At the start of a track, your speed is obviously lowest. There's not a lot of interesting stuff you can do in a start except for turns. Making the turn more difficult will make good players stand out.
Hot take: I don't need the start to be interesting. Just let me drive straight for a second. At the very least it should generally be hard to make a run ending mistake in the first second of a map, at least for totd.
While I do like it to be interesting, I would like to have some more space than in today's TOTD. More than a second straight feels like you have to wait a lot - the start of the map is the part you play the most.
Perhaps, but an instant 90 degree right (and it's almost always right it seems) just doesn't feel right. It's on all sorts of maps, including full speed. On a tech track it might make sense thematically, but others not so much.
I map a lot. Generally I do a weird start to either force you into a certain speed or do something you can only do at low speed.
If I just give you a straight line you may have way more speed than I want going into a section.
as mentioned by others it's to make the process of gaining initial speed not be just holding accelerate. The concept is sound but it's not always executed well and some mappers take it too far imo
if you want an example of a map that doesn't have a start like that but really should play 'Summer 2023 - 15' for a while
Doubt many maps, if at all, do that. But who knows I don't play actively anymore so maybe the quality of maps has dipped.
Naturally though, starts will repeat amongst thousands of maps. The point I was trying to make, at least to me, I don't care how the start is built, as long as it's just not 5 seconds pf.
I will gladly take a dirt 180 I have to somehow manage to noslide and shift up on kB over any kind of pf. I would hope that's a shared opinion amongst the majority.
yeah. Honestly I thought this post would get hate but people seem to agree somewhat. TOTDS are hard for new players as they should be. However, It's hard to correct an instant steer versus one you can set up, at least on controller imo. Ultimately the turn is at the beginning so it's no dd2
It's also kind of a thing to satisfy veterans. I'd be crying and end TM (lol I did 2 yrs ago) if starts had less variety than they do. Imagine it's only of, slight left/right tap or full right/left after like 1.8secs.
I suppose it's just a separation of skill level in the end. I got like 100 hours but I detest a start turn that makes or breaks a run, especially when I take ample opportunity fucking up the rest of the map. So I wouldn't mind a pf start lmao
Amongst other design advantages, it's a way to spread out the field in rounds mode. This makes for more interesting mid-race comebacks. Sort of the reverse equivalent of a risky finish - you risk touching a wall at the start and gain a few tenths? or do you go safe?
People compare it to a risky fin, and I agree: It's a gimmick, that has some positives, but can be overdone and easily done poorly. When that's the case it makes for a worse player experience, specifically for beginners.
The previous two TOTD have had tight starts that I know I would have hated a while back, and am still slightly annoyed at. You know going into COTD that those starts has the highest likelihood of being what knocks you out. Case in point: Today's TOTD has a tiny ledge you can drive over. It took me down to gear 3 before hitting the dirt cone. That one mistake in timing within the first few seconds of the map cost me 3 seconds by the end, because of how crucial that gear is in the start.
As a counter to the idea that the start is otherwise boring: Having a clean start makes for a better experience IMO. Not talking straight road, but plenty margin for adjustment. Certain maps can take several attempts just to get past the start during time attack when they're based on a precision/timing turn. Which doesn't feel great at all losing time to. Secondly, during rounds, having a natural flow from downtime between rounds into the map makes for a much nicer experience. Every map having it's own little mini obstacle course in the start isn't good mapping, just like every risky fin isn't good mapping. And when overdone it gets obnoxious quick. COTD should have margin for error and adjustments that punish but don't outright kill a run.
I'm at a point where I much prefer the challenge be in the map, and not tacked unto the start or finish. Kudos to mappers leaving out the risky fin. It's overdone.
Yeah my experience as a newer player is that more than half of maps have a start sequence that is the most difficult precise part of the track. Restarting constantly to get a good start isn't fun, and I'm not able to be nearly consistent enough to play knockout rounds.
You could certainly say I'm not the audience for COTD if I'm that easily skillchecked but I play every TOTD and the ones that don't go overboard on the weird ass starting line are reliably more fun IMHO.
Today's TOTD is a really good example of how a smooth start isn't bad mapping. Aries maps aren't in everyone's taste. It's just a straight acceleration, but with the added twist of getting good gear-ups. If the gear-ups go badly, you're not instantly losing the round, and if they go well, you just gained some time, without the start being press-forward and wait.
I pretty much play only COTD and almost nothing else, so my entire journey in TM is going from playing div 30-45 to getting div 10-25 over the past 1½ year. While those precise starts have gotten easier, they still take a bit to learn and it's not uncommon I have to restart 10 times to get a run going. It really is my biggest grip with it, if they're too punishing right at the start of the map.
I'm really getting annoyed that pretty much every single totd map has a similar start, it's like it's mandatory if you build a map nowadays. Some better made than others...I find them annoying half the time
That's why I quickly stopped playing TOTDs if you suck as much at this game as I did prior to quitting. Having at least half your attempts fail in the first two seconds is not fun.
I was thinking this exact thing and think I g about asking this very question recently. It seems like every track has either a sharp left or right at start and often this is accompanied by the need to quite a precise line.
I guess it’s the same disease that causes every track to be 40-50 seconds long with a risky finish. People have lost the ability to be original and just copy the same tired formula
At the start of a track, your speed is obviously lowest. There's not a lot of interesting stuff you can do in a start except for turns. Making the turn more difficult will make good players stand out.
And also, mistake at these speeds will compound a lot more.
Hot take: I don't need the start to be interesting. Just let me drive straight for a second. At the very least it should generally be hard to make a run ending mistake in the first second of a map, at least for totd.
While I do like it to be interesting, I would like to have some more space than in today's TOTD. More than a second straight feels like you have to wait a lot - the start of the map is the part you play the most.
study show that what stays in mind are the fisrt and ladt impressions, so an interesting start goes a long way to get a map selected imo
Perhaps, but an instant 90 degree right (and it's almost always right it seems) just doesn't feel right. It's on all sorts of maps, including full speed. On a tech track it might make sense thematically, but others not so much.
Heh, "right just doesn't feel right", nice one.
Are they even still "interesting" at this point? It feels like every other totd has the same 180° turn at the start
I map a lot. Generally I do a weird start to either force you into a certain speed or do something you can only do at low speed. If I just give you a straight line you may have way more speed than I want going into a section.
as mentioned by others it's to make the process of gaining initial speed not be just holding accelerate. The concept is sound but it's not always executed well and some mappers take it too far imo if you want an example of a map that doesn't have a start like that but really should play 'Summer 2023 - 15' for a while
Just from context I know exactly which map this is and yeah it was horrible.
its so that its not boring
And yet... so many tracks have a similar gimmick at the start, to the extent that it has become cliche and in itself boring!
So you'd rather pf for 5 seconds before making the first input
No? There are loads of ways of starting a map without a precise and very tight sequence of corners that have little room for error.
Doubt many maps, if at all, do that. But who knows I don't play actively anymore so maybe the quality of maps has dipped. Naturally though, starts will repeat amongst thousands of maps. The point I was trying to make, at least to me, I don't care how the start is built, as long as it's just not 5 seconds pf. I will gladly take a dirt 180 I have to somehow manage to noslide and shift up on kB over any kind of pf. I would hope that's a shared opinion amongst the majority.
Good thing we agree on PF starts then. I'm not sure anyone disagrees with you.
todays totd did it well imo. It's a hard turn that has a lower margin of error, but you get a couple seconds to line it up so it's easier to learn.
It wouldn't have been the end of the world if the turn was without setup. Would've required tapping or smooth steer of some sort.
yeah. Honestly I thought this post would get hate but people seem to agree somewhat. TOTDS are hard for new players as they should be. However, It's hard to correct an instant steer versus one you can set up, at least on controller imo. Ultimately the turn is at the beginning so it's no dd2
It's also kind of a thing to satisfy veterans. I'd be crying and end TM (lol I did 2 yrs ago) if starts had less variety than they do. Imagine it's only of, slight left/right tap or full right/left after like 1.8secs.
I suppose it's just a separation of skill level in the end. I got like 100 hours but I detest a start turn that makes or breaks a run, especially when I take ample opportunity fucking up the rest of the map. So I wouldn't mind a pf start lmao
it’s the start equivalent of a risky fin
Two stars now hmmm?
I've noticed that as well. They all have weird starts. It's getting annoying.
Amongst other design advantages, it's a way to spread out the field in rounds mode. This makes for more interesting mid-race comebacks. Sort of the reverse equivalent of a risky finish - you risk touching a wall at the start and gain a few tenths? or do you go safe?
People compare it to a risky fin, and I agree: It's a gimmick, that has some positives, but can be overdone and easily done poorly. When that's the case it makes for a worse player experience, specifically for beginners. The previous two TOTD have had tight starts that I know I would have hated a while back, and am still slightly annoyed at. You know going into COTD that those starts has the highest likelihood of being what knocks you out. Case in point: Today's TOTD has a tiny ledge you can drive over. It took me down to gear 3 before hitting the dirt cone. That one mistake in timing within the first few seconds of the map cost me 3 seconds by the end, because of how crucial that gear is in the start. As a counter to the idea that the start is otherwise boring: Having a clean start makes for a better experience IMO. Not talking straight road, but plenty margin for adjustment. Certain maps can take several attempts just to get past the start during time attack when they're based on a precision/timing turn. Which doesn't feel great at all losing time to. Secondly, during rounds, having a natural flow from downtime between rounds into the map makes for a much nicer experience. Every map having it's own little mini obstacle course in the start isn't good mapping, just like every risky fin isn't good mapping. And when overdone it gets obnoxious quick. COTD should have margin for error and adjustments that punish but don't outright kill a run. I'm at a point where I much prefer the challenge be in the map, and not tacked unto the start or finish. Kudos to mappers leaving out the risky fin. It's overdone.
Yeah my experience as a newer player is that more than half of maps have a start sequence that is the most difficult precise part of the track. Restarting constantly to get a good start isn't fun, and I'm not able to be nearly consistent enough to play knockout rounds. You could certainly say I'm not the audience for COTD if I'm that easily skillchecked but I play every TOTD and the ones that don't go overboard on the weird ass starting line are reliably more fun IMHO.
Today's TOTD is a really good example of how a smooth start isn't bad mapping. Aries maps aren't in everyone's taste. It's just a straight acceleration, but with the added twist of getting good gear-ups. If the gear-ups go badly, you're not instantly losing the round, and if they go well, you just gained some time, without the start being press-forward and wait. I pretty much play only COTD and almost nothing else, so my entire journey in TM is going from playing div 30-45 to getting div 10-25 over the past 1½ year. While those precise starts have gotten easier, they still take a bit to learn and it's not uncommon I have to restart 10 times to get a run going. It really is my biggest grip with it, if they're too punishing right at the start of the map.
I'm really getting annoyed that pretty much every single totd map has a similar start, it's like it's mandatory if you build a map nowadays. Some better made than others...I find them annoying half the time
That's why I quickly stopped playing TOTDs if you suck as much at this game as I did prior to quitting. Having at least half your attempts fail in the first two seconds is not fun.
I was thinking this exact thing and think I g about asking this very question recently. It seems like every track has either a sharp left or right at start and often this is accompanied by the need to quite a precise line. I guess it’s the same disease that causes every track to be 40-50 seconds long with a risky finish. People have lost the ability to be original and just copy the same tired formula
PF starts are boring
probably a jumpscare tactic to make the player think the map is more interesting/difficult
They should make a TOTD where you start backwards
27th May 2022 was a pretty cool backwards map
That’s absolutely wild to me
Community made maps have had this tendency since tmnf. Just something you gotta get down and sooner than later these turns will feel natural to you.