That is something all levels of government regardless of political affiliation has been guilty of for at least 40 years.
The lobbying system has been very successful at limiting corporate responsibility for all environmental issues. Mercury in Dryden ON, PCB contaminated SaskPower sites in Saskatchewan, Selenium contaminated rivers near coal mines and expanding irrigation in Saskatchewan during a drought. These are examples of corporate needs surpassing the public good.
Considering that the UCP created a bill to evict federal environmental assessors and that the Supreme Court upheld any provinces jurisdiction to do so does not show how "all levels of government" are responsible, imo.
The feds have been shut out by conservative run provinces for the last 5 years.
We have an anti environmentalist as a premier. The lobbying wasn't just successful. It shattered any hope to repair the situation.
I do not see this as a "both sides " issue since only one side has silenced scientific researchers, decimated environmental assessment and safety, and has interfered with the market to benefit only fossil fuels corporations.
The Libs are not innocent of willful neglect. However, they're not actively working to shut down the entire green alternative completely.
None of the City of Calgary courses use potable water, but other courses do rely on different water sources, including treated city water, to irrigate their playing surfaces.
Golf courses in Calgary do seem to be proactive thus far. However, I’ve had smoke blown up my ass before…. Lol
https://calgary.ctvnews.ca/calgary-golf-courses-prepare-for-potential-water-restrictions-ahead-of-2024-season-1.6841782#:~:text=None%20of%20the%20City%20of,Wednesday%2C%20April%2010%2C%202024.
The golf course I worked as a teenager had their own well, which pumped water into a dugout. This is pretty rural Alberta, not sure how bigger city courses manage.
For those unfamiliar: grey water is water that is untreated, but not full of contaminates. Like rain or raw river water. It's not safe for human consumption, but it's fine for watering grass and plants.
Kinda like how you can use water colleced in rain barrels to water your lawn, but it's probably not a great idea to drink that water.
Grey water is “used” water that comes from any source except raw sewage (like toilets or urinals). It can come from washing machines, showers, sinks and dishwashers, etc.
It can then be used as a source of water for any application except drinking (watering lawns, irrigation, toilets, etc).
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Slight tangent, I would very much be in favor of banning golf courses outright, at least inside city limits. Have them all converted to public parks, I feel like there's so many benefits to be had
I'm genuinely surprised that you're getting downvoted.
Yes, grey water is not treated water, yet it is a source that can be used for higher priorities such as human consumption once we do treat it.
Golf courses are such needless luxuries, especially when you consider what is happening with our climate.
We're going to have to learn to live much leaner, and we're not going to be given an option.
They are already trotting out the talking points that oil and gas industry usage is small in comparison to Alberta households combined. I don’t expect they will manage this crisis well at all.
They use the word, industry will use the minimum they need to operate, all without telling us how much they use. Another play on words that many UCP supports will buy.
[https://www.aer.ca/protecting-what-matters/holding-industry-accountable/industry-performance/water-use-performance/oil-sands-mining-water-use](https://www.aer.ca/protecting-what-matters/holding-industry-accountable/industry-performance/water-use-performance/oil-sands-mining-water-use)
The data for water use is can be found in on the left under "Data".
Industry has to tell the regulator how much they use, and it's public data
I agree.
Sad, isn’t it? I always thought the job of politicians was to do the job they were elected to do and not look after the interests of themselves and donors first.
A helpful watch is CGP Grey's Rules for Rulers on YouTube.
Politicians are people, and people are self-interested. It's our job as citizens to make damn sure that politicians' self interest lines up with ours, and they would rather it didn't since it's harder to please the masses than a smaller number of business interests.
The average citizen has little individual power, and we have slept on that job for so long that it's very difficult now to push back. We don't have high-paying no-show jobs to dish out to our champions, and most of us don't have the time or money to buy rubber chicken at $1,000 / plate. So we need to use organizations that consolidate the power to act as our bullhorns. But political parties are snarled up in procedure and unions are reviled and neutered.
I hate to say it, but Take Back Alberta seems to have an effective model right now; and progressives should co-opt it.
I agree with everything you've written , 100%.
I've been trying to get family and friends to take notice of what's happening, and you know what 90% of the response has been?
"Oh well. Nothing we can do about it..."
I've stopped talking with these people.
They're so self absorbed and lazy, I just couldn't associate with them anymore.
I always thought the same. Sadly, it was a smokescreen we all wanted to believe because we grew up with fairytales and Disney.
The good guy is losing right now.
The average Albertan uses around 130 litres per day.
Even if every Albertan completely HALVES their water use entirely, it would be just over 100billion litres saved in a year.
So that would still be only HALF of what oil and gas uses and I bet they won’t be making any efforts to reduce their usage nor will they have restrictions placed on them.
Thank you for this! I seriously doubt Albertans could reduce their water consumption by half so why is this being put on the shoulders of Albertans when industry should be sharing the pain? I know, we don’t have leverage over politicians!
Important to remember that there are consumptive and non-consumptive water uses. Households are mostly non-consumptive users. The water you use to shower gets treated and goes right back into the river, you're really only borrowing it for a while. This is why they focus on things like lawn watering, that's one of the few consumptive water uses for most of us.
Industries can go either way, some, like irrigation, permanently consume water while others just use it, then treat and release.
This brings up a problem with the supposed innocence of golf courses using gray water. It's still consuming water that would have otherwise been fully treated and put back in the river.
The oil site i work at has a permit for so many thousands of gallons, i dont remember the number, but when the pipe from the river to site sprung a leak, they stopped pulling water from the river once they reached their permitted limit, and borrowed from another sites reserves. So while the oil companies suck they do follow the rules in place.
I don't envision Marlaina placing restrictions on them though.
I do believe they follow the rules, it's just that the rules need to change, currently the cost to these companies does not reflect the cost thier water usage has on survivability of agriculture and the surrounding environments that are needed to support resilient food systems.
The vast majority of non saline water use by O&G comes from NE Alberta. Unless we install massive pipelines hundreds of km from Lake Athabasca their extraction is not having an effect on agriculture and environments in the areas we are currently seeing drought.
Ironically O&G extraction seems to be the scapegoat to distract from the real issue: Agriculture, which uses the bulk of fresh water in the province to try and farm in a semi arid environment.
Agriculture, which is primarily in south and central Alberta, where the majority of drought issues are.
Unless you're using low flow efficient toilets they're probably using 4-6 litres a flush. If you drink a healthy amount of water you might be flushing say like 8-10 times a day, that's already like 50 litres on the toilet alone.
Here's some info on it.
[https://albertawater.com/alberta-water-blog/household-water-use-in-alberta/](https://albertawater.com/alberta-water-blog/household-water-use-in-alberta/)
[https://www.calgary.ca/environment/climate/water-consumption-in-calgary.html](https://www.calgary.ca/environment/climate/water-consumption-in-calgary.html)
Using is different from simply letting it evaporate, oil and gas production (and households) recycle water. We should have numbers reflecting how much of that water goes into an unusable state, there's a difference to just running your tap down the drain and running your sprinklers in 30 degree heat at 3 pm
Here's the report the OP is referring to:
[https://www.aer.ca/protecting-what-matters/holding-industry-accountable/industry-performance/water-use-performance](https://www.aer.ca/protecting-what-matters/holding-industry-accountable/industry-performance/water-use-performance)
"In 2022, 17% of the water used by the oil and gas industry was nonsaline, 1% was alternative make-up water, and 82% was recycled water."
The vast majority of the non saline water used is from Oil Sands, which is extracted from NE Alberta.
[https://www.aer.ca/protecting-what-matters/holding-industry-accountable/industry-performance/water-use-performance/oil-sands-mining-water-use](https://www.aer.ca/protecting-what-matters/holding-industry-accountable/industry-performance/water-use-performance/oil-sands-mining-water-use)
Basically, unless the government installs massive water pipelines from Lake Athabasca to south and central Alberta, water usage by O&G is broadly irrelevant to the drought currently affecting southern and central Alberta.
I'm not a fan of Oil Sands, but lets at least try and have an honest argument. Oil and gas uses far less non saline water than municipalities in Alberta, and way less than other industries, let alone agriculture. The O&G industry used \~2.6% of the allocated fresh water in Alberta in 2022 for example.
On the flip side, if your maths is right then it shows just how much water is wasted in municipalities due to leaks, pond filling and other wastage.
Cities have to cut back on water, but farmers are going to have cut back the most. Oil and gas and mining will not have water restrictions. If I remember her press conference correctly, that is. I assume this also includes the mines that are running without permits but are still allowed to mine...I didn't expect her to make her own fan base have stricter water restrictions than the city's.
That sounds like poli-speak. I’d like to see specific measurables, not promises from industry to use “only the minimum volume of water practical”. Who is going to monitor this? Or is industry going to self regulate?
From the GoA's press release last week:
These water-sharing agreements are at the centre of Alberta’s drought response efforts. In 2001, agreements between southern irrigators and others played a key role in helping share water during that drought. This year’s agreements, facilitated by the Alberta government, are even bigger in scale and scope.
There are four water-sharing agreements, one to cover each of the following sub-basins: the Red Deer River, the Bow River, the mainstem of the Oldman River and the upper tributaries of the Oldman River. Specific commitments are laid out in each individual Memorandum of Understanding, but generally speaking:
* Participating municipalities will reduce water consumption by between five and 10 per cent. These are reasonable targets that can be achieved without affecting indoor water use.
* Participating industries will use only the minimum volume of water practical to maintain safe, reliable operations. They will also look for additional water conservation opportunities.
* Participating irrigation districts will use less water and allow other users to get their water first, then use the remaining water available for licenced use.
For reference, O&G extraction from Edmonton to the southern border (essentially the four sub basins above) accounts for 8 Billion litres of water usage.
[https://www.aer.ca/protecting-what-matters/holding-industry-accountable/industry-performance/water-use-performance/water-allocation-and-availability](https://www.aer.ca/protecting-what-matters/holding-industry-accountable/industry-performance/water-use-performance/water-allocation-and-availability)
Calgary's water aims are to maintain maximum water extraction from its rivers 213 billion litres, the same as 2003.
"Our goal is to hold withdrawals from the river steady at the 2003 baseline level of 212.5 billion litres, despite a growing population."
[https://www.calgary.ca/water/programs/water-efficiency-strategy.html](https://www.calgary.ca/water/programs/water-efficiency-strategy.html)
Municipal water usage is around 10% of Alberta's overall freshwater usage, the bulk of it is used by farming and secondly by (non energy) industry.
"Participating industries will use only the minimum volume of water practical "
In other words, industries will probably decide how much water they feel is practical and if they wish to participate at all. This sounds like some pretty weasly language carefully set to let them do whatever they want.
>So please assure us that this time you are actually going to put the interests of Albertans ahead of those of your handlers.
Heh. Yeah. I'm going to go ahead and hold my breath.
Agriculture needs water to [ correction: ] produce crops for export, cuz money.
Alberta doesn’t survive by consuming much of its own crops. CSA farms need water for food. Greenhouses need water for food. Backyard gardeners need water for food. A portion of farmers need water for crops that are food for horses and livestock. But beyond that, a lot of grain and otherwise is sold and shipped out.
Not saying it isn’t a necessary element of AB economy, or that farms don’t need water/farmers don’t need help, but… just adding some additional context. A lot of people (farmers and otherwise) are going to hurt. It’s unfortunate, but even within industries, prioritization ought to occur.
Also, I’d argue a lot of folks that *are* producing food for the local community are using water in very efficient ways. That is, compared to the vast monocultured for-export “agricultural” fields.
Correct.
There was approximately [580,000 acres](https://www.grainews.ca/columns/the-benefits-of-irrigation-in-alberta/#:~:text=Irrigated%20agriculture%20contributes%20about%20%246.5,projects%20by%20about%202%2C600%20farmers.) (as of 2021, these things do change a bit yeat-to-year) of grain grown under irrigation.
Compare that to millions of acres of grains total in Alberta - having trouble finding combined number, but [this article](https://centralalbertaonline.com/articles/farmers-expected-to-seed-more-wheat-in-2024-and-less-canola) says the prediction for the 2024 is 8.1M acres for wheat, and [this one](https://www.seed.ab.ca/alberta-farmers-to-plant-more-wheat-less-canola-this-year/) says 3.7M acres of barley back in 2022. Other grains - oats, rye, and triticale - make up a smaller portion of acres.
6 to 7 million of Canola. It's often similar to the wheat numbers.
Farmers of 2004: Your grandchildren are not going to grow the same crops you do. Ignoring climate change will cost you more than anyone!
Farmers of 2024: Same message!
Farmers of 2044: Get the message yet?
I know the St Mary's Irrigation District is allocating about half as much water to farmers as a normal year and I'd imagine most other districts are similar.
All water agreements are optional. It is very clear in the opening that they are voluntary. Edited to add this link: https://x.com/ndbyyc1305/status/1781349370207543601?s=46
How does water allocation work in Alberta?
Each river basin will have water licences issued. The
Ode licence holders that have the oldest water licences get the first dibs on water usage. An organization like the Eastern Irrigation District in Brooks has the oldest water licence in the Bow River Basin. The EID will have to voluntarily cut their water usage so other users like the city of Calgary can use water.
From the water that a city removes from
The River about 98% of that volume is returned to the river. The interesting thing is there is no obligation to return that water to the river. The city of Calgary could divert that water & sell it to farms for a private irrigation project…. I have always found that tidbit interesting.
I gave up going home for Christmas and found UCP going on holidays, they have no credibility to ask for anything from me. NDP I would consider but for the UCP I'm just a walking wallet, nothing more.
The biggest irony of it all is the the farmers, fire prevention, and yes even O&G will receive millions if not billions of bailout/emergency money from Ottawa if any losses are incurred due to environmental emergencies, and 90% of them will still whine that the feds don't do anything for Alberta and continue to actively vote against their own self interests due to ideology and in spite of intellect and evidence. This province has chosen willful ignorance for almost half a century at this point.
I also wouldn't put it past the UCP to deny those same funds as long as they have restrictions on them preventing the UCP from skimming off the top or using it to reward only their supporters and "business partners".
As someone who works in O&G, the government restricts how much water we are allowed to consume thru Water Permits. We only are allowed so much water from natural sources and when that limit is reached then no more water. It is also monitored very strictly by a Water Operator. Quite a few projects have been shelved because of the lack of water which means you can’t get a permit which means that specific O&G operation is a no-go. Although O&G uses a lot of water, they’re only only following the rules and regulations laid out by the government and believe me, they are some of the strictest environmental laws in the O&G worldwide.
I will be mindful of my water use, but realistically, there's nothing I can do that's going to make things worse. That's simply not how math works. Once again, the problem lies with larger companies than need to do better, not with the peasants who are already struggling.
I'll pile on about Smith on a whole host of subjects. Idk that she's automatically in the wrong about water.
You can't look at the total numbers of water use in the province and then just allocate it that way. Water falls where it falls and then runs where it runs. Even if O&G was using 50% of the water in the province, if they weren't using a huge portion of what's in the major rivers then it wouldn't impact residential use. Residential use does not require licenses in Alberta; commercial, agricultural, and industrial uses do.
I'll switch to an anecdote: last year while rafting the Bow, there were many places where the deepest parts were only a metre or so. It's the lowest I've seen it in the ten years I've lived here. Calgary is larger this year than it was last year too. I think having pre-emptive restrictions on outdoor lawn watering and other recreational use in the city is common sense before we know what the May-July rainfall is going to be.
I think the province and municipalities need to consider water when they're approving new housing. It's something we have enough of for the population we have, but perhaps not for 3x the population we have.
> It's something we have enough of for the population we have, but perhaps not for 3x the population we
have.
This is playing a big part we had a really bad drought in the 80's and also early 2000's was a couple years, but we did not have as many people as much irrigation, as much industry, as many feedlots. Its not just one thing that is the problem here.Add to this that this the Palliser triangle has always been iffy to support large scale water use
>Residential use does not require licenses in Alberta; commercial, agricultural, and industrial uses do.
It is a requirement to have a licence to withdraw water for all uses.
If there are more than 20 water service connections, hamlet, village , City, whatever, further regulations , permits and approvals to prevent waterborne disease outbreaks are required .
The Provinces 19th largest City , population 11,000 ish, in the surface precipitation fed Battle River Basin, has a licence to withdraw surface water from a shallow lake, up to 6000 cubic meters per day for short periods, 4500 cubic meters per day routinely .
A large sod farm on the Lakeshore, growing \selling water intensive non native plants , has a larger licence to withdraw, as does Exxon's Canadian branch, for underground oilfield injection, larger raw water pumps may extract over 11,000 cubic meters per day. The City's water used is returned to the river a few months later, with lowered, reduced biochemical oxygen demand, lowered total suspended solids, lowered ammonia, etc, such that a successful trout survival test is required before return to the fish bearing stream.
The industry can remove the surface water forever, injected deep under ground , or contaminate it with nutrients ( sod farm on Lakeshore, fertilizer run off\loading ) and return it to the river.
The City has third priority for withdrawal.
Overall though, residential use is a smaller fraction of water use, most Cities return 80 %ish back to the source, or downstream.
>I think the province and municipalities need to consider water when they're approving new housing
That's a good point, many approaches, including reducing the proliferation of non native plants , Kentucky blue Grass and similiar mixes , don't belong in this climate , are always in intensive care, and are thirsty.
Generic discussions; e.g ,LAND USE PLANNING TOOLS FOR MUNICIPALITIES AND INDIGENOUS GROUPS
https://www.battleriverwatershed.ca/watershed-management/land-use-practices/
It's interesting how cleverly desert city Phoenix tied water withdrawal to new construction, assigned a cost, and required multidecadal supply assurance , and are booming.
Your Watershed Planning and Advisory Council is
on this list ,
https://albertawater.com/water-maps/
I agree that being proactive is very much needed. I struggle with being told to take shorter showers while wondering what huge consumers of water are being told they have to do, like oil & gas, golf courses, and other UCP supporters.
It would be nice to have trustworthy news supported by independently sourced facts to give us an accurate picture. I don’t trust the government to do what’s right for Albertans, they’re too busy looking after other interests.
Taking a shorter shower doesn’t really matter. All that just goes back in the river anyway. It’s more of a waste of energy than water.
Your lawn is the one that wastes it.
The shorter shower was a recommendation from the premier. One Redditor calculated that if every Albertan reduced their water consumption by 50% it would amount to a savings of about 100 billion litres, or about half of the fresh water used by oil & gas in 2022.
Regardless, it’s going to be interesting to see what happens the rest of the year.
I work in the oil and gas industry and we definitely use a lot of water in my particular line of work... and we are definitely cutting back this year. There are likely to be layoffs at my company, and summer-wide slowdowns across the board.
This is both due to government water bans preventing our customers from getting approval for fracturing or any other well servicing, as well as increased costs of getting water hindering our ability to be as cost efficient.
Rest assured we are doing our part to reduce water consumption as much as anyone else.
And I don't work in upper management or anything like that. I just swing a hammer and turn knobs.
The OP leaves out a few crucial points from the very source it was pulled from.
Here is the actual link showing that the energy industry allotment was about 1% of non-saline water available in the province and actually used a fifth of their allotment. So yes, 200 billion litres of water sounds like a massive amount, but it’s missing a lot of context
https://www.aer.ca/protecting-what-matters/holding-industry-accountable/industry-performance/water-use-performance/about-water-use
It says the energy industry has 60% of Albertas surface and ground water allocated to it, correct? That’s fairly substantial. Plus, if they are over-licensed that should be drawn back.
Lol the aer is a joke of a organization. Why do you believe them? They serve the oil and gas industry not Albertans.
Fyi the rich and the conservatie politicans that serve them don't care about you
There’s lots of info from the federal government [here](https://natural-resources.canada.ca/sites/www.nrcan.gc.ca/files/www/pdf/com/resoress/publications/wateau/wateau-eng.pdf), dated 2009, with some stats from 2005:
Gross water use by major Canadian water-using sectors:
• **60% thermal-electric power generation (e.g. nuclear and fossil fuel generation)**
• 5% mineral and metal products
• 6% forest products
• 1% petroleum and coal products
• 4% minerals and metals mining
• 23% other (8% agriculture, 9% municipal, 6% other manufacturing).
BUT. Water *consumption* is remarkably different:
• 15% thermal-electric power generation
• 4% minerals and metals products
• 3% forest products
• 0.7% petroleum and coal products
• **58% agriculture**
• 9% municipal
• 10% other manufacturing
Sources listed are Environment Canada and Statistics Canada.
Based on the first breakdown of use by industry, 60% of 60,436.2 million cubic metres (mcm) is about 36,261.7 mcm *used* for thermal-electric power generation. Applied to the latter, it’s about 9,065.4 mcm *consumed*.
Someone more awake and less brain dead from exams than me can double check my math, but that’s roughly 9,065,400,000,000 litres. Nationally.
Surface water in Alberta licensed to O&G is 6% of 9,255 mcm or 55.53 million litres.
Ground water in Alberta licensed to O&G is 32% of 308 mcm or 98.56 million litres.
Total licensed to O&G is about 154.1 million litres.
That’s a lot less than 200 billion litres, or even 20% of 200 billion. So, maybe the difference is in industry inclusion. I haven’t looked at what the AER is accounting for.
If 60% is thermal-electric, that just reinforces the notion that solar is good for us. Those solar fields look to be photo electric, since there's no obvious turbine structure attached to the fields. Plus using them to shade crops would reduce evaporation and water use for that industry.
Of course, the steam from that (and evaporation from crops) should precipitate back out, but there's no control over where and limited predictability...
Anything that leads to a tailings pond needs to be improved though. We shouldn't be making those ecological disasters-in-waiting.
I just want to point out that this source, while good is from a LONG time ago when we think of how much coal-fueled electricity generation there was done then and how little there is now (and supposed to be gone this year sometime).
I fully sympathize with the difficulty in finding current sources. I've run into thos myself lots. Just want to say that these stats need to be taken with a * because a lot has changed, though I don't know much aside from the definite change in our electricity grid mix.
Sure; that’s why I included the dates, but these kinds of information surveys and publications don’t get updated every year, or every five years. I didn’t look very far to find it, but I imagine we’re only just coming due for something current now.
There are a lot of other great anecdotes in the document as well, including a projection that oil sands production would double by 2015.
I’m sure there are a lot of factors and variables between then and now. I would estimate that it shakes out about the same or close, though. Personal opinion, based loosely on other relevant environmental statistics I’ve had my head in lately, and given the scale of units we’re looking at.
A little out of date, but not from the AER:
[https://open.alberta.ca/dataset/1832cd36-bbeb-4997-ae81-67d3eedfcfe5/resource/18a9d64b-bad8-413a-8c63-77a548ec9d88/download/4888138-2010-facts-about-water-in-alberta-2010-12.pdf](https://open.alberta.ca/dataset/1832cd36-bbeb-4997-ae81-67d3eedfcfe5/resource/18a9d64b-bad8-413a-8c63-77a548ec9d88/download/4888138-2010-facts-about-water-in-alberta-2010-12.pdf)
It's water allocations from 2010, not actual usage.
44.3% agriculture
29.6% commercial
11.3% Municipalities
8.5% Industrial (O&G)
She called the industrial use just a sliver. They pump hundreds of thousands of litres down hole and fully contaminate fresh surface water when fracking. They used oil in the past which is much more expensive but some can be reused when you clean up the flow back. Some water may be reused but will not be fresh drinkable water again. I am not against the oil and gas industry, but we are wasting fresh water for the most part, because it is cheap... For now.
Burning oil and gas produces water vapor. The hydrogen in hydrocarbons comes from water that was broken apart by plants and converted to sugars that are more hydrocarbons. Burning fossil fuels releases CO2 and H2O that were taken out of the atmosphere of millions of years.
It's bottled locally for sale locally. I very much doubt they export it out of the province.
Great marketing though. Literally local tap water in a bottle, sold to people that don't and think it's Evian or something...
Oil & Gas mostly operate in different watersheds then the south saskatchewan basin. I dunno why this is so hard for people to understand, the water used in fort mac isn't the same water you drink in calgary. Fracking in fox creek doesn't have any impact on southern alberta.
I also find myself scratching my head at the idea that O&G doesn't already have heavy restrictions on when and how much water they're allowed to use.
They do. And energy industry water licence holders also significantly under used their allotments in 2022; their allotment amounts to less than 1% of non-saline water in the province and they used about 20% of that (0.18% of non-saline water available).
https://www.aer.ca/protecting-what-matters/holding-industry-accountable/industry-performance/water-use-performance/about-water-use
Most northern Alberta oil operations use what's called brackish water, or water with high sodium content that makes it not usable for farming because it prevents any crops from growing (think salting the earth). So you technically wouldn't be fighting fire with it anyways, because nothing will grow there afterwards.
Alberta oil sands have a water reuse mandate where the water used has to be recycled and makeup water has to consist mainly of the brackish water I mentioned and a small amount of fresh water.
I've been doing some digging into the top 50 most profitable "Canadian" Oil and Gas corporations. The majority of those 50 "Canadian" companies are owned by American corporations when you look at their shareholders on the TSX and other exchanges.
To be fair, I know of a facility that draws from the south Saskatchewan river and is making provisions for running out of allotted water this summer, and will have to curtail operations. I'm sure many others are in the same boat.
>So please assure us that this time you are actually going to put the interests of Albertans ahead of those of your handlers.
Awww hahahahahahahahahaha
So my mom went to high school in another province in the 60’s and she mentioned before that they said Alberta would be a dust bowl one day.
I’m not surprised.
Rest assured we "oilfield" are feeling the pain as you say as well. Water permits being voided daily and I'm hearing of multiple canceled drilling programs. Lots of operations in an attempt to forge ahead are using sewage water as drilling fluid in water based sections.
With respect, if you want your opinions to be taken objectively on serious issues, try less virtue-signaling in your approach.
I agree with you on this point, but the Marlaina shit is getting old and it's a bad look for the leftist club.
I can understand wanting solid assurance that our ‘leader’ will do what’s right for the province and the people. It won’t happen though, not sure why anyone has an inkling of faith in her practices. I’m a bit shocked at how many people say they refuse to reduce their water consumption because this place or that agency doesn’t have to. The fact of the matter is, we’re low on our most precious resource and, it’s something we can’t live without. I support the right to protest, but that’s a very irresponsible way to make your point.
Interesting article, thanks for sharing the link.
Now, since the government is aware of how serious the drought is expected to be in 2024, hopefully they’ll respond in an appropriate manner to ensure what water they use is used properly.
Sadly I have little faith that they will and suspect big oil won’t change what they’re already doing, and they’ll have the support of the government they influence.
Oil and gas predominantly shifted to using water from privately owned sources that don’t contribute to collective water use. Don’t get me wrong they will take where they can get it. But oil and gas isn’t stupid. They know the image that creates when taking from a river or stream.
Marlaina Danielle Smith is the premiers full name. Calling her by her first name came about when she was calling for parental consent be obtained if kids wanted to use a different name other than their proper name. Since we don’t actually know if her parents gave consent for her to be called by her middle name, many are calling her Marlaina.
What’s best for Albertans should be the primary focus, not catering to UCP supporters. It’s a balancing act that won’t be easy to achieve. We need to ensure our interests are properly being looked after.
"Marlaina, I’m sure even your base would agree that water availability is a must. After all, you can’t grow crops using oil, and you certainly can’t fight forest fires with oil."
That 'balancing act' isn't going to be struck following this thought process I can tell you that now. Our current practices in agriculture AND firefighting deeply depend on oil.
Hey OP, I recommend reading through the resources on this not-for-profit webpage about how water is licensed and allocated in Alberta: https://albertawater.com/water-licences-transfers-and-allocation/
This also presents water allocation by sector, and by river flow.
> Water allocations in Alberta have grown by seven per cent since 2000, surpassing 9.9 billion cubic metres by 2010. *(i.e., 9,900 billion litres)*.
You are grossly misinformed on how water is allocated in Alberta, and where the largest uses are.
Edit to add this CBC article with more recent info - though not as well presented to show uses by sector in the different basins. https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/edmonton/in-this-drought-year-alberta-s-water-allocation-is-under-the-microscope-here-s-what-the-data-says-1.7133575
Thanks for the recommended reading, I’ll check it out.
I don’t recall commenting on how water is allocated or where the largest uses are, rather I quoted from information obtained from AER which said in 2022 oil & gas used over 200 billion litres of fresh water. Not sure how that means I’m grossly misinformed.
Ok, so Alberta's oil and gas sector used 261 million cubic metres of water. Sounds like a huge number!
But that's just 2.66 % of the 9,800 million cubic metres[9,800 million cubic metres](https://www.aer.ca/protecting-what-matters/holding-industry-accountable/industry-performance/water-use-performance/about-water-use) that humans allocated in2022. And this completely ignores the (*very important*) nuances of the geographic differences (much of the oil and gas water use is in the north, while water scarcity is most severe down south), withdrawal type (surface water vs groundwater), and seasonal vs. year-round.
And allocation and how our licensing system works is absolutely important if you're worried about restrictions in times of scarcity - or in your words "sharing the pain". Water licences in Alberta work based on "first in time, first in right". In times of scarcity, the oldest licenses (generally irrigation districts and municipalities, in that order) get to continue withdrawing water, while newer users may have to restrict use. Much of oil and gas operates on "temporary diversion licenses", which are the first to get cut. They will absolutely be sharing the pain.
It really sounds like you're taking a complex multifaceted issue and turning it into a single-industry problem perpetuated by a single super villain premiere.
I made a similar comment that O&G won’t feel the same restriction of the rest of Alberta and woke a O&G troll who said northern Alberta is not suffering drought and to get my fax straight before I go on a uninformed rant. Not only was my comment benign but the woke troll clearly was triggered and lost all ability to comprehend because I was not ranting.
I’ve had a couple of similar responses today however the positive comments greatly outweigh the negative. We know there are a lot of people who won’t change or see things for how they are.
What I don’t understand is that the UCP TBA isn’t the old Conservative Party from years past yet so many Albertans blindly follow whatever they are told, as long as it isn’t NDP or Trudeau.
Question for your O&G troll in northern Alberta. While I’m glad they’re not suffering drought, do they have the water resources to deal with what will likely be another bad year for fires?
I hope Alberta survives this government, we deserve better.
I know of a golf course that has an old water license allowing them unlimited draw from the bow River. I bet their course will be perfectly green this summer as they're more of a premium course. They have ponds that will fill with rain, but if they is no significant rain, they are maintained by the river.
Are these licenses etched in stone or are they periodically reviewed, do you know? Golf courses must use a tremendous amount of water. If these licenses aren’t periodically reviewed, maybe it’s time they were.
Generally, they’re operated on a “FITFIR” system, or “first in time, first in right”. The oldest are prioritized over newer licenses, and in theory (if at capacity), new ones don’t come available unless old ones are forfeited. They also get passed down, so if a rancher sells his ranch to someone or passes it down to a child, the new owner gets the license with it. There’s no re-application. Even land use can change, to a varying degree, without re-evaluating. A farmer can change crop type, production, etc. to a manner/method that uses more/less water without changing their allocation.
It’s a very old system, and honestly… I think we just haven’t ever faced issues like this before. We’ve been lucky to operate well within capacity, even recklessly. The system is now being tested.
The water license for the golf course came with the land that was sold to develop it. I think he told me it was like one of the first licenses, and that's why it's so rare with pretty much no restrictions.
Primarily gray water. At least every rig In my area is hooked up to a pump fed from the local lagoon. That's where they get the water to fill thier dugouts too.
I was basing my comments on the AER report that said over 200 billion litres of fresh water. I was aware that grey water is used extensively by O&G but I found the number in the report to be staggering.
The oil and gas companies are not using water that Albertans are drinking, unless of course you all wish to drink slough water or water that is not gone through a water treatment plant. If you all want to complain about oil and gas companies using water, stop for 1 minute and think about how much river water runs through our river systems to be forever unusable in the salt water of the oceans.
Straight up it's pointless unless oil companies and other large water consuming enterprises do the same. Why should I have to suffer because some billionaires can't get it through their thick skulls that they consume most of the water due to their industrial and recreational activities.
This has generated a lot of discussion. I’ve learned about various water agreements and don’t fully understand why they apparently can’t be changed. I suspect it’s for political reasons as politicians don’t want to upset the billionaires who help keep them in office.
I had more than a few comments about how oil & gas uses gray water and tell me I’m wrong. All I did was quote the AER which, as stated above says oil & gas in 2022 used over 200 billion litres of FRESH water.
Thanks for your comment!
I bet golf courses across Alberta will be lush and green all summer.
I was thinking that same thing. We all need to contribute to this.
Yes somehow it falls on the regular hard working citizens every time.
That is something all levels of government regardless of political affiliation has been guilty of for at least 40 years. The lobbying system has been very successful at limiting corporate responsibility for all environmental issues. Mercury in Dryden ON, PCB contaminated SaskPower sites in Saskatchewan, Selenium contaminated rivers near coal mines and expanding irrigation in Saskatchewan during a drought. These are examples of corporate needs surpassing the public good.
Considering that the UCP created a bill to evict federal environmental assessors and that the Supreme Court upheld any provinces jurisdiction to do so does not show how "all levels of government" are responsible, imo. The feds have been shut out by conservative run provinces for the last 5 years. We have an anti environmentalist as a premier. The lobbying wasn't just successful. It shattered any hope to repair the situation. I do not see this as a "both sides " issue since only one side has silenced scientific researchers, decimated environmental assessment and safety, and has interfered with the market to benefit only fossil fuels corporations. The Libs are not innocent of willful neglect. However, they're not actively working to shut down the entire green alternative completely.
So you are saying the “conservative parties” in Alberta are bought and paid for by oil and gas companies? I am shocked:).
Yes but people keep electing the gozer party.
Let’s remember that this would be conservatives for 36 years and NDP for four. There’s a clear direction in which blame can and should be placed.
Don't worry UCP are willing to throw us under the bus for corporations.
Do golf courses in Alberta not use grey water ?
Some have their own water reserves, some use grey some are just connected to infrastructure like city courses.
None of the City of Calgary courses use potable water, but other courses do rely on different water sources, including treated city water, to irrigate their playing surfaces. Golf courses in Calgary do seem to be proactive thus far. However, I’ve had smoke blown up my ass before…. Lol https://calgary.ctvnews.ca/calgary-golf-courses-prepare-for-potential-water-restrictions-ahead-of-2024-season-1.6841782#:~:text=None%20of%20the%20City%20of,Wednesday%2C%20April%2010%2C%202024.
The golf course I worked as a teenager had their own well, which pumped water into a dugout. This is pretty rural Alberta, not sure how bigger city courses manage.
I only know about two personally; campbell river and in prince george. Both in BC. Both use grey wastewater
For those unfamiliar: grey water is water that is untreated, but not full of contaminates. Like rain or raw river water. It's not safe for human consumption, but it's fine for watering grass and plants. Kinda like how you can use water colleced in rain barrels to water your lawn, but it's probably not a great idea to drink that water.
Grey water is “used” water that comes from any source except raw sewage (like toilets or urinals). It can come from washing machines, showers, sinks and dishwashers, etc. It can then be used as a source of water for any application except drinking (watering lawns, irrigation, toilets, etc).
You can't just use washing machine/dishwasher/shower water to water your grass. Most soap and detergents will kill plants.
I’m just defining grey water. Some types have to be used for flushing toilets. Some types can water your lawn.
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That is apparently correct according to the font of all information, google, thank you
I’ll bet they won’t unless they have their own reservoir.
Even then, their reservoir is just storing water that would have entered the watershed and could have been used elsewhere.
Idk, my course is usually pretty brown except for the greens...
Slight tangent, I would very much be in favor of banning golf courses outright, at least inside city limits. Have them all converted to public parks, I feel like there's so many benefits to be had
I'm genuinely surprised that you're getting downvoted. Yes, grey water is not treated water, yet it is a source that can be used for higher priorities such as human consumption once we do treat it. Golf courses are such needless luxuries, especially when you consider what is happening with our climate. We're going to have to learn to live much leaner, and we're not going to be given an option.
Our courses in Fort McMurray use untreated water from the river only if the water from the ponds filled by rainwater drops too low.
Not across Alberta. Definitely in Calgary, but Edmontons will probably be dry and brown.
They are already trotting out the talking points that oil and gas industry usage is small in comparison to Alberta households combined. I don’t expect they will manage this crisis well at all.
They use the word, industry will use the minimum they need to operate, all without telling us how much they use. Another play on words that many UCP supports will buy.
[https://www.aer.ca/protecting-what-matters/holding-industry-accountable/industry-performance/water-use-performance/oil-sands-mining-water-use](https://www.aer.ca/protecting-what-matters/holding-industry-accountable/industry-performance/water-use-performance/oil-sands-mining-water-use) The data for water use is can be found in on the left under "Data". Industry has to tell the regulator how much they use, and it's public data
But the regulator has no obligation to share with the public. And the government definitely doesn't share all the public needs to know.
I love that it ignores the reality that city's use the least water. Reality and basic facts are hard for the UCP,, they love to lie!
I agree. Sad, isn’t it? I always thought the job of politicians was to do the job they were elected to do and not look after the interests of themselves and donors first.
A helpful watch is CGP Grey's Rules for Rulers on YouTube. Politicians are people, and people are self-interested. It's our job as citizens to make damn sure that politicians' self interest lines up with ours, and they would rather it didn't since it's harder to please the masses than a smaller number of business interests. The average citizen has little individual power, and we have slept on that job for so long that it's very difficult now to push back. We don't have high-paying no-show jobs to dish out to our champions, and most of us don't have the time or money to buy rubber chicken at $1,000 / plate. So we need to use organizations that consolidate the power to act as our bullhorns. But political parties are snarled up in procedure and unions are reviled and neutered. I hate to say it, but Take Back Alberta seems to have an effective model right now; and progressives should co-opt it.
I agree with everything you've written , 100%. I've been trying to get family and friends to take notice of what's happening, and you know what 90% of the response has been? "Oh well. Nothing we can do about it..." I've stopped talking with these people. They're so self absorbed and lazy, I just couldn't associate with them anymore.
I always thought the same. Sadly, it was a smokescreen we all wanted to believe because we grew up with fairytales and Disney. The good guy is losing right now.
The average Albertan uses around 130 litres per day. Even if every Albertan completely HALVES their water use entirely, it would be just over 100billion litres saved in a year. So that would still be only HALF of what oil and gas uses and I bet they won’t be making any efforts to reduce their usage nor will they have restrictions placed on them.
Thank you for this! I seriously doubt Albertans could reduce their water consumption by half so why is this being put on the shoulders of Albertans when industry should be sharing the pain? I know, we don’t have leverage over politicians!
Important to remember that there are consumptive and non-consumptive water uses. Households are mostly non-consumptive users. The water you use to shower gets treated and goes right back into the river, you're really only borrowing it for a while. This is why they focus on things like lawn watering, that's one of the few consumptive water uses for most of us. Industries can go either way, some, like irrigation, permanently consume water while others just use it, then treat and release. This brings up a problem with the supposed innocence of golf courses using gray water. It's still consuming water that would have otherwise been fully treated and put back in the river.
The oil site i work at has a permit for so many thousands of gallons, i dont remember the number, but when the pipe from the river to site sprung a leak, they stopped pulling water from the river once they reached their permitted limit, and borrowed from another sites reserves. So while the oil companies suck they do follow the rules in place. I don't envision Marlaina placing restrictions on them though.
I do believe they follow the rules, it's just that the rules need to change, currently the cost to these companies does not reflect the cost thier water usage has on survivability of agriculture and the surrounding environments that are needed to support resilient food systems.
The vast majority of non saline water use by O&G comes from NE Alberta. Unless we install massive pipelines hundreds of km from Lake Athabasca their extraction is not having an effect on agriculture and environments in the areas we are currently seeing drought. Ironically O&G extraction seems to be the scapegoat to distract from the real issue: Agriculture, which uses the bulk of fresh water in the province to try and farm in a semi arid environment. Agriculture, which is primarily in south and central Alberta, where the majority of drought issues are.
130 litres sounds insane. Keeping in mind showering, flushing toilets, washing clothing, and washing dishes.
Unless you're using low flow efficient toilets they're probably using 4-6 litres a flush. If you drink a healthy amount of water you might be flushing say like 8-10 times a day, that's already like 50 litres on the toilet alone.
Here's some info on it. [https://albertawater.com/alberta-water-blog/household-water-use-in-alberta/](https://albertawater.com/alberta-water-blog/household-water-use-in-alberta/) [https://www.calgary.ca/environment/climate/water-consumption-in-calgary.html](https://www.calgary.ca/environment/climate/water-consumption-in-calgary.html)
Using is different from simply letting it evaporate, oil and gas production (and households) recycle water. We should have numbers reflecting how much of that water goes into an unusable state, there's a difference to just running your tap down the drain and running your sprinklers in 30 degree heat at 3 pm
Here's the report the OP is referring to: [https://www.aer.ca/protecting-what-matters/holding-industry-accountable/industry-performance/water-use-performance](https://www.aer.ca/protecting-what-matters/holding-industry-accountable/industry-performance/water-use-performance) "In 2022, 17% of the water used by the oil and gas industry was nonsaline, 1% was alternative make-up water, and 82% was recycled water." The vast majority of the non saline water used is from Oil Sands, which is extracted from NE Alberta. [https://www.aer.ca/protecting-what-matters/holding-industry-accountable/industry-performance/water-use-performance/oil-sands-mining-water-use](https://www.aer.ca/protecting-what-matters/holding-industry-accountable/industry-performance/water-use-performance/oil-sands-mining-water-use) Basically, unless the government installs massive water pipelines from Lake Athabasca to south and central Alberta, water usage by O&G is broadly irrelevant to the drought currently affecting southern and central Alberta. I'm not a fan of Oil Sands, but lets at least try and have an honest argument. Oil and gas uses far less non saline water than municipalities in Alberta, and way less than other industries, let alone agriculture. The O&G industry used \~2.6% of the allocated fresh water in Alberta in 2022 for example. On the flip side, if your maths is right then it shows just how much water is wasted in municipalities due to leaks, pond filling and other wastage.
130 liters per day!?! Im single and no roommates and my usage last month was 2 cubic meters about 66 l/ day what are these ppl doing to use 130?
Right?! When I googled it I was floored.
Got a source for those numbers?
Cities have to cut back on water, but farmers are going to have cut back the most. Oil and gas and mining will not have water restrictions. If I remember her press conference correctly, that is. I assume this also includes the mines that are running without permits but are still allowed to mine...I didn't expect her to make her own fan base have stricter water restrictions than the city's.
I’m pretty sure she never mentioned any water restrictions on O&G, after all, that’s why they support her.
"**Participating industries** will use only the minimum volume of water practical"
That sounds like poli-speak. I’d like to see specific measurables, not promises from industry to use “only the minimum volume of water practical”. Who is going to monitor this? Or is industry going to self regulate?
Which mines are operating without permits?
https://www.aer.ca/protecting-what-matters/holding-industry-accountable/industry-performance/water-use-performance/about-water-use
From the GoA's press release last week: These water-sharing agreements are at the centre of Alberta’s drought response efforts. In 2001, agreements between southern irrigators and others played a key role in helping share water during that drought. This year’s agreements, facilitated by the Alberta government, are even bigger in scale and scope. There are four water-sharing agreements, one to cover each of the following sub-basins: the Red Deer River, the Bow River, the mainstem of the Oldman River and the upper tributaries of the Oldman River. Specific commitments are laid out in each individual Memorandum of Understanding, but generally speaking: * Participating municipalities will reduce water consumption by between five and 10 per cent. These are reasonable targets that can be achieved without affecting indoor water use. * Participating industries will use only the minimum volume of water practical to maintain safe, reliable operations. They will also look for additional water conservation opportunities. * Participating irrigation districts will use less water and allow other users to get their water first, then use the remaining water available for licenced use.
I hope everyone does what they say and that it actually makes a difference.
For reference, O&G extraction from Edmonton to the southern border (essentially the four sub basins above) accounts for 8 Billion litres of water usage. [https://www.aer.ca/protecting-what-matters/holding-industry-accountable/industry-performance/water-use-performance/water-allocation-and-availability](https://www.aer.ca/protecting-what-matters/holding-industry-accountable/industry-performance/water-use-performance/water-allocation-and-availability) Calgary's water aims are to maintain maximum water extraction from its rivers 213 billion litres, the same as 2003. "Our goal is to hold withdrawals from the river steady at the 2003 baseline level of 212.5 billion litres, despite a growing population." [https://www.calgary.ca/water/programs/water-efficiency-strategy.html](https://www.calgary.ca/water/programs/water-efficiency-strategy.html) Municipal water usage is around 10% of Alberta's overall freshwater usage, the bulk of it is used by farming and secondly by (non energy) industry.
"Participating industries will use only the minimum volume of water practical " In other words, industries will probably decide how much water they feel is practical and if they wish to participate at all. This sounds like some pretty weasly language carefully set to let them do whatever they want.
Do we know who the participating cities are? Thanks
>So please assure us that this time you are actually going to put the interests of Albertans ahead of those of your handlers. Heh. Yeah. I'm going to go ahead and hold my breath.
They already basically have shown that every O&G job is worth more than a average Albertan
Wishful thinking, I know.
Agriculture needs water to [ correction: ] produce crops for export, cuz money. Alberta doesn’t survive by consuming much of its own crops. CSA farms need water for food. Greenhouses need water for food. Backyard gardeners need water for food. A portion of farmers need water for crops that are food for horses and livestock. But beyond that, a lot of grain and otherwise is sold and shipped out. Not saying it isn’t a necessary element of AB economy, or that farms don’t need water/farmers don’t need help, but… just adding some additional context. A lot of people (farmers and otherwise) are going to hurt. It’s unfortunate, but even within industries, prioritization ought to occur. Also, I’d argue a lot of folks that *are* producing food for the local community are using water in very efficient ways. That is, compared to the vast monocultured for-export “agricultural” fields.
Almost all grain grown in Alberta is not irrigated. We rely on rain to water these crops.
Correct. There was approximately [580,000 acres](https://www.grainews.ca/columns/the-benefits-of-irrigation-in-alberta/#:~:text=Irrigated%20agriculture%20contributes%20about%20%246.5,projects%20by%20about%202%2C600%20farmers.) (as of 2021, these things do change a bit yeat-to-year) of grain grown under irrigation. Compare that to millions of acres of grains total in Alberta - having trouble finding combined number, but [this article](https://centralalbertaonline.com/articles/farmers-expected-to-seed-more-wheat-in-2024-and-less-canola) says the prediction for the 2024 is 8.1M acres for wheat, and [this one](https://www.seed.ab.ca/alberta-farmers-to-plant-more-wheat-less-canola-this-year/) says 3.7M acres of barley back in 2022. Other grains - oats, rye, and triticale - make up a smaller portion of acres.
6 to 7 million of Canola. It's often similar to the wheat numbers. Farmers of 2004: Your grandchildren are not going to grow the same crops you do. Ignoring climate change will cost you more than anyone! Farmers of 2024: Same message! Farmers of 2044: Get the message yet?
But keep in mind thats just grain irrigated as per your article there is 1.7 millionish total
I know the St Mary's Irrigation District is allocating about half as much water to farmers as a normal year and I'd imagine most other districts are similar.
All water agreements are optional. It is very clear in the opening that they are voluntary. Edited to add this link: https://x.com/ndbyyc1305/status/1781349370207543601?s=46
Yes because its a carrot and stick thing, thats how water act works
How does water allocation work in Alberta? Each river basin will have water licences issued. The Ode licence holders that have the oldest water licences get the first dibs on water usage. An organization like the Eastern Irrigation District in Brooks has the oldest water licence in the Bow River Basin. The EID will have to voluntarily cut their water usage so other users like the city of Calgary can use water. From the water that a city removes from The River about 98% of that volume is returned to the river. The interesting thing is there is no obligation to return that water to the river. The city of Calgary could divert that water & sell it to farms for a private irrigation project…. I have always found that tidbit interesting.
While approving mining projects requiring 0.5 cubic meter per seconds of water...
Do as I say, not as I do. That’s the way she thinks
Yup. That’s one reason why she doesn’t care, her friends either, because they know they won’t be in the least bit inconvenienced.
She actually didn't say this, OP lied.
I bet there’s still water for fracking though..
Remember COVID and how they said not to travel while traveling and skirting the rules themselves? Yeah, expect the same.
This is just the beginning, they’re getting bolder all the time.
I'm going to use the same amount of water I always do. I don't water lawns or any of that. I know those people won't lower theirs.
Many people have said the same thing, they have no intention of changing their lives. It’s going to be an interesting summer.
I gave up going home for Christmas and found UCP going on holidays, they have no credibility to ask for anything from me. NDP I would consider but for the UCP I'm just a walking wallet, nothing more.
The biggest irony of it all is the the farmers, fire prevention, and yes even O&G will receive millions if not billions of bailout/emergency money from Ottawa if any losses are incurred due to environmental emergencies, and 90% of them will still whine that the feds don't do anything for Alberta and continue to actively vote against their own self interests due to ideology and in spite of intellect and evidence. This province has chosen willful ignorance for almost half a century at this point. I also wouldn't put it past the UCP to deny those same funds as long as they have restrictions on them preventing the UCP from skimming off the top or using it to reward only their supporters and "business partners".
No bailouts for cash crop farmers! Reduce you environmental impact if you want to keep the profits and get the bailouts! The world is on fire! 🔥
As someone who works in O&G, the government restricts how much water we are allowed to consume thru Water Permits. We only are allowed so much water from natural sources and when that limit is reached then no more water. It is also monitored very strictly by a Water Operator. Quite a few projects have been shelved because of the lack of water which means you can’t get a permit which means that specific O&G operation is a no-go. Although O&G uses a lot of water, they’re only only following the rules and regulations laid out by the government and believe me, they are some of the strictest environmental laws in the O&G worldwide.
Thanks for sharing your first hand knowledge!
I will be mindful of my water use, but realistically, there's nothing I can do that's going to make things worse. That's simply not how math works. Once again, the problem lies with larger companies than need to do better, not with the peasants who are already struggling.
I'll pile on about Smith on a whole host of subjects. Idk that she's automatically in the wrong about water. You can't look at the total numbers of water use in the province and then just allocate it that way. Water falls where it falls and then runs where it runs. Even if O&G was using 50% of the water in the province, if they weren't using a huge portion of what's in the major rivers then it wouldn't impact residential use. Residential use does not require licenses in Alberta; commercial, agricultural, and industrial uses do. I'll switch to an anecdote: last year while rafting the Bow, there were many places where the deepest parts were only a metre or so. It's the lowest I've seen it in the ten years I've lived here. Calgary is larger this year than it was last year too. I think having pre-emptive restrictions on outdoor lawn watering and other recreational use in the city is common sense before we know what the May-July rainfall is going to be. I think the province and municipalities need to consider water when they're approving new housing. It's something we have enough of for the population we have, but perhaps not for 3x the population we have.
> It's something we have enough of for the population we have, but perhaps not for 3x the population we have. This is playing a big part we had a really bad drought in the 80's and also early 2000's was a couple years, but we did not have as many people as much irrigation, as much industry, as many feedlots. Its not just one thing that is the problem here.Add to this that this the Palliser triangle has always been iffy to support large scale water use
>Residential use does not require licenses in Alberta; commercial, agricultural, and industrial uses do. It is a requirement to have a licence to withdraw water for all uses. If there are more than 20 water service connections, hamlet, village , City, whatever, further regulations , permits and approvals to prevent waterborne disease outbreaks are required . The Provinces 19th largest City , population 11,000 ish, in the surface precipitation fed Battle River Basin, has a licence to withdraw surface water from a shallow lake, up to 6000 cubic meters per day for short periods, 4500 cubic meters per day routinely . A large sod farm on the Lakeshore, growing \selling water intensive non native plants , has a larger licence to withdraw, as does Exxon's Canadian branch, for underground oilfield injection, larger raw water pumps may extract over 11,000 cubic meters per day. The City's water used is returned to the river a few months later, with lowered, reduced biochemical oxygen demand, lowered total suspended solids, lowered ammonia, etc, such that a successful trout survival test is required before return to the fish bearing stream. The industry can remove the surface water forever, injected deep under ground , or contaminate it with nutrients ( sod farm on Lakeshore, fertilizer run off\loading ) and return it to the river. The City has third priority for withdrawal. Overall though, residential use is a smaller fraction of water use, most Cities return 80 %ish back to the source, or downstream. >I think the province and municipalities need to consider water when they're approving new housing That's a good point, many approaches, including reducing the proliferation of non native plants , Kentucky blue Grass and similiar mixes , don't belong in this climate , are always in intensive care, and are thirsty. Generic discussions; e.g ,LAND USE PLANNING TOOLS FOR MUNICIPALITIES AND INDIGENOUS GROUPS https://www.battleriverwatershed.ca/watershed-management/land-use-practices/ It's interesting how cleverly desert city Phoenix tied water withdrawal to new construction, assigned a cost, and required multidecadal supply assurance , and are booming. Your Watershed Planning and Advisory Council is on this list , https://albertawater.com/water-maps/
I agree that being proactive is very much needed. I struggle with being told to take shorter showers while wondering what huge consumers of water are being told they have to do, like oil & gas, golf courses, and other UCP supporters. It would be nice to have trustworthy news supported by independently sourced facts to give us an accurate picture. I don’t trust the government to do what’s right for Albertans, they’re too busy looking after other interests.
Why is the government picking winners? It’s time to leave this up to the market… /s 🙄
Taking a shorter shower doesn’t really matter. All that just goes back in the river anyway. It’s more of a waste of energy than water. Your lawn is the one that wastes it.
The shorter shower was a recommendation from the premier. One Redditor calculated that if every Albertan reduced their water consumption by 50% it would amount to a savings of about 100 billion litres, or about half of the fresh water used by oil & gas in 2022. Regardless, it’s going to be interesting to see what happens the rest of the year.
How bold of you to think that they actually give a fuck about anyone that isn't making them richer.
We all know they don’t care about ordinary Albertans, even their base. For them it’s all about control, enriching themselves, and their supporters.
I work in the oil and gas industry and we definitely use a lot of water in my particular line of work... and we are definitely cutting back this year. There are likely to be layoffs at my company, and summer-wide slowdowns across the board. This is both due to government water bans preventing our customers from getting approval for fracturing or any other well servicing, as well as increased costs of getting water hindering our ability to be as cost efficient. Rest assured we are doing our part to reduce water consumption as much as anyone else. And I don't work in upper management or anything like that. I just swing a hammer and turn knobs.
Thanks for your input. It’s good to hear from those working in the industry and not just politicians.
Thanks for your input. It’s good to hear from those working in the industry and not just politicians.
We need to do what Australia does with regards to water
Australia is very serious about water conservation. You’re right, we could learn from their experience although it could be a hard sell in Alberta.
How much do you want to bet all the golf courses will be blasting water
^[Sokka-Haiku](https://www.reddit.com/r/SokkaHaikuBot/comments/15kyv9r/what_is_a_sokka_haiku/) ^by ^488Aji: *How much do you want* *To bet all the golf courses* *Will be blasting water* --- ^Remember ^that ^one ^time ^Sokka ^accidentally ^used ^an ^extra ^syllable ^in ^that ^Haiku ^Battle ^in ^Ba ^Sing ^Se? ^That ^was ^a ^Sokka ^Haiku ^and ^you ^just ^made ^one.
The OP leaves out a few crucial points from the very source it was pulled from. Here is the actual link showing that the energy industry allotment was about 1% of non-saline water available in the province and actually used a fifth of their allotment. So yes, 200 billion litres of water sounds like a massive amount, but it’s missing a lot of context https://www.aer.ca/protecting-what-matters/holding-industry-accountable/industry-performance/water-use-performance/about-water-use
It says the energy industry has 60% of Albertas surface and ground water allocated to it, correct? That’s fairly substantial. Plus, if they are over-licensed that should be drawn back.
I don't think he's gonna reply to you.
Lol the aer is a joke of a organization. Why do you believe them? They serve the oil and gas industry not Albertans. Fyi the rich and the conservatie politicans that serve them don't care about you
Can you provide a link to a more reputable organization that tracks water usage in Alberta then?
There’s lots of info from the federal government [here](https://natural-resources.canada.ca/sites/www.nrcan.gc.ca/files/www/pdf/com/resoress/publications/wateau/wateau-eng.pdf), dated 2009, with some stats from 2005: Gross water use by major Canadian water-using sectors: • **60% thermal-electric power generation (e.g. nuclear and fossil fuel generation)** • 5% mineral and metal products • 6% forest products • 1% petroleum and coal products • 4% minerals and metals mining • 23% other (8% agriculture, 9% municipal, 6% other manufacturing). BUT. Water *consumption* is remarkably different: • 15% thermal-electric power generation • 4% minerals and metals products • 3% forest products • 0.7% petroleum and coal products • **58% agriculture** • 9% municipal • 10% other manufacturing Sources listed are Environment Canada and Statistics Canada. Based on the first breakdown of use by industry, 60% of 60,436.2 million cubic metres (mcm) is about 36,261.7 mcm *used* for thermal-electric power generation. Applied to the latter, it’s about 9,065.4 mcm *consumed*. Someone more awake and less brain dead from exams than me can double check my math, but that’s roughly 9,065,400,000,000 litres. Nationally. Surface water in Alberta licensed to O&G is 6% of 9,255 mcm or 55.53 million litres. Ground water in Alberta licensed to O&G is 32% of 308 mcm or 98.56 million litres. Total licensed to O&G is about 154.1 million litres. That’s a lot less than 200 billion litres, or even 20% of 200 billion. So, maybe the difference is in industry inclusion. I haven’t looked at what the AER is accounting for.
If 60% is thermal-electric, that just reinforces the notion that solar is good for us. Those solar fields look to be photo electric, since there's no obvious turbine structure attached to the fields. Plus using them to shade crops would reduce evaporation and water use for that industry. Of course, the steam from that (and evaporation from crops) should precipitate back out, but there's no control over where and limited predictability... Anything that leads to a tailings pond needs to be improved though. We shouldn't be making those ecological disasters-in-waiting.
I just want to point out that this source, while good is from a LONG time ago when we think of how much coal-fueled electricity generation there was done then and how little there is now (and supposed to be gone this year sometime). I fully sympathize with the difficulty in finding current sources. I've run into thos myself lots. Just want to say that these stats need to be taken with a * because a lot has changed, though I don't know much aside from the definite change in our electricity grid mix.
Sure; that’s why I included the dates, but these kinds of information surveys and publications don’t get updated every year, or every five years. I didn’t look very far to find it, but I imagine we’re only just coming due for something current now. There are a lot of other great anecdotes in the document as well, including a projection that oil sands production would double by 2015. I’m sure there are a lot of factors and variables between then and now. I would estimate that it shakes out about the same or close, though. Personal opinion, based loosely on other relevant environmental statistics I’ve had my head in lately, and given the scale of units we’re looking at.
A little out of date, but not from the AER: [https://open.alberta.ca/dataset/1832cd36-bbeb-4997-ae81-67d3eedfcfe5/resource/18a9d64b-bad8-413a-8c63-77a548ec9d88/download/4888138-2010-facts-about-water-in-alberta-2010-12.pdf](https://open.alberta.ca/dataset/1832cd36-bbeb-4997-ae81-67d3eedfcfe5/resource/18a9d64b-bad8-413a-8c63-77a548ec9d88/download/4888138-2010-facts-about-water-in-alberta-2010-12.pdf) It's water allocations from 2010, not actual usage. 44.3% agriculture 29.6% commercial 11.3% Municipalities 8.5% Industrial (O&G)
The analysis may (and I repeat *may*) be politically bias, but they provide the data so you can look through yourself. The data will be accurate.
They also lied about all of the things that Smith supposedly said. Leftists can't help but lie to spread propaganda.
I’ll take shorter showers the minute the country club has brown grass.
Tax horse owners.
No water and rolling blackouts. Sounds like North Korea.
It’s funny that people still think the UCP care about their opinion. Last May was the last time your opinion ever counted.
She called the industrial use just a sliver. They pump hundreds of thousands of litres down hole and fully contaminate fresh surface water when fracking. They used oil in the past which is much more expensive but some can be reused when you clean up the flow back. Some water may be reused but will not be fresh drinkable water again. I am not against the oil and gas industry, but we are wasting fresh water for the most part, because it is cheap... For now.
Burning oil and gas produces water vapor. The hydrogen in hydrocarbons comes from water that was broken apart by plants and converted to sugars that are more hydrocarbons. Burning fossil fuels releases CO2 and H2O that were taken out of the atmosphere of millions of years.
If we stopped letting companies bottle water here for essentially free, it would solve out drought issues for the summer.
I wasn’t aware our water was being bottled for sale. I bet the companies doing this are big UCP supporters.
Dasani is bottled in Calgary using city tap water.
I had no idea. And for whatever reason, these companies get our water for far less than what it’s worth.
It would be good to know how much of the water bottled here leaves southern AB
It's bottled locally for sale locally. I very much doubt they export it out of the province. Great marketing though. Literally local tap water in a bottle, sold to people that don't and think it's Evian or something...
Oh that's why I hate Dasani water
Oil & Gas mostly operate in different watersheds then the south saskatchewan basin. I dunno why this is so hard for people to understand, the water used in fort mac isn't the same water you drink in calgary. Fracking in fox creek doesn't have any impact on southern alberta. I also find myself scratching my head at the idea that O&G doesn't already have heavy restrictions on when and how much water they're allowed to use.
On top of this some companies ARE looking at storing and reusing water. I have heard of more than one fracking company looking at this.
They do. And energy industry water licence holders also significantly under used their allotments in 2022; their allotment amounts to less than 1% of non-saline water in the province and they used about 20% of that (0.18% of non-saline water available). https://www.aer.ca/protecting-what-matters/holding-industry-accountable/industry-performance/water-use-performance/about-water-use
What about water needed to fight forest fires in northern Alberta?
There is an abundance available, barely any of the allocation in northern watersheds is used.
Most northern Alberta oil operations use what's called brackish water, or water with high sodium content that makes it not usable for farming because it prevents any crops from growing (think salting the earth). So you technically wouldn't be fighting fire with it anyways, because nothing will grow there afterwards. Alberta oil sands have a water reuse mandate where the water used has to be recycled and makeup water has to consist mainly of the brackish water I mentioned and a small amount of fresh water.
I’m trying to imagine what over 200 billion litres of water looks like.
Well an olympic size swimming pool usually holds 2.5 million so...
I've been doing some digging into the top 50 most profitable "Canadian" Oil and Gas corporations. The majority of those 50 "Canadian" companies are owned by American corporations when you look at their shareholders on the TSX and other exchanges.
Went to a water conservation thing put on by the local authority ....business is pretty much exempt. They don't want to harm business
Dont forget to keep your clean car, clean
To be fair, I know of a facility that draws from the south Saskatchewan river and is making provisions for running out of allotted water this summer, and will have to curtail operations. I'm sure many others are in the same boat.
>So please assure us that this time you are actually going to put the interests of Albertans ahead of those of your handlers. Awww hahahahahahahahahaha
So my mom went to high school in another province in the 60’s and she mentioned before that they said Alberta would be a dust bowl one day. I’m not surprised.
I hope that’s not the case but a lot has to do with how governments handle our water supply.
When they get tired of asking people to conserve water all they will to to ensure compliance is jack up the price.
Personally, I'd like to see Marlaina's shower and tap water be hooked up directly to Lake Harper, that leaking tailings pond outside of Fort Mac!!
Fuck the golf courses yo.
This should be on r/leopardsatemyface
Much like with the rolling blackouts this winter I will not be reducing my useage because the people at the top aren't going to
Rest assured we "oilfield" are feeling the pain as you say as well. Water permits being voided daily and I'm hearing of multiple canceled drilling programs. Lots of operations in an attempt to forge ahead are using sewage water as drilling fluid in water based sections.
Thanks for this!
With respect, if you want your opinions to be taken objectively on serious issues, try less virtue-signaling in your approach. I agree with you on this point, but the Marlaina shit is getting old and it's a bad look for the leftist club.
What makes it a bad look, specifically? Please explain how it is virtue signalling?
I can understand wanting solid assurance that our ‘leader’ will do what’s right for the province and the people. It won’t happen though, not sure why anyone has an inkling of faith in her practices. I’m a bit shocked at how many people say they refuse to reduce their water consumption because this place or that agency doesn’t have to. The fact of the matter is, we’re low on our most precious resource and, it’s something we can’t live without. I support the right to protest, but that’s a very irresponsible way to make your point.
https://www.theglobeandmail.com/business/article-alberta-drought-oil-companies/
Interesting article, thanks for sharing the link. Now, since the government is aware of how serious the drought is expected to be in 2024, hopefully they’ll respond in an appropriate manner to ensure what water they use is used properly. Sadly I have little faith that they will and suspect big oil won’t change what they’re already doing, and they’ll have the support of the government they influence.
Oil and gas predominantly shifted to using water from privately owned sources that don’t contribute to collective water use. Don’t get me wrong they will take where they can get it. But oil and gas isn’t stupid. They know the image that creates when taking from a river or stream.
Who do you think we need to save the water for,? This is Alberta, damn it!
Who is Marlaina?
Marlaina Danielle Smith is the premiers full name. Calling her by her first name came about when she was calling for parental consent be obtained if kids wanted to use a different name other than their proper name. Since we don’t actually know if her parents gave consent for her to be called by her middle name, many are calling her Marlaina.
We need permission from her dad, sorry.
What if you need that tax revenue to support critical infrastructure?
What’s best for Albertans should be the primary focus, not catering to UCP supporters. It’s a balancing act that won’t be easy to achieve. We need to ensure our interests are properly being looked after.
"Marlaina, I’m sure even your base would agree that water availability is a must. After all, you can’t grow crops using oil, and you certainly can’t fight forest fires with oil." That 'balancing act' isn't going to be struck following this thought process I can tell you that now. Our current practices in agriculture AND firefighting deeply depend on oil.
Hey OP, I recommend reading through the resources on this not-for-profit webpage about how water is licensed and allocated in Alberta: https://albertawater.com/water-licences-transfers-and-allocation/ This also presents water allocation by sector, and by river flow. > Water allocations in Alberta have grown by seven per cent since 2000, surpassing 9.9 billion cubic metres by 2010. *(i.e., 9,900 billion litres)*. You are grossly misinformed on how water is allocated in Alberta, and where the largest uses are. Edit to add this CBC article with more recent info - though not as well presented to show uses by sector in the different basins. https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/edmonton/in-this-drought-year-alberta-s-water-allocation-is-under-the-microscope-here-s-what-the-data-says-1.7133575
Thanks for the recommended reading, I’ll check it out. I don’t recall commenting on how water is allocated or where the largest uses are, rather I quoted from information obtained from AER which said in 2022 oil & gas used over 200 billion litres of fresh water. Not sure how that means I’m grossly misinformed.
Ok, so Alberta's oil and gas sector used 261 million cubic metres of water. Sounds like a huge number! But that's just 2.66 % of the 9,800 million cubic metres[9,800 million cubic metres](https://www.aer.ca/protecting-what-matters/holding-industry-accountable/industry-performance/water-use-performance/about-water-use) that humans allocated in2022. And this completely ignores the (*very important*) nuances of the geographic differences (much of the oil and gas water use is in the north, while water scarcity is most severe down south), withdrawal type (surface water vs groundwater), and seasonal vs. year-round. And allocation and how our licensing system works is absolutely important if you're worried about restrictions in times of scarcity - or in your words "sharing the pain". Water licences in Alberta work based on "first in time, first in right". In times of scarcity, the oldest licenses (generally irrigation districts and municipalities, in that order) get to continue withdrawing water, while newer users may have to restrict use. Much of oil and gas operates on "temporary diversion licenses", which are the first to get cut. They will absolutely be sharing the pain. It really sounds like you're taking a complex multifaceted issue and turning it into a single-industry problem perpetuated by a single super villain premiere.
I made a similar comment that O&G won’t feel the same restriction of the rest of Alberta and woke a O&G troll who said northern Alberta is not suffering drought and to get my fax straight before I go on a uninformed rant. Not only was my comment benign but the woke troll clearly was triggered and lost all ability to comprehend because I was not ranting.
I’ve had a couple of similar responses today however the positive comments greatly outweigh the negative. We know there are a lot of people who won’t change or see things for how they are. What I don’t understand is that the UCP TBA isn’t the old Conservative Party from years past yet so many Albertans blindly follow whatever they are told, as long as it isn’t NDP or Trudeau. Question for your O&G troll in northern Alberta. While I’m glad they’re not suffering drought, do they have the water resources to deal with what will likely be another bad year for fires? I hope Alberta survives this government, we deserve better.
Our water restrictions in Vancouver start next week. We have them every year. You guys will get through this.
If you all run short, I can give you all you want to drink for nothing.
Good think production is at historic highs.
I know of a golf course that has an old water license allowing them unlimited draw from the bow River. I bet their course will be perfectly green this summer as they're more of a premium course. They have ponds that will fill with rain, but if they is no significant rain, they are maintained by the river.
Are these licenses etched in stone or are they periodically reviewed, do you know? Golf courses must use a tremendous amount of water. If these licenses aren’t periodically reviewed, maybe it’s time they were.
Generally, they’re operated on a “FITFIR” system, or “first in time, first in right”. The oldest are prioritized over newer licenses, and in theory (if at capacity), new ones don’t come available unless old ones are forfeited. They also get passed down, so if a rancher sells his ranch to someone or passes it down to a child, the new owner gets the license with it. There’s no re-application. Even land use can change, to a varying degree, without re-evaluating. A farmer can change crop type, production, etc. to a manner/method that uses more/less water without changing their allocation. It’s a very old system, and honestly… I think we just haven’t ever faced issues like this before. We’ve been lucky to operate well within capacity, even recklessly. The system is now being tested.
The water license for the golf course came with the land that was sold to develop it. I think he told me it was like one of the first licenses, and that's why it's so rare with pretty much no restrictions.
Thanks for sharing this. I hope the system passes the test!
Primarily gray water. At least every rig In my area is hooked up to a pump fed from the local lagoon. That's where they get the water to fill thier dugouts too.
I was basing my comments on the AER report that said over 200 billion litres of fresh water. I was aware that grey water is used extensively by O&G but I found the number in the report to be staggering.
What lagoon contains grey water? Any natural body of water in Alberta would contain freshwater.
Hard for people to understand how much freshwater they are losing when they don’t even know what freshwater or grey water is.
Build a pipeline from BC
Salty!
The oil and gas companies are not using water that Albertans are drinking, unless of course you all wish to drink slough water or water that is not gone through a water treatment plant. If you all want to complain about oil and gas companies using water, stop for 1 minute and think about how much river water runs through our river systems to be forever unusable in the salt water of the oceans.
Yes that weird somehow separate water. Jesus christ.
Straight up it's pointless unless oil companies and other large water consuming enterprises do the same. Why should I have to suffer because some billionaires can't get it through their thick skulls that they consume most of the water due to their industrial and recreational activities.
This has generated a lot of discussion. I’ve learned about various water agreements and don’t fully understand why they apparently can’t be changed. I suspect it’s for political reasons as politicians don’t want to upset the billionaires who help keep them in office. I had more than a few comments about how oil & gas uses gray water and tell me I’m wrong. All I did was quote the AER which, as stated above says oil & gas in 2022 used over 200 billion litres of FRESH water. Thanks for your comment!