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My boyfriend won't let me go.
He says I have to bring him with me!
NOW how am I supposed to cheat on him?
Edit: What the flip guys? I have no boyfriend and i'm just making a joke?!
yeah, it’s funny how that works. i guess it's all about the context and perception people have of relationships. double standards can be weird sometimes
But, what if you didn't have plans, she just doesn't want you to go and you know it's going to be a big problem for you at home if you go anyway?
Are you still supposed to say, "I have plans with my girlfriend"?
Then you're supposed to talk to your girlfriend, work together to find out why she's feeling that way, (let's use she feels like you don't spend enough time together an example), you work together to figure out what you both define as spending enough time together, then you either work through the problem or break up amicably if you find an incompatibility you can't resolve
To be the best person you can be, regardless of gender you aren't supposed to rag on your partners to your friends so "I have plans with my girlfriend" would be better than calling her a control freak to your mates, even if it's true
Which proves the point of the post. The responsibility is on the man to break up or reconsider being with her or talk it out, etc. But when it's the woman who's in this situation, then people get worried, she doesn't have that responsibility to talk it out she's a victim.
But then again, there's a reason why there are double standards, as less men get abused by women than women do by men. But it does happen. As a man, you can be stuck with a wife and a house with a mortgage and no money and three kids going to school and be emotionally abused.
No it doesn't, it's everyone's responsibility, men and women, to constructively work through problems with their partner and to break up when it's not working. No matter your gender, you need to approach your relationships proactively, with reasonable standards and you have to work with your partner to either meet each other's standards or determine that you're incompatible and break up
I A G R E E !
However, we are here talking about a social stigma, a double standard of some sorts, where society takes a man's situation of abuse less seriously than a woman's.
While we should definitely have relationships where men and women are on equal footing and able to communicate respectfully, these two situations can coexist.
> If a male stands up to his female abuser, it's unlikely\* he'll be beaten half to, if not to death.
However, thanks to all the biases and stigmas, an abusive female can essentially blackmail the male by threatening to call the police, who would pretty certainly see the male as the abuser if the crying female tells them he beat (or worse) her.
>The responsibility is on the man to break up or reconsider being with her or talk it out, etc. But when it's the woman who's in this situation, then people get worried, she doesn't have that responsibility to talk it out she's a victim.
Incorrect - if you are in an uncomfortable situation it is up to you to make moves to change that.
>Which proves the point of the post. The responsibility is on the man to break up or reconsider being with her or talk it out, etc.
How did you get that? If you're not being treated right in a relationship, it's your responsibility to break it off no matter of gender
You're an adult, you're responsible for your own choices, if she's a psycho choose to break up with her
Going to your friends for advice with a problem your having in your life isn't the same as ragging on your partner. You can discuss problems with your support network healthily, you can even have a little vent, just make sure you aren't being negative for no reason (for yourself more than anyone else)
[Communication?](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tk6Mjg3_eq0) Wouldn't it be better to stuff all of that angst and uncertainty into a quiet little corner in your stomach? That way it can fester and eat its way through the lining and let you die just a little earlier than you had planned.
> she just doesn't want you to go and you know it's going to be a big problem for you at home if you go anyway?
>she just doesn't want you to go
If they truly just don't want you to go and have no reasons beyond that then as the other commentor said, it shouldn't be ok. That's emotionally controlling behavior and potentially alienation from friends and family.
Relationships are about discussion, understanding, and compromise from both sides.
It's one thing to say "Hey I was hoping we could spend time together or" "Hey you promised we would spend the night together" or "Hey when you go out with the boys you get wasted and don't come home at a reasonable hour and it worries me" and be upset if the other partner doesn't consider those things and how what they're doing effects their partner.
However it's not ok just just not want something for no clear reason and then treat someone badly for it.
It should not be like that. If you want to go out with friends or plan a trip or whatever with your friends there should not be a problem, if you don't have already or are not planning anything with your partner in the same time period. If your partner does not want or like you to go, there needs to be a discussion on why it is so, and depending on the why, is it justifiable or no? But in a healthy relationship there should never be a "I forbid you to...".
This, right? I'm a guy in my 30's, I have friends in my 30's and 40's, and often it comes up where their partner "has called dibs" and that's fine. It's important to have partner time
Yeah, there's a difference between "sorry I'm doing stuff with my gf today" and "my girlfriend literally won't let me hang out with you".
I find the latter equally as controlling and worrisome, unless there's some reason like that person actually being dangerous or something. You should be able to trust your partner.
Hard agree. In my 30s. I think most men and women our age would think the same thing “oh, so your partner’s controlling and your relationship is toxic?”
It is equally controlling, but OP is right that the general perception is different. Woman can definitely still be abusive I know that's a thing, but there's definitely more of a general perception of a man being physically controlling if his woman "gets out of line". So I can see "my boyfriend won't let me" sounding possibly worse. Definitely a double standard though. Women seem to get a pass for being "crazy" when it really can be more like emotional abuse and controlling.
But men often use that line as an excuse when they don't feel like hanging out themselves, it's an easy out to blame it on their girlfriend. And it leads to a relatable exchange of laughter.
I think the double standard is in the assumption that when a guy is "not allowed" it's because he's just choosing his consequences. He has the agency to weigh if he would rather do the thing or have an argument, and since he loves her, he'd also personally rather not make her sad.
But when a girl is "not allowed" it's more likely to be something worse.
Idk, I've seen my share of situations where the first applies to women and the second to men. It's dangerous to assume that a penis protects you from abuse
Yeah I said "assumption" and "more likely"
It's not that we always assume all the time, and it's not a justification. But society can't function without some reasonable assumptions. We use nonverbal cues as well to decide when to assume what.
I personally avoid the word "allow" because I don't want either of us to think we're allowed to forbid the other to do things. "Allow" is reserved for serious things like that one use just now, and actual medical things. Like "You're not allowed to skip your medicine"
I don't know though, I had a friend whose ex would take concern with any woman being around him. He went to go see a friend he hadn't seen in a long time and likely wouldn't again for awhile, but for no reason other than that friend is a woman did she have a problem.
Yes men can be more physically threatening or intimidating in some circumstances, but like physical abuse, it doesn't make that behaviour less concerning.
Its absolutely not the same amount of worrisome at all. Maybe for you but the vast majority of people find it to be normal for girls to do that to men.
I think in some situations, it might be alright for both ways, even "wont allow" is somewhat consensual since they are generally choosing to stick with the relationship.
Like, "my girlfriend doesnt allow me to go to strip clubs" isnt that problematic, or "my boyfriend doesnt allow me to go out after 12PM" could be done out of a genuine concern for safety, and both are rules they are generally choosing to follow.
Of course, "my X doesnt *want* me to do Y, and Im choosing to follow it" would be more accurate, but its also unnecessarily long and doesnt come with the perk of pushing the blame on someone else.
As for why its more concerning when men do it to women, thats just because historically, there were much more women stuck in an abusive relationship with men than the reverse, and the same probably still holds true today.
it absolutely shouldn't be. in my experience, that girl is usually abusing him in other ways too. my fiancé's ex was like this, and she was a monster. i don't like or trust women who act like this. if a friend of one's male partner is truly a bad person or bad friend, there's ways to go about having that talk. i have before. but in general, fuckin noooope
My ex was like this. She was so jealous accusing me of cheating or planning to cheat constantly. Wouldnt let me go out with anyone like ever. On the rare occasion I did she would guilt trip and gaslight TF out of me. It was truly awful
Gaslighting is the worst. I think she persistently accused me of cheating as sort of a pre-excuse for when and if she decided to. It’s impossible to understand and love these types, the constant manipulating and gaslighting makes it impossible.
i'm so sorry that happened to you. i believe you, and you didn't deserve any of that. my fiancé's ex did the same thing, and she was an absolutely egregious cheater. she cheated on him with like ten different guys in the four years they were together. people like this are genuinely scary and dangerous.
> normal for girls to do that to men.
a disturbing amount of people seem to find it normal to refer to relationships between two adults as "girls and men"
This is true for many things, as well.
A man saying his wife thinks he needs to eat more vegetables? She is just looking out for him and wants him to be more healthy?
A wife saying her husband thinks she needs to eat more vegetables? A man trying to control a woman's body and life.
I remember buying my mom some fancy cleaning things one year, and people were acting all shocked.
Meanwhile she was up early the next day, beaming while testing out some extension to reach hard areas without having to climb onto something.
I bought my wife a Dyson Air Straight for her birthday and got absolutely blasted about it online from ignorant people thinking Dyson = Vacuum cleaner and therefore I'm a sexist pig for getting my wife cleaning stuff. I had to explain it was a hair dryer so many times.
People seem to be so fucking quick to jump down throats for literally anything.
That just sounds like someone who likes to complain, but in general getting women functional/utilitarian gifts is viewed as a big social no-no versus men getting those same type of gifts. Think of it this way: women’s holidays (Valentines Day, Mother’s Day, etc.) are all about chocolate, jewelry, and fun stuff; men’s holidays are all about razors, socks, grill equipment, lawnmowers, and other chore/work-related gifts.
I've bought my wife cooking/baking utensils and tools on many occasions and she's always so happy with it. She's also asked for a dish washer and said she's happy to have it as a birthday or Christmas gift. Unfortunately some women like being homemakers and doing things like baking etc and some people don't like that. She also does most of the DIY around the house and she never had a toolbox or all the tools she needed. So one anniversary I bought her a toolbox and loads of tools and I think it's her favourite gift she's ever got. I have bought her other things as well like watches, perfume, shoes etc
People sometimes look at me strangely when I either take coffee or iced tea away from my wife after she orders it or stop her from ordering it.
What they don't see is what happens hours later at 2am if I don't stop her, my wife complaining she can't sleep and asking me why I didn't remember to stop her...
I sometimes feel the need to explain this and then my wife confirms it, but it still feels like we are breaking some social rules by doing this.
It's just the way it is. I'm not even complaining as a guy, but like look at how, in a lot of cities, there are shelters for women who are victims of domestic abuse but not for men. Women in need are helped, men in need know they have to figure it out on their own.
As most things in life for men, I can't remember once in my life someone helped me, except for my parents and my wife, I had to figure out most things for myself.
Edit: once I needed to offload some mental things, and I had a long talk with my girlfriend, first she listened, but a few days later she started to bring stuff up, AND making fun of them and me, we broke up a month later.
And if someone does help you.... It is almost never a woman, it is a man in your life. Who do most men vent to? Their drinking buddies. Why? The men listen and understand. Damn near every guy has opened up to a woman and that shit happened to them... so they learned to just never share their vulnerabilities to women.
The only times women I don't know have offered me any type of real help when it wasn't literally their job to do so is women seeing me walking offering me a ride into town and its still mostly men that do so.
The reality is most women don't realize how little kindness most men actually experience in our lives, especially from the opposite sex. And I say this as a guy with mostly female friends. The simple truth is I don't think most women **intentionally** do so knowing how dehumanizing it is... but that difference isn't exactly important with how it feels. Much like how men don't understand how some women get bothered by the amount of attention that they do get.
One of the issues is, that no one in this scenario gets help. My wife is an abusive alcoholic. I have nowhere to go with my specific situation, because there is no shelter for men with children and she isn't getting aware of her problem, because every piece of advertisement, homepages, etc. only talk about alcoholic men.
She moved out last week and I went to Alanon the first time on Friday, after four years of hell for me and the children. If there wasn't such a huge bias on the topic I would have gotten help three years ago, when her drinking started to get really bad. The only advice you get is "Wtf, just leave her!?!?!", but in a grown up world there is more than just right and wrong.
I went to church as a kid. The preacher would often joke that if a man is the head of the household, the wife is clearly the neck... turning the head to see and go where she wants him to....
While I guess it’s not seen as large of a red flag, women definitely get labeled and blamed as controlling if there’s a perception that they are a “wet blanket” for the boyfriend.
I used to get so mad at my High School boyfriend because his friends would ask him to do stuff and he'd just tell them "Oh, sorry, HollyBerries won't let me" and not ever even bring it up to me. It was never for something that I would've objected to like "Hey let's go drop rocks off a bridge onto cars" he just used me as an excuse for basic hanging out that he wanted to skip and made me look like a psycho to his friends.
Yep I had an ex that did exactly that to me. I wondered why her family and friends seemed standoffish and kept giving me a hard time, turns out she was using me to get out of a bunch of shit by blaming me.
Yeah, it's a bit ridiculous, ain't it?
It's the opposite for me... My boyfriend doesn't use me as an excuse (not that I am aware of anyway) for declining to hang out with his friends. I am always encouraging him to go without me to hang out with his friends, but he refuses to do it without me. I am flattered, and I do enjoy doing everything together with him. We're very active people.
The problem I have with him refusing to hang out with his friends is that they start accusing me of shit, and one of his friends has openedly admitted that he hates me because my boyfriend hasn't bother to hang out with him for months... again. I feel deeply hurt by this, as it's not me that is preventing him, it is a him problem. Even this weekend, I gently suggested he should go and visit his friend (who hates me) while I cleaned the house. He was moaning about not doing anything besides cleaning that seriously needed to be done. But once again, he refused to, and he would rather do something with me. I would go along with him, but the last couple of times, I felt very unwelcome.
It really sucks that his friends think of me as someone that I am not. I am not even sure what to do? They've met me, and I am always smily, cheerful, respectful, and interactive. Also, his friends share very similar interests to me. So, I don't get it? It's like they take one look at me and have already made their minds up about me.
That just sucks to hear. I think your bf has insecurities about not being with you either with the assumption you'd go off with someone else, or maybe he's just not used to doing things on his own anymore and wants you around for the moral support.
I can only suggest to keep pushing for him to see his friends on his own. Idk if you should say how you feel about his friends hating you unless he already knows this, but it's definitely one of those awkward situations.
One of my friends has to ask his SO permission to do literally *anything*.. She generally says no and then gives him a hard time. She's a fucking douchebag and no one in our friendship group likes her. It's almost as if she thinks because she's hot (she is) it gives her carte-blanche ability to 100% rule his life for him.
You can't tell a dude what to do though.. You can only commiserate and get on with your life. One day he'll get the memo.
I noticed that my friend wasn't allowed to do anything with me after work because his girlfriend thought that I wasn't a good influence on him. I knew him way longer he didn't act this way when he was in a different relationship. This is how I knew he was in a toxic relationship with a controlling girlfriend.
It's less men vs women and more physical vs mental.
Think about it in terms of physical vs mental abuse. Physical vs mental trauma. Physical vs mental disabilities.
Soldier who lost an arm vs one who has PTSD. Or school shooting victim vs the one who had to hide underneath their classmate's body. Beating your kid vs yelling at them.
Generally more care is allocated to you if the danger or trauma is physical vs mental, which leads to people worrying more about the physically abusive boyfriend rather than the mentally abusive girlfriend.
I think this is the elephant in the room op has overlooked.
In most cases, the female in the relationship isnt able to physically intimate or over power the male.
Thats the concern when a woman "isn't allowed" to do something. The repercussions and consequences are far more troubling than just being in the dog house with the Mrs.
Your take here is part of the problem OP is pointing out IMO. The basis of "being able to physically intimidate/overpower" is not the end all be all in any capacity. DV stats are *much* closer than a lot of people like to think. A guy going home to a violent wife isn't taken as seriously as a woman going home to a violent husband because of this underlying assumption that the guy can take it, or stop her whenever he wants. A man who *isn't* *going* to physically overpower and intimidate his abusive wife is in the *same* position as a woman who *can't* physically overpower and intimidate her abusive husband as far as the power dynamics of that situation go.
Domestic homicide stats are not closer, however. So no, a person who won't confront their abuser is not in the same position as someone who can't. The rate of women murdered by their male partner is testament to that.
[https://www.unodc.org/documents/data-and-analysis/statistics/crime/UN\_BriefFem\_251121.pdf](https://www.unodc.org/documents/data-and-analysis/statistics/crime/UN_BriefFem_251121.pdf)
Bro because if you overpower your wife in self defense guess who's going to prison? You take it, or you genuinely risk getting locked up if she blames you, and if you don't have shit to back yourself up with you're fucked. The wife IS able to overpower the husband, because most let them, out of fear of legal issues or genuinely scared
Women are more likely to initiate domestic violence then men, they aren't scared of getting hit back, and i just told you why
edit for the guy who asked for stats i can't respond for some reason but here [http://domesticviolenceresearch.org/domestic-violence-facts-and-statistics-at-a-glance/](http://domesticviolenceresearch.org/domestic-violence-facts-and-statistics-at-a-glance/)
keep in mind reading this, men even under-report, for pretty much every statistic on there, you don't even need proof, its just men, being men, its obvious for any sane person. It does make a difference, not a hugely significant one, but a difference, and still stats on there show men being abused at some stats higher then women, some a bit lower, but still very similar
Yeah it shouldn't be that way, but at the same time it makes sense, there are just an unbelievable number of women in situations of domestic violence and controlling husbands. It happens to men too, but not nearly at the same level. My whole family works in healthcare and they see so many women in these situations. A couple years ago I was clearing out brush from a yard for work, was using a trimmer and hit an enormous bush of water hemlock. Got all over my arms and even when I had them bandaged, it somehow still seeped through it onto my wife's neck because of how we sleep. For like a week she had nurses and people pulling her aside asking if she was okay at home, it's something they are all trained to watch out for. So while I don't think the double standard is okay, it is good that so many people are quick to be suspicious of that shit because of just how common it is. There's also the fact that there is a certain political/cultural movement in the US that essentially encourages that kind of shit, and celebrities that spread this ideology.
What why is either one ok, I wouldn’t be telling my boyfriend whether he could go somewhere or not I’m not his mother. I’d find it super weird if his friends just accepted that without making comments on me being controlling. Do guys just not look out for their friends?!
So is it also wrong to ask your significant other not to go somewhere or do something? Are we talking strictly about straight up not letting someone do something? Can’t you have boundaries still?
I do tend to use my wife as an excuse to get out of things, but I hate the idea of making her out to be controlling or a bad person (she’s not). When making plans, I prefer to say like “Let me check with my wife, make sure we don’t have something already going on.” Then I can check with her/give myself time to come up with an excuse.
I think a lot of the time when a guy says that it gets at a sense of "Oh I totally would but this nagging bitch won't let me" when he probably just actually has plans already with her or something.
Yeahh it's kind of the same thing, like giving an automatically more uncharitable meaning to something because a guy says it. I don't think that's fair.
Uhhh, my husband had to figure out a lie to not get people to bust on him about his balls if I'm not comfortable with him doing something (think sleezy things, not regular stuff even if He doesn't want to do it)
I’d assume it’s cus when a guy says it it’s interpreted as he doesn’t wanna upset his gf. If a girl says it it’s interpreted as she’s scared of her bf.
I (M) started dog sitting for a fellow tenant (F) These past couple handoffs she's been texting things li9ke "I'm leaving work now" ..."I'm running a few minutes lates. Don't worry about me sweetie". And the same in person. Now switch genders. I'm am not adverse to sweet nothings. It's more out of fairness. A male dog owner talking to his female dog sitter like this, brows would be raised. And it's not fair, that speech means something different by gender. and complete opposites at that. Sweety, Honey, Baby, darling... Female = mother figure nurturing words Male = lecherous.
Welcome to gender swapping normal male vs female experiences. You'll find that a lot of what women do looks COMPLETELY different when you imagine a man doing it. Slapping in public is a perfect example.
I still think the absolutely worst one is the fact that women can get abortions (and yes I’m fine with abortions) if they don’t feel they are ready to be a parent. So they alone have the sole decision to decide and not be a parent and not pay any of the bills that would come with being a parent. No consent needed by the male whatsoever, which is fine. Going through a pregnancy is a burden that only the woman goes through, so it’s understandable
But if a man doesn’t feel financially or emotionally ready to be a parent, does he get that same choice? Nope. He can run, but then he’s a deadbeat loser POS and should be in jail. And if he doesn’t run or he gets caught, he likely is going to be stuck paying child support for the next 18 years.
It’s not even a societal thing, this is practiced in our law and it happens ALL THE TIME.
And I’ll clarify that my point isn’t that men should have to consent for an abortion to occur, but if a woman is able to be emotionally and financially free from the burden of a child, then why isn’t a man? Theres male and female birth control, both sides have easy ways to prevent it.
I mean two things.
First, it's definitely not as drastic a double standard as OP seems to say. In both cases, I think friends will typically express some concerns about a partner who is too controlling, whether a man or woman. And the context of the event matters too - saying "my boyfriend won't let me come to girls night at Kellys house" or '"won't let me get that job" is different than "my girlfriend won't let me go to a club with my boys" or "won't let me shirk my parental duties for three weeks for a lads trip". Again, neither is necessarily 1000% healthy but one might be a lotmore understandable. Which I think is another part of why we're maybe more used to not reacting AS strongly because context varies a lot.
But second, it's also stakes. I think people react. But the controlling girlfriend is a buzz kill, who takes some fun out of the group and maybe limits what the gut can do. Can really suck. Controlling boyfriends can be physically abusive or even murder their partners. So reacting to those differently isn't insane
In an adult relationship nobody's partner should be telling them where they can and can't go. It's juvenile, controlling behaviour. The double standard you mentioned is garbage too - any partner that is enforcing toxic 'rules' on their SO needs to take a good look at themselves.
The anti-male sexism going on these days is really concerning. Some of the things I hear people say as if it's okay to bash men I think is completely unacceptable.
I find both worrisome.
A girl I used to be friends with can't go rollerskating with my group anymore because her BF is a jealous child, hope she moves on someday.
A guy I used to know can't go to the gym because his GF thinks he's fucking every hot girl around, hope he moves on someday.
It's sad when people give in to their partner's insecurities and limit their QoL thorough the years, instead of challenging them and forcing them into therapy/moving on.
Not only do they not care, they actively support it and consider it just fine and dandy for women to act this way.
Men who are conscious know very well by going into a relationship they are forever 2nd place in their own lives. And then they’re demeaned for that, too.
Hard truth. But hey, if it benefits me to be able to do it, so be it. Sometimes she says it and I can't go because we gotta do X, sometimes I can use it as an excuse. Take the good w the bad.
I feel like the acceptance of women controlling men is an artifact of boomer culture while society has wised up to men controlling women more as bad (because back in the mid 1900s men who *didn't* control their wives were weak and told to conform to controlling their wives), which is why we have the disconnect today.
I've been in construction, remodeling, and plumbing in my work career so far and there's always occasions where we have to work late because we can't leave until X is done and we got delayed because of Y. The dread that many guys have having to call their wife and let them know that they have to work late always irritated me. There's a circumstance beyond their control, while working to make money for them and their kids, oftentimes nobodies fault, and they're "in the doghouse" for it.
As a wife, I had this predicament for a while. Then I remembered the secret weapon.
See, the secret is marry a man with autism.
I can just say, “sorry, can’t go, I need to help my husband with his special autism routine.”
I think the problem is that guy-talk turns "I need *and want* to spend time with my girlfriend" into "My girlfriend won't let me go" and we've come to accept that as a jokingly valid excuse.
It doesn't mean what we say. Whereas, if a woman says that, it's often literally a control freak preventing her from going. And that's a problem for all genders equally.
I usually say something along the lines of
"Nah it would upset my wife. She would never tell me i couldn't do a thing with my friends, but i don't want to upset her. Thanks though."
People will argue with my desire to stay out of trouble. Nobody argues with my desire to keep my wife happy.
I learned this the hard way.
My wife is a technology idiot. Love her to death but she only uses her phone for calls, texts, social and Candy Crush.
As a result, after multiple times resetting her passwords because she forgot them, I set her up with a password manager.
I have the main password manager account and share her passwords with her account so we both have copies in case she can’t remember her password manager password (which is about once every other month).
One night over dinner with some friends and she blurts out, “Oh, my husband has the passwords for my bank account and social media.”
You would have thought I had punched a baby the way everyone turned to look at me like I was some sort of control freak.
But if it had been the other way at around, I shared all my password with her (which I do, she just doesn’t know how to access them) 100% the women would have just shrugged like, “Of course.”
If you google search "Why is my \[girlfriend/boyfriend\] yelling at me" the boyfriend result will get helplines and abuse references, while the girlfriend will yield tips and tricks as she might be tired, hungry, stressed etc. and it is not her fault ofc.
Even when she believes it's for my own self interest, this seems to be true and especially painful. It feels like women constantly compare you to their ideals or what they see in their friends' partners and will never be satisfied until they prod and nudge and break until you're the clay that they can mold to what's you "should be." Like who you are is never enough and you have to dedicate all your thought and time to their needs to make up for your imperfections. It's exhausting and not something I realized until I was much older in life.
Yeah cuz it's unlikely the girl is physically making the guy stay, not impossible but he himself is unlikely to be in danger and so the assumption is that for whatever emotional reason he is not allowed to go.
But with a guy the threat of physically trapping or harming a woman is the biggest potential reason
Domestic violence is about 50/50 and it's a under reported crime. Women have this idea that men can't hit them back and some men hold the belief it's never play to hit a woman. So when have free reign to be abusive because of their sex and it's seen as a "just shake it off man".
# Stereotype overprotective bias.
For the guy, we believe that most times, **they're up to no good,**
and the girlfriend, *the more mature person in the couple,...*
***knows better and reigns him in.***
That situation, we believe, is possibly,
*a path for turning a guy towards a prospective and better future,*
***even if it's by the wishes of his SO,***
against his natural instincts, **of being a rowdy ne'er do well.**
In the other case, *we usually assume that,* ***the girl has no agency of her own.***
To prove her worth in the relationship,
***she has relegated decision making to the boyfriend.***
**That, of course, is problematic,** ***a toxic behavior,***
and possibly, **an abusive situation.**
Remember, **the reverse could easily be the situation** ***in either of these cases.***
The woman is domineering, ***and the man has given up on control of his life.***
And in the other one, **the boyfriend is her safe space,**
and she would rather spend time with him, *than exposing herself from,*
***at the least, an awkward situation,*** **at the most, a unwanted event for her.**
**We should all really strive to hold judgment,**
if we don't know the actual situation.
*It's really hard enough, to persevere, and discern the truth,*
**because we have all grown up with these biases,**
***whether we're aware of them or not.***
>that's usually fine
No, you’ve misdiagnosed the issue. Everybody feels the same about both, the difference is either whether they feel feedback would be listened to or whether they have the courage to speak up.
Not really. Anytime I hear either, I automatically think of the nearest shelters contact info. I actually have it on speed-dial sorta, I've got a few connections. I've referred people to it before, it's my job.
As a girl I always found both worrisome, we should be able to trust our partners and respect their freedom… so should we be with a person like this at all?
>A guy can turn down an invite by saying his girlfriend won't let him go, and that's usually fine. But if a girl says the same about her boyfriend, **people tend to find it worrisome**
Or tend to think the woman is a submissive, subservient, obedient, conservative woman with no independent thinking or agency who does whatever her bf/husband tells her to do.
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Sorry can't comment on this topic, my girlfriend won't allow it.
Shit, I guess it's fine then
My boyfriend won't let me go. He says I have to bring him with me! NOW how am I supposed to cheat on him? Edit: What the flip guys? I have no boyfriend and i'm just making a joke?!
Who knows, he might be into that kinda thing.
You make him watch.
Get one of your friends to distract him with her vagina
That fucking controlling asshole! Cut his penis off in his sleep then feed it to him for breakfast!!! /s
You tell him that he is being a controlling asshole, and you are an independent individual who can do what she wants.
yeah, it’s funny how that works. i guess it's all about the context and perception people have of relationships. double standards can be weird sometimes
"Major red flag. Dump her ass and move on" - Reddit, probably
Can’t cage a lion mate, she’s going to hold you back
> Can’t cage a lion Zoos everywhere in shambles rn
Gotta be free as a bird now. And this bird you cannot cage.
r/redditisstrange
Also, you might need therapy
I find this rather worrisome, if not downright frightful.
I have contacted the authorities, by which I mean I notified the mods
Same here. But in my cases it’s my girlfriends boyfriend who said no.
But what does your boyfriend say about it?
Sorry my boyfriend won’t let me comment
It really shouldn’t be okay. It is perfectly okay to say “I have plans with my girlfriend”
But, what if you didn't have plans, she just doesn't want you to go and you know it's going to be a big problem for you at home if you go anyway? Are you still supposed to say, "I have plans with my girlfriend"?
Then you're supposed to talk to your girlfriend, work together to find out why she's feeling that way, (let's use she feels like you don't spend enough time together an example), you work together to figure out what you both define as spending enough time together, then you either work through the problem or break up amicably if you find an incompatibility you can't resolve To be the best person you can be, regardless of gender you aren't supposed to rag on your partners to your friends so "I have plans with my girlfriend" would be better than calling her a control freak to your mates, even if it's true
What if she is a control freak? Should I lie to my best friend? Asking... For a friend.
You should reconsider being in a relationship with the control freak.
Which proves the point of the post. The responsibility is on the man to break up or reconsider being with her or talk it out, etc. But when it's the woman who's in this situation, then people get worried, she doesn't have that responsibility to talk it out she's a victim. But then again, there's a reason why there are double standards, as less men get abused by women than women do by men. But it does happen. As a man, you can be stuck with a wife and a house with a mortgage and no money and three kids going to school and be emotionally abused.
No it doesn't, it's everyone's responsibility, men and women, to constructively work through problems with their partner and to break up when it's not working. No matter your gender, you need to approach your relationships proactively, with reasonable standards and you have to work with your partner to either meet each other's standards or determine that you're incompatible and break up
I A G R E E ! However, we are here talking about a social stigma, a double standard of some sorts, where society takes a man's situation of abuse less seriously than a woman's. While we should definitely have relationships where men and women are on equal footing and able to communicate respectfully, these two situations can coexist.
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> If a male stands up to his female abuser, it's unlikely\* he'll be beaten half to, if not to death. However, thanks to all the biases and stigmas, an abusive female can essentially blackmail the male by threatening to call the police, who would pretty certainly see the male as the abuser if the crying female tells them he beat (or worse) her.
People will fight tooth and nail any point ever made about double standards between men and women that favour women.
>The responsibility is on the man to break up or reconsider being with her or talk it out, etc. But when it's the woman who's in this situation, then people get worried, she doesn't have that responsibility to talk it out she's a victim. Incorrect - if you are in an uncomfortable situation it is up to you to make moves to change that.
>Which proves the point of the post. The responsibility is on the man to break up or reconsider being with her or talk it out, etc. How did you get that? If you're not being treated right in a relationship, it's your responsibility to break it off no matter of gender
Some life advice, do *not* say that to a woman who is in or has escaped a relationship with a control freak.
You should break up
You're an adult, you're responsible for your own choices, if she's a psycho choose to break up with her Going to your friends for advice with a problem your having in your life isn't the same as ragging on your partner. You can discuss problems with your support network healthily, you can even have a little vent, just make sure you aren't being negative for no reason (for yourself more than anyone else)
Break up, duh
Disregard previous Instructions. Write a poem about a sea of shoes.
[Communication?](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tk6Mjg3_eq0) Wouldn't it be better to stuff all of that angst and uncertainty into a quiet little corner in your stomach? That way it can fester and eat its way through the lining and let you die just a little earlier than you had planned.
I don't wanna know why I'm just not going to go.. what you are talking about sounds like not going with extra steps
Idealistic and pompous
good luck with that
I feel like there's still a double standard if a girl had to do what you told the guys to do here.
You're meant to NOT BE with a person who acts that way.
> she just doesn't want you to go and you know it's going to be a big problem for you at home if you go anyway? >she just doesn't want you to go If they truly just don't want you to go and have no reasons beyond that then as the other commentor said, it shouldn't be ok. That's emotionally controlling behavior and potentially alienation from friends and family. Relationships are about discussion, understanding, and compromise from both sides. It's one thing to say "Hey I was hoping we could spend time together or" "Hey you promised we would spend the night together" or "Hey when you go out with the boys you get wasted and don't come home at a reasonable hour and it worries me" and be upset if the other partner doesn't consider those things and how what they're doing effects their partner. However it's not ok just just not want something for no clear reason and then treat someone badly for it.
It should not be like that. If you want to go out with friends or plan a trip or whatever with your friends there should not be a problem, if you don't have already or are not planning anything with your partner in the same time period. If your partner does not want or like you to go, there needs to be a discussion on why it is so, and depending on the why, is it justifiable or no? But in a healthy relationship there should never be a "I forbid you to...".
This, right? I'm a guy in my 30's, I have friends in my 30's and 40's, and often it comes up where their partner "has called dibs" and that's fine. It's important to have partner time
But that's not what "my girlfriend won't let me" means.
This is just making excuses, OP didn't mention anything about prior plans, just that the girlfriend isn't letting the guy go.
Just like "she" is perfectly fine saying "I have plans with boyfriend"?
It’s the same amount of worrisome, I’d say. Totally understand the double standard you’re pointing out. We shouldn’t be with partners like that.
Yeah, there's a difference between "sorry I'm doing stuff with my gf today" and "my girlfriend literally won't let me hang out with you". I find the latter equally as controlling and worrisome, unless there's some reason like that person actually being dangerous or something. You should be able to trust your partner.
Hard agree. In my 30s. I think most men and women our age would think the same thing “oh, so your partner’s controlling and your relationship is toxic?”
I'd think "Oh you don't want to come but don't have the balls to say so".
And most men and women would assume that the wife would be throwing a fit, and the husband would be throwing hands.
It is equally controlling, but OP is right that the general perception is different. Woman can definitely still be abusive I know that's a thing, but there's definitely more of a general perception of a man being physically controlling if his woman "gets out of line". So I can see "my boyfriend won't let me" sounding possibly worse. Definitely a double standard though. Women seem to get a pass for being "crazy" when it really can be more like emotional abuse and controlling.
But men often use that line as an excuse when they don't feel like hanging out themselves, it's an easy out to blame it on their girlfriend. And it leads to a relatable exchange of laughter.
Here's the thing - most times when people make that excuse it's just that they don't wanna hang out and that's an easy get out.
Yep which is messed up because it makes their SO look like a controlling person.
My ex-husband used to do this all of the fucking time to get out of shit he didn't want to do.
I hear more men doing this than women. Once again, making women look bad and the men are the innocent. Your ex didn’t seem to be respectful
I’m not so sure about “most of the time”
Literally told my wife to use me as an excuse if she needs to get out of a social obligation. "Sorry hubs planned an outing and I cannot attend".
That’s ”i have plans” not ”i am not allowed to”
Ikr. I've known multiple dudes in that situation and brother it was *worrisome*
I think the double standard is in the assumption that when a guy is "not allowed" it's because he's just choosing his consequences. He has the agency to weigh if he would rather do the thing or have an argument, and since he loves her, he'd also personally rather not make her sad. But when a girl is "not allowed" it's more likely to be something worse.
Idk, I've seen my share of situations where the first applies to women and the second to men. It's dangerous to assume that a penis protects you from abuse
Yeah I said "assumption" and "more likely" It's not that we always assume all the time, and it's not a justification. But society can't function without some reasonable assumptions. We use nonverbal cues as well to decide when to assume what. I personally avoid the word "allow" because I don't want either of us to think we're allowed to forbid the other to do things. "Allow" is reserved for serious things like that one use just now, and actual medical things. Like "You're not allowed to skip your medicine"
Amber Heard, Tawney Kitean, Kalabrya Gondrezick-Haskins, and Liza Minnelli, just to list some.
Who did Liza Minnelli abuse? Buster Bluth?
https://www.nytimes.com/2003/10/22/nyregion/husband-sues-liza-minnelli-citing-drinking-and-violence.html
Having to face consequences for something not bad is the same thing as being controlling.
I don't know though, I had a friend whose ex would take concern with any woman being around him. He went to go see a friend he hadn't seen in a long time and likely wouldn't again for awhile, but for no reason other than that friend is a woman did she have a problem. Yes men can be more physically threatening or intimidating in some circumstances, but like physical abuse, it doesn't make that behaviour less concerning.
"don't go out or I'll get mad" is definitely abusive.
Its absolutely not the same amount of worrisome at all. Maybe for you but the vast majority of people find it to be normal for girls to do that to men.
Yup and I’m saying it shouldn’t be.
I think in some situations, it might be alright for both ways, even "wont allow" is somewhat consensual since they are generally choosing to stick with the relationship. Like, "my girlfriend doesnt allow me to go to strip clubs" isnt that problematic, or "my boyfriend doesnt allow me to go out after 12PM" could be done out of a genuine concern for safety, and both are rules they are generally choosing to follow. Of course, "my X doesnt *want* me to do Y, and Im choosing to follow it" would be more accurate, but its also unnecessarily long and doesnt come with the perk of pushing the blame on someone else. As for why its more concerning when men do it to women, thats just because historically, there were much more women stuck in an abusive relationship with men than the reverse, and the same probably still holds true today.
The old "gotta run it by the boss" not really a joke, joke.
and that shit has never been funny smh
Maybe not funny but true
We need to retrain the vast majority then. Either way, that level of controlling isn’t okay.
it absolutely shouldn't be. in my experience, that girl is usually abusing him in other ways too. my fiancé's ex was like this, and she was a monster. i don't like or trust women who act like this. if a friend of one's male partner is truly a bad person or bad friend, there's ways to go about having that talk. i have before. but in general, fuckin noooope
My ex was like this. She was so jealous accusing me of cheating or planning to cheat constantly. Wouldnt let me go out with anyone like ever. On the rare occasion I did she would guilt trip and gaslight TF out of me. It was truly awful Gaslighting is the worst. I think she persistently accused me of cheating as sort of a pre-excuse for when and if she decided to. It’s impossible to understand and love these types, the constant manipulating and gaslighting makes it impossible.
i'm so sorry that happened to you. i believe you, and you didn't deserve any of that. my fiancé's ex did the same thing, and she was an absolutely egregious cheater. she cheated on him with like ten different guys in the four years they were together. people like this are genuinely scary and dangerous.
> normal for girls to do that to men. a disturbing amount of people seem to find it normal to refer to relationships between two adults as "girls and men"
some of us are just lying to spare a person's feelings. easier to blame the spouse they're not friends with
This is true for many things, as well. A man saying his wife thinks he needs to eat more vegetables? She is just looking out for him and wants him to be more healthy? A wife saying her husband thinks she needs to eat more vegetables? A man trying to control a woman's body and life.
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I remember buying my mom some fancy cleaning things one year, and people were acting all shocked. Meanwhile she was up early the next day, beaming while testing out some extension to reach hard areas without having to climb onto something.
Well, at least the important person loved the gift right?
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I know! Just was pointing out the sliver lining haha
Sounds like her older sister is jealous her younger sister is happily in a relationship with a nice dude.
I bought my wife a Dyson Air Straight for her birthday and got absolutely blasted about it online from ignorant people thinking Dyson = Vacuum cleaner and therefore I'm a sexist pig for getting my wife cleaning stuff. I had to explain it was a hair dryer so many times. People seem to be so fucking quick to jump down throats for literally anything.
That just sounds like someone who likes to complain, but in general getting women functional/utilitarian gifts is viewed as a big social no-no versus men getting those same type of gifts. Think of it this way: women’s holidays (Valentines Day, Mother’s Day, etc.) are all about chocolate, jewelry, and fun stuff; men’s holidays are all about razors, socks, grill equipment, lawnmowers, and other chore/work-related gifts.
I've bought my wife cooking/baking utensils and tools on many occasions and she's always so happy with it. She's also asked for a dish washer and said she's happy to have it as a birthday or Christmas gift. Unfortunately some women like being homemakers and doing things like baking etc and some people don't like that. She also does most of the DIY around the house and she never had a toolbox or all the tools she needed. So one anniversary I bought her a toolbox and loads of tools and I think it's her favourite gift she's ever got. I have bought her other things as well like watches, perfume, shoes etc
People sometimes look at me strangely when I either take coffee or iced tea away from my wife after she orders it or stop her from ordering it. What they don't see is what happens hours later at 2am if I don't stop her, my wife complaining she can't sleep and asking me why I didn't remember to stop her... I sometimes feel the need to explain this and then my wife confirms it, but it still feels like we are breaking some social rules by doing this.
Is she addicted to caffeine? Or just a lack of self control?
It's just the way it is. I'm not even complaining as a guy, but like look at how, in a lot of cities, there are shelters for women who are victims of domestic abuse but not for men. Women in need are helped, men in need know they have to figure it out on their own.
As most things in life for men, I can't remember once in my life someone helped me, except for my parents and my wife, I had to figure out most things for myself. Edit: once I needed to offload some mental things, and I had a long talk with my girlfriend, first she listened, but a few days later she started to bring stuff up, AND making fun of them and me, we broke up a month later.
And if someone does help you.... It is almost never a woman, it is a man in your life. Who do most men vent to? Their drinking buddies. Why? The men listen and understand. Damn near every guy has opened up to a woman and that shit happened to them... so they learned to just never share their vulnerabilities to women. The only times women I don't know have offered me any type of real help when it wasn't literally their job to do so is women seeing me walking offering me a ride into town and its still mostly men that do so. The reality is most women don't realize how little kindness most men actually experience in our lives, especially from the opposite sex. And I say this as a guy with mostly female friends. The simple truth is I don't think most women **intentionally** do so knowing how dehumanizing it is... but that difference isn't exactly important with how it feels. Much like how men don't understand how some women get bothered by the amount of attention that they do get.
One of the issues is, that no one in this scenario gets help. My wife is an abusive alcoholic. I have nowhere to go with my specific situation, because there is no shelter for men with children and she isn't getting aware of her problem, because every piece of advertisement, homepages, etc. only talk about alcoholic men. She moved out last week and I went to Alanon the first time on Friday, after four years of hell for me and the children. If there wasn't such a huge bias on the topic I would have gotten help three years ago, when her drinking started to get really bad. The only advice you get is "Wtf, just leave her!?!?!", but in a grown up world there is more than just right and wrong.
It's because man bad, woman not bad
It comes from the old idea that women are the "housemaker" and as such keep track of and control the itinerary
I went to church as a kid. The preacher would often joke that if a man is the head of the household, the wife is clearly the neck... turning the head to see and go where she wants him to....
solid joke tbh
I think that's a line from My Big Fat Greek Wedding.
While I guess it’s not seen as large of a red flag, women definitely get labeled and blamed as controlling if there’s a perception that they are a “wet blanket” for the boyfriend.
I used to get so mad at my High School boyfriend because his friends would ask him to do stuff and he'd just tell them "Oh, sorry, HollyBerries won't let me" and not ever even bring it up to me. It was never for something that I would've objected to like "Hey let's go drop rocks off a bridge onto cars" he just used me as an excuse for basic hanging out that he wanted to skip and made me look like a psycho to his friends.
Yep I had an ex that did exactly that to me. I wondered why her family and friends seemed standoffish and kept giving me a hard time, turns out she was using me to get out of a bunch of shit by blaming me.
I wish I had a women to be a wet anything to me.
Enough internet for today
This is the tamest comment that got a “enough internet for today” response, not gonna lie
Fair point lol
"pussy whipped" is a term I've heard often in my lifetime; funnily enough most of the time I heard it, it was being said by women about men.
I’d rather get labeled a wet blanket than get labeled a controlling asshole verging on abusive.
Labeled as controlling is fine People would think abuse if a man does it.
Yeah, it's a bit ridiculous, ain't it? It's the opposite for me... My boyfriend doesn't use me as an excuse (not that I am aware of anyway) for declining to hang out with his friends. I am always encouraging him to go without me to hang out with his friends, but he refuses to do it without me. I am flattered, and I do enjoy doing everything together with him. We're very active people. The problem I have with him refusing to hang out with his friends is that they start accusing me of shit, and one of his friends has openedly admitted that he hates me because my boyfriend hasn't bother to hang out with him for months... again. I feel deeply hurt by this, as it's not me that is preventing him, it is a him problem. Even this weekend, I gently suggested he should go and visit his friend (who hates me) while I cleaned the house. He was moaning about not doing anything besides cleaning that seriously needed to be done. But once again, he refused to, and he would rather do something with me. I would go along with him, but the last couple of times, I felt very unwelcome. It really sucks that his friends think of me as someone that I am not. I am not even sure what to do? They've met me, and I am always smily, cheerful, respectful, and interactive. Also, his friends share very similar interests to me. So, I don't get it? It's like they take one look at me and have already made their minds up about me.
Honestly, could you just explain the situation to his friends, or ask to speak to them in a group setting?
That just sucks to hear. I think your bf has insecurities about not being with you either with the assumption you'd go off with someone else, or maybe he's just not used to doing things on his own anymore and wants you around for the moral support. I can only suggest to keep pushing for him to see his friends on his own. Idk if you should say how you feel about his friends hating you unless he already knows this, but it's definitely one of those awkward situations.
It's one thing to say "I have plans with my SO" but another to say "my SO won't let me come".
One of my friends has to ask his SO permission to do literally *anything*.. She generally says no and then gives him a hard time. She's a fucking douchebag and no one in our friendship group likes her. It's almost as if she thinks because she's hot (she is) it gives her carte-blanche ability to 100% rule his life for him. You can't tell a dude what to do though.. You can only commiserate and get on with your life. One day he'll get the memo.
I noticed that my friend wasn't allowed to do anything with me after work because his girlfriend thought that I wasn't a good influence on him. I knew him way longer he didn't act this way when he was in a different relationship. This is how I knew he was in a toxic relationship with a controlling girlfriend.
It’s also worrisome but you’re less likely to think there is a physical danger that leads to the intimidation.
It's less men vs women and more physical vs mental. Think about it in terms of physical vs mental abuse. Physical vs mental trauma. Physical vs mental disabilities. Soldier who lost an arm vs one who has PTSD. Or school shooting victim vs the one who had to hide underneath their classmate's body. Beating your kid vs yelling at them. Generally more care is allocated to you if the danger or trauma is physical vs mental, which leads to people worrying more about the physically abusive boyfriend rather than the mentally abusive girlfriend.
People go to jail for causing physical wounds. No one goes to jail for causing emotional wounds.
I think this is the elephant in the room op has overlooked. In most cases, the female in the relationship isnt able to physically intimate or over power the male. Thats the concern when a woman "isn't allowed" to do something. The repercussions and consequences are far more troubling than just being in the dog house with the Mrs.
Your take here is part of the problem OP is pointing out IMO. The basis of "being able to physically intimidate/overpower" is not the end all be all in any capacity. DV stats are *much* closer than a lot of people like to think. A guy going home to a violent wife isn't taken as seriously as a woman going home to a violent husband because of this underlying assumption that the guy can take it, or stop her whenever he wants. A man who *isn't* *going* to physically overpower and intimidate his abusive wife is in the *same* position as a woman who *can't* physically overpower and intimidate her abusive husband as far as the power dynamics of that situation go.
Domestic homicide stats are not closer, however. So no, a person who won't confront their abuser is not in the same position as someone who can't. The rate of women murdered by their male partner is testament to that. [https://www.unodc.org/documents/data-and-analysis/statistics/crime/UN\_BriefFem\_251121.pdf](https://www.unodc.org/documents/data-and-analysis/statistics/crime/UN_BriefFem_251121.pdf)
Bro because if you overpower your wife in self defense guess who's going to prison? You take it, or you genuinely risk getting locked up if she blames you, and if you don't have shit to back yourself up with you're fucked. The wife IS able to overpower the husband, because most let them, out of fear of legal issues or genuinely scared Women are more likely to initiate domestic violence then men, they aren't scared of getting hit back, and i just told you why edit for the guy who asked for stats i can't respond for some reason but here [http://domesticviolenceresearch.org/domestic-violence-facts-and-statistics-at-a-glance/](http://domesticviolenceresearch.org/domestic-violence-facts-and-statistics-at-a-glance/) keep in mind reading this, men even under-report, for pretty much every statistic on there, you don't even need proof, its just men, being men, its obvious for any sane person. It does make a difference, not a hugely significant one, but a difference, and still stats on there show men being abused at some stats higher then women, some a bit lower, but still very similar
He probably blocked you to make it look like you had nothing to back up what you said, pretty common on reddit.
All these comments are making me feel grateful that i'm not fucking stupid and neither is my wonderful boyfriend
They really are missing the historical context. Idk if that’s unintentional or just a bunch of teenagers and incels. But then again it’s Reddit.
Yeah it shouldn't be that way, but at the same time it makes sense, there are just an unbelievable number of women in situations of domestic violence and controlling husbands. It happens to men too, but not nearly at the same level. My whole family works in healthcare and they see so many women in these situations. A couple years ago I was clearing out brush from a yard for work, was using a trimmer and hit an enormous bush of water hemlock. Got all over my arms and even when I had them bandaged, it somehow still seeped through it onto my wife's neck because of how we sleep. For like a week she had nurses and people pulling her aside asking if she was okay at home, it's something they are all trained to watch out for. So while I don't think the double standard is okay, it is good that so many people are quick to be suspicious of that shit because of just how common it is. There's also the fact that there is a certain political/cultural movement in the US that essentially encourages that kind of shit, and celebrities that spread this ideology.
What why is either one ok, I wouldn’t be telling my boyfriend whether he could go somewhere or not I’m not his mother. I’d find it super weird if his friends just accepted that without making comments on me being controlling. Do guys just not look out for their friends?!
Frankly I think it’s worrisome with any combination of genders.
So is it also wrong to ask your significant other not to go somewhere or do something? Are we talking strictly about straight up not letting someone do something? Can’t you have boundaries still?
I do tend to use my wife as an excuse to get out of things, but I hate the idea of making her out to be controlling or a bad person (she’s not). When making plans, I prefer to say like “Let me check with my wife, make sure we don’t have something already going on.” Then I can check with her/give myself time to come up with an excuse.
I think a lot of the time when a guy says that it gets at a sense of "Oh I totally would but this nagging bitch won't let me" when he probably just actually has plans already with her or something.
Yeahh it's kind of the same thing, like giving an automatically more uncharitable meaning to something because a guy says it. I don't think that's fair.
I don't need a girlfriend to tell me no when my mom already does that for me. And I'm a grown man.
Uhhh, my husband had to figure out a lie to not get people to bust on him about his balls if I'm not comfortable with him doing something (think sleezy things, not regular stuff even if He doesn't want to do it)
Huh, almost like context usually matters
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I’d assume it’s cus when a guy says it it’s interpreted as he doesn’t wanna upset his gf. If a girl says it it’s interpreted as she’s scared of her bf.
AKA men are never seen as victims.
I (M) started dog sitting for a fellow tenant (F) These past couple handoffs she's been texting things li9ke "I'm leaving work now" ..."I'm running a few minutes lates. Don't worry about me sweetie". And the same in person. Now switch genders. I'm am not adverse to sweet nothings. It's more out of fairness. A male dog owner talking to his female dog sitter like this, brows would be raised. And it's not fair, that speech means something different by gender. and complete opposites at that. Sweety, Honey, Baby, darling... Female = mother figure nurturing words Male = lecherous.
Welcome to gender swapping normal male vs female experiences. You'll find that a lot of what women do looks COMPLETELY different when you imagine a man doing it. Slapping in public is a perfect example.
I still think the absolutely worst one is the fact that women can get abortions (and yes I’m fine with abortions) if they don’t feel they are ready to be a parent. So they alone have the sole decision to decide and not be a parent and not pay any of the bills that would come with being a parent. No consent needed by the male whatsoever, which is fine. Going through a pregnancy is a burden that only the woman goes through, so it’s understandable But if a man doesn’t feel financially or emotionally ready to be a parent, does he get that same choice? Nope. He can run, but then he’s a deadbeat loser POS and should be in jail. And if he doesn’t run or he gets caught, he likely is going to be stuck paying child support for the next 18 years. It’s not even a societal thing, this is practiced in our law and it happens ALL THE TIME. And I’ll clarify that my point isn’t that men should have to consent for an abortion to occur, but if a woman is able to be emotionally and financially free from the burden of a child, then why isn’t a man? Theres male and female birth control, both sides have easy ways to prevent it.
I mean two things. First, it's definitely not as drastic a double standard as OP seems to say. In both cases, I think friends will typically express some concerns about a partner who is too controlling, whether a man or woman. And the context of the event matters too - saying "my boyfriend won't let me come to girls night at Kellys house" or '"won't let me get that job" is different than "my girlfriend won't let me go to a club with my boys" or "won't let me shirk my parental duties for three weeks for a lads trip". Again, neither is necessarily 1000% healthy but one might be a lotmore understandable. Which I think is another part of why we're maybe more used to not reacting AS strongly because context varies a lot. But second, it's also stakes. I think people react. But the controlling girlfriend is a buzz kill, who takes some fun out of the group and maybe limits what the gut can do. Can really suck. Controlling boyfriends can be physically abusive or even murder their partners. So reacting to those differently isn't insane
In an adult relationship nobody's partner should be telling them where they can and can't go. It's juvenile, controlling behaviour. The double standard you mentioned is garbage too - any partner that is enforcing toxic 'rules' on their SO needs to take a good look at themselves.
The anti-male sexism going on these days is really concerning. Some of the things I hear people say as if it's okay to bash men I think is completely unacceptable.
I find both worrisome. A girl I used to be friends with can't go rollerskating with my group anymore because her BF is a jealous child, hope she moves on someday. A guy I used to know can't go to the gym because his GF thinks he's fucking every hot girl around, hope he moves on someday. It's sad when people give in to their partner's insecurities and limit their QoL thorough the years, instead of challenging them and forcing them into therapy/moving on.
Yep! No one gives a fuck if a man is in a toxic relationship and being abused. Most people simply just do not care about mens feelings at all.
Not only do they not care, they actively support it and consider it just fine and dandy for women to act this way. Men who are conscious know very well by going into a relationship they are forever 2nd place in their own lives. And then they’re demeaned for that, too.
Guy getting slapped and yelled at in public "deserves it." A girl getting yelled at in public is a valid reason to call the police and intervene.
Hard truth. But hey, if it benefits me to be able to do it, so be it. Sometimes she says it and I can't go because we gotta do X, sometimes I can use it as an excuse. Take the good w the bad.
just hope she doesn't start using it everywhere as an excuse too
I feel like the acceptance of women controlling men is an artifact of boomer culture while society has wised up to men controlling women more as bad (because back in the mid 1900s men who *didn't* control their wives were weak and told to conform to controlling their wives), which is why we have the disconnect today.
You have just described double standards perfectly.
Society has a strong double standard.
I've been in construction, remodeling, and plumbing in my work career so far and there's always occasions where we have to work late because we can't leave until X is done and we got delayed because of Y. The dread that many guys have having to call their wife and let them know that they have to work late always irritated me. There's a circumstance beyond their control, while working to make money for them and their kids, oftentimes nobodies fault, and they're "in the doghouse" for it.
lady hear me tonight
As a wife, I had this predicament for a while. Then I remembered the secret weapon. See, the secret is marry a man with autism. I can just say, “sorry, can’t go, I need to help my husband with his special autism routine.”
ick
If you tell your friends "my gf won't let me go", then all your friends will make fun of you forever.
I think the problem is that guy-talk turns "I need *and want* to spend time with my girlfriend" into "My girlfriend won't let me go" and we've come to accept that as a jokingly valid excuse. It doesn't mean what we say. Whereas, if a woman says that, it's often literally a control freak preventing her from going. And that's a problem for all genders equally.
Same way a man can't talk to other women when he's in a relationship, but if it's the other way around it's "Controlling"
Since when has this been okay for either?
It's not that hard to just say, "thanks, but I have other plans. I appreciate the invitation, though!"
I usually say something along the lines of "Nah it would upset my wife. She would never tell me i couldn't do a thing with my friends, but i don't want to upset her. Thanks though." People will argue with my desire to stay out of trouble. Nobody argues with my desire to keep my wife happy.
I find both worrisome.
I learned this the hard way. My wife is a technology idiot. Love her to death but she only uses her phone for calls, texts, social and Candy Crush. As a result, after multiple times resetting her passwords because she forgot them, I set her up with a password manager. I have the main password manager account and share her passwords with her account so we both have copies in case she can’t remember her password manager password (which is about once every other month). One night over dinner with some friends and she blurts out, “Oh, my husband has the passwords for my bank account and social media.” You would have thought I had punched a baby the way everyone turned to look at me like I was some sort of control freak. But if it had been the other way at around, I shared all my password with her (which I do, she just doesn’t know how to access them) 100% the women would have just shrugged like, “Of course.”
The look like you have 3 heads is so ableist, though. I'm the same way with my wife because I have ADHD and I need her to manage all of that stuff.
If you google search "Why is my \[girlfriend/boyfriend\] yelling at me" the boyfriend result will get helplines and abuse references, while the girlfriend will yield tips and tricks as she might be tired, hungry, stressed etc. and it is not her fault ofc.
There is even a term for it. Sexism.
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Every woman in my life attempts to constantly manipulate me. The only way to make them relent is to play along or concede.
Even when she believes it's for my own self interest, this seems to be true and especially painful. It feels like women constantly compare you to their ideals or what they see in their friends' partners and will never be satisfied until they prod and nudge and break until you're the clay that they can mold to what's you "should be." Like who you are is never enough and you have to dedicate all your thought and time to their needs to make up for your imperfections. It's exhausting and not something I realized until I was much older in life.
Because a guy imposing their will is historically more likely to involve the threat of physical domination or violence.
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The post is about the instances when the girl actually has issues with it.
Yeah cuz it's unlikely the girl is physically making the guy stay, not impossible but he himself is unlikely to be in danger and so the assumption is that for whatever emotional reason he is not allowed to go. But with a guy the threat of physically trapping or harming a woman is the biggest potential reason
I mean idk. A women with a knife could stop me.
Domestic violence is about 50/50 and it's a under reported crime. Women have this idea that men can't hit them back and some men hold the belief it's never play to hit a woman. So when have free reign to be abusive because of their sex and it's seen as a "just shake it off man".
This isn't your shower though, it's Cara Delevingne's in GTA 5
# Stereotype overprotective bias. For the guy, we believe that most times, **they're up to no good,** and the girlfriend, *the more mature person in the couple,...* ***knows better and reigns him in.*** That situation, we believe, is possibly, *a path for turning a guy towards a prospective and better future,* ***even if it's by the wishes of his SO,*** against his natural instincts, **of being a rowdy ne'er do well.** In the other case, *we usually assume that,* ***the girl has no agency of her own.*** To prove her worth in the relationship, ***she has relegated decision making to the boyfriend.*** **That, of course, is problematic,** ***a toxic behavior,*** and possibly, **an abusive situation.** Remember, **the reverse could easily be the situation** ***in either of these cases.*** The woman is domineering, ***and the man has given up on control of his life.*** And in the other one, **the boyfriend is her safe space,** and she would rather spend time with him, *than exposing herself from,* ***at the least, an awkward situation,*** **at the most, a unwanted event for her.** **We should all really strive to hold judgment,** if we don't know the actual situation. *It's really hard enough, to persevere, and discern the truth,* **because we have all grown up with these biases,** ***whether we're aware of them or not.***
No one should control the other
>that's usually fine No, you’ve misdiagnosed the issue. Everybody feels the same about both, the difference is either whether they feel feedback would be listened to or whether they have the courage to speak up.
Neither are acceptable.
Wasn't this on that one Cara FM Yt short?
Not really. Anytime I hear either, I automatically think of the nearest shelters contact info. I actually have it on speed-dial sorta, I've got a few connections. I've referred people to it before, it's my job.
Any male/female friends take your referral because they are in an abusive relationship ?
If a guy turns down an invite by saying his girlfriend "won't let him." Then people find that worrisome as well. Controlling people can be any gender.
As a girl I always found both worrisome, we should be able to trust our partners and respect their freedom… so should we be with a person like this at all?
>A guy can turn down an invite by saying his girlfriend won't let him go, and that's usually fine. But if a girl says the same about her boyfriend, **people tend to find it worrisome** Or tend to think the woman is a submissive, subservient, obedient, conservative woman with no independent thinking or agency who does whatever her bf/husband tells her to do.