Hmm, I feel like a level 8 mind-affecting touch attack spell should maybe do a bit more than this. It effectively just takes a single enemy out of the fight for a couple of rounds, gives them a slight defensive debuff, and makes them provoke AoOs.
Terrible Remorse has a pretty similar effect at half the spell level, and that one can be done from close range without any attack rolls needed.
You say that, but that's only if you judge by the average of monsters that appear in the bestiary, and few GMs just pick monsters at random from the bestiary, especially at the levels where they're winding up for the BBEG and climax. I was once playing a wizard that was attacked by a "naked" shadowdancer with something like 54 Dex at *level 7*. (The GM screamed when I rolled a nat 20 with [Dimensional Anchor](https://aonprd.com/SpellDisplay.aspx?ItemName=Dimensional%20Anchor), because the plan was explicitly for this enemy to kidnap my character. I hadn't realized at the time that the enemy's AC was *ALL* Dex at the time, and only a nat 20 would hit, or I wouldn't have tried casting it.) If you take touch attacks for granted, most GMs *will* pull something with stupid high Dex out on you.
That requires I know the target has a touch AC of 37 before making the attack, which I didn't. Also, at level 7, I didn't even take Quicken Spell yet, and SL 4 was my highest-level spell level. This was basically a "you're supposed to lose" battle against a threat the GM openly said she couldn't believe we beat, and apparently killing her so fast before getting kidnapped ruined some sort of plot before it even started.
I always get this confused with lower-level spells like [Hideous Laughter](https://aonprd.com/SpellDisplay.aspx?ItemName=Hideous%20Laughter) or [Jitterbugs](https://aonprd.com/SpellDisplay.aspx?ItemName=Jitterbugs) since this one is so high-level I basically never see it. Also, I always forget about it and get surprised it's such a high-level spell any time I notice pixie with irrisistable dance is somehow on [SNA 9](https://aonprd.com/SpellDisplay.aspx?ItemName=Summon%20Nature%27s%20Ally%209) next to a storm giant because nobody uses it; this spell has basically the same effect that you'd expect from a SL 2 or 3. It isn't even rounds/level for an effect not quite as crippling as [Hold Person](https://aonprd.com/SpellDisplay.aspx?ItemName=Hold%20Person).
This is a legacy spell from 2e AD&D, so they included it, but I have to think that maybe they should have been no save but maybe concentration (so that the caster "leads the dance")? At least then it would *actually* be "irresistable". (You know, besides the touch attack and SR.) Maybe the name is ironic? Because between two rolls this spell can fail to do anything, a third to only last one round, and how common \[mind-affecting\] immunity is at this level, I will bet good money this spell is getting resisted one way or another. ~~There is no excuse for a SL 8 to not be AoE, SR: no, no save or at least partial save.~~ OK, I just missed the last line again, there is a partial save, which means it has a weak excuse. It lasts 1 round even if they save, and keep in mind, at this level, due to Wis scaling anything worth casting a single-target will save at *absolutely will* make the save, no matter how much you pump DC. 1 round effect even if they save, however, still requires touching (and even a bard is going to be cautious of going into melee at this level, much less wizards or witches) and beating SR on a target without \[mind-affecting\] immunity, so it's still unlikely to even get to the save.
You're missing that it still lasts a round on a save.
You cast this and the boss is not just wasting an entire round, but provoking AoOs and taking big penalties to reflex and AC.
(Edited previous because I did miss this.)
It trades an action and an SL 8 for a turn with the boss *if* you beat the touch and SR and it isn't immune to \[mind-affecting\]. Nothing worth casting single-target SL8s on will be lacking SR. *Yeeeeah*, I'm still holding out for [Clashing Rocks](https://aonprd.com/SpellDisplay.aspx?ItemName=Clashing%20Rocks), whose trip attack (and damage too, I guess) has no save, no touch attack (or CMD), and no SR. Prone also gives the same AC penalty this does, and triggers AoOs when they try to stand. -10 to reflex is certainly nice, but we're trying to avoid saves here, aren't we?
Even on the level, [Maze](https://aonprd.com/SpellDisplay.aspx?ItemName=Maze) is "only" SR and lets you surround the target before it reappears, and for a level below, I recall you advocating Paizo's inconsistent save descriptions meant [Maddening Oubliette](https://aonprd.com/SpellDisplay.aspx?ItemName=Maddening%20Oubliette) only allowed a save after they were in the other dimension for another "only" SR (although that 1 round cast time will get you killed). The closest to this spell, [Euphoric Tranquility](https://aonprd.com/SpellDisplay.aspx?ItemName=Euphoric%20Tranquility) is no save until *after* you hit them (making it easier to crowd around and delay to set up the full attacks after everything else is dead) and rounds/level with touch and SR.
I mean, it certainly goes from "not worth remembering it exists" to "generally not the best tool in the toolbelt", but it's not at all guaranteed to work.
Clashing rocks is just mediocre damage, can't trip a flying enemy.
Those other spells don't give the party an entire turn to focus the enemy.
One round with no actions, AoOs and an AC penalty should be plenty for the rest of the party to kill literally anything.
A psychic inception stare mesmerist with an extend metamagic rod could have some fun with it.
Because everyone wants to see the Lich King perform the hustle.
Outside of the hilarity of making the BBEG do a funny dance, this is mostly just worse than Maze. The only reason I could imagine using this over that is if you know the creature you'll really want to disable is a minotaur or has a stupid high intelligence mod (and a low wisdom save) OR they'll have access to plane shift (and in the case of plane shift, you're still trading your turn and spell slot for the turn and spell slot of a creature likely much meaner than you).
And you have to know all of this at the time you're preparing spells (somewhat possible, though very unlikely) or choosing spells known (no shot)
Hmm, I feel like a level 8 mind-affecting touch attack spell should maybe do a bit more than this. It effectively just takes a single enemy out of the fight for a couple of rounds, gives them a slight defensive debuff, and makes them provoke AoOs. Terrible Remorse has a pretty similar effect at half the spell level, and that one can be done from close range without any attack rolls needed.
Yes, but this one makes them dance. Don't you wanna see the big bad wizard do a jig?
The big part is still taking them completely out for a round on a passed save.
If you hit the melee touch attack. Which is not guaranteed, and for most of the classes which can cast this, not very safe either.
It's a touch attack, you probably hit on a 2 by this level.
You say that, but that's only if you judge by the average of monsters that appear in the bestiary, and few GMs just pick monsters at random from the bestiary, especially at the levels where they're winding up for the BBEG and climax. I was once playing a wizard that was attacked by a "naked" shadowdancer with something like 54 Dex at *level 7*. (The GM screamed when I rolled a nat 20 with [Dimensional Anchor](https://aonprd.com/SpellDisplay.aspx?ItemName=Dimensional%20Anchor), because the plan was explicitly for this enemy to kidnap my character. I hadn't realized at the time that the enemy's AC was *ALL* Dex at the time, and only a nat 20 would hit, or I wouldn't have tried casting it.) If you take touch attacks for granted, most GMs *will* pull something with stupid high Dex out on you.
*That's* why you should always prepare a quickened True Strike or two.
That requires I know the target has a touch AC of 37 before making the attack, which I didn't. Also, at level 7, I didn't even take Quicken Spell yet, and SL 4 was my highest-level spell level. This was basically a "you're supposed to lose" battle against a threat the GM openly said she couldn't believe we beat, and apparently killing her so fast before getting kidnapped ruined some sort of plot before it even started.
reach metamagic solves that
Can’t Stop Doing The Monkey
I always get this confused with lower-level spells like [Hideous Laughter](https://aonprd.com/SpellDisplay.aspx?ItemName=Hideous%20Laughter) or [Jitterbugs](https://aonprd.com/SpellDisplay.aspx?ItemName=Jitterbugs) since this one is so high-level I basically never see it. Also, I always forget about it and get surprised it's such a high-level spell any time I notice pixie with irrisistable dance is somehow on [SNA 9](https://aonprd.com/SpellDisplay.aspx?ItemName=Summon%20Nature%27s%20Ally%209) next to a storm giant because nobody uses it; this spell has basically the same effect that you'd expect from a SL 2 or 3. It isn't even rounds/level for an effect not quite as crippling as [Hold Person](https://aonprd.com/SpellDisplay.aspx?ItemName=Hold%20Person). This is a legacy spell from 2e AD&D, so they included it, but I have to think that maybe they should have been no save but maybe concentration (so that the caster "leads the dance")? At least then it would *actually* be "irresistable". (You know, besides the touch attack and SR.) Maybe the name is ironic? Because between two rolls this spell can fail to do anything, a third to only last one round, and how common \[mind-affecting\] immunity is at this level, I will bet good money this spell is getting resisted one way or another. ~~There is no excuse for a SL 8 to not be AoE, SR: no, no save or at least partial save.~~ OK, I just missed the last line again, there is a partial save, which means it has a weak excuse. It lasts 1 round even if they save, and keep in mind, at this level, due to Wis scaling anything worth casting a single-target will save at *absolutely will* make the save, no matter how much you pump DC. 1 round effect even if they save, however, still requires touching (and even a bard is going to be cautious of going into melee at this level, much less wizards or witches) and beating SR on a target without \[mind-affecting\] immunity, so it's still unlikely to even get to the save.
You're missing that it still lasts a round on a save. You cast this and the boss is not just wasting an entire round, but provoking AoOs and taking big penalties to reflex and AC.
(Edited previous because I did miss this.) It trades an action and an SL 8 for a turn with the boss *if* you beat the touch and SR and it isn't immune to \[mind-affecting\]. Nothing worth casting single-target SL8s on will be lacking SR. *Yeeeeah*, I'm still holding out for [Clashing Rocks](https://aonprd.com/SpellDisplay.aspx?ItemName=Clashing%20Rocks), whose trip attack (and damage too, I guess) has no save, no touch attack (or CMD), and no SR. Prone also gives the same AC penalty this does, and triggers AoOs when they try to stand. -10 to reflex is certainly nice, but we're trying to avoid saves here, aren't we? Even on the level, [Maze](https://aonprd.com/SpellDisplay.aspx?ItemName=Maze) is "only" SR and lets you surround the target before it reappears, and for a level below, I recall you advocating Paizo's inconsistent save descriptions meant [Maddening Oubliette](https://aonprd.com/SpellDisplay.aspx?ItemName=Maddening%20Oubliette) only allowed a save after they were in the other dimension for another "only" SR (although that 1 round cast time will get you killed). The closest to this spell, [Euphoric Tranquility](https://aonprd.com/SpellDisplay.aspx?ItemName=Euphoric%20Tranquility) is no save until *after* you hit them (making it easier to crowd around and delay to set up the full attacks after everything else is dead) and rounds/level with touch and SR. I mean, it certainly goes from "not worth remembering it exists" to "generally not the best tool in the toolbelt", but it's not at all guaranteed to work.
Clashing rocks is just mediocre damage, can't trip a flying enemy. Those other spells don't give the party an entire turn to focus the enemy. One round with no actions, AoOs and an AC penalty should be plenty for the rest of the party to kill literally anything.
Save or still suck that takes away they're turn grants free AoOs and applies penalties. High level, but effective
A psychic inception stare mesmerist with an extend metamagic rod could have some fun with it. Because everyone wants to see the Lich King perform the hustle.
Outside of the hilarity of making the BBEG do a funny dance, this is mostly just worse than Maze. The only reason I could imagine using this over that is if you know the creature you'll really want to disable is a minotaur or has a stupid high intelligence mod (and a low wisdom save) OR they'll have access to plane shift (and in the case of plane shift, you're still trading your turn and spell slot for the turn and spell slot of a creature likely much meaner than you). And you have to know all of this at the time you're preparing spells (somewhat possible, though very unlikely) or choosing spells known (no shot)
With maze, the party can't attack the target.