The timing of 9 months age versus 2 days ago will make the texts laughable as a reason in court. Jurors aren't idiots, and lawyers know this. It's wrongful termination.
Yep. But if they want to go down this road OP need to scorch the earth.
I would go to the local police station and file a police report for assault. The teacher can explain their actions to the judge during sentencing or parole hearing.
Then I would find an employment litigation attorney and schedule a consult. The attorney should be admitted to practice in federal court and be well versed in EEOC laws. The school appears to be guilty of retaliation in this instance and if this is the case that ladies and gents is a violation of federal laws.
FAFO. š¤·š»āāļø
Iāll make it easy for everyone.. OP is full of shit.
65 days ago:
>I wake up and apply for 10 jobs a day. I adapt my resume and cover letter to every job. It takes me on average 3 hrs a day. I'm done by 8 a.m. I then either go to a daily work agency, accept a sub teacher job or donate plasma getting on average 100 dollars a day from those methodsā¦.I have been unemployed for 334 days.
https://www.reddit.com/r/antiwork/s/vPdXRWQpsH
51 days ago:
> My son is non verbal and was diagnosed a 2 but I'm suspicious of the diagnosis process. It's literally 3 hrs of playing with toys.
https://www.reddit.com/r/Autism_Parenting/s/pR4QnWozC0
But theyāre now an ABA āspecialist?ā
No.. they were subbing for a school, thought that because they have an autistic child, they were āneededā to intervene so they stepped in a situation they werenāt asked to; hence the initial unexplained assault and why none of this makes sense.
Notice how they were never asked to step in.. but rather they āadvisedā an overwhelmed teacher not to do something.
On top of this, never resign from a job. Ā You will not be eligible for unemployment benefits if you resign, which is why they are askingĀ you to do so. Ā
The teacher should most definitely lose their job. They hit a coworker in front of behaviorally challenged kids. She's effectively teaching them that hitting is an acceptable way to handle things.
Also if the teacher almost instinctively reacted this way to a fellow adult I can about guarantee that teacher is hitting those kids. Special needs kids being physically abused by teachers is painfully common. Corporal punishment never left education, it just moved to the kids who either can't or won't tell about it.
I can confirm. I was physically abused by teachers until I was in grade twelve. Never told people because Iāve always slipped through the cracks. Nobody actually cared about ME during my time in school they just cared about me passing.
If a teacher was to react like that to a grow ass human then without a shadow of a doubt I know that this teacher is abusing the kids.
Keep in mind, most lawyers arenāt labor lawyers and are usually in a position of management or being the lawyer for management. Iām banned from commenting on legal advice for āanecdotal commentsā when I was explaining how to address wage theft and used an example of how it played out for someone I know who was successful.
Lawyers tend to be far more aligned with the capitalist class, with obvious exceptions. Iāve also noticed that legal subs tend to view workers issues as civil contract disputes, not legal ones. Folks here have a class solidarity to support other workers that lawyers often lack. Even if a lawyer isnāt an owner or a manger they tend to serve them and Marx would call them petite bourgeoisie.
Lawyers aren't even good, generally. They fill a seat.
I've gotten so many interpretations of FL's sunshine law from the same attorneys repeatedly over and over... It's incredibly frustrating.
They'll say one thing about a 501c3 structure one day and the opposite the next. Like I have them recorded and ask for the reason and they essentially just shrug.
You can't even rely on their advice. Typically you have to bring them research and allow them to give merit to that...
But you're spot on, typically they're in place to protect corruption and assets, not to assist in dispensing justice.
Yes. Just call the police and report an assault. Don't bother with your boss etc. As a potential bonus, If the perp is convicted of assault most likely, he won't be able to work with kids again.
Also, file a report with the school board (or teachers union if there is one), rather than just your school about the child being neglected when you are absent and let his or her parents know. I have an autistic son and while he doesnāt need bathroom help anymore at school, Iād be livid if I found out they werenāt cleaning him up when needed.
You were not hit. You were assaulted.
Contact law enforcement and press charges.
Them attempting to get you to leave and say nothing is obstruction of justice.
Find an employment lawyer.
Also, you were assaulted by a violent teacher, and a mandatory reporter was notified.
If that teacher was not pulled from the classroom there may be further liability.
You have witnesses to the assault. Iād be reporting it to the authorities asap. Looks like work isnāt going to do anything, so take it above their heads and create a record
Having worked in schools for many years, call the district HR team or Assistant Superintendent. If they do not take it seriously, talk to a school board member. Those folks are elected and cannot handle bad press.
Iāve reported teachers in aut rooms for horrible behavior. Theyāre still there and the people reporting them (including me) get slapped on the wrist for not following the chain of command. Like, you did nothing so we went above you.
This is lawyer territory.
They fired you instead of her because they thought it was the easier route. Maybe they thought you would not fight back, or maybe they saw you as a possible source of further trouble. Showing them your daily log, especially if you recorded possible issues like the neglect you mentioned, probably did more harm than good.
Only a lawyer can tell you if you have a case or if you should just accept this. I would seek a consultation, especially if this incident can possibly affect your future employment prospects.
Odds on the worker has threats against everyone.
Anyone striking a colleague at work needs to go. The fact they arenāt has greater underlying inferences. Speak to a lawyer and additionally ask about any mandatory reporting to can do to any local care inspectorates. Odds on children are also being hit, when out of sight.
This is so true. I was shoved by a coworker back in like 2015, a coworker who had been transferred to 5 different locations for this company in 7 years because they were so difficult to work with. I immediately called my store manager, it was a retail optometry place similar to LensCrafters (it was 100% not LensCrafters just using them for example) and they transferred her to another location for about 2 months and then when they took a revenue hit (she was a snake oil salesman and pushed the most $$ stuff on ppl even if they didnāt need it) they transferred her back and told me they couldnāt 100% substantiate my side of things because it wasnāt on camera and the only other employee there had not been paying attention when it happened. I quit shortly after and wish I had pursued it more.
No genuinely ā Iāll trust a spec ed teacher over an ABA practitioner every damn time. ABA is licensed child abuse and anyone pretending otherwise doesnāt know what ABA is or would just rather be a bigot.
You have witnesses, press criminal charges. You have nothing to lose at this point.
Point out to your employer (through a lawyer) that this is clearly retaliation from the teacher, and as the original attack has not been dealt with you will be going to the police about the assault.
While that is an option I would prefer the payday over personal retribution. No harm in speaking to the lawyer first to tell you the best way to do so since you're going to talk to them anyways.Ā
Neglect would be reported to a different agency, not the police, they won't do shit about it. And as OP would be a mandated reporter the lawyer will also advise them to do so as they are compelled by law to report it, and now that it's clear that the employer is doing nothing about it you go through the proper channels.
FYI, it might not be wise to trust an ABA practitionerās assessment of what is or isnāt child abuse. They work in forced conversion therapy. ABA is abusive itself.
The police report is a record, for the lawyer they need to get. OP should have reported the assault to law enforcement immediately. I donāt understand why they didnāt.
I agree with that, but now that they haven't that's why you want to talk to the lawyer first. It's possible that it could also be interpreted as retaliation now that it's been a time and an accusation from that person was made. If it was made before that point there would be less issue.Ā
There's no harm in waiting another day or so before reporting at this point to speak to a lawyer and have them advise you on how to proceed. Thru all have much better insight than any random internet people on what steps are best.Ā
An attorney is 100% going to have them file IMMEDIATELY. Without question. Jury's will understand the OP's grace in not filing right away. Violence 100% can not be promoted under any circumstances. There are zero acceptable excuses for hurting someone physically. It is human nature to hit when verbally frustrated. It is also human nature to rape, but there is this thing called modern society..
It's so wild that OP wrote a book about a simple assault and not once was calling the cops and having them earn their similarly doled out tax dollars mentioned. I realize the cops in 'murika are lazy and useless at best case but why does no one ever think of crime == call the cops
You should absolutely consult with an employment attorney. Your employer *may* have a point about the text (although given the context it seems innocent to me), but your coworker *definitely* assaulted you, *plus* (if I'm understanding you correctly) she was/is neglecting the children under her care (and what if she is assaulting them, too?).
Yes, sending memes with sexual overtones to a coworker is sexual harassment. Of course they are getting rid of you because you stirred up some shit about neglect.
You may want to consult an employment lawyer to see if you have a good case, probably would be stronger if you still have access to the group chat and can show that others sent similar content and weren't terminated.
Behaviorists are Mandated reporters. They have to report. I think the teacher is being protected because of how hard it is to find sped teachers these days.
You don't understand how mandatory reporter duties work do you?
any observed neglect or abuse is the provider's responsibility to report and therefore, their issue.
FYI, it might not be wise to trust an ABA practitionerās assessment of what is or isnāt child abuse. They work in forced conversion therapy. ABA is abusive itself.
Glad someone said this! Being hit by a coworker is INSANELY inappropriate regardless of the job but I definitely felt a little weird scrolling through and not seeing anything about how the entire concept of ABA is abusive to childrenā¦
Why would a legally sanctioned abuser admit to abusing autistic kids? ABA is torture. They know, they'd just prefer autistic people pretend they're not autistic.
Literally though, the whole idea behind it from what I understand (I am neither a psychologist nor an autistic person but have a few friends who are both and have learned a lot from them) the whole point of ABA is to teach a child to pretend not to be autistic. Thatās it. Not to help them cope with strong emotions, advocate for their needs or navigate systems built against them or anything actually USEFUL for neurodivergent and/or disabled folks.
And I really hate the narrative OP is pushing in the edits that say she isnāt responsible because she isnāt specialized in ABA and didnāt intend this to be her career etc. Idk I know we all do what we have to do to survive when it comes to getting a paycheck but straight up abusing kids (or at the VERY least directly contributing to a system that does) is crossing a line imo.
I really hate the narrative that ABA is conversion therapy or teaching a kid not to be autistic. I work with a kid who literally spoke in 1 word utterances, was frequently upset to the point of multiple tantrums and melt downs daily, and was having next to none of his needs met from anyone. Since we started together 6 months ago, heās come so far - he can ask for what he needs, he can tell people around him how he feels, he can stand up from himself and tell people when he doesnāt like something, etc.
And Iāve never forced him to do a single thing. Our sessions mostly consist of me giving af. I follow his lead, I take an actual interest in what heās into, I run my mouth about whatever he is into to model communication. We literally play and watch videos (that he likes) and talk to each other. Heās always excited to see me and gets sad whenever a session is cancelled if either of us is sick. Helping this kidās life get a little easier is the highlight of my day. (Notice how I said helping his life, not the life of others around him)
I hear stories about his school, I see the videos they send to his parents where they arenāt doing anything to help him through anything at school, just berate him and attempt to use shame to get him to comply with them. It makes me sick. Those are his teachers who are with him most of the day. (I work with him in his home) Iāve seen videos of him being strapped to his school bus seat. It is sickening. Aside from his parents, Iām the only one advocating for this kid and to be quite honest only one parent is involved and willing to meet the kid where heās at.
It is so terrible to villainize and entire occupation, because individuals are all different. Iāve met some AVA practitioners who suck, and Iāve met some teachers who suck, some parents who suck, some doctors who suck, etc. That doesnāt mean that there arenāt some people who are amazing, compassionate, kind, ethical people in all of these fields.
As an aba therapist, i teach my kids to say what they feel. I teach them to pee in the toilet. I teach them to ask for a break instead of self harming. I do not care if they stim. I do not care how they play, as long as no one is getting hurt.
ABA is not what it was 15-20 years ago. Horrible shit happened then, and most of us were receptive to that and want to change. A lot of us, like myself, are autistic.
It's not torture. There's not a single clinic I've worked at where their goal was to make the child appear less autistic. It sucks to see that people still think ABA is still what it was in the 60s.
Yes, this. Clients I work with have been able to learn skills to help them become more independent. I've helped clients learn to go to the bathroom in the toilet at 9 years old, to wash hands, make sandwiches, go on walks with family, brush teeth, tolerate waiting longer durations, learn deep breathing and mindfulness activities/coping skills, and so much more. I'm so heartbroken that so many people say ABA is abuse. It's preventing so many people from getting help to make socially significant changes to their lives.
ABA has come so far. It's not just about compliance like it once was.
I straight up dont teach compliance. Im not there to create compliant kids. Im there to help them learn how to communicate without hurting themselves or anyone else. And that's literally it. Compliance never has been a target behavior that I've addressed, except for stuff like crossing the street.
This is false information. The whole point of ABA has absolutely nothing to do with trying to āteach a child not to be autistic.ā ABA when working with autistic leole is typically teaching them communication skills, functional living skills, self-regulation, being able to tolerate hard things that naturally occur in life (that is out of no oneās control - like changes to a schedule/daily routine), how to advocate for their own wants and needsā¦. You guys are misinformed and reading an article about lovaas from however long ago isnāt what the field is nowadays.
Youāre wrong about the existence of ethical ABA.
You donāt need to be forced to act like others want you to. We should all expect & be expected to meet each other in the middle. Weāre not wrong for existing as who we are. The people who refuse to let us (harmlessly) be ourselves are the problem ā they are wrong and they are asshole bigots. If you want to build skills (and work towards liberation), ABA is not the way.
I work in ABA and as an autistic individual I would *never* do anything that would hurt kids and I def donāt seek to change who they are or āforce them to act like othersā. Iām huge about meeting my clients where they are and functional communication is the one of our biggest goals. Sure it would be nice if neurotypical people could meet in the middle but they really donāt seem to want to do that do they? So why wouldnāt I want to try to help give these kids the tools they need to hopefully function independently in an increasingly hostile world? If you had bad experiences with ABA Iām genuinely sorry but it can absolutely be used for good.
I don't think the person you replied to thinks OP is wrong for bringing up the neglect, but their employer may see it that way (they're a troublemaker if they don't let problems lie).
OP is a Mandatory Reporter for the students in their care. They are legally bound to call CPS if they suspect a student is being neglected. Key word is ā Suspectā, you donāt even need proof, and you donāt need need to tell your boss first.
You are supposed to follow the law and go over administration and do whatās best for the child. Why didnāt this happen?
Everything you described in your story is just major rookie moves. Unprofessional group emails, suspecting neglect and not reporting?
Also, what kind of shoddy-assed school are you working at where staff slap other adults? Something isnāt adding up in your story.
What the hell, are you right out of college?
nah, he\`s an 'aba therapist' - which is basically a gay conversion therapist, but now targeting autistic children - see his post - he wants to force a child clearly in distress (sensory overload / meltdown due to a processing error - common with autistic children) to remain in the very situation that causes the overload - and calls allowing a child to remove themselves from a stressful situation to calm down 'reinforcing negative behavior'
Teachers in SPED are trained and certified specialists - hence teacher would realize the child needed to have some space to cool down and calm down.
āWhere he is licking his lipsā āWhere your boyfriend atā that gif definitely has those overtones.
The 9 months ago part is something to consider, but objectively that fits the definition of sexual overtones.
The employer is looking for a reason to get rid of op. They come up with this thing that happened in the past to be the reason for termination. This kind of thing happens all the time.
Keep everything professional with coworkers. Personally, I think your joke was innocent but it's something you would send your friends. Those people are not your friends, even if you've known them for years. It's a job and however much you enjoy the people or work, never let your guard down. Resign and take the good reference.
I think this is the best lesson going forward.
Most likely option now is to write a letter asking them to explain how this accusation is not retaliation, make sure to request it in writing. If you still haven't decided, then I'd make your decision time contingent on receiving that letter. Keep a copy of anything you write (preferably bcc your personal email.)
Yes! I get along with my coworkers like friends and we have a department group chat. But I keep it PG and donāt say any names or vent on there (even though some of them do) just in case.
Yes, that text you sent could be sexual harassment. Don't send things you would send to your friends to the professionals you work with. It's not the same, and honestly that text was pretty gross. Yes, you can probably fight the termination with the help of a lawyer, but the text you sent WAS wrong too. These people are not your friends and, as you've learned, have the power to get you fired.
The text was completely inappropriate and I find it odd that youāre even questioning that. I think it came up 9 months later because she was so bothered by it that it was still top of mind for her. Iām sorry you were hit - that is also unacceptable at work.
... She went straight to assault after you said she shouldn't let the kid go out? There was nothing in between? Nothing at all? Just you saying don't let him out (which you were wrong to do, btw, I don't need to reiterate everyone telling you ABA is disgusting but that kid was very clearly overwhelmed and needed to step out) and then she comes swinging? Attacking a coworker in front of kids? And then you didn't file a police report?
Did you restrain her? Did you touch her in any way? What happened between you saying don't let the kid out and her hitting you? Also, you're a mandated reporter, why didn't you report your observations of neglect ages ago???
That comment and gif is 100% sexual harassment. "Other people were joking too" sure, were they also intoning sexual behavior or were you the only one? Even if others were, don't ever participate. At work, always always compliment in ways that simply compliment their merit, NOTHING ELSE. Call them cool, call them awesome, say they're the best, etc. Don't say they're *sweet like candy* and send them a gif of a dude licking their lips asking if they're single. This should be obvious.
Usually I want to believe posters who come looking for help, but this whole thing is so fishy. You're not sharing what actually happened.
I generally try to trust workers when their job fucks them over until I see actual evidence that they were in the wrong, but as soon as I read "ABA", hell no. Those people are less like workers and more like abusers (and I'm using mild language here, to hopefully not get in trouble with the mods or anything)
The meme with comments is definately not ok to send to a co worker. Did other stuff or comments happen? If not, you gave her a good stick to hit you with. Learn from it.
If there were more comments like that, she might have slapped you because of that. Not that its ok but not every woman is comfortable speaking up or they can feel intimidated and it just comes to a boiling point.
This is your view and your side of things. I wonder what her story is.
Itās pissing me off so much that many comments are brushing this off or acting like itās *weird* that a woman wouldnāt report every instance of low-level sexual harassment she experiences at work. I never have and it absolutely would never have done anything most of the time anyway (except paint *me* as a troublemaker)ā¦
With respect - but no sympathy from me here.
First of all - ABA specialist? So, dogtraining for children with autism, ADHD etc.
Have you looked REALLY into the origins of ABA ? You might want to reconsider your career choice.
Then - this 'gem'
>One day, a teacher in charge of the classroom wanted to let a child leave the lunchroom because he was throwing things. I knew this would reinforce his disruptive behavior,Ā
Autistic children can get overwhelmed - and a meltdown is due to 'input overload' and not a tantrum. The teacher was actually correct- removing overloaded child from an overstimulating and overwhelming situation helps calm them down. Forcing them to remain in that situation is abusive, and creates an unsafe environment for both the overwhelmed child AND the others in said room.
Of course, you being wrong here does not excuse that teacher from hitting you - for which she did apologize and you yourself indicate you moved on from.
But - from your text - i gather you are a man and this teacher is a woman - with the other info, could it be she felt threatened by your comments (how did you tell her this? ) and she reacted out of fear / instinct?
And - saying you see signs of neglect while actively trying to force neglect of the immediate mental needs?
Nope, again, no sympathy here.
Of course, I am biased, as i prefer my son to learn to navigate this neuro-divergent unfriendly world without abusive therapy.
For those that wonder why I am opposed to ABA and have no sympathy for 'ABA professionals' : [https://stopabasupportautistics.home.blog/the-origins-of-aba-o-ivar-lovaas-the-father-of-aba-and-gay-conversion-therapy/](https://stopabasupportautistics.home.blog/the-origins-of-aba-o-ivar-lovaas-the-father-of-aba-and-gay-conversion-therapy/)
Edited to add - the reason why i have zero sympathy for OP is a) due to my child being autistic, b) due to me seeing the damage in adults these 'aba specialists' do (ABA trauma is real - due to the inherent abusive nature of this rebranded gay conversion therapy, c) because the base of this aba is the dehumanizing and invalidating of autistic children and their individual needs and last but not least - d) i am autistic as well - just late diagnosed (and usually shoved aside as 'high functioning, doesn\`t need any help').
Edit to add some more - why is ABA dehumanizing? Because OP actually confessed to this in the comment about the 'reinforcing disruptive behavior' - OP does not see a child in distress - he sees an unruly subject that needs to be subdued. yuck!
Also most teachers of SPED classrooms are highly qualified with masters in special education
ABAs are not much more than specialised teacher assistants.
OP is taking a superiour ground they do not possess. Its like a chiropractor complaining about an orthopedist.
Yeah plus professional adults donāt just randomly hit their coworkers so was he trying to restrain the poor kid? Or stop her from getting them to safety?
Without respect - no sympathy from me either
The ABA thing is a bit of a problem. A coworker assaulting you is definitely wrong. However, I find it a bit odd to complain that "someone hit me at my job where I abuse autistic children".
Would this help:
[https://stopabasupportautistics.home.blog/the-origins-of-aba-o-ivar-lovaas-the-father-of-aba-and-gay-conversion-therapy/](https://stopabasupportautistics.home.blog/the-origins-of-aba-o-ivar-lovaas-the-father-of-aba-and-gay-conversion-therapy/)
I'm not ABA, but "shaping" has a particular meaning in behaviorism in general. It's not "shaping a child" to be someone different, it's changing a behavior over time. So for example if you have Social Anxiety Disorder maybe you tend to avoid social events. You want to feel less anxious, so you go to a social event for 15 minutes, then the next time 20 minutes, then 30, etc. as you become more comfortable and experienced going to social events. That process is shaping. It' just a way of saying getting closer to the end goal behavior you want.
i do aba for a living and have a certification. totally dont understand how ppl are losing their minds. ive worked with kids who were biting themselves, throwing things, hurting other people and watched them calm down and be totally capable of not being a danger to themselves all without any of us doing anything that would be considered "abuse." we didnt even touch the poor guys unless they were hugging us. ive taught many kids how to complete their first sentences and watched them make their first sounds, all through the help of ABA practice. "shaping" their behavior should not deter you dont listen to these weird people. most of the clients ive worked with are a genuine danger to themselves, willing to run away as fast as they can into the street or harm themselves. thats why they need treatment in the first place. the ones who arent these clients we just teach them like theyre in school but its one on one so they get extra special attention for their handicapped needs, so nobody is forcing them to learn at a pace they arent equipped for. is learning really that bad? i didnt realize giving a kid a piece of candy for being able to go potty on their own for the first time at age 4 was so abusive. i didnt realize congratulating my 16 year old client on being able to speak a sentence clearly (so you know, he can have a voice and advocate for himself as he gets older) was so abusive. really makes all these people show they have no experience with anyone with mental handicaps. we arent shaping their behaviors to be "normal" its so they can like idk go potty without an adult and be able to speak to their parents and stop them from self harming. š
The teacher was right that the kid should've left the lunchroom. Speaking as an Autistic person, being forced to stay in an overwhelming situation as a child instead of being allowed to remove myself and self-regulate, was a cause of lifetime trauma that I'm still untangling in therapy at age 29. I was luckily never subjected to ABA officially but the principles of it (sit down, shut up, act "normal") were applied by teachers and parents all my life. I think what you do is disgusting, unethical, and honestly pure evil. Also, the text you sent was 100% inappropriate and I am shocked you'd send it in 2023.
All of that said, Your coworker shouldn't have hit you. It's almost as if we shouldn't use physical force to change someone else's behavior just because we don't like it.
Maybe this is an opportunity for you to do some soul-searching and ask yourself if training Autistic kids like dogs is really your life's mission.
I came for this. Also autistic adult here, ABA is disgusting. Rather than accommodating our differences and trying to make environments safe for us to navigate in ways that we understand better or are more comfortable in, ABA tell us to shut up and act like weāre not autistic. The ACTUAL autistic community (meaning people with autism, not moms of kids with autism) hate ABA and are outspokenly against it. Itās conversion therapy, but instead of trying to force the gay out of people it tries to force the autism out of people.
I understand that you were unaware of what ABA is, but the rant is still necessary. As far as the situation goes, talk to a lawyer, try to get money from the situation, then dump the career of abusing kids with autism.
As a relatively new teacher (4th year), I was shocked by the kind of chat that happens in the staff room and at the bar.
Hell a trainee teacher was gives a 'paint your own vagina' clay set for secret santa.Ā
Professionalism appears to be for management, kids and parents. There's a limit with colleagues but most go beyond what I'm comfortable doing/saying.Ā
I don't excuse the teacher hitting you but, ABA is awful on virtually every level. Nevermind that its foundation is based on "research" done by the same man who created conversion therapy but, the models used in ABA are not just similar to the ones used to train animals, it unashamedly boasts that that's where it roots itself.Ā
I agree with their decision to remove the child...who was throwing things...and could have hurt other children. I don't know why you'd think any different. But you're an ABA "specialist" so fine, not a thinker.Ā Ā
I would also agree that the message you chose to send was highly inappropriate and completely unprofessional at best. It's sort of baffling how you *don't* see it as sexual harassment.
Finally, just think of this as one of your tenets of ABA - your behavior was being driven by lack of consequence. You were seeking attention via pretending to care about your students. Now you have the opportunity to correct that behavior.Ā
I agree with almost all of this comment, but it does kind of sound like you are trying to excuse the other teacher at the end. OP was wrongfully terminated, full stop. OP probably shouldn't have sent that text (personally I don't think it's harassment barring any other context but it does sound extremely unprofessional) BUT the other teacher bringing it up almost a year later in response to this is clearly just her trying to save her job, which she deserves to lose for *assaulting her co-worker*.
Edit: upon reflection, I think the message/gif were sexually inappropriate for sure. "Harassment" requires a pattern of behavior but that's kind of splitting hairs at this point. Not an ok message to send. However, the rest of my comment stands. She shouldn't have hit him.
Yeah, not very antiwork of them doing a job that actively tries to mold autistic children into allistic children. A thing partially done to make us "normal" and "useful" to the exploitative work force.
> Abuses autistic children for a living
> Does shocked Pikachu face over one slap
Nope, no sympathy here.
ETA: Oh, and about your edit? Complete bullshit. Your post history indicates that your *own child* is in ABA. So you're either a liar or a bad parent. Either way, not a good look.
You are not "just following orders" nor are you just a misguided but well meaning paraprofessional doing your darndest to help kids. You literally tried to override a *teacher's* decision to remove an autistic child from a distressing environment because you believe in the ABA "rEwArDiNg BaD BeHaViOr" bullshit so much. You are not innocent and you deserved both the slap and being fired.
Literally everyone is saying this. OPs edits also sound like complete bullshit "oh I don't know what ABA is" that's so fucking stupid you had to train or go to school for it you damn well know how bad it is. Especially when forcing the kid to stay in the lunchroom really shows her lack of empathy towards the kids
He introduces himself as an ABA specialist and then he says he doesn't know what ABA is? Fascinating. His earlier posts elsewhere talk about ABA, too. And he has a child with autism (poor kid).
Also he's suddenly talking about the children being neglected after he was fired, before that apparently he had no issues with that same neglect for all the time he worked there.
Did the school know he was an ABA supporter when they hired him? Is the school okay with that pseudotherapy crap? If my child was going there, I'd want to know.
I'm guessing the school generally practices ABA with a lot of their "psychologists" and also willing to bet OP obfuscated critical information to make them look better. An ABA therapist would never mention they hit a kid because they know it's wrong but we all know better we know they do that shit behind closed doors
Sending that meme was absolutely a terrible idea in a work environment. Full stop. You left yourself open to that.
You're honestly in lawyer territory right now. Reddit can't help you here.
>As an ABA specialist
You are an awful person. You are willingly practicing ABA when there is a ton of evidence that it does more harm than good. Sure the teacher should not have assaulted you but at the end of the day I have zero sympathy. Lets not mince words, forcing ABA on autistic kids is abuse and whether you like it or not you are an abuser.
>I want to learn from this experience and avoid any future trouble
Stop doing ABA then and actually get education on autism and how to properly interact and support young autistic students in a way thats healthly for them longterm.
'as a ABA specialist' you should never be allowed around vulnerable children or adults.
You still shouldn't have been hit at work, that is not cool, but a child being 'disruptive' in the lunchroom needs a break from the sensory hell they are forced to try to eat in. Not being made to wait there suffering.
The teacher hit you. That was unprofessional and is never permitted. That's on the teacher. You may have cause to sue there. You would need to consult a lawyer to determine that.
You sent text messages that could be construed as sexual harassment. That's on you. The "well, everyone else was doing it" excuse never works. They, at this moment, don't care about "everyone else." They care about YOU. That excuse is like the old "if everyone else jumped off a bridge, would you jump off too?"
I don't know enough about ABA to pass judgment on your career choice. It sounds as though it falls in a very gray area and might not be in the best interests of the child. If so, you may want to return to school and get a degree so you can use effective strategies to deal with autistic children. Again, I don't know enough so I'm not passing judgment on this.
I feel that there is more to this story, and you haven't posted the whole interaction. A teacher tells a student to leave, you tell teacher not to do that, teacher hits you. There's definitely more to this story. What happened between you telling the teacher not to do that and the teacher hitting you? What else did you say or do? What else did the teacher say or do? Give us the whole story.
Reminder that ABA is operant conditioning and generally traumatic for the youth and was created by the same asshole that created gay conversion therapy, Ivar Lovaas,, you deserve more than being hit
assault is assault, but "just following orders" doesn't excuse you either. do better.
in fact, it seems you've bought into the whole practice. please resign.
It's not antiwork to abuse children for a living. Also, stop sexually harassing your coworkers. Did she "hit" you or push you out of the way of a distressed child you were abusing by forcing them to stay in an overstimulating environment?
Get your own house in order before you try to take someone else down. Special Ed teachers carry multiple degrees and ongoing education yearly. When was the last time you were in a classroom learning how to abuse children? How many degrees in special education do you have?
Gtfoh with this nonsense.
>I felt that this was a desperate attempt by the teacher to save her own job by making a false accusation.
Obviously retaliation, but she has ammunition.
> I also wondered why they did not discipline her for hitting me, which was clearly unacceptable.
Your counter offer could be to not sue the school for 1. being assaulted by a teacher on school grounds and 2. not disciplining the teacher who assaulted you, and 3. creating an unsafe work environment.
Lawyer up, kid. You could make some money here. At the very least, talk to an employment lawyer as soon as you can. Whatever advice you get is going to be better than what you get in this sub.
You're a mandated reporter, why weren't your observations of neglect reported to the state? We reported abuse & neglect to OIG(Office of Inspector General). Not reporting abuse & neglect within 24 hrs, will have your nurse/state registry red flagged. Always always always report neglect and abuse!
If you're ever in the situation where another coworker puts their hands on you, you call 911. It's battery/ assault. You need to fight this and that school. I would be on the phone now, reporting everything to OIG. Let them sort it out with an investigation. Fight them Op!!
OP was actively trying to prevent a qualified teacher from ensuring a distressed child get the chance to calm down - and even gloats that 'allowing that is reinforcing negative behavior'.
OP is just a 'child abusing therapist'.
If OP goes to the police - the teacher can inform them "Op was hindering the safety and well being of children put in my care - risking escalation and unsafe situation continuing for myself, for the child and the other children" - which was the case - not sure if she could not claim to have acted in defense of a minor here.
I see your little edit about ABA there's no way you just "decided" to become an abuse specialist and had no idea what aba was before. Sorry but you had it coming. I don't believe you for a second that you don't "reprimand" kids as you clearly were fine with a kid doing disruptive behavior and let him stay in the lunchroom. Do you realize that exposes everyone else in the lunchroom to, idk, having something thrown at them? There's a reason walks are so helpful, especially if you are making them stay in the lunchroom together. Do you also think letting someone listen to music after having a panic attack and throwing things is "reinforcing bad behavior"? Because with the logic you use for that kid yes you would take away music in a heartbeat. I don't care what you think aba is but you need to like, stop supporting it maybe? If you truly think what your doing is good, then your not practicing aba. aba is conversion "therapy" for ND people. Please take up a better position, you have 0 sympathy from me.
ABA is incredibly unethical. Not saying that you being hit was justified in any means, but the fact that you're willing to practice this, what is essentially, *autistic conversion therapy* gives me little sympathy. I'd still lawyer up but you should really think about doing something other than this shit as a profession. Learn to be sympathetic to autistic people instead of forcing them to mask and end up in sensory overload because of your lack of care.
[https://neuroclastic.com/invisible-abuse-aba-and-the-things-only-autistic-people-can-see/](https://neuroclastic.com/invisible-abuse-aba-and-the-things-only-autistic-people-can-see/)
[https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s41252-021-00201-1](https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s41252-021-00201-1)
[https://ausometraining.com/aba-abuse/](https://ausometraining.com/aba-abuse/)
[https://whyy.org/segments/how-a-therapy-once-seen-as-a-victory-for-autistic-kids-has-come-under-fire-as-abuse/](https://whyy.org/segments/how-a-therapy-once-seen-as-a-victory-for-autistic-kids-has-come-under-fire-as-abuse/)
Just a few links but there is quite a lot more information online about it. ABA is basically the same thing as gay conversion therapy. Just trying to change something that can't be changed and really traumatisingthe person while doing it.
ABA (Applied behavior analysis) therapy essentially hinges on the principle of ruthlessly punishing behaviors deemed undesirable and rewarding behavior deemed desirable. The intent is not to help the patient, but to make the people around them more comfortable. An example of how it can be immediately harmful can be found in this post: OP objected to the removal of a child who was overstimulated and on the verge of a meltdown from a lunchroom, which at the moment was filled with sensory input. In the long term, it can be incredibly traumatic, patients often gaining C-PTSD, self worth issues, and more.
Check other comments in the thread. ABA is gay conversion adapted for neurodivergent kids. It doesnāt help the kids by providing them tools, rather it helps the adults around the kids by forcing the kids to follow neurotypical behavioral rules. Kids get abused; adults get a ācompliantā kid.
Seems to me like they are searching for the path of least resistance. If its made clear to them that it won't be by going through you I suspect they would change corse. If you're in the right & getting fucked anyway, best to go down swinging.
Take it up with the law, she could have handled the situation professionally and intervened appropriately, she could have handled the situation without putting hands on another adult. Sorry, i disagree and your overt outrage and defense is sounding like you might be prone to solve situations by hitting people. Your wrong @morningwood whoever you are that blocked me from responding. You are controlling. Checks out.
That's a lot of edits to say, "ABA ain't so bad fuckers." Lol. Look...you don't get "forced" into ABA, regardless of a family situation. I haven't read what commenters have said, but based on all your defensive edits, I agree with them. That child should have been removed, because they were using the behavior they had at their disposal to cry for help to say they were overwhelmed and needed out. That behavior isn't "reinforced" by helping the child get out of a situation that's overwhelming them. It's the tool they have at their disposal.
Anyway, the point is, just because your coworkers jump off a bridge into an icy river doesn't mean you should jump with them. Remain 100% professional at work, always. No, what you did wrong not reading a social situation well ;) is not equal to her physically assaulting you. I have no idea if they can make a good enough case in court, but honestly it sounds like a toxic place and I'd get out...and find a way to change my career path. But ehh...I'm sure you've heard that a thousand times and it hasn't done any good, so not beating my head against a brick wall.
Iām autistic and youre and ABA therapist. That means youāre a huge fucking piece of shit and everything you say is a lie from gaslighting abusive narcissistic liar.
People who call ABA inherently abusive do not understand what ABA is whatsoever, and possibly more importantly, do not understand how much ABA practices have changed in the last 20 years.
However, the ABA intervention described here is, in my opinion as a BCBA, not best practice and does not reflect the way that ABA as a field is moving to intentionally not be traumatizing and abusive, which may be why you are catching so much flak here. Assent should always ALWAYS be first and foremost unless imminent safety risk is involved. In this case, not only was the child overwhelmed and not assenting to being in the lunchroom, but their staying was affecting the safety of others! I do not know everything so cannot give true feedback but I do somewhat question your supervisorās judgment on this if it really did come directly from them.
The text you sent was inappropriate, but the latency and timing of the report are obviously suspicious. If other texts in the same thread are similarly sexual in nature I would suggest documenting them (screenshots, etc.) and I would suggest lawyering up.
To avoid situations like this in the future, I think āDonāt get too comfortable with coworkersā is ALWAYS the way to go. A coworker is never your friend, not really, until you donāt work with them anymore. Your boss is not your friend. A teacher is not your friend. The administrative assistant is not your friend. You can be friendly and comfortable, but no matter how much you trust someone at work they will ALWAYS cover their own back end first, even if it means tossing you under the bus.
How many BCBAs or technicians are autistic themselves?
Iām sure there is a statistic, but Iām fine with anecdotal information. I was looking into it at one point, you know, be the change you want to see and all.. and while, sure thereās a lot less physical abuse and outright trauma, the underlying problems remain
Itās still dog training. Well, actually, let me back up.. according to this dog trainer [itās not dog training](https://neuroclastic.com/is-aba-really-dog-training-for-children-a-professional-dog-trainer-weighs-in/?amp), as they would never treat a dog the same way.
I agree on all fronts. I am, by no means, an expert in experience, training, or understanding. The school district as a whole has a plethora of problems, and I was just trying to do the best I could with near 0 support.
Imagine a classroom with too many kids trying to do everything by yourself. Informal training and operating outside of the supervision of a bcba
Yeah. Iām sorry you were put in that situation. That is wrong on all fronts. For one, a technician should NEVER work without BCBA oversight. Or be doing ABA with that many kids at once. Or be told they are performing ABA without the requisite 40 hours intensive training. Yikes!
I feel like both of you are in the wrong here. The text was definitely inappropriate and could very well be seen as sexual harassment. But her striking you was wrong as well.
That said (NaL), a Title VII claim of harassment must be filed within 180 days (unless a state law extends it, in which case it is usually 300 days) or the statute of limitations expires. If the text was 9 months old, it would be past that reporting cutoff unless your state extends it.
The lesson to take away from this should be that coworkers in general aren't your friends. While you should be polite and professional, your conversations - especially in group settings - should be job-focused.
>I had said "youre not mean, youre sweet like candy" and sent the gif from MadTV's "where your boyfriend at" where he is licking his lips".
You lost me right here. This was incredibly inappropriate. I have zero idea why anyone would do this in a professional situation.
On the flip side, this teacher hitting you was assault, so you might want to make a police report.
This sounds like the school and the teacher covering their asses. The text thing in context is perfectly fine, she only brought it up to fight back against your allegations of neglect. Go to whatever higher authority you can with your evidence, talk to a lawyer and protect yourself.
The timing of 9 months age versus 2 days ago will make the texts laughable as a reason in court. Jurors aren't idiots, and lawyers know this. It's wrongful termination.
Yep. But if they want to go down this road OP need to scorch the earth. I would go to the local police station and file a police report for assault. The teacher can explain their actions to the judge during sentencing or parole hearing. Then I would find an employment litigation attorney and schedule a consult. The attorney should be admitted to practice in federal court and be well versed in EEOC laws. The school appears to be guilty of retaliation in this instance and if this is the case that ladies and gents is a violation of federal laws. FAFO. š¤·š»āāļø
Consult an employment lawyer now.
Iāll make it easy for everyone.. OP is full of shit. 65 days ago: >I wake up and apply for 10 jobs a day. I adapt my resume and cover letter to every job. It takes me on average 3 hrs a day. I'm done by 8 a.m. I then either go to a daily work agency, accept a sub teacher job or donate plasma getting on average 100 dollars a day from those methodsā¦.I have been unemployed for 334 days. https://www.reddit.com/r/antiwork/s/vPdXRWQpsH 51 days ago: > My son is non verbal and was diagnosed a 2 but I'm suspicious of the diagnosis process. It's literally 3 hrs of playing with toys. https://www.reddit.com/r/Autism_Parenting/s/pR4QnWozC0 But theyāre now an ABA āspecialist?ā No.. they were subbing for a school, thought that because they have an autistic child, they were āneededā to intervene so they stepped in a situation they werenāt asked to; hence the initial unexplained assault and why none of this makes sense. Notice how they were never asked to step in.. but rather they āadvisedā an overwhelmed teacher not to do something.
Shit, what a waste of time and empathy š”
On top of this, never resign from a job. Ā You will not be eligible for unemployment benefits if you resign, which is why they are askingĀ you to do so. Ā
'report any retaliation' they said
Yeah I found it ironic that they said that and then it felt like they retaliated themselves
Up the ante. Contact the police and file a report for assault. Then contact a lawyer and see about suing for wrongful termination and retaliation.
This. You have to make them feel like They (the administrator) will lose their job over the incident.
The teacher should most definitely lose their job. They hit a coworker in front of behaviorally challenged kids. She's effectively teaching them that hitting is an acceptable way to handle things.
Also if the teacher almost instinctively reacted this way to a fellow adult I can about guarantee that teacher is hitting those kids. Special needs kids being physically abused by teachers is painfully common. Corporal punishment never left education, it just moved to the kids who either can't or won't tell about it.
I can confirm. I was physically abused by teachers until I was in grade twelve. Never told people because Iāve always slipped through the cracks. Nobody actually cared about ME during my time in school they just cared about me passing. If a teacher was to react like that to a grow ass human then without a shadow of a doubt I know that this teacher is abusing the kids.
Lol when better legal advice comes here than other subs.... Yall are fucking funny š¤£
That's the experience of putting up w/ beaucratic bullshit of those so called administrators that claim those positions
Keep in mind, most lawyers arenāt labor lawyers and are usually in a position of management or being the lawyer for management. Iām banned from commenting on legal advice for āanecdotal commentsā when I was explaining how to address wage theft and used an example of how it played out for someone I know who was successful. Lawyers tend to be far more aligned with the capitalist class, with obvious exceptions. Iāve also noticed that legal subs tend to view workers issues as civil contract disputes, not legal ones. Folks here have a class solidarity to support other workers that lawyers often lack. Even if a lawyer isnāt an owner or a manger they tend to serve them and Marx would call them petite bourgeoisie.
Lawyers aren't even good, generally. They fill a seat. I've gotten so many interpretations of FL's sunshine law from the same attorneys repeatedly over and over... It's incredibly frustrating. They'll say one thing about a 501c3 structure one day and the opposite the next. Like I have them recorded and ask for the reason and they essentially just shrug. You can't even rely on their advice. Typically you have to bring them research and allow them to give merit to that... But you're spot on, typically they're in place to protect corruption and assets, not to assist in dispensing justice.
Yes. Just call the police and report an assault. Don't bother with your boss etc. As a potential bonus, If the perp is convicted of assault most likely, he won't be able to work with kids again.
Absolutely report the assault. Please follow u/mirabai503 's advice
Also, file a report with the school board (or teachers union if there is one), rather than just your school about the child being neglected when you are absent and let his or her parents know. I have an autistic son and while he doesnāt need bathroom help anymore at school, Iād be livid if I found out they werenāt cleaning him up when needed.
šÆ%
You were not hit. You were assaulted. Contact law enforcement and press charges. Them attempting to get you to leave and say nothing is obstruction of justice. Find an employment lawyer.
And just had reported possible neglects with observations and logs. That doesn't look good for them.
Also, you were assaulted by a violent teacher, and a mandatory reporter was notified. If that teacher was not pulled from the classroom there may be further liability.
And screen shot that entire worker message thread before you get removed from it.
You have witnesses to the assault. Iād be reporting it to the authorities asap. Looks like work isnāt going to do anything, so take it above their heads and create a record
Having worked in schools for many years, call the district HR team or Assistant Superintendent. If they do not take it seriously, talk to a school board member. Those folks are elected and cannot handle bad press.
An employment lawyer will have a field day with this case. Enjoy your $$$
āI would like to report retaliation I am feelingā
She assaulted you screw HR press charges
Iāve reported teachers in aut rooms for horrible behavior. Theyāre still there and the people reporting them (including me) get slapped on the wrist for not following the chain of command. Like, you did nothing so we went above you.
This is lawyer territory. They fired you instead of her because they thought it was the easier route. Maybe they thought you would not fight back, or maybe they saw you as a possible source of further trouble. Showing them your daily log, especially if you recorded possible issues like the neglect you mentioned, probably did more harm than good. Only a lawyer can tell you if you have a case or if you should just accept this. I would seek a consultation, especially if this incident can possibly affect your future employment prospects.
Odds on the worker has threats against everyone. Anyone striking a colleague at work needs to go. The fact they arenāt has greater underlying inferences. Speak to a lawyer and additionally ask about any mandatory reporting to can do to any local care inspectorates. Odds on children are also being hit, when out of sight.
This is so true. I was shoved by a coworker back in like 2015, a coworker who had been transferred to 5 different locations for this company in 7 years because they were so difficult to work with. I immediately called my store manager, it was a retail optometry place similar to LensCrafters (it was 100% not LensCrafters just using them for example) and they transferred her to another location for about 2 months and then when they took a revenue hit (she was a snake oil salesman and pushed the most $$ stuff on ppl even if they didnāt need it) they transferred her back and told me they couldnāt 100% substantiate my side of things because it wasnāt on camera and the only other employee there had not been paying attention when it happened. I quit shortly after and wish I had pursued it more.
Imagine what they could do to a child in PRIVATE if theyāre willing to hit a coworker in public
You mean.. like aba therapists treat children ? yeah.. imagine that.
No genuinely ā Iāll trust a spec ed teacher over an ABA practitioner every damn time. ABA is licensed child abuse and anyone pretending otherwise doesnāt know what ABA is or would just rather be a bigot.
Preach
>They fired you instead of her because they thought it was the easier route. I bet OP isn't in the same union as the teacher
You have witnesses, press criminal charges. You have nothing to lose at this point. Point out to your employer (through a lawyer) that this is clearly retaliation from the teacher, and as the original attack has not been dealt with you will be going to the police about the assault.
Speak to a lawyer before going to the police. Let them advise you as to whether or not making a criminal case would be beneficial too your case.Ā
If someoneās hit me and with witnesses, Iām going to the police regardless.
While that is an option I would prefer the payday over personal retribution. No harm in speaking to the lawyer first to tell you the best way to do so since you're going to talk to them anyways.Ā
This person is also neglecting and possibly abusing vulnerable children under her care. This isn't about retribution, it's about justice.
Neglect would be reported to a different agency, not the police, they won't do shit about it. And as OP would be a mandated reporter the lawyer will also advise them to do so as they are compelled by law to report it, and now that it's clear that the employer is doing nothing about it you go through the proper channels.
Former CPS worker here. We absolutely have police call our agency about things. Thatās how we found out a child on my caseload died.
FYI, it might not be wise to trust an ABA practitionerās assessment of what is or isnāt child abuse. They work in forced conversion therapy. ABA is abusive itself.
Unchanged old diapers is objectively abuse
The police report is a record, for the lawyer they need to get. OP should have reported the assault to law enforcement immediately. I donāt understand why they didnāt.
Whenever possible bring a lawyer along when visiting the police Even for paperwork. Especially for paperwork.
I agree with that, but now that they haven't that's why you want to talk to the lawyer first. It's possible that it could also be interpreted as retaliation now that it's been a time and an accusation from that person was made. If it was made before that point there would be less issue.Ā There's no harm in waiting another day or so before reporting at this point to speak to a lawyer and have them advise you on how to proceed. Thru all have much better insight than any random internet people on what steps are best.Ā
An attorney is 100% going to have them file IMMEDIATELY. Without question. Jury's will understand the OP's grace in not filing right away. Violence 100% can not be promoted under any circumstances. There are zero acceptable excuses for hurting someone physically. It is human nature to hit when verbally frustrated. It is also human nature to rape, but there is this thing called modern society..
Lawyer first 100%
It's so wild that OP wrote a book about a simple assault and not once was calling the cops and having them earn their similarly doled out tax dollars mentioned. I realize the cops in 'murika are lazy and useless at best case but why does no one ever think of crime == call the cops
You should absolutely consult with an employment attorney. Your employer *may* have a point about the text (although given the context it seems innocent to me), but your coworker *definitely* assaulted you, *plus* (if I'm understanding you correctly) she was/is neglecting the children under her care (and what if she is assaulting them, too?).
There is a 100% chance I would have brought a lawsuit against the school. When did this happen? How long ago?
February 16 this year.
Look for a lawyer like yesterday
Let us know when you press charges. š¤·š¾āāļø
Yes, sending memes with sexual overtones to a coworker is sexual harassment. Of course they are getting rid of you because you stirred up some shit about neglect. You may want to consult an employment lawyer to see if you have a good case, probably would be stronger if you still have access to the group chat and can show that others sent similar content and weren't terminated.
'stirred up some shit about neglect' it's literally their job?
Behaviorists are Mandated reporters. They have to report. I think the teacher is being protected because of how hard it is to find sped teachers these days.
while you are 100% correct, some places don't want to know about it and pretend everything is fine.
That's not the OP's fault or issue.
You don't understand how mandatory reporter duties work do you? any observed neglect or abuse is the provider's responsibility to report and therefore, their issue.
Yeah, my point is that the op reported it and the employer didn't like it. The employer is not the op's issue. They are a mandatory reporter.
not their fault, but its become their issue unfortunately. OP should document the hell out of everything.
FYI, it might not be wise to trust an ABA practitionerās assessment of what is or isnāt child abuse. They work in forced conversion therapy. ABA is abusive itself.
Glad someone said this! Being hit by a coworker is INSANELY inappropriate regardless of the job but I definitely felt a little weird scrolling through and not seeing anything about how the entire concept of ABA is abusive to childrenā¦
Why would a legally sanctioned abuser admit to abusing autistic kids? ABA is torture. They know, they'd just prefer autistic people pretend they're not autistic.
Literally though, the whole idea behind it from what I understand (I am neither a psychologist nor an autistic person but have a few friends who are both and have learned a lot from them) the whole point of ABA is to teach a child to pretend not to be autistic. Thatās it. Not to help them cope with strong emotions, advocate for their needs or navigate systems built against them or anything actually USEFUL for neurodivergent and/or disabled folks. And I really hate the narrative OP is pushing in the edits that say she isnāt responsible because she isnāt specialized in ABA and didnāt intend this to be her career etc. Idk I know we all do what we have to do to survive when it comes to getting a paycheck but straight up abusing kids (or at the VERY least directly contributing to a system that does) is crossing a line imo.
I really hate the narrative that ABA is conversion therapy or teaching a kid not to be autistic. I work with a kid who literally spoke in 1 word utterances, was frequently upset to the point of multiple tantrums and melt downs daily, and was having next to none of his needs met from anyone. Since we started together 6 months ago, heās come so far - he can ask for what he needs, he can tell people around him how he feels, he can stand up from himself and tell people when he doesnāt like something, etc. And Iāve never forced him to do a single thing. Our sessions mostly consist of me giving af. I follow his lead, I take an actual interest in what heās into, I run my mouth about whatever he is into to model communication. We literally play and watch videos (that he likes) and talk to each other. Heās always excited to see me and gets sad whenever a session is cancelled if either of us is sick. Helping this kidās life get a little easier is the highlight of my day. (Notice how I said helping his life, not the life of others around him) I hear stories about his school, I see the videos they send to his parents where they arenāt doing anything to help him through anything at school, just berate him and attempt to use shame to get him to comply with them. It makes me sick. Those are his teachers who are with him most of the day. (I work with him in his home) Iāve seen videos of him being strapped to his school bus seat. It is sickening. Aside from his parents, Iām the only one advocating for this kid and to be quite honest only one parent is involved and willing to meet the kid where heās at. It is so terrible to villainize and entire occupation, because individuals are all different. Iāve met some AVA practitioners who suck, and Iāve met some teachers who suck, some parents who suck, some doctors who suck, etc. That doesnāt mean that there arenāt some people who are amazing, compassionate, kind, ethical people in all of these fields.
As an aba therapist, i teach my kids to say what they feel. I teach them to pee in the toilet. I teach them to ask for a break instead of self harming. I do not care if they stim. I do not care how they play, as long as no one is getting hurt. ABA is not what it was 15-20 years ago. Horrible shit happened then, and most of us were receptive to that and want to change. A lot of us, like myself, are autistic. It's not torture. There's not a single clinic I've worked at where their goal was to make the child appear less autistic. It sucks to see that people still think ABA is still what it was in the 60s.
Yes, this. Clients I work with have been able to learn skills to help them become more independent. I've helped clients learn to go to the bathroom in the toilet at 9 years old, to wash hands, make sandwiches, go on walks with family, brush teeth, tolerate waiting longer durations, learn deep breathing and mindfulness activities/coping skills, and so much more. I'm so heartbroken that so many people say ABA is abuse. It's preventing so many people from getting help to make socially significant changes to their lives. ABA has come so far. It's not just about compliance like it once was.
I straight up dont teach compliance. Im not there to create compliant kids. Im there to help them learn how to communicate without hurting themselves or anyone else. And that's literally it. Compliance never has been a target behavior that I've addressed, except for stuff like crossing the street.
This is false information. The whole point of ABA has absolutely nothing to do with trying to āteach a child not to be autistic.ā ABA when working with autistic leole is typically teaching them communication skills, functional living skills, self-regulation, being able to tolerate hard things that naturally occur in life (that is out of no oneās control - like changes to a schedule/daily routine), how to advocate for their own wants and needsā¦. You guys are misinformed and reading an article about lovaas from however long ago isnāt what the field is nowadays.
Iām sorry you feel that way but educate yourself. Thereās absolutely ethical ABA and I wish I couldāve received it as a child.
Youāre wrong about the existence of ethical ABA. You donāt need to be forced to act like others want you to. We should all expect & be expected to meet each other in the middle. Weāre not wrong for existing as who we are. The people who refuse to let us (harmlessly) be ourselves are the problem ā they are wrong and they are asshole bigots. If you want to build skills (and work towards liberation), ABA is not the way.
I work in ABA and as an autistic individual I would *never* do anything that would hurt kids and I def donāt seek to change who they are or āforce them to act like othersā. Iām huge about meeting my clients where they are and functional communication is the one of our biggest goals. Sure it would be nice if neurotypical people could meet in the middle but they really donāt seem to want to do that do they? So why wouldnāt I want to try to help give these kids the tools they need to hopefully function independently in an increasingly hostile world? If you had bad experiences with ABA Iām genuinely sorry but it can absolutely be used for good.
I don't think the person you replied to thinks OP is wrong for bringing up the neglect, but their employer may see it that way (they're a troublemaker if they don't let problems lie).
OP is a Mandatory Reporter for the students in their care. They are legally bound to call CPS if they suspect a student is being neglected. Key word is ā Suspectā, you donāt even need proof, and you donāt need need to tell your boss first. You are supposed to follow the law and go over administration and do whatās best for the child. Why didnāt this happen? Everything you described in your story is just major rookie moves. Unprofessional group emails, suspecting neglect and not reporting? Also, what kind of shoddy-assed school are you working at where staff slap other adults? Something isnāt adding up in your story. What the hell, are you right out of college?
nah, he\`s an 'aba therapist' - which is basically a gay conversion therapist, but now targeting autistic children - see his post - he wants to force a child clearly in distress (sensory overload / meltdown due to a processing error - common with autistic children) to remain in the very situation that causes the overload - and calls allowing a child to remove themselves from a stressful situation to calm down 'reinforcing negative behavior' Teachers in SPED are trained and certified specialists - hence teacher would realize the child needed to have some space to cool down and calm down.
ABA pushers will hear a child screaming and not let them take their hand off the stove because it "reinforces negative behavior"
Carefull not to anger the most agressive and selfish of folks. Spot on reply tho.
I already did lol. They want us to have more sympathy for ABA pushers than they ever did
ABA ātherapistsā are absolutely mandated reporters.
AND they just ABA
It sounds made-up. Likely OP is still in college and just messing around.
What sexual overtones? Why wasn't it "offensive" 9 months ago?Ā
āWhere he is licking his lipsā āWhere your boyfriend atā that gif definitely has those overtones. The 9 months ago part is something to consider, but objectively that fits the definition of sexual overtones.
The employer is looking for a reason to get rid of op. They come up with this thing that happened in the past to be the reason for termination. This kind of thing happens all the time.
Keep everything professional with coworkers. Personally, I think your joke was innocent but it's something you would send your friends. Those people are not your friends, even if you've known them for years. It's a job and however much you enjoy the people or work, never let your guard down. Resign and take the good reference.
I agree with this comment šÆ but IMO this was wrongful termination and he should consider a consultation with a lawyer.
I think this is the best lesson going forward. Most likely option now is to write a letter asking them to explain how this accusation is not retaliation, make sure to request it in writing. If you still haven't decided, then I'd make your decision time contingent on receiving that letter. Keep a copy of anything you write (preferably bcc your personal email.)
Yes! I get along with my coworkers like friends and we have a department group chat. But I keep it PG and donāt say any names or vent on there (even though some of them do) just in case.
Yes, that text you sent could be sexual harassment. Don't send things you would send to your friends to the professionals you work with. It's not the same, and honestly that text was pretty gross. Yes, you can probably fight the termination with the help of a lawyer, but the text you sent WAS wrong too. These people are not your friends and, as you've learned, have the power to get you fired.
The text was completely inappropriate and I find it odd that youāre even questioning that. I think it came up 9 months later because she was so bothered by it that it was still top of mind for her. Iām sorry you were hit - that is also unacceptable at work.
... She went straight to assault after you said she shouldn't let the kid go out? There was nothing in between? Nothing at all? Just you saying don't let him out (which you were wrong to do, btw, I don't need to reiterate everyone telling you ABA is disgusting but that kid was very clearly overwhelmed and needed to step out) and then she comes swinging? Attacking a coworker in front of kids? And then you didn't file a police report? Did you restrain her? Did you touch her in any way? What happened between you saying don't let the kid out and her hitting you? Also, you're a mandated reporter, why didn't you report your observations of neglect ages ago??? That comment and gif is 100% sexual harassment. "Other people were joking too" sure, were they also intoning sexual behavior or were you the only one? Even if others were, don't ever participate. At work, always always compliment in ways that simply compliment their merit, NOTHING ELSE. Call them cool, call them awesome, say they're the best, etc. Don't say they're *sweet like candy* and send them a gif of a dude licking their lips asking if they're single. This should be obvious. Usually I want to believe posters who come looking for help, but this whole thing is so fishy. You're not sharing what actually happened.
Oh good, I wasn't the only one. Yeah this is suspicious as hell.Ā
I generally try to trust workers when their job fucks them over until I see actual evidence that they were in the wrong, but as soon as I read "ABA", hell no. Those people are less like workers and more like abusers (and I'm using mild language here, to hopefully not get in trouble with the mods or anything)
If the mods are gonna kick people for calling forced conversion therapy abusive, they sound like asshats and Iām cool with them banning me lol
The meme with comments is definately not ok to send to a co worker. Did other stuff or comments happen? If not, you gave her a good stick to hit you with. Learn from it. If there were more comments like that, she might have slapped you because of that. Not that its ok but not every woman is comfortable speaking up or they can feel intimidated and it just comes to a boiling point. This is your view and your side of things. I wonder what her story is.
I would be furious if a coworker sent me texts like that. Let women fucking exist in peace.
Itās pissing me off so much that many comments are brushing this off or acting like itās *weird* that a woman wouldnāt report every instance of low-level sexual harassment she experiences at work. I never have and it absolutely would never have done anything most of the time anyway (except paint *me* as a troublemaker)ā¦
With respect - but no sympathy from me here. First of all - ABA specialist? So, dogtraining for children with autism, ADHD etc. Have you looked REALLY into the origins of ABA ? You might want to reconsider your career choice. Then - this 'gem' >One day, a teacher in charge of the classroom wanted to let a child leave the lunchroom because he was throwing things. I knew this would reinforce his disruptive behavior,Ā Autistic children can get overwhelmed - and a meltdown is due to 'input overload' and not a tantrum. The teacher was actually correct- removing overloaded child from an overstimulating and overwhelming situation helps calm them down. Forcing them to remain in that situation is abusive, and creates an unsafe environment for both the overwhelmed child AND the others in said room. Of course, you being wrong here does not excuse that teacher from hitting you - for which she did apologize and you yourself indicate you moved on from. But - from your text - i gather you are a man and this teacher is a woman - with the other info, could it be she felt threatened by your comments (how did you tell her this? ) and she reacted out of fear / instinct? And - saying you see signs of neglect while actively trying to force neglect of the immediate mental needs? Nope, again, no sympathy here. Of course, I am biased, as i prefer my son to learn to navigate this neuro-divergent unfriendly world without abusive therapy. For those that wonder why I am opposed to ABA and have no sympathy for 'ABA professionals' : [https://stopabasupportautistics.home.blog/the-origins-of-aba-o-ivar-lovaas-the-father-of-aba-and-gay-conversion-therapy/](https://stopabasupportautistics.home.blog/the-origins-of-aba-o-ivar-lovaas-the-father-of-aba-and-gay-conversion-therapy/) Edited to add - the reason why i have zero sympathy for OP is a) due to my child being autistic, b) due to me seeing the damage in adults these 'aba specialists' do (ABA trauma is real - due to the inherent abusive nature of this rebranded gay conversion therapy, c) because the base of this aba is the dehumanizing and invalidating of autistic children and their individual needs and last but not least - d) i am autistic as well - just late diagnosed (and usually shoved aside as 'high functioning, doesn\`t need any help'). Edit to add some more - why is ABA dehumanizing? Because OP actually confessed to this in the comment about the 'reinforcing disruptive behavior' - OP does not see a child in distress - he sees an unruly subject that needs to be subdued. yuck!
Also most teachers of SPED classrooms are highly qualified with masters in special education ABAs are not much more than specialised teacher assistants. OP is taking a superiour ground they do not possess. Its like a chiropractor complaining about an orthopedist.
As an autistic now-adult, say it louder for the people in the back!
Absolutely. A coworker hitting you is wrong. And also, ABA is just sanctioned abuse of autistic kids.
Yeah plus professional adults donāt just randomly hit their coworkers so was he trying to restrain the poor kid? Or stop her from getting them to safety? Without respect - no sympathy from me either
My bet is OP blocked the door or something else similarly childish. I donāt even slightly trust OPās retelling.
It does seem like there's holes in the story...Ā
This comment needs to be higher up.
The ABA thing is a bit of a problem. A coworker assaulting you is definitely wrong. However, I find it a bit odd to complain that "someone hit me at my job where I abuse autistic children".
Kinda off topic but can you elaborate on ABA being abusive? I just looked it up because I didnāt know anything about it.
Would this help: [https://stopabasupportautistics.home.blog/the-origins-of-aba-o-ivar-lovaas-the-father-of-aba-and-gay-conversion-therapy/](https://stopabasupportautistics.home.blog/the-origins-of-aba-o-ivar-lovaas-the-father-of-aba-and-gay-conversion-therapy/)
OKā¦I had a feeling it was something like this after reading that ABA tries to āshapeā children and correct behavior. Thanks for the article.
Basically this but without the actual hitting. [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sdb4rNFRzU0](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sdb4rNFRzU0)
I'm not ABA, but "shaping" has a particular meaning in behaviorism in general. It's not "shaping a child" to be someone different, it's changing a behavior over time. So for example if you have Social Anxiety Disorder maybe you tend to avoid social events. You want to feel less anxious, so you go to a social event for 15 minutes, then the next time 20 minutes, then 30, etc. as you become more comfortable and experienced going to social events. That process is shaping. It' just a way of saying getting closer to the end goal behavior you want.
i do aba for a living and have a certification. totally dont understand how ppl are losing their minds. ive worked with kids who were biting themselves, throwing things, hurting other people and watched them calm down and be totally capable of not being a danger to themselves all without any of us doing anything that would be considered "abuse." we didnt even touch the poor guys unless they were hugging us. ive taught many kids how to complete their first sentences and watched them make their first sounds, all through the help of ABA practice. "shaping" their behavior should not deter you dont listen to these weird people. most of the clients ive worked with are a genuine danger to themselves, willing to run away as fast as they can into the street or harm themselves. thats why they need treatment in the first place. the ones who arent these clients we just teach them like theyre in school but its one on one so they get extra special attention for their handicapped needs, so nobody is forcing them to learn at a pace they arent equipped for. is learning really that bad? i didnt realize giving a kid a piece of candy for being able to go potty on their own for the first time at age 4 was so abusive. i didnt realize congratulating my 16 year old client on being able to speak a sentence clearly (so you know, he can have a voice and advocate for himself as he gets older) was so abusive. really makes all these people show they have no experience with anyone with mental handicaps. we arent shaping their behaviors to be "normal" its so they can like idk go potty without an adult and be able to speak to their parents and stop them from self harming. š
Neurodivergent Rebel has a good rundown on it here https://youtu.be/MyesuqN_YMw
The teacher was right that the kid should've left the lunchroom. Speaking as an Autistic person, being forced to stay in an overwhelming situation as a child instead of being allowed to remove myself and self-regulate, was a cause of lifetime trauma that I'm still untangling in therapy at age 29. I was luckily never subjected to ABA officially but the principles of it (sit down, shut up, act "normal") were applied by teachers and parents all my life. I think what you do is disgusting, unethical, and honestly pure evil. Also, the text you sent was 100% inappropriate and I am shocked you'd send it in 2023. All of that said, Your coworker shouldn't have hit you. It's almost as if we shouldn't use physical force to change someone else's behavior just because we don't like it. Maybe this is an opportunity for you to do some soul-searching and ask yourself if training Autistic kids like dogs is really your life's mission.
I came for this. Also autistic adult here, ABA is disgusting. Rather than accommodating our differences and trying to make environments safe for us to navigate in ways that we understand better or are more comfortable in, ABA tell us to shut up and act like weāre not autistic. The ACTUAL autistic community (meaning people with autism, not moms of kids with autism) hate ABA and are outspokenly against it. Itās conversion therapy, but instead of trying to force the gay out of people it tries to force the autism out of people. I understand that you were unaware of what ABA is, but the rant is still necessary. As far as the situation goes, talk to a lawyer, try to get money from the situation, then dump the career of abusing kids with autism.
As a relatively new teacher (4th year), I was shocked by the kind of chat that happens in the staff room and at the bar. Hell a trainee teacher was gives a 'paint your own vagina' clay set for secret santa.Ā Professionalism appears to be for management, kids and parents. There's a limit with colleagues but most go beyond what I'm comfortable doing/saying.Ā
I don't excuse the teacher hitting you but, ABA is awful on virtually every level. Nevermind that its foundation is based on "research" done by the same man who created conversion therapy but, the models used in ABA are not just similar to the ones used to train animals, it unashamedly boasts that that's where it roots itself.Ā I agree with their decision to remove the child...who was throwing things...and could have hurt other children. I don't know why you'd think any different. But you're an ABA "specialist" so fine, not a thinker.Ā Ā I would also agree that the message you chose to send was highly inappropriate and completely unprofessional at best. It's sort of baffling how you *don't* see it as sexual harassment. Finally, just think of this as one of your tenets of ABA - your behavior was being driven by lack of consequence. You were seeking attention via pretending to care about your students. Now you have the opportunity to correct that behavior.Ā
Omg this comment is amazing; the last bit especially. Thank you for the clap back to the egregious ABA abuse. š«¶
Took way too long to find a comment saying this. As an autistic person, thank you šš»
I agree with almost all of this comment, but it does kind of sound like you are trying to excuse the other teacher at the end. OP was wrongfully terminated, full stop. OP probably shouldn't have sent that text (personally I don't think it's harassment barring any other context but it does sound extremely unprofessional) BUT the other teacher bringing it up almost a year later in response to this is clearly just her trying to save her job, which she deserves to lose for *assaulting her co-worker*. Edit: upon reflection, I think the message/gif were sexually inappropriate for sure. "Harassment" requires a pattern of behavior but that's kind of splitting hairs at this point. Not an ok message to send. However, the rest of my comment stands. She shouldn't have hit him.
ABA, no sympathy. Quit and find a job which doesn't involve abusing vulnerable people.
Yeah, not very antiwork of them doing a job that actively tries to mold autistic children into allistic children. A thing partially done to make us "normal" and "useful" to the exploitative work force.
> Abuses autistic children for a living > Does shocked Pikachu face over one slap Nope, no sympathy here. ETA: Oh, and about your edit? Complete bullshit. Your post history indicates that your *own child* is in ABA. So you're either a liar or a bad parent. Either way, not a good look. You are not "just following orders" nor are you just a misguided but well meaning paraprofessional doing your darndest to help kids. You literally tried to override a *teacher's* decision to remove an autistic child from a distressing environment because you believe in the ABA "rEwArDiNg BaD BeHaViOr" bullshit so much. You are not innocent and you deserved both the slap and being fired.
You deserve worse for the way you treat neurodivergent children, shame on you. Actively participating in ABA, you should be ashamed of yourself.
Actively preventing staff from getting a distressed disabled student to safety, and then bragging about it! Fuck this guy.
An asshole to women, an asshole to children, and of course they still believe they are in the right. I don't even believe their story about being hit
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
ABA is conversion therapy for autistic kids, it's fucking barbaric
Who wants to bet that OP had his hands on the child when he got hit by the teacher?
Literally everyone is saying this. OPs edits also sound like complete bullshit "oh I don't know what ABA is" that's so fucking stupid you had to train or go to school for it you damn well know how bad it is. Especially when forcing the kid to stay in the lunchroom really shows her lack of empathy towards the kids
He introduces himself as an ABA specialist and then he says he doesn't know what ABA is? Fascinating. His earlier posts elsewhere talk about ABA, too. And he has a child with autism (poor kid). Also he's suddenly talking about the children being neglected after he was fired, before that apparently he had no issues with that same neglect for all the time he worked there. Did the school know he was an ABA supporter when they hired him? Is the school okay with that pseudotherapy crap? If my child was going there, I'd want to know.
I'm guessing the school generally practices ABA with a lot of their "psychologists" and also willing to bet OP obfuscated critical information to make them look better. An ABA therapist would never mention they hit a kid because they know it's wrong but we all know better we know they do that shit behind closed doors
ABA specialist......No sympathy for you from me.
Sending that meme was absolutely a terrible idea in a work environment. Full stop. You left yourself open to that. You're honestly in lawyer territory right now. Reddit can't help you here.
No sympathy for the professional child abuser. ABA is abuse.
>As an ABA specialist You are an awful person. You are willingly practicing ABA when there is a ton of evidence that it does more harm than good. Sure the teacher should not have assaulted you but at the end of the day I have zero sympathy. Lets not mince words, forcing ABA on autistic kids is abuse and whether you like it or not you are an abuser. >I want to learn from this experience and avoid any future trouble Stop doing ABA then and actually get education on autism and how to properly interact and support young autistic students in a way thats healthly for them longterm.
'as a ABA specialist' you should never be allowed around vulnerable children or adults. You still shouldn't have been hit at work, that is not cool, but a child being 'disruptive' in the lunchroom needs a break from the sensory hell they are forced to try to eat in. Not being made to wait there suffering.
The teacher hit you. That was unprofessional and is never permitted. That's on the teacher. You may have cause to sue there. You would need to consult a lawyer to determine that. You sent text messages that could be construed as sexual harassment. That's on you. The "well, everyone else was doing it" excuse never works. They, at this moment, don't care about "everyone else." They care about YOU. That excuse is like the old "if everyone else jumped off a bridge, would you jump off too?" I don't know enough about ABA to pass judgment on your career choice. It sounds as though it falls in a very gray area and might not be in the best interests of the child. If so, you may want to return to school and get a degree so you can use effective strategies to deal with autistic children. Again, I don't know enough so I'm not passing judgment on this. I feel that there is more to this story, and you haven't posted the whole interaction. A teacher tells a student to leave, you tell teacher not to do that, teacher hits you. There's definitely more to this story. What happened between you telling the teacher not to do that and the teacher hitting you? What else did you say or do? What else did the teacher say or do? Give us the whole story.
He abuses kids for a living. Of course he's leaving out crucial details to make himself look better.
Reminder that ABA is operant conditioning and generally traumatic for the youth and was created by the same asshole that created gay conversion therapy, Ivar Lovaas,, you deserve more than being hit
You're an ABA. A limp wristed slap on the face is the absolute least you deserve.
You're an ABA pusher. Take the L and quit while you're still behind
assault is assault, but "just following orders" doesn't excuse you either. do better. in fact, it seems you've bought into the whole practice. please resign.
Deserved for being an abuse specialist
It's not antiwork to abuse children for a living. Also, stop sexually harassing your coworkers. Did she "hit" you or push you out of the way of a distressed child you were abusing by forcing them to stay in an overstimulating environment? Get your own house in order before you try to take someone else down. Special Ed teachers carry multiple degrees and ongoing education yearly. When was the last time you were in a classroom learning how to abuse children? How many degrees in special education do you have? Gtfoh with this nonsense.
>I felt that this was a desperate attempt by the teacher to save her own job by making a false accusation. Obviously retaliation, but she has ammunition. > I also wondered why they did not discipline her for hitting me, which was clearly unacceptable. Your counter offer could be to not sue the school for 1. being assaulted by a teacher on school grounds and 2. not disciplining the teacher who assaulted you, and 3. creating an unsafe work environment. Lawyer up, kid. You could make some money here. At the very least, talk to an employment lawyer as soon as you can. Whatever advice you get is going to be better than what you get in this sub.
You're a mandated reporter, why weren't your observations of neglect reported to the state? We reported abuse & neglect to OIG(Office of Inspector General). Not reporting abuse & neglect within 24 hrs, will have your nurse/state registry red flagged. Always always always report neglect and abuse! If you're ever in the situation where another coworker puts their hands on you, you call 911. It's battery/ assault. You need to fight this and that school. I would be on the phone now, reporting everything to OIG. Let them sort it out with an investigation. Fight them Op!!
OP was actively trying to prevent a qualified teacher from ensuring a distressed child get the chance to calm down - and even gloats that 'allowing that is reinforcing negative behavior'. OP is just a 'child abusing therapist'. If OP goes to the police - the teacher can inform them "Op was hindering the safety and well being of children put in my care - risking escalation and unsafe situation continuing for myself, for the child and the other children" - which was the case - not sure if she could not claim to have acted in defense of a minor here.
Because the abuse and neglect doesn't actually exist. OP is not a reliable narrator.
I see your little edit about ABA there's no way you just "decided" to become an abuse specialist and had no idea what aba was before. Sorry but you had it coming. I don't believe you for a second that you don't "reprimand" kids as you clearly were fine with a kid doing disruptive behavior and let him stay in the lunchroom. Do you realize that exposes everyone else in the lunchroom to, idk, having something thrown at them? There's a reason walks are so helpful, especially if you are making them stay in the lunchroom together. Do you also think letting someone listen to music after having a panic attack and throwing things is "reinforcing bad behavior"? Because with the logic you use for that kid yes you would take away music in a heartbeat. I don't care what you think aba is but you need to like, stop supporting it maybe? If you truly think what your doing is good, then your not practicing aba. aba is conversion "therapy" for ND people. Please take up a better position, you have 0 sympathy from me.
ABA is incredibly unethical. Not saying that you being hit was justified in any means, but the fact that you're willing to practice this, what is essentially, *autistic conversion therapy* gives me little sympathy. I'd still lawyer up but you should really think about doing something other than this shit as a profession. Learn to be sympathetic to autistic people instead of forcing them to mask and end up in sensory overload because of your lack of care.
It sounds like retailiation. I would talk to an employement lawyer. If youāre in a union, be sure to have your union steward present.
ABA is abuse. So idk what you want. You literally abuse children for a living.
>ABA is abuse. So idk what you want. You literally abuse children for a living. Can you explain that? Edit: Thank you all.
[https://neuroclastic.com/invisible-abuse-aba-and-the-things-only-autistic-people-can-see/](https://neuroclastic.com/invisible-abuse-aba-and-the-things-only-autistic-people-can-see/) [https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s41252-021-00201-1](https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s41252-021-00201-1) [https://ausometraining.com/aba-abuse/](https://ausometraining.com/aba-abuse/) [https://whyy.org/segments/how-a-therapy-once-seen-as-a-victory-for-autistic-kids-has-come-under-fire-as-abuse/](https://whyy.org/segments/how-a-therapy-once-seen-as-a-victory-for-autistic-kids-has-come-under-fire-as-abuse/) Just a few links but there is quite a lot more information online about it. ABA is basically the same thing as gay conversion therapy. Just trying to change something that can't be changed and really traumatisingthe person while doing it.
ABA (Applied behavior analysis) therapy essentially hinges on the principle of ruthlessly punishing behaviors deemed undesirable and rewarding behavior deemed desirable. The intent is not to help the patient, but to make the people around them more comfortable. An example of how it can be immediately harmful can be found in this post: OP objected to the removal of a child who was overstimulated and on the verge of a meltdown from a lunchroom, which at the moment was filled with sensory input. In the long term, it can be incredibly traumatic, patients often gaining C-PTSD, self worth issues, and more.
Check other comments in the thread. ABA is gay conversion adapted for neurodivergent kids. It doesnāt help the kids by providing them tools, rather it helps the adults around the kids by forcing the kids to follow neurotypical behavioral rules. Kids get abused; adults get a ācompliantā kid.
Ohhh Nooo, not the ABA specialist, this is sooo unfortunate
Yeah, you probably should resign from your "abuse vulnerable children" job.
Did anyone see her hit you, or were there cameras available?
Ok I really didnāt get past the comment āshe hit meā
make them fire you! thatās some bs
Almost no situation where resigning is better than taking the fire or lay off.
Seems to me like they are searching for the path of least resistance. If its made clear to them that it won't be by going through you I suspect they would change corse. If you're in the right & getting fucked anyway, best to go down swinging.
Take it up with the law, she could have handled the situation professionally and intervened appropriately, she could have handled the situation without putting hands on another adult. Sorry, i disagree and your overt outrage and defense is sounding like you might be prone to solve situations by hitting people. Your wrong @morningwood whoever you are that blocked me from responding. You are controlling. Checks out.
Youāre an ABA therapist for autistic people? Karmaās a bitch, huh? I hope my fellow autists felt like they got justice here. Get fucked.
Another adult hit you and you didn't press charges?
That's a lot of edits to say, "ABA ain't so bad fuckers." Lol. Look...you don't get "forced" into ABA, regardless of a family situation. I haven't read what commenters have said, but based on all your defensive edits, I agree with them. That child should have been removed, because they were using the behavior they had at their disposal to cry for help to say they were overwhelmed and needed out. That behavior isn't "reinforced" by helping the child get out of a situation that's overwhelming them. It's the tool they have at their disposal. Anyway, the point is, just because your coworkers jump off a bridge into an icy river doesn't mean you should jump with them. Remain 100% professional at work, always. No, what you did wrong not reading a social situation well ;) is not equal to her physically assaulting you. I have no idea if they can make a good enough case in court, but honestly it sounds like a toxic place and I'd get out...and find a way to change my career path. But ehh...I'm sure you've heard that a thousand times and it hasn't done any good, so not beating my head against a brick wall.
karmaās a bitch, isnāt it? you deserved worse and i hope all of that and more comes to you <3 āaba specialistā
ABA specialist sigh. Iām sorry you were wrongfully terminated butā¦
Iām autistic and youre and ABA therapist. That means youāre a huge fucking piece of shit and everything you say is a lie from gaslighting abusive narcissistic liar.
People who call ABA inherently abusive do not understand what ABA is whatsoever, and possibly more importantly, do not understand how much ABA practices have changed in the last 20 years. However, the ABA intervention described here is, in my opinion as a BCBA, not best practice and does not reflect the way that ABA as a field is moving to intentionally not be traumatizing and abusive, which may be why you are catching so much flak here. Assent should always ALWAYS be first and foremost unless imminent safety risk is involved. In this case, not only was the child overwhelmed and not assenting to being in the lunchroom, but their staying was affecting the safety of others! I do not know everything so cannot give true feedback but I do somewhat question your supervisorās judgment on this if it really did come directly from them. The text you sent was inappropriate, but the latency and timing of the report are obviously suspicious. If other texts in the same thread are similarly sexual in nature I would suggest documenting them (screenshots, etc.) and I would suggest lawyering up. To avoid situations like this in the future, I think āDonāt get too comfortable with coworkersā is ALWAYS the way to go. A coworker is never your friend, not really, until you donāt work with them anymore. Your boss is not your friend. A teacher is not your friend. The administrative assistant is not your friend. You can be friendly and comfortable, but no matter how much you trust someone at work they will ALWAYS cover their own back end first, even if it means tossing you under the bus.
How many BCBAs or technicians are autistic themselves? Iām sure there is a statistic, but Iām fine with anecdotal information. I was looking into it at one point, you know, be the change you want to see and all.. and while, sure thereās a lot less physical abuse and outright trauma, the underlying problems remain Itās still dog training. Well, actually, let me back up.. according to this dog trainer [itās not dog training](https://neuroclastic.com/is-aba-really-dog-training-for-children-a-professional-dog-trainer-weighs-in/?amp), as they would never treat a dog the same way.
I agree on all fronts. I am, by no means, an expert in experience, training, or understanding. The school district as a whole has a plethora of problems, and I was just trying to do the best I could with near 0 support. Imagine a classroom with too many kids trying to do everything by yourself. Informal training and operating outside of the supervision of a bcba
Yeah. Iām sorry you were put in that situation. That is wrong on all fronts. For one, a technician should NEVER work without BCBA oversight. Or be doing ABA with that many kids at once. Or be told they are performing ABA without the requisite 40 hours intensive training. Yikes!
I donāt think OP is a technician, either. Theyāre a parent and a substitute teacher
They have you provide the ABA therapy and then on in service days they start you on the training and certification process.
I feel like both of you are in the wrong here. The text was definitely inappropriate and could very well be seen as sexual harassment. But her striking you was wrong as well. That said (NaL), a Title VII claim of harassment must be filed within 180 days (unless a state law extends it, in which case it is usually 300 days) or the statute of limitations expires. If the text was 9 months old, it would be past that reporting cutoff unless your state extends it. The lesson to take away from this should be that coworkers in general aren't your friends. While you should be polite and professional, your conversations - especially in group settings - should be job-focused.
>I had said "youre not mean, youre sweet like candy" and sent the gif from MadTV's "where your boyfriend at" where he is licking his lips". You lost me right here. This was incredibly inappropriate. I have zero idea why anyone would do this in a professional situation. On the flip side, this teacher hitting you was assault, so you might want to make a police report.
Harassment is repeated and continued. One text message is NOT harassment. Do NOT resign.
This sounds like the school and the teacher covering their asses. The text thing in context is perfectly fine, she only brought it up to fight back against your allegations of neglect. Go to whatever higher authority you can with your evidence, talk to a lawyer and protect yourself.
What state are you in? If California, I have some news for you.
involve police and cps. The school is clearly not interested in appropriately handling this. report the rest as retaliation.