To be fair, not a lot of guys in the league you could clone 14x and make a really good team.
Tatum actually would be on the short list for clone teams. Kuzma, nah.
Heatless Bron easily could've played modern day C with the athleticism. And played that short roll on offense when the inevitable double goes to the ball.
There was a big tournament style series of threads about this but all time legends included on one of the NBA subs awhile back and I believe the cloned Shaqs won the tournament if I remember correctly, but the Lebrons werenāt part of the tournament because they were thought to be the easy winner
But aging Lebron might not be the answer idk who would do better than him tho still
A team of cloned players would have some really easy exploits. For example for a team of cloned Shaq's, I would just run a fast break on them every time with a team of cloned Steph Curry's and shoot 3's every chance I got. Then on D I would just concede and let Shaq score the basket, come back and hit a 3.
Shaq gets the rebound in the paint after a missed FT and dunks it. Fouling would be the only way Shaq gets a 3-pt play. Curry's only hope is to shoot 70% from 3 and get a few steals.
If just giving up 2 free points every time to get Steph fast break 3 opportunities were a viable option we wouldāve seen the warriors try to cherry pick with him already lol
Definitely LeBron imo. Especially if you can pick some LeBrons from different years.
I think KD's passing/playmaking isn't quite good enough for me to feel 100% comfortable though. 4 KDs and 1 point guard would be great though.
4 wemby, 2 steph
Line up the wembys to jog up court in front of the 1 steph. Each wemby picks a spot to play from, with one odd one out designated to crash boards no matter what
If steph gets doubled, he shoots. Wemby wins board and makes the right play
Ooo, I like Magic. I assumed the player in question is playing in the same era they had played in. And Magic proved he play Center in the 1980 Finals when Kareem was injured.
It might actually be Tatum here.
Durant is my favorite player by far but he doesn't pass well enough. Bron is too lazy on defense at this point. Tatum might be too short though, perhaps Giannis?
>Bron is too lazy on defense at this point
If we have 15 of him cloned that wouldnāt necessarily be the case though. You could essentially run hockey rotations with him and play them all for 16 minutes and just completely empty the tank in those minutes.
> Who would be the best in that situation? LeBron?
Definitely. He's universally considered either the first or second best player of all time and to my knowledge the only one who has ever had at least one year listed at every single position. There's nobody else that comes particularly close as a combination of versatility/scoring/play making/defense and he can defend 1-4 at an all-NBA level and does decently against 5s as long as the minutes are limited.
LeBron runs away as the #1 pick in that scenario. 2nd tier would be KD, Magic, Bird. 3rd tier Nowitzki, Tatum, Giannis...plenty of other good choices. Basically any two-way point forward.
Dirk not even close. Man couldn't play C because he couldn't hack it on defence lol. Imagine him at SF, SG and PG. They'd definitely get smoked even by a team of 5 Paul George's, let alone the better point forwards
Imagine 15 wembys. They could line up across the court and pass the ball overhead of eachother where no one else could reach. Would be hilarious to watch
LeBron.
Can he have different tendencies? Point guard LeBron, PF LeBron, SF LeBron, 5 LeBronā¦
Seen him drop 30+ a season. He could literally do it all.
A team of Tatums could probably bring home the chip in this era. 5 tall lengthy playmaking, rebounding, decent shooting wings would be extremely formidable and deep.
I mean, if you legitimately have 15 jayson tatums on the same team i don't think they would lose a single game against any real team rn. Same goes with a couple of other two way stars
14 Kuzmas would be decent. letās say itās a league of small forward teams, theyād probably be like the Heat. heās a jack of all trades, master of none type
Yeah but Kuzma isnāt good enough at his own position to think Kuzma at other positions would be great. Kuzma defending centers ? Nah. Defending fast Pgās? Nah.
yeah, if he could take a lesser role like Aaron Gordon for example he could be an extremely valuable player. I donāt think heās ever gonna be a legitimate #2 either.
https://preview.redd.it/c2m3c0xnqx8d1.jpeg?width=1200&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=ad0838c0c3c7717f4d5cb3ab5ae9ba5acd11f34f
Itās probably so awesome when your grind out 3 and D guys show up to the game like this.
Lmao I just meant if he could take his obviously well above average talent level and take a lesser role a la Aaron Gordon or Derrick White he would be better off
On paper? Yeah, but I would imagine thereās nothing more annoying than a high fashion zesty role player. the dude seems like an absolute locker room cancer, which is why he ended up in DC lmao.
Every team in the league wants a player who is the Tatum archetype - a tall wing who can shoot, defend, has feel for the game, and can play with other great players. Only one team in the league really wants Kuzma, and that is the Washington Wizards.
Better, but not by that much. The Wizards suck. No singular player is going to suddenly make them a 50-win team. Tatum isn't a star like Lebron, or Luka, or Russell Westbrook does where they can just score every point, get every rebound, and dish every assist. But make no mistake, Tatum is leagues better than Kyle Kuzma - that debate was settled long ago.
He could. He does everything on the court at an extremely high level. They have nobody that can score OR defend like him, probably not that can pass that well either
Literally the only people with this take are Lakers fans still smoldering about this debate. Iāve never seen a Wizards fan claim Kuzma is better than Tatum. Guarantee the reply-guy is a Lakers fan.
No Lakers fan in history thinks Kuzma is a centerpiece. He's gotten better since he left. He was a great find for the Lakers, late pick and helped win a chip. He's been mostly forgotten in L.A. The bigger regret is choosing THT over Caruso.
I appreciate that everyone feels that way now. But I was around for the Kuzma > Tatum conversations and I'm sure they're archived on Reddit too.
It was a not-uncommon sentiment from Lakers fans.
A good example among many: https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/ael81u/is_kyle_kuzma_better_than_jayson_tatum_by_a_fair/
Oh, yeah. He is better than Tatum, bc Tatum sucks and is probably in a fetal position somewhere trembling. I mean MAX Christie is better than Tatum we all know that. You can't build around any of them. š¤£
I just meant this post. Maybe OP is a Laker fan idk.
By my definition, building around a player like Kuzma starts with finding 2 better players than him. If that is included and successful, sure, they can win. If the question is, would a roster of 8 players, Kuzma and 7 just as good player as him (so he can be the de facto best player on the team), perfectly fit with each other, win the title, the question is no, most likely not.
Damn Iām an unc now?
During that time it was a legitimate debate. For what Boston needed Tatum was perfect, he wasnāt offensively dominant at that point. Iirc he barely scored over 25 points a few times and he was much younger
He was drafted into a good team that had came off an ECF appearance so the situations are also different
At that point, purely scoring. Kuzma was better, but obviously thatās no longer the case and Tatum is clearly the better player. Tatum was also the better defender between the two but.. damn I remember these debates. That was 7 years ago..
Calling the Wizards a team ābuilt around Kuzmaā is delusional. Itās a team with Kuzma as its main star. There was absolutely no team building involved.
What's the difference? "Build around" means he is your number 1, then put pieces around him.
Let's say the reverse: What if you trade Jokic for KK? You'd have Jokic, Gafford and Poole. I'd say that team makes the playoffs easily. Same as every top player swapped for KK.
Man yāall may hate this comment, but Iāve seen Kuz in live actionā¦dat boy aināt NO JOKE! Iāve played against a few NBA players and everytime it really puts into perspective why theyāre in the league and Iām just a pickup player ššššššššš
Seriously tho, Kuz can ball. I think the comment I saw where if heās your best option you wonāt win, and that is 100% true but I do think paired with an elite guard like an Edwards or Doncic weāll see his game get to another level.
NBA level talent is crazy. I remember Dlo said on a podcase that Reeves could hold his own at any \[street\] court. Like? The dude was a starter for a WCF final team. OF COURSE he could beat dudes on the street lmao wtf
The only people debating this were Lakers fans lmao. They literally regard any player that plays for that organization as an elite player. Lakers fans are so delusional when it comes to actual player analysis (āAustin Reaves is so good! Heās developing into an elite player and will elevate usā)
I have zero recollection of that discussion. Ingram was mostly slandered and slept on until he left the Lakers. Same with Lonzo. Every fan base hypes their players, but only Lakers get slandered to the degree they do.
Just search āIngram Tatumā in the lakers sub and youāll get endless conversations comparing the two they often resort to Ingram the lakers being better. Listen, I get itās home town fans defending their guy, but there are a ton of takes like these:
Of the 95 players in the NBA that ran at least 100 isolation plays Jayson Tatum ranks 95th of 95. Brandon Ingram ranks 11th btw.
https://www.reddit.com/r/lakers/s/gv69X5o4qi
Am I crazy to think Ingram/Kuzma are more valuable than Tatum/Brown?
Everyone is saying the Pelicans need to wait for the offseason to trade AD so Boston can get their "monster offer" in with Tatum/Brown. I think it's bizarre to call that a monster offer when I think that Ingram Kuzma are better as a duo offer than those two. Ingram is the best defensive player of that group, Kuzma is the best offensive player of that group. Both Tatum and Brown have regressed from last season while Ingram has at least been steady from last year (his defense is signifcantly better imo) and Kuzma has increased his offensive repertoire .
The only clear advantage I see the celtics having is being able to offer that Memphis pick which could be 9th this year. The Clippers pick probably won't convey and will end up being a second rounder. The Kings pick could also be fairly good, though it is #1 protected and most people are saying this is a one man draft.
So guys, am I biased/Crazy?
https://www.reddit.com/r/lakers/s/50MYLdd1qm
Brandon Ingram VS Jayson Tatum
What is the common belief around r/NBA and this subreddit? I know Jayson Tatum had a good playoff run for a rookie but if given the opportunity, I definitely believe Brandon Ingram would kill it in the playoffs to a greater extent.
https://www.reddit.com/r/lakers/s/gOTEwFciI8
Itās not āslanderā if the conversations happened on a regular basis. Thatās the point
Thereās also a ton of threads about āwe gotta trade Kobe!ā. That was a legit faction of the fanbase in his later years
What you see on fan pages isn't evidence of anything. Every team fan page has conversations like that. What was happening on NBA and other general forums was far more negative toward Lakers young core than was warranted. Every one of them turned out better than was general option.
If you replace Tatum with Kuzma do they win this year? Iām not 100% convinced on that. I think the lowest caliber player you could have switched Tatum with and still win the ring would be healthy PG.
I think thatās the comp, PG v Tatum.
Letās put it this way if you put Kuzma on the Celtics this year in place of Tatum, if Porzingis is healthy the entire time they still win the title if Porzingis is still injured as much as he actually was then they probably lose in the semifinals in a close series to the Pacers
Anyone who was not a Lakers or a Sixers fan knew the Celtics took Tatum with the #1 pick but at the #3 spot. They only traded the pick when they were confident neither of them would take him at #1 or #2.
Let me answer your question with a a question - if Kuzma were in Tatumās shoes during the Celtics ā24 playoff run, would he be able to adapt to a more selfless, team oriented style of play when his shots werenāt falling? Tatum has been universally regarded as the #1 option on the team for years but had no problem taking on a facilitator role for the majority of the playoffs to ensure the win while effective sacrificing a potential FMVP. Would Kuzma (or any of your other favorite superstars) be willing to do the same?
Yeah, I think they would. Kuzma not the most consistent, but a unit with defensive ideology with consistent scoring with Kuzma as the standard would be a contender for sure.
Idk if yāall watched this season but Jayson Tatum looked like the champion he became. He was a total and complete team-game-of-basketball player. Kuzma is not a bad player by any stretch but the debate between him and Tatum is ridiculous, and the āreal uncsā who remember this debate are the ESPN Laker fans who only think one team matters
Lol fuck no. Kuzma doesn't really take basketball seriously enough. He's like Nick Young is a sense as they both had pretty good potential but satisfied where they currently are.
The team wouldnāt be āaround kuzmaā but if b4 this year Boston traded Tatum for Kuz 1 for 1 they would still prolly win, but the finals would hav been closer
This was legitimately never a debate. Big time Revisionist history to say it was. Kuzma then and now is a role player who can do some things well. Very inconsistent. As a 4th option or bench guy, heās a good player. This has always been clear. While Tatum is has been the number one option his whole career
I see where you could go with this. But even if kuzma was premiered more in offense and so on, there are levels. And kuz is unfortunately at least 1 tier below Tatum minimum.
Argument: Change Tatum and Kuz, what happens? Wizards improve by a healthy margin and Boston has to probably go to game 6 or 7 before winning it all, if at all. Thatās how big of a difference there is between them in my opinion.
The hardest thing about building a roster around Kuzma would be finding a better version of Kuzma to make the thing work.
But they have Jordan Poole š¤
lol, he is my cousin, i was floored when i found out. get me in there!
Pro tip: just have LeBron James
And AD playing like heās the love child of Hakeem and Jordan.
Kuzma must be the GOAT of being āthe poor manās _____ā
I'll do you one better. Hypothetically, if we were able to clone Kuzma 14-15 times, how would a full team of Kuzma's do?Ā
To be fair, not a lot of guys in the league you could clone 14x and make a really good team. Tatum actually would be on the short list for clone teams. Kuzma, nah.
That's a far better thought experiment lol. Who would be the best in that situation? LeBron? KD?
Lmao imagine 3 squadrons of Lebrons all playing 16 minutes. I'll run some simulations on 2K and report backĀ
With various numbers, headbands, and hairlines to tell them apart
Honestly this would be sick. Laker Bron at PG 03-09 Bron at SG Heatles Bron at SF 2nd Stint CLE Bron at PF And fuck it, Bronny at C
Heatless Bron easily could've played modern day C with the athleticism. And played that short roll on offense when the inevitable double goes to the ball.
275lb Bron at C for sure. Basically Ben Wallace on D and 100x better on offense
LeBron has never been close to Ben Wallace on D. Stop it.
15 minute stints, 3 LeBron rotation. He could do it. Prove me wrong! š
Yea that's capp
yea it's more like Bam-sized defense as they are similar in stature which is still hella good
Zero championships. They'd all die of lung disease from the chalk in the air.
It's been 2 days. What's the answer.Ā
There was a big tournament style series of threads about this but all time legends included on one of the NBA subs awhile back and I believe the cloned Shaqs won the tournament if I remember correctly, but the Lebrons werenāt part of the tournament because they were thought to be the easy winner But aging Lebron might not be the answer idk who would do better than him tho still
A team of cloned players would have some really easy exploits. For example for a team of cloned Shaq's, I would just run a fast break on them every time with a team of cloned Steph Curry's and shoot 3's every chance I got. Then on D I would just concede and let Shaq score the basket, come back and hit a 3.
No need to concede, just foul every time... although I guess that slows down the pace.
Shaq gets the rebound in the paint after a missed FT and dunks it. Fouling would be the only way Shaq gets a 3-pt play. Curry's only hope is to shoot 70% from 3 and get a few steals.
If just giving up 2 free points every time to get Steph fast break 3 opportunities were a viable option we wouldāve seen the warriors try to cherry pick with him already lol
Itās different when itās 5 300 pound slow guys in defense but itās still not a good strategy
Young Shaq aināt slow lol
Heās not slow but heās not quick and nimble enough to defend 5 Stephen Curryās
Quick enough to make a enough of a difference to win the 5v5 tho while getting a literal automatic 2 points every time on offense
If theyd use aging lebron then theyd have to use 50 year old shaq to make it fair
Give me 15 Jonathon Isaacs.
Definitely LeBron imo. Especially if you can pick some LeBrons from different years. I think KD's passing/playmaking isn't quite good enough for me to feel 100% comfortable though. 4 KDs and 1 point guard would be great though.
Hear me out. With 5 KDās, one of them is bound to be hot at all times, just feed the hot hand, get a guard switched onto him and let him iso.
4 Jokics and 1 Wemby Not saying they'd be the best team but man it'd be fun to watch
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
4 wemby, 2 steph Line up the wembys to jog up court in front of the 1 steph. Each wemby picks a spot to play from, with one odd one out designated to crash boards no matter what If steph gets doubled, he shoots. Wemby wins board and makes the right play
5 Wemby's could just play keep away from the other team like they were younger brothers.
Donāt think this is the answer but 15 Jokics would be so much fun. Would give up 200 points per game but would score 200 too
Yeah prime lebron and KD are top answers. Magic works well too.
Ooo, I like Magic. I assumed the player in question is playing in the same era they had played in. And Magic proved he play Center in the 1980 Finals when Kareem was injured.
Team of Wembyās would be a spectacle
It might actually be Tatum here. Durant is my favorite player by far but he doesn't pass well enough. Bron is too lazy on defense at this point. Tatum might be too short though, perhaps Giannis?
>Bron is too lazy on defense at this point If we have 15 of him cloned that wouldnāt necessarily be the case though. You could essentially run hockey rotations with him and play them all for 16 minutes and just completely empty the tank in those minutes.
Horrific spacing with Giannis
Even MJ right? Or is he not versatile enough?
I would say not versatile enough defensively to be in the top conversation. MJ is not guarding Centers.
Makes sense, I'd agree. And to the same point 5 Draymonds wouldn't score enough.
> Who would be the best in that situation? LeBron? Definitely. He's universally considered either the first or second best player of all time and to my knowledge the only one who has ever had at least one year listed at every single position. There's nobody else that comes particularly close as a combination of versatility/scoring/play making/defense and he can defend 1-4 at an all-NBA level and does decently against 5s as long as the minutes are limited.
LeBron runs away as the #1 pick in that scenario. 2nd tier would be KD, Magic, Bird. 3rd tier Nowitzki, Tatum, Giannis...plenty of other good choices. Basically any two-way point forward.
Dirk not even close. Man couldn't play C because he couldn't hack it on defence lol. Imagine him at SF, SG and PG. They'd definitely get smoked even by a team of 5 Paul George's, let alone the better point forwards
I forgot about PG and Kawhi. You're right about Dirk, though he's probably not on the list.
5 Yao Mings
LeBron. Definitely LeBron. In today's small ball era, he can legit play 1 to 5. Durant would struggle at 1 and 5.
KD would be getting bodied. He isnāt strong or fast enough
Imagine 15 wembys. They could line up across the court and pass the ball overhead of eachother where no one else could reach. Would be hilarious to watch
LeBron. Can he have different tendencies? Point guard LeBron, PF LeBron, SF LeBron, 5 LeBronā¦ Seen him drop 30+ a season. He could literally do it all.
A team of Tatums could probably bring home the chip in this era. 5 tall lengthy playmaking, rebounding, decent shooting wings would be extremely formidable and deep.
I mean, if you legitimately have 15 jayson tatums on the same team i don't think they would lose a single game against any real team rn. Same goes with a couple of other two way stars
14 Wembys blocking shots all day.
everytime i see those "make a team with 10$" games online and a center or wemby is in the 1$ section i just think "Give me 10 Wembys"
14 Kuzmas would be decent. letās say itās a league of small forward teams, theyād probably be like the Heat. heās a jack of all trades, master of none type
Yeah but Kuzma isnāt good enough at his own position to think Kuzma at other positions would be great. Kuzma defending centers ? Nah. Defending fast Pgās? Nah.
Tatum and LeBron. Maybe kawhi but heās not a good enough passer. Who else?
All time or current? All time I think KD, Magic, Bird, Pippen might work.
Full team of Kuzma v a full team of Tatums? šš
22-60
Kuzma could be a solid contributor on a contender, but if he's in your top 2 you're probably not a real contender.
If heās your #2 youāre probably not a real contender for a top 6 seed let alone to win a ring
If heās your #2 youāre a contender for a top 6 pick in the draft maybe.
Maybe? We have direct evidence of this lol
yeah, if he could take a lesser role like Aaron Gordon for example he could be an extremely valuable player. I donāt think heās ever gonna be a legitimate #2 either.
Yeah similar to MPJ even lmao. Just being that 3-5 option on a great team he could kill it.
Iād rather have Aaron Gordon than Kuz
https://preview.redd.it/c2m3c0xnqx8d1.jpeg?width=1200&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=ad0838c0c3c7717f4d5cb3ab5ae9ba5acd11f34f Itās probably so awesome when your grind out 3 and D guys show up to the game like this.
Lmao I just meant if he could take his obviously well above average talent level and take a lesser role a la Aaron Gordon or Derrick White he would be better off
Could be? He already was
If he's in your top 2, you're in the lottery.
if heās one of your top 2 good luck making the playoffs lmao. youād have to have prime bron or something lol
What if he had a supporting cast of Jordan Poole?
Kuzma is an ideal bench scorer. Give him keys to the second unit or pray he can be efficient enough as a 3 & D on the first unit.
On paper? Yeah, but I would imagine thereās nothing more annoying than a high fashion zesty role player. the dude seems like an absolute locker room cancer, which is why he ended up in DC lmao.
If heās in your top 2, youāre probably in the lottery unless the top guy is like top 3 in the league.
Checks Wizard's draft position...
Every team in the league wants a player who is the Tatum archetype - a tall wing who can shoot, defend, has feel for the game, and can play with other great players. Only one team in the league really wants Kuzma, and that is the Washington Wizards.
If you put Tatum on the wizards how much better are they?
Better, but not by that much. The Wizards suck. No singular player is going to suddenly make them a 50-win team. Tatum isn't a star like Lebron, or Luka, or Russell Westbrook does where they can just score every point, get every rebound, and dish every assist. But make no mistake, Tatum is leagues better than Kyle Kuzma - that debate was settled long ago.
Tatum could make the Wizards a playoff team (or play-in team at worst). Put some respect on this man
no he couldnāt man
He could. He does everything on the court at an extremely high level. They have nobody that can score OR defend like him, probably not that can pass that well either
I want Kuzma for the 76ers i feel heās a great PF for next to Embiid
Didn't the Sixers just run old Tobias Harris out of town? Now you want young Tobias Harris there?
No
/closethread
Watching Boston win a title really does make LA fans lose their minds.
Kuzma hasn't been in LA for three seasons. What are you talking about?
Some garbage. But he needs internet meme clout from other people who donāt actually watch the NBA
I didnāt check but Iām sure youāre an LA fan. Edit: even worse, a salty Mavericks fan. Why are you mad, you never had a chance.
Literally the only people with this take are Lakers fans still smoldering about this debate. Iāve never seen a Wizards fan claim Kuzma is better than Tatum. Guarantee the reply-guy is a Lakers fan.
No Lakers fan in history thinks Kuzma is a centerpiece. He's gotten better since he left. He was a great find for the Lakers, late pick and helped win a chip. He's been mostly forgotten in L.A. The bigger regret is choosing THT over Caruso.
I appreciate that everyone feels that way now. But I was around for the Kuzma > Tatum conversations and I'm sure they're archived on Reddit too. It was a not-uncommon sentiment from Lakers fans. A good example among many: https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/ael81u/is_kyle_kuzma_better_than_jayson_tatum_by_a_fair/
Oh, yeah. He is better than Tatum, bc Tatum sucks and is probably in a fetal position somewhere trembling. I mean MAX Christie is better than Tatum we all know that. You can't build around any of them. š¤£ I just meant this post. Maybe OP is a Laker fan idk.
A contender for the number one draft pick.
OK that was funny
Whoever actually believes that is straight up braindead. Kuzma isn't even on the same stratosphere as Tatum
If you sub tabum for kuzmom the Celtics probably need KP for more than one game to win the title.
Yāall have let these stupid repetitive jokes rot your brains.
Tatum and Kuzma was never a debate tho
Their rookie year they had similar counting stats, though anyone who watched the games knew it wasnt close
Anyone looking at the birthdates knew it
In the mind of LAL fans it was
I always thought it was Ingram vs Tatum.
By my definition, building around a player like Kuzma starts with finding 2 better players than him. If that is included and successful, sure, they can win. If the question is, would a roster of 8 players, Kuzma and 7 just as good player as him (so he can be the de facto best player on the team), perfectly fit with each other, win the title, the question is no, most likely not.
Damn Iām an unc now? During that time it was a legitimate debate. For what Boston needed Tatum was perfect, he wasnāt offensively dominant at that point. Iirc he barely scored over 25 points a few times and he was much younger He was drafted into a good team that had came off an ECF appearance so the situations are also different At that point, purely scoring. Kuzma was better, but obviously thatās no longer the case and Tatum is clearly the better player. Tatum was also the better defender between the two but.. damn I remember these debates. That was 7 years ago..
Why ask? Washington did have a team built around Kuzma. With KP last year. How's it going so far for the WWS?
Calling the Wizards a team ābuilt around Kuzmaā is delusional. Itās a team with Kuzma as its main star. There was absolutely no team building involved.
What's the difference? "Build around" means he is your number 1, then put pieces around him. Let's say the reverse: What if you trade Jokic for KK? You'd have Jokic, Gafford and Poole. I'd say that team makes the playoffs easily. Same as every top player swapped for KK.
jokic, gafford, and poole? thatās a play in team lol
How do you build around a role player
What's the roster? Is it like Jokic, Luka, Giannis, Embiid? If it is, yeah they might win.
Lmaooooo
Man yāall may hate this comment, but Iāve seen Kuz in live actionā¦dat boy aināt NO JOKE! Iāve played against a few NBA players and everytime it really puts into perspective why theyāre in the league and Iām just a pickup player ššššššššš Seriously tho, Kuz can ball. I think the comment I saw where if heās your best option you wonāt win, and that is 100% true but I do think paired with an elite guard like an Edwards or Doncic weāll see his game get to another level.
NBA level talent is crazy. I remember Dlo said on a podcase that Reeves could hold his own at any \[street\] court. Like? The dude was a starter for a WCF final team. OF COURSE he could beat dudes on the street lmao wtf
Absolute facts!
Can't believe this was a debate. Kuzma is clear
The only people debating this were Lakers fans lmao. They literally regard any player that plays for that organization as an elite player. Lakers fans are so delusional when it comes to actual player analysis (āAustin Reaves is so good! Heās developing into an elite player and will elevate usā)
Also Tatum vs Brandon Ingramā¦when he was on the lakers. Once these players get traded away from the lakers the discussion ends. Wonder why that is.
Ingram is at least 2/ 3 kuzmas in value.. Maybe not Stat wise.. But impact wise
Yeah Ingram is still relevant. I honestly forgot kuzma was still in the league till this post
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I have zero recollection of that discussion. Ingram was mostly slandered and slept on until he left the Lakers. Same with Lonzo. Every fan base hypes their players, but only Lakers get slandered to the degree they do.
Just search āIngram Tatumā in the lakers sub and youāll get endless conversations comparing the two they often resort to Ingram the lakers being better. Listen, I get itās home town fans defending their guy, but there are a ton of takes like these: Of the 95 players in the NBA that ran at least 100 isolation plays Jayson Tatum ranks 95th of 95. Brandon Ingram ranks 11th btw. https://www.reddit.com/r/lakers/s/gv69X5o4qi Am I crazy to think Ingram/Kuzma are more valuable than Tatum/Brown? Everyone is saying the Pelicans need to wait for the offseason to trade AD so Boston can get their "monster offer" in with Tatum/Brown. I think it's bizarre to call that a monster offer when I think that Ingram Kuzma are better as a duo offer than those two. Ingram is the best defensive player of that group, Kuzma is the best offensive player of that group. Both Tatum and Brown have regressed from last season while Ingram has at least been steady from last year (his defense is signifcantly better imo) and Kuzma has increased his offensive repertoire . The only clear advantage I see the celtics having is being able to offer that Memphis pick which could be 9th this year. The Clippers pick probably won't convey and will end up being a second rounder. The Kings pick could also be fairly good, though it is #1 protected and most people are saying this is a one man draft. So guys, am I biased/Crazy? https://www.reddit.com/r/lakers/s/50MYLdd1qm Brandon Ingram VS Jayson Tatum What is the common belief around r/NBA and this subreddit? I know Jayson Tatum had a good playoff run for a rookie but if given the opportunity, I definitely believe Brandon Ingram would kill it in the playoffs to a greater extent. https://www.reddit.com/r/lakers/s/gOTEwFciI8
A team fan page hyping up their own players. That's weird.
Itās not āslanderā if the conversations happened on a regular basis. Thatās the point Thereās also a ton of threads about āwe gotta trade Kobe!ā. That was a legit faction of the fanbase in his later years
What you see on fan pages isn't evidence of anything. Every team fan page has conversations like that. What was happening on NBA and other general forums was far more negative toward Lakers young core than was warranted. Every one of them turned out better than was general option.
They both wear 0 so theyāre basically the same
Bruh thatās the wizardsā¦ but still no
As a Wizards fan, Kuzna is trash but I also donāt like Tatum
Couldn't they have used a pic of Kuzma on WAS to really drive this home?
If he was drafted onto a one seed, yes
Sure if heās the number 3 guy. But at that point you a rent building around him, heās just happens to be on the team
No. Tatum worked on improving, Kuzma has not
If Kuz is your #3, you are likely to be a title contender. If Kuz is your #2, you probably arenāt a playoff team.
If you replace Tatum with Kuzma do they win this year? Iām not 100% convinced on that. I think the lowest caliber player you could have switched Tatum with and still win the ring would be healthy PG. I think thatās the comp, PG v Tatum.
I mean, Washington is currently attempting to build a team around Kuzma, something tells me their ECF appearance drought since 1979 will continue on.
I remember the debate being between Kuzma and Ball?
I'll never get my kudos for rightfully calling this an idiotic argument
Letās put it this way if you put Kuzma on the Celtics this year in place of Tatum, if Porzingis is healthy the entire time they still win the title if Porzingis is still injured as much as he actually was then they probably lose in the semifinals in a close series to the Pacers
Tatum vs Kuz was only a debate Laker fan boys created to feel relevant. Anyone who knew anything saw Tatum was going to be better than Kuz.
Anyone who was not a Lakers or a Sixers fan knew the Celtics took Tatum with the #1 pick but at the #3 spot. They only traded the pick when they were confident neither of them would take him at #1 or #2.
Fuck no
Tatum won a championship and kuzma was along for the ride.
If part of that roster construction meant getting him an actual superstar then maybe.
Let me answer your question with a a question - if Kuzma were in Tatumās shoes during the Celtics ā24 playoff run, would he be able to adapt to a more selfless, team oriented style of play when his shots werenāt falling? Tatum has been universally regarded as the #1 option on the team for years but had no problem taking on a facilitator role for the majority of the playoffs to ensure the win while effective sacrificing a potential FMVP. Would Kuzma (or any of your other favorite superstars) be willing to do the same?
I rather build around Kuzma than Poole.
They would do it What are they gonna say now
No. Next question.
Yeah itās a no from me, dog. Any contending team has to have a player better than Kuz, so the team effectively wouldnāt be built around him.
Play-in contender
If Kuzma doesn't end up being mentored by LeBron, he just becomes another chucker that doesn't pass or play defense.
Kuzma is butt
I wouldāve been offended by saying real uncs remember that debate, but then I remember seeing the XXL list yesterday.
The post below this one starts with āFrankly laughableā, which I find perfect for your question
No.
This championship will unlock Tatum. He is now a champ. He can now do him and canāt no say anything. He will be better next year.
No lmao
Light skinned ns... Owners feel half bad I just watched Clipped and They did Blake Griffin bogus Sucks when you have to play with LeBron
I think if you put Kuzma on the '23-'24 Celtics he would've been a great fit and 2 time NBA champion.
It'll be similar to Antawn Jamison Warriors
I literally don't remember this debate. We all knew Kuzma was trash and Tatum was a stud.
Kuzma can be a nice piece for a contender. However if heās any higher than your 4th option then youāre probably not a contender.
Yeah, I think they would. Kuzma not the most consistent, but a unit with defensive ideology with consistent scoring with Kuzma as the standard would be a contender for sure.
If you put Tatum on the Wizards and Kuz on the Celtics, then the Celtics probably still win the championship
Id say no. The Cs still make the playoffs. The Wiz go from horrible to 6-8 seed.
Idk if yāall watched this season but Jayson Tatum looked like the champion he became. He was a total and complete team-game-of-basketball player. Kuzma is not a bad player by any stretch but the debate between him and Tatum is ridiculous, and the āreal uncsā who remember this debate are the ESPN Laker fans who only think one team matters
Not too much on Kuz tho. Heās well rounded. Good frame. Confident. I can see him doing more moving forward.
Contender for the 8th seed maybe
Yeah if you built the 1996 bulls around him theyād be champions
Hypothetically the Lakers could have drafted Tatum and Jalen but they took Kuzma and Ingram instead, so thereās thatā¦.
Not in Boston
No lol
Bruh that's the Wizards
Kuzma was drafted 27th. Why is this even a comparison lol
Kuzma is a top X player in the league (fill in the blank).
No
The debate was only made by Laker fans
Conference mvp? All nba? All star selections? Leading the playoffs in stats?
Hell fuckin no lmao
Lol fuck no. Kuzma doesn't really take basketball seriously enough. He's like Nick Young is a sense as they both had pretty good potential but satisfied where they currently are.
Replace Tatum with Kuz and the Celtics still probably make the finals last year, led by JB, but donāt beat the Mavs
No, Kuzma wasn't the focus in L. A.
Drop kuz on the celts this past finals and they still win so whatever
The team wouldnāt be āaround kuzmaā but if b4 this year Boston traded Tatum for Kuz 1 for 1 they would still prolly win, but the finals would hav been closer
This was legitimately never a debate. Big time Revisionist history to say it was. Kuzma then and now is a role player who can do some things well. Very inconsistent. As a 4th option or bench guy, heās a good player. This has always been clear. While Tatum is has been the number one option his whole career
By this logic kuzma > Luka
I see where you could go with this. But even if kuzma was premiered more in offense and so on, there are levels. And kuz is unfortunately at least 1 tier below Tatum minimum. Argument: Change Tatum and Kuz, what happens? Wizards improve by a healthy margin and Boston has to probably go to game 6 or 7 before winning it all, if at all. Thatās how big of a difference there is between them in my opinion.
Tatum and Kuzma was never a debate.