Listening to Tom delonge on the Joe rogan podcast and he mentions how these ufo fly and blink in and out in space due to their mechanics folding the fabric in time and space.
Imagine folding a paper several time and running through it. It would appear to us as if it's blinking in and out, but for them it would appear as if they are going straight within their ufo ships.
There's been a lot of recent UFO clips dropping from recordings that show UFO fading in and out during their travels and I believe this to be the phenomenon described appearing in those flight captures.
He got involved due to general curiosity and truth but then became the chosen person to be used as a disinformation propriator to the masses by the deep state in the later stages of his mission.
I mentioned my opinion on him on a comment on this thread, but the thing he says should be taken with a grain of salt.
But of the flight ability of the craft resonates due to it being a detail that is commonly seen and witnessed in actual UFO captures.
Yeah wow that sounds legit. Like they’re just warping around and sometimes it goes through here. Wonder if that means there’s a lot of these aliens. High traffic
Our star is toward the edge of our galaxy. Our galaxy is toward the edge of our cluster of galaxies. Earth may be a convenient way station for intergalactic travelers.
Somebody may own Earth. If someone owned it at the time of the dinosaurs, you have to wonder why they didn't divert the asteroid. You have to wonder if the asteroid was directed toward the planet intentionally to serve some end.
Sometimes I wonder if an advanced reptilian race was doing a project here, and a rival wiped it out and began working on their hairless ape project.
I wouldn’t be too shocked to discover when NHI conclude their experiment, they reset the planet for the next test group. Hopefully, we aren’t near the end of the “monotheistic experiment”
I think this is the second time we have gone hard on an oil tech tree and the first time we have had such a large population. Going by the geological record you can see we have only destroyed the climate once before in human induced climate change in history. Maybe anti gravitics is the most obvious tech tree
Even in these reddit groups there's been a noticeable uptick of UFO sightings but if they can fly without pulposion and have gravity defying technology it isn't unreasonable to consider they can fold fabric of time and space of which gravity is an element of. It would also make sense in an efficiency sense to travel in those ways. Instead of going through point A, B, to get to C you can just skip B all together.
It really isn't obvious, but what ive read is how the mechanism was described. I'm only sharing what I've heard, I'm hardly an expert on it and I don't assume 99% of any persons to be. But do appreciate the correction.
Carl Sagan did a pretty good explanation of 4th dimensional objects on Cosmos way back in the day. It's on Youtube. Basically if we were to see a 4th dimensional object, we would only be able to see the 3 dimensional shadow of the 4th dimensional object.
if you were 2d, a 3d sphere passing through your world would look like a tiny circle that grows and then shrinks and disappears.
so yeah, if a 4d "sphere" passed through our 3d space, we'd see some weird shit that we couldn't explain
I believe there are some misleading things going on more as of current than in the early development of Tom's involvement. In my opinion his earlier statements from the beginning of his involvement was from a place of general curiosity and concern for disclosure of the truth, but was later infiltrated and fed disinformation and used as a vehicle to spread those disinformation knowingly.
However, I do believe that what he speaks of has truth but is marred by apparent counterintelligence spurred on by the likes of Richard Doty, who is a strong counterintelligence agent.
As with anything I would say to take the information that have consistent parallel with different sources, witness and testimony. The more rarely discussed element of his stories may just be the disinformation mixed in with the truth.
The best form of disinformation is the truth mutilated.
Not to mention Christopher Mellon’s involvement. The man is from a family of tycoons/robber barons/oligarchs like the Carnegies and Vanderbilts, an agent of the pentagon and has deep ties with dynastic American elites. The exact type that would want to keep the status quo.
It’s controlled disinformation with assistance from the DoD. Who knows what truths, if any, are coming out of TTSA
I believe that we should pay attention to the flow of money and policies on these things. Because all of these things that play out with all key players being government players or ex-players are all playing a role in the grand theatric to model and influence our perspective, and in turn dwindle down to real policy changes, ammendments, and budget allowances and allocation... all of which we have no real choice in the matter.
It is obvious that in the presidential election landscape that the democratic and republican party is all theatrics, they all play for the same deep state party underlyingly, and when they don't they get Donald trumped or JFK'ed.
I truly believe this is happening the same for this UFO disclosure process.. things are definitely fishy.
It's classic here's the hero, and here's the bad guys narrative that allow us to latch on to and care, but the things happening in the background is so far out our hands and is of no influence of our own. The play is to just give them any plausible reason to pass through self-serving policies right under our nose under the guise of "disclosure".
I think it's written by some closed minded asshole trying to discredit the whole UFO phenomenon, when you can't. You can't discredit something that so many people have experienced. It's ignorant AF.
One of the Ariel school witnesses described one of the NHI appearing and reappearing in a glitch-like manner as it moved away from the craft towards part of the school
These are two recent clips that I can share that pinged this flight pattern.
[ufo 01 ](https://www.reddit.com/r/aliens/comments/15jv73d/caught_a_ufo_in_random_video_footage/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=2)
[ufo 02](https://www.reddit.com/r/aliens/comments/15w9hyn/recent_ufo_post_is_most_likely_fake_hard_cut_in/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=1)
Then it would at the least give credence it was an actual captured UAP and not doctored.
But its common enough occurrence with recent examples that it would be a notable detail to keep In awareness.
But I don't doubt that what you say could possibly be an explanationation.
There are a few statements we can make with certainty, based on the evidence available:
* UAP have been flying around our skies and occasionally crashing at least since 1945 if not for millennia
* The UAP display a knowledge of physics far beyond our own, as they seem to violate the laws as we understand them
* There is a reverse-engineering program to study recovered UAP artifacts
* There has been a government coverup of the phenomena and reverse engineering program since Roswell, if not before
* There are growing factions within government that work for honesty, disclosure, and accountability about this issue while other factions fight to keep the same policy of "deny and discredit" of the past 85 years
Anything else we can't be as certain about. We don't know who they are, where they are from, why they are here, what they want. We don't know if they are extraterrestrials, cryptoterrestrials, time travelers, interdimensionals, etc. We don't know how far black science has gone with the help of this reverse engineering process, though I expect we see technology transition out of black science after about 20 years or so, otherwise what good is it if we can't use it?
The problem, is, the film came first and the dude behind the tv show had nothing to do with it.
It always broke immersion when watching that episode for me.
1. I agree that Roswell was likely a real crash given the testimony. The specifics you list are less clear to me, but plausible in light of the testimony.
2. Plausible, but the specific technologies you list and their path from crashed vehicles to useful technology is unclear to me.
3. Agree if by "above top secret" you mean a criminal conspiracy to misappropriate public funds with no oversight or accountability. This is the reason for the aggressive secrecy, the decades of misdirection, and what the whistleblower's testimony was really about. No one risks prison to avoid exposing the public to "ontological shock." It's about the money and always has been.
4. I think the framing is wrong. I don't think they are exceeding the speed of light as Einstein understood it. I think they are exploiting an aspect of the physical world of which we are currently unaware, the same way a flint-knapping caveman is unaware of electricity or nuclear fusion.
5. We have lots of secrets in the space program, but intergalactic travel is a stretch. We are a primitive cargo cult on a remote island with some crashed vehicles we can't explain or understand. Flying about the universe in said vehicles sounds like the later seasons of Stargate that irretrievably jumped the shark.
6. I have no information on the mechanical details of recovered NHI vehicles and I am curious about your sources.
7. I think this is the same as 4.
Hi
2. The materials were collected and parts were filtered into private industry at the requisite time (ie when they were close to finding it themselves) by the usaf under the watch of colonel corso
3. I meam above top secret as in privy to only members of majestic 12 - let me know if you need further info and i can tell
4. I am going on the basis that einstein had an error in his formula, this was remarked by lockheed skunkworks ceo at the time to a few observers. This is my assumption of what the error is. Superluminal velocity is thrle key. You could also.be right here
5. I think i have stretched it a bit here maybe - but what about mckinnons discovery and threat to deport him. Appears he accessed an inventory relating to ship to ship transfers of personnel
6. I will defer to grusch' comments related to recovery and also to witness testimony from retired usaf officials on greers youtube channel that have admitted such programmes exist
7.yep
It doesnt sound like you have done "fact finding". It sounds like you have gathered a lot of evidence and formed beliefs. Which is fair. What you cant say is you have proof for your beliefs, and those beliefs are not knowledge, they are simply beliefs.
Beliefs based on evidence is not knowledge based on proof.
Look at how you worded your point about Roswell "no ifs, no buts". There are ifs and buts. Whilst you may feel you have compelling evidence, which you may, you do not have proof. Noone has offered proof for any of the beliefs you have. Just evidence, and evidence that is at least contested and not accepted by all.
The weight of credible witness testimony, enough to convict folk in a court of law, is "enough". Im not going to show you evidence because I can't. You know this, so stop posing the question and attempting to shut down discussion. We should as a species become more open minded to the possibility that a) we are not the only ones in the universe and that.b) other more superior forms may have found a way to travel great distances and have overcome time and g force constraints.
"That which can be asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence as well."
Witness testimony is sketchy at best.
I'm open to the possibility that we are not alone in the universe. In fact there is an almost certainty that among the trillions of galaxies in the universe, intelligent life has come about or will come about.
The evidence that they have landed on Earth just hasn't shown up and made itself known to the average person. If intelligent life has visited Earth from other planetary bodies, it is not apparent. We have people telling stories, but no physical manifestations of craft, beings, or extra terrestrial intelligence.
Proof, please.
Show me proof. Not stories. Not tales. Not accounts told and passed down. Proof.
Show me a craft. Show me a body. Show me something besides hearsay.
The last thing i want to do is limit the sharing of useful information. I am more than happy, however, if you choose not to share why you hold your own beliefs given the wild claims you have made as fact; when every reasonable onlooker will agree that they are "a likely possibility" at very best. It is your opinion that these people are credible, this is in dispute by people who make compelling arguments to the contrary.
https://washingtonspectator.org/spaceship-of-fools/
Read that whole article thoroughly, and feel free to come back addressing the points made within.
Thanks, respect! Genuinely looking forward to your thoughts. I found the article to be disillusioning, because almost every claim is backed up with evidence i found compelling/interesting. I would LOVE someone to prove that some of the big claims in it are completely false. For example, the questions raised about Lue Elizondos credentials. Previously I found him to be one of the most believable however I have seen him in interviews say he will not provide proof of his credentials which is sad given that the Pentagon has basically said he exaggerated his role greatly.
Hi again, there is so much information there, that I will have to give a detailed reply here in sections, so lets start with Mussolini, Metallurgy, Auditing of Pentagon and Grusch.
**Mussolini**
‘The pope tipped of the USA to a UFO retrieved by Mussolini’
\-> I watched the full hearing and don’t recall hearing that at all from Grusch - but happy to be corrected.
**TTSA**
As to the validity of TTSA; this is just one organisation, I don’t know its aims, objectives, credibility etc., and I really don’t think its relevant to the points I raised or beliefs if you like, but I will deal with one specific point - that he has ‘alien artifacts’.
**Metallurgy**
What I do know is that some if not all of these came via Linda Moulton Howe through Art Bell, a well known radio host in his time: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q9xDsOkrPRo
The main query on these materials stems from a micron layered combination of bismuth and magnesium/small traces of zinc with alternating layering.
These samples came from one of the craft that crashed at Roswell. You can read more about the sample find here in a four part article: [https://archive.fo/qblRc](https://archive.fo/qblRc)
So does TTSA has the articles ? - certainly Linda sold them on to them. The jury is out as to whether these are of alien origin, but currently it does not seem to be a manufacture arising on earth as it stands. Several highly qualified institutions have examined the material and said the same - who are we to disbelieve that this is something at least, of 'exotic origin'.
Further research I believe has been done on the material in water (if i can find the article i will link) where after some hours or days it began to react with water, causing the water to bubble, but not displacing any mass!
**Auditing**
As to the $22 million ’error’ concerning the UFO funding programme. This is just pure smoke. The pentagon has been decried for failing tax audits year after year, look at this video to see the hostility they react with when questioned about it: [https://www.reddit.com/r/UFOs/comments/15ctujv/re\_pentagon\_and\_its\_failed\_audits\_remember\_when/](https://www.reddit.com/r/UFOs/comments/15ctujv/re_pentagon_and_its_failed_audits_remember_when/)
Senators talk about how the Pentagon has failed year on year here in the full hearing: [https://www.youtube.com/live/SNgoul4vyDM?si=AE\_CHSonWDIPvavR](https://www.youtube.com/live/SNgoul4vyDM?si=AE_CHSonWDIPvavR)
Its common knowledge that they are siphoning money away to secret programmes run by a kabul. Grusch has the names, read further in to see why he couldn't name names directly in the hearing.
**Grusch**
David Grusch has stated he has further information that will be made available when a SCIF is provided. This ‘SCIF’ is a secure unit where classified information can be discussed.
Three weeks on from the hearing, and we still apparently have ‘technical issues’ giving Grusch a platform. You might like to ask, why is he being denied the opportunity to fully whistle blow - surely that is of public interest ?
Could it be that those who run the programme have some friends in the right places to deny him access to detailed leaks?
Now lets deal with the ‘red flags’ referred to by these ‘newspapers’. reference starting with this diatribe:
[https://youtu.be/ASiuVuQ\_5Oo?si=ZgE2EYpZ0LdJDZ2s](https://youtu.be/ASiuVuQ_5Oo?si=ZgE2EYpZ0LdJDZ2s)
From “Truthseekers’, or as I like to call them “TruthAvoiders”. Another juvenile towing the line and he does not know what he does.. anyway…I've gone through some of it...
He starts laugably referring to everybody else but Grusch, and every story apart from the story we are all interested in concerning the whistleblowers!!!! He keeps banging on about Coulthard; yes we know coulthard broke the story, but the real story is Grusch’ testimony and access to the individuals that matter inside the organisation. This is entirely playing the man and not the ball - and puts me in a position where I don’t really want to listen any further.
But, for the sake of balance I continue with his remarks…
‘He says he has documents, but no-one is able to see them..’... sigh.. Please see earlier commentary on Grusch. He needs a SCIF.
He then goes on to say Luiz Elizondo didn’t work for a programme .. that he faked it.. Wait, what ? You mean this Luiz Elizondo: https://www.washingtonpost.com/washington-post-live/2021/06/08/ufos-national-security-with-luis-elizondo-former-director-advanced-aerospace-threat-identification-program-aatip/
Oh, righty then… ‘he was a director of a programme in his imagination’.. Yep, keep popping the pills. You mean this programme” :https://edition.cnn.com/2017/12/16/politics/pentagon-ufo-project/index.html
And the defense publication reviewed grusch’ claims and approved them - so there isn’t anything confidential. It sounds very much like this guy just hasn’t bothered to find the time to sit through the congressional hearing. Many times, Grusch says he has to be careful what he states and will disclose after in a secure setting.
Lets deal direct with a couple of red flags:
‘All the men selling the story are working together to release it together’ . What? Really ? You mean..they are coming to the congressional hearing prepared with information… no, never…
\> He then provides a scathing attack on Ross coulthurt saying he sat on a story since ‘May’... wait,,,you mean he sat on the story so he could release it at a time that carried more weight at the hearing, no, really ? Total idiot.
To be honest, I’m now half way through this diatribe and its a switch off moment.
I will continue the analysis at a later stage. When I've recovered from that youtube video. I mean, i could go on.. but its a bad start; I just wish folk wouldn't fall for the discreditors and read between the lines, look at what is credible, what the sources are, and you will see what is really going on.
You covered very little points in the article. Grusch didnt mention Mussolini or the Vatican but did he has mentioned the Italy crash 1933. Which is undoubtedly the same story. Forget Grusch, im happy to give him the benefit of the doubt for now, but tell me what you think about everything else. Id genuinely love to hear.
Also...
What do you think of Jeremy McGowans articles re Lue Elizondo?
I’ve got 40 years on this. Saw my first and only (as far as I can recall) real alien craft at age 9. It changed me forever. There so much more to this than we find on the Internet. All you say is probably true to some extant. We are on the edge of becoming to know the truth but the way we’ve had the rug pulled from beneath us time and time again, I think something real is going to happen within our lifetimes.
4. You're not breaking the laws of physics if you actually manipulate space time for the drive. see here as an example
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alcubierre\_drive](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alcubierre_drive)
Objects cannot accelerate to the speed of light within normal spacetime; instead, the Alcubierre drive shifts space around an object so that the object would arrive at its destination more quickly than light would in normal space without breaking any physical laws
Also from what I've read in the literature, the entities always bring up gravity manipulation as their underlying tech for interstellar travel.
Theres always a well written article trying to debunk; what i would say is that amongst a group of ten people there are always 2 idiots, 1 complete loony bin and 7 rational.folk.
I tend to go with the rational folk.
For every 7 witness testimonies you may have 3 of the above
Same goes for the articles established that you may refer to - they are attempting to drown out the 70%. Unfortunately for them, if youve done the extensive research on this subject - and by the way i am a voracious analyst in my full time work - you come to only one conclusion. Sh1t happened. Now as to what that sh1t is, is up.for grabs, but for those eho have trawles and matched, there are some common themes that do not go away.
As for the idiot in the comments here (not you btw!) asking me for proof, its just the same tired response from the naysayers. I do ask myself this question, why if they are so not interested in the possibility of et life do they even bother to hang out in these forums.
My opinion on the article is in line with yours. There will be elements of this phenomenon that will be consistent across the globe and for anyone to write that off with the assumption that different sources of people, all ages, all races, all culture, and fields of professions inside and outside the government and military infrastructure were in on the hoax to fool all the world's population from the existent of UAP/ETs is to say more foolish than to write it all off completely due to some self proclaimed lack of existence of hard "proof" but that would be patently false. The proof is out there if you dig enough, people have died for it, and the proof have been suppressed and scrubbed.
This phenomenon is not a hoax and is classified above top secret for a reason there are trillions of dollars on the line to keep all this obfuscated.
People who believe a hoax and propogate it, arent "in on it". Theres an argument to be made that its very possible this is a "stand alone complex" of people like you and me who want to believe, grifters and profiteers, government disinformation agents, intelligence and defence spending lobbyists, mentally ill people and the gullible. We both can name beliefs held by millions that are ridiculous beliefs, it doesnt mean those people are in on a hoax.
You're speaking on a perspective of this which is not the same of what I am speaking of in my example. There are legitimate testimony, experiences, and encounters that these individual have and share that are real and correlate with similar details in the overall phenomenon. Not only withstanding that they are proliferating the idea based on the idea alone lacking any actual first hand experience.
But anything can and will be utilized for personal agenda and profiteering. Theres no argument here, we are on the same page.
But I'd like to think towards an optimistic position of this climate as a whole, there are a groups of people who are searching and finding the truth of all this and are asking and demanding we have transparency on all this. That's why all this is so important for us.
Unicorns exist. When I was 7 my great-grandma told me about a time when she saw one in a forest. And I've read many books about unicorns. No ifs, ands, or buts, unicorns are real and are in our world.
This kind of testimony is the only kind of testimony that I ever see regarding aliens. Second hand, without proof, easily seen through.
...you are exactly the reason that the argument never moves forwards, its witless replies like this.
If you can send me 10 links of credible (note the word 'credible') people that have seen or worked with unicorns let me know. I'll see your ten and raise you ten.
Mug
That's exactly the point. There are no credible people who have seen or worked with aliens. Everyone who comes forward with "proof" is offering secondhand accounts of stories they heard, with NO EVIDENCE.
Ive never suggested this in my opening statements - not once have I referred to meeting aliens in my belief list. Nor have I said I have proof. Do yourself a favour and READ IT PROPERLY.
This is another problem with naysayers, they just dont listen/read!
My statement is not just about meeting aliens. It's about everything to do with aliens, their craft, their technology, and whether or not it has visited Earth.
> Here is where I am on the subject of extra terrestrial life
Extra terrestrial life is synonymous with alien.
> 1. Roswell was real. 3 ufos crashed, 1 live entity survived until. 1952
1 live entity from a ufo -> You don't explicitly say it, but it is heavily implied this is an alien entity.
> 2. Alien tech from this crash has worked its way into our industry
Alien tech. Need I say more? Where's the proof that there was a crash from some being that came from beyond our planet? Show me.
Share with me your ten credible people who have seen or worked with aliens. And share with me their absolute, undeniable PROOF that what they say is factual.
You are still not capable of reading properly - so no point in making an effort with you. Once you've learned to read properly and objectively let me know and we can restart this conversation.
Of course you won't share with me your proof. You can't, because it doesn't exist. Just like I can't share proof that unicorns exist. It's not possible.
I'm sorry, what makes a person 'credible' ?
What qualifications must a person have for you to believe them when they essentially say "everyone else is wrong and this is the way reality is" ?
For something this big, "proof" is not even something that is enough for me. I would need firsthand experience to be fully, 100% sure. Anyone who says otherwise is deluding themselves imo.
it's literally the same as the God argument. And you're the one arguing from a position of blind faith.
I've just had a look at some of your comments in previous threads, its fairly obvious you are a juvenile - look, I respect your opinion, you win, everything I said, just collapses, all that research and all my conclusions. Well done u
bahahaha, that's the best thing I've heard all day.
I'm just a random software developer in a random city.
Yeah yeah yeah, that's just what someone who is part of the cover up would say.
Don't drink the juice brother, the articles on mainstream newsmedia and mainstream media in general purpose is to obfuscate and mislead, and at the least implant plausible deniability. People will have to have discernment and apply their time to research outside sources that are infiltrated and controlled by the power that be. The MSM job is to repaint any reliable witness through discrediting, mislabeling, and unqualifying.
It's a tactic as old as civilizations existentence, consider if the narrative is being written so malaligned on these people risking their life, career, family, and name consistently that they are doing so for a reason more noble than ego.
I do value less the information of people who do have to gain in the form of grifting, but its clear to say that not all people who come forward are grifters.
Absolutely, if you like me (and i think you have) listened to hundreds of credible witness testimony it is clear there is a disinfo campaign to avoid disclosure. This started at roswell, manifested through the cia to maj 12 and still runs to this day under a different guise - however what i do hope is that given the recent congress testimonials that we are starting to see the end of threats to witnesses and their families - if you look at the roswell trail you will see generals on their deathbeds stating the ufo crash was real. But folk shut up shop when the 'men in black' arrived. As funny as that seems.given we have a film.about it, this is exactly how the owners of the tech have ridiculed the believers, partly threatened and for the rest
..nobody would say the men in black arrived following ufo related events.
But they did.
And perhaps they still do
Calling this article lies without debunking the points made within it, is not compelling. Its a cult like way of defending your beliefs. "Outsiders bad"
With out spending time on trying to qualify each point for or against specifically on that article, that wasn't my point to note.
I'm just saying to carry discernment from either side of this, towards the potential grifters, and the counter narrative MSM.
I wouldn't put full faith in one facet of an argument, I'd look in different directions and draw a deduction from there. And the farther you dig can unlock more truth to the situation at large or further prove the real witness or not.
I've looked at this from all angles. Nowhere have I seen anybody sensibly dispute the claims made in that article. Instead, i get cult like responses from people who have already made their minds up.
Sorry, that clckbaity outfit holds zero credibility I see so many tendentious stories there, always a follow the money thing, they need money and guess what you hold the bills, what do you want me to publish?
I havent researched much but the bit about military pilots not being good observers reads like total bullshit.
Especially when they add that not only the pilots are unreliable but also the radar/sensors/optics
It's the military It's the best equipement that is produced
Nice.
1. 'Roswell' was an air force base. It's more likely that a classified balloon with sensors crashed.
To survive for years an 'entity' has to be adapted to Earth's atmosphere, gravity, food and so on. Worlds come in many variations, an "identical" Earth is probably extremely rare.
2. Tech you describe are applications of 19th century science. ICs came from transistors, which came from experiments with light bulbs.
3. Any "UFO" is most likely made of self aware AI nanotech, or even microntech, if that is a word. Impossible to reverse engineer. It's like ecamining an IPhone in the stone age without battery or signal.
4. The things I saw had zero velocity for over 20 minutes in a raging thunderstorm, as if they were locked on fixed coördinates relative to Earth's rotating surface. They were not affected by wind gusts, yet they would be obscured a bit by passing clouds.
5. We don't have money for that. Also, people capable of something remotely close are busy with working on the LHC and actual space programs.
6. Any "UFO" most likely has a ChatGPT-on-steroids interface that can pick up brain waves. No hands needed.
7. Space with time is a brain interpretation/representation of a much deeper base reality.
Since the Universe is very Old, a technological singularity most probably already happened, a very long time ago. Our Universe might be an augmented reality hybrid, a kind of holodeck, fine tuned by and for intelligent life. Maybe you can just spawn a UFO with the proper credentials or prompt...
1. Too many fake stories.
2. Moore's law has been pretty consistent without the need for alien tech.
3. I think the best argument against this theory is the lack of experts in any government related role.
4. Not enough evidence to make any such claims.
5. Same as point 3, top secret with no experts, the best scientific minds on the planet would and should be on this but it's been pointed out that experts are not. As for the theory these experts are on it and are bound by secrecy does not hold water either, as their actual work is visible.
6. Fun idea
7. Fun idea
Would be intresting to see how news of this kind of tech affects the egos of people like Elon Musk who have thought that rockets were the only way to get to space pretty much their whole lives & also don't think aliens exist. They'd probably loose their shit if they found out all this was real.
Well, tesla the man was silenced by jp.morgan when he showed a route to free energy.
No doubt oil will end and we just pay for electricity and we think we have advanced as a civilisation.
When in fact we already have free energy devices that.haven't seen the light of day. And probably wont until they can be monetized effectively.
The question I keep coming back to is: if they're so good at folding space, why are their craft crashing here? I've heard the reasoning that "radar messes up their instruments" but that just doesn't hold water for me.
That the orbits of the planets exist at intersections of the concave and convex arcs which are formed as gravity waves eminating from the sun. When these change, planets are 'cancelled' (asteroid belt). Ask any physicist to describe gravity... see what they say... they all have difficulty absolutely describing what appears to be a fundamental basic force.
https://youtu.be/PE4C7OI7Frg?si=ZjA1AjyBUaNz7kPW
Go to 50:09 where they talk about the 'souece of gravity'
Actually this is a pet 'belief' or at least something i have read and seems quite poetic - orbital rings at distances matched by resonant waves. Explains part of what makes up the universe and why there is plenty of food for thought concerning other theories.
Here are some other thoughts / links you may wish to digest
That we 'have' anti gravity tech:
https://m.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL72C5F1D20D1B676B
That the aether theory is starting to popularise once more as the michelson-morley experiment shows signs of being invalid.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luminiferous_aether#:~:text=Luminiferous%20aether%20or%20ether%20(%22luminiferous,not%20be%20able%20to%20do
If you want witness statement that says our traditional physics taught at schools is denying us access to 'higher up' physics and other models, see the interview with hal puthoff here: https://youtu.be/iQOibpIDx-4?si=-qlV25i6x3zvwGgR
If youd like an alternate to the standard model see here:
https://youtu.be/VsPirA-JqLQ
Secret mcdonnell douglas alien tech programme:
https://youtu.be/thLGknsJ2Qg
Finally, a synopsis
https://www.cs.mcgill.ca/~abatko/interests/conspiracy/mj12/
I seriously doubt in ''We have a secret space programme and we have inter galactic travel. But its locked up in deep black projects.'' We've seen claims of that but I doubt we'd not get some hard evidence of that if this was true. And what about NASA? NASA would serve as some very expensive coverup space program?
Yeh that ones a little tenuous but you can try this for size.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/amp/entry/solar-warden-the-secret-space-program_b_1659192/
I mean, it wouldn't surprise me... who knows how far we have come in reverse engineering.. they seemes keen on mckinnon at one point, why all the fuss?
1. there was no mention of ETs at roswell until years later
2. all of these things have logical iterative technological ancestry, none of them indicate some unexplained huge leap
3. yeah probably
4. what makes you say that?
5. there are probably lots of space projects we don’t know about being worked on by lots of agencies we do know about
6. we don’t know who pilots the craft or if they have hands or minds. the crafts being unmanned drones is probably the most likely answer but who really knows
7. saw someone in another thread talking about how they use a focused point of gravity to travel. no idea if it’s true but sounded interesting
I feel like humans trying to reverse engineer something capable of intergalactic travel would be like neanderthals trying to reverse engineer a smart phone. It would be so beyond our scope of understanding, that it would be impossible.
They don't have intergalactic travel, the us government doesn't have any special technology because they lack the knowledge and know how to reverse engineer advanced alien tech almost like giving a neanderthal a broken smart phone, he wouldn't know what to do with it let alone reverse engineer it. They are probably trying but someone smart enough to figure it out wouldn't work for these people because that someone would most likely understand the consequences of giving too much power to the wrong people.The tech aliens have might be the result of thousands of years of scientific research by more highly intelligent beings so to think some us gov black project is gonna figure it all out in 30 or 50 years is unlikely. Not to mention there are alien races keeping an eye on earth if those criminals get their hands on some form of high tech, those alien races would try to destroy them before they can cause damage, they might be allowed to interfere on earth for that purpose almost like you wouldn't let a child play with something dangerous.
1. Just stories, that turns around American ego
2. Nothing alien about theses techs, they are still the logical progression of human technologies
3. There are plenty of attempts to create such technology, nothing to do with ET. This is also a human dream
4. We don’t know that, maybe they are from here or from another reality
5. Pure sci-fi fantasy
6. We don’t know that
7. It also could be a result of a clever combination of meta materials and simple laws of physics that we didn’t figure out
I have many sources, what I am doing here is not referencing anything, I am showing you my conclusions after all the research what I now believe. And inviting comments, shared interests. For most of these there would be too many sources of info.
I'm still kinda on this fence that the relatively modern stuff (nimitz, Fravor and graves) is really whacky science stuff being experimented on by our hands or another beings.
Same thing with Grusch, like I head the breakout story when he first came forward and had this like "oh, yeah right" reaction. I was a little more puzzled by the hearing, because that's someone under oath saying it's all real basically, but there's just nothing handed out to prove it, so I still remain on the fence. Now I believe in aliens, 100%, but the government telling us about aliens is something I still haven't committed to.
Supposed alien tech, bending spacetime, traveling in and out of dimensions, telepathic controls... In my head I want to believe it's true and so I keep an open mind, but in my skeptical lizard brain, it all seems too "human". Like these are human ideas, science fiction writers have been around for a bit, and between the abduction recounts, surveiling craft and researching from a distance, that's what we do to other beings and ourselves. Who's to say some stupidly advanced intelligent species even bothers with all that hulabaloo?
One of my favorite lines comes from Signs. When Merrill is in the recruiters office and the recruiter says "I know what they're doing, surveiling, not engaging, gathering Intel for the invasion" I know that was a plot device since he calls out exactly what they were doing in the movie and it's meant to make that obvious for the audience since you mainly see it only from the Hess farms perspective.
But that is a perfect example of what I'm saying. A human was able to figure out a whole alien plan because it was what we would do. who's to say these aliens travel in crafts with defined shapes and not just some invisible shield around their bodies controlled through their supposed telepathy? If theyre from another dimension, able to pass dimensions; why are they physically here? (Crashes and retrieval of bodies) Humans travel in crafts with solid bodies that have lights that blink, that's a human thing. Who's to say these aliens have consciousness like we do? They have manufacturing facilities like humans building these ships? A labor class mining raw materiels, scientist creating meta materials, etc ... A bunch of the alien stuff I feel is us projecting many of our tendencies onto beings we have no idea about. We treat our behavior as "universal" in a sense, defining intelligence/consciousness based on our understanding of it. I almost can't think of the words to describe what I'm thinking. Think about it like we consider ourselves intelligent, we're conscious, we're self aware and aware of the world around us, we solve problems, have abstract thought, emotions, morality; this is the spectrum of consciousness we define as intelligent. My main point I'm making here is, what if the spectrum of consciousness is radically different for another being?
But alas, I'm a sucker for the mystery of it all and as I said, I want to believe. So in my curious mind, when it comes to foreign technology that we've recovered from crashes I just don't see us having the ability to back engineer it. Ironically I think we'd probably have the least issue with the material science, since we have an understanding of things at the atomic level, so we MIGHT be able to recreate a specific material, but as for the "motors" and "controls" I don't think our physics is there yet. We might have an idea how it works, but much of my dive into the world of physics and how what we know about physics is applied to the real world, I don't think we're creating or able to take apart and put back together something that's, spacetime warping, transdimensional crossing, "free-energy" producing, even *fast as lightspeed* tech.
We can make things invisible, radar deflecting, super strong, etc... But I've heard quite a few physicists point out those discoveries are from humans. If the real heavy shit is kept behind the veil, then I have a hard time believing someone would be able to leak it. They openly admitted to tapping into everyone's phones, they are well aware of what we're all talking about, especially those in a special access programs.
I really want there to be some crashed alien disc sitting in a hangar at S4, though, that shit really tickles my pickle, especially the idea of recovered bodies. I've only ever heard Roswell was a coverup, never hearing anyone believe the weather balloon story, so I too am in 100% Roswell wasn't what they said it was. I only heard there were bodies recovered, never a living one that lasted until 1952, I always wonder what day to day with a gray at some secret government base would be like. I have optimism its just like Paul. That'd be weirder to me then it being some drone for surveillance, dudes a bro. Like you think they fed it? Gave it yard time, you think it developed a rapport with guards and stuff?
Yeh there are a ton of unknowns here; and we probably entirely do not know what or who we are playing with. However, if I stretch the conclusions a little .. and I've purposely reigned them in, a) there has been contact and b) there was a treaty. A few presidents were in 'the know' eisenhower even was introduced. But its gone black/ private and above top secret and no longer has any administrative control that the public can reach into. Its only these occasional whistleblowers, these truthseekers, that affirm its existence. Lazar has for over 30 years told the same story of back engineering; he has carried people with him, esteemed individuals like george knapp. Are they all in on it ? Is this a massive conspiracy to defraud the population...or is this just folk wanting the public to know we have a programme.
I believe from my research it is the latter. And what we have now is a battle of the titans taking place. Previous defenders of the cosmos such as neil de grasse tyson are now appearing on talk shows to diss the possibility of aliens landing.
This is now the defensive action; for all his smooth talking, tyson is part of the disinfo campaign. Just like brian cox. They are presented front and centre because they hold the view that we have not been visited, and laugh at the possibility. If you want links i can send them.
This is how the world works; those scientists with the 'right view' laughing off alien visitations are presented front and centre to mock the population. This is what we have to change, and we can start with social media.
Every time one of these high profile individuals starts with 'witness testimony is not enough in science' (tysons favourite line) he is slamming down the experiences of all those people worldwide who have seen something.
Quite unbelievable. This is why he gets so much air time. Unsubscribe from his channels, switch off, reduce his influence and we can make progress as a civilization.
Listening to Tom delonge on the Joe rogan podcast and he mentions how these ufo fly and blink in and out in space due to their mechanics folding the fabric in time and space. Imagine folding a paper several time and running through it. It would appear to us as if it's blinking in and out, but for them it would appear as if they are going straight within their ufo ships. There's been a lot of recent UFO clips dropping from recordings that show UFO fading in and out during their travels and I believe this to be the phenomenon described appearing in those flight captures.
Honest question, why has the singer of blink 182 been given so much authority? Is there something I missed?
He is accessible to the masses, and would be a perfect mouthpiece for propaganda being fed to him from government psyop agents.
He got involved due to general curiosity and truth but then became the chosen person to be used as a disinformation propriator to the masses by the deep state in the later stages of his mission. I mentioned my opinion on him on a comment on this thread, but the thing he says should be taken with a grain of salt. But of the flight ability of the craft resonates due to it being a detail that is commonly seen and witnessed in actual UFO captures.
I've been wondering the same thing myself.
Yeah wow that sounds legit. Like they’re just warping around and sometimes it goes through here. Wonder if that means there’s a lot of these aliens. High traffic
Our star is toward the edge of our galaxy. Our galaxy is toward the edge of our cluster of galaxies. Earth may be a convenient way station for intergalactic travelers. Somebody may own Earth. If someone owned it at the time of the dinosaurs, you have to wonder why they didn't divert the asteroid. You have to wonder if the asteroid was directed toward the planet intentionally to serve some end. Sometimes I wonder if an advanced reptilian race was doing a project here, and a rival wiped it out and began working on their hairless ape project.
I wouldn’t be too shocked to discover when NHI conclude their experiment, they reset the planet for the next test group. Hopefully, we aren’t near the end of the “monotheistic experiment”
I think this is the second time we have gone hard on an oil tech tree and the first time we have had such a large population. Going by the geological record you can see we have only destroyed the climate once before in human induced climate change in history. Maybe anti gravitics is the most obvious tech tree
When do you think the first one occurred?
Even in these reddit groups there's been a noticeable uptick of UFO sightings but if they can fly without pulposion and have gravity defying technology it isn't unreasonable to consider they can fold fabric of time and space of which gravity is an element of. It would also make sense in an efficiency sense to travel in those ways. Instead of going through point A, B, to get to C you can just skip B all together.
Its not gravity defying the ships generate its own gravity. Thats Why pilots are not affected by the speed and sharp turns how is that not obvious?
It really isn't obvious, but what ive read is how the mechanism was described. I'm only sharing what I've heard, I'm hardly an expert on it and I don't assume 99% of any persons to be. But do appreciate the correction.
I was once told a 4th dimensional object passing through a 3 dimensional space would appear to blink in and out of existence, as well as change shape.
Carl Sagan did a pretty good explanation of 4th dimensional objects on Cosmos way back in the day. It's on Youtube. Basically if we were to see a 4th dimensional object, we would only be able to see the 3 dimensional shadow of the 4th dimensional object.
if you were 2d, a 3d sphere passing through your world would look like a tiny circle that grows and then shrinks and disappears. so yeah, if a 4d "sphere" passed through our 3d space, we'd see some weird shit that we couldn't explain
What do you think of the accusations of fraud levied at Tom and TTS?
I believe there are some misleading things going on more as of current than in the early development of Tom's involvement. In my opinion his earlier statements from the beginning of his involvement was from a place of general curiosity and concern for disclosure of the truth, but was later infiltrated and fed disinformation and used as a vehicle to spread those disinformation knowingly. However, I do believe that what he speaks of has truth but is marred by apparent counterintelligence spurred on by the likes of Richard Doty, who is a strong counterintelligence agent. As with anything I would say to take the information that have consistent parallel with different sources, witness and testimony. The more rarely discussed element of his stories may just be the disinformation mixed in with the truth. The best form of disinformation is the truth mutilated.
Not to mention Christopher Mellon’s involvement. The man is from a family of tycoons/robber barons/oligarchs like the Carnegies and Vanderbilts, an agent of the pentagon and has deep ties with dynastic American elites. The exact type that would want to keep the status quo. It’s controlled disinformation with assistance from the DoD. Who knows what truths, if any, are coming out of TTSA
Mellon, and Elizondo who are the juggernauts of TTSA, are huge supporters of Grusch.... you're almost there. Keep going
are you saying Grusch is part of the dis-info?
No, the guy who I replied to did.
oh i see. interesting.
I believe that we should pay attention to the flow of money and policies on these things. Because all of these things that play out with all key players being government players or ex-players are all playing a role in the grand theatric to model and influence our perspective, and in turn dwindle down to real policy changes, ammendments, and budget allowances and allocation... all of which we have no real choice in the matter. It is obvious that in the presidential election landscape that the democratic and republican party is all theatrics, they all play for the same deep state party underlyingly, and when they don't they get Donald trumped or JFK'ed. I truly believe this is happening the same for this UFO disclosure process.. things are definitely fishy. It's classic here's the hero, and here's the bad guys narrative that allow us to latch on to and care, but the things happening in the background is so far out our hands and is of no influence of our own. The play is to just give them any plausible reason to pass through self-serving policies right under our nose under the guise of "disclosure".
Interesting perspective, i certainly enjoy listening to him. What do you think of this article? https://washingtonspectator.org/spaceship-of-fools/
Thanks going to study this and come back - somebody else posted same link. Have replied there.
I think it's written by some closed minded asshole trying to discredit the whole UFO phenomenon, when you can't. You can't discredit something that so many people have experienced. It's ignorant AF.
Personally i found it to be very interesting, backed by compelling evidence.
One of the Ariel school witnesses described one of the NHI appearing and reappearing in a glitch-like manner as it moved away from the craft towards part of the school
Ah yes, like the “debunked” MH370 plane…
Which peculiar clips do you have in mind?
These are two recent clips that I can share that pinged this flight pattern. [ufo 01 ](https://www.reddit.com/r/aliens/comments/15jv73d/caught_a_ufo_in_random_video_footage/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=2) [ufo 02](https://www.reddit.com/r/aliens/comments/15w9hyn/recent_ufo_post_is_most_likely_fake_hard_cut_in/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=1)
Isn't it just blinking because the Frames per second of the camera isn't high enough to properly track it's speed lmao
Then it would at the least give credence it was an actual captured UAP and not doctored. But its common enough occurrence with recent examples that it would be a notable detail to keep In awareness. But I don't doubt that what you say could possibly be an explanationation.
There are a few statements we can make with certainty, based on the evidence available: * UAP have been flying around our skies and occasionally crashing at least since 1945 if not for millennia * The UAP display a knowledge of physics far beyond our own, as they seem to violate the laws as we understand them * There is a reverse-engineering program to study recovered UAP artifacts * There has been a government coverup of the phenomena and reverse engineering program since Roswell, if not before * There are growing factions within government that work for honesty, disclosure, and accountability about this issue while other factions fight to keep the same policy of "deny and discredit" of the past 85 years Anything else we can't be as certain about. We don't know who they are, where they are from, why they are here, what they want. We don't know if they are extraterrestrials, cryptoterrestrials, time travelers, interdimensionals, etc. We don't know how far black science has gone with the help of this reverse engineering process, though I expect we see technology transition out of black science after about 20 years or so, otherwise what good is it if we can't use it?
"we have inter galactic travel" No, we don't. Zero evidence for this claim.
You should watch “Wormhole: X-Treme!” It’s so meta.
The problem, is, the film came first and the dude behind the tv show had nothing to do with it. It always broke immersion when watching that episode for me.
It was basically over at that point. I still think Stargate was a controlled leak…
Yeah this is the one that got me. Doesn't make sense to not have this publicly known. Struggle to go to Mars =/= Intergalactic travel capabilities
1. I agree that Roswell was likely a real crash given the testimony. The specifics you list are less clear to me, but plausible in light of the testimony. 2. Plausible, but the specific technologies you list and their path from crashed vehicles to useful technology is unclear to me. 3. Agree if by "above top secret" you mean a criminal conspiracy to misappropriate public funds with no oversight or accountability. This is the reason for the aggressive secrecy, the decades of misdirection, and what the whistleblower's testimony was really about. No one risks prison to avoid exposing the public to "ontological shock." It's about the money and always has been. 4. I think the framing is wrong. I don't think they are exceeding the speed of light as Einstein understood it. I think they are exploiting an aspect of the physical world of which we are currently unaware, the same way a flint-knapping caveman is unaware of electricity or nuclear fusion. 5. We have lots of secrets in the space program, but intergalactic travel is a stretch. We are a primitive cargo cult on a remote island with some crashed vehicles we can't explain or understand. Flying about the universe in said vehicles sounds like the later seasons of Stargate that irretrievably jumped the shark. 6. I have no information on the mechanical details of recovered NHI vehicles and I am curious about your sources. 7. I think this is the same as 4.
Hi 2. The materials were collected and parts were filtered into private industry at the requisite time (ie when they were close to finding it themselves) by the usaf under the watch of colonel corso 3. I meam above top secret as in privy to only members of majestic 12 - let me know if you need further info and i can tell 4. I am going on the basis that einstein had an error in his formula, this was remarked by lockheed skunkworks ceo at the time to a few observers. This is my assumption of what the error is. Superluminal velocity is thrle key. You could also.be right here 5. I think i have stretched it a bit here maybe - but what about mckinnons discovery and threat to deport him. Appears he accessed an inventory relating to ship to ship transfers of personnel 6. I will defer to grusch' comments related to recovery and also to witness testimony from retired usaf officials on greers youtube channel that have admitted such programmes exist 7.yep
It doesnt sound like you have done "fact finding". It sounds like you have gathered a lot of evidence and formed beliefs. Which is fair. What you cant say is you have proof for your beliefs, and those beliefs are not knowledge, they are simply beliefs. Beliefs based on evidence is not knowledge based on proof. Look at how you worded your point about Roswell "no ifs, no buts". There are ifs and buts. Whilst you may feel you have compelling evidence, which you may, you do not have proof. Noone has offered proof for any of the beliefs you have. Just evidence, and evidence that is at least contested and not accepted by all.
The weight of credible witness testimony, enough to convict folk in a court of law, is "enough". Im not going to show you evidence because I can't. You know this, so stop posing the question and attempting to shut down discussion. We should as a species become more open minded to the possibility that a) we are not the only ones in the universe and that.b) other more superior forms may have found a way to travel great distances and have overcome time and g force constraints.
"That which can be asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence as well." Witness testimony is sketchy at best. I'm open to the possibility that we are not alone in the universe. In fact there is an almost certainty that among the trillions of galaxies in the universe, intelligent life has come about or will come about. The evidence that they have landed on Earth just hasn't shown up and made itself known to the average person. If intelligent life has visited Earth from other planetary bodies, it is not apparent. We have people telling stories, but no physical manifestations of craft, beings, or extra terrestrial intelligence.
You and I don't have them but as a species we had many such manifestations they have been recorded through out the ages
Proof, please. Show me proof. Not stories. Not tales. Not accounts told and passed down. Proof. Show me a craft. Show me a body. Show me something besides hearsay.
I think you should look into the power structures in this world and then understand why in it's current state proof is impossible
The last thing i want to do is limit the sharing of useful information. I am more than happy, however, if you choose not to share why you hold your own beliefs given the wild claims you have made as fact; when every reasonable onlooker will agree that they are "a likely possibility" at very best. It is your opinion that these people are credible, this is in dispute by people who make compelling arguments to the contrary. https://washingtonspectator.org/spaceship-of-fools/ Read that whole article thoroughly, and feel free to come back addressing the points made within.
Will do. Given the number of pages and references on each page to youtube videos ..give me some time. But i will come back to you
Thanks, respect! Genuinely looking forward to your thoughts. I found the article to be disillusioning, because almost every claim is backed up with evidence i found compelling/interesting. I would LOVE someone to prove that some of the big claims in it are completely false. For example, the questions raised about Lue Elizondos credentials. Previously I found him to be one of the most believable however I have seen him in interviews say he will not provide proof of his credentials which is sad given that the Pentagon has basically said he exaggerated his role greatly.
Hi again, there is so much information there, that I will have to give a detailed reply here in sections, so lets start with Mussolini, Metallurgy, Auditing of Pentagon and Grusch. **Mussolini** ‘The pope tipped of the USA to a UFO retrieved by Mussolini’ \-> I watched the full hearing and don’t recall hearing that at all from Grusch - but happy to be corrected. **TTSA** As to the validity of TTSA; this is just one organisation, I don’t know its aims, objectives, credibility etc., and I really don’t think its relevant to the points I raised or beliefs if you like, but I will deal with one specific point - that he has ‘alien artifacts’. **Metallurgy** What I do know is that some if not all of these came via Linda Moulton Howe through Art Bell, a well known radio host in his time: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q9xDsOkrPRo The main query on these materials stems from a micron layered combination of bismuth and magnesium/small traces of zinc with alternating layering. These samples came from one of the craft that crashed at Roswell. You can read more about the sample find here in a four part article: [https://archive.fo/qblRc](https://archive.fo/qblRc) So does TTSA has the articles ? - certainly Linda sold them on to them. The jury is out as to whether these are of alien origin, but currently it does not seem to be a manufacture arising on earth as it stands. Several highly qualified institutions have examined the material and said the same - who are we to disbelieve that this is something at least, of 'exotic origin'. Further research I believe has been done on the material in water (if i can find the article i will link) where after some hours or days it began to react with water, causing the water to bubble, but not displacing any mass! **Auditing** As to the $22 million ’error’ concerning the UFO funding programme. This is just pure smoke. The pentagon has been decried for failing tax audits year after year, look at this video to see the hostility they react with when questioned about it: [https://www.reddit.com/r/UFOs/comments/15ctujv/re\_pentagon\_and\_its\_failed\_audits\_remember\_when/](https://www.reddit.com/r/UFOs/comments/15ctujv/re_pentagon_and_its_failed_audits_remember_when/) Senators talk about how the Pentagon has failed year on year here in the full hearing: [https://www.youtube.com/live/SNgoul4vyDM?si=AE\_CHSonWDIPvavR](https://www.youtube.com/live/SNgoul4vyDM?si=AE_CHSonWDIPvavR) Its common knowledge that they are siphoning money away to secret programmes run by a kabul. Grusch has the names, read further in to see why he couldn't name names directly in the hearing. **Grusch** David Grusch has stated he has further information that will be made available when a SCIF is provided. This ‘SCIF’ is a secure unit where classified information can be discussed. Three weeks on from the hearing, and we still apparently have ‘technical issues’ giving Grusch a platform. You might like to ask, why is he being denied the opportunity to fully whistle blow - surely that is of public interest ? Could it be that those who run the programme have some friends in the right places to deny him access to detailed leaks? Now lets deal with the ‘red flags’ referred to by these ‘newspapers’. reference starting with this diatribe: [https://youtu.be/ASiuVuQ\_5Oo?si=ZgE2EYpZ0LdJDZ2s](https://youtu.be/ASiuVuQ_5Oo?si=ZgE2EYpZ0LdJDZ2s) From “Truthseekers’, or as I like to call them “TruthAvoiders”. Another juvenile towing the line and he does not know what he does.. anyway…I've gone through some of it... He starts laugably referring to everybody else but Grusch, and every story apart from the story we are all interested in concerning the whistleblowers!!!! He keeps banging on about Coulthard; yes we know coulthard broke the story, but the real story is Grusch’ testimony and access to the individuals that matter inside the organisation. This is entirely playing the man and not the ball - and puts me in a position where I don’t really want to listen any further. But, for the sake of balance I continue with his remarks… ‘He says he has documents, but no-one is able to see them..’... sigh.. Please see earlier commentary on Grusch. He needs a SCIF. He then goes on to say Luiz Elizondo didn’t work for a programme .. that he faked it.. Wait, what ? You mean this Luiz Elizondo: https://www.washingtonpost.com/washington-post-live/2021/06/08/ufos-national-security-with-luis-elizondo-former-director-advanced-aerospace-threat-identification-program-aatip/ Oh, righty then… ‘he was a director of a programme in his imagination’.. Yep, keep popping the pills. You mean this programme” :https://edition.cnn.com/2017/12/16/politics/pentagon-ufo-project/index.html And the defense publication reviewed grusch’ claims and approved them - so there isn’t anything confidential. It sounds very much like this guy just hasn’t bothered to find the time to sit through the congressional hearing. Many times, Grusch says he has to be careful what he states and will disclose after in a secure setting. Lets deal direct with a couple of red flags: ‘All the men selling the story are working together to release it together’ . What? Really ? You mean..they are coming to the congressional hearing prepared with information… no, never… \> He then provides a scathing attack on Ross coulthurt saying he sat on a story since ‘May’... wait,,,you mean he sat on the story so he could release it at a time that carried more weight at the hearing, no, really ? Total idiot. To be honest, I’m now half way through this diatribe and its a switch off moment. I will continue the analysis at a later stage. When I've recovered from that youtube video. I mean, i could go on.. but its a bad start; I just wish folk wouldn't fall for the discreditors and read between the lines, look at what is credible, what the sources are, and you will see what is really going on.
You covered very little points in the article. Grusch didnt mention Mussolini or the Vatican but did he has mentioned the Italy crash 1933. Which is undoubtedly the same story. Forget Grusch, im happy to give him the benefit of the doubt for now, but tell me what you think about everything else. Id genuinely love to hear. Also... What do you think of Jeremy McGowans articles re Lue Elizondo?
> more open minded to the possibility Why is it that this is always said by someone dead set on a particular conclusion?
Trust me bro, I watched a lot of YouTube.
If only Einstein had had YouTube maybe he wouldn’t have had flaws in his formulas
I’ve got 40 years on this. Saw my first and only (as far as I can recall) real alien craft at age 9. It changed me forever. There so much more to this than we find on the Internet. All you say is probably true to some extant. We are on the edge of becoming to know the truth but the way we’ve had the rug pulled from beneath us time and time again, I think something real is going to happen within our lifetimes.
I do too, the air is getting thick and something is growing ripe, like the gestational period of a pregnancy before birth.
Very descriptive!
flowery language does not make something a fact
No it doesn’t.
Might wanna post that one on your blog.
This sounds like a perfect description of what is being told to us. Sounds amazing and I really wish they would share more with us about the details!
4. You're not breaking the laws of physics if you actually manipulate space time for the drive. see here as an example [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alcubierre\_drive](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alcubierre_drive) Objects cannot accelerate to the speed of light within normal spacetime; instead, the Alcubierre drive shifts space around an object so that the object would arrive at its destination more quickly than light would in normal space without breaking any physical laws Also from what I've read in the literature, the entities always bring up gravity manipulation as their underlying tech for interstellar travel.
Youve spent a long time on this subject. What are your thoughts on this article? https://washingtonspectator.org/spaceship-of-fools/
Theres always a well written article trying to debunk; what i would say is that amongst a group of ten people there are always 2 idiots, 1 complete loony bin and 7 rational.folk. I tend to go with the rational folk. For every 7 witness testimonies you may have 3 of the above Same goes for the articles established that you may refer to - they are attempting to drown out the 70%. Unfortunately for them, if youve done the extensive research on this subject - and by the way i am a voracious analyst in my full time work - you come to only one conclusion. Sh1t happened. Now as to what that sh1t is, is up.for grabs, but for those eho have trawles and matched, there are some common themes that do not go away. As for the idiot in the comments here (not you btw!) asking me for proof, its just the same tired response from the naysayers. I do ask myself this question, why if they are so not interested in the possibility of et life do they even bother to hang out in these forums.
My opinion on the article is in line with yours. There will be elements of this phenomenon that will be consistent across the globe and for anyone to write that off with the assumption that different sources of people, all ages, all races, all culture, and fields of professions inside and outside the government and military infrastructure were in on the hoax to fool all the world's population from the existent of UAP/ETs is to say more foolish than to write it all off completely due to some self proclaimed lack of existence of hard "proof" but that would be patently false. The proof is out there if you dig enough, people have died for it, and the proof have been suppressed and scrubbed. This phenomenon is not a hoax and is classified above top secret for a reason there are trillions of dollars on the line to keep all this obfuscated.
100%. Well said.
People who believe a hoax and propogate it, arent "in on it". Theres an argument to be made that its very possible this is a "stand alone complex" of people like you and me who want to believe, grifters and profiteers, government disinformation agents, intelligence and defence spending lobbyists, mentally ill people and the gullible. We both can name beliefs held by millions that are ridiculous beliefs, it doesnt mean those people are in on a hoax.
You're speaking on a perspective of this which is not the same of what I am speaking of in my example. There are legitimate testimony, experiences, and encounters that these individual have and share that are real and correlate with similar details in the overall phenomenon. Not only withstanding that they are proliferating the idea based on the idea alone lacking any actual first hand experience. But anything can and will be utilized for personal agenda and profiteering. Theres no argument here, we are on the same page. But I'd like to think towards an optimistic position of this climate as a whole, there are a groups of people who are searching and finding the truth of all this and are asking and demanding we have transparency on all this. That's why all this is so important for us.
Unicorns exist. When I was 7 my great-grandma told me about a time when she saw one in a forest. And I've read many books about unicorns. No ifs, ands, or buts, unicorns are real and are in our world. This kind of testimony is the only kind of testimony that I ever see regarding aliens. Second hand, without proof, easily seen through.
...you are exactly the reason that the argument never moves forwards, its witless replies like this. If you can send me 10 links of credible (note the word 'credible') people that have seen or worked with unicorns let me know. I'll see your ten and raise you ten. Mug
That's exactly the point. There are no credible people who have seen or worked with aliens. Everyone who comes forward with "proof" is offering secondhand accounts of stories they heard, with NO EVIDENCE.
Ive never suggested this in my opening statements - not once have I referred to meeting aliens in my belief list. Nor have I said I have proof. Do yourself a favour and READ IT PROPERLY. This is another problem with naysayers, they just dont listen/read!
My statement is not just about meeting aliens. It's about everything to do with aliens, their craft, their technology, and whether or not it has visited Earth. > Here is where I am on the subject of extra terrestrial life Extra terrestrial life is synonymous with alien. > 1. Roswell was real. 3 ufos crashed, 1 live entity survived until. 1952 1 live entity from a ufo -> You don't explicitly say it, but it is heavily implied this is an alien entity. > 2. Alien tech from this crash has worked its way into our industry Alien tech. Need I say more? Where's the proof that there was a crash from some being that came from beyond our planet? Show me.
Share with me your ten credible people who have seen or worked with aliens. And share with me their absolute, undeniable PROOF that what they say is factual.
You are still not capable of reading properly - so no point in making an effort with you. Once you've learned to read properly and objectively let me know and we can restart this conversation.
Of course you won't share with me your proof. You can't, because it doesn't exist. Just like I can't share proof that unicorns exist. It's not possible.
wow you just folded like a cardboard box. what a cowardly, lazy response to a rational argument.
I'm sorry, what makes a person 'credible' ? What qualifications must a person have for you to believe them when they essentially say "everyone else is wrong and this is the way reality is" ? For something this big, "proof" is not even something that is enough for me. I would need firsthand experience to be fully, 100% sure. Anyone who says otherwise is deluding themselves imo. it's literally the same as the God argument. And you're the one arguing from a position of blind faith.
I've just had a look at some of your comments in previous threads, its fairly obvious you are a juvenile - look, I respect your opinion, you win, everything I said, just collapses, all that research and all my conclusions. Well done u
Lol k
You are part of the cover up. Don't try to deny it.
bahahaha, that's the best thing I've heard all day. I'm just a random software developer in a random city. Yeah yeah yeah, that's just what someone who is part of the cover up would say.
For me this article is quite compelling in painting the picture that out of those 10 people, at least 8 of them are not to be believed
Don't drink the juice brother, the articles on mainstream newsmedia and mainstream media in general purpose is to obfuscate and mislead, and at the least implant plausible deniability. People will have to have discernment and apply their time to research outside sources that are infiltrated and controlled by the power that be. The MSM job is to repaint any reliable witness through discrediting, mislabeling, and unqualifying. It's a tactic as old as civilizations existentence, consider if the narrative is being written so malaligned on these people risking their life, career, family, and name consistently that they are doing so for a reason more noble than ego. I do value less the information of people who do have to gain in the form of grifting, but its clear to say that not all people who come forward are grifters.
Absolutely, if you like me (and i think you have) listened to hundreds of credible witness testimony it is clear there is a disinfo campaign to avoid disclosure. This started at roswell, manifested through the cia to maj 12 and still runs to this day under a different guise - however what i do hope is that given the recent congress testimonials that we are starting to see the end of threats to witnesses and their families - if you look at the roswell trail you will see generals on their deathbeds stating the ufo crash was real. But folk shut up shop when the 'men in black' arrived. As funny as that seems.given we have a film.about it, this is exactly how the owners of the tech have ridiculed the believers, partly threatened and for the rest ..nobody would say the men in black arrived following ufo related events. But they did. And perhaps they still do
Calling this article lies without debunking the points made within it, is not compelling. Its a cult like way of defending your beliefs. "Outsiders bad"
With out spending time on trying to qualify each point for or against specifically on that article, that wasn't my point to note. I'm just saying to carry discernment from either side of this, towards the potential grifters, and the counter narrative MSM. I wouldn't put full faith in one facet of an argument, I'd look in different directions and draw a deduction from there. And the farther you dig can unlock more truth to the situation at large or further prove the real witness or not.
I've looked at this from all angles. Nowhere have I seen anybody sensibly dispute the claims made in that article. Instead, i get cult like responses from people who have already made their minds up.
i want proof precisely BECAUSE i am so interested in the possibility of et life. Have yet to see any.
Sorry, that clckbaity outfit holds zero credibility I see so many tendentious stories there, always a follow the money thing, they need money and guess what you hold the bills, what do you want me to publish?
Attacking the outlet rather than addressing the points does not look good and definitely is not a way to convince any rational skeptic.
I havent researched much but the bit about military pilots not being good observers reads like total bullshit. Especially when they add that not only the pilots are unreliable but also the radar/sensors/optics It's the military It's the best equipement that is produced
Check this out. https://thedebrief.org/researchers-manipulating-time-cause-first-ever-successful-photon-collisions/
Great link. Thanks. Yes some of this tech is just hidden in plain sight...like the ufos 🤣
Nice. 1. 'Roswell' was an air force base. It's more likely that a classified balloon with sensors crashed. To survive for years an 'entity' has to be adapted to Earth's atmosphere, gravity, food and so on. Worlds come in many variations, an "identical" Earth is probably extremely rare. 2. Tech you describe are applications of 19th century science. ICs came from transistors, which came from experiments with light bulbs. 3. Any "UFO" is most likely made of self aware AI nanotech, or even microntech, if that is a word. Impossible to reverse engineer. It's like ecamining an IPhone in the stone age without battery or signal. 4. The things I saw had zero velocity for over 20 minutes in a raging thunderstorm, as if they were locked on fixed coördinates relative to Earth's rotating surface. They were not affected by wind gusts, yet they would be obscured a bit by passing clouds. 5. We don't have money for that. Also, people capable of something remotely close are busy with working on the LHC and actual space programs. 6. Any "UFO" most likely has a ChatGPT-on-steroids interface that can pick up brain waves. No hands needed. 7. Space with time is a brain interpretation/representation of a much deeper base reality. Since the Universe is very Old, a technological singularity most probably already happened, a very long time ago. Our Universe might be an augmented reality hybrid, a kind of holodeck, fine tuned by and for intelligent life. Maybe you can just spawn a UFO with the proper credentials or prompt...
1. Too many fake stories. 2. Moore's law has been pretty consistent without the need for alien tech. 3. I think the best argument against this theory is the lack of experts in any government related role. 4. Not enough evidence to make any such claims. 5. Same as point 3, top secret with no experts, the best scientific minds on the planet would and should be on this but it's been pointed out that experts are not. As for the theory these experts are on it and are bound by secrecy does not hold water either, as their actual work is visible. 6. Fun idea 7. Fun idea
Totally agree with you! Wish it would all come out.
Always trust your instincts, somehow they already know the truth.
The theory behind superluminal travel won't break Einstein's theory anymore than his theory broke Newtons.
Would be intresting to see how news of this kind of tech affects the egos of people like Elon Musk who have thought that rockets were the only way to get to space pretty much their whole lives & also don't think aliens exist. They'd probably loose their shit if they found out all this was real.
Well, tesla the man was silenced by jp.morgan when he showed a route to free energy. No doubt oil will end and we just pay for electricity and we think we have advanced as a civilisation. When in fact we already have free energy devices that.haven't seen the light of day. And probably wont until they can be monetized effectively.
The question I keep coming back to is: if they're so good at folding space, why are their craft crashing here? I've heard the reasoning that "radar messes up their instruments" but that just doesn't hold water for me.
I like the idea that they are unmanned drones monitoring us for hundreds or thousands of years and eventually break down.
What else do you know. Curious.
That the orbits of the planets exist at intersections of the concave and convex arcs which are formed as gravity waves eminating from the sun. When these change, planets are 'cancelled' (asteroid belt). Ask any physicist to describe gravity... see what they say... they all have difficulty absolutely describing what appears to be a fundamental basic force. https://youtu.be/PE4C7OI7Frg?si=ZjA1AjyBUaNz7kPW Go to 50:09 where they talk about the 'souece of gravity' Actually this is a pet 'belief' or at least something i have read and seems quite poetic - orbital rings at distances matched by resonant waves. Explains part of what makes up the universe and why there is plenty of food for thought concerning other theories. Here are some other thoughts / links you may wish to digest That we 'have' anti gravity tech: https://m.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL72C5F1D20D1B676B That the aether theory is starting to popularise once more as the michelson-morley experiment shows signs of being invalid. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luminiferous_aether#:~:text=Luminiferous%20aether%20or%20ether%20(%22luminiferous,not%20be%20able%20to%20do If you want witness statement that says our traditional physics taught at schools is denying us access to 'higher up' physics and other models, see the interview with hal puthoff here: https://youtu.be/iQOibpIDx-4?si=-qlV25i6x3zvwGgR If youd like an alternate to the standard model see here: https://youtu.be/VsPirA-JqLQ Secret mcdonnell douglas alien tech programme: https://youtu.be/thLGknsJ2Qg Finally, a synopsis https://www.cs.mcgill.ca/~abatko/interests/conspiracy/mj12/
Awesome!! Thank you, I will definitely read through this. Especially in regards to gravity, I feel like there is a stone that has not been turned yet.
I seriously doubt in ''We have a secret space programme and we have inter galactic travel. But its locked up in deep black projects.'' We've seen claims of that but I doubt we'd not get some hard evidence of that if this was true. And what about NASA? NASA would serve as some very expensive coverup space program?
Yeh that ones a little tenuous but you can try this for size. https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/amp/entry/solar-warden-the-secret-space-program_b_1659192/ I mean, it wouldn't surprise me... who knows how far we have come in reverse engineering.. they seemes keen on mckinnon at one point, why all the fuss?
You're 100% spot on. Also 2) fiber optics and probably LEDs also.
1. there was no mention of ETs at roswell until years later 2. all of these things have logical iterative technological ancestry, none of them indicate some unexplained huge leap 3. yeah probably 4. what makes you say that? 5. there are probably lots of space projects we don’t know about being worked on by lots of agencies we do know about 6. we don’t know who pilots the craft or if they have hands or minds. the crafts being unmanned drones is probably the most likely answer but who really knows 7. saw someone in another thread talking about how they use a focused point of gravity to travel. no idea if it’s true but sounded interesting
What do NHI look like? Any verifiable photos?
I feel like humans trying to reverse engineer something capable of intergalactic travel would be like neanderthals trying to reverse engineer a smart phone. It would be so beyond our scope of understanding, that it would be impossible.
I want to believe. How did they give us integrated circuits?
Debunked has debunked aliens real Thank u op
RE: #5. Just out of curiosity, are you a Stargate SG-1 fan?
IPad bro
They don't have intergalactic travel, the us government doesn't have any special technology because they lack the knowledge and know how to reverse engineer advanced alien tech almost like giving a neanderthal a broken smart phone, he wouldn't know what to do with it let alone reverse engineer it. They are probably trying but someone smart enough to figure it out wouldn't work for these people because that someone would most likely understand the consequences of giving too much power to the wrong people.The tech aliens have might be the result of thousands of years of scientific research by more highly intelligent beings so to think some us gov black project is gonna figure it all out in 30 or 50 years is unlikely. Not to mention there are alien races keeping an eye on earth if those criminals get their hands on some form of high tech, those alien races would try to destroy them before they can cause damage, they might be allowed to interfere on earth for that purpose almost like you wouldn't let a child play with something dangerous.
1. Just stories, that turns around American ego 2. Nothing alien about theses techs, they are still the logical progression of human technologies 3. There are plenty of attempts to create such technology, nothing to do with ET. This is also a human dream 4. We don’t know that, maybe they are from here or from another reality 5. Pure sci-fi fantasy 6. We don’t know that 7. It also could be a result of a clever combination of meta materials and simple laws of physics that we didn’t figure out
I say where are your sources for any of these points ?
I have many sources, what I am doing here is not referencing anything, I am showing you my conclusions after all the research what I now believe. And inviting comments, shared interests. For most of these there would be too many sources of info.
Gotcha , appreciate it!
Intresting
I'm still kinda on this fence that the relatively modern stuff (nimitz, Fravor and graves) is really whacky science stuff being experimented on by our hands or another beings. Same thing with Grusch, like I head the breakout story when he first came forward and had this like "oh, yeah right" reaction. I was a little more puzzled by the hearing, because that's someone under oath saying it's all real basically, but there's just nothing handed out to prove it, so I still remain on the fence. Now I believe in aliens, 100%, but the government telling us about aliens is something I still haven't committed to. Supposed alien tech, bending spacetime, traveling in and out of dimensions, telepathic controls... In my head I want to believe it's true and so I keep an open mind, but in my skeptical lizard brain, it all seems too "human". Like these are human ideas, science fiction writers have been around for a bit, and between the abduction recounts, surveiling craft and researching from a distance, that's what we do to other beings and ourselves. Who's to say some stupidly advanced intelligent species even bothers with all that hulabaloo? One of my favorite lines comes from Signs. When Merrill is in the recruiters office and the recruiter says "I know what they're doing, surveiling, not engaging, gathering Intel for the invasion" I know that was a plot device since he calls out exactly what they were doing in the movie and it's meant to make that obvious for the audience since you mainly see it only from the Hess farms perspective. But that is a perfect example of what I'm saying. A human was able to figure out a whole alien plan because it was what we would do. who's to say these aliens travel in crafts with defined shapes and not just some invisible shield around their bodies controlled through their supposed telepathy? If theyre from another dimension, able to pass dimensions; why are they physically here? (Crashes and retrieval of bodies) Humans travel in crafts with solid bodies that have lights that blink, that's a human thing. Who's to say these aliens have consciousness like we do? They have manufacturing facilities like humans building these ships? A labor class mining raw materiels, scientist creating meta materials, etc ... A bunch of the alien stuff I feel is us projecting many of our tendencies onto beings we have no idea about. We treat our behavior as "universal" in a sense, defining intelligence/consciousness based on our understanding of it. I almost can't think of the words to describe what I'm thinking. Think about it like we consider ourselves intelligent, we're conscious, we're self aware and aware of the world around us, we solve problems, have abstract thought, emotions, morality; this is the spectrum of consciousness we define as intelligent. My main point I'm making here is, what if the spectrum of consciousness is radically different for another being? But alas, I'm a sucker for the mystery of it all and as I said, I want to believe. So in my curious mind, when it comes to foreign technology that we've recovered from crashes I just don't see us having the ability to back engineer it. Ironically I think we'd probably have the least issue with the material science, since we have an understanding of things at the atomic level, so we MIGHT be able to recreate a specific material, but as for the "motors" and "controls" I don't think our physics is there yet. We might have an idea how it works, but much of my dive into the world of physics and how what we know about physics is applied to the real world, I don't think we're creating or able to take apart and put back together something that's, spacetime warping, transdimensional crossing, "free-energy" producing, even *fast as lightspeed* tech. We can make things invisible, radar deflecting, super strong, etc... But I've heard quite a few physicists point out those discoveries are from humans. If the real heavy shit is kept behind the veil, then I have a hard time believing someone would be able to leak it. They openly admitted to tapping into everyone's phones, they are well aware of what we're all talking about, especially those in a special access programs. I really want there to be some crashed alien disc sitting in a hangar at S4, though, that shit really tickles my pickle, especially the idea of recovered bodies. I've only ever heard Roswell was a coverup, never hearing anyone believe the weather balloon story, so I too am in 100% Roswell wasn't what they said it was. I only heard there were bodies recovered, never a living one that lasted until 1952, I always wonder what day to day with a gray at some secret government base would be like. I have optimism its just like Paul. That'd be weirder to me then it being some drone for surveillance, dudes a bro. Like you think they fed it? Gave it yard time, you think it developed a rapport with guards and stuff?
Yeh there are a ton of unknowns here; and we probably entirely do not know what or who we are playing with. However, if I stretch the conclusions a little .. and I've purposely reigned them in, a) there has been contact and b) there was a treaty. A few presidents were in 'the know' eisenhower even was introduced. But its gone black/ private and above top secret and no longer has any administrative control that the public can reach into. Its only these occasional whistleblowers, these truthseekers, that affirm its existence. Lazar has for over 30 years told the same story of back engineering; he has carried people with him, esteemed individuals like george knapp. Are they all in on it ? Is this a massive conspiracy to defraud the population...or is this just folk wanting the public to know we have a programme. I believe from my research it is the latter. And what we have now is a battle of the titans taking place. Previous defenders of the cosmos such as neil de grasse tyson are now appearing on talk shows to diss the possibility of aliens landing. This is now the defensive action; for all his smooth talking, tyson is part of the disinfo campaign. Just like brian cox. They are presented front and centre because they hold the view that we have not been visited, and laugh at the possibility. If you want links i can send them. This is how the world works; those scientists with the 'right view' laughing off alien visitations are presented front and centre to mock the population. This is what we have to change, and we can start with social media. Every time one of these high profile individuals starts with 'witness testimony is not enough in science' (tysons favourite line) he is slamming down the experiences of all those people worldwide who have seen something. Quite unbelievable. This is why he gets so much air time. Unsubscribe from his channels, switch off, reduce his influence and we can make progress as a civilization.
Pretty good assessment