I got an interview offer at Amazon and the recruiter wanted to know if I "was interviewing anywhere else" before they would schedule an interview with me.
I didn't have any but I would have said 'no' regardless. They have no right to that information. "We want to make sure we're not wasting anyone's time" my ass.
same — i got asked in an interview if i currently had a job and when i said i did, they asked why i was interviewing for other jobs like it was insane of me to search for other opportunities. it’s like they’re afraid if you’re willing to quit your current job you’d be willing to quit their job at some point and like…yes???? that’s how jobs work???
There's this weird song and dance in job searching where they know you probably won't spend the rest of your life working at that company and you know you won't spend the rest of your life at that company, but you have to pretend like that's what you want regardless. Recruiters don't like hiring people they view as unfaithful to the company, so if you're currently with a job and interviewing at other positions just make sure you have a solid story as to why. It could be anything like job expectations not lining up or you want a change of pace or whatever. Just make sure you don't sound like you're just whining about having a bad boss because they'll see that as a red flag too.
I'd like to only have one job for the rest of my working career. But I know my next employer will, at some point, underpay me because policy states they can't increase pay at a rate higher than inflation.
I was told I unemployable for having been out of a job for 5 months. It probably depends on whether they're looking for somone to just put up and shut up.
Yep, predatorial recruiters like people desperate for a job. It's a green flag for them: "desperate will do anything'.
But you don't want to show that kind of desperation to a recruiter. Trust me, it's not worth it.
Weirdly, it's a habit among software developers to pretend to be unemployed when being interviewed and among employers, to pretend to believe. I still struggle to understand why after 20+ years in the industry.
Yes that’s a red flag too. You’re a red flag if you have a job, you’re a red flag if you are interviewing multiple ppl, and you’re a red flag if you appear to be a “job hopper”. You can hope you get lucky enough to have someone who’s can see your value and move you forward in the process.
Recruiters ask for a few reasons, one is so that they don't put you across the desk of someone you've already interviewed with. That said having multiple interviews lined up with different recruiters does make you more attractive to some markets.
Considering it's Amazon, they could use that info to buy the other company where you're interviewing and shut it down just to keep you within their clutches. A fabulous waste of money, yes, but something I think Bezos would do.
Just a heads up, Recruiters will sometimes ask if you're in advanced interview stages or offer stages elsewhere so that they can let the Hiring Manager know your timeline when they submit you to the Hiring Manager.
If you are in advanced interview stages or offer stages elsewhere, tell anyone else you're interviewing with so they know to move their ass if they want a shot at retaining you. If you aren't, lie and say you are anyway. You dont have to provide specifics, and it gives the impression that you're sought after/in demand.
I generally say "yes". Sure, occasionally you might run into this jackass, but the vast majority of the time it induces a sense of FOMO and lights a fire under their asses to speed up the process.
Yah, I wrote this elsewhere. The vast majority of the time they’re asking for your benefit, not to punish you. A lot of very wrong people in this thread.
I get asked this in every interview. Even if the truth is no, the answer is yes. It means you get a call back same day to accelerate or conclude your hiring process.
Careful about your reaction to this question. You may just be harming yourself.
I’ve been asked this question many, many times (and when I ask this question to people in interviews) and it’s purely been to ACCELERATE the interview process if I/they were interviewing elsewhere. That way we can get them an offer first and not lose someone good. It’s always good to put a potential employer on their back foot where they feel they have to rush to get you vs. having their pick of the litter.
Extremely strange response and unprofessional. If the company needs an answer before the end of next week. Just pick up the phone and speak to the candidate about this. It’s called being a grown up.
Yeah this is suchhhhhh a personal, hostile response back! Like it’s Extremely Normal to the point of Standard Canned Response for a candidate to say “let me consider this and I’ll let you know by X date”. Like! People aren’t even necessarily considering other options! They have to talk to spouses, consider finances, look over their upcoming year to review any travel that’s already booked that they’ll need to flag coming in…you don’t just jump into things feet first! The person who wrote back all butt hurt is definitely a loose canon emotionally
And look weak? Pfft, I think not. I am lord and master of this business and I will not stoop so low as to allow potential employee to think they are worthy of my time nor that they are worthy of respect for their time. The audicity of mere peasants. …/s
I saw this on another post and OP explained a bit more. They had a phone call to discuss the offer and OP asked for a week to think about it. The employer sounded put off but agreed. OP then sent this email as a follow up and then got this response.
Covid killed professionalism. people realized slave wages were no longer worth the effort. Folks show up for jobs now but most don’t give any effort; or more accurately people began working at the level they are paid.
In other words; you pay peanuts, you get clowns.
Right?? What the fuck. From terrible grammar & spelling to the blatant unprofessionalism, it’s just terrible that these types of people have the jobs they do.
Good Evening
Thank you for that reply it told me everything I needed to know about your company, I will be removing myself from your pool of candidates
Regards
Name
You didn't break up with me I broke up with you!!
How childish either they extended an offer or they didn't and if they did, quit being such toddlers about not getting a response within 30 seconds.
It’s like when someone calls a woman beautiful and she says “I know” or “not interested” then they come back with “you’re not all that, relax”. Clown behavior
How does labor have any leverage right now? This was the case pre-covid (and during covid for around a year), but right now, labor has no advantage because there are many multiples of people all looking for the same job.
This is also why people all over Reddit are submitting 500+ resumes and getting 2 interviews.
The labor force participation rate is higher now that it was pre-covid, and the unemployment rate is lower now than it was during the pandemic (not including the initial spike and 80% of that can be accounted for if you remove retail jobs) and roughly the same as before it (give or take .02% variance month to month). That means there's a labor SHORTAGE for employers and a job availablity surplus giving potential employees better bargaining power
People all over reddit are submitting 500+ resumes and only getting 2 callbacks because workers are finally fairly evaluating their worth and the new generation of employees aren't corpo dogs that are willing to degrade themselves just so they can be handed a pittance that will get them by month to month from daddy business
Companies don't know what to do with workers who rightfully understand "5+ years experience required" was always a bullshit ploy to pay qualified workers less for starting level positions and workers are more and more willing to barely scrape by instead of bowing down like doormats
Does boot soup taste good, or do you just like basing your opinions off inaccurate information
Absolutely. In fact, it’s totally normal IMO to ask how long you have to accept an offer and/or to let the potential employer know when you will be able to give them an answer.
If they need an answer sooner than what you can provide, then it’s not a match, and they should be able to be mature adults about it.
Their response seems very insecure and childish, and they really should have countered with a timeframe in which the offer still stands to help you make a decision. Immediately saying that the offer may not be on the table is a crimson flag.
This isn’t Shark Tank. You shouldn’t have to make a life-altering decision on the spot.
Agreed. To be power-tripping before the offer is even accepted is absolutely unhinged behavior. This is the stage where an employer should still be courting the employee, since they’ve already decided they want the employee, but the employee hasn’t confirmed that they want the employer back. If they’re doing this already, I can only imagine the heinous, petty shit they pull on their actual employees.
Unless you’re majorly under-qualified and/or over-paid for a job, you don’t need to be eternally grateful to your employer for employing you.
Employment is a business transaction. You’re selling your time and skills for compensation to your employer. If either party feels like the ongoing transaction is no longer worthwhile, they can end it.
In any non-failing business, employees are making the employer profit. Why you should owe a life-debt to someone who profits off your labor is beyond me.
Both parties should treat each other with respect, knowing that maintaining an amicable relationship and a mutually beneficial financial arrangement are vital steps in ensuring the relationship continues to remain strong over time.
When I get a job offer, I ask for it in writing, and I let the employer know that I will get back to them in a few days. I tend to let them know that the answer is "yes," but it is prudent to take a few days to fully digest the written document, run through changes in benefit plans, compare commutes, and rework my personal budget.
One thing that I have learned about people (and I am not an exception to this rule) is that we all tend to hear what we want to hear. Having something written can help me work through whatever weird bias I have in my head.
Great advice. Yeah, I wouldn’t actually fully commit to anything until I have the full formal offer with everything laid out, and I’ll send that back signed as confirmation of acceptance of the position.
Because often times accepting one offer means turning down another(s), and turning down others before having actual, definitive confirmation that this is the job you want and there’s no funny business or miscommunication is vital.
I don’t truly consider the job mine, either from them accepting me or me accepting them, until I have that job offer with pay/position/responsibilities/etc. signed and returned to them haha.
We once had a guy work for my company for 5 days. On that Friday, he went to lunch at Subway. He never returned, simply calling and quitting his job. He had been interviewing at two places at once and didn’t want to show his hand. When my company offered first, he took it. When his preferred company offered at lunch that Friday, he bounced. No one really blamed him. Though the running gag among us underlings when things would be crappy was, “think I may go to Subway for lunch today.”
Funny how certain things stick. My uncle told me a story about a temp they hired. He called to ask for directions to their office (pre internet). Then, at the end of the day, he asked for directions home. His last name was Chuka, and for years after that his coworkers would gauge dumb behavior on a scale of millichukes 😅
The guy might have been on unemployment before taking the job at your company. Many (most?) states require you to accept a job offer or face penalties. I've wound up with really shitty jobs with low pay and tyrant managers before because of this bullshit requirement. It sucks, because you also (in my state, at least) have to apply to at least 2 jobs per week to qualify for a check, so it forces you to apply to stuff that you might not necessarily want just to be able to get your UE payment. I've seen the same thing happen at companies I've worked for where someone gets hired and then a week or two later, they're off to the job they really wanted. I honestly can't blame those folks at all!
At another company, we had a woman who had been on unemployment who took a CS job. The company was AWFUL (like 29 full time positions in the front office and in the 18 months that I was there, I was the 43rd person to quit. We went through 3 COOs, 3 CFOs, and 4 warehouse managers in that time). She was training with the CS lead. At lunch time, she looked the CS Lead squarely in the eyes and said, “being on unemployment was less stressful. I quit.”
This guy came to us from IT at another company (like worked a notice with previous company and then came straight to us on a Monday after his last day was on a Friday). Other company offered him like $20K more and more vacation time. We all understood… even management was like, “hey, good luck with the new gig.”
When they hired the new head of pharmacy for the hospital I work for they asked for about a week to decide. Apparently very common in high level executive or management positions.
Yeah it feels unfair to the other candidates. There are likely others who have interviewed and may be a 2nd or 3rd choice that now how to wait around for a decision from this company because you’re undecided.
If I’m doing the math right here, you’re saying you might take up to 9 days to decide and let them know? Then if (IF, I know) there’s a time it takes to exit your current position, that pushes your start date back however far past that.
Was anything along those lines discussed during the interview process? Possible start date? How long you’d need once you turned in a notice? It seems weird that it wouldn’t be.
The way OP thanks them for being patient with them during the application and interview process makes me wonder if they dragged that process out as well.
That was my takeaway as well - the employer feels strung along already and this wasn’t out of nowhere. An offer was made no later than Wednesday. If you can’t give an answer by the next Monday, I’m assuming it’s because you have another interview on Tuesday.
Just tell them theyre the only one, do this til you get a good offer. Then politely tell them youve got a better offer or quit without notice during orientation or training. This is how I job hunt, those people do not care about my family getting to have pizza night or a nice christmas. They dont care if Im ever home for a birthday or barbeque. Im not going to care if they waste money and resources hiring me and training me.
The day a billionaire makes enough of a change that my generation can afford to be homeowners Ill go work for that person and give my all 100% of the time. Until that day, fuck the rich.
I went through this with a no name firm in Troy, MI after an attempt to scalp me through LinkedIn after I’d been fired from a larger Detroit based mortgage firm.
In short they had ridiculous interview times that didn’t work and wanted to do everything by video only after I video toured my interview space which would potentially be a WFH space for a hybrid job where I’d be expected to be on call post my shift and on weekends. All for $15 and “potential commissions”. NAH.
I replied I’d be willing to hear them out through phone call and only through such. They ghosted. I’m glad.
I had something similar to this where I was waiting for a reply from a job and this place had already offered me a position but I said I wanted to wait before I confirm and sign anything and they told me to basically fuck off in corporate. Now they're closed down, makes me laugh every time i drive past
Mayor of smugtown move:
Forward the email to ceo or president of company and say “I’m fine with you passing on me, just know it’s a shame this is how you are reflected”.
I once I had a recruiter demand to know where else I was interviewing. He also refused to tell me who he was representing. He didn't want to represent me unless I accepted his terms.
I wonder how that worked out for him.
They always hate when their own rules are used against them.
As long as it's respectfully said, which it was, it is okay. Employers need to learn that we get the same courtesies they expect.
My other favorite is when they want you to give two weeks. It's allegedly just a courtesy and if you are able and willing to.
But no they definitely feel entitled to it without saying so.
Just respond, "I greatly appreciate both the demonstration of your company's leadership style, as well as not making me have to tell you I chose to go with my other option."
You need to accept any offer you're willing to take, even if you have other opportunities later. Employers will absolutely complain about people who sign and then quit or no-show. But that's what happens when showing any hesitation from the applicant means they lost the opportunity.
I remember a number of times at my old job where people would accept a job and then never show up. Either we were their backup or they were using it as leverage. If people don't show up to your company, your company probably pays terribly.
You need a whole week + to make a decision? I can see the company’s point of view although they could have handled it without all the sass, such as by making an offer and then providing a deadline.
You need a two week notice to accept an offer?
Like, I get wanting a few days to review the offer in full, wait to see if a different company offers anything, etc., but at what point do you expect a company to hold out for you?
The response was extremely childish, so I get all the other comments and I don't think I'd work there either, but let's be real. An offer comes through on Tuesday most likely and on Wednesday your response is "Let's circle back around and see how I feel a week from Friday so you won't be able to do anything more until the following week."
I had a quite reasonable job offer, in writing, which I accepted. The next day they tried to walk it back when I asked them to confirm one detail that seemed to be in conflict with their internal policy. Turns out the policy was right, and the offer was "miscommunicated".
Then when I objected and said that wasn't reasonble, they rescinded the offer and said I wasn't "culturally aligned" to their organisation.
I applied for some division of Amazon, mostly to get more details about the job. The job was just doing maintenance around the building. Reviews said you might hang whiteboards or fix sensors for equipment. It didn't sound like bad work.
But... I've always heard bad things about Amazon. Always. And the pay wasn't great but it was better than the $16 an hour they were paying "pickers."
You had to sign a contract, work so many years, work any shift any time they said, full availability. By contract they basically own you.
Plus, you have to travel anywhere they tell you to and have no choice.
The only reason I found this out was going through their bullshit preliminary stuff.
It was only a $40k a year job.
I gathered that basically you're not human to them, the company owns you, and the worst part is that people are falling for it.
I left Walmart nearly fifteen years ago and I had worked there a few years. It was soulless. And the company was cold and detached. But they didn't own you or make you feel like a robot. And the coworkers were fun.
Amazon is just pulled straight from a dystopian scifi novel.
They also assumed that you would immediately accept their offer.
They’re full of themselves to say the least since they tried to pin it on to you, making you look like the bad guy.
I don’t understand the anger toward the company. Candidate says hold off & firm says ok, but don’t presume the offer is still on the table.
This is business ppl. I’m a hiring manager & if I make an offer that you reject or postpone, if business needs dictate immediate hiring, then that’s my prerogative. I wouldn’t call this person either. This is so weird of a take.
You don't give candidates a few days to think it over? Mind you, 10 days seems excessive, but two or three business days seems reasonable. Otherwise people will "accept" make you do all the paperwork, and then resign or just never show up.
Unless there is an explicit expiration date on the offer, rescinding it is so unprofessional. It's almost as if they were fishing for a quick reply accepting the offer. I never accept an offer right away. I like to make them sweat for a few days. How they behave during that period tells you a lot about how they'll treat you if you accept.
I think it's OK to rescind it if someone needs that long to consider it, but I'd say it in a much more professional tone, like "Hey, I appreciate you're looking but for awareness this offer is valid until X... after that we will have to consider our other candidates." That's more the norm.
Let me give you my thoughts as a hiring manager.
I'll give you 2-3 days and that is it. If it takes you more than a week to make a decision it's not going to end well.
You should have accepted the offer and been all smiles. If the other offer came in and that was a better offer, take it. You owe nothing to employer A in this case.
Both parties suck here. Taking a couple days to make a decision is one thing but saying you’ll get back to them next week seems kinda long. Not defending the company since they clearly don’t know how to respond professionally but they are clearly looking to fill a position sooner rather than later.
The only thing this is training is for employees to accept more offers than they can fill and then rescind after accepting is that what they really want?
I'm sorry that happened. I would have had to have a phone conversation to clear the air. I would try to get to the bottom of the about face. If you really want it, tell them so but, I see the red flags in this way. If everything lines up besides this, maybe take it. Their reply is certainly crappy but, I work around crappy stuff daily. Regardless - I wish you the best!
Got one of these myself when I asked clarifying questions about their vague language regarding compensation for my services as a therapist. Like good luck finding someone not confused by your slave labor wages
>Please do not assume you still have an offer from us.
I’m not assuming, I know I will. Thanks!
Or.
Correct, not this offer but a better one after we negotiate.
That’s just a sign they weren’t meant for you…
But also, you can accept and rescind it later if your other opportunity offers you a position.
If the second opportunity offers you a job, it doesn’t matter if you delay accepting the position for the first one or turn it down later, you’re still burning that bridge.
Play the game so you don’t leave yourself without a job.
If you’re not going to take the offer then they need to make an offer to another candidate. I look at this and think about how rude YOU were in thinking that all the other candidates they were interviewing should just sit on hold because you wanted TEN DAYS to respond. That’s ludicrous and I honestly find it hard to believe that any hiring manager would see that as appropriate.
The company should have told you up front that the offer had an expiration, usually something like “please let us know by Friday if you’re accepting this offer” or three days. And if they didn’t, then they should have responded in this email asking for an answer within 48 hours.
Jesus. In what word is taking ten days to take a job good? I mean I guess I could see it you had to move across the country, but you should have figured that out before getting the offer.
I don't blame them for their response.
I got an interview offer at Amazon and the recruiter wanted to know if I "was interviewing anywhere else" before they would schedule an interview with me. I didn't have any but I would have said 'no' regardless. They have no right to that information. "We want to make sure we're not wasting anyone's time" my ass.
"Am I the only candidate you're interviewing? Wouldn't want you to waste my time"
But don’t recruiters think it’s a red flag if you are not being interviewed elsewhere too? LOL
No, the red flag is that you don't already have a job. They don't like hiring people who aren't currently working.
Funny because i’ve experienced the opposite lol
same — i got asked in an interview if i currently had a job and when i said i did, they asked why i was interviewing for other jobs like it was insane of me to search for other opportunities. it’s like they’re afraid if you’re willing to quit your current job you’d be willing to quit their job at some point and like…yes???? that’s how jobs work???
That’s exactly what they’re afraid of, “this employee is willing to move on from better things rather than suffer bullshit”
There's this weird song and dance in job searching where they know you probably won't spend the rest of your life working at that company and you know you won't spend the rest of your life at that company, but you have to pretend like that's what you want regardless. Recruiters don't like hiring people they view as unfaithful to the company, so if you're currently with a job and interviewing at other positions just make sure you have a solid story as to why. It could be anything like job expectations not lining up or you want a change of pace or whatever. Just make sure you don't sound like you're just whining about having a bad boss because they'll see that as a red flag too.
It’s red flags no matter what you do. You can’t really overthink it, except to go in and hope for the best.
I'd like to only have one job for the rest of my working career. But I know my next employer will, at some point, underpay me because policy states they can't increase pay at a rate higher than inflation.
Or you get RIF’ed
I was told I unemployable for having been out of a job for 5 months. It probably depends on whether they're looking for somone to just put up and shut up.
Yep, predatorial recruiters like people desperate for a job. It's a green flag for them: "desperate will do anything'. But you don't want to show that kind of desperation to a recruiter. Trust me, it's not worth it.
Weirdly, it's a habit among software developers to pretend to be unemployed when being interviewed and among employers, to pretend to believe. I still struggle to understand why after 20+ years in the industry.
This is not actually a problem for professionals fyi, it’s an issue for low wage workers primarily.
Yes that’s a red flag too. You’re a red flag if you have a job, you’re a red flag if you are interviewing multiple ppl, and you’re a red flag if you appear to be a “job hopper”. You can hope you get lucky enough to have someone who’s can see your value and move you forward in the process.
Recruiters ask for a few reasons, one is so that they don't put you across the desk of someone you've already interviewed with. That said having multiple interviews lined up with different recruiters does make you more attractive to some markets.
No - you can just say you’re looking opportunistically and this company caught your eye, but you’re otherwise happy in your current role.
Sure fire way to get the lowest offer.
showing up is a sure fire way to get the lowest offer lol
Considering it's Amazon, they could use that info to buy the other company where you're interviewing and shut it down just to keep you within their clutches. A fabulous waste of money, yes, but something I think Bezos would do.
That sounds more like a Musk thing he'd do. But I don't think Bezos is better than that too. Reality is saddening.
If Jeff buys Relativity... Edit spelling
Bezos doesn’t run Amazon. Hasn’t for years.
Just a heads up, Recruiters will sometimes ask if you're in advanced interview stages or offer stages elsewhere so that they can let the Hiring Manager know your timeline when they submit you to the Hiring Manager. If you are in advanced interview stages or offer stages elsewhere, tell anyone else you're interviewing with so they know to move their ass if they want a shot at retaining you. If you aren't, lie and say you are anyway. You dont have to provide specifics, and it gives the impression that you're sought after/in demand.
Amazon is particularly vicious in their interview process. They only want the hungriest. Not necessarily a good thing.
I generally say "yes". Sure, occasionally you might run into this jackass, but the vast majority of the time it induces a sense of FOMO and lights a fire under their asses to speed up the process.
Yah, I wrote this elsewhere. The vast majority of the time they’re asking for your benefit, not to punish you. A lot of very wrong people in this thread. I get asked this in every interview. Even if the truth is no, the answer is yes. It means you get a call back same day to accelerate or conclude your hiring process.
Well that was stupid. You say yes to that question even if it’s not true….
I actually get asked that ever time.
I would say yes so they know I’m in demand.
Careful about your reaction to this question. You may just be harming yourself. I’ve been asked this question many, many times (and when I ask this question to people in interviews) and it’s purely been to ACCELERATE the interview process if I/they were interviewing elsewhere. That way we can get them an offer first and not lose someone good. It’s always good to put a potential employer on their back foot where they feel they have to rush to get you vs. having their pick of the litter.
Extremely strange response and unprofessional. If the company needs an answer before the end of next week. Just pick up the phone and speak to the candidate about this. It’s called being a grown up.
Yeah this is suchhhhhh a personal, hostile response back! Like it’s Extremely Normal to the point of Standard Canned Response for a candidate to say “let me consider this and I’ll let you know by X date”. Like! People aren’t even necessarily considering other options! They have to talk to spouses, consider finances, look over their upcoming year to review any travel that’s already booked that they’ll need to flag coming in…you don’t just jump into things feet first! The person who wrote back all butt hurt is definitely a loose canon emotionally
When people show you who they really are, believe them.
Red flag!
[удалено]
In the original post, OP stated that the VP was the one to offer him the job. I doubt the owner isn't aware of this.
And look weak? Pfft, I think not. I am lord and master of this business and I will not stoop so low as to allow potential employee to think they are worthy of my time nor that they are worthy of respect for their time. The audicity of mere peasants. …/s
I saw this on another post and OP explained a bit more. They had a phone call to discuss the offer and OP asked for a week to think about it. The employer sounded put off but agreed. OP then sent this email as a follow up and then got this response.
I’ve never received an offer where they didn’t tell me when they needed a response by. It’s good for both sides to set clear expectations
Is anybody, like… professional anymore?
Covid killed professionalism. people realized slave wages were no longer worth the effort. Folks show up for jobs now but most don’t give any effort; or more accurately people began working at the level they are paid. In other words; you pay peanuts, you get clowns.
Right?? What the fuck. From terrible grammar & spelling to the blatant unprofessionalism, it’s just terrible that these types of people have the jobs they do.
Good Evening Thank you for that reply it told me everything I needed to know about your company, I will be removing myself from your pool of candidates Regards Name
Too formal. "lol. K"
I like being formal passive aggressive
Best way to handle narcissistic.
I was replied with “bummer take it ease” to this jack ass who has lit me during the interview process
Why lol when you can just K 🫠
Because I lol'd
This is the way
Inappropriate and unnecessarily threatening response. Extremely odd.
"Well, that really helped me make my decision. Thank you for letting dodge this bullet."
You didn't break up with me I broke up with you!! How childish either they extended an offer or they didn't and if they did, quit being such toddlers about not getting a response within 30 seconds.
It’s like when someone calls a woman beautiful and she says “I know” or “not interested” then they come back with “you’re not all that, relax”. Clown behavior
We're in a weird spot where labor has more and more leverage and a lot of businesses don't know how to handle that loss of power over interviewees.
It makes it easy to spot the power mongers.
How does labor have any leverage right now? This was the case pre-covid (and during covid for around a year), but right now, labor has no advantage because there are many multiples of people all looking for the same job. This is also why people all over Reddit are submitting 500+ resumes and getting 2 interviews.
The labor force participation rate is higher now that it was pre-covid, and the unemployment rate is lower now than it was during the pandemic (not including the initial spike and 80% of that can be accounted for if you remove retail jobs) and roughly the same as before it (give or take .02% variance month to month). That means there's a labor SHORTAGE for employers and a job availablity surplus giving potential employees better bargaining power People all over reddit are submitting 500+ resumes and only getting 2 callbacks because workers are finally fairly evaluating their worth and the new generation of employees aren't corpo dogs that are willing to degrade themselves just so they can be handed a pittance that will get them by month to month from daddy business Companies don't know what to do with workers who rightfully understand "5+ years experience required" was always a bullshit ploy to pay qualified workers less for starting level positions and workers are more and more willing to barely scrape by instead of bowing down like doormats Does boot soup taste good, or do you just like basing your opinions off inaccurate information
This is not the right post to be making this point.
Seems like you dodged a bullet
Absolutely. In fact, it’s totally normal IMO to ask how long you have to accept an offer and/or to let the potential employer know when you will be able to give them an answer. If they need an answer sooner than what you can provide, then it’s not a match, and they should be able to be mature adults about it. Their response seems very insecure and childish, and they really should have countered with a timeframe in which the offer still stands to help you make a decision. Immediately saying that the offer may not be on the table is a crimson flag. This isn’t Shark Tank. You shouldn’t have to make a life-altering decision on the spot.
This is someone who thinks employees should have a life debt to them because they deigned to offer them a job. Fuck em.
Agreed. To be power-tripping before the offer is even accepted is absolutely unhinged behavior. This is the stage where an employer should still be courting the employee, since they’ve already decided they want the employee, but the employee hasn’t confirmed that they want the employer back. If they’re doing this already, I can only imagine the heinous, petty shit they pull on their actual employees. Unless you’re majorly under-qualified and/or over-paid for a job, you don’t need to be eternally grateful to your employer for employing you. Employment is a business transaction. You’re selling your time and skills for compensation to your employer. If either party feels like the ongoing transaction is no longer worthwhile, they can end it. In any non-failing business, employees are making the employer profit. Why you should owe a life-debt to someone who profits off your labor is beyond me. Both parties should treat each other with respect, knowing that maintaining an amicable relationship and a mutually beneficial financial arrangement are vital steps in ensuring the relationship continues to remain strong over time.
This guy will have trouble filling the position and conclude that no one wants to work anymore. In reality, no one wants to work for that guy anymore.
When I get a job offer, I ask for it in writing, and I let the employer know that I will get back to them in a few days. I tend to let them know that the answer is "yes," but it is prudent to take a few days to fully digest the written document, run through changes in benefit plans, compare commutes, and rework my personal budget. One thing that I have learned about people (and I am not an exception to this rule) is that we all tend to hear what we want to hear. Having something written can help me work through whatever weird bias I have in my head.
Great advice. Yeah, I wouldn’t actually fully commit to anything until I have the full formal offer with everything laid out, and I’ll send that back signed as confirmation of acceptance of the position. Because often times accepting one offer means turning down another(s), and turning down others before having actual, definitive confirmation that this is the job you want and there’s no funny business or miscommunication is vital. I don’t truly consider the job mine, either from them accepting me or me accepting them, until I have that job offer with pay/position/responsibilities/etc. signed and returned to them haha.
We once had a guy work for my company for 5 days. On that Friday, he went to lunch at Subway. He never returned, simply calling and quitting his job. He had been interviewing at two places at once and didn’t want to show his hand. When my company offered first, he took it. When his preferred company offered at lunch that Friday, he bounced. No one really blamed him. Though the running gag among us underlings when things would be crappy was, “think I may go to Subway for lunch today.”
Funny how certain things stick. My uncle told me a story about a temp they hired. He called to ask for directions to their office (pre internet). Then, at the end of the day, he asked for directions home. His last name was Chuka, and for years after that his coworkers would gauge dumb behavior on a scale of millichukes 😅
The guy might have been on unemployment before taking the job at your company. Many (most?) states require you to accept a job offer or face penalties. I've wound up with really shitty jobs with low pay and tyrant managers before because of this bullshit requirement. It sucks, because you also (in my state, at least) have to apply to at least 2 jobs per week to qualify for a check, so it forces you to apply to stuff that you might not necessarily want just to be able to get your UE payment. I've seen the same thing happen at companies I've worked for where someone gets hired and then a week or two later, they're off to the job they really wanted. I honestly can't blame those folks at all!
At another company, we had a woman who had been on unemployment who took a CS job. The company was AWFUL (like 29 full time positions in the front office and in the 18 months that I was there, I was the 43rd person to quit. We went through 3 COOs, 3 CFOs, and 4 warehouse managers in that time). She was training with the CS lead. At lunch time, she looked the CS Lead squarely in the eyes and said, “being on unemployment was less stressful. I quit.” This guy came to us from IT at another company (like worked a notice with previous company and then came straight to us on a Monday after his last day was on a Friday). Other company offered him like $20K more and more vacation time. We all understood… even management was like, “hey, good luck with the new gig.”
Childish reply. Very unprofessional. They couldn't pay me enough to work there. This is probably a blessing for you.
What, did you apply to a company created by spoiled children WTF
Spoiled Children LLC
Just do what i did, accept the offer, but keep interviewing and looking at your options. You can back out at any time, and make up a bs excuse
Uno Reverso: accept offer, Continue to think it over, if you dont like it, Quit on March 8th.
You’re not breaking up with me, because I’m breaking up with you first!
Oh, that isn't just a red flag. We are just so far beyond red flags at this point.
FWIW, Next time I wouldn’t give them anymore info than necessary. Just say I would like a few days to think about it.
Sounds pissed you didn’t bow down and immediately accept. Reply back you gonna pass on their remarkable offer.
You’ve got about 48-96 hours, at most. I would never assume that any offer would be open for 10+ days.
Agree, but then you say something like "due to our internal procedures, we need an answer on x day".
When they hired the new head of pharmacy for the hospital I work for they asked for about a week to decide. Apparently very common in high level executive or management positions.
Yeah it feels unfair to the other candidates. There are likely others who have interviewed and may be a 2nd or 3rd choice that now how to wait around for a decision from this company because you’re undecided.
Yeah that's absurd
Looks like someone dodged a bullet.
If I’m doing the math right here, you’re saying you might take up to 9 days to decide and let them know? Then if (IF, I know) there’s a time it takes to exit your current position, that pushes your start date back however far past that. Was anything along those lines discussed during the interview process? Possible start date? How long you’d need once you turned in a notice? It seems weird that it wouldn’t be.
The way OP thanks them for being patient with them during the application and interview process makes me wonder if they dragged that process out as well.
That was my takeaway as well - the employer feels strung along already and this wasn’t out of nowhere. An offer was made no later than Wednesday. If you can’t give an answer by the next Monday, I’m assuming it’s because you have another interview on Tuesday.
See that hole in the wall behind you? It was created by the bullet you just dodged.
Just tell them theyre the only one, do this til you get a good offer. Then politely tell them youve got a better offer or quit without notice during orientation or training. This is how I job hunt, those people do not care about my family getting to have pizza night or a nice christmas. They dont care if Im ever home for a birthday or barbeque. Im not going to care if they waste money and resources hiring me and training me. The day a billionaire makes enough of a change that my generation can afford to be homeowners Ill go work for that person and give my all 100% of the time. Until that day, fuck the rich.
Did your offer letter include an expiration date? This is wildly unprofessional.
I went through this with a no name firm in Troy, MI after an attempt to scalp me through LinkedIn after I’d been fired from a larger Detroit based mortgage firm. In short they had ridiculous interview times that didn’t work and wanted to do everything by video only after I video toured my interview space which would potentially be a WFH space for a hybrid job where I’d be expected to be on call post my shift and on weekends. All for $15 and “potential commissions”. NAH. I replied I’d be willing to hear them out through phone call and only through such. They ghosted. I’m glad.
I had something similar to this where I was waiting for a reply from a job and this place had already offered me a position but I said I wanted to wait before I confirm and sign anything and they told me to basically fuck off in corporate. Now they're closed down, makes me laugh every time i drive past
Mayor of smugtown move: Forward the email to ceo or president of company and say “I’m fine with you passing on me, just know it’s a shame this is how you are reflected”.
I once I had a recruiter demand to know where else I was interviewing. He also refused to tell me who he was representing. He didn't want to represent me unless I accepted his terms. I wonder how that worked out for him.
They should have had a deadline in the offer for you to accept or decline. Most give a week.
Lmao! Dodged a bullet for real!
You know what you go ahead and hire the second best. I withdraw my application.
Fukabuncha that! They did u a favor.
"Well looks like you handed me the red flag i needed to make the decision. Thanks for making my decision to not accept your offer so easy!"
Wew big red flag 🚩
🚩 🚩🚩
Wow, very passive aggressive. Red flag. Dodged a bullet.
Bye Felicia!
They always hate when their own rules are used against them. As long as it's respectfully said, which it was, it is okay. Employers need to learn that we get the same courtesies they expect. My other favorite is when they want you to give two weeks. It's allegedly just a courtesy and if you are able and willing to. But no they definitely feel entitled to it without saying so.
This reads like a whiney teenager from the employer side
Well you lucked out.
Lack of context OP. What did they originally say to make you think there was an offer?
There's context if you go to the linked post
Looks like they did you a favor.
Just respond, "I greatly appreciate both the demonstration of your company's leadership style, as well as not making me have to tell you I chose to go with my other option."
You dodged a bullet right there, buddy.
Perfect response back thank you for making my decision for me
Which company was mentioned so I can never give them business
Angry before they're even an employee to start harassing slowly over the first 6 months and then have HR deny it like a psychopath
You need to accept any offer you're willing to take, even if you have other opportunities later. Employers will absolutely complain about people who sign and then quit or no-show. But that's what happens when showing any hesitation from the applicant means they lost the opportunity. I remember a number of times at my old job where people would accept a job and then never show up. Either we were their backup or they were using it as leverage. If people don't show up to your company, your company probably pays terribly.
You need a whole week + to make a decision? I can see the company’s point of view although they could have handled it without all the sass, such as by making an offer and then providing a deadline.
That's a shitty employer. It's terribly bad from to make an offer and not give someone at least a few days to decide.
You need a two week notice to accept an offer? Like, I get wanting a few days to review the offer in full, wait to see if a different company offers anything, etc., but at what point do you expect a company to hold out for you? The response was extremely childish, so I get all the other comments and I don't think I'd work there either, but let's be real. An offer comes through on Tuesday most likely and on Wednesday your response is "Let's circle back around and see how I feel a week from Friday so you won't be able to do anything more until the following week."
And that's when I would withdraw my app. Right then and there
Well that just made your decision a lot easier! Who would choose to work with someone like this? Damn!!
“You have 20 seconds to comply”
I had a quite reasonable job offer, in writing, which I accepted. The next day they tried to walk it back when I asked them to confirm one detail that seemed to be in conflict with their internal policy. Turns out the policy was right, and the offer was "miscommunicated". Then when I objected and said that wasn't reasonble, they rescinded the offer and said I wasn't "culturally aligned" to their organisation.
I applied for some division of Amazon, mostly to get more details about the job. The job was just doing maintenance around the building. Reviews said you might hang whiteboards or fix sensors for equipment. It didn't sound like bad work. But... I've always heard bad things about Amazon. Always. And the pay wasn't great but it was better than the $16 an hour they were paying "pickers." You had to sign a contract, work so many years, work any shift any time they said, full availability. By contract they basically own you. Plus, you have to travel anywhere they tell you to and have no choice. The only reason I found this out was going through their bullshit preliminary stuff. It was only a $40k a year job. I gathered that basically you're not human to them, the company owns you, and the worst part is that people are falling for it. I left Walmart nearly fifteen years ago and I had worked there a few years. It was soulless. And the company was cold and detached. But they didn't own you or make you feel like a robot. And the coworkers were fun. Amazon is just pulled straight from a dystopian scifi novel.
Red flag. Drop them quickly. Asshole message = toxic working environment.
They also assumed that you would immediately accept their offer. They’re full of themselves to say the least since they tried to pin it on to you, making you look like the bad guy.
I don’t understand the anger toward the company. Candidate says hold off & firm says ok, but don’t presume the offer is still on the table. This is business ppl. I’m a hiring manager & if I make an offer that you reject or postpone, if business needs dictate immediate hiring, then that’s my prerogative. I wouldn’t call this person either. This is so weird of a take.
You don't give candidates a few days to think it over? Mind you, 10 days seems excessive, but two or three business days seems reasonable. Otherwise people will "accept" make you do all the paperwork, and then resign or just never show up.
Unless there is an explicit expiration date on the offer, rescinding it is so unprofessional. It's almost as if they were fishing for a quick reply accepting the offer. I never accept an offer right away. I like to make them sweat for a few days. How they behave during that period tells you a lot about how they'll treat you if you accept.
I think it's OK to rescind it if someone needs that long to consider it, but I'd say it in a much more professional tone, like "Hey, I appreciate you're looking but for awareness this offer is valid until X... after that we will have to consider our other candidates." That's more the norm.
Let me give you my thoughts as a hiring manager. I'll give you 2-3 days and that is it. If it takes you more than a week to make a decision it's not going to end well. You should have accepted the offer and been all smiles. If the other offer came in and that was a better offer, take it. You owe nothing to employer A in this case.
Both parties suck here. Taking a couple days to make a decision is one thing but saying you’ll get back to them next week seems kinda long. Not defending the company since they clearly don’t know how to respond professionally but they are clearly looking to fill a position sooner rather than later.
Bullet: Dodged
Most companies are terrible at hiring and will strongly consider their runner up if you don't accept right away.
Seems like the normal way to deal with a job offer is to accept it immediately and then ghost them when the other better job offer comes through.
You people need to talk to the other side over the phone. Most of these sites seem data gathering
Decision made.
The only thing this is training is for employees to accept more offers than they can fill and then rescind after accepting is that what they really want?
I'm sorry that happened. I would have had to have a phone conversation to clear the air. I would try to get to the bottom of the about face. If you really want it, tell them so but, I see the red flags in this way. If everything lines up besides this, maybe take it. Their reply is certainly crappy but, I work around crappy stuff daily. Regardless - I wish you the best!
I want to know who this was
Some bitchy HR in play
Annnnnnnnnd Red Flag
Got one of these myself when I asked clarifying questions about their vague language regarding compensation for my services as a therapist. Like good luck finding someone not confused by your slave labor wages
>Please do not assume you still have an offer from us. I’m not assuming, I know I will. Thanks! Or. Correct, not this offer but a better one after we negotiate.
Thank you for letting me know how you out treat your employees. Best of luck to you.
That’s just a sign they weren’t meant for you… But also, you can accept and rescind it later if your other opportunity offers you a position. If the second opportunity offers you a job, it doesn’t matter if you delay accepting the position for the first one or turn it down later, you’re still burning that bridge. Play the game so you don’t leave yourself without a job.
If you’re not going to take the offer then they need to make an offer to another candidate. I look at this and think about how rude YOU were in thinking that all the other candidates they were interviewing should just sit on hold because you wanted TEN DAYS to respond. That’s ludicrous and I honestly find it hard to believe that any hiring manager would see that as appropriate. The company should have told you up front that the offer had an expiration, usually something like “please let us know by Friday if you’re accepting this offer” or three days. And if they didn’t, then they should have responded in this email asking for an answer within 48 hours.
Original post got deleted. Can anyone reup?
10 days for a decision? Unless you’re going for a director-level role or higher, you should give a response within 3-4 working days.
Jesus. In what word is taking ten days to take a job good? I mean I guess I could see it you had to move across the country, but you should have figured that out before getting the offer. I don't blame them for their response.
Think you dodged a bullet not working there
Accept the offer. Then no show if there’s a better offer.