You’re 100% within your rights to talk with your supervisor and I suggest you do so.
Some tactics you can use with J-
Interrupt and redirect him when he starts the creepy talk…
J, “you are so pretty, I’d-“
You, “J, does the van have enough gas? You should go check, hate for you and our customers to get stranded.”
You, “J, I have to concentrate on this so I need you to find somewhere else to be for a while, thank you.”
You, “J, i’m not sure what you meant by that, but it’s not a conversation for a work place.”
yeah, that's way inappropriate.
yes, take it up with your manager, but I would also start a diary/journal of dates/times/creepy-stuff he's said/done.
after you've spoken to your manager, and if creepy-guy doesn't pull his head in, then you contact corporate hr and tell them he is doing these things - scan&email / fax your documentation. this is low level harassment, and while he (probably) won't take it to the 'next level', just the stress you are being put through is creating a hostile environment.
now, no doubt he (and possibly hr) will come back and say 'it's just his way' and 'he doesn't mean anything by it' - but that is not the point. *he* may not mean anything, but *you* are feeling harassed and constantly, night after night - so it needs to stop.
I used to have a friend whose father was in his 70s. Every time we went to her parents' house, he wanted a hug. That, on its own, wasn't a problem. The thing I hated was that he always patted my butt when he hugged me. Creeped me out big time. But he was old and feeble so I didn't know what to say or do about it. I mostly tried to be on my way out the door as she started to tell her parents bye. I was in my 30s and didn't know how to handle it without upsetting everyone. But I hated to hug that old man. Some older men are just perverts and they think they can get away with it because of their age. Because a lot of people won't say anything. Don't be afraid to say something to your boss. You shouldn't have to put up with that stuff, especially at work.
This is because we were taught that girls need to "be nice." We were also taught by actions that we have to hug or kiss someone hello or goodbye. Studies are showing these actions by parents, negate the whole say no talk, or the it's our body talk. It is what made most of us vulnerable to SA, whether that was from a family member, a co-worker, or a friend of the family.
You need to report this.
The name thing is weird, but yes, remembering names or face blind may be the cause but that stuff about boys... No! Draw a line and stick to it. If you want management to handle it, fine. But otherwise just be rude when it gets to that point. Many men don't get hints. I would go with something like. "My private life is not up for discussion, ever! Got it?" You can then shorten it to "boundaries!". And walk away from him each time. He should get the hint quickly that that ends the discussion, because you won't be around to talk with.
The hint thing is real. Don't hint at a man for what you want for your birthday, you won't get it. Just take the pressure off him and discuss things that might be nice gifts. The hint will get you a vacuum cleaner, mixer or négligé that you hate forever
I second not to give hints! Unless you meet a guy who really can take hints ... otherwise, tell them what to do or, as ☝️ mentioned, give him a list of options.
Rock that boat, because you aren't the one rocking the boat: his behavior is.
Best to let management explain to him what inappropriate behavior at work is.
He needs to be set straight.
Needs to.
Ask your manager to keep your complaint anonymous if at all possible. You didn't start this.
You didn't and still don't want this, so let your manager know.
Edited for typos
Exactly: the creepy guy is the one rocking the boat. OP is steadying it. Over and over, he rocks, and she smoothes out the water so it doesn’t make waves.
OP, stop steadying the boat.
Do tell your manger. This should not be happening! I'm in my early 70's and it still happens. And not just o me. I hope things will get better for you and your team mates.
If you’re based in NYC, we need another overnight person 12-8. I don’t play that shit on my shift and neither do our coworkers that are left there. We had a guy who worked at our building and when he finished there he’d work across the street at another hotel. He sexually harassed a guest in our hotel and was fired and then two weeks later was fired at the other hotel for sexually harassing the staff. As a (36M) I make it a point to maintain distance and respect and make sure my female coworkers are comfortable. If you’re not in a relationship with the person, there’s no need for interactions like that. You should absolutely speak up, BUT I will suggest you encourage the others to speak up with you. I say this only because so many bosses won’t do much off of ONE persons complaint. Don’t let this escalate.
Is the shuttle driver in his 80’s? I get people are working longer but usually shuttle drivers are younger, since they don’t get paid well. If he is in his 80’s he would be from a time when what he is saying was ‘ firty’ and acceptable, but those days are long long gone and he needs to understand that it’s not acceptable in the modern workforce! Once you have started to avoid him and feel uncomfortable then HR needed to get involved. Your manager should’ve stepped in a while ago, they can take it as job coaching to better prepare him for working with younger staff and guests. If he makes you uneasy imagine the female guests!
>Is the shuttle driver in his 80’s? I get people are working longer but usually shuttle drivers are younger, since they don’t get paid well.
My grandpa drove a school bus into his 70s, I think(I don't remember exactly how old he was when he retired).
Most old timers I knew who worked were in their 70’s but left before 80 crept in. I’m just surprised as most hotels have younger staff because it’s cheaper. But this is why I think he doesn’t understand what he says is wrong, if you’re in your 80’s what he is saying in his mind seems acceptable, but it’s outdated and not acceptable these days. He needs job coaching from his supervisor as to what is acceptable language in the work place towards staff.
Clearly it's "too much" since you've come to strangers for the support your manager refused to give. As soon as you mentioned it to the manager, action should have been taken. The driver is harassing you, doesn't matter if he's been doing it for 60 years. It wasn't OK then, ain't OK now.
I would think they should not be letting someone that age be responsible for driving people to and from places. They are legally liable if he has an accident. Statistics indicate accident rates increase as we age beyond 65. It's the same at the bottom range of age. The younger the drivers age the higher the accident rate. His accident rate is equivalent to that of a teenager.
And he's doing pretty well at it, given that his predecessor, who's only a few years younger, attempted a fascist coup, is a predator with a history of sexual assault, was a close friend of Jeffrey Epstein, and now is a convicted felon (34 counts).
Yes please report him, and also tell him, “I know you mean these things as compliments and I’ve given you leeway because you come from a different time. I do need to say that these days this kind of conversation comes off as inappropriate. Let’s just keep our remarks to the weather and other common topics. I don’t want you to comment on my appearance. Thanks.”
Here’s the thing. Back in the day, this shit was common as dirt. Men felt free to say the most obnoxious shit to women, I’ve been hearing it since I was about 11! Watch an episode of The Price is Right from the seventies. Bob Barker runs this game up one side and down the other. Richard Dawson on Family Feud kissing all the women.
It’s an age thing. And it needs to stop.
You are definitely NOT the AH!
It seems to have gone way beyond what the manager may have called "too much." I am no HR pro. Still, I think that your pattern of remaining professional in the face of his slime is remarkable. When you tell the manager, begin with the intensely personal stuff like his comments on your body and asking for your father's phone number, etc. No one should ever have to defend themselves from this kind of thing. I see clearly how the first boundaries of "hon" and "doll" were a warning many may easily dismiss or miss entirely. But you're being targeted by this man. Management should protect you!
Either you do make a formal complaint, you try to fight fire with fire, or you let that creep walk all over you. I'll go for the first but I can understand that it can be daunting when you are 20 and lacking the experience.
Fighting fire with firing is returning his questions without answering them. Answer his 'honey' with a cheerful 'Gramp', and try to make the rest of the staff do so. Answer his question about your weight with a look at him and ask the same, with false compassion because "at his age he has to be careful.". Answer his creepy 'boys will attack you' with worry about his age making him a target for robbers and has he a way to defend himself. Sexual comments are to be ignored, change the subject to how tiring that must be to drive so much at his age. This kind of thing.
Just tell him straight up he’s crossing boundaries you don’t care to cross and he’s making you uncomfortable. I never beat around the bush with stuff like this. Be courteous, but be direct, and make sure he understands the message you are giving.
It is easy for us to sometimes say, “Confront the person who is being abusive to you,” but that also shouldn’t be the victim’s responsibility. She shouldn’t have to take the step to make an uncomfortable situation even more uncomfortable. She isn’t the one who created the situation and shouldn’t be the one expected to resolve it.
It would be better to have management deal with it. Old guy probably wouldn’t take her comments seriously anyway.
Introduce him to your "bodybuilder boyfriend" and explain that you're "sure you don't have to worry about creeps he can break in half." Bonus points for mean expression directed towards driver. This will also shake the "I'm just looking out for you" defense...
Yeah, it may work to deter creepy guy. I was wondering if OP could tell him she has a boyfriend.
There was an older creepy guy at a place I used to work. He would make really icky uncomfortable comments to me and he actually left me alone after I told him I have a boyfriend.
we just fired a 60 year old assistant manager from my hotel for that sort of thing. Our guy was bringing up inappropriate subjects to young front desk ladies. OP’s shuttle guy doesn’t sound as bad as ours, but she still needs to go back to her manager and tell manage the to have a talk with him. Right now. good night auditors need to kept happy.
His behavior is going way, WAY beyond what's acceptable. It doesn't matter what his age is. The comment:
>“I want your dad’s phone number, and let me tell you why. I want to tell him to make sure to keep all the boys off you.”
in particular is a real problem. I strongly suggest you talk to your manager about this. Let them know that the behavior needs to stop entirely for you to feel safe enough to continue in your job.
Copy the contents of this post and send it as an email to your manager as well. That shows the seriousness of your concerns.
You’re 100% within your rights to talk with your supervisor and I suggest you do so. Some tactics you can use with J- Interrupt and redirect him when he starts the creepy talk… J, “you are so pretty, I’d-“ You, “J, does the van have enough gas? You should go check, hate for you and our customers to get stranded.” You, “J, I have to concentrate on this so I need you to find somewhere else to be for a while, thank you.” You, “J, i’m not sure what you meant by that, but it’s not a conversation for a work place.”
yeah, that's way inappropriate. yes, take it up with your manager, but I would also start a diary/journal of dates/times/creepy-stuff he's said/done. after you've spoken to your manager, and if creepy-guy doesn't pull his head in, then you contact corporate hr and tell them he is doing these things - scan&email / fax your documentation. this is low level harassment, and while he (probably) won't take it to the 'next level', just the stress you are being put through is creating a hostile environment. now, no doubt he (and possibly hr) will come back and say 'it's just his way' and 'he doesn't mean anything by it' - but that is not the point. *he* may not mean anything, but *you* are feeling harassed and constantly, night after night - so it needs to stop.
I used to have a friend whose father was in his 70s. Every time we went to her parents' house, he wanted a hug. That, on its own, wasn't a problem. The thing I hated was that he always patted my butt when he hugged me. Creeped me out big time. But he was old and feeble so I didn't know what to say or do about it. I mostly tried to be on my way out the door as she started to tell her parents bye. I was in my 30s and didn't know how to handle it without upsetting everyone. But I hated to hug that old man. Some older men are just perverts and they think they can get away with it because of their age. Because a lot of people won't say anything. Don't be afraid to say something to your boss. You shouldn't have to put up with that stuff, especially at work.
This is because we were taught that girls need to "be nice." We were also taught by actions that we have to hug or kiss someone hello or goodbye. Studies are showing these actions by parents, negate the whole say no talk, or the it's our body talk. It is what made most of us vulnerable to SA, whether that was from a family member, a co-worker, or a friend of the family. You need to report this.
I really appreciate your concern, but he is dead now.
The name thing is weird, but yes, remembering names or face blind may be the cause but that stuff about boys... No! Draw a line and stick to it. If you want management to handle it, fine. But otherwise just be rude when it gets to that point. Many men don't get hints. I would go with something like. "My private life is not up for discussion, ever! Got it?" You can then shorten it to "boundaries!". And walk away from him each time. He should get the hint quickly that that ends the discussion, because you won't be around to talk with. The hint thing is real. Don't hint at a man for what you want for your birthday, you won't get it. Just take the pressure off him and discuss things that might be nice gifts. The hint will get you a vacuum cleaner, mixer or négligé that you hate forever
I second not to give hints! Unless you meet a guy who really can take hints ... otherwise, tell them what to do or, as ☝️ mentioned, give him a list of options.
J, why do I need pepper spray? I’m perfectly comfortable with my Glock. J, if you try to talk to my dad, he’ll probably cut you.
I like the way you think
Rock that boat, because you aren't the one rocking the boat: his behavior is. Best to let management explain to him what inappropriate behavior at work is. He needs to be set straight. Needs to. Ask your manager to keep your complaint anonymous if at all possible. You didn't start this. You didn't and still don't want this, so let your manager know. Edited for typos
Exactly: the creepy guy is the one rocking the boat. OP is steadying it. Over and over, he rocks, and she smoothes out the water so it doesn’t make waves. OP, stop steadying the boat.
or ask J if you can test your pepper spay on him. You know to test how it works on creepy people.
Do tell your manger. This should not be happening! I'm in my early 70's and it still happens. And not just o me. I hope things will get better for you and your team mates.
An employee consistently acting in an unprofessional, predatory manner is not something you should deal with directly. This is a management issue.
If you’re based in NYC, we need another overnight person 12-8. I don’t play that shit on my shift and neither do our coworkers that are left there. We had a guy who worked at our building and when he finished there he’d work across the street at another hotel. He sexually harassed a guest in our hotel and was fired and then two weeks later was fired at the other hotel for sexually harassing the staff. As a (36M) I make it a point to maintain distance and respect and make sure my female coworkers are comfortable. If you’re not in a relationship with the person, there’s no need for interactions like that. You should absolutely speak up, BUT I will suggest you encourage the others to speak up with you. I say this only because so many bosses won’t do much off of ONE persons complaint. Don’t let this escalate.
Is the shuttle driver in his 80’s? I get people are working longer but usually shuttle drivers are younger, since they don’t get paid well. If he is in his 80’s he would be from a time when what he is saying was ‘ firty’ and acceptable, but those days are long long gone and he needs to understand that it’s not acceptable in the modern workforce! Once you have started to avoid him and feel uncomfortable then HR needed to get involved. Your manager should’ve stepped in a while ago, they can take it as job coaching to better prepare him for working with younger staff and guests. If he makes you uneasy imagine the female guests!
>Is the shuttle driver in his 80’s? I get people are working longer but usually shuttle drivers are younger, since they don’t get paid well. My grandpa drove a school bus into his 70s, I think(I don't remember exactly how old he was when he retired).
Most old timers I knew who worked were in their 70’s but left before 80 crept in. I’m just surprised as most hotels have younger staff because it’s cheaper. But this is why I think he doesn’t understand what he says is wrong, if you’re in your 80’s what he is saying in his mind seems acceptable, but it’s outdated and not acceptable these days. He needs job coaching from his supervisor as to what is acceptable language in the work place towards staff.
My dad was a part time helicopter mechanic into his late 70s. When he retired for good, they were still bugging him to go full time.
Clearly it's "too much" since you've come to strangers for the support your manager refused to give. As soon as you mentioned it to the manager, action should have been taken. The driver is harassing you, doesn't matter if he's been doing it for 60 years. It wasn't OK then, ain't OK now.
I would think they should not be letting someone that age be responsible for driving people to and from places. They are legally liable if he has an accident. Statistics indicate accident rates increase as we age beyond 65. It's the same at the bottom range of age. The younger the drivers age the higher the accident rate. His accident rate is equivalent to that of a teenager.
They let a guy in his 80's run the country and be responsible for millions of people.
And he's doing pretty well at it, given that his predecessor, who's only a few years younger, attempted a fascist coup, is a predator with a history of sexual assault, was a close friend of Jeffrey Epstein, and now is a convicted felon (34 counts).
Both the cars my mom totalled, she totalled in her 80s. (Plenty of fender benders before then.)
Yes please report him, and also tell him, “I know you mean these things as compliments and I’ve given you leeway because you come from a different time. I do need to say that these days this kind of conversation comes off as inappropriate. Let’s just keep our remarks to the weather and other common topics. I don’t want you to comment on my appearance. Thanks.” Here’s the thing. Back in the day, this shit was common as dirt. Men felt free to say the most obnoxious shit to women, I’ve been hearing it since I was about 11! Watch an episode of The Price is Right from the seventies. Bob Barker runs this game up one side and down the other. Richard Dawson on Family Feud kissing all the women. It’s an age thing. And it needs to stop.
You are definitely NOT the AH! It seems to have gone way beyond what the manager may have called "too much." I am no HR pro. Still, I think that your pattern of remaining professional in the face of his slime is remarkable. When you tell the manager, begin with the intensely personal stuff like his comments on your body and asking for your father's phone number, etc. No one should ever have to defend themselves from this kind of thing. I see clearly how the first boundaries of "hon" and "doll" were a warning many may easily dismiss or miss entirely. But you're being targeted by this man. Management should protect you!
Either you do make a formal complaint, you try to fight fire with fire, or you let that creep walk all over you. I'll go for the first but I can understand that it can be daunting when you are 20 and lacking the experience. Fighting fire with firing is returning his questions without answering them. Answer his 'honey' with a cheerful 'Gramp', and try to make the rest of the staff do so. Answer his question about your weight with a look at him and ask the same, with false compassion because "at his age he has to be careful.". Answer his creepy 'boys will attack you' with worry about his age making him a target for robbers and has he a way to defend himself. Sexual comments are to be ignored, change the subject to how tiring that must be to drive so much at his age. This kind of thing.
Document every interaction.
Just tell him straight up he’s crossing boundaries you don’t care to cross and he’s making you uncomfortable. I never beat around the bush with stuff like this. Be courteous, but be direct, and make sure he understands the message you are giving.
Tell him to fuck off, tactfully. Lol!
It is easy for us to sometimes say, “Confront the person who is being abusive to you,” but that also shouldn’t be the victim’s responsibility. She shouldn’t have to take the step to make an uncomfortable situation even more uncomfortable. She isn’t the one who created the situation and shouldn’t be the one expected to resolve it. It would be better to have management deal with it. Old guy probably wouldn’t take her comments seriously anyway.
She's also the one who will continue to have work with him by herself.
Fuck off, please and thank you :) No need to be rude after all
I love this and laughed so hard.
Introduce him to your "bodybuilder boyfriend" and explain that you're "sure you don't have to worry about creeps he can break in half." Bonus points for mean expression directed towards driver. This will also shake the "I'm just looking out for you" defense...
Yeah, it may work to deter creepy guy. I was wondering if OP could tell him she has a boyfriend. There was an older creepy guy at a place I used to work. He would make really icky uncomfortable comments to me and he actually left me alone after I told him I have a boyfriend.
NTA Talk with your manager &/or HR
we just fired a 60 year old assistant manager from my hotel for that sort of thing. Our guy was bringing up inappropriate subjects to young front desk ladies. OP’s shuttle guy doesn’t sound as bad as ours, but she still needs to go back to her manager and tell manage the to have a talk with him. Right now. good night auditors need to kept happy.
His behavior is going way, WAY beyond what's acceptable. It doesn't matter what his age is. The comment: >“I want your dad’s phone number, and let me tell you why. I want to tell him to make sure to keep all the boys off you.” in particular is a real problem. I strongly suggest you talk to your manager about this. Let them know that the behavior needs to stop entirely for you to feel safe enough to continue in your job. Copy the contents of this post and send it as an email to your manager as well. That shows the seriousness of your concerns.