I think you are mistaken. It's not about whether Sicilia is a bad ship, it's about what way it is better than the Colombo. Why would you spend hard earned Research Bureau points for a sidegrade (arguably worse) Colombo? The SAP on Colombo is strong, why would you want to trade it for some of the worst BB HE at tier X?
I haven't picked up Sicilia for the reasons you mentioned, but there is the typical benefit of premium/special ships versus tech tree: unlike Colombo, you can freely move commanders on and off Sicilia.
E.g., I play Hayate far more than Shimakaze because I have Yamamoto on Bungo. I can see someone wanting to do the same if they have Sansonetti trained for Piemonte / Venezia / Regolo.
Whether that's worth it for RB points is just a matter of personal preference.
Sure, but it’s 60k research points. Maybe for gold or coal it’s nice to have, but if I’m burning 60k research points (which costs a lot of credits and/or free xp), then it’s gotta be unique, not just a sidegrade.
Unique in what? If he didn't want to grind Italian bbs, he doesn't have a side grade.
Time is a resource. Do you want to grind ships or play at the level you want when you get the two hours on the weekend to play?
Could be he passively grinds RB which is what I do.
I reset the haragumo line everytime there is a new 2x reset available.
I put all my free exp into going through the tech tree before the next 2x.
Once the next 2x is here I reset the line again and once again use all accumulated free exp to move through the tech tree.
Once there is something I want in RB then I will buy the actual ships and half grind half free exp to gather the RB points.
Since the 2x (and 1x if you wanted) stack you only need to actually grind out the line once to get enough RB for a ship assuming you are patient and play often enough with eco bonuses that you free exp accumulates decently fast. If you are actively grinding a new line your free exp may not accumulate as fast if you are using it for new lines so it can take longer for some people.
Other than the name(and that is subjective), nothing on Sicilia is better or actually, gameplay-wise different than her TT counterpart Colombo. Get the Colombo. You will be sad you wasted resources on Sicilia.
Sicilia might not be godly, but that’s also complete horseshit. She gets significantly improved reload (33s vs CC's 37s) and smoke (+1 charge and 15s longer duration) over Colombo
* That reload buff also gives her 39k more AP dpm, which actually gives her the best AP dpm of all tier X BBs
* She also gets some AA buffs due to her new American dual purpose secondaries
Not to mention, CCs secondaries do *literally nothing*. Sicilias dealing damage *AT ALL* is by default much better, even if the lack of accuracy means you shouldn't build into them.
* This also makes Sicilia far better against DDs, because CCs secondaries are shit and her SAP has a *VERY* low damage cap on DDs. Getting usable secondaries and main battery HE shells makes Sicilia far more able to counter them.
Those aren't negligible differences.
Thank you for submitting to r/WorldOfWarships!
Unfortunately your submission has been removed because it is in violation of Rule 5.
> "Posts and comments that are deemed overly toxic towards users, players, members of Wargaming staff, ethnic, or national groups will be removed and the poster may be banned without warning. This includes bringing any sort of political, religious or social issues and debates to this subreddit."
If you have a question or concern regarding the removal of your submission please message the mod team. Do not reply to this comment as they are not always read.
Thanks for understanding and have a good day!
Thank you for submitting to r/WorldOfWarships!
Unfortunately your submission has been removed because it is in violation of Rule 5.
> "Posts and comments that are deemed overly toxic towards users, players, members of Wargaming staff, ethnic, or national groups will be removed and the poster may be banned without warning. This includes bringing any sort of political, religious or social issues and debates to this subreddit."
If you have a question or concern regarding the removal of your submission please message the mod team. Do not reply to this comment as they are not always read.
Thanks for understanding and have a good day!
But that’s exactly the point, the ship was labeled as a monster with a nasty SAP and smoke combo. But we have seen that without the improved accuracy, they’re mediocre at best.
Ironically, for a ship intended to get closer it has a lot designed for the opposite. Mainly the infamous back turret "bug", poor secondary angles, discount turtleback.
There’s a reason why Napoli is the best Italian battleship in the game
I think not allowing every BB to have at least a half-decent secondary build has hurt the game. Secs are fun and are rarely optimal even on ships designed to be secondary ships.
Sicilia is plagued by the massive mistake WG did when adding BB caliber SAP guns.
Why play Sicilia when Colombo despite having slightly worse reload and smoke has the better ammo?
And the answer is that it is boring, SAP caliber BB guns add absolutely nothing interesting to the game.
When first introduced those BBs were seen as weak, more after the removal of DeadEye, they seem to give up **everything** for SAP on BB guns (as smoke on a BB is at best situational)
Now after some tweaks I decided to play them again and found them so boring, especially Colombo, you don't need to switch ammo even with the improved EL. BB caliber SAP is just too good but at the same time so unbalanced, you just aim at the general direction of an enemy and you get 20k salvos, sure you can switch for AP but considering the type of guns and shells italian BBs fire, you are limited to broadside BBs at close ranges.
So... why bother with Sicilia? After the buffs Colombo even firing only SAP is stronger.
Personally I love playing ships like Sicilia, Hayate, Delny for the challenge, you give up mostly damage output but gain slightly more tools to reposition or assist yourself.
Sicilia **forces** you to play AP only Colombo and it's great, it's fun, I love playing a BB in which I have to mind my positioning to get broadsides, to switch ammo and force the enemy into playing a different position or retreat, I love having dynamic gameplay. Colombo gameplay is mostly shot SAP at the highest HP enemy from mid-low range and move on.
Is Colombo better? Damagewise, performance wise? Very much. Is it fun? For me? No, I find SAP caliber so unfun, especially with Colombo long reload, every Sicilia game feels so much fun.
I feel the same but want to add that range of secondaries matters. Close range they kill DD and cruisers faster than a Schlieffen or Agincourt.
Had a game where I went undetected and surprised a 17k hp Shima coming around an island about 5km out. The secondaries killed it faster than I could turn my guns. I think the fight was over in 7 seconds. The SAP at close range is scary.
thanks for sharing this. unsure what to get for my next rb ship, and have been seriously considering sicilia (i'm biased by my desire to put aurora di natale or whoever she is in a fun ship).
I agree I sat on it for a while despite having plenty of rb points, I tried it first full secondary and was having just ok results, I switched to hybrid and it is doing great, may try full gun build at some point.
>Putting Kremlin on the same level as Ohio and Bourgogne
Hard disagree there.
Everything else you've written is basically saying "this ship's unique gimmicks are useless". Then the question is, why would you spend x6 worth of line resets on a Colombo sidegrade (and that's being generous)
I haven't had a whole lot of battles in TierX, but it seems that most matches have 2-4 radar ships.
Smoke seems pretty useless when they can click a button and see you immediately.
I'll disagree with you there. You need to be aware of a radar threat and play around it. No radar covers the entire map, so stay out of range or time an activation and move closer when you know the radar is on cooldown.
A BB with smoke is an entirely different beast still. The only BB smoke in the game is the italian fuel smoke, which you either use offensively, to push in under cover, or defensively, to cover your retreat.
If you are pushing into a radar and get lit, you have much more time to decide what to do and act on that than say, a DD. If you can't turn around without getting slapped, you probably would have died anyway.
If you get radared while in kite, it's most likly not looking too bad. And if it is, again, the smoke most likely wouldn't have saved you.
I think you are mistaken. It's not about whether Sicilia is a bad ship, it's about what way it is better than the Colombo. Why would you spend hard earned Research Bureau points for a sidegrade (arguably worse) Colombo? The SAP on Colombo is strong, why would you want to trade it for some of the worst BB HE at tier X?
I haven't picked up Sicilia for the reasons you mentioned, but there is the typical benefit of premium/special ships versus tech tree: unlike Colombo, you can freely move commanders on and off Sicilia. E.g., I play Hayate far more than Shimakaze because I have Yamamoto on Bungo. I can see someone wanting to do the same if they have Sansonetti trained for Piemonte / Venezia / Regolo. Whether that's worth it for RB points is just a matter of personal preference.
Sure, but it’s 60k research points. Maybe for gold or coal it’s nice to have, but if I’m burning 60k research points (which costs a lot of credits and/or free xp), then it’s gotta be unique, not just a sidegrade.
Unique in what? If he didn't want to grind Italian bbs, he doesn't have a side grade. Time is a resource. Do you want to grind ships or play at the level you want when you get the two hours on the weekend to play?
If time is expensive why would you want to spend 60k RB points which equal to 5 times regrinding the whole italian BBs line?
Could be he passively grinds RB which is what I do. I reset the haragumo line everytime there is a new 2x reset available. I put all my free exp into going through the tech tree before the next 2x. Once the next 2x is here I reset the line again and once again use all accumulated free exp to move through the tech tree. Once there is something I want in RB then I will buy the actual ships and half grind half free exp to gather the RB points. Since the 2x (and 1x if you wanted) stack you only need to actually grind out the line once to get enough RB for a ship assuming you are patient and play often enough with eco bonuses that you free exp accumulates decently fast. If you are actively grinding a new line your free exp may not accumulate as fast if you are using it for new lines so it can take longer for some people.
The critical question is "Does it worth 60k RB?" NO
That's the same as saying Colombo is the one to take.
Other than the name(and that is subjective), nothing on Sicilia is better or actually, gameplay-wise different than her TT counterpart Colombo. Get the Colombo. You will be sad you wasted resources on Sicilia.
Sicilia might not be godly, but that’s also complete horseshit. She gets significantly improved reload (33s vs CC's 37s) and smoke (+1 charge and 15s longer duration) over Colombo * That reload buff also gives her 39k more AP dpm, which actually gives her the best AP dpm of all tier X BBs * She also gets some AA buffs due to her new American dual purpose secondaries Not to mention, CCs secondaries do *literally nothing*. Sicilias dealing damage *AT ALL* is by default much better, even if the lack of accuracy means you shouldn't build into them. * This also makes Sicilia far better against DDs, because CCs secondaries are shit and her SAP has a *VERY* low damage cap on DDs. Getting usable secondaries and main battery HE shells makes Sicilia far more able to counter them. Those aren't negligible differences.
Which is literally no reason to invest research bureau points on. Same ship with a little better reload and without SAP main guns.
[удалено]
Thank you for submitting to r/WorldOfWarships! Unfortunately your submission has been removed because it is in violation of Rule 5. > "Posts and comments that are deemed overly toxic towards users, players, members of Wargaming staff, ethnic, or national groups will be removed and the poster may be banned without warning. This includes bringing any sort of political, religious or social issues and debates to this subreddit." If you have a question or concern regarding the removal of your submission please message the mod team. Do not reply to this comment as they are not always read. Thanks for understanding and have a good day!
You can live your way. Right now, idc about you or your opinion. Please refrain from replying to my comments. Thanks.
[удалено]
Thank you for submitting to r/WorldOfWarships! Unfortunately your submission has been removed because it is in violation of Rule 5. > "Posts and comments that are deemed overly toxic towards users, players, members of Wargaming staff, ethnic, or national groups will be removed and the poster may be banned without warning. This includes bringing any sort of political, religious or social issues and debates to this subreddit." If you have a question or concern regarding the removal of your submission please message the mod team. Do not reply to this comment as they are not always read. Thanks for understanding and have a good day!
But that’s exactly the point, the ship was labeled as a monster with a nasty SAP and smoke combo. But we have seen that without the improved accuracy, they’re mediocre at best. Ironically, for a ship intended to get closer it has a lot designed for the opposite. Mainly the infamous back turret "bug", poor secondary angles, discount turtleback. There’s a reason why Napoli is the best Italian battleship in the game
I think not allowing every BB to have at least a half-decent secondary build has hurt the game. Secs are fun and are rarely optimal even on ships designed to be secondary ships.
Yeah that's quite sad indeed. I hope we get such a ship one day. Sicilia certainly isn't that.
Sicilia is plagued by the massive mistake WG did when adding BB caliber SAP guns. Why play Sicilia when Colombo despite having slightly worse reload and smoke has the better ammo? And the answer is that it is boring, SAP caliber BB guns add absolutely nothing interesting to the game. When first introduced those BBs were seen as weak, more after the removal of DeadEye, they seem to give up **everything** for SAP on BB guns (as smoke on a BB is at best situational) Now after some tweaks I decided to play them again and found them so boring, especially Colombo, you don't need to switch ammo even with the improved EL. BB caliber SAP is just too good but at the same time so unbalanced, you just aim at the general direction of an enemy and you get 20k salvos, sure you can switch for AP but considering the type of guns and shells italian BBs fire, you are limited to broadside BBs at close ranges. So... why bother with Sicilia? After the buffs Colombo even firing only SAP is stronger. Personally I love playing ships like Sicilia, Hayate, Delny for the challenge, you give up mostly damage output but gain slightly more tools to reposition or assist yourself. Sicilia **forces** you to play AP only Colombo and it's great, it's fun, I love playing a BB in which I have to mind my positioning to get broadsides, to switch ammo and force the enemy into playing a different position or retreat, I love having dynamic gameplay. Colombo gameplay is mostly shot SAP at the highest HP enemy from mid-low range and move on. Is Colombo better? Damagewise, performance wise? Very much. Is it fun? For me? No, I find SAP caliber so unfun, especially with Colombo long reload, every Sicilia game feels so much fun.
I feel the same but want to add that range of secondaries matters. Close range they kill DD and cruisers faster than a Schlieffen or Agincourt. Had a game where I went undetected and surprised a 17k hp Shima coming around an island about 5km out. The secondaries killed it faster than I could turn my guns. I think the fight was over in 7 seconds. The SAP at close range is scary.
thanks for sharing this. unsure what to get for my next rb ship, and have been seriously considering sicilia (i'm biased by my desire to put aurora di natale or whoever she is in a fun ship).
I agree I sat on it for a while despite having plenty of rb points, I tried it first full secondary and was having just ok results, I switched to hybrid and it is doing great, may try full gun build at some point.
Sicilia is extremely bad once you realise it trades SAP for a better smoke, a smoke that isnt even better because it's only useful to run away with.
>Putting Kremlin on the same level as Ohio and Bourgogne Hard disagree there. Everything else you've written is basically saying "this ship's unique gimmicks are useless". Then the question is, why would you spend x6 worth of line resets on a Colombo sidegrade (and that's being generous)
I haven't had a whole lot of battles in TierX, but it seems that most matches have 2-4 radar ships. Smoke seems pretty useless when they can click a button and see you immediately.
I'll disagree with you there. You need to be aware of a radar threat and play around it. No radar covers the entire map, so stay out of range or time an activation and move closer when you know the radar is on cooldown. A BB with smoke is an entirely different beast still. The only BB smoke in the game is the italian fuel smoke, which you either use offensively, to push in under cover, or defensively, to cover your retreat. If you are pushing into a radar and get lit, you have much more time to decide what to do and act on that than say, a DD. If you can't turn around without getting slapped, you probably would have died anyway. If you get radared while in kite, it's most likly not looking too bad. And if it is, again, the smoke most likely wouldn't have saved you.