have anything close to a reasonable alternative. Second, primary voters thought they were voting for a candidate with the capacity to mount a presidential campaign. There are now serious doubts that President Biden has that capacity. Primaries that dispositivley choose the nominee are a relatively new concept. They have a lot of upsides compared to brokered conventions. But one downside is that they are on a very early, long timeline and are only as effective at communicating an actual preference as a primary race is competitive among viable opponents.
Well, I guess we’re stuck with Trump.
Ok seeing as it’s not out of the question and Science willing it doesn’t, but what happens if he actually gets sick? Vote for him while he’s unconscious on life support? Just need to know how I should vote in the case
Normally I would agree with this but after following DC politics for the last 30 years, I think anything is possible.
The present system, in which delegates are bound by party bylaws and sometimes state law to abide by the primary vote in their state, is historically recent, dating back to the 1970s. Where there state laws with criminal penalties, there are generally loopholes to deal with situations like the presumptive nominee dying or being incapacitated between the primary election and the general. Eg, the electors become unbound or bound to vote with their state party leadership in their party's national convention. Open national party conventions and 'smoke filled rooms' to select the nominee were the norm for over 150 years. While they didn't always choose the most qualified or electable nominee, they also didn't lead to national defeats (and SVR RF victories) like the nomination and election of DJT. Ultimately, the decision is Biden's. I think he's well aware of the gravity of the situation, at least before his 8 PM bed time.
Kamala is a guaranteed L and it’s okay to admit it.
Guaranteed, everyone hates" The Cackler"
Dumb argument
He will not step down voluntarily, so most likely they will 25th Amendment him.
This is just not true. You don’t know how the party rules or the convention works.
Okay look at it this way: Suppose a non-elderly candidate had a massive medical event that suddenly put them in the condition Joe Biden is in. Nobody ( Republican or Democrat ) would bat an eye if they stepped down and were replaced. Aging isn't linear. I'm honestly willing to give the benefit of the doubt and say it's likely Biden was more or less fine 6 months ago, but it's clear the dude should drop out. I say this as someone who will vote for him even if he doesn't drop out.
Don’t you get it? The DNC is trying to protect Democracy by NOT doing Democracy. Get with it, racist.
There is a concerted astroturf campaign going on right now. The same thing happened to Hillary. Trump was utterly deranged at the same debate they keep harping Joe for. Epstein grand jury transcripts are also out and trumps name is all over them. Trump appointed Scotus builds a throne, trumps talking executions and camps, removing elections, and it's crickets. I'd say the oligarchs who own the media are making their move, especially with the conservative wipe out in the uk.
Over half the country didn’t even get a voice in the primary though. By the time my state ran primaries only Biden was left. The entire primary system is flawed, everyone should vote on the same day just like the general so we actually get to hear everyone’s votes.
The primaries where no one was allowed to run against joe? Those primaries?
Is it a MMW if everyone acknowledges that the only path forward rests on Biden’s decision? There wouldn’t be a pressure campaign if he could just be replaced despite his delegates.
Fucking what primary? Biden or Biden?
Many wouldn't have voted for him if they were honest about the President's condition.
I can tell you that very few primary voters actually wanted him as he had no real alternatives in almost every state. We would be happy to see him replaced with someone that can truly beat Trump
You think the DNC cares about your voters? 😂😂😂
I guarentee if they had a general vote of democrats with one question, “should Biden step aside,” I’m fairly confident that “yes” would win in a landslide so the “will of the people” argument doesn’t really apply
Who gives a fuck. Seriously who cares. It’s about winning
Since when did the Democrat party care about voters. This was an orchestrated scheme to install Joe.
His war chest does not transfer over to a new candidate. Switching someone in for Biden is **EXACTLY** what MAGA wants.
People should have voted for a younger candidate four years ago guys. You knew or should have if he won the presidency he would not get a primary challenger in 2024. The opportunity to get younger people on the ballot was missed in favor or biden and if not sanders.
In my state the DNC cancelled the Primary. They won legal battles against doing this by citing that they are a private, not public organization, and the voting is a farce.
Since when is this a concern? I have seen lots of votes’ intentions being nullified. The beat goes on.
What primary?
Biden, speaking to supporters from a middle school gymnasium in Madison, Wisconsin, said: "I'm the nominee of the Democratic Party," adding that "millions of Democrats just like you just voted for me in primaries all across America."
No, there was effectively no primary
So did Biden lie?
Should I define effectively for you?
Please do 🤣 I’d love to hear the spin here. Doesn’t matter if there was no other candidate on the ballet…there is always, ALWAYS, a write in option.
You can't define effectively? I think we're done
Don’t give up on your argument. Biden said in his own letter to Dems today that he received 14 million votes through the primaries, and one challenger left to run as independent. So yes, tell me what you mean by “effectively” in your statement. Because I do not think you know what that word means. 😂
An actual debate among primary contestants would be the minimum to claim there was an effective primary
That is your opinion, not a requirement.
There were no substantive primaries this year. Many states outright cancels them, more just had one name. DNC already took our voice away in the primaries, it's bullshit to worry about the few primary voters now.
There were no primaries
Tell that to him: Biden, speaking to supporters from a middle school gymnasium in Madison, Wisconsin, said: "I'm the nominee of the Democratic Party," adding that "millions of Democrats just like you just voted for me in primaries all across America."
because liberal pukes are hypocrites
The MAGA bots are out in force today! Joe biden just had a bad night because he had a cold. Stop trying to make something out of nothing.
😆 Oh he had a cold. Strong cope.
You haven't downloaded the latest propaganda. It wasn't a cold it was jet lag.
There was a cold There was a jet lag
You actually believe that cold BS? He also was just way too tired from his travel 12 days before the debate. Oh, also his team did a bad job of prepping him. The only thing that has been proven here is that narcissism is the norm for anyone who makes it to the top of a presidential ticket. I thought highly of Jill Biden previously, but now I think she is just committing elder abuse. I don’t think either party has anyone to blame but themselves for letting us get to these two terrible choices.
These people refuse to face reality.
No, he's way too old and completely.lost his train of thought and ability to make a coherent statement in the first 5 minutes. Trump was a fear mongering liar. The whole thing stinks.
Lol a cold, more like a corpse.
Well, it wouldn’t be the first time the DNC ignored their voters and forced out a candidate remember #feelthebern?
He should just appoint himself leader for life, or September. Whatever comes first. Official act, amirite???
No, that makes you just as bad as the Republicans. The US was formed as a democracy.
Also, would have zero standing to be considered an official act.
They already ignored voters in 2016 with Bernie. So why wouldn't they do it now? That's how much they love democracy.
That’s not what happened even ignoring super delegates Hilary did better. She won more states and had a better popular vote too. It was close but she had more support.
As much as I love Bernie and supported him, this is simply true and we need to stop pretending something else happened because we don't like the reality it reflects.
Which worked out poorly for them.
Clinton got more votes than Sanders in the 2016 primary anyway though.
12% of Bernie supporters voted for Trump in 2016
And significantly more of them went to vote for Clinton, despite Clinton running as the antithesis for what Sanders advocated on most subjects. A significantly higher percentage of Sanders voters went on to vote for Clinton than Clinton voters went on to vote for Obama in 2008.
Clinton only lost by 60k votes across 3 states.
Everyone agrees on this. On the other hand, the Democratic party has argued in court before that the DNC chooses the candidate, and they don't have to abide by the primary results or provide visibility into their primary process if they don't want to, so yeah, party elites could give him the hook. They just won't, it would require unanimity and at that point, just use the 25th Amendment to remove him now and promote Kamala.
Not sure it should be Kamala. Her rating may be worse than Biden’s. Also you lose the voters that won’t vote for a woman. You pick a no name 50 year old male and they win in a landslide.
You're kidding, right? You're gonna tell the multiracial female VP to take a hike? That would be Trump's fantasy.
But we didn't have a primary.
After what the dnc has done to other candidates this is suddenly a problem?
In all honesty Biden will lose, facism will come to pass and its all because biden is too stubborn . Power goes to people's head. They think they are better then they really are. Voters would have looked at the debate and said this yeah Trump lies but atleast he can put a sentence together. That's it. People will vote trump just for the sake of Biden being incoherent. Democracy will die in the Usa and people will remember it being Bidens fault.
Dems are pushing Joe hard to bail...and he will. This will be glorious to watch.