Because
1 because is still funny to me that he got in the game
2 everyone was hating him when he got revealed, then after a while i ended up liking him and having him on my flair
3 is funny
That’s what was said during the entirety of the beta and neither he nor Finn received anything even remotely substantial. Considering how many issues that the game has unrelated to balance, I’m not super hopeful that it’ll come soon
Nah I don’t main Bugs. I played all the characters pretty significantly in the Beta and can tell you that Bugs dropped off big time when they increased his cooldown.
He’s definitely better now for the new release, but fairly manageable with certain characters.
The safe hitting multiple times on one drive was a big change at least, that was my biggest bugs problem. I find him pretty counterable on a regular basis
Yeah, I feel that. We'll see but so far the Gizmo and Harley nerfs seem to have helped a bit. I have yet to face a Harley since the patch and Gizmo feels much more manageable to fight
Harley is still quite good, I think other characters have had some interesting kits and changes and it's just people jumping off because they can't combo so hard
Absolutely. The hitbox is so massive that sometimes it hits *underneath* him.
Frankly, I think PFG should get rid of these roles. They don't work on fighting games and give everyone the wrong perception of the characters, especially if you have experience on MOBAs or MMOs.
Personally? I'd replace them with fighting game archetypes: rushdown, zoning, turtle, etc. That would help new players identify what each character specializes in.
The MOBA roles are way too generic for fighting game characters, and also give players the wrong impression. Traditionally in MOBAs the Mage characters have powerful cooldown abilites but weak normal attacks; Bugs Bunny and the Joker definitely don't fit that bill because they're good at both.
not sure they are going to gut this rabbit...he's managed to stay in the top tier since beta the nair loop though needs to go. The safe needs the same treatment that lebron got. Let it hit only once and it will be fine or lower the safes hp to be destroyed easier.
Well at the same time, I do kinda believe you. But that of course was not intended behavior but the game is so damn buggy.
Yesterday with Jason I had the following issues.
I literally could not hit Gizmo, like my moves were all going over or right through him.
My moves sometimes just did not deal any knockback or create a hitstun. As in you hear the sound effect, you see the damage. But they are there free to do whatever they want, this happened multiple times with the bed move, sair and up air.
And the other one was when I was fully charged with armor, I traded with a Harley, and she knocked me out while again, she did not get any knockback.
Yea I decided to drop the game until they fix this game 🤣
Could very well be the case. Like I said in another comment, I was also just slightly below the stage when that happened.
I also recall a couple cases where attacks seemingly registered but there was no knockback, tho thankfully, those were few and far between.
Then you either just play 1s or are super casual. Have the maps are party maps so just throw safe down and attack mindlessly and get your opponent to 90 percent in seconds
No worries. But people are either just straight up bad if they say bugs isn’t a problem. Or they are just super super casuals that don’t play higher level ppl
I said it in the beta and ill say now. PFG need to decide what bugs are either mage and focusing on his projectiles or an assasin and doing his aerial combos.. Now works as everything.
I think they should just remove these labels. MOBA / MMO terminology has no place in fighting games. Especially since they removed the Support role and labeled Steven and Velma as Mages, and their gameplay don't really reflect that.
But I absolutely agree they should either nerf Bugs' melee combos or his projectiles. He's too good at both. The same about the Joker.
I think basket bat going to CD after successful hit can work. Decrease damage from spin and side special and incerase speed of cakes and safe. Increase movment speed but make Bugs lighter.
A cooldown for a normal attack might be a bit too much (even though I hate Bugs' bat). I'd just decrease / adjust the hitboxes (they're gigantic) and reduce its knockback (it kills way too early than it should).
I think he fills a unique niche as a jack of all trades. I'd rather they focus on his damage and knockback first and see how he feels after tweaking those values.
Fun fact that I found out playing against my brother today - if he's doing the forward flurry punching both you and the safe, you're gonna get hit by the safe equal amount of times as his punches, you can also get knocked from the floor too - even more damage with the perk.
I went from 0 to 70 and got thrown right into an up air as well without anything possible to do, which killed (I was playing Jake). Just so you know to watch out for that as well
Safe is like the 50/50, either the bugs forward airs it and i can dodge it no problem and its off the map, or the Bugs has a PHD in geological tunnels and does insane safe loops and rockets haha
Ive been loving some characters being able to one shot the safe though.
The safe is just broken. It can kill so easily by landing on people.
Bugs has so many ways to influence the battlefield. His safe shouldn’t be so powerful
Yeah exactly. She’s got the juggling of an assassin while also having all the benefits of being a tank.
She’s also the perfect counter to all mages. She and Marvin belong in an anti-mage class lol
I can deal with most of his moves, but his bat and Nair are just ridiculous.
Rocket is also pretty annoying since it covers so much of the stage, basically forcing you to either give up stage control, jump over and risk getting hit by his aerials, or take the hit, but at least that has a long cooldown.
I just tank the rocket everytime as a Jason main. Jumping is a death sentence against so many characters. They will just endlessly juggle you. The teleport is of no use either its so easy to punish.
If I'm playing Jason I usually have the projectile shield equipped, so anytime I see the rocket I just walk directly at it and tank it with no concern. Does a great job of psyching out the Bugs.
Didn't think of that. For some reason, I thought the shield didn't work against heavy projectiles.
Definetly gonna try using it on my next Bugs match. Thanks for the tip.
No problem, works against the safe too. Keep in mind that you have to keep moving forward for the shield to stay active, the second you do something like attack, jump or even stop, the shield drops.
Also also, the shield doesn't only block from the from! I remember playing against a LeBron on the Rick and Morty stage. You can kinda just...run into the speaker and invalidate him as a character, haha
No matter what they do to bugs he always be top tier with the kit he has. You give any character that up air in any platform fighter and their immediately high tier, and that’s putting the rest of his kit aside with safe and rocket and his neutral air, they may nerf his kill power and knock back but he will always be a combo machine.
It was one of the only things people spoke about during the beta phase of this game and I guess everyone kind of agreed as time went on that he’s really strong so there isn’t much need to mention it over and over as everyone already knew
He has a stun, a pie toss and his hammer's see very little play.
He can be relatively optimized by using only like 4 moves the entire game.
Needs fairer hurtboxes when spinning his arms/ears it should collide with other melee atks.
https://preview.redd.it/bryotgq2f77d1.jpeg?width=300&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=cd792f46516b96e9bb5a6100cc2d16aa45bc21f0
Me when I see I’m facing a Bugs and Harley team (the skies are their domain now)
A lot of his moves are very oppressive and same goes for a lot of characters like Harley, Tom and Jerry, Joker, and gizmo where their projectiles and speed make it hard to play against them, bugs and harleys bat seem incredibly unfair since it feels like when they do the bat swings there is a hit box behind them which make it hard to punish. I kind of wish projectiles weren't so oppressive with their knock backs overall as well. If you play a mainly close range fighter like superman, garnet, jason.. etc its very difficult to even some touch those characters sometimes especially since some characters lacks moves with armor to even trade properly.
Ah man don't get me started on Tom & Jerry and Gizmo (Stripes gets a dishonorable mention). T&J so fast and seems to stay in the air so long. I can't even touch Gizmo with most characters unless they have fast, low hitting moving like Batman's slide kick. Gizmo car spamming makes my blood boil because it's recovery time to switch direction is instantaneous
I only have issues with his Air Lariat move. For a Mage that thing can loop combo ridiculously and it shouldn't be part of his class-game. The rest is powerful but ok, at least goes along with his mage class design.
Yea his stupid safe needs to be nerfed can hit you multible times and drops an item. Like lebrons ball was nerfed so they can only hit you once why can bugs safe smash you 3 times with his projectile...
Been a few days since I last played; went against bugs and played some bugs myself..
Honestly I don’t know what they’re doing/need to do with there “class” system but.. bugs isn’t really a mage. He’s got projectiles but that’s more utility in his kit outside of Safe KO’s (the literal safe, not safe to throw out kill shots lol). He’s a bruiser/assassin with a “projectile” Kit that gives him stage control and some KO potential.
Nerf damage and knockback on safe and potentially give it the Lebron treatment (as a bron main though still think that nerf to him of all things/characters to nerf was absolutely insane, but meh) by allowing it to only hit once. Main broken interaction move likely fixed after that;
His big issues are the same as banana guard side special -> bugs up air hit box is absolutely HUGE and he juggles into KO’s wayyyy better than he should -> bugs nair is pretty busted; I wouldn’t say it’s the hit box persay but the actual frame data that’s making it so absolutely oppressive to fight against and such a “safe regain control” card for bugs players. These 2 moves need some nerfs and/or frame data adjustments to really fix the bugs problem…
But then that inherently speaks to the problems of four characters off the top of my head : Bugs, WW, Shaggy, Banana Guard -> they’re all busted in 1 or multiple ways purely due to either gigantic hit boxes, horribly broken frame data (in an abusable way), or both. Hopefully PFG will fix that up over next 3-6 months. Long time for basic QoL on a platform arcade fighter but that’s my expectation atp.
His frickin spin is very annoying, don't matter how much i dodge it just... Sucks me in, then BAT, spin... THEN BAT! SPIN, THEN BAT! SKIN, THEN BAD, GIVE ME YOUR SKIN.
Lets tally it up shall we?
\- Neutral air combo that stun locks you especially the heavier/tank fighters and god help you if you get stuck under the basketball hoops on the space jam map
\- The bat move that has insane reach, speed, priority, and get KOs on most fighters, even below 100 dmg, including tanks. Way too high recovery time as well, so if he somehow whiffs it, he can get away like 9 out of 10 times.
\- The safe move, while nerfed to no longer cause consecutive hits, is still one of the best zoning tools in the game, does major damage and knock back, and it takes way too much damage to destroy. Combined with his rocket move, he can effectively shutdown 1/4 or even 1/3 of the map plus the aerial zone as well.
\- His burrow move that provides total safety (bidding time in case his ally was rung out or he is high on damage and needs his teammate to get a KO to win) and is near impossible to counter.
\- Overall small hitbox and high speed both on the ground and in the air
\- Solid durability given his size (the amount of times I hit this guy with a KO causing move when he is at 120+ dmg and he lives is staggering)
I don't understand why a "mage" is so deadly in CQC, at least when I close the gap on Tom and Jerry I feel like I have the advantage, the problem with Bugs is he excels not just at zoning but also in straight up rushdowns. It needs to be one or the other, because as it stands he is incredibly overtuned and unfun to play against.
I think he's perfectly fine mostly, but my only issue is THAT NEUTRAL AIR NEUTRAL... Like... how is that thing allow to hit both sides and up. He gets you with one and you can't dodge into him, or away from him or up from him. That move is gonna hit you.
That's the only thing that need to be fix. The rest is totally fine. As a Buggs main even i feel terrible and bad about the people getting hit by the air neutral normal
I don't deny that he's probably the most annoying of the cast, but he's not unbeatable. To provide some tips (hopefully not in an annoying backseating way):
> Upair (the bat)The trick to dodging it is to be a bit patient. It doesn't come out instantly, so if you can react, the easiest way to avoid it is to dodge left/right in the direction buggs is facing. Unless the buggs has perfect spacing, you should be able to punish them after a successful dodge.
Alternatively, if you're scared or want to be pre-emptive - and though this may sound counterintuitive - an upwards dodge can be very useful for avoiding the bat, as it's the best way of simply getting outside of its range. I'd only recommend using this sparingly, as you're guaranteed dead if the buggs predicts you choosing this option.
Finally, buggs only has so much aerial options. If you can simply stall midair, he's gonna eventually have to land. In a situation where you anticipate pressure from a buggs, preemptively burning a jump or air dodge to stall midair can prevent you from being in the situation entirely.
> Safe
This one is a lot more case-by-case. However, the one biggest piece of wisdom for dealing with it is that any armor breaking move will break it INSTANTLY. Even if it means taking a hit from the safe, it's often worthwhile to do so, just to make sure the safe is gone as fast as possible.
Past that, if you notice that a buggs player always launches the safe in the same way, you can ABSOLUTELY get the jump on them. For example, I often see buggs players using air safe, fastfalling, and then using their forward air (the horizontal kick with two feet). If I can see that coming, it's very easy to simply sit towards the side of the safe, wait just a moment, and then hit them with some sort of upwards strike before they get the kick off. Some characters (finn, arya, rick) may be better at this than others - but all of them have \*some\* solution.
Continuing from that train of thought, most characters have their own unique ways of dealing with the safe. Finn's side special, for example, makes him dash through or stop projectiles on contact. Batman's smoke bomb makes him ignore projectiles completely. Superman/Wonder Woman/Jason can use armor to tank the hit dead on. Steven can bounce the safe off his shield. Etc. I'd suggest spending some time figuring out what your specific character can do to answer the safe. If nothing else, you can grab the perk that gives you projectile armor while running forward.
As a quick note, there's a TON of overlap in the advice that can be applied to this, and the advice that can be applied to dealing with the rocket.
> Upwards kick
This is a far simpler move to deal with. One of buggs' biggest weaknesses is that, horizontally, he does NOT have much to threaten at all. A strong buggs will use a wall of projectiles and a long-range rabbit hole to compensate for this - but the weakness is still undeniably there. If you're getting hit a lot by this move, spend some more time grounded, or simply slow down your play. The move is very good defensively (or as a strong read), but it's far less useful when it comes to actually applying pressure. If you do get hit by it, DI out. A launch straight upwards is the last thing you want.
> Neutral air (spinny funny punches)
This move is a grand evil. If you get hit by it, DI up and out. You're still going to get looped, but you'll force the loops to end earlier. Getting hit by the bat at low percents is unironically preferable here - it means the combo ends, and you get to (eventually) reset to neutral. If a buggs relies TOO hard on it, you can call him out by standing still/backing off slightly, and hitting him with a predictive attack, Once again, character dependent what your answer is. Superman/Jake might want to use uptilt, stripe might use down tilt, taz can use up special, etc. For some characters, you have a far safer option in simply crouching. Buggs neutral air cannot hit some characters while they're crouching - so if you're playing one of them, you can just crouch, wait for the nair, and hit them after it's finished. If they opt not to try to nair you, you can just... do whatever you want. You didn't commit to anything.
In general, a lot of beating buggs just comes down to allowing yourself to play on their playing field, rather than trying to force your own playstlye. Allowing yourself to play reactive (waiting for buggs to commit to an option) is often times the best option in a neutral situation - and the moment you gain the advantage, push it as hard as you can. Buggs does take some time to set up - so don't let him get away with something like using his rocket in melee range - just hit him out of it. Allow him to play his game once, then keep up the offense so he can't do it a second time.
Idt he’s OP at all, a good bugs player makes him look OP but it requires tactical thinking to be a good bugs player. If you’re just wasting your safe and missile a decent player will cook you.
I dony think bugs is as op as you guys claim he fordny have an infinite loop like some of these charctets playing 2s I think you should focus on parying his safe is his only issue
Safe definitely isn't the only issue. Plus it's easy for me to dodge the save. It's the combination of speed (movement and attack series), attack reach, and his spinning attacks for me
I'm mad that as IG i can't dodge any of his air attacks, the hitbox lasts longer than the invul of dodge and with my hurtbox and movement speed i'm not able to dodge either. I just die, and in 2's it's overkill becaise a lot of characters can spam up air wich is broken.
"my favourite character to play against" *brother*, i would become a terrorist just to go to the same level as you in hell to rain excrement down on your very *SOUL*.
That being said. I know IG is in deep shit and has been for a while, but i love him as a character, i'm maybe even fascinated by the idea of him and the execution in the game, therefore, i love this game, also, i hate this game.
He needs a buff and stages need to be bigger so that his size, when his attacks do land and you're not watching a cinematic of your death from start to finish, so that his size can't be 'abused' because that's what people complain about, even if it's like one guy, you can abuse the character, however, you can also abuse him way easier, it's only bad players who get shit on by IG and because it's the majority the devs go and blindly murder him like absolute dumbasses, i hate that about this game (and other things).
They nerfed his little safe quite heavily in the fact that it can't go repeatedly through the rabbit holes anymore, and breaks on command once it goes through the second after the first. I used to abuse that a lot with him in the beta for how strong it was.
Any vertical based characters I feel all got major buffs, seriously sick of dying under 100% when that rarely ever happened to me in the beta, it’s one of the things that’s really ruining the fun for me as Ill think that I’m more than safe at the % I’m at but two swings of that damn bat and I’m out.
See I'm not the only one I dodge his attacks It sucks me in I think it's ridiculous and it's not a skill issue it's just he's just beyond unbalanced along with many other characters. But Bugs Bunny and WW are a huge problem right now honestly. They've been a problem for a minute honestly. But people up here complaining about Harley Quinn and other stuff which to me I feel that she was beatable honestly but when it comes down to it WW and Bugs Bunny I think they completely blow her out the ballpark. They need a huge nerf bigger than Gizmo I want people to actually put in the effort to play the game to get a win not smash 2 buttons repeatedly.
I'm glad you mentioned they his attacks suck you in. I thought I was the only noticing it. Gizmo give me nightmares m; his hit boxes are so small, and he's so fast I whiff on what should be clear cut confirms
I can fight him pretty fine with shaggy. It’s just annoying that every time his bull shit is off cool down I have to play a bullet hell game and get rid of his safe before I can go back to fighting.
He has some insane range on his attacks and I bet he feels awesome to play with some of his moves/setups. That being said my issue is the nair spam more than anything.
He is on the top of every tier list ever since the beta first dropped, no? I think I remember Garnet being able to use her neutral special to bubble his projectiles, and still he was a nuisance
He's annoying for sure, his nair combos are insane, easy to hit, can do a couple of loops and can kill if you DI wrong. But I can deal with that, the safe on the other side, I despite the safe, especially in 2s where I can get stuck and eat like 70+ damage in one interaction.
Wdym it’s being talked about. Just not officially because half the roster and hitboxes are busted af but yeah let’s make sure to shut down ig immediately 🙄
Wasn’t saying anything out of hate towards you there, sorry if it came across that way. Could’ve phrased it better for my tone. The eye roll and sass were mainly meant to be about how people here acknowledge it, but devs didn’t put bugs on the “we are looking the adjust them” list like Harley and shaggy I think it was? It’s all rough, I’m just salty after a year it feels like the games in a worse state than in beta
It doesn't cause it's tagged as a discussion, not feedback or the like. Just wanted people to share what they were going through and maybe tips and other things they noticed
Basically you are saying a character is so OP you made a thread about it on the internet but don’t think it should be nerfed. And the tags the tags! Nice try Captain logic.
Again you're putting words to my post that's not there based on your assumption. I already told you specifically what point was. Keep on arguing if you want
If he wont say it, i will. Hope he gets nerfed lol. Hes incredibly annoying and strong to play against in 2v2's. With his stage control projectiles, insane up air, ridiculous Nair. Losing as bugs and banana guard specifically, is a choice if you are a remotely average player or better.
I dunno. Personally I'm more annoyed at the neutral air combo of taking you from 0 to 90 with no escape.
I die a little inside every time I queue into bugs as Jason Because I’m getting nair looped to 80
I die a little inside every tyime I queue as Jason
Relatable
How can you say relatable when you play the Minecraft Steve of Multiversus
I play every character lmao (in fact i main rick) I'm level 8 jason and every time i play him i remember how slow he is and then play other character
Jason is the chunkiest feeling character and not in a good way
Then why is your flair Banana Guard
Because 1 because is still funny to me that he got in the game 2 everyone was hating him when he got revealed, then after a while i ended up liking him and having him on my flair 3 is funny
Fair points
I die a little inside every time I queue
I switched from learning Jason to iron giant and it's unsurprisingly even worse LOL literally just nair ;-;
I feel you brother *IG cry*.
i read this and got palutena ptsd💀
It’s DI/KBI based. The only way he’s getting u to 90 is if he predicts ur DI every single time.
0 to 90 with no escape and then a confirm with the Up Air.
Agreed, this needs a fix
Dunno dunnnooooo dun dun o o. Don't know?
It's been mentioned several times today alone. I'm sure the upcoming balance patch won't be too kind to him.
THEY'RE GOING TO KILL BUGS BUNNY?
It's wabbit hunting season
Kill the wabbit, kill the wabbit! Kill the wabbit? Kill the wabbit!
Yea about time I hope
That’s what was said during the entirety of the beta and neither he nor Finn received anything even remotely substantial. Considering how many issues that the game has unrelated to balance, I’m not super hopeful that it’ll come soon
The most substantial nerf to Finn was the removal of his Side Special gem teleport. His Up Special still has a deceptively large hitbox.
They nerfed his cooldown and jump height in the beta. He went from S-tier to B-tier pretty quickly.
You probably main him huh, cuz even now they are both s tier
Nah I don’t main Bugs. I played all the characters pretty significantly in the Beta and can tell you that Bugs dropped off big time when they increased his cooldown. He’s definitely better now for the new release, but fairly manageable with certain characters.
The safe hitting multiple times on one drive was a big change at least, that was my biggest bugs problem. I find him pretty counterable on a regular basis
Yeah, I feel that. We'll see but so far the Gizmo and Harley nerfs seem to have helped a bit. I have yet to face a Harley since the patch and Gizmo feels much more manageable to fight
Harley is still quite good, I think other characters have had some interesting kits and changes and it's just people jumping off because they can't combo so hard
I’ll be happy if they only adjust bug’s bat move. It’s too powerful for a mage character lol
Absolutely. The hitbox is so massive that sometimes it hits *underneath* him. Frankly, I think PFG should get rid of these roles. They don't work on fighting games and give everyone the wrong perception of the characters, especially if you have experience on MOBAs or MMOs.
Should the roles be replaced with anything, or should they just be done with altogether?
Personally? I'd replace them with fighting game archetypes: rushdown, zoning, turtle, etc. That would help new players identify what each character specializes in. The MOBA roles are way too generic for fighting game characters, and also give players the wrong impression. Traditionally in MOBAs the Mage characters have powerful cooldown abilites but weak normal attacks; Bugs Bunny and the Joker definitely don't fit that bill because they're good at both.
not sure they are going to gut this rabbit...he's managed to stay in the top tier since beta the nair loop though needs to go. The safe needs the same treatment that lebron got. Let it hit only once and it will be fine or lower the safes hp to be destroyed easier.
But no one is talking about it. /s
Yeah right lol. Bugs has been brain dead since the beta. He’s going to get minor touches that won’t remove any of his core BS.
His up air is a cannon. It sends all weights flllllying.
I once got killed by it under 100% from *below the stage*. And Shaggy is not a particularly light character.
That’s just lying, and as a shaggy player I don’t think you really get to complain about moves hitting way harder then they should.
I know what I saw man. But fair point on the last part lol
Well at the same time, I do kinda believe you. But that of course was not intended behavior but the game is so damn buggy. Yesterday with Jason I had the following issues. I literally could not hit Gizmo, like my moves were all going over or right through him. My moves sometimes just did not deal any knockback or create a hitstun. As in you hear the sound effect, you see the damage. But they are there free to do whatever they want, this happened multiple times with the bed move, sair and up air. And the other one was when I was fully charged with armor, I traded with a Harley, and she knocked me out while again, she did not get any knockback. Yea I decided to drop the game until they fix this game 🤣
Could very well be the case. Like I said in another comment, I was also just slightly below the stage when that happened. I also recall a couple cases where attacks seemingly registered but there was no knockback, tho thankfully, those were few and far between.
yeah, gizmo Jason is almost unplayable rn lol. he's surprisingly decent vs. the other top tiers, but gizmo is a nightmare
No you didn’t lol
Yeah, I didn't believe when it happened either. Granted, it was very slightly below the stage and the move was not stale.
Biblical lore accurate Bugs Bunny
As a bugs main I can confirm this is true
Maybe for the small percent of top tier players 🤷♂️. The rest of us out here struggling with bugs but having fun.
Fair I love playin bugs but I hate playin against him
Then you either just play 1s or are super casual. Have the maps are party maps so just throw safe down and attack mindlessly and get your opponent to 90 percent in seconds
UHHHHH NOOOOOOO???
Wasn’t replying to you lol
Oh my bad og
No worries. But people are either just straight up bad if they say bugs isn’t a problem. Or they are just super super casuals that don’t play higher level ppl
Bugs is an omnipotent cosmic entity 🤣
I said it in the beta and ill say now. PFG need to decide what bugs are either mage and focusing on his projectiles or an assasin and doing his aerial combos.. Now works as everything.
I agree with this. Mage characters should not have incredible juggling abilities.
Yeah my thoughts exactly, im maining joker rn and he is way too capable of juggling people from 0 to death.
I think they should just remove these labels. MOBA / MMO terminology has no place in fighting games. Especially since they removed the Support role and labeled Steven and Velma as Mages, and their gameplay don't really reflect that. But I absolutely agree they should either nerf Bugs' melee combos or his projectiles. He's too good at both. The same about the Joker.
I think basket bat going to CD after successful hit can work. Decrease damage from spin and side special and incerase speed of cakes and safe. Increase movment speed but make Bugs lighter.
A cooldown for a normal attack might be a bit too much (even though I hate Bugs' bat). I'd just decrease / adjust the hitboxes (they're gigantic) and reduce its knockback (it kills way too early than it should).
I think he fills a unique niche as a jack of all trades. I'd rather they focus on his damage and knockback first and see how he feels after tweaking those values.
Jack of all trades, master of EVERYTHING.
A jack of all trades is supposed to be mid / weak at what he does if he's able to do multiple things, bugs is fucking OP at all he does
Which is why I said, focus on his damage and Knockback influence
Fun fact that I found out playing against my brother today - if he's doing the forward flurry punching both you and the safe, you're gonna get hit by the safe equal amount of times as his punches, you can also get knocked from the floor too - even more damage with the perk. I went from 0 to 70 and got thrown right into an up air as well without anything possible to do, which killed (I was playing Jake). Just so you know to watch out for that as well
It’s his damn safe man
Safe is like the 50/50, either the bugs forward airs it and i can dodge it no problem and its off the map, or the Bugs has a PHD in geological tunnels and does insane safe loops and rockets haha Ive been loving some characters being able to one shot the safe though.
The safe is just broken. It can kill so easily by landing on people. Bugs has so many ways to influence the battlefield. His safe shouldn’t be so powerful
I’m a Bugs main, bro half the cast can one shot his safe, his safe ain’t shit compared to his air game.
Yeah the safe’s durability shouldn’t be decreased. But I think it does too much knockback upon landing. It can take people out when they’re under 100%
Nah. Top Tiers outside of Wonder Woman are fine. Game doesn't need nerfs, it needs buffs. Once WW is nerfed, top tiers are in a good place
Wonder Woman is an abomination lol. She’s a combination of multiple classes.
Right. She's a tank with the attack speed of an assassin and knockback power of a bruiser.
Yeah exactly. She’s got the juggling of an assassin while also having all the benefits of being a tank. She’s also the perfect counter to all mages. She and Marvin belong in an anti-mage class lol
Used to love playing Taz into him so I could just eat the projectile but since they got rid of that it feels so bad
I can deal with most of his moves, but his bat and Nair are just ridiculous. Rocket is also pretty annoying since it covers so much of the stage, basically forcing you to either give up stage control, jump over and risk getting hit by his aerials, or take the hit, but at least that has a long cooldown.
I just tank the rocket everytime as a Jason main. Jumping is a death sentence against so many characters. They will just endlessly juggle you. The teleport is of no use either its so easy to punish.
Too mutch lag entering and elaving it. I agree it sucks
If I'm playing Jason I usually have the projectile shield equipped, so anytime I see the rocket I just walk directly at it and tank it with no concern. Does a great job of psyching out the Bugs.
Didn't think of that. For some reason, I thought the shield didn't work against heavy projectiles. Definetly gonna try using it on my next Bugs match. Thanks for the tip.
No problem, works against the safe too. Keep in mind that you have to keep moving forward for the shield to stay active, the second you do something like attack, jump or even stop, the shield drops.
Also also, the shield doesn't only block from the from! I remember playing against a LeBron on the Rick and Morty stage. You can kinda just...run into the speaker and invalidate him as a character, haha
No matter what they do to bugs he always be top tier with the kit he has. You give any character that up air in any platform fighter and their immediately high tier, and that’s putting the rest of his kit aside with safe and rocket and his neutral air, they may nerf his kill power and knock back but he will always be a combo machine.
I can’t wait for them to add Duffy. He would be a perfect counter to bugs.
It was one of the only things people spoke about during the beta phase of this game and I guess everyone kind of agreed as time went on that he’s really strong so there isn’t much need to mention it over and over as everyone already knew
I am he’s even more op in closed stages with his safe.
We've been talking about this since beta that bugs is the meta
I wasn't on reddit during the beta. Good to know I'm not the only one
I hate wonder woman with a passion
I feel you. ww isn't that bad if you get someone who is actually trying to do different combos, but spammers can make you hate any character
Release Elmer or Daffy as ultimate bugs counter. Like Elmer with his ruffle one shot all bugs projectile and send them on 120s CD
imo the two necessary changes would be making his safe break on hitting the first enemy target, and reduing the hitbox on his up air
Active frames on up air could be reduced, so that its harder to time and gives the opponent an easier time dodging thru its animation.
I personally love how his rocket and safe are two of the best projectiles and they’re not reflectsble
They need to nerf his neutral and up air and maybe the safe slightly then see if his other stuff could do with some buffs if necessary
He has a stun, a pie toss and his hammer's see very little play. He can be relatively optimized by using only like 4 moves the entire game. Needs fairer hurtboxes when spinning his arms/ears it should collide with other melee atks.
They will as soon as WW and Banana Guard are brought in line. Bugs is too much right now but WW and BG are criminal.
https://preview.redd.it/bryotgq2f77d1.jpeg?width=300&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=cd792f46516b96e9bb5a6100cc2d16aa45bc21f0 Me when I see I’m facing a Bugs and Harley team (the skies are their domain now)
Definitely one of the most annoying characters in the game. With all his tricks and treats flying all over the place and his op up bat
I guess that's how he is canon wise but they could at least tone down the damage
A lot of his moves are very oppressive and same goes for a lot of characters like Harley, Tom and Jerry, Joker, and gizmo where their projectiles and speed make it hard to play against them, bugs and harleys bat seem incredibly unfair since it feels like when they do the bat swings there is a hit box behind them which make it hard to punish. I kind of wish projectiles weren't so oppressive with their knock backs overall as well. If you play a mainly close range fighter like superman, garnet, jason.. etc its very difficult to even some touch those characters sometimes especially since some characters lacks moves with armor to even trade properly.
Ah man don't get me started on Tom & Jerry and Gizmo (Stripes gets a dishonorable mention). T&J so fast and seems to stay in the air so long. I can't even touch Gizmo with most characters unless they have fast, low hitting moving like Batman's slide kick. Gizmo car spamming makes my blood boil because it's recovery time to switch direction is instantaneous
I only have issues with his Air Lariat move. For a Mage that thing can loop combo ridiculously and it shouldn't be part of his class-game. The rest is powerful but ok, at least goes along with his mage class design.
I’ve seen a lot of people complain about him. I think it’s generally accepted that he needs a bat nerf
Nair loops are fucked
Yea his stupid safe needs to be nerfed can hit you multible times and drops an item. Like lebrons ball was nerfed so they can only hit you once why can bugs safe smash you 3 times with his projectile...
Been a few days since I last played; went against bugs and played some bugs myself.. Honestly I don’t know what they’re doing/need to do with there “class” system but.. bugs isn’t really a mage. He’s got projectiles but that’s more utility in his kit outside of Safe KO’s (the literal safe, not safe to throw out kill shots lol). He’s a bruiser/assassin with a “projectile” Kit that gives him stage control and some KO potential. Nerf damage and knockback on safe and potentially give it the Lebron treatment (as a bron main though still think that nerf to him of all things/characters to nerf was absolutely insane, but meh) by allowing it to only hit once. Main broken interaction move likely fixed after that; His big issues are the same as banana guard side special -> bugs up air hit box is absolutely HUGE and he juggles into KO’s wayyyy better than he should -> bugs nair is pretty busted; I wouldn’t say it’s the hit box persay but the actual frame data that’s making it so absolutely oppressive to fight against and such a “safe regain control” card for bugs players. These 2 moves need some nerfs and/or frame data adjustments to really fix the bugs problem… But then that inherently speaks to the problems of four characters off the top of my head : Bugs, WW, Shaggy, Banana Guard -> they’re all busted in 1 or multiple ways purely due to either gigantic hit boxes, horribly broken frame data (in an abusable way), or both. Hopefully PFG will fix that up over next 3-6 months. Long time for basic QoL on a platform arcade fighter but that’s my expectation atp.
He literally makes the game unfun
His frickin spin is very annoying, don't matter how much i dodge it just... Sucks me in, then BAT, spin... THEN BAT! SPIN, THEN BAT! SKIN, THEN BAD, GIVE ME YOUR SKIN.
Don't forget the speed that he can start attacks after the animation of another ends
It's canon to Looney Tunes
That's Toon Force for ya.
Lets tally it up shall we? \- Neutral air combo that stun locks you especially the heavier/tank fighters and god help you if you get stuck under the basketball hoops on the space jam map \- The bat move that has insane reach, speed, priority, and get KOs on most fighters, even below 100 dmg, including tanks. Way too high recovery time as well, so if he somehow whiffs it, he can get away like 9 out of 10 times. \- The safe move, while nerfed to no longer cause consecutive hits, is still one of the best zoning tools in the game, does major damage and knock back, and it takes way too much damage to destroy. Combined with his rocket move, he can effectively shutdown 1/4 or even 1/3 of the map plus the aerial zone as well. \- His burrow move that provides total safety (bidding time in case his ally was rung out or he is high on damage and needs his teammate to get a KO to win) and is near impossible to counter. \- Overall small hitbox and high speed both on the ground and in the air \- Solid durability given his size (the amount of times I hit this guy with a KO causing move when he is at 120+ dmg and he lives is staggering) I don't understand why a "mage" is so deadly in CQC, at least when I close the gap on Tom and Jerry I feel like I have the advantage, the problem with Bugs is he excels not just at zoning but also in straight up rushdowns. It needs to be one or the other, because as it stands he is incredibly overtuned and unfun to play against.
I think he's perfectly fine mostly, but my only issue is THAT NEUTRAL AIR NEUTRAL... Like... how is that thing allow to hit both sides and up. He gets you with one and you can't dodge into him, or away from him or up from him. That move is gonna hit you. That's the only thing that need to be fix. The rest is totally fine. As a Buggs main even i feel terrible and bad about the people getting hit by the air neutral normal
Everyone knows he’s broken. Just like Joker, WW, Iron, and BG.
I don't deny that he's probably the most annoying of the cast, but he's not unbeatable. To provide some tips (hopefully not in an annoying backseating way): > Upair (the bat)The trick to dodging it is to be a bit patient. It doesn't come out instantly, so if you can react, the easiest way to avoid it is to dodge left/right in the direction buggs is facing. Unless the buggs has perfect spacing, you should be able to punish them after a successful dodge. Alternatively, if you're scared or want to be pre-emptive - and though this may sound counterintuitive - an upwards dodge can be very useful for avoiding the bat, as it's the best way of simply getting outside of its range. I'd only recommend using this sparingly, as you're guaranteed dead if the buggs predicts you choosing this option. Finally, buggs only has so much aerial options. If you can simply stall midair, he's gonna eventually have to land. In a situation where you anticipate pressure from a buggs, preemptively burning a jump or air dodge to stall midair can prevent you from being in the situation entirely. > Safe This one is a lot more case-by-case. However, the one biggest piece of wisdom for dealing with it is that any armor breaking move will break it INSTANTLY. Even if it means taking a hit from the safe, it's often worthwhile to do so, just to make sure the safe is gone as fast as possible. Past that, if you notice that a buggs player always launches the safe in the same way, you can ABSOLUTELY get the jump on them. For example, I often see buggs players using air safe, fastfalling, and then using their forward air (the horizontal kick with two feet). If I can see that coming, it's very easy to simply sit towards the side of the safe, wait just a moment, and then hit them with some sort of upwards strike before they get the kick off. Some characters (finn, arya, rick) may be better at this than others - but all of them have \*some\* solution. Continuing from that train of thought, most characters have their own unique ways of dealing with the safe. Finn's side special, for example, makes him dash through or stop projectiles on contact. Batman's smoke bomb makes him ignore projectiles completely. Superman/Wonder Woman/Jason can use armor to tank the hit dead on. Steven can bounce the safe off his shield. Etc. I'd suggest spending some time figuring out what your specific character can do to answer the safe. If nothing else, you can grab the perk that gives you projectile armor while running forward. As a quick note, there's a TON of overlap in the advice that can be applied to this, and the advice that can be applied to dealing with the rocket. > Upwards kick This is a far simpler move to deal with. One of buggs' biggest weaknesses is that, horizontally, he does NOT have much to threaten at all. A strong buggs will use a wall of projectiles and a long-range rabbit hole to compensate for this - but the weakness is still undeniably there. If you're getting hit a lot by this move, spend some more time grounded, or simply slow down your play. The move is very good defensively (or as a strong read), but it's far less useful when it comes to actually applying pressure. If you do get hit by it, DI out. A launch straight upwards is the last thing you want. > Neutral air (spinny funny punches) This move is a grand evil. If you get hit by it, DI up and out. You're still going to get looped, but you'll force the loops to end earlier. Getting hit by the bat at low percents is unironically preferable here - it means the combo ends, and you get to (eventually) reset to neutral. If a buggs relies TOO hard on it, you can call him out by standing still/backing off slightly, and hitting him with a predictive attack, Once again, character dependent what your answer is. Superman/Jake might want to use uptilt, stripe might use down tilt, taz can use up special, etc. For some characters, you have a far safer option in simply crouching. Buggs neutral air cannot hit some characters while they're crouching - so if you're playing one of them, you can just crouch, wait for the nair, and hit them after it's finished. If they opt not to try to nair you, you can just... do whatever you want. You didn't commit to anything. In general, a lot of beating buggs just comes down to allowing yourself to play on their playing field, rather than trying to force your own playstlye. Allowing yourself to play reactive (waiting for buggs to commit to an option) is often times the best option in a neutral situation - and the moment you gain the advantage, push it as hard as you can. Buggs does take some time to set up - so don't let him get away with something like using his rocket in melee range - just hit him out of it. Allow him to play his game once, then keep up the offense so he can't do it a second time.
Idt he’s OP at all, a good bugs player makes him look OP but it requires tactical thinking to be a good bugs player. If you’re just wasting your safe and missile a decent player will cook you.
Cause it’s a cash grab? Lol
I'm getting killed below 100% anyways, he's balanced (/j)
I dony think bugs is as op as you guys claim he fordny have an infinite loop like some of these charctets playing 2s I think you should focus on parying his safe is his only issue
Safe definitely isn't the only issue. Plus it's easy for me to dodge the save. It's the combination of speed (movement and attack series), attack reach, and his spinning attacks for me
I'm mad that as IG i can't dodge any of his air attacks, the hitbox lasts longer than the invul of dodge and with my hurtbox and movement speed i'm not able to dodge either. I just die, and in 2's it's overkill becaise a lot of characters can spam up air wich is broken.
Sorry to say but IG easy pickings for everybody; he's my favorite character to play against
"my favourite character to play against" *brother*, i would become a terrorist just to go to the same level as you in hell to rain excrement down on your very *SOUL*. That being said. I know IG is in deep shit and has been for a while, but i love him as a character, i'm maybe even fascinated by the idea of him and the execution in the game, therefore, i love this game, also, i hate this game. He needs a buff and stages need to be bigger so that his size, when his attacks do land and you're not watching a cinematic of your death from start to finish, so that his size can't be 'abused' because that's what people complain about, even if it's like one guy, you can abuse the character, however, you can also abuse him way easier, it's only bad players who get shit on by IG and because it's the majority the devs go and blindly murder him like absolute dumbasses, i hate that about this game (and other things).
They nerfed his little safe quite heavily in the fact that it can't go repeatedly through the rabbit holes anymore, and breaks on command once it goes through the second after the first. I used to abuse that a lot with him in the beta for how strong it was.
He isn’t that op, op.
Because there are worse offenders. Not only do I speak from experience, but Iron Giant also exists.
I can confirm.
Because other characters are better
Idk I can beat him if I focus (sweat). A little skill and luck honestly. He has a crazy kit though.
Luckily the safe doesn't take you from 0 to 60 instantly sometimes
Why is no one tlaking about how bogus AOE attack harley is on insanity in rift mode...if you know you know.....
Don't forget WW, she's unga bunga as hell
Any vertical based characters I feel all got major buffs, seriously sick of dying under 100% when that rarely ever happened to me in the beta, it’s one of the things that’s really ruining the fun for me as Ill think that I’m more than safe at the % I’m at but two swings of that damn bat and I’m out.
See I'm not the only one I dodge his attacks It sucks me in I think it's ridiculous and it's not a skill issue it's just he's just beyond unbalanced along with many other characters. But Bugs Bunny and WW are a huge problem right now honestly. They've been a problem for a minute honestly. But people up here complaining about Harley Quinn and other stuff which to me I feel that she was beatable honestly but when it comes down to it WW and Bugs Bunny I think they completely blow her out the ballpark. They need a huge nerf bigger than Gizmo I want people to actually put in the effort to play the game to get a win not smash 2 buttons repeatedly.
I'm glad you mentioned they his attacks suck you in. I thought I was the only noticing it. Gizmo give me nightmares m; his hit boxes are so small, and he's so fast I whiff on what should be clear cut confirms
I can fight him pretty fine with shaggy. It’s just annoying that every time his bull shit is off cool down I have to play a bullet hell game and get rid of his safe before I can go back to fighting.
Well in the Beta he was nerfed into the ground so it's been nice to experience how he is now imo
He has some insane range on his attacks and I bet he feels awesome to play with some of his moves/setups. That being said my issue is the nair spam more than anything.
He is on the top of every tier list ever since the beta first dropped, no? I think I remember Garnet being able to use her neutral special to bubble his projectiles, and still he was a nuisance
He’s an OG. He even says: “I’ve been doing this before you were born” and I’m sure he’s not lyin. He deserves it I am garbage with him tho
the missile in the right spot(it’s a challenge not to put it there) is completely unavoidable
My friend plays big and she a bitch for that lol
so insanely busted and difficult to play against
They are? I feel like I see it every day
He's annoying for sure, his nair combos are insane, easy to hit, can do a couple of loops and can kill if you DI wrong. But I can deal with that, the safe on the other side, I despite the safe, especially in 2s where I can get stuck and eat like 70+ damage in one interaction.
Because Is not thath strong , Is good but not op, they Nerfed bugs a lot After the beta
He's not that op, Morty is really worse
I’ve mained morty for the entire game, and he is not op. What is broken about him?
Not long ago, someone was spamming thoses zoning attacks and that spin (probably a side attack) and he was so quick, I couldn't do anything.
it's just his up air honestly seems a little strong but I don't think he needs any major nerfs imo.
Neigh
Thanks, Mr Grammer 🫡
Mommy mommy the rabbit man is back
Wdym it’s being talked about. Just not officially because half the roster and hitboxes are busted af but yeah let’s make sure to shut down ig immediately 🙄
Obviously I have seen it if I asked about. People are the internet are so nasty and quick to assume
Wasn’t saying anything out of hate towards you there, sorry if it came across that way. Could’ve phrased it better for my tone. The eye roll and sass were mainly meant to be about how people here acknowledge it, but devs didn’t put bugs on the “we are looking the adjust them” list like Harley and shaggy I think it was? It’s all rough, I’m just salty after a year it feels like the games in a worse state than in beta
You guys just want to nerf every character you don’t main. Sad. I really hope the devs aren’t brain dead enough to listen to Redditors.
Reading is important. I never Buggs should get nerved. No where in my post did I say that. Maybe I wanted to if others are experiencing the same thing
OP and needing balancing (aka nerf) mean the same thing. Comprehension is just as important as being able to sound out words.
It doesn't cause it's tagged as a discussion, not feedback or the like. Just wanted people to share what they were going through and maybe tips and other things they noticed
Basically you are saying a character is so OP you made a thread about it on the internet but don’t think it should be nerfed. And the tags the tags! Nice try Captain logic.
Again you're putting words to my post that's not there based on your assumption. I already told you specifically what point was. Keep on arguing if you want
You are astonished no one is commenting on how OP bugs is. Maybe because Bugs is a solid character but not OP.
If he wont say it, i will. Hope he gets nerfed lol. Hes incredibly annoying and strong to play against in 2v2's. With his stage control projectiles, insane up air, ridiculous Nair. Losing as bugs and banana guard specifically, is a choice if you are a remotely average player or better.