I had the same thinking about "colleagues are not your friends" when I was working in my hometown.
Then I moved to SG for work. Majority of the week spent on work, weekends mostly spent on catching up sleep or house duties.
So, no family here, no friends either.
But I do have really good workmates, whom I get to joke around. Sometimes I bully them, sometimes they bully me.
And then one of them told us that she had a parent who died. Coming from a different culture, I thought it's just right to visit and pay our respects. So I went. She wasn't expecting none of us at work but we still went there.
Over time, I realize there's no strict rules about not treating your colleagues as your friends. People around us just impose it because, I dont know.
You can treat them as how you would treat your friends, you can also put boundaries if you want to. We grow up, we lose some people in our lives but we also gain some.
If we always stick to "workmates are strictly acquantances" then I'm afraid we'll miss out on many things during our adult life.
If the work environment you are currently at is lax like a government job, sure — these instances do apply.
The only time they don’t is when work becomes competitive and the pay is top notch: you want to outperform others at work in order to secure more promotions, more favours, and more prestige. For work like this, being a cooperative sport doesn’t necessarily mean you will be reciprocated back, be it your colleagues stealing and pitching your ideas to the bosses and so on.
It’s often safer to err on the safe side by being wary and guarding your own rice bowl rather than being accommodating to everything and everyone.
I'd have to agree with you, if you were right.
Unfortunately, I can't work in the government or in any government office. I do want to work in this one particular agency because it'll definitely make my porfolio really attractive in terms of cybersec, but I'm afraid I'm not qualified because I'm not from here.
Second, I do work in an extremely competitive (emphasis on the extremely) industry, but none of us pay attention to whoever gets the promotion or not. Hence the part in my comment "majority of the week is spent on work), so yeah. Sometimes 8 hours, sometimes 10 hours work.
Third, and I dont want to be hated, but I'll still say it.
I'd consider the pay in our team is top notch, at least for me. But we never discuss it, nor do we discuss if anyone got any promotions recently (we just had appraisals after CNY).
If we're not doing work, then we're bullying each other. Lols. But of course we're all guys in the team, so we dont get offended by any racial jokes, like I tell them to just to go do grab (one person I call "gojek", there's two jokes in this but I wont say lols), and then they tell me why I'm in the team, that I should be in the hospital because some doctor is asking for my help. Then we just laugh on some this hurls.
We became this way because I told them long long time ago that insults are always two-way, if I insult them or joke on something important to them, then its an invitation for them to insult me back, well of course in a joking manner.
They did tell me this one word many years ago, "kiasu".
Some people call it competitive, some people just call being smart. I dont know. Each are entitled to their own interpretation.
I've been with different organizations, and I've worked with a lot of nationalities. There's always those who treats the work as some sort of contest of who gets in front first.
But in every team I've lead, I always say this,
"If you want to go fast, go alone. No one will stop you.
If you want to go far, go together".
Anyway, sorry I'm getting out of topic, but the point is, we can all be independent and just focus on ourselves, always guarding your own rice bowl.
But we'll always need someone's help, trust me.
I didnt have any families here so when I got admitted to hospital due to a minor infection, i didnt expect anyone, but the three bullies went there.
The attitude of always watching your own ricebowl is definitely useful when you're in your comfort zone, like for example, your own country.
But when you step out? Definitely still watch your back.
But find friends along the way. They dont have to be transactional, nor do they always have to be casual people who are in different industries.
Sometimes the people in the cubicles next to you also just want another person to have some meal and discussion with about toycons or hikes or marathons.
> But we'll always need someone's help, trust me. I didnt have any families here so when I got admitted to hospital due to a minor infection, i didnt expect anyone, but the three bullies went there.
>
> The attitude of always watching your own ricebowl is definitely useful when you're in your comfort zone, like for example, your own country.
>
> But when you step out? Definitely still watch your back. But find friends along the way. They dont have to be transactional, nor do they always have to be casual people who are in different industries.
Good on you on finding friends you can relate to at work. Of course, I am not dismissing your take on this issue. After all, the relationships you forge at work are real, just as how the people you interact with are real as well.
My only qualm with this arrangement is that work at the end of the day is still work, and many people do this just to make a living or to chase their career aspirations. No one of sane disposition go to work just to make friends — after all, work is never permanent: people come and go, and good times often never last forever with a change of management.
As for finding friends along the way, I just want to point out it is perfectly normal to have no one to talk to during adulthood but it isn't because one doesn't have friends at all.
We often have so much reservation these days about how we feel and how expressing our inner thoughts will be perceived by others that we end up keeping to ourselves. In time, this turns into a self enforced loneliness as what OP has mentioned.
Of course, if one expect the worst of others, that is what we will end up finding since our minds are often great at validating our own opinions.
The key to friendship is reciprocity.
It is to my experience that the people I know who have the strongest friendships (not necessarily the most) are genuinely more interested in others than whether others are interested in them. And when they need someone to speak to, it's simply a matter of to whom.
Unfortunately for us, such people are a rarity these days, and they are even more so in work environments where people often work just to act their wage. There’s a reason why friendships are best cultivated in environments when there is common interest and shared aspirations. The office is unfortunately just a place of convenience for many.
Yeah, you're correct on this. Shared interests and aspirations are a big factor. I got lucky with my previous work because we all happen to match each other's energies.
But in general, office is just a place of convenience for many. There are also days when I actually just want to finish the work for the day, get paid, and go home. Lols.
They might be insensitive jokes for many, so I can't share what it means, sorry. Haha. But it is basically just refers to many stereotypes, our team is mixed of people from in and out of sg. So I'll let you just figure it out based on the previous comment. Do note that I wont say this to any stranger who I dont know the tolerance for dark humor, which in our team, I already know. Haha.
Okay since this is reddit, maybe I can share about the joke, but I'll tone it down a bit.
When we had to do three consecutive weekends of work, we opted to order lunch through grab app because its been raining nonstop, then I jokingly asked one of the guy if he knows the delvery guys because he looked liked them, so thats where the banter started (I know, really, really bad joke).
The gojek is a word play, because one of our teammate is also from a neighboring country.
On my end, I came from a country where most people work in hospitals overseas, like in sg hospitals.
Hence the joke that someone in ER always needs my assistance, and also them asking me in some mornings if I already did my rounds.
You're assuming that being more competitive and cut-throat at work gets you more promotions, prestige etc. My experience is that more collaborative and cooperative people get more promotions, prestige and success.
As I said before:
> The only time they don’t is when **work** becomes competitive…
In certain competitive work environments (think of executives), there are only so many job vacancies available to you — either for promotion or for hire. Collaboration within your team members seem dandy and good, but if your superiors can only afford to elevate a select number of you to the upper echelons: who do you think will they promote at the end of the day? A team worker who only can produce results when working as a team, or someone else who has proven themselves by merit that they can get the job done?
Of course, one can argue that this is all circumstantial and that it ultimately depends on the job scope, but the price of forgoing better opportunities at work just to be a team sport seem to run contrarian: you are after all going to work to make money, not to make friends.
>Collaboration within your team members seem dandy and good, but if your superiors can only afford to elevate a select number of you to the upper echelons: who do you think will they promote at the end of the day? A team worker who only can produce results when working as a team, or someone else who has proven themselves by merit that they can get the job done?
I think there is a false dichotomy here. You can be both a team player and someone who has proven merit to get the job done. It is not one or the other. In fact, being a team player and being collaborative can be useful in getting the job done rather than going solo.
Always surprised by comments that government job = lax, please tell me which government job is so good being lax, everywhere I see my govt service friends complaining about overwork and stress, from teaching to police to caseworkers.
Ahh I used to be colleagues can never be friends.
But then I realised actually it's more like "don't assume your colleague is your friend, but actually along the way some of your colleagues CAN be friends" : ) so yeah last sentence is correct! In fact haha my friends (who are ex colleagues, used to work at the same place but then one of them left) were saying how that workplace the people are super chill, "like secondary school everytime also wanna go ppl house to hangout as if 5day week not enough" - but they're just super friendly and easy-going I guess.
My colleagues and I are ok, like we don't really chat outside of work and stuff but we do have casual convos from time to time. & I'll partly admit it's also cause one day someone good-naturedly said "hey how r u!" and I was like "u rly wna know" and then mumbled something about like "AAAA deadlines" lol. then that broke the ice into how's your experience like here, how's the REAL progress on the project, etc. Not just the stony faced "pretend everyone and everything is ok and we are all perfectly functioning and meeting every single deadline ahead of time" (lol we are NOT. :p)
When most people start working or get married, they are very likely to drift away. For me as an introvert, its even harder to retain such friends.
At the start I still tried to organise outings and keep in touch, but it got very tiring initiating all these all the time. I decided to just go with the flow. If they are willing to drift away, no matter what you do they won't stay.
Making new friends is cool for me, but it's always hard to forge a good bond with anyone, as compared to in the past. I'm always open to knowing new people though!
Do you have any interests or hobbies? Or what's the area of your studies/working sector? You'll be more likely to find like-minded people this way! All the best :D
>colleagues aren’t family or friends
What's up with these rules? Do people really love living in hard mode?
Just go with the flow. Anyone and everyone could be a friend.
exactly, in fact most lifetime friend are from workplace or during uni, there is a theory behind it as both have common topic to dicusss and have same interest about the field sector, but then you need choose right person to be friend with.
The issue is usually is the other party do not know when to draw the line. So hence work is work. Friends is friend. Did encounter when things go south, things can get really ugly
thissss hahaha but I think my team is ok la. bonding and talk cock really is bond and talk cock LOL.
but when it comes to work like better know who did what and who passed what instructions to who lol. but ya January team-bonding we were just talking abt like generational trauma (! oop) and parenting and breaking the cycle hahaha (incl my boss sia lol) - I was quite impressed, because I've learned to match my level of sharing or reciprocity by what i see.
But then I must also caveat we're 90% female. part of the gist of that convo was "women talk abt these things, and feelings, and how we navigate them - but in men it's mostly taboo. Like they just talk abt NS lor lol"
I paused. "Ya really leh my dad will talk about ... travelling, his time in civil service ... and .. ya" (he didn't do NS because originally born in Msia and converted to citizenship for marriage and I don't even know if he was ever PR or whatnot but tldr, his equivalent is, was in SPF not NS)
Ikr. I have colleagues that i can count on as friends and when we have life milestones we do gather, i.e. new bto, baby 1 yr old bday etc.
And also for drinks n beer with the project team, just to bitch about the boss. It's a good way to vent and last that bit longer and grow ur career rather than job-hop when u feel frustrated. Of coz if u are in a toxic environment just leave, but sometimes we just need to bitch abit and the spouse isn't really the best person to bitch about work.
Aren't there times when you just "click" and bond with someone at work? Not romantically, but there's a spark. I envy my MIL who is 80 and still travels/hangs out with her school friends - friendships are so important ...
My mom reconnected with her secondary school friends at 60!
They don't travel but then sometimes they do group hangouts, but she also has this other closer friend (in part because they stay nearer proximity) that she hangs out with one-on-one for meals from time to time! hasn't happened in a while this year though ..
It takes time and effort to cultivate relationships. Started with lunch, then drinks, partying, helping out each other, celebrating birthdays, festivals together, etc.
I think depends though. Like if you are a manager, there’s always a distance you need to keep with your subordinate. There’s some things you’d know that you can’t ever share with them (e.g somebody else’s performance) so it’s very hard to be really friends at that level.
Over the years, I realise the workplaces and schools are places of convenience where people come to work/study together. There are more opportunities to maintain ties as everyone sees each other almost on a weekly basis.
After a person is no longer around/leaves a place, sometimes the relationships will end/follow out the door. Have already experienced this many times after different phases in my life, like Uni/NS/changing job etc. It does feels disappointing at times but I guess this is part and parcel of adulthood.
My view is it takes effort to maintain relationships over time no matter where the persons are located at. And it is also possible to open up new relationships if one is keen to explore, like e.g. join interest groups/volunteer.
Sigh. I can relate. Lost my secondary and post friends. All of them. Barely have 2 from ns, not much family due to certain reasons and really struggling now. Live alone and feel really lonely at times. It’s so bad that I go to this ytf stall regularly (even tho it’s quite ex) because the auntie there talks like she is family.
Early 30s. Yes have tried and recently got heartbroken by a girl from hinge. Not gonna try it again for a long while. Also not in the right headspace for a relationship. Feels like I need friends more than a partner right now
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I rather have an intimate dinner with a few friends, just three or four of us than going to a gathering party where everyone is flexing.
Hate those patronizing moments or small talk where people ain't really interested about your life.
totally, going out for the obligatory sec sch gathering and they all chit chatting away while you're just the token invite. the usual talk about change job, salary, gf/bf, getting married. honestly feels very pointless, then you'd find out they have some other group chats going on and you're not in the loop of whatever/whoever they are talking about.
I learned this in Phase 2 Covid.
HAHAHA.
When it comes to choosing 4 friends (d'uh its 5pax, the last pax is yourself mah) - who will you pick? THATS your real friends : )
actually some colleagues can become friends esp if you have similar interests. one of my close friends is from my first job after graduation. we are no longer working at the same place but make an effort to meet each other at least 4x a year haha.
adulting is understanding that you dont have to meet all the time to be close or to be friends.
i also made new friends as an adult when i became a cat mum.
I haven't had many RL friends since I came out of NS in 2013. My life hasn't exactly been the smoothest since then, that's one thing but it's also because I'm a huge homebody myself who doesn't exactly thrive on social interaction (your stereotypical introvert basically) so my "friends" mostly from online games.
Does it get lonely? Well yes. but I've learned to live with it. Besides, I don't know what's worst, loneliness or needing to participate in those awkward water cooler conversations.
I'm 28M, I have a friend just like you. Having to depend on herself at a young age and forced to grow up quick to support herself. She's often lonely, just like myself, and tries to keep herself occupied to not feel as lonely. I share the same experience with her. Growing up we didn't really fit in anywhere so we didn't make friends along the way.
Now in adulthood, its much more difficult to make close friends, especially ones you can trust. I'd recommend you to join more interest clubs and classes/group activities. It's there where you can meet people and gain exposure for yourself. Meet more people, get to know them, spend time with them, and decide for yourself who you can consider friends.
I feel like im losing friends too as everyone around me moves onto the next stage in life- get married and have kids, whereas im single and have more free/alone time
I am 39 years old, and at this point almost a loner. I was also a school drop out at the age of 16, did not go to poly, JC, let’s not mention uni. Had been much of an outcast in my teenage days and instead mostly made friends from the internet during the hey days of online forums and chatrooms, either that or friends from work. Completely did not even bond with anyone during NS like normal guys do.
Anyway, as time goes by, everyone else moves on with their lives especially once everyone starts having families of their own, and colleagues are still colleagues, even if we were once like a family. The team disbands, people move on to other jobs, we all grow older and have more responsibilities and commitments, life goes on.
My social life now is non-existent, especially since there is no longer any venues for me to find new friends, and my present colleagues are a radically different type of people from the sort I used to be with. Work is just work, we don’t really communicate much outside of it.
A lot of the times, colleagues can be like hi and bye friends/acquaintances. People you interact with on a daily basis but don’t hang out outside of work, same goes for when you’re schooling.
I did made two really good friends from my workplace who I actually hang out with outside of work but it mostly boils down to me vibing with them and having really similar interests, so keep an open mind and just stick to those that reciprocates to your friendship.
24. Lost pretty much entire social circle over the years on account of NS and me working while in Uni. I just hold on to the hope that when all this blow over I can start to carve new relationships.
Suspect that we drift away because we are at different stages of life. In addition, our worldviews clash with each other. I realise it is better to set my own boundaries. There are many people outside everywhere and they are keen to make friends. Maybe you can start sharing about your interests or hobbies. From there then, you will meet likeminded people. But please exercise caution when meeting them.
As for me, i will spend time on watching anime or drama. Either, I will do home workout before heading for a run. Also, I met friends whom I have not met in a long time (probably more than a few months or years) for brunch or lunch, not regular ones. Oh yes, i read books too. :)
Yes as you grow older people start to be apart , in a family unit where the children are pre occupied with work and own family to even meet up with siblings and parents. In the own family unit , people are busy with phones and whatnots. I can imagine how hard it is for a single person, but you need to make an effort to have some friends, colleagues can be good friends too. Need to have the same wavelength. I suggest to go for courses or even like gym classes/spin bike classes to make new friends in your life.
A long time ago.
Someone gave me this advice
“If you want to be friends, then act like friends”
Sure. Not everyone will reciprocate. Sure. Some will be false friends.
But if you never try you’ll never know.
We should just band together and create a support group at this point. Its so so important.
Many people who are religious have an easier time accessing a community wheareas non-religious folks might find it hard to find the same network of support. More so if you are someone who struggles with social anxiety and is just introverted by nature.
If anyone is down with this idea, hit me up. I have a few board games in tow and if it becomes a thing, I already have some other board games I'm eyeing to buy (:
Join interest group on your free time or if you happen to be a Christian (im only speaking this cause I'm a Christian myself) Join a church. I made the most authentic loving friendship in church. Im not too sure how other religion works? But if you're a muslim you can go for madrasah and you'll have friends there.
Humans are social creature. Like it or not. Only difference is high intensity of meeting friends (extroverts) or low intensity of meeting friends (introverts) there has to be some form of friends that you make throughout your life.
Aye but if you dont mind. Im open to making new friends. I'm a introvert tho so i don't really initate conversation that much(im just fortunate i get loads of opportunities to make friendships)
Tbh i think friends matter a lot. Not as much as family members of course but they're also important to have in life. You need people around you to spend time with, help you out when you're at a low point in your life and to celebrate with you when something good happens. Being a friendly and good person to many people comes with a lot of perks and benefits even something as simple as having someone to treat you to a drink.
I will never understand why people on here love to say "Your colleagues should not be your friends." Why..??? Why limit yourself? So many people I know myself included have found good friends from work that hang out outside work too. They'll say this and then lament about not having social life or any friends in their 30s.
Believe it or not, smartphones are the main cause of this loneliness epidemic. I dont think its as bad in the pre smartphone era. Everything from social media to "leaning too much of own understanding" has cut down on real life interaction to maintain relationships. Nothing like a little stupidity to preserve the humility. People are too smart for their own damn good.
In my early 30s and I hate interacting with new people beyond superficial business reasons. I can empathise with the grinch on wanting to be alone and enjoy my quiet time and not worry about other people’s feelings
Friends don’t just come, you make friends if you want one.
Ofc it’s trial and error but you’ll learn and you’ll meet different types of people and personality, hence, contributes to your growth too.
Differences and diversity will teach you how to deal with people and you’ll know who you want or don’t want to be in your life.
I haven't really made new friends since I graduated sec sch coz I couldn't get into tiertiary schools and my social life sorta died there. Other people kinda just come and go. I do have some friends who have been with me for the last 15-20 years (I'm 34F now), but it's also kinda on and off. One of my newer bonded friend was from work. I think if you vibe with them well then just befriend them. Be discerning also. Some colleagues are just friendly but not always friend-material.
I do feel lonely when I want to play new games but have no one to call because adults are busy :( my partner doesn't game either. But I also have other things I enjoy doing alone so it's not as bad these days compared to my younger 20s. You kinda just find fulfilment elsewhere.
I found most of my friends from discord/arcade so I'd say it's more of putting yourself out there, you never know who you may meet. I've met a property agent cum yoga instructor and a fire breather from working event jobs, cyclists from reservist, and also a guy who listens to the same music as me from work.
I'd say give it a shot trying to talk to people on reddit as well :) or try meetup.com or Eventbrite to see if you meet anyone. Of course, always err on the side of caution but also, be willing to open up.
27M.I only have a few frienda from sec school. None after and i try to make frienss online when playing my video games. It is lonely. Dating is non existent as there isnt a way to meet like minded with my work hours(60-72hrs/week).
Everyday routine is just wake up, go work, go home,play for 3 hrs, go sleep. rinse and repeat.
Not all colleagues are friends. Some people can act genuine in front of you but backstab you like mad behind your back. There's one mad person in my department behaving this way. Thinking that the world revolves around them and wants to know every single new gossip. When groups are laughing without them they get paranoid, thinking that we are badmouthing about them. But you can still make friends outside your workplace. Find new hobbies and join new interest groups and slowly expand ur social circle!
Having friends at different stages of life from Primary to Tertiary education and then work life. It is more about maintaining your social circle. I too used to have many cliques of friends but now i only usually talk to the usual few, less than 5 probably.
If you are feeling lonely, pick up an interest and there will be like minded people who are willing to be your friends. If you game, find some game friend to play every night.
The number of true friends I have now can be counted with just 1 hand. 4 of them married already while 1 is still flying high at overseas. Married bros are not the same as last time because of family commitments which I understand while I only see the remaining one once per year when he is back to Singapore for holidays. So I’m technically same as having no true friends now.
I moved here in 2022 and if it weren't for my colleagues I'd have no friends at all. It's hard to make friends in a new country (as an adult), unless you go to clubs and stuff -- which can feel a bit forced.
I have an alternative view on this. It is easy to make friends in secondary school, jc etc for 2 reasons:
1) Proximity.
Many of those friends I made in secondary school were those that I had due to convenience and proximity, as opposed to actually mutually shared values. Coming from a minority, you don't really get to choose your friends, in that sense. You hang around those that are like you in sufficient ways to warrant a friendship.
2) Complexity
Children and adolescence have yet to acquire much real-world experience. They are ignorant of values, morals and so on without much information to go on. As we develop, we become increasingly complex humans.. and naturally as a result, it becomes more difficult to relate to people.
personally, I find it also quite difficult to make friends at this age (not that I have the time for many) and for good reason. And if it is harder for you, then great... means that you have become a more interesting and complex person.
It’s easier to make friends in schools because people come together to do something.
When you’re adults, it is easier to find friends in activity groups. Chatting up some stranger at the beach, cafe and making deep friendship is very unlikely.
I happened to joined an activity group (not religious) more than 10 years ago made countless friends.
Ultimately it will come down to the individual to find and maintain friendships.
I'm reaching my 30s(F) soon and I'm really a loner. I used to have a group of close friends in sec sch but I gradually came to terms with me not actually liking them lol. I had one friend I talked to a lot more than the rest but it's really draining to have to arrange a meetup every time. We both work in healthcare too. I just stopped trying. I don't like people in my workplace either and I'm just cordial. I don't feel like joining them in activities outside of work. I am also not very girly or go do my nails, go shopping, etc. I don't have a partner nor do I actively look for one. Some days I feel like it would be nice but other days, I think I wouldn't tolerate living with someone else or they tolerate me as well. 😅 A lot of my hobbies are solitary also so... 😓 Definitely need to put in a lot of effort to find friends but my energy is like -1000%. Idk how people go gymming, spin class, dance class. It's expensive also. I'm starting to think work is the problem. 🤣
Surely you didnt drop out of every school?
My best friend is from post secondary. We still whatsapp frequently.
Otherwise I hang out with a group of ex-colleagues every month or so, but we also whatsapp frequently.
Then I have another bunch of ex colleagues that meet up every once in a while.
But to be honest, this is about as much as I can muster. Anything else and its too much work lols.
But dont be friends with your colleagues, you never know what they might be planning. Its ok to be friends with them after your work relationship is complete though.
People say don't befriend colleagues but I still do it anyways.
I may not actively seek it out, but if we click, we click.
Sure, sometimes I get hurt because of it but I have also made some good ones.
But aside from friends made in school, my longest friendships come from my hobbies.
Friends gradually drift apart after grad and after leaving the company and it's very sian when you are the one initiating and not receiving much reciprocate
I dont really keep in contact with friends from school days and i usually just go home and chill after work. I spend my time on my hobbies , kinda realise my craving for social interaction is really little but thats just me though. I have friends who literally told me they would go into a depression if they didnt go out to some socialising for a week.
Many people would be willing to be friends with you here. I assume you will receive at least a few dms from this post. Otherwise there’s bumble bff too. Can also try Slowly if you’re into online penpals, I personally really like the app
I had the same thinking about "colleagues are not your friends" when I was working in my hometown. Then I moved to SG for work. Majority of the week spent on work, weekends mostly spent on catching up sleep or house duties. So, no family here, no friends either. But I do have really good workmates, whom I get to joke around. Sometimes I bully them, sometimes they bully me. And then one of them told us that she had a parent who died. Coming from a different culture, I thought it's just right to visit and pay our respects. So I went. She wasn't expecting none of us at work but we still went there. Over time, I realize there's no strict rules about not treating your colleagues as your friends. People around us just impose it because, I dont know. You can treat them as how you would treat your friends, you can also put boundaries if you want to. We grow up, we lose some people in our lives but we also gain some. If we always stick to "workmates are strictly acquantances" then I'm afraid we'll miss out on many things during our adult life.
If the work environment you are currently at is lax like a government job, sure — these instances do apply. The only time they don’t is when work becomes competitive and the pay is top notch: you want to outperform others at work in order to secure more promotions, more favours, and more prestige. For work like this, being a cooperative sport doesn’t necessarily mean you will be reciprocated back, be it your colleagues stealing and pitching your ideas to the bosses and so on. It’s often safer to err on the safe side by being wary and guarding your own rice bowl rather than being accommodating to everything and everyone.
I'd have to agree with you, if you were right. Unfortunately, I can't work in the government or in any government office. I do want to work in this one particular agency because it'll definitely make my porfolio really attractive in terms of cybersec, but I'm afraid I'm not qualified because I'm not from here. Second, I do work in an extremely competitive (emphasis on the extremely) industry, but none of us pay attention to whoever gets the promotion or not. Hence the part in my comment "majority of the week is spent on work), so yeah. Sometimes 8 hours, sometimes 10 hours work. Third, and I dont want to be hated, but I'll still say it. I'd consider the pay in our team is top notch, at least for me. But we never discuss it, nor do we discuss if anyone got any promotions recently (we just had appraisals after CNY). If we're not doing work, then we're bullying each other. Lols. But of course we're all guys in the team, so we dont get offended by any racial jokes, like I tell them to just to go do grab (one person I call "gojek", there's two jokes in this but I wont say lols), and then they tell me why I'm in the team, that I should be in the hospital because some doctor is asking for my help. Then we just laugh on some this hurls. We became this way because I told them long long time ago that insults are always two-way, if I insult them or joke on something important to them, then its an invitation for them to insult me back, well of course in a joking manner. They did tell me this one word many years ago, "kiasu". Some people call it competitive, some people just call being smart. I dont know. Each are entitled to their own interpretation. I've been with different organizations, and I've worked with a lot of nationalities. There's always those who treats the work as some sort of contest of who gets in front first. But in every team I've lead, I always say this, "If you want to go fast, go alone. No one will stop you. If you want to go far, go together". Anyway, sorry I'm getting out of topic, but the point is, we can all be independent and just focus on ourselves, always guarding your own rice bowl. But we'll always need someone's help, trust me. I didnt have any families here so when I got admitted to hospital due to a minor infection, i didnt expect anyone, but the three bullies went there. The attitude of always watching your own ricebowl is definitely useful when you're in your comfort zone, like for example, your own country. But when you step out? Definitely still watch your back. But find friends along the way. They dont have to be transactional, nor do they always have to be casual people who are in different industries. Sometimes the people in the cubicles next to you also just want another person to have some meal and discussion with about toycons or hikes or marathons.
> But we'll always need someone's help, trust me. I didnt have any families here so when I got admitted to hospital due to a minor infection, i didnt expect anyone, but the three bullies went there. > > The attitude of always watching your own ricebowl is definitely useful when you're in your comfort zone, like for example, your own country. > > But when you step out? Definitely still watch your back. But find friends along the way. They dont have to be transactional, nor do they always have to be casual people who are in different industries. Good on you on finding friends you can relate to at work. Of course, I am not dismissing your take on this issue. After all, the relationships you forge at work are real, just as how the people you interact with are real as well. My only qualm with this arrangement is that work at the end of the day is still work, and many people do this just to make a living or to chase their career aspirations. No one of sane disposition go to work just to make friends — after all, work is never permanent: people come and go, and good times often never last forever with a change of management. As for finding friends along the way, I just want to point out it is perfectly normal to have no one to talk to during adulthood but it isn't because one doesn't have friends at all. We often have so much reservation these days about how we feel and how expressing our inner thoughts will be perceived by others that we end up keeping to ourselves. In time, this turns into a self enforced loneliness as what OP has mentioned. Of course, if one expect the worst of others, that is what we will end up finding since our minds are often great at validating our own opinions. The key to friendship is reciprocity. It is to my experience that the people I know who have the strongest friendships (not necessarily the most) are genuinely more interested in others than whether others are interested in them. And when they need someone to speak to, it's simply a matter of to whom. Unfortunately for us, such people are a rarity these days, and they are even more so in work environments where people often work just to act their wage. There’s a reason why friendships are best cultivated in environments when there is common interest and shared aspirations. The office is unfortunately just a place of convenience for many.
Yeah, you're correct on this. Shared interests and aspirations are a big factor. I got lucky with my previous work because we all happen to match each other's energies. But in general, office is just a place of convenience for many. There are also days when I actually just want to finish the work for the day, get paid, and go home. Lols.
I totally don’t get the jokes.
They might be insensitive jokes for many, so I can't share what it means, sorry. Haha. But it is basically just refers to many stereotypes, our team is mixed of people from in and out of sg. So I'll let you just figure it out based on the previous comment. Do note that I wont say this to any stranger who I dont know the tolerance for dark humor, which in our team, I already know. Haha.
Okay since this is reddit, maybe I can share about the joke, but I'll tone it down a bit. When we had to do three consecutive weekends of work, we opted to order lunch through grab app because its been raining nonstop, then I jokingly asked one of the guy if he knows the delvery guys because he looked liked them, so thats where the banter started (I know, really, really bad joke). The gojek is a word play, because one of our teammate is also from a neighboring country. On my end, I came from a country where most people work in hospitals overseas, like in sg hospitals. Hence the joke that someone in ER always needs my assistance, and also them asking me in some mornings if I already did my rounds.
You're assuming that being more competitive and cut-throat at work gets you more promotions, prestige etc. My experience is that more collaborative and cooperative people get more promotions, prestige and success.
As I said before: > The only time they don’t is when **work** becomes competitive… In certain competitive work environments (think of executives), there are only so many job vacancies available to you — either for promotion or for hire. Collaboration within your team members seem dandy and good, but if your superiors can only afford to elevate a select number of you to the upper echelons: who do you think will they promote at the end of the day? A team worker who only can produce results when working as a team, or someone else who has proven themselves by merit that they can get the job done? Of course, one can argue that this is all circumstantial and that it ultimately depends on the job scope, but the price of forgoing better opportunities at work just to be a team sport seem to run contrarian: you are after all going to work to make money, not to make friends.
>Collaboration within your team members seem dandy and good, but if your superiors can only afford to elevate a select number of you to the upper echelons: who do you think will they promote at the end of the day? A team worker who only can produce results when working as a team, or someone else who has proven themselves by merit that they can get the job done? I think there is a false dichotomy here. You can be both a team player and someone who has proven merit to get the job done. It is not one or the other. In fact, being a team player and being collaborative can be useful in getting the job done rather than going solo.
Always surprised by comments that government job = lax, please tell me which government job is so good being lax, everywhere I see my govt service friends complaining about overwork and stress, from teaching to police to caseworkers.
Ahh I used to be colleagues can never be friends. But then I realised actually it's more like "don't assume your colleague is your friend, but actually along the way some of your colleagues CAN be friends" : ) so yeah last sentence is correct! In fact haha my friends (who are ex colleagues, used to work at the same place but then one of them left) were saying how that workplace the people are super chill, "like secondary school everytime also wanna go ppl house to hangout as if 5day week not enough" - but they're just super friendly and easy-going I guess. My colleagues and I are ok, like we don't really chat outside of work and stuff but we do have casual convos from time to time. & I'll partly admit it's also cause one day someone good-naturedly said "hey how r u!" and I was like "u rly wna know" and then mumbled something about like "AAAA deadlines" lol. then that broke the ice into how's your experience like here, how's the REAL progress on the project, etc. Not just the stony faced "pretend everyone and everything is ok and we are all perfectly functioning and meeting every single deadline ahead of time" (lol we are NOT. :p)
When most people start working or get married, they are very likely to drift away. For me as an introvert, its even harder to retain such friends. At the start I still tried to organise outings and keep in touch, but it got very tiring initiating all these all the time. I decided to just go with the flow. If they are willing to drift away, no matter what you do they won't stay. Making new friends is cool for me, but it's always hard to forge a good bond with anyone, as compared to in the past. I'm always open to knowing new people though! Do you have any interests or hobbies? Or what's the area of your studies/working sector? You'll be more likely to find like-minded people this way! All the best :D
Ikr. Sometimes I also feel like why is it that I’m always the one initiating
And it's draining to be initiating all the time. No worries bro, just be yourself and you'll find like-minded people eventually! :)
Agree...
Lai, be my friend! Open to making new friends regardless of age :)
Haha sure bro why not! You can always drop a DM! :)
>colleagues aren’t family or friends What's up with these rules? Do people really love living in hard mode? Just go with the flow. Anyone and everyone could be a friend.
If not friend why friend shaped?
My best friend is a former colleague. We hang out in each other house and catch movie sometimes. What’s with the label.
No it's just in alot of workplaces colleague see each other as competitions.
Because the workplace acts as a bridge and without it whats there to talk about? Maybe checkup on one another from time to time but wont be as close?
exactly, in fact most lifetime friend are from workplace or during uni, there is a theory behind it as both have common topic to dicusss and have same interest about the field sector, but then you need choose right person to be friend with.
the people who say "work is work, don't share anything personal to colleagues" tends to be the problematic ones instead.
The issue is usually is the other party do not know when to draw the line. So hence work is work. Friends is friend. Did encounter when things go south, things can get really ugly
thissss hahaha but I think my team is ok la. bonding and talk cock really is bond and talk cock LOL. but when it comes to work like better know who did what and who passed what instructions to who lol. but ya January team-bonding we were just talking abt like generational trauma (! oop) and parenting and breaking the cycle hahaha (incl my boss sia lol) - I was quite impressed, because I've learned to match my level of sharing or reciprocity by what i see. But then I must also caveat we're 90% female. part of the gist of that convo was "women talk abt these things, and feelings, and how we navigate them - but in men it's mostly taboo. Like they just talk abt NS lor lol" I paused. "Ya really leh my dad will talk about ... travelling, his time in civil service ... and .. ya" (he didn't do NS because originally born in Msia and converted to citizenship for marriage and I don't even know if he was ever PR or whatnot but tldr, his equivalent is, was in SPF not NS)
Ikr. I have colleagues that i can count on as friends and when we have life milestones we do gather, i.e. new bto, baby 1 yr old bday etc. And also for drinks n beer with the project team, just to bitch about the boss. It's a good way to vent and last that bit longer and grow ur career rather than job-hop when u feel frustrated. Of coz if u are in a toxic environment just leave, but sometimes we just need to bitch abit and the spouse isn't really the best person to bitch about work.
Aren't there times when you just "click" and bond with someone at work? Not romantically, but there's a spark. I envy my MIL who is 80 and still travels/hangs out with her school friends - friendships are so important ...
My mom reconnected with her secondary school friends at 60! They don't travel but then sometimes they do group hangouts, but she also has this other closer friend (in part because they stay nearer proximity) that she hangs out with one-on-one for meals from time to time! hasn't happened in a while this year though ..
This. I made quite a number of great friends at workplace whom I still meet up after 20+ years!
How’d you do it man? I cant seem to keep any of my ex colleagues as friends
It takes time and effort to cultivate relationships. Started with lunch, then drinks, partying, helping out each other, celebrating birthdays, festivals together, etc.
I think depends though. Like if you are a manager, there’s always a distance you need to keep with your subordinate. There’s some things you’d know that you can’t ever share with them (e.g somebody else’s performance) so it’s very hard to be really friends at that level.
Over the years, I realise the workplaces and schools are places of convenience where people come to work/study together. There are more opportunities to maintain ties as everyone sees each other almost on a weekly basis. After a person is no longer around/leaves a place, sometimes the relationships will end/follow out the door. Have already experienced this many times after different phases in my life, like Uni/NS/changing job etc. It does feels disappointing at times but I guess this is part and parcel of adulthood. My view is it takes effort to maintain relationships over time no matter where the persons are located at. And it is also possible to open up new relationships if one is keen to explore, like e.g. join interest groups/volunteer.
Sigh. I can relate. Lost my secondary and post friends. All of them. Barely have 2 from ns, not much family due to certain reasons and really struggling now. Live alone and feel really lonely at times. It’s so bad that I go to this ytf stall regularly (even tho it’s quite ex) because the auntie there talks like she is family.
Me too
How old are you if you don't mind me asking? Have you tried dating apps to meet a partner?
Early 30s. Yes have tried and recently got heartbroken by a girl from hinge. Not gonna try it again for a long while. Also not in the right headspace for a relationship. Feels like I need friends more than a partner right now
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I rather have an intimate dinner with a few friends, just three or four of us than going to a gathering party where everyone is flexing. Hate those patronizing moments or small talk where people ain't really interested about your life.
totally, going out for the obligatory sec sch gathering and they all chit chatting away while you're just the token invite. the usual talk about change job, salary, gf/bf, getting married. honestly feels very pointless, then you'd find out they have some other group chats going on and you're not in the loop of whatever/whoever they are talking about.
Surface chats. Lol.
I learned this in Phase 2 Covid. HAHAHA. When it comes to choosing 4 friends (d'uh its 5pax, the last pax is yourself mah) - who will you pick? THATS your real friends : )
actually some colleagues can become friends esp if you have similar interests. one of my close friends is from my first job after graduation. we are no longer working at the same place but make an effort to meet each other at least 4x a year haha. adulting is understanding that you dont have to meet all the time to be close or to be friends. i also made new friends as an adult when i became a cat mum.
I haven't had many RL friends since I came out of NS in 2013. My life hasn't exactly been the smoothest since then, that's one thing but it's also because I'm a huge homebody myself who doesn't exactly thrive on social interaction (your stereotypical introvert basically) so my "friends" mostly from online games. Does it get lonely? Well yes. but I've learned to live with it. Besides, I don't know what's worst, loneliness or needing to participate in those awkward water cooler conversations.
Thank you all for dropping by to take the time to read & share your one cents one this.
I'm 28M, I have a friend just like you. Having to depend on herself at a young age and forced to grow up quick to support herself. She's often lonely, just like myself, and tries to keep herself occupied to not feel as lonely. I share the same experience with her. Growing up we didn't really fit in anywhere so we didn't make friends along the way. Now in adulthood, its much more difficult to make close friends, especially ones you can trust. I'd recommend you to join more interest clubs and classes/group activities. It's there where you can meet people and gain exposure for yourself. Meet more people, get to know them, spend time with them, and decide for yourself who you can consider friends.
I feel like im losing friends too as everyone around me moves onto the next stage in life- get married and have kids, whereas im single and have more free/alone time
Same, I'm sure many also feel this way ..
I am 39 years old, and at this point almost a loner. I was also a school drop out at the age of 16, did not go to poly, JC, let’s not mention uni. Had been much of an outcast in my teenage days and instead mostly made friends from the internet during the hey days of online forums and chatrooms, either that or friends from work. Completely did not even bond with anyone during NS like normal guys do. Anyway, as time goes by, everyone else moves on with their lives especially once everyone starts having families of their own, and colleagues are still colleagues, even if we were once like a family. The team disbands, people move on to other jobs, we all grow older and have more responsibilities and commitments, life goes on. My social life now is non-existent, especially since there is no longer any venues for me to find new friends, and my present colleagues are a radically different type of people from the sort I used to be with. Work is just work, we don’t really communicate much outside of it.
A lot of the times, colleagues can be like hi and bye friends/acquaintances. People you interact with on a daily basis but don’t hang out outside of work, same goes for when you’re schooling. I did made two really good friends from my workplace who I actually hang out with outside of work but it mostly boils down to me vibing with them and having really similar interests, so keep an open mind and just stick to those that reciprocates to your friendship.
24. Lost pretty much entire social circle over the years on account of NS and me working while in Uni. I just hold on to the hope that when all this blow over I can start to carve new relationships.
Suspect that we drift away because we are at different stages of life. In addition, our worldviews clash with each other. I realise it is better to set my own boundaries. There are many people outside everywhere and they are keen to make friends. Maybe you can start sharing about your interests or hobbies. From there then, you will meet likeminded people. But please exercise caution when meeting them. As for me, i will spend time on watching anime or drama. Either, I will do home workout before heading for a run. Also, I met friends whom I have not met in a long time (probably more than a few months or years) for brunch or lunch, not regular ones. Oh yes, i read books too. :)
Yes as you grow older people start to be apart , in a family unit where the children are pre occupied with work and own family to even meet up with siblings and parents. In the own family unit , people are busy with phones and whatnots. I can imagine how hard it is for a single person, but you need to make an effort to have some friends, colleagues can be good friends too. Need to have the same wavelength. I suggest to go for courses or even like gym classes/spin bike classes to make new friends in your life.
A long time ago. Someone gave me this advice “If you want to be friends, then act like friends” Sure. Not everyone will reciprocate. Sure. Some will be false friends. But if you never try you’ll never know.
We should just band together and create a support group at this point. Its so so important. Many people who are religious have an easier time accessing a community wheareas non-religious folks might find it hard to find the same network of support. More so if you are someone who struggles with social anxiety and is just introverted by nature. If anyone is down with this idea, hit me up. I have a few board games in tow and if it becomes a thing, I already have some other board games I'm eyeing to buy (:
Join interest group on your free time or if you happen to be a Christian (im only speaking this cause I'm a Christian myself) Join a church. I made the most authentic loving friendship in church. Im not too sure how other religion works? But if you're a muslim you can go for madrasah and you'll have friends there. Humans are social creature. Like it or not. Only difference is high intensity of meeting friends (extroverts) or low intensity of meeting friends (introverts) there has to be some form of friends that you make throughout your life. Aye but if you dont mind. Im open to making new friends. I'm a introvert tho so i don't really initate conversation that much(im just fortunate i get loads of opportunities to make friendships)
When you grow older, you will realise friends are not your top priorities. Family members like your parents and siblings are.
Tbh i think friends matter a lot. Not as much as family members of course but they're also important to have in life. You need people around you to spend time with, help you out when you're at a low point in your life and to celebrate with you when something good happens. Being a friendly and good person to many people comes with a lot of perks and benefits even something as simple as having someone to treat you to a drink. I will never understand why people on here love to say "Your colleagues should not be your friends." Why..??? Why limit yourself? So many people I know myself included have found good friends from work that hang out outside work too. They'll say this and then lament about not having social life or any friends in their 30s.
mostly is does matter about friend, is more about acquaintance , each event have a acquaintance group that do thing together.
Believe it or not, smartphones are the main cause of this loneliness epidemic. I dont think its as bad in the pre smartphone era. Everything from social media to "leaning too much of own understanding" has cut down on real life interaction to maintain relationships. Nothing like a little stupidity to preserve the humility. People are too smart for their own damn good.
In my early 30s and I hate interacting with new people beyond superficial business reasons. I can empathise with the grinch on wanting to be alone and enjoy my quiet time and not worry about other people’s feelings
Friends don’t just come, you make friends if you want one. Ofc it’s trial and error but you’ll learn and you’ll meet different types of people and personality, hence, contributes to your growth too. Differences and diversity will teach you how to deal with people and you’ll know who you want or don’t want to be in your life.
I haven't really made new friends since I graduated sec sch coz I couldn't get into tiertiary schools and my social life sorta died there. Other people kinda just come and go. I do have some friends who have been with me for the last 15-20 years (I'm 34F now), but it's also kinda on and off. One of my newer bonded friend was from work. I think if you vibe with them well then just befriend them. Be discerning also. Some colleagues are just friendly but not always friend-material. I do feel lonely when I want to play new games but have no one to call because adults are busy :( my partner doesn't game either. But I also have other things I enjoy doing alone so it's not as bad these days compared to my younger 20s. You kinda just find fulfilment elsewhere.
I made my best friends in my course of work, even my project manager is my good friend…
I found most of my friends from discord/arcade so I'd say it's more of putting yourself out there, you never know who you may meet. I've met a property agent cum yoga instructor and a fire breather from working event jobs, cyclists from reservist, and also a guy who listens to the same music as me from work. I'd say give it a shot trying to talk to people on reddit as well :) or try meetup.com or Eventbrite to see if you meet anyone. Of course, always err on the side of caution but also, be willing to open up.
27M.I only have a few frienda from sec school. None after and i try to make frienss online when playing my video games. It is lonely. Dating is non existent as there isnt a way to meet like minded with my work hours(60-72hrs/week). Everyday routine is just wake up, go work, go home,play for 3 hrs, go sleep. rinse and repeat.
Not all colleagues are friends. Some people can act genuine in front of you but backstab you like mad behind your back. There's one mad person in my department behaving this way. Thinking that the world revolves around them and wants to know every single new gossip. When groups are laughing without them they get paranoid, thinking that we are badmouthing about them. But you can still make friends outside your workplace. Find new hobbies and join new interest groups and slowly expand ur social circle!
I can be your friend 🙂.. youre not alone OP !!⚘️
First mover advantage. Jiayous!
Having friends at different stages of life from Primary to Tertiary education and then work life. It is more about maintaining your social circle. I too used to have many cliques of friends but now i only usually talk to the usual few, less than 5 probably. If you are feeling lonely, pick up an interest and there will be like minded people who are willing to be your friends. If you game, find some game friend to play every night.
You can join a dance class. Hip hop, street jazz, pole dancing. If you want to meet guys, can join partner dancing like bachata , salsa , kizomba etc.
Ppl change. Your friends in youth will change, sone get closer, some will disappear. Keep meeting new ppl and picking up hobbies.
The number of true friends I have now can be counted with just 1 hand. 4 of them married already while 1 is still flying high at overseas. Married bros are not the same as last time because of family commitments which I understand while I only see the remaining one once per year when he is back to Singapore for holidays. So I’m technically same as having no true friends now.
Because work is work and friends are not a part of it. Don’t shit on the rice bowl that fed you for so long.
For me... I do feel lonely and wish to have more friends, but it's not happening, so I just focus on how to earn more money.
Same. I want to date but impossible already. Tired with needing to work for more money. If I could work 7 days to get more money I would.
I moved here in 2022 and if it weren't for my colleagues I'd have no friends at all. It's hard to make friends in a new country (as an adult), unless you go to clubs and stuff -- which can feel a bit forced.
Got myself an anime waifu :D Say real one tho, hobbies. Get out of the house and do something during the weekends
Well you can be each other friends!
I have an alternative view on this. It is easy to make friends in secondary school, jc etc for 2 reasons: 1) Proximity. Many of those friends I made in secondary school were those that I had due to convenience and proximity, as opposed to actually mutually shared values. Coming from a minority, you don't really get to choose your friends, in that sense. You hang around those that are like you in sufficient ways to warrant a friendship. 2) Complexity Children and adolescence have yet to acquire much real-world experience. They are ignorant of values, morals and so on without much information to go on. As we develop, we become increasingly complex humans.. and naturally as a result, it becomes more difficult to relate to people. personally, I find it also quite difficult to make friends at this age (not that I have the time for many) and for good reason. And if it is harder for you, then great... means that you have become a more interesting and complex person.
It’s easier to make friends in schools because people come together to do something. When you’re adults, it is easier to find friends in activity groups. Chatting up some stranger at the beach, cafe and making deep friendship is very unlikely. I happened to joined an activity group (not religious) more than 10 years ago made countless friends. Ultimately it will come down to the individual to find and maintain friendships.
I'm reaching my 30s(F) soon and I'm really a loner. I used to have a group of close friends in sec sch but I gradually came to terms with me not actually liking them lol. I had one friend I talked to a lot more than the rest but it's really draining to have to arrange a meetup every time. We both work in healthcare too. I just stopped trying. I don't like people in my workplace either and I'm just cordial. I don't feel like joining them in activities outside of work. I am also not very girly or go do my nails, go shopping, etc. I don't have a partner nor do I actively look for one. Some days I feel like it would be nice but other days, I think I wouldn't tolerate living with someone else or they tolerate me as well. 😅 A lot of my hobbies are solitary also so... 😓 Definitely need to put in a lot of effort to find friends but my energy is like -1000%. Idk how people go gymming, spin class, dance class. It's expensive also. I'm starting to think work is the problem. 🤣
Surely you didnt drop out of every school? My best friend is from post secondary. We still whatsapp frequently. Otherwise I hang out with a group of ex-colleagues every month or so, but we also whatsapp frequently. Then I have another bunch of ex colleagues that meet up every once in a while. But to be honest, this is about as much as I can muster. Anything else and its too much work lols. But dont be friends with your colleagues, you never know what they might be planning. Its ok to be friends with them after your work relationship is complete though.
People say don't befriend colleagues but I still do it anyways. I may not actively seek it out, but if we click, we click. Sure, sometimes I get hurt because of it but I have also made some good ones. But aside from friends made in school, my longest friendships come from my hobbies.
Friends gradually drift apart after grad and after leaving the company and it's very sian when you are the one initiating and not receiving much reciprocate
Got friend also will get snatch by other people . LOL I don't know Y some ppl Exisit
I dont really keep in contact with friends from school days and i usually just go home and chill after work. I spend my time on my hobbies , kinda realise my craving for social interaction is really little but thats just me though. I have friends who literally told me they would go into a depression if they didnt go out to some socialising for a week.
The rule is not all colleagues are your friends. You can make friend with your colleagues, they won't bite. One of my best friends is my ex colleague
Have 1 best friend, have a few Army friends. That's it.
Try FBs escorts ect , U will not be lonely
Many people would be willing to be friends with you here. I assume you will receive at least a few dms from this post. Otherwise there’s bumble bff too. Can also try Slowly if you’re into online penpals, I personally really like the app
Want to make friend ? I pmed you