If it were done maliciously, would it be a hate crime though?
As long as you bought the flag, you're destroying your own property which should be legal.
I have no idea, I don't know anything about US laws on this.
In Texas v. Johnson the Supreme Court ruled that burning the American flag is protected free speech. Using this as a guide we can assume it is an expression of free speech when you choose your entrance appearance. The real crime is the fact that you turned the ace flag into what looks like an oversized pair of pants being hung from the roof. If guilty of anything it’s a fashion crime.
Wouldn't get into any legal problems, if people did get in trouble for just showing hate towards queer people then there would be alot less homophobic people on the internet lol
There isn't really such thing as hate crimes, they're just crimes. And cutting or burning a flag isn't a crime.
But in this case, the person is just being creative with the flag. It would be like making an art piece with the ace colors.
They might define crimes against certain people as "hate crimes", but technically there is no such thing, there are just crimes. A person should be punished for the crime they did, and the demographic should not be considered. So, in relation to this discussion, I would never expect someone to be punished for burning a flag just because it hurt my feelings, but not punished for burning another flag because it didn't hurt my feelings.
>A person should be punished for the crime they did, and the demographic should not be considered.
But that happens all the time with other crimes.
* Sexually assaulting a minor and sexually assaulting an adult are different crimes. We consider age.
* Cutting foreskin or mutilating female genitalia are handled differently, so sex plays a role.
* Abortions can only be committed against or by pregnant people.
We always consider certain demographics in crime and we certainly consider demographics when deciding the punishment. Hitting a child or an adult is not the same thing. Yes, it's both assault but your criminal intent is different as it's easy to hit an adult but you have to be especially mean-spirited to hit a child.
I'm guessing that hate crime is something that is considered in culpability, so how bad is the intent. But I don't know how US laws work.
If people can cut a flag in certain ways and make it into a shirt or pants and get praised for it, I really don’t see why making curtains would be a hate crime.
Both may be against flag codes, but since the first is done so much, why treat this in the polar opposite manner?
Yes and no. Flags are ultimately symbolic of the group. Even with no government body backing it, a code still exists, and it may not even be written. But innately, we all would know that if we were to go to a pride event, then set fire to a flag of a certain group within LGBT+, or drag it in mud, or rip it up, etc. that would send a disrespectful and negative message.
Speaking for the US, one can deface the American flag, and it has been upheld by the Supreme Court that this is free speech. Same would really apply to any other flag. There may be laws in certain EU countries which may consider it hate, I am not sure.
But making a door scraper or toilet brush out of it could be different. Basically, if it's done to "insult" the flag. Not sure what different courts ruled on that one. Probably a really rare offense
Yep,exactly. I also guess it's super rare. Probably it's usually not even prosecuted when actually done as an insult unless it has a really huge audience
>But making a door scraper or toilet brush out of it
I... I'm sorry, I know this is off topic, but... that sounds like the most complicated process to obtain the least effective toilet brush possible.
Usually flag shirts and pants aren‘t made from actual flags, but from cloth with a flag print that would never have been a flag and was made specifically to be turned into apparel (which is why flag code doesn‘t really apply to them). But I agree with your point it isn‘t a hate crime
This is the other thing that irks me about this
(The first being the design flaw - why cut, when you could've used a thin pole and slide it like a shower curtain, which would look nicer and serve the purpose better)
But the not ironing/steaming before hand is also super irksome.
And, the lack of hemming. Its likely to fray at some point
Technically depending on countries, its only a crime, for like officials national flags, and officials doesn't mean the one you buy at the dollar store, i am talking you have to get it through the government or at government authorized seller, or if you die as soldier
No I don’t think it would be. It is the intent that matters. Your intent of cutting it is just to make curtains. You are rather showing your pride. You are not cutting the flag for disrespect or with the intent to spread hate. I think it looks great :)
In itself, no. Design wise, possibly
(Personally I'd have gone with "slider door" style, or just hung it like normal and push it out the way, like the flaps in chillers/at butchers)
And please iron or steam! But it is a nice idea and now I'm tempted to do similar... but I have cats. One of which gets into EVERYTHING. She's the reason I never got a bead curtain...
Yes.
Go to ace jail.
In all seriousness no first because it’s your property it’s not a crime to modify it, second as far as I know you weren’t motivated by hatred of the people you’re targeting, third you’re targeting an individual rather than a group, and finally you aren’t cutting the flag because its ace you’re cutting it because the amount of light block wasn’t changeable
for everyone confused about this: cutting a countries flag is considered a hate crime and banned in pretty much any of their constitutions. (at least of the ones i know) but since there is no ace country (yet) do what you want. people still might get upset tho.
No but you just gave me an idea for pride..
What if.. I inserted the demiflux flag in the middle where you cut it? Like a peek of who I am as I walk thru pride parade. 🙂 I need to make this now. 😐
Uhm, you have this mislabeled as a curtain. Clearly this is a very large pair of pants in ace colors. Also you're cheerfully displaying all the colors, so I really don't know how this could be considered a hate crime.
As long as it isn’t done maliciously, I don’t see how it could even be remotely seen as a hate crime
How did you get so many ace flags?
You can add it as your flair
They have flags in surpl-ace
If it were done maliciously, would it be a hate crime though? As long as you bought the flag, you're destroying your own property which should be legal. I have no idea, I don't know anything about US laws on this.
In Texas v. Johnson the Supreme Court ruled that burning the American flag is protected free speech. Using this as a guide we can assume it is an expression of free speech when you choose your entrance appearance. The real crime is the fact that you turned the ace flag into what looks like an oversized pair of pants being hung from the roof. If guilty of anything it’s a fashion crime.
Dammit now I want flaired ace trousers
i’m tempted to make ace pants so let because so many people have mentioned they look like pants and i can’t disappoint
I believe the fashion police will pardon your prior offense if you did so 😉
I think it would look good
Yeah if you wanted curtains... why not just buy 2? Or put it on a thin pole and have it work like a shower curtain or like how net curtains work?
It wouldn't be a hatecrime, just disrespectful
That's obviously hateful but the legal side is what's interesting to me.
Wouldn't get into any legal problems, if people did get in trouble for just showing hate towards queer people then there would be alot less homophobic people on the internet lol
There isn't really such thing as hate crimes, they're just crimes. And cutting or burning a flag isn't a crime. But in this case, the person is just being creative with the flag. It would be like making an art piece with the ace colors.
Well, hate crimes seem to be defined by several states, so it is a crime type (?) as far as I'm aware.
They might define crimes against certain people as "hate crimes", but technically there is no such thing, there are just crimes. A person should be punished for the crime they did, and the demographic should not be considered. So, in relation to this discussion, I would never expect someone to be punished for burning a flag just because it hurt my feelings, but not punished for burning another flag because it didn't hurt my feelings.
>A person should be punished for the crime they did, and the demographic should not be considered. But that happens all the time with other crimes. * Sexually assaulting a minor and sexually assaulting an adult are different crimes. We consider age. * Cutting foreskin or mutilating female genitalia are handled differently, so sex plays a role. * Abortions can only be committed against or by pregnant people. We always consider certain demographics in crime and we certainly consider demographics when deciding the punishment. Hitting a child or an adult is not the same thing. Yes, it's both assault but your criminal intent is different as it's easy to hit an adult but you have to be especially mean-spirited to hit a child. I'm guessing that hate crime is something that is considered in culpability, so how bad is the intent. But I don't know how US laws work.
If people can cut a flag in certain ways and make it into a shirt or pants and get praised for it, I really don’t see why making curtains would be a hate crime. Both may be against flag codes, but since the first is done so much, why treat this in the polar opposite manner?
Does flag code even apply to flags that aren't of a government?
Yes and no. Flags are ultimately symbolic of the group. Even with no government body backing it, a code still exists, and it may not even be written. But innately, we all would know that if we were to go to a pride event, then set fire to a flag of a certain group within LGBT+, or drag it in mud, or rip it up, etc. that would send a disrespectful and negative message.
Okay. Obviously there's the social code but I was asking about the government one you can get arrested for disobeying.
Speaking for the US, one can deface the American flag, and it has been upheld by the Supreme Court that this is free speech. Same would really apply to any other flag. There may be laws in certain EU countries which may consider it hate, I am not sure.
It's forbidden in Germany, § 90a StGB. Only for the flag of the country itself or their states. Don't know about other countries in Europe though.
But even here, I'd assume that making a curtain out of it wouldn't be considered an offense
But making a door scraper or toilet brush out of it could be different. Basically, if it's done to "insult" the flag. Not sure what different courts ruled on that one. Probably a really rare offense
Yep,exactly. I also guess it's super rare. Probably it's usually not even prosecuted when actually done as an insult unless it has a really huge audience
>But making a door scraper or toilet brush out of it I... I'm sorry, I know this is off topic, but... that sounds like the most complicated process to obtain the least effective toilet brush possible.
ace curtain 😎
No.
Usually flag shirts and pants aren‘t made from actual flags, but from cloth with a flag print that would never have been a flag and was made specifically to be turned into apparel (which is why flag code doesn‘t really apply to them). But I agree with your point it isn‘t a hate crime
It's your property. Do what ya want.
Who says it's not stolen?
be queer, do crime
Misread as "do queer, be crime"
r/meirl
Hail Satan!
I thought it was a really long pair of pants at first.
THATS GENIUS
ace pants ace pants
Someone better do this.
For real I need those in my life!!
Excuse me while I go get some white pants and fabric dye
Only if you don't get the wrinkles out, the dignity of the flag is paramount
This is the other thing that irks me about this (The first being the design flaw - why cut, when you could've used a thin pole and slide it like a shower curtain, which would look nicer and serve the purpose better) But the not ironing/steaming before hand is also super irksome. And, the lack of hemming. Its likely to fray at some point
Not to me. Looks good.
I see no problem but why not buy TWO flags and have double the queernes to show off; really make those Allos rethink even looking you're direction. /s
no?
No. It's not a crime, it's yours and it hurts no one.
If I didn't have cats, I'd definitely do this because it's cool as hell!
Nope, that's just a good idea.
happy cake day ^^
Thanks!
Do it again and make pants
No, but not ironing it might be, haha.
Technically depending on countries, its only a crime, for like officials national flags, and officials doesn't mean the one you buy at the dollar store, i am talking you have to get it through the government or at government authorized seller, or if you die as soldier
No I don’t think it would be. It is the intent that matters. Your intent of cutting it is just to make curtains. You are rather showing your pride. You are not cutting the flag for disrespect or with the intent to spread hate. I think it looks great :)
Is it for a doorway? How cool would it be to dramatically walk out of your ace door lol
it is in my door way and it does feel dramatic
Only if you don't hem the cuts to keep them from fraying 😤 In all seriousness, super neat idea!
It’s just practical, maybe iron it tho, it’s quite wrinkled
you’re right i should
Looks like pants. Pants I would wear.
me too
Oh my gosh what a bigot! Actually shaking and crying rn wtfff??m?
Too bad I didn't think of it first! Love it <3
NO I THINK ITS CUTE AND SMART I WISH I COULD DO THIS TOO
Nah, that's actually a hella cool idea
It makes you an overthinker
I personally think that, if you aren't cutting it as a hate crime, it's not a hate crime
Flags aren't sacred things; it's your flag, do what you want to do with it.
That seam is going to fray...
pants lol
I wouldn't say hate crime BUT it would've been cool to use two flags, one as a curtain each
Honestly, I thought that was a pair of pants.
Same here.
*Suddenly wants to make pants out of an ace flag*
Absolutely
That's really cool!!
Only if you let it fray at the edges. That’s a crime against sewing!
No but not ironing it before you did this is
I'd call that smart 👌
My only concern is that its too thin to block out the light.
I think it's in front of a doorway
It’s looks nice, so I’d say it’s fine
It looks beautiful
In itself, no. Design wise, possibly (Personally I'd have gone with "slider door" style, or just hung it like normal and push it out the way, like the flaps in chillers/at butchers) And please iron or steam! But it is a nice idea and now I'm tempted to do similar... but I have cats. One of which gets into EVERYTHING. She's the reason I never got a bead curtain...
Just a thought: you could use two flags as curtains that you can open and close rather than cutting one flag down the middle.
No, it’s not. It’s just fabric and It’s actually a pretty cool idea tbh.
It's neither hateful nor a crime, so no, I don't think so.
Okay, but did you heat the cut sections with a lighter so that they were smoother :P
It looks almost like a pair of pants.
Don’t hate crime, hate the causes of crime. Seriously though I like it.
Yes. Go to ace jail. In all seriousness no first because it’s your property it’s not a crime to modify it, second as far as I know you weren’t motivated by hatred of the people you’re targeting, third you’re targeting an individual rather than a group, and finally you aren’t cutting the flag because its ace you’re cutting it because the amount of light block wasn’t changeable
Nah, that’s really cool
I don't think so, no. It's your own flag you can do with it what you want.
Yeah nah i dont reckon thats a hate crime.
I don’t mean to make fun of OP but cmon…..first of all, cutting any flag isn’t a hate crime if it belongs to you. You cant hate crime yourself.
Make more cuts along the other stipes 😈😈 So it can be like one of those streamer thingys
Yes, wait, I am calling cops. /s
Is this a real question?
it’s literally tagged as a joke
I don’t think so
Nah, it just makes cool curtains ! :)
It’s definitely not a hate crime
Yes. The assasins are on their way to your location now. Pray to any god who will listen, your end is nigh.
for everyone confused about this: cutting a countries flag is considered a hate crime and banned in pretty much any of their constitutions. (at least of the ones i know) but since there is no ace country (yet) do what you want. people still might get upset tho.
no it's fucking dope
No but you just gave me an idea for pride.. What if.. I inserted the demiflux flag in the middle where you cut it? Like a peek of who I am as I walk thru pride parade. 🙂 I need to make this now. 😐
Seems fine to me
dope idea tbh
Yes. It's a hate crime against curtains. /j The only crime I see here is the fact you still have wall space. MOAR WALL DECOR Yep I'm a freak 🤣
No not at all. Looks Great
Well I thought this was a really long pair of pants. Take that as you will.
The crime are those wrinkles lol is that the correct word?
If you have good intentions? I think not it’s honestly a easy diy tbh but if it was with bad intentions mm but that’s smart make it into a curtain :D
Uhm, you have this mislabeled as a curtain. Clearly this is a very large pair of pants in ace colors. Also you're cheerfully displaying all the colors, so I really don't know how this could be considered a hate crime.
Its a good idea, but executed poorly. Should've got all the stripes on each half and it'd definitely look more appealing
i feel like this fits my doorway better, plus i like the stripes on either side, i think it looks clean (it’ll look better once i iron it too)
Thats valid, sorry if i was making my opinion sound as if it was objective
Yes.