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I'm just sad that Montez Ford seemed like he was primed for a great solo run after that Elimination Chamber performance and now he's stuck in this trio that is going absolutely nowhere.
At one point the Profits were easily the most over tag team in WWE and now you barely remember they're on the roster. Lashley went from WWE Champion to potentially being on Speed in a few weeks.
i’ve never seen a push die so immediately and so drastically due to unrelated unfortunate circumstances until seeing the way lashley’s momentum and aura got completely evaporated after bray wyatt had to step away from their mania match
bobby went from going toe to toe w lesnar and being one of the top babyfaces on raw to being a nondescript midcard babyface, then a nondescript midcard heel with a forced stable, and now back to a nondescript midcard face with a forced stable.
Personally I don't think Lashley's aura died because of Wyatt disappearing, it died because the rubber match in his feud with Brock was a dogshit match that ended in a 4 minute DQ.
before Vince scandal hit it seemed like they were just weeks away from breaking up Profits and Montez singles run. Then Triple H took over and that got killed which i was pretty bummed about.
Then the Chamber match happened which got my hopes up again only for not only Montez but Profits/Lashley not do anything of importance for year and a half now lol
i don’t understand teaming them up with b-fab and bobby. they don’t need a manager they already had the mic chops and bobby and them really had no correlation other than being black 😭
This
Also, I feel like they lost a lot of momentum with that really weird heel run for a few weeks. They turned and seemed poised to be a heel faction with Bobby. Then they turned back and are just... there.
Doesn't help that B-Fab doesn't really add much as a manager. She doesn't speak or even really hype them up.
By all accounts wrestlers asked to be paired with together or who they want in a stable. Hence why minorities are paired together, the black wrestlers likely hang out and travel together and the Latino's likely hang out together and the Japanese wrestlers are friends with history. So you pair them with people you believe they have chemistry with
The build up to the Pride was Bobby talking to a lot of black wrestlers like Carmelo Hayes, Cedric, Ashante, Omos, Shelton teasing the idea of a Hurt Business 2.0 before choosing the Street Profits to mentor. Which makes sense from a storyline perspective, the Profits want a legend like Lashley to guide them in a new direction and Lashley is getting older so he doesn't have to be in the ring as much.
Let’s not forget, no one in the IWC at the time wanted the profits to be broken up. They didn’t have a sense of direction but people were worried about Angelo Dawkins being stuck in mid card purgatory which is honestly fair given the history of WWE and Vince at the time.
Arguably they would have been far better off as solo characters than what we got. but I think it’s not necessary, and we could of had a story similar to trick and Carmelo before a break off. Either way it’s not fully HHH’s fault that they weren’t broken up either.
Either way it really sucks, Montez is so talented and deserves the opportunity at the United States or intercontinental title at the minimum just to see him as a solo act and really break out, but we’re no closer to that happening in the past 2 years. Personally I would love to see him get that opportunity after LA Knight gets his flowers.
I wanted Angelo to turn heel on Montez and become the leader of Hit Row. Montez would've been super over as a babyface at the time, and Angelo would've gotten lots of heat. Angelo would've also had Top Dolla as a heater and Ashante as a workhorse. And B-Fab to counter Montez's inevitable alignment with Bianca. Hit Row themselves floundered without a third man, and Angelo could've been it.
The IWC didn't want The New Day to be broken up either. What happened? As soon as Big E or Kofi lost their titles, they went back to being tag team wrestlers lost in the shuffle instead of building upon their solo run. Meanwhile, Jey is constantly in the Main-Event because he can't simply go back to The Usos ( and when he did, it was the worst work he ever done that almost ruined his momentum )
As for Angelo, if he is good ( which he is ), he will shine. He has his own charisma completely different from Montez, he has a hoss move-set that's totally different from Montez. He can work and he should be trusted.
Also, how is it not HHH's fault? He is the booker, he is the one who never did anything with Lashley or Montez or Dawkins to the point no one cares about Montez anymore while Logan Paul has been champion for more than half a year while never being on the roster.
I really don't see why every time a tag guy gets a little morw momentum than his partner, it's backstage like "ohhhh we GOTTA have one turn heel on the other!"
Why they can't just do what they did when Enzo was hurt and Cass was still wrestling, have him talk, beyond me.
It’s weird they did that small hint towards him going heel after the Street Profits lost to the Uso’s years ago and then just dropped it. I always feel like Montez and Bianca would make a great heel power couple
Hate that both tag titles are stuck on thrown together duos while the Street Profits just kinda sit around. Montez Ford is obviously really good but Dawkins is also someone that could be a staple of their midcard, and could always be paired with another person in the future to further the tag division's development.
Bobby Lashley, The Street Profits, Cedric Alexander, Shelton Benjamin and MVP as a newly reenforced Hurt Business would've been fucking sick.
They could've been an entire 3 month feud for The Bloodline in their prime leading to War Games.
You people are always sad for all these wrestlers and for the good reasons obviously because they have talent and promise, but you just can't be pissed not every wrestler with potential is given a chance because there just isn't that much space for it.
With how long title reigns are now there's not much room for anyone in the top spots that's not been in those storylines as they've been building them for a long time
Yeah. I mean how many wrestlers have been pushed that didn't deserve it instead of Montez Ford or Bobby Lashley since Vince left? Not enough time on TV even for LA knight.
Karrion Kross been given chances sure, but his segments are essentially Hurt Business's chances as he was feuding with them.
Maybe solo right now but he's just keeping the seat warm for Roman Reigns.
Funny how you make a negative comment about race stuff and WWE when you can't tell the difference between Samoans and Tongans when the 'random samoans' you're talking about literally have "Tonga" in their names.
The Tongan connection hasn't been revealed yet (if there even is anything to reveal), but they're implying that Solo's building up his own crew to take over the Bloodline and usurp power while Roman's out.
I've seen people in the past say that The Rock's family and Haku (the father of the Tongans) are connected in some familial/tribal way other than by blood, but not sure what's correct and what isn't.
I don’t get why Bobby Lashley booking has fallen off a cliff. Guy is still massively over. Crowds were rejecting his heel turn and giving him a massive reaction but him and the profits haven’t really gotten great booking.
Yea especially when Roman beat every major threat there was, can’t really think of anyone else besides Lashley that could have a chance but didn’t face him
Lashley even pinned the big dog on a random raw years ago. When he was champion a few years back he was so fucking cool and he never really lost that aura. We still love Bobby
Probably to protect Lashley. Lashley wasn't gonna be the one to beat Roman. They did Roman vs Brock already so Roman didn't need a win over Lashley too. Lashley shouldn't lose very often, especially not in singles matches, to keep his aura. If you look at last 3 years, Lashley has won about 80% of his singles matches. Besides Roman and Cody, only Gunther is a bit better.
Idk about this narrative when AJ Styles just had two wwe championship matches at 47, nobody tryna push a racist narrative but Bobby’s booking been suspect as fuck since HHH took charge.
Especially as a guy who’s one of the last remnants of the ruthless aggression era who people recognize. Bobby is underrated on here for how OVER he truly is.
Three Title matches at 47 really. AJ Styles' whole new persona became a thing after losing the 4-Way and blaming LA Knight.
But while AJ is featured more than Bobby I wouldn't say he is booked stronger. His role is to lose every major feud now (which he should). You bring Bobby back tomorrow and put him in a top programme people wouldnt bat an eye. He is absolutely on the same level and booking as Styles. Just not featured right now.
I guess it's just case of bad timing with injuries and not being able to use everybody at the same time. It does seem like he was gearing up for a program with Carmelo Hayes before his injury. Which is the perfect spot for a 48yo veteran.
You could have made bobby + SP and hell throw in Omos and called then the new hurt business just like like the LWO
at least we would have gotten to see Omos more and hurt business sounds a hell of a lot better of a faction name than "the pride".
Such a shame.
Yeah the thread title is burying the lead here. MVP isn’t just saying HHH squashed the Hurt Business comeback, he’s implying that HHH is “emasculating black men” which feels like a big accusation to throw out there
The second and the last comments on the right don't really leave much to the imagination. HHH not wanting to bring back Hurt Business is one thing but those two responses... Ouch. Props to MVP for not giving a shit I guess.
I think HHH is really focused on the younger talent getting some more tv time and developing. The Hurt Business was MVP, Bobby, Shelton and Cedric. The problem is none of those guys are the future. I also hate the booking of specific races and genders being in the same group all the time. I love judgment day because its a nice mix.
Doesn't seem like Omos is benefitting from that. In fact, the only black wrestler really doing anything of consequence is Jade Cargill and Bianca as a tag team. Now, Lashley's injured, I guess, but let's be real, he'd probably be doing nothing of consequence either since when he left, he was trying to get The Pride over to no success.
And Bianca and Jade just lost those titles surprisingly quickly for what should have been the most dominant women's tag team maybe ever. They lost it clean as well regardless of if they got pinned. Dominance means overcoming odds otherwise any champ could lose in a standard triple threat. Imagine Cody had a triple threat even now and just lost to someone with no build who hadn't even been on TV. It would rightfully cause outrage especially if he won clean.
Now obviously there are external factors to consider and I'm not angry that the unholy union won. I'm upset that Jade and Bianca could be made to lose so easily without more cheating from the unholy union to justify a rematch and the narrative which was the main story of the tag division " who could possibly topple the most dominant team maybe ever?"
To be fair, they very likely did this to get a hometown pop in (as Drew was losing), split Jade and Bianca and seemingly get Jade ready to dethrone Jax. Would be my guess.
I don’t think he’s a racist but he’s not doing himself any favors to prevent that perception. All main roster Latinos are either with LWO or somehow affected by the LWO or Legado. Profits are doing nothing basically, Bobby has been reduced to a leader of a nothing faction. Melo has lost a lot of momentum. New Day needs to figure things out.
And then you have Bronn Breaker who is pushed to the heavens right now.
Jade, Bianca, Dom and Priest are the only minorities in some form of prospering story
>And then you have Bronn Breaker who is pushed to the heavens right now.
He's 26 and has pretty much everything you want in a professional wrestler. Barring injury, he is the future of the company.
It doesn't even take any *conscious* racism. All it takes is for him to think about what the next story should be, and even though he hasn't figured out which wrestlers to cast, the placeholder people in his imagined scene are all white. If that happens and he doesn't question it, good luck getting a good role if you don't match the image in his head.
People forget that H worked right alongside Vince for years, and while he certainly hated or disagreed with some (probably a few fair regarding NXT call ups) of Vince's decisions, he was likely agreeing with most of it, and being deeply influenced by Vince and his mindset. I do check in on current day WWE but still recognise too many Vince-isms to really get sucked in and invested. I also remember NXT more clearly than most and think H is just an above average booker, but not much more. I think WWE's boom was the promised pay off to the Cody story and Trips was seen as a master story teller for telling it well without too many hiccups, unlike how Vince would, but that in a year or two people will turn on him as they see more of his stories and how they play out.
Throw in that Bruce Pritchard threw Triple H under the bus as ad libbing lines during the Booker T promo that made it racist. Bruce Pritchard is usually full of shit but add that to his bad Pakistani accent segment...it all just doesnt look great on the surface.
May as well include Damage CTRL in this, even if Iyo is still being presented somewhat well.
Anyway this is one of the reasons why HBK > HHH as a booker tbh.
Its a merchandise grab, like Hardy Boyz or New Day. There's always room for midcarders that can push merchandise in WWE.
I mean look at Xavier Woods, he wrestles like once a month maybe, even less for singles matches. And he's probably raking in well over a million with the youtube channel and new day/upupdwndwn merchandise while WWE gets a nice cut.
I know nothing lasts forever, but it always shocks me to see how trivial New Day is now after what they were. A wider gulf than Bryan's drop from winning the world title after going through Batista, Orton, and HHH, to scrambling for the IC title.
The shittiest part is that as much as I do like Triple H, it’s not like it doesn’t track, can’t remember him every working a program with anybody black since, well you know.
Hunter wrestled and lossed to Shelton a year and a half after the Booker match at XIX.
He also worked with Booker again during the King Booker gimmick in 2007.
There's also the fact that there wasn't any other Black talent to work with the in main-event scene. Lashley wasn't around long enough before he quit.
It isn't shocking given all those PUBLIC Instagram comments have MVP calling HHH a secret racist...
If I'm HHH, what incentivizes me to give somebody who does that television time?
I think two things can be true at the same time.
1. WWE has and has always had a problem with consistently booking minorities in storylines. And that isn't limited to just black people. That's Asians, Latinos, Middle Easterners, etc...
2. HHH is not racist and this rant is more MVP being bitter his television time with the Omos storyline was cut and never given a chance. So these posts are him lashing out over that.
I also think it's worth noting that it is quite clear that NXT is being primed as the brand to target the African American audience right now while main roster is not that.
Exactly. These comments are a big indicator that the working relationship between MVP and WWE is coming to an end. That first point has been true historically but Bianca has been the top face and strongest booked of the women for years now, Bobby might be in a lull atm but has been very well utilized in recent years. Very few guys have been booked as definitively to be Brock's equal as Lashley was.
There are clearly huge plans for Trick and Melo and I'd be surprised if that wasn't still true for Montez as well. MVP is being brazen here, he likely doesn't give AF anymore and the relationship has degraded behind the scenes.
But HHH had sidelines both MVP and the Hurt Business literal *years* before these comments were made. You’re making it sound like it’s not surprising HHH has sidelined them *because* of these comments, but it makes no sense.
If he's saying this publicly, how guarded are his comments to other staff in the building? Folks talk shit at work. That's normal. Folks also get in trouble for running their mouths about the wrong person. No surprises here.
If Lashley and the SP are going to remain together, then I’d rather see Dawkins and Lashley tag teaming together and Ford as the solo champion within the group.
That was something he said during the Triple H vs. Booker T pre Wrestlemania match promo. Who told him to say it? Maybe Vince IDK. But the excuse of "People like you meaning WCW guys." Was an awful one.
I knew where the quote came from. It was the 100 emoji that I was surprised by. MVP didn't try to soften the use of the quote or anything. Just agreed completely and kept it moving.
Well damn, there’s some pretty heavy comments/insinuations from MVP on the right side there… Especially the one where he agreed with the comment referencing the “Someone like you doesn’t get to be champion” promo.
Fans commenting things like "you gotta talk to Hunter, Nick, and William" as a normal thing on every wrestling post in 2024 is the biggest takeaway.
This is the era for that kind of fan. Would have been roasted to hell for posting something like this in years past
Bobby is suffering the same fate as everyone else after a certain age with few exceptions. If you’re not one of the biggest stars like Orton or Rock, your creative is secondary. It’s why Edge left, it’s why Goldberg isn’t getting that retirement match.
Goldberg? He had more opportunities than he should’ve had his last run. Also with Edge he was give the Rumble and essentially put no one over but Roman.
Edge had a ton of high profile feuds before he did though ,Bobby is not only still over but can go in the ring plus ticks all the charisma boxes preety much ,theres no reason he shouldnt be having big feuds.
I’m seeing a lot of comments about Bobby’s age as if there aren’t multiple top guys in there late 30s to early 40s. Nobody is saying that he needs to be world champ but his booking pre-WM 39 to now is night and day.
Yeah I’m not buying the age excuse when Bobby doesn’t even look like he’s 40 either, plus he’s still extremely over. Even if he’s not a champ or anything, it feels like it’s been a long while since he’s been featured in anything memorable or meaningful
Yeah a lot of the reasons mentioned hold no weight at all. Even if you think he's old and doesn't have much longer as an active guy he's a more recent champion and there is a lot to mine from that. He can easily elevate someone to the next level.
They started a bit awkwardly but they definitely found their groove after a bit. It felt like they were in the cusp of being amazing than they broke them up for whatever reason
It's just one of those things people always bring up as a fix or fantasy booking. Like reforming bullet club in WWE.
Never any suggestion on what they would do or why that would be good.
Bobby Lashley is currently in a faction with a (now) lower tier tag team. What would be different if he was with Shelton and Cedric?
Sounds like something personal with MVP. Notice how Omos isn't on TV anymore either?
Anyway at first I really didn't agree with one of those Tweets about HHH "emasculating" black men. Then I thought about it and it isn't that crazy to see. I know Lashley is hurt but the Pride has completely stalled him and the Street Profits. Omos is almost completely gone from TV, when was his last appearance? Crews is getting TV time...while getting his ass whooped. Ashonte/Cedric are technically paired together but haven't done anything recently besides appear ringside.
Carmelo is the only black dude I think getting significant TV time. The New Day are getting some midcard TV time but it's revolving around the boring black hole of a Kross story. Ricochet was but he's probably gone now. The Street Profits have fallen so far despite being on TV. I might be forgetting someone significant but I really can't think of any black guys with a significant spot on TV outside of Carmelo.
I don't really agree that HHH is "emasculating" them but I do understand why someone would feel that way.
NXT is absolutely cooking though so the future is bright. Trick, Lee and Femi are all going to be big deals right away. Especially Trick.
I just don't understand. Because you look at black and gold nxt and you see what H is capable of.
But the way certain stars are being handled isn't just limited to black wrestlers. It extends to latinos. Look at the whole LWO v LDF feud. It extends to the women's division. Rhea Ripley is so over but her title reign was uneventful and had so much potential. Same can be said for Bianca and IYO. It extends to the tag division too.
Bianca is still well featured but she definitely felt like a bigger deal before the creative change than she does now. The never ending damage ctrl feud really didn’t help.
They sidelined her in a tag team to get somebody else over. It’s also interesting to note in relation to a discussion of race and Hunter, that he took the two African American women stars (or rather one star, one the company wants to be a star) he has and put them together. They also happen to be of a certain type as well.
You're definitely right. I just brought up the men since that's all the post brought up.
I think Bianca and Jade are pushed really well. Naomi is given significant TV time and title matches since she has been back. B Fab is trapped in that Pride stuff although she was never more than a stand in for stables. Kayden Carter was a champion and does get TV time.
I could be forgetting someone but I don't think the main roster has many black women. It might just be those five. Although again NXT has some great wrestlers waiting. Lash is going to do really well.
Carmelo also is getting TV time as a “footnote” to the real Logan vs LA Knight, maybe it gets more heat after that feud is settled but right now he’s kinda just “there” for LA to shit talk to when Logan is busy
>NXT is absolutely cooking though so the future is bright. Trick, Lee and Femi are all going to be big deals right away. Especially Trick.
I still remember Swerve saying HBK and Triple H had radically different opinions of him, which gives me pause. I can't believe I'm saying this, but it unironically feels like Shawn is a lot more attuned to or invested in African American culture than Triple H. Look at the pushes for Swerve and Trick, putting Lash and Trick forward as a very attractive couple, even the singing with Sexy Red.
Hurt Business had their time, they were one of the MVP's, no pun intended, of the pandemic era. Factions end, that's just how it is, Shield didn't last. It's hard to find spots for everyone when the rosters are so full of talented people.
The booking on the male side of Black talent has been pretty weird/inconsistent this past year and a half. It’s like every time someone gets a CRUMB of momentum they get removed from TV or are only used to prop up whoever’s being pushed next.
Specifically DX all doing black face on national TV, Trips included, I would imagine. It could of course be excused that that was a Vince call, but it's a really, really bad look.
Yea the same guy who was mocking Indian citizens in NYC accents and mocked mark Henry with a gorilla taunt as he was coming down the ring which even JR didn’t acknowledge (so let’s not act like Vince told him to do it and he ain’t a grown ass man who could’ve said no and gotten heat in other ways)
Triple H has always been one of my top five favorite wrestlers and I've been a Triple H defender on the internet, including during his so-called reign of terror.
I didn't blame Triple H for the racism in the Booker T feud. He's a company man and he's playing the character they write for him. I didn't think the heavy metal imagery was enough to call the guy a racist. I didn't really think the "blackface" during the DX parodying the Nation segment was Triple H's idea or racially motivated hatred, though I understand better today why it was terribly racist.
But man ever since he has taken over as the head of creative... All of those examples of racism in his past are echoing in my mind as I watch what is happening with a lot of the latino talent and black talent. Now I'm looking at Triple H in charge going... OK this is where we find out if there's any truth to the racism allegations. And it ain't looking good.
I mean Cody Rhodes is the whitest white guy with the american flag and blond hair and blue eyes and... lol it was a great fucking story and he needs to be champion right now but it does NOT HELP Triple H at all.
Maybe it's unintentional bias! Maybe he sees this and talks to some black and latino writers and wrestlers and says let's fix this.
> He’s a company man and he’s playing the character they write for him.
Plenty have people have expressed regret for being involved in some of those sort of segments, eg Kurt Angle with the Sharmell angle during his Booker T feud or X-PAC about the blackface in the DX v Nation feud.
HHH never has though. If anything, he’s been enthusiastically at the forefront of a lot of these over the years.
If anyone has come up with a good reason as to why he monkey danced in front of Mark Henry on Raw all of years ago, I’m yet to hear it.
> I didn't blame Triple H for the racism in the Booker T feud. He's a company man and he's playing the character they write for him.
Take it for what it is but Bruce Pritchard said he DIDNT read what was written and said. He was supposed to say people like you and only subtly hint at racism but lean on the criminal thing but according to Pritchard Triple H added the "People like you. With your nappy hair and your fun little dance" stuff on his own which really made the context of the feud very clear.
Bruce Pritchard has been known to be full of shit though.
I think it’s more the stuff that happened behind the scenes that would have him labeled as a racist, like refusing to put over black talent such a D Lo who put him over so many times along with the Booker T stuff. He also tried his best to bury Rock which obviously didn’t work.
Ricardo Rodriguez has claimed that Triple H called him openly racist terms in NXT and the way he books the people of color along with the majority of release under him being people of color to me is more evidence than any promo he did back in the day as a fictional character.
I remember the backlash on social media when Trips got accused of putting together too many factions of racially similar people (LWO, Biana / Jade / Naomi / etc) so, lol
Normally I really hate the IWC knee jerk reaction to taking Black talent that aren't being used and throwing them in Nation of Domination 2.0 booking, but man, the Hurt Business was outstanding and had a great run and what I felt was a bright future ahead of it. I thought it was killed too soon and I always thought Vince moved on because he wanted to break Lashley away for a big singles run.
I'd love to see them come back in some fashion, because as others have pointed out they're kind of floundering in Main Event-level programs. Throw MVP together with Lashley and Omos and maybe bring in someone that need something to do - Shawn Spears? Dijak?
Something to shake up the dog whistles that pop up because it's hard to dismiss it seems Hunter really likes to paint all his stables with the same kind of brush.
What's fucking wild is all that comes to mind is that dirt sheet story in like 2008 where MVP attacked HHH with a screwdriver. WAS IT ACTUALLY REAL!?
Edit: I originally read about it when I was on the old wrestlecrap forums, I want to say it may or may not have been reported by Rajah at the time!
One image in particular is definitely interesting....
"He's emasculating black men." With MVP saying "You see it."
Which is interesting to me because as a Latino, I think HHH isn't doing a good job in booking Latino wrestlers either.
Prob should hire someone that could represent different cultures and maybe write for them for they can sound authentic. I know the drones will go out in force with their lil shitty downvotes thinking it has any use but nothing that I said is a lie.
A lil while ago someone commented why does HHH only book Latino talent against Latino talent and Andrade basically said “I’m asking myself the same thing”.
This is where I went too honestly. I can't help but notice how many factions in the WWE are racially or ethnicity based and how often those factions either feud with each other or just get pushed to the side. Bloodline (Samoan), Damage Ctrl (three Japanese wrestlers and Dakota), LWO (Latino), Legado (Latino), and The Pride (Black) all stand out - and obviously the Bloodline has a logical build to it, but the other four have way more talent than the overall storylines and wins they've been given - especially as Bayley was the face of Damage Ctrl and ended up with the title post-split. Heck, they even patched Bianca and Jade together despite both being, in storyline, way overpowered to be working in the women's tag division.
Contrast this with NXT where the top two men's titles have Black Men competing for them, the two women's titles are held by women of color, the factions are very diverse, and honestly it's hard not to notice it - especially when combined with the WWE's history on all of this stuff.
I also imagine MVP probably isn't super happy being a circus promoter for the attraction Omos on the house show circuit as opposed to being able to do something more.
Clearly since HHH took over, MVP's stock has dropped A LOT. He had more of a purpose under Vince McMahon definitely.
I gotta agree with you. I think HBK does a much better job when it comes to that than HHH. NXT on a roll.
> Clearly since HHH took over, MVP's stock has dropped A LOT. He had more of a purpose under Vince McMahon definitely.
Yeah there's no reason why MVP shouldn't be Paul Heyman but for RAW and can wrestle from time to time if needed
> Contrast this with NXT where the top two men's titles have Black Men competing for them, the two women's titles are held by women of color
Isn't that a pretty big overrepresentation? Is that what it takes for people to say things are being done right because that doesn't really seem sustainable, more happenstance that's cool but not necessary.
It is in this very moment but It's more about how NXT is more willing to place people of color in the main storylines and in more open completion and fans are backing it.
> Which is interesting to me because as a Latino, I think HHH isn't doing a good job in booking Latino wrestlers either.
As a south american (Chilean), lWo is fucking ass, one of the lamest stables I've ever had the experience of watching, no joke
All talented people wasted on this group lmfao
I didn’t downvote this comment, but I will say - do we actually know WWE doesn’t have different cultures in the creative room? They definitely should, it could only improve the product.
I was actually happy they added Carlito to the JD story. Grouping a team together based on race/ethnicity alone is the most annoying pro-wrestling trope.
> do we actually know WWE doesn’t have different cultures in the creative room?
Ryan Ward is still there I think? I know people who have left have talked about there being no women and at times no POC.
I can't tell you right now who's in their creative. I'm just willing to bet 432864872364823 dollars whoever is writing for LWO.... just isn't Latino.
I have listened to MANY interviews from former WWE creative. They tend to be white guys for the most part. Not everyone though but the ones that do media tours about their time there tend to be white.
As a black guy, it's definitely something that I've noticed once Triple H took over. Vince is plenty racist but he was booking a lot of black wrestlers pretty strongly in the pandemic era and shortly after plus giving a ton of TV time to them as well.
One of the things that was kinda a red flag for was the way HHH talked about diversity with women (and other groups) when they women started being booked on top in that it was basically "hey, I book who gets over. If women are in the main event, it's because they deserve it" as if wrestling were some big color/gender/etc blind meritocracy.
The key has never been about the exceptional talents, it's about who the booker tries to get over. Latinos, black wrestlers, and a lot of the women have sorta been after thoughts while he tries to get over his own projects (Kross, DIY, New Catch Republic, etc) instead while giving less attention to guys like Omos, Lashley, etc.
It's definitely not every case and I'm not even accusing anyone of anything but it's something that has been bugging me about the HHH-era.
Latino chiming in - I’m not here to argue your overall point, just thought it might be worth pointing out you probably shouldn’t list Kross as an example in this context.
Yes, Kross was an absolute pet project of Triple H.
Kross is also Puerto Rican.
Kross also just lost a feud against Lashley and the street profits. Like literally 2 months ago. Kross’s stable was squashed at Mania of all places yet people bitch about how the Profits and Lashley are booked
>I think HHH isn't doing a good job in booking Latino wrestlers either.
He isnt doing a good job in booking anyone*
He is overrated cause he isnt Vince, but once that shine wears off people will realize we still have the same booking as before. Which was never as bad as people thought, but since it was vince the booking was over hated
I would agree I haven't felt like the Latino representation has been very good. I am hoping though with the recent Dragon Lee and Andrade promos that they'll be booking them better/more interestingly.
They really need to change the way they write for them. I saw a LWO segment that was so cringey as fuck a couple of weeks ago. Like fucking embarrassingly bad filled "WWE speak" and phrases that Mexicans just do not ever use in English. It's blatant obvious that they don't have a Latino with Latino culture background writing for these guys.
I don't know, Bianca and Jade were plastered across the woman's division...I find these really serious accusations hard to not read at least a little as sour grapes, since these are only coming from one person who is not getting booked on TV.
Also, R-Truth is everywhere too, and Bobby Lashley has been used pretty well in a sunsetting wrestler role, able to be slotted in anywhere as a believable badass regardless of storyline. He was in EC! I don't know what else people want a 50 year old jacked motherfucker who is a **terrible** promo to do. Lashley has had a ceiling for a long time now due to his promo ability, he doesn't sound anything like you would expect and it doesn't really work with his gimmick of All-Mighty Greek God Body Huge Ass Beater.
Also, Omos is constantly on the house show circuit, it's not like MVP *and* the wrestler he manages are being kept away from people.
Also, The Rock was an integral part of the biggest Wrestlemania story in decades?
This isn't a great look for MVP imo...
Hot take: Judgement Day has been over pushed and every title reign they’ve had has gone on too long. People like Montez, Lashley, Bianca, Theory, LA, and even Seth kinda (his title reign felt less important than even the IC belt) are much better but have been severely underpushed during Triple H’s run. The middle of 2023 with JD all over Raw was trash outside of Cody vs Brock
Agreed, and I love(d?) Judgement Day. They had a good run but now it's just tiresome.. unfortunately, WWE has a habit of doing just that; finding something that works and running it into the ground.. and then deeper still.
Is it that farfetched that the members of the faction didn't want the presentation of the faction to be about race but they recognize the boss wasn't feeling the faction because he saw it as being about race?
Reminds me of when people complain about DEI stuff. The people who complain about it make it more about race than anyone else could.
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I'm just sad that Montez Ford seemed like he was primed for a great solo run after that Elimination Chamber performance and now he's stuck in this trio that is going absolutely nowhere.
This trio feels like it's actively making each guy lose stock. I've never been less interested in any of them than I am in this run of theirs.
At one point the Profits were easily the most over tag team in WWE and now you barely remember they're on the roster. Lashley went from WWE Champion to potentially being on Speed in a few weeks.
In fairness ill never forget Montez because of that clip of him screaming "WRESTLEMANIAAAAAAAAAAA"
Genuinely thought you were talking about the drug for a second I was wondering what the fuck storylines they’ve got going on at the moment
In fairness, we’ve had the rise of the Bloodline and the Judgment Day since then.
i’ve never seen a push die so immediately and so drastically due to unrelated unfortunate circumstances until seeing the way lashley’s momentum and aura got completely evaporated after bray wyatt had to step away from their mania match bobby went from going toe to toe w lesnar and being one of the top babyfaces on raw to being a nondescript midcard babyface, then a nondescript midcard heel with a forced stable, and now back to a nondescript midcard face with a forced stable.
Personally I don't think Lashley's aura died because of Wyatt disappearing, it died because the rubber match in his feud with Brock was a dogshit match that ended in a 4 minute DQ.
before Vince scandal hit it seemed like they were just weeks away from breaking up Profits and Montez singles run. Then Triple H took over and that got killed which i was pretty bummed about. Then the Chamber match happened which got my hopes up again only for not only Montez but Profits/Lashley not do anything of importance for year and a half now lol
Yup, he'd be so good in the US Title scene. He could have a banger of a match with Logan Paul.
It’s fine to want the Montez singles push but breaking the Profits up to do it would have been dumb.
Why? They're a decent team but have been around for years and going absolutely nowhere
i don’t understand teaming them up with b-fab and bobby. they don’t need a manager they already had the mic chops and bobby and them really had no correlation other than being black 😭
This Also, I feel like they lost a lot of momentum with that really weird heel run for a few weeks. They turned and seemed poised to be a heel faction with Bobby. Then they turned back and are just... there. Doesn't help that B-Fab doesn't really add much as a manager. She doesn't speak or even really hype them up.
yeah pairing them up does feel like someone in management going "They're all black, right? Let's make a group."
By all accounts wrestlers asked to be paired with together or who they want in a stable. Hence why minorities are paired together, the black wrestlers likely hang out and travel together and the Latino's likely hang out together and the Japanese wrestlers are friends with history. So you pair them with people you believe they have chemistry with The build up to the Pride was Bobby talking to a lot of black wrestlers like Carmelo Hayes, Cedric, Ashante, Omos, Shelton teasing the idea of a Hurt Business 2.0 before choosing the Street Profits to mentor. Which makes sense from a storyline perspective, the Profits want a legend like Lashley to guide them in a new direction and Lashley is getting older so he doesn't have to be in the ring as much.
Wwe likes to group minorities together
Let’s not forget, no one in the IWC at the time wanted the profits to be broken up. They didn’t have a sense of direction but people were worried about Angelo Dawkins being stuck in mid card purgatory which is honestly fair given the history of WWE and Vince at the time. Arguably they would have been far better off as solo characters than what we got. but I think it’s not necessary, and we could of had a story similar to trick and Carmelo before a break off. Either way it’s not fully HHH’s fault that they weren’t broken up either. Either way it really sucks, Montez is so talented and deserves the opportunity at the United States or intercontinental title at the minimum just to see him as a solo act and really break out, but we’re no closer to that happening in the past 2 years. Personally I would love to see him get that opportunity after LA Knight gets his flowers.
I wanted Angelo to turn heel on Montez and become the leader of Hit Row. Montez would've been super over as a babyface at the time, and Angelo would've gotten lots of heat. Angelo would've also had Top Dolla as a heater and Ashante as a workhorse. And B-Fab to counter Montez's inevitable alignment with Bianca. Hit Row themselves floundered without a third man, and Angelo could've been it.
The IWC didn't want The New Day to be broken up either. What happened? As soon as Big E or Kofi lost their titles, they went back to being tag team wrestlers lost in the shuffle instead of building upon their solo run. Meanwhile, Jey is constantly in the Main-Event because he can't simply go back to The Usos ( and when he did, it was the worst work he ever done that almost ruined his momentum ) As for Angelo, if he is good ( which he is ), he will shine. He has his own charisma completely different from Montez, he has a hoss move-set that's totally different from Montez. He can work and he should be trusted. Also, how is it not HHH's fault? He is the booker, he is the one who never did anything with Lashley or Montez or Dawkins to the point no one cares about Montez anymore while Logan Paul has been champion for more than half a year while never being on the roster.
I really don't see why every time a tag guy gets a little morw momentum than his partner, it's backstage like "ohhhh we GOTTA have one turn heel on the other!" Why they can't just do what they did when Enzo was hurt and Cass was still wrestling, have him talk, beyond me.
It’s weird they did that small hint towards him going heel after the Street Profits lost to the Uso’s years ago and then just dropped it. I always feel like Montez and Bianca would make a great heel power couple
Hate that both tag titles are stuck on thrown together duos while the Street Profits just kinda sit around. Montez Ford is obviously really good but Dawkins is also someone that could be a staple of their midcard, and could always be paired with another person in the future to further the tag division's development.
Bobby Lashley, The Street Profits, Cedric Alexander, Shelton Benjamin and MVP as a newly reenforced Hurt Business would've been fucking sick. They could've been an entire 3 month feud for The Bloodline in their prime leading to War Games.
Now I'm sad we won't ever get this. Montez Ford, Cedric, and Shelton in a War Games match is just a highlight reel.
IDK what it us, but his beard keeps making me expect a heel turn sometime soon.
You people are always sad for all these wrestlers and for the good reasons obviously because they have talent and promise, but you just can't be pissed not every wrestler with potential is given a chance because there just isn't that much space for it.
With how long title reigns are now there's not much room for anyone in the top spots that's not been in those storylines as they've been building them for a long time
Yeah. I mean how many wrestlers have been pushed that didn't deserve it instead of Montez Ford or Bobby Lashley since Vince left? Not enough time on TV even for LA knight. Karrion Kross been given chances sure, but his segments are essentially Hurt Business's chances as he was feuding with them. Maybe solo right now but he's just keeping the seat warm for Roman Reigns.
all the POC push slots have been taken up by 29 random samoans, sorry.
Funny how you make a negative comment about race stuff and WWE when you can't tell the difference between Samoans and Tongans when the 'random samoans' you're talking about literally have "Tonga" in their names.
Why is the bloodline half Samoan and half tongan now anyway? Didn't the rock show a literal family tree at one point to show us who the bloodline was?
The Tongan connection hasn't been revealed yet (if there even is anything to reveal), but they're implying that Solo's building up his own crew to take over the Bloodline and usurp power while Roman's out. I've seen people in the past say that The Rock's family and Haku (the father of the Tongans) are connected in some familial/tribal way other than by blood, but not sure what's correct and what isn't.
Rock considers Haku to be an uncle
I'm not sure how the Tongan side fits into things, but the Rock is not related to Roman and the Usos by blood. That might be what you're thinking of.
I don’t get why Bobby Lashley booking has fallen off a cliff. Guy is still massively over. Crowds were rejecting his heel turn and giving him a massive reaction but him and the profits haven’t really gotten great booking.
I don’t get why HHH never slotted him against Roman at any point during his reign.
Yea especially when Roman beat every major threat there was, can’t really think of anyone else besides Lashley that could have a chance but didn’t face him
Lashley even pinned the big dog on a random raw years ago. When he was champion a few years back he was so fucking cool and he never really lost that aura. We still love Bobby
Sheamus and Lashley were the last two challengers
Probably to protect Lashley. Lashley wasn't gonna be the one to beat Roman. They did Roman vs Brock already so Roman didn't need a win over Lashley too. Lashley shouldn't lose very often, especially not in singles matches, to keep his aura. If you look at last 3 years, Lashley has won about 80% of his singles matches. Besides Roman and Cody, only Gunther is a bit better.
So he's protected Lashley to do what exactly?
He's injured atm I believe.
I’m talking for the past 2 years or so. Since the creative change he’s taken a major demotion down the card.
Probably because he's 47. Can't expect him to do it much longer
Idk about this narrative when AJ Styles just had two wwe championship matches at 47, nobody tryna push a racist narrative but Bobby’s booking been suspect as fuck since HHH took charge. Especially as a guy who’s one of the last remnants of the ruthless aggression era who people recognize. Bobby is underrated on here for how OVER he truly is.
Three Title matches at 47 really. AJ Styles' whole new persona became a thing after losing the 4-Way and blaming LA Knight. But while AJ is featured more than Bobby I wouldn't say he is booked stronger. His role is to lose every major feud now (which he should). You bring Bobby back tomorrow and put him in a top programme people wouldnt bat an eye. He is absolutely on the same level and booking as Styles. Just not featured right now.
They did that whole tease where he celebrated a win with a fan’s replica title and got a huge reaction, but they never went anywhere with it.
I guess it's just case of bad timing with injuries and not being able to use everybody at the same time. It does seem like he was gearing up for a program with Carmelo Hayes before his injury. Which is the perfect spot for a 48yo veteran.
It’s interesting because they had MVP talking to people in the background similar to what Liv had been doing but it went no where.
You could have made bobby + SP and hell throw in Omos and called then the new hurt business just like like the LWO at least we would have gotten to see Omos more and hurt business sounds a hell of a lot better of a faction name than "the pride". Such a shame.
This has to be the biggest shot taken by a contracted talent since HHH took over. MVP is pretty much implying that HHH is racist, wild.
Yeah the thread title is burying the lead here. MVP isn’t just saying HHH squashed the Hurt Business comeback, he’s implying that HHH is “emasculating black men” which feels like a big accusation to throw out there
The second and the last comments on the right don't really leave much to the imagination. HHH not wanting to bring back Hurt Business is one thing but those two responses... Ouch. Props to MVP for not giving a shit I guess.
I think HHH is really focused on the younger talent getting some more tv time and developing. The Hurt Business was MVP, Bobby, Shelton and Cedric. The problem is none of those guys are the future. I also hate the booking of specific races and genders being in the same group all the time. I love judgment day because its a nice mix.
>The problem is none of those guys are the future. The Cedric erasure will absolutely not stand.
Cedric is great but has the charisma of my toe.
Sounds like he'd benefit from some kind of stable with a manager.
I mean he did for what a year? How long we gonna keep beating the Cedric horse until we realize that he suffers from Ricochetitus?
Cedric isn't entertaining on the mic.
He screams a lot and sounds way too.. Not raspy but idk, there's something that sounds unpleasant, kinda like Seth's voice sometimes
Cedric has no real charisma or anything to take him to the next level. He peaked during the Cruiserweight days.
Doesn't seem like Omos is benefitting from that. In fact, the only black wrestler really doing anything of consequence is Jade Cargill and Bianca as a tag team. Now, Lashley's injured, I guess, but let's be real, he'd probably be doing nothing of consequence either since when he left, he was trying to get The Pride over to no success.
And Bianca and Jade just lost those titles surprisingly quickly for what should have been the most dominant women's tag team maybe ever. They lost it clean as well regardless of if they got pinned. Dominance means overcoming odds otherwise any champ could lose in a standard triple threat. Imagine Cody had a triple threat even now and just lost to someone with no build who hadn't even been on TV. It would rightfully cause outrage especially if he won clean. Now obviously there are external factors to consider and I'm not angry that the unholy union won. I'm upset that Jade and Bianca could be made to lose so easily without more cheating from the unholy union to justify a rematch and the narrative which was the main story of the tag division " who could possibly topple the most dominant team maybe ever?"
Why have a dominant reign that ends with a good build when you can just go for the cheap hometown/country pop?
To be fair, they very likely did this to get a hometown pop in (as Drew was losing), split Jade and Bianca and seemingly get Jade ready to dethrone Jax. Would be my guess.
I don’t think he’s a racist but he’s not doing himself any favors to prevent that perception. All main roster Latinos are either with LWO or somehow affected by the LWO or Legado. Profits are doing nothing basically, Bobby has been reduced to a leader of a nothing faction. Melo has lost a lot of momentum. New Day needs to figure things out. And then you have Bronn Breaker who is pushed to the heavens right now. Jade, Bianca, Dom and Priest are the only minorities in some form of prospering story
>And then you have Bronn Breaker who is pushed to the heavens right now. He's 26 and has pretty much everything you want in a professional wrestler. Barring injury, he is the future of the company.
It doesn't even take any *conscious* racism. All it takes is for him to think about what the next story should be, and even though he hasn't figured out which wrestlers to cast, the placeholder people in his imagined scene are all white. If that happens and he doesn't question it, good luck getting a good role if you don't match the image in his head.
People forget that H worked right alongside Vince for years, and while he certainly hated or disagreed with some (probably a few fair regarding NXT call ups) of Vince's decisions, he was likely agreeing with most of it, and being deeply influenced by Vince and his mindset. I do check in on current day WWE but still recognise too many Vince-isms to really get sucked in and invested. I also remember NXT more clearly than most and think H is just an above average booker, but not much more. I think WWE's boom was the promised pay off to the Cody story and Trips was seen as a master story teller for telling it well without too many hiccups, unlike how Vince would, but that in a year or two people will turn on him as they see more of his stories and how they play out.
Throw in that Bruce Pritchard threw Triple H under the bus as ad libbing lines during the Booker T promo that made it racist. Bruce Pritchard is usually full of shit but add that to his bad Pakistani accent segment...it all just doesnt look great on the surface.
May as well include Damage CTRL in this, even if Iyo is still being presented somewhat well. Anyway this is one of the reasons why HBK > HHH as a booker tbh.
I mean no one in this new Wyatt clan is actually the future either. Montez should absolutely be a singles star right now and I wonder why he isn’t.
Its a merchandise grab, like Hardy Boyz or New Day. There's always room for midcarders that can push merchandise in WWE. I mean look at Xavier Woods, he wrestles like once a month maybe, even less for singles matches. And he's probably raking in well over a million with the youtube channel and new day/upupdwndwn merchandise while WWE gets a nice cut.
I know nothing lasts forever, but it always shocks me to see how trivial New Day is now after what they were. A wider gulf than Bryan's drop from winning the world title after going through Batista, Orton, and HHH, to scrambling for the IC title.
New Days whole thing was that there were 3 of them. A regular tag team of Xavier and Kofi isn't the same vibe.
What a crazy allegation with Trick being the guy on NXT, and Carmelo getting a push.
MVP is victimizing so hard there it's insane. The hurt business was already dead in the water at the end of VKM era and somehow its HHHs fault lmao.
The shittiest part is that as much as I do like Triple H, it’s not like it doesn’t track, can’t remember him every working a program with anybody black since, well you know.
Since Booker? HHH put Shelton over huge, I want to say he lost to him 3 or 4 times in a row
Hunter wrestled and lossed to Shelton a year and a half after the Booker match at XIX. He also worked with Booker again during the King Booker gimmick in 2007. There's also the fact that there wasn't any other Black talent to work with the in main-event scene. Lashley wasn't around long enough before he quit.
Yeah that creepy “emasculating black men” is really a red flag, yet mvp is like “that’s rights!”
I mean, history would not be kind to HHH in that respect. There's certainly some amount of examples.
I'm surprised that MVP isn't at least featured more right now as an additional commentator or as a manager for another wrestler aside from Omos
He’s a great talker at one point I felt like he was the best talker outside of maybe heyman. It’s a shame we didn’t get hurt business vs the bloodline
It isn't shocking given all those PUBLIC Instagram comments have MVP calling HHH a secret racist... If I'm HHH, what incentivizes me to give somebody who does that television time? I think two things can be true at the same time. 1. WWE has and has always had a problem with consistently booking minorities in storylines. And that isn't limited to just black people. That's Asians, Latinos, Middle Easterners, etc... 2. HHH is not racist and this rant is more MVP being bitter his television time with the Omos storyline was cut and never given a chance. So these posts are him lashing out over that. I also think it's worth noting that it is quite clear that NXT is being primed as the brand to target the African American audience right now while main roster is not that.
Exactly. These comments are a big indicator that the working relationship between MVP and WWE is coming to an end. That first point has been true historically but Bianca has been the top face and strongest booked of the women for years now, Bobby might be in a lull atm but has been very well utilized in recent years. Very few guys have been booked as definitively to be Brock's equal as Lashley was. There are clearly huge plans for Trick and Melo and I'd be surprised if that wasn't still true for Montez as well. MVP is being brazen here, he likely doesn't give AF anymore and the relationship has degraded behind the scenes.
Montez has absolutely no momentum rn lol I doubt theirs huge plans for him
But HHH had sidelines both MVP and the Hurt Business literal *years* before these comments were made. You’re making it sound like it’s not surprising HHH has sidelined them *because* of these comments, but it makes no sense.
If he's saying this publicly, how guarded are his comments to other staff in the building? Folks talk shit at work. That's normal. Folks also get in trouble for running their mouths about the wrong person. No surprises here.
We just found out why.
I like the Street Profits a lot. And would not mind solo runs. But as soon as they became attached to Lashley, they just fell down hard.
If Lashley and the SP are going to remain together, then I’d rather see Dawkins and Lashley tag teaming together and Ford as the solo champion within the group.
HHH about to bring back the Hurt Business minus MVP outta spite.
And they're gonna dominate Speed.
Awfully bold for a contracted talent 😬
It’s a contract though. He is getting paid until the end of it.
You’re right, WWE talent have never been released from contracts early.
This may sound harsh, but MVP can easily be fired for these statements.
If you breach certain terms it can be terminated tho right?
oh yikes some of these look bad
That one in the bottom right is a simple but pretty brutal response.
That was something he said during the Triple H vs. Booker T pre Wrestlemania match promo. Who told him to say it? Maybe Vince IDK. But the excuse of "People like you meaning WCW guys." Was an awful one.
I knew where the quote came from. It was the 100 emoji that I was surprised by. MVP didn't try to soften the use of the quote or anything. Just agreed completely and kept it moving.
I heard he originally wanted to be called Kunter Kearst Kelmsley
Triple Hitler
Well damn, there’s some pretty heavy comments/insinuations from MVP on the right side there… Especially the one where he agreed with the comment referencing the “Someone like you doesn’t get to be champion” promo.
It was better as the Beat Down Clan anyway...
I love me some Kenny King
Fans commenting things like "you gotta talk to Hunter, Nick, and William" as a normal thing on every wrestling post in 2024 is the biggest takeaway. This is the era for that kind of fan. Would have been roasted to hell for posting something like this in years past
Triple H don't give af about Bobby Lashey i thought we knew this. And the way he booked Lashley/Profits i'm not surprised he said no to hurt business
Bobby is suffering the same fate as everyone else after a certain age with few exceptions. If you’re not one of the biggest stars like Orton or Rock, your creative is secondary. It’s why Edge left, it’s why Goldberg isn’t getting that retirement match.
Edge had a hell in a cell wrestlemania match where he went over lol
Goldberg? He had more opportunities than he should’ve had his last run. Also with Edge he was give the Rumble and essentially put no one over but Roman.
Edge had a ton of high profile feuds before he did though ,Bobby is not only still over but can go in the ring plus ticks all the charisma boxes preety much ,theres no reason he shouldnt be having big feuds.
Doing this while under contract is beast ngl
I’m seeing a lot of comments about Bobby’s age as if there aren’t multiple top guys in there late 30s to early 40s. Nobody is saying that he needs to be world champ but his booking pre-WM 39 to now is night and day.
Yeah I’m not buying the age excuse when Bobby doesn’t even look like he’s 40 either, plus he’s still extremely over. Even if he’s not a champ or anything, it feels like it’s been a long while since he’s been featured in anything memorable or meaningful
Yeah a lot of the reasons mentioned hold no weight at all. Even if you think he's old and doesn't have much longer as an active guy he's a more recent champion and there is a lot to mine from that. He can easily elevate someone to the next level.
I feel like the one guy who wasn't a big fan of the Hurt Business. I like all the guys involved but it never clicked for me
They started a bit awkwardly but they definitely found their groove after a bit. It felt like they were in the cusp of being amazing than they broke them up for whatever reason
It's just one of those things people always bring up as a fix or fantasy booking. Like reforming bullet club in WWE. Never any suggestion on what they would do or why that would be good. Bobby Lashley is currently in a faction with a (now) lower tier tag team. What would be different if he was with Shelton and Cedric?
Me neither but I'd be open to it being given another shot. People seem to have clicked with it and it had a lot of potential.
you’re not alone it’s just pandemic nostalgia ppl pretending like those mfs were evolution
This thread is making me feel like I should delete Reddit holy moly.
Sounds like something personal with MVP. Notice how Omos isn't on TV anymore either? Anyway at first I really didn't agree with one of those Tweets about HHH "emasculating" black men. Then I thought about it and it isn't that crazy to see. I know Lashley is hurt but the Pride has completely stalled him and the Street Profits. Omos is almost completely gone from TV, when was his last appearance? Crews is getting TV time...while getting his ass whooped. Ashonte/Cedric are technically paired together but haven't done anything recently besides appear ringside. Carmelo is the only black dude I think getting significant TV time. The New Day are getting some midcard TV time but it's revolving around the boring black hole of a Kross story. Ricochet was but he's probably gone now. The Street Profits have fallen so far despite being on TV. I might be forgetting someone significant but I really can't think of any black guys with a significant spot on TV outside of Carmelo. I don't really agree that HHH is "emasculating" them but I do understand why someone would feel that way. NXT is absolutely cooking though so the future is bright. Trick, Lee and Femi are all going to be big deals right away. Especially Trick.
I just don't understand. Because you look at black and gold nxt and you see what H is capable of. But the way certain stars are being handled isn't just limited to black wrestlers. It extends to latinos. Look at the whole LWO v LDF feud. It extends to the women's division. Rhea Ripley is so over but her title reign was uneventful and had so much potential. Same can be said for Bianca and IYO. It extends to the tag division too.
Bianca is still well featured but she definitely felt like a bigger deal before the creative change than she does now. The never ending damage ctrl feud really didn’t help.
They sidelined her in a tag team to get somebody else over. It’s also interesting to note in relation to a discussion of race and Hunter, that he took the two African American women stars (or rather one star, one the company wants to be a star) he has and put them together. They also happen to be of a certain type as well.
You're definitely right. I just brought up the men since that's all the post brought up. I think Bianca and Jade are pushed really well. Naomi is given significant TV time and title matches since she has been back. B Fab is trapped in that Pride stuff although she was never more than a stand in for stables. Kayden Carter was a champion and does get TV time. I could be forgetting someone but I don't think the main roster has many black women. It might just be those five. Although again NXT has some great wrestlers waiting. Lash is going to do really well.
Kiana James is also black.
Carmelo also is getting TV time as a “footnote” to the real Logan vs LA Knight, maybe it gets more heat after that feud is settled but right now he’s kinda just “there” for LA to shit talk to when Logan is busy
>NXT is absolutely cooking though so the future is bright. Trick, Lee and Femi are all going to be big deals right away. Especially Trick. I still remember Swerve saying HBK and Triple H had radically different opinions of him, which gives me pause. I can't believe I'm saying this, but it unironically feels like Shawn is a lot more attuned to or invested in African American culture than Triple H. Look at the pushes for Swerve and Trick, putting Lash and Trick forward as a very attractive couple, even the singing with Sexy Red.
Hurt Business had their time, they were one of the MVP's, no pun intended, of the pandemic era. Factions end, that's just how it is, Shield didn't last. It's hard to find spots for everyone when the rosters are so full of talented people.
::HBK building up all his Black wrestlers as good as he can:: HHH : "Yeah. That doesn't work for me Brother."
They don't call him HBShizzle for no reason.
Hurt Business had that Final Boss energy. Especially on Lashleys entrance.
The booking on the male side of Black talent has been pretty weird/inconsistent this past year and a half. It’s like every time someone gets a CRUMB of momentum they get removed from TV or are only used to prop up whoever’s being pushed next.
HHH will never beat the racist allegations
Being prominently involved in two of the most infamously racist angles in WWE history certainly doesn't help.
Booker T, and what’s the other? The DX mocking of The Nation of Domination?
Specifically DX all doing black face on national TV, Trips included, I would imagine. It could of course be excused that that was a Vince call, but it's a really, really bad look.
He also did monkey gestures towards Mark Henry
His posing with Trump?
Yea the same guy who was mocking Indian citizens in NYC accents and mocked mark Henry with a gorilla taunt as he was coming down the ring which even JR didn’t acknowledge (so let’s not act like Vince told him to do it and he ain’t a grown ass man who could’ve said no and gotten heat in other ways)
Triple H has always been one of my top five favorite wrestlers and I've been a Triple H defender on the internet, including during his so-called reign of terror. I didn't blame Triple H for the racism in the Booker T feud. He's a company man and he's playing the character they write for him. I didn't think the heavy metal imagery was enough to call the guy a racist. I didn't really think the "blackface" during the DX parodying the Nation segment was Triple H's idea or racially motivated hatred, though I understand better today why it was terribly racist. But man ever since he has taken over as the head of creative... All of those examples of racism in his past are echoing in my mind as I watch what is happening with a lot of the latino talent and black talent. Now I'm looking at Triple H in charge going... OK this is where we find out if there's any truth to the racism allegations. And it ain't looking good. I mean Cody Rhodes is the whitest white guy with the american flag and blond hair and blue eyes and... lol it was a great fucking story and he needs to be champion right now but it does NOT HELP Triple H at all. Maybe it's unintentional bias! Maybe he sees this and talks to some black and latino writers and wrestlers and says let's fix this.
> He’s a company man and he’s playing the character they write for him. Plenty have people have expressed regret for being involved in some of those sort of segments, eg Kurt Angle with the Sharmell angle during his Booker T feud or X-PAC about the blackface in the DX v Nation feud. HHH never has though. If anything, he’s been enthusiastically at the forefront of a lot of these over the years. If anyone has come up with a good reason as to why he monkey danced in front of Mark Henry on Raw all of years ago, I’m yet to hear it.
ah man I know he doesn't like it but it's so fucking hilarious. "I WANT TO HAVE ROUGH SEX WITH YOUR WIFE"
> I didn't blame Triple H for the racism in the Booker T feud. He's a company man and he's playing the character they write for him. Take it for what it is but Bruce Pritchard said he DIDNT read what was written and said. He was supposed to say people like you and only subtly hint at racism but lean on the criminal thing but according to Pritchard Triple H added the "People like you. With your nappy hair and your fun little dance" stuff on his own which really made the context of the feud very clear. Bruce Pritchard has been known to be full of shit though.
I think it’s more the stuff that happened behind the scenes that would have him labeled as a racist, like refusing to put over black talent such a D Lo who put him over so many times along with the Booker T stuff. He also tried his best to bury Rock which obviously didn’t work. Ricardo Rodriguez has claimed that Triple H called him openly racist terms in NXT and the way he books the people of color along with the majority of release under him being people of color to me is more evidence than any promo he did back in the day as a fictional character.
I mean, do a majority of people really WANT the Hurt Business?
How to get fired 101
I genuinely don't think he cares at this point.
He’s probably trying to get fired…
I remember the backlash on social media when Trips got accused of putting together too many factions of racially similar people (LWO, Biana / Jade / Naomi / etc) so, lol
I dont know why youd just want to rehash the Hurt Business anyways.
Kind of gutsy to go on social media and say these things. Did MVP already leave WWE?
Maybe HHH thinks it’s played out.
Normally I really hate the IWC knee jerk reaction to taking Black talent that aren't being used and throwing them in Nation of Domination 2.0 booking, but man, the Hurt Business was outstanding and had a great run and what I felt was a bright future ahead of it. I thought it was killed too soon and I always thought Vince moved on because he wanted to break Lashley away for a big singles run. I'd love to see them come back in some fashion, because as others have pointed out they're kind of floundering in Main Event-level programs. Throw MVP together with Lashley and Omos and maybe bring in someone that need something to do - Shawn Spears? Dijak? Something to shake up the dog whistles that pop up because it's hard to dismiss it seems Hunter really likes to paint all his stables with the same kind of brush.
For someone who can talk better than like half the roster (and is funny asf lol), I'm surprised MVP hasn't been featured more, in ***any*** capacity.
I'm just glad someone isnt glazing HHH
Right. Its actually refreshing from the usual “HHH is so great” comments that the company spams over and over again
That may explain why we haven't really seen MVP these days. Such a shame he's a great manager if they'd just pair him up with someone else
Welp....looks like MVP is coming to TNA.
So you're saying there's a chance?!
What's fucking wild is all that comes to mind is that dirt sheet story in like 2008 where MVP attacked HHH with a screwdriver. WAS IT ACTUALLY REAL!? Edit: I originally read about it when I was on the old wrestlecrap forums, I want to say it may or may not have been reported by Rajah at the time!
One image in particular is definitely interesting.... "He's emasculating black men." With MVP saying "You see it." Which is interesting to me because as a Latino, I think HHH isn't doing a good job in booking Latino wrestlers either. Prob should hire someone that could represent different cultures and maybe write for them for they can sound authentic. I know the drones will go out in force with their lil shitty downvotes thinking it has any use but nothing that I said is a lie.
A lil while ago someone commented why does HHH only book Latino talent against Latino talent and Andrade basically said “I’m asking myself the same thing”.
This is where I went too honestly. I can't help but notice how many factions in the WWE are racially or ethnicity based and how often those factions either feud with each other or just get pushed to the side. Bloodline (Samoan), Damage Ctrl (three Japanese wrestlers and Dakota), LWO (Latino), Legado (Latino), and The Pride (Black) all stand out - and obviously the Bloodline has a logical build to it, but the other four have way more talent than the overall storylines and wins they've been given - especially as Bayley was the face of Damage Ctrl and ended up with the title post-split. Heck, they even patched Bianca and Jade together despite both being, in storyline, way overpowered to be working in the women's tag division. Contrast this with NXT where the top two men's titles have Black Men competing for them, the two women's titles are held by women of color, the factions are very diverse, and honestly it's hard not to notice it - especially when combined with the WWE's history on all of this stuff. I also imagine MVP probably isn't super happy being a circus promoter for the attraction Omos on the house show circuit as opposed to being able to do something more.
Clearly since HHH took over, MVP's stock has dropped A LOT. He had more of a purpose under Vince McMahon definitely. I gotta agree with you. I think HBK does a much better job when it comes to that than HHH. NXT on a roll.
> Clearly since HHH took over, MVP's stock has dropped A LOT. He had more of a purpose under Vince McMahon definitely. Yeah there's no reason why MVP shouldn't be Paul Heyman but for RAW and can wrestle from time to time if needed
> Contrast this with NXT where the top two men's titles have Black Men competing for them, the two women's titles are held by women of color Isn't that a pretty big overrepresentation? Is that what it takes for people to say things are being done right because that doesn't really seem sustainable, more happenstance that's cool but not necessary.
It is in this very moment but It's more about how NXT is more willing to place people of color in the main storylines and in more open completion and fans are backing it.
> Which is interesting to me because as a Latino, I think HHH isn't doing a good job in booking Latino wrestlers either. As a south american (Chilean), lWo is fucking ass, one of the lamest stables I've ever had the experience of watching, no joke All talented people wasted on this group lmfao
They fucking suck, man lol. You can tell Zelina Vega has not found herself in this role AT ALL.
I didn’t downvote this comment, but I will say - do we actually know WWE doesn’t have different cultures in the creative room? They definitely should, it could only improve the product. I was actually happy they added Carlito to the JD story. Grouping a team together based on race/ethnicity alone is the most annoying pro-wrestling trope.
> do we actually know WWE doesn’t have different cultures in the creative room? Ryan Ward is still there I think? I know people who have left have talked about there being no women and at times no POC.
I can't tell you right now who's in their creative. I'm just willing to bet 432864872364823 dollars whoever is writing for LWO.... just isn't Latino. I have listened to MANY interviews from former WWE creative. They tend to be white guys for the most part. Not everyone though but the ones that do media tours about their time there tend to be white.
As a black guy, it's definitely something that I've noticed once Triple H took over. Vince is plenty racist but he was booking a lot of black wrestlers pretty strongly in the pandemic era and shortly after plus giving a ton of TV time to them as well. One of the things that was kinda a red flag for was the way HHH talked about diversity with women (and other groups) when they women started being booked on top in that it was basically "hey, I book who gets over. If women are in the main event, it's because they deserve it" as if wrestling were some big color/gender/etc blind meritocracy. The key has never been about the exceptional talents, it's about who the booker tries to get over. Latinos, black wrestlers, and a lot of the women have sorta been after thoughts while he tries to get over his own projects (Kross, DIY, New Catch Republic, etc) instead while giving less attention to guys like Omos, Lashley, etc. It's definitely not every case and I'm not even accusing anyone of anything but it's something that has been bugging me about the HHH-era.
Latino chiming in - I’m not here to argue your overall point, just thought it might be worth pointing out you probably shouldn’t list Kross as an example in this context. Yes, Kross was an absolute pet project of Triple H. Kross is also Puerto Rican.
The world champion is also Puerto Rican...
cody rhodes is half cuban.
Kross also just lost a feud against Lashley and the street profits. Like literally 2 months ago. Kross’s stable was squashed at Mania of all places yet people bitch about how the Profits and Lashley are booked
>I think HHH isn't doing a good job in booking Latino wrestlers either. He isnt doing a good job in booking anyone* He is overrated cause he isnt Vince, but once that shine wears off people will realize we still have the same booking as before. Which was never as bad as people thought, but since it was vince the booking was over hated
I'm gonna be honest. If Vince had booked that Clash at the Castle show, he would've been crucified for that shitty booking.
I would agree I haven't felt like the Latino representation has been very good. I am hoping though with the recent Dragon Lee and Andrade promos that they'll be booking them better/more interestingly.
They really need to change the way they write for them. I saw a LWO segment that was so cringey as fuck a couple of weeks ago. Like fucking embarrassingly bad filled "WWE speak" and phrases that Mexicans just do not ever use in English. It's blatant obvious that they don't have a Latino with Latino culture background writing for these guys.
I don't know, Bianca and Jade were plastered across the woman's division...I find these really serious accusations hard to not read at least a little as sour grapes, since these are only coming from one person who is not getting booked on TV. Also, R-Truth is everywhere too, and Bobby Lashley has been used pretty well in a sunsetting wrestler role, able to be slotted in anywhere as a believable badass regardless of storyline. He was in EC! I don't know what else people want a 50 year old jacked motherfucker who is a **terrible** promo to do. Lashley has had a ceiling for a long time now due to his promo ability, he doesn't sound anything like you would expect and it doesn't really work with his gimmick of All-Mighty Greek God Body Huge Ass Beater. Also, Omos is constantly on the house show circuit, it's not like MVP *and* the wrestler he manages are being kept away from people. Also, The Rock was an integral part of the biggest Wrestlemania story in decades? This isn't a great look for MVP imo...
“Please fire me.” - MVP
https://preview.redd.it/oc7hea33tz7d1.jpeg?width=640&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=955a74285a0a05c28721e90824741645c962f02e
i dont see the appeal of hurt business.
Hot take: Judgement Day has been over pushed and every title reign they’ve had has gone on too long. People like Montez, Lashley, Bianca, Theory, LA, and even Seth kinda (his title reign felt less important than even the IC belt) are much better but have been severely underpushed during Triple H’s run. The middle of 2023 with JD all over Raw was trash outside of Cody vs Brock
Yes. It's partially why I prefer Smackdown. A billion segments with Judgement Day is every Raw isn't it
Agreed, and I love(d?) Judgement Day. They had a good run but now it's just tiresome.. unfortunately, WWE has a habit of doing just that; finding something that works and running it into the ground.. and then deeper still.
H burying the brothers since booker t, meanwhile swerve is the world champion. You see it.
I feel like the Hurt Business have come back and gone so many times now I think it's just a lost cause at this point
Its pretty crazy to think about about Swerves comments saying he said he wasnt Triple Hs guy. I think he meant what MVP was implying.
MVP went from 'The Hurt Business is not a faction based on race' to implying Triple H is racist because he doesn't want to book the faction on TV.
Is it that farfetched that the members of the faction didn't want the presentation of the faction to be about race but they recognize the boss wasn't feeling the faction because he saw it as being about race? Reminds me of when people complain about DEI stuff. The people who complain about it make it more about race than anyone else could.