FWIW you lose stabilization if you record in the higher resolution modes. Which does matter if you’re handheld. Less so if you have the phone on a gimbal.
The default camera app will always stabilize spatial video and shoot 30fps to get more light to reduce blur. That’s why it’s 1080p30
This app allows you to go to 1080p60 at the expense of light. Or 4k30 at the expense of stabilization.
All the APIs it uses are part of the Apple SDK, so the default camera app just made a default choice that works for the majority of people.
This is much like how Halide offers tons more options than the camera app. It’s not because Apple can’t do it, it’s because they make the APIs for other apps to do it, and pick defaults for the camera app
This is what I like about how Apple does it; they make their product work good for most people. Those that want more specialized setups can get access through their SDK from other apps 😊
I am usually the first person willing to shit on Apple but in this case I have to hold their side. An excessive amount of options just confuses people. This is what the AppStore is for.
From the article: A $3 third-party app can now record spatial video on iPhone 15 Pro models in a higher resolution than Apple's very own Camera app.
Thanks to an update first spotted by UploadVR, Spatialify can now record spatial videos with HDR in 1080p at 60fps or in 4K at 30fps. In comparison, Apple's native Camera app is limited to recording spatial video in 1080p at 30fps.
Shortly after Apple's Vision Pro headset launched in February in the United States, Apple released iOS 17.2, which brought the new spatial video recording format to iPhone 15 Pro models.
When viewed on iPhone, spatial video appear as normal videos, but viewed on Vision Pro they provide an immersive viewing experience on Vision Pro that is almost three-dimensional.
Combined with advanced computational videography techniques and HEVC compression, spatial videos filmed at 30fps in 1080p take up around 130MB of storage space for one minute of video, so bear that in mind when shooting using Spatialify's higher resolution options, which will take up substantially more storage.
I think inside the video hevc bitstream there must be two frames for each frame of video, effectively doubling the required fps in the actual encoding.
One frame must be for left camera and one for right camera for each frame. Interesting challenge but might be easier for the actual encoding if each left frame is used as reference for the right frame since the difference of Luma between them would be very less. Since encoding algorithms usually focus on Luma more than chroma since human eyes don’t notice color difference that much, it must be easier to encode but still a lot more space needed. Almost double but not exactly double.
MV-HEVC takes advantage of the fact that spatial videos share a lot of the same image, just from slightly different angles.
[https://blog.mikeswanson.com/post/746216801650753536/encoding-spatial-video](https://blog.mikeswanson.com/post/746216801650753536/encoding-spatial-video)
Basically, one "eye" (left or right) is the "main" view and is encoded as full-frame video. This is what you see when viewing the video on a non-spatially-aware device like an iPhone, and it will be the same size on-disk as a regular HEVC video. The second stream encodes only the difference between the "main eye" and "the other eye", so the result is much, much smaller than it would be if it encoded an entire second frame of video.
> Shoots Better Quality
The reality is it shoots higher resolution which is not necessarily better quality, not to mention the loss of stabilization.
Complete clickbait title.
I haven’t tried the video to comment on the quality difference, if any, but it’s interesting that there is a spatial PHOTO mode to take 3d pictures with the app: this is something I was hoping to be able to do on the iPhone. I’ll test it out but let’s hope the native iPhone app can do that as well soon.
I have this app and the spatial photos are just ok. They're just 3D photos, like the ones I could take on my 3DS over a decade ago. The issue is that because the iPhone's cameras are so close together, the 3D effect isn't strong unless you're taking a closeup - and the high min focus distance of the main sensor blurs anything that's closer than 8in away. So you either end up with photos of faraway subjects that don't really look 3D, or photos of close subjects that are weirdly blurred because one eye is seeing a blurry subject. It's fun to mess with but I can see why it's not an official feature.
It is quite hilarious that the minimum focus distance on the new pro cameras pretty much make it impossible to record stereo videos with any real depth to them
But then again spatial video on the iPhone currently is a bit of a gimmick…
It's absolutely a gimmick (not to mention 1080p 30fps is unpleasantly low for spatial videos in the first place) and there's not much they can do either unless they change the main camera back to a smaller sensor. I'm curious if they try to improve this in the future or the feature remains a gimmick
as far as I'm concerned anything less than two identical lenses at the correct interocular distance isnt worth hassle.
they gotta sort that out before we quibble about resolution and frame rates
Alternate headline: app for enthusiasts can make feature tradeoffs Apple won’t choose in stock app used by a billion people.
I will speculate that the 1080p60 recording experiences frame drops or other issues under edge cases like background activity, bunch of notifications landing, etc. Which is fine for an indie dev, and not fine for Apple.
Why would you speculate that, based off what?
The comments seem to suggest the opposite, from what people have tested.
It wouldn’t be the first time Apple has withheld features for a newer device that’s been “backported” by devs.
Nothing is being back ported. Apple provides access to a bunch of APIs that offer a bunch of features. The stock app doesn't expose all the options because Apple literally never does this. They pick the best tradeoffs and stick with it.
As others have pointed out, recording at a higher frame rate results in losses in stabilisation as well as results in more storage consumption. That’s the trade off.
It’s honestly kind of baffling you don’t realise that spatial videos probably require great stabilisation to work. Can you imagine how sick you’d feel if that wasn’t the case?
It’s honestly kind of baffling you don’t realise that spatial videos probably require great stabilisation to work. Can you imagine how sick you’d feel if that wasn’t the case?
Clearly apple thought it was worse? WHy do you think they didnt go above 1080p30fps? Just for shits and giggles? Lol
Has anyone actually tried this app to confirm or deny? Otherwise we all are just talking into the air.
Yes but none of that says frame drops. Apple hardware and software is usually really good at avoiding dropping frames, and this software is juts using the Apple SDK which supports 4k60 native.
This Reddit is so damn weird. It’s like Apple pays these people to argue for them with complete disregard for plausibility no matter how obviously Apple is in the wrong. It’s like a sub filled with Trump’s lawyers working for Apple lmao
Imagine how weird these subs are for people who have worked in tech for 30 years and managed similar products, and who have a real idea of both how the tech works and the way products are built, and who then see all these weird emotional conspiracy theories where strange people think that giving context is somehow a sign of loyalty to a company.
I assure you, it is very strange indeed. Back in my day, youngin, tech enthusiasts largely put reality over cheesy pro- and anti-company emotions.
I think its more to do with apple design philosophy. People assume that the reasons for things are due to that, and to be honest, with no further information its plenty plausible.
It could be as simple as apple not having tested it enough to conclude it wont effect the performance and have things like frame drops in edge cases enough to confidently ship it. Definitely they cant test absolutely everything possible, and when they cant they limit it instead of ship it even if upon testing it would be ok… they cant confirm it
I think it has much much much more to do with the Apple marketing behemoth than design. They have amazing and incredibly funded omnipresent PR that has gotten people thinking the richest company in the world is just looking out for their personal interests
Im under no delusions about that lol. Both can be true at the same time you know? They aren’t necessarily looking out for MY interests but their design philosophy certainly comes with security benefits that benefit me
You don’t know that. The weird thing about this sub is how they always make assumptions about things they don’t know in Apple’s favor just like you’ve done here, regardless of how loudly Occam’s Razor is screaming that Apple has done simply something poorly
You can also make cool 3d models using the LiDAR cams but only through 3rd party apps. It’s amazing how much cool stuff our phone is capable of but not natively, unlocked by brainy third party developers.
iOS comes with a 3D scanning framework, it's just not exposed in any of the default apps. So most of those apps didn't build their own tech. Some did though.
Related - the ‘manual’ camera apps are great. I use Camera M which was $8 I think (one time). You can capture raw + jpeg, easily control the exposure and all that. …iPhone default camera tends to over expose a little.
The Vision Pro video recording has issues shooting if you are moving, as it loses tracking, giving you a warning. Thinking an app needs to fix it so you can move and keep recording. Kind of silly.
I love this app, have been using it since Spatial recording became available mostly because I use it to convert Spatial format to SBS so I can then view it on my Lume Pad 2. Even viewing on a device like Quest 3, because it’s shown like a normal video but in 3D & not 180 or 360 (taking up almost all of your field of view), stabilisation isn’t as important. It might make the viewing experience slightly more comfortable but it’s not totally necessary
This coming from the company who uses their camera as a Marketing Sales Point. HAHAHA
If only they went with a 200 Megapixel camera and a processor, RAM, and HD (with microSD slot) that could handle it. Oh well, here we are.
The reason why it is the way it is on the native camera app is for space conservation. I wish we had the option to choose between more space vs lower quality
FWIW you lose stabilization if you record in the higher resolution modes. Which does matter if you’re handheld. Less so if you have the phone on a gimbal.
so this app + gimbal > camera app spatial video?
Can you elaborate on that. Is this true for the native camera app as well?
The default camera app will always stabilize spatial video and shoot 30fps to get more light to reduce blur. That’s why it’s 1080p30 This app allows you to go to 1080p60 at the expense of light. Or 4k30 at the expense of stabilization. All the APIs it uses are part of the Apple SDK, so the default camera app just made a default choice that works for the majority of people. This is much like how Halide offers tons more options than the camera app. It’s not because Apple can’t do it, it’s because they make the APIs for other apps to do it, and pick defaults for the camera app
This is what I like about how Apple does it; they make their product work good for most people. Those that want more specialized setups can get access through their SDK from other apps 😊
Why not put an option for the user to select but keep the same defaults?
I am usually the first person willing to shit on Apple but in this case I have to hold their side. An excessive amount of options just confuses people. This is what the AppStore is for.
because the majority of people that aren’t big into tech will click the biggest number not knowing what the trade off is
Braindead
This explains why some of the test videos I took with this app are so jittery, I was so disappointed.
https://preview.redd.it/9pi1oe7ogbrc1.jpeg?width=1290&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b44b264ad48d4e6a6050bbb88741c67d79ffbcb3
>!"for what it's worth" to anyone that were wondering, folga wooga imoga womp!<
Don’t listen to this guy, he’s a big fat liar
From the article: A $3 third-party app can now record spatial video on iPhone 15 Pro models in a higher resolution than Apple's very own Camera app. Thanks to an update first spotted by UploadVR, Spatialify can now record spatial videos with HDR in 1080p at 60fps or in 4K at 30fps. In comparison, Apple's native Camera app is limited to recording spatial video in 1080p at 30fps. Shortly after Apple's Vision Pro headset launched in February in the United States, Apple released iOS 17.2, which brought the new spatial video recording format to iPhone 15 Pro models. When viewed on iPhone, spatial video appear as normal videos, but viewed on Vision Pro they provide an immersive viewing experience on Vision Pro that is almost three-dimensional. Combined with advanced computational videography techniques and HEVC compression, spatial videos filmed at 30fps in 1080p take up around 130MB of storage space for one minute of video, so bear that in mind when shooting using Spatialify's higher resolution options, which will take up substantially more storage.
I think inside the video hevc bitstream there must be two frames for each frame of video, effectively doubling the required fps in the actual encoding. One frame must be for left camera and one for right camera for each frame. Interesting challenge but might be easier for the actual encoding if each left frame is used as reference for the right frame since the difference of Luma between them would be very less. Since encoding algorithms usually focus on Luma more than chroma since human eyes don’t notice color difference that much, it must be easier to encode but still a lot more space needed. Almost double but not exactly double.
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MV-HEVC takes advantage of the fact that spatial videos share a lot of the same image, just from slightly different angles. [https://blog.mikeswanson.com/post/746216801650753536/encoding-spatial-video](https://blog.mikeswanson.com/post/746216801650753536/encoding-spatial-video) Basically, one "eye" (left or right) is the "main" view and is encoded as full-frame video. This is what you see when viewing the video on a non-spatially-aware device like an iPhone, and it will be the same size on-disk as a regular HEVC video. The second stream encodes only the difference between the "main eye" and "the other eye", so the result is much, much smaller than it would be if it encoded an entire second frame of video.
> Shoots Better Quality The reality is it shoots higher resolution which is not necessarily better quality, not to mention the loss of stabilization. Complete clickbait title.
Too bad the article doesn’t say how much space “substantially more storage” is for that same one minute.
Probably same as 4k/60 for 4k/30 spatial
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Or it’s a fair critique of bad reporting?
I haven’t tried the video to comment on the quality difference, if any, but it’s interesting that there is a spatial PHOTO mode to take 3d pictures with the app: this is something I was hoping to be able to do on the iPhone. I’ll test it out but let’s hope the native iPhone app can do that as well soon.
I have this app and the spatial photos are just ok. They're just 3D photos, like the ones I could take on my 3DS over a decade ago. The issue is that because the iPhone's cameras are so close together, the 3D effect isn't strong unless you're taking a closeup - and the high min focus distance of the main sensor blurs anything that's closer than 8in away. So you either end up with photos of faraway subjects that don't really look 3D, or photos of close subjects that are weirdly blurred because one eye is seeing a blurry subject. It's fun to mess with but I can see why it's not an official feature.
It is quite hilarious that the minimum focus distance on the new pro cameras pretty much make it impossible to record stereo videos with any real depth to them But then again spatial video on the iPhone currently is a bit of a gimmick…
It's absolutely a gimmick (not to mention 1080p 30fps is unpleasantly low for spatial videos in the first place) and there's not much they can do either unless they change the main camera back to a smaller sensor. I'm curious if they try to improve this in the future or the feature remains a gimmick
as far as I'm concerned anything less than two identical lenses at the correct interocular distance isnt worth hassle. they gotta sort that out before we quibble about resolution and frame rates
Alternate headline: app for enthusiasts can make feature tradeoffs Apple won’t choose in stock app used by a billion people. I will speculate that the 1080p60 recording experiences frame drops or other issues under edge cases like background activity, bunch of notifications landing, etc. Which is fine for an indie dev, and not fine for Apple.
Why would you speculate that, based off what? The comments seem to suggest the opposite, from what people have tested. It wouldn’t be the first time Apple has withheld features for a newer device that’s been “backported” by devs.
Nothing is being back ported. Apple provides access to a bunch of APIs that offer a bunch of features. The stock app doesn't expose all the options because Apple literally never does this. They pick the best tradeoffs and stick with it.
As others have pointed out, recording at a higher frame rate results in losses in stabilisation as well as results in more storage consumption. That’s the trade off.
That happens with literally any recording device, that’s how physics works.
Key point is stabilization
So you never record at 60fps? 30fps? That's the dumbest fake logic I've heard lol
It’s honestly kind of baffling you don’t realise that spatial videos probably require great stabilisation to work. Can you imagine how sick you’d feel if that wasn’t the case?
It’s honestly kind of baffling you don’t realise that spatial videos probably require great stabilisation to work. Can you imagine how sick you’d feel if that wasn’t the case?
Spacial Videos are not normal videos last time I checked lol.
They're still videos with IS, which means high framerates always equal worse stabilization. What part of that is confusing?
Clearly apple thought it was worse? WHy do you think they didnt go above 1080p30fps? Just for shits and giggles? Lol Has anyone actually tried this app to confirm or deny? Otherwise we all are just talking into the air.
None of it is. The part where you don’t equate that with being a trade off Apple was unwilling to make, however, is baffling.
Yes but none of that says frame drops. Apple hardware and software is usually really good at avoiding dropping frames, and this software is juts using the Apple SDK which supports 4k60 native.
Based on the fact that fans can’t accept anything remotely bad about anything to do with Apple.
This Reddit is so damn weird. It’s like Apple pays these people to argue for them with complete disregard for plausibility no matter how obviously Apple is in the wrong. It’s like a sub filled with Trump’s lawyers working for Apple lmao
Imagine how weird these subs are for people who have worked in tech for 30 years and managed similar products, and who have a real idea of both how the tech works and the way products are built, and who then see all these weird emotional conspiracy theories where strange people think that giving context is somehow a sign of loyalty to a company. I assure you, it is very strange indeed. Back in my day, youngin, tech enthusiasts largely put reality over cheesy pro- and anti-company emotions.
I think its more to do with apple design philosophy. People assume that the reasons for things are due to that, and to be honest, with no further information its plenty plausible. It could be as simple as apple not having tested it enough to conclude it wont effect the performance and have things like frame drops in edge cases enough to confidently ship it. Definitely they cant test absolutely everything possible, and when they cant they limit it instead of ship it even if upon testing it would be ok… they cant confirm it
I think it has much much much more to do with the Apple marketing behemoth than design. They have amazing and incredibly funded omnipresent PR that has gotten people thinking the richest company in the world is just looking out for their personal interests
Im under no delusions about that lol. Both can be true at the same time you know? They aren’t necessarily looking out for MY interests but their design philosophy certainly comes with security benefits that benefit me
It’s a tradeoff, not better or worse. Apple just did the thing that they think consumers would prefer; stability and other things one picture quality.
You don’t know that. The weird thing about this sub is how they always make assumptions about things they don’t know in Apple’s favor just like you’ve done here, regardless of how loudly Occam’s Razor is screaming that Apple has done simply something poorly
We literally do know that because of what is possible with the actual camera SDK. You are wrong.
And then steal the tech without compensation or credit..... Ala apple watch keyboard
You can also make cool 3d models using the LiDAR cams but only through 3rd party apps. It’s amazing how much cool stuff our phone is capable of but not natively, unlocked by brainy third party developers.
iOS comes with a 3D scanning framework, it's just not exposed in any of the default apps. So most of those apps didn't build their own tech. Some did though.
i’m seeing the clickbait of this article all the way from the opposite earth hemisphere
Related - the ‘manual’ camera apps are great. I use Camera M which was $8 I think (one time). You can capture raw + jpeg, easily control the exposure and all that. …iPhone default camera tends to over expose a little.
The Vision Pro video recording has issues shooting if you are moving, as it loses tracking, giving you a warning. Thinking an app needs to fix it so you can move and keep recording. Kind of silly.
Because spatial video needs a very specific position and a specific movement if you want to move.
It’s not a video issue though. It’s a Vision Pro issue.
I don't understand why they alpha-blur the edges so much in the Apple standard videos and images. Why not at least make an option to *not* do that?
Presumably using iPhone’s camera. Hmmm.
iPhones 12mp wide camera isn’t capable of doing 4K because of how much it has to crop. How are they doing this?
L
I love this app, have been using it since Spatial recording became available mostly because I use it to convert Spatial format to SBS so I can then view it on my Lume Pad 2. Even viewing on a device like Quest 3, because it’s shown like a normal video but in 3D & not 180 or 360 (taking up almost all of your field of view), stabilisation isn’t as important. It might make the viewing experience slightly more comfortable but it’s not totally necessary
queue apple removing it from the app store and then suddenly their camera app getting some very similar features.
Not shocking at all.
This coming from the company who uses their camera as a Marketing Sales Point. HAHAHA If only they went with a 200 Megapixel camera and a processor, RAM, and HD (with microSD slot) that could handle it. Oh well, here we are.
This just in, uninformed user thinks that specs are everything, in other news, water is wet.
The reason why it is the way it is on the native camera app is for space conservation. I wish we had the option to choose between more space vs lower quality
Are you sure. I’m pretty sure it’s this way because of the lower resolution of the wide camera
I’m talking about the 30FPS
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read the fucking article.
Anyone know what's so special about the iPhone 15 Pro that it's the only one that can record Spacial Video? Surely other Pro models could as well?