I don't "lose on purpose", but if someone new or a lower belt is working something, sometimes I just won't fight the escape as much as I could and they might finish it.
That being said I'm not gonna GIVE it to them. They gotta work.
Yeah I generally won't give actual submissions away but I'm happy to be as facilitating as possible with positions and sweeps in order to make things fun and active.
Exactly, lowering your strength and speed let's you practice making your technique absolutely perfect less it fails. They have an easier time working theirs and you've got an opportunity to work the exact angles and pressure without getting duped right away by someone at your skill level
I used to train with a guy that did this, he called it Project Mayhem. Weird dude though if I'm being honest, could seem like two completely different people.
It was a black belt's birthday, and the coach was doing Ego Busters. First half of the round, lower belt picks the starting position. Second half, upper belt does. Except if you're going against the birthday boy, then you get to pick 100% of the time.
Coach's suggestion was to start with subs 90% locked in, and if he escapes, tap immediately so you can reset to another 90% sub.
Maybe instead of losing on purpose, work on letting yourself get into a bad spot and finding a way to get out.
Or work on a specific technique that you're not good at or don't use often.
This is legit. I have been doing this the last couple months to give myself more experience in tough spots with people who don't really pose a threat and it's been great!
I’ll often roll with guys who it’s their first time grappling or are very new. I don’t lose on purpose, but I will sometimes let my opponent get into positions that I could have easily stopped them from getting into including letting them sink in subs.
If you are forgetting what you want to work on after 30 seconds then that means your partner is better than you to the point where you have no choice but to resort to survival mode. You just aren’t experienced enough to work on any specific thing. Keep training and as you get better you will relax and be able to actually think through your positions.
You aren’t struggling with competitiveness. Nobody likes to lose. You are struggling with your own insecurities. Probably goes beyond jiu jitsu. Start there.
BJJ got so much more fun when I stopped caring. In side control? Shrimp the wrong way and let them take my back then try escaping when things are worse. I feel a lot more comfortable in bad positions and I’ve come up with a few escapes that I get a lot of folks with because I wasn’t afraid to try them/care if I lose.
Last week I was all “ah he’s competing this weekend, he’ll want the morale boost”.
Reality was the little shit has a mean fuckin’ straight ankle lock and it hurt.
Scrolled way too far to find this.
There is no winning and losing in class just learning. You should be trying new things, you should be getting tapped.
No blue should be getting tapped by any but the best of the whites. Those whites should be near promotion or have significant wrestling or raw talent.
Being a good training partner is something more coaches should teach and reinforce. Spazzy egomaniacs should be tossed into the cage with the fighters for a couple of hours to learn with guys they can’t hurt easily. In my experience most fighters enjoy working each other over but would never hurt somebody if they can help it. That’s the control we’re looking for.
Take the tap… reset, try not to f it up the same way again.
I find if I go into a roll with a specific position I want to get to my training partners will sense it and stop me from getting there, and then if I try to force it anyway things degenerate into using strength instead of technique.
So I think it's better just to treat rolling as free/fun and let things lead wherever they will. Working on specific things is good too but rolling is not the right time.
I dont lose on purpose. But my win conditions are not making the other person tap.
Each day Ive studied something I want to improve on. It is best if I only pick one thing. I watch instructionals. Then before rolls I remind myself of what Im working on. I do this before every roll. During the roll Im laser focused on getting it. A win is when I remember to even try. Some days I forget every single roll, but most of the time Im able to practice it.
If it is complex I might ask my partner to let me positional spar it like 5 times. Over 5-10 rounds I can get a lot of reps in without imposing too much on a single person.
A month before a comp Im just rolling with what I know, not trying to add anything new. In those cases Im rolling to win rounds, but I let people know Im training for a comp and make sure they are ok with it.
Yeah 90% of my wins i just let my opponents win.
If i even use 20% of my power i'd just maul all the coloured belts.
Oh gawd life is hard as a white belt.
If you don’t consider being tapped in the training room as “losing”, you probably won’t obsess as much on “winning”.
While I don’t think letting people tap you on purpose is super useful, I found that focusing on controlling position and seeing the tap (on either end) as a way to reset position and getting a chance to establish control again worked well for me.
I cant say it s on purpose , but when I see that someone way smaller than me nomatter man or woman, are making it difficult for me ,i a take a second to think how would it be if that person was at the same size like I am , and then I give them a the tap to acknowledge that theyvwere good. On the next round though I let them face reality
Not on purpose. Often, with lower belts or women who are my belt rank, or significantly smaller, I’m not going to go 100%.
If they use good technique, I’ll fight it a bit but not as if my life depends on it. If they finish it, they finish it.
I help coach intro classes at my gym now so I partially feel responsible for students improvement. So i usually won’t go very hard when rolling with white belt and will let them work. Also. I will often give up good positions against blue or purple belts in order to work in being defensive. This often leads to me losing the round, but it’s a learning process. Rolling isn’t competing, the whole point is for you to practice against an unwilling opponent and learn what works and doesn’t work in a live scenario.
I let white and smaller blue/purple belts (usually women) work on things and won’t block them, if I can tell they’re trying it with proper technique, and some times I get submitted. And that’s totally okay for me. Or I let myself get 90% of the way there and then work on escaping with proper technique.
Not exactly - but we do have some smaller but very talented women at our academy. I use very little resistance or strength when rolling with them, instead I let them work. I can very easily muscle out of most positions but I don’t. I do make them work hard for it, but don’t explode out of things. Occasionally I’ll turn it up gradually and let them know so they can also learn to cope with and adapt to higher pressure and strength - I think that is hugely important so as not to build a false sense of security, especially from a self-defence perspective.
I will tailor down my strength/skill to my opponents level if I can tell they are inexperienced or there is a gap in one of the areas. It doesn’t benefit me to beat up on newbies or guys significantly smaller/weaker than me.
Honestly kinda yeah.
I start guard most times even though I’m much better on top. Most rolls I won’t go apeshit to stop someone from passing or submitting me. I’d rather take the L and keep rolling and executing techniques than get stuck in a 3 minute war over some tiny change in position.
It’s a switch. Training mode for me is ok with taking L’s. Competition mode will grind my forehead through your neck to pass from half guard into side control.
Humility really increases my learning capacity and also learning “outcome independence”. When I’m not scared of the outcome; I’m much more willing to experiment and learn
I think you are mistaking training for competition.
You can't lose in training.
There is no win or lose condition.
I mean unless you are playing a task based games with a wim condition.
Tapping or being tapped in training is neither winning or losing its a part of learning.
Do I put myself into position where a training partner might have a higher chance of tapping me, sure all the time.
Am I going to fight out of every single submission like my joints or consciousness actually depends on escape.
Hell no.
Do I not finish a submission in hopes that a training partner can work escape and survive absolutely.
Try reframing what “winning” and “losing” mean. If you think “winning” is getting a sub then you are going to get tough, or good at Jiu Jitsu. However, if you make “winning” getting a particular sweep or escape, then you will start to see faster improvement.
It’s good to have that killer instinct, but you need to learn how to control it. Just like with any attribute you have.
I sometimes smash people then let them work and even feel like they’ve smashed me. Letting someone build confidence is fine.
If I’m much better than someone else overall…it’s not much different from training with a kid. I’ll let them get certain things but only after I’ve made it clear I’m letting them do certain things to also confirm to them this stuff works
I'm a purple belt and I have this problem. Not necessarily with people much more or less skilled but it's mostly with people who I know I could give a really challenging roll and even come out on top.
I honestly see rolling as training, for myself and my partners. I try not to roll the “win at all cost” people. This is not a competition, we are training.
So if my partner is doing well, i dont fight too hard and let the, get the move, if they are just bouncing around, then I work on my techniques.
I'm not sure if I ever lose on purpose but I definitely roll with people knowing that I'm going to lose.
Alright. That sounds a little bit weird. But ill try to focus on stuff that isn't my A game and more often than not, I get punished for it.
Sort of...I may coast the round. An example is if I was comfortably winning a round or subbing my opponent and there's 1-2minutes left on the clock, I'll let them pass or turtle and then hold them off/re-guard until the buzzer. It's good for defense and gives my opponent new opportunities to work too. Also, if I'm rolling with people lower weight/women, and they are using superior technique, and if the only way out for me is using my strength rather than technique, its a tap.
I have started tapping to super light pressure with a guy who rolls too damn hard on every single roll. I'm athletic, my cardio is better than his, I'm Stronger than him, but man I just don't need him constantly trying to sink stuff to prove he can. When we roll live I will just control him and tire him out until the time is up because he goes full spazz and he's not good enough to pass or maintain guard.
If I'm being honest at first my ego really didn't work for me to tap to light stuff. If he happened to catch something I'd hang there too long and let him apply too much pressure. Now I tap, we reset and it stops him from being able to ramp up to end up hurting me. I would get mad if he did catch something and then I'd want to go hard on the next roll. Since then I've realized, I'm not that good at this stuff since nobody is asking me for autographs.
There's a gal I regularly roll with who is one of my favorite training partners and she has actually tapped me for real and doesn't believe it because I tap to everything with that guy. It's kinda sad really
Work on late stage sub defence. Tell them before the roll. They get close to a sub, then you start escaping. This way you 'win' by not getting subbed, but if you get subbed.... It's not a big deal because you let them get almost to that point with no resistance.
The best part is - your Jiu jitsu will massively improve from this. And hopefully it's easier on your ego
What?
"Losing on purpose" is different from "not trying to win".
You can do either of the above and still learn absolutely nothing.
Focus on doing the thing you set yourself to do and learning from what goes right/wrong from it.
Against everybody vaguely close to your level and below, tell yourself you will give them openings until they put you in a sub. Then you get to practice an escape, potentially a pretty late-stage one, and you may only get back to guard or turtle or something. Then go back to defending suboptimally, until they start making you suffer again and briefly try again. See it as survival-only training. You don't have to lose, but if you give them like twice as many sub opportunities, you will lose more. And if you do lose this was, then you must have waited to long to try. As long as you were thinking hard during, you can learn a lot from those "points of no return." Also, verbally saying to myself that I might lose helps me relax and let them work more as well. I have the same problem, but luckily I suck enough to lose plenty on accident.
You're a white belt.
You're not supposed to be rolling to win. You're supposed to be rolling to learn.
Learn to escape more effectively. Learn to pass more effectively. Learn to stop attacks more effectively.
If getting the tap is all you're aiming for, you're probably also giving yourself the reputation as the overly aggressive (and possibly spazzy) white belt at the gym.
When it comes to other white belts, I just let them work. I would never let them get me into a scenario where they might tap me, but I let them dominate me an entire round.
The higher belts let me do it to them too, it just boosts confidence/allows me to develop skills. It’s all about how they sell it though. If it’s obvious they aren’t trying…. I just lose interest.
Not losing on purpose but deliberately opening my game up to take more risks, empty out the gas tank, be on the offensive instead of shelling up trying desperately to not get tapped, losing was just a natural by product of that.
But every time I lost, I deliberately forced my brain to take it as a learning experience and giving myself props for going out on my shield rather than taking it as an attack on my ego/self worth.
Yes. Sometimes a against very eager whitebelts, I just give them 1 or 2 taps; sometimes so they know their pace is a bit aggressive for me, sometimes it just gives them enough satisfaction so they are chill and easy to work with the rest of the round.
I train with a lot of guys bigger and stronger. I was able to win, but I was physically redlining it and was sore all the time.
So I stopped that. Now I get tapped a lot more by white belts. But I’m also starting to develop a bit more of a relaxed game. I suspect it starts to work in my favour when they can’t feel me resisting everything all the time. Also, if I need to be a bit explosive to free an arm or break a grip, it’s more effective.
I give some people a certain handicap and then I start working seriously at a point depending on what I expect from them. Sometimes I misjudge, give them too much and they submit me.
I was just thinking it would be beneficial when going to a new place, rolling with someone you usually beat or out rank. Let them work for something and tap you, but then do what you want. That might be the thing that makes their day and makes them want to stay with it. And for you it makes you a less intimidating, fun roll. I want people to be happy to see me and want to roll with me instead of avoiding eye contact when I’m looking for someone.
Sometimes I try to work on one single thing and keep trying to get to that position/move, sometimes I am just trying fun moves like granby rolls or berimbolos, or I just blank out and become a dead body, to where I "lose rolls", but I don't really care because I'm just there to have fun
I only try not to "lose" when I'm training for a comp or when I'm rolling with somebody that is getting ready for a comp
I don't "lose on purpose" however even when in competition I try to do a technique or game that I am trying out to see if it is good or not. I have a shit comp record which this attitude is partially to blame.
In the gym I will do dumb shit like let a purple belt start on my back to see if I can get out. Which bites me in the ass all the time but I have gotten far better at escapes due to it.
Any time I roll with a higher belt and I'm about to tap them, I let them get out and reverse it at the very end of the round so they don't leave the roll with a vendetta against me; some of them will get a little wild if their ego is hurt.
No, but I do "lose" to people I could beat. This is because practice IE sparing is mainly about skill development unless you're getting ready for a competition. That means I am trying new things I have not perfected. When working these moves, folks may get passes, back control, etc. that they would not ordinarily get and occasion even a sub. You will find as your skill improves, your ego will want you to continue tapping people with you A game. The issue with this is that you will never get better at anything else.
There have been a few points in my training where for a couple weeks or a month I've asked to start in a rubbish position (like bottom half) and immediately to reset if I advance to anything better. This is not 'losing on purpose' but trying to improve some specific things that I felt I did especially badly. I wouldn't say any miracles happened, but I definitely got something out of it.
When i submit a 4decade old, father of a family hobbyist, i feel guilt. Like i respect them so much just for showing up even though the hardness of life. So i submit them first and only once just to make sure to myself that i can do it, then i let them dominate, so they feel good. When you have to do it in a way to not make it obvious, and when u add that « wow nice move can you show me how u did it? » at the end of the roll. It makes losing on purpose an art and an even more refined learning method to improve your skills in my opinion.
I intentionally put myself into inferior positions all time to see if I can defend/escape.
I also unintentionally put myself into inferior positions all the time.
If it’s a lower belt or someone I know has been struggling I usually give it to them when I notice they’re going for a move and the coaches start giving them advice on how to finish it. I won’t suddenly become limp and let them do whatever tho, there are some people who don’t take the chance so I escape but I definitely slow it down and if I feel that they’re just about to get it I even tell them and give them advice.
I start every roll giving my arms to my partner. I like to just work on reacting. I know starting in bad positions is probably better, but I like to let them take the lead so I'm just working on defense and then if I get lucky enough to get in an advantageous position, I'll go for the sub. I like to go into turtle for white belts and let them work on getting hooks while I work on defending the back. They never know what to do when they get the back though so it's not really high risk lol
I’ve not lost for that reason but i can see it being helpful
Every once in a while I will let up on my defense if someone is discouraged with their progress, to let them get a sub
Lower belts that I trust and like tap me all the time cause that’s who I let get me in bad positions. Lower belts that’s spaz and think they are competing at worlds get smashed. My point is I “lose” all the time cause good blue and white belts get deep on a sub that I couldn’t get out of but doing that has for sure helped me for when higher belts catch those positions in a more serious roll.
Maybe reframe your win condition as making progress on the move you are working on?
If I am working on a guard pass, hit it, but got swept/subbed I still consider that a win.
Yeah 100%, or at least open myself up to the possibility of losing.
Example:
1. Im working turtle escapes today, in particular Im working quad pod escapes.
2. Okay, go grab scrappy white/blue belt and turtle. Let them have one hook and a seatbelt.
3. Alright, time to quad pod. “Oh wtf did he just go double unders/power half? Sheeeit”
4. Get back taken.
5. Escape from back, turtle again. Try again with new gripping strategy.
So yeah, not saying I give up everything but I work on stuff with people who might get me.
Reframe this from "losing on purpose" to "maintaining the self discipline to focus on my training goals". The wins and losses will happen as they happen but your bigger problem is you can't stay on task because your ego. Losing on purpose won't fix that.
I lost once on purpose. The initial part of class just ended, and it was time for open mat. There was one teenage boy was about to leave, but his dad insisted that he stay and get one roll. I asked him to roll, we were just rolling as usual, however I noticed his dad watching intently, with his hand clutched almost trying to cheer his son on. I was on top mount, I then laid flat on my partner, then hugged him and rolled him on to top mount, then I whispered to him to just go for a choke choke, it wasn't even set in that good, but after 5 seconds I tapped. After we reset, and finished the round with like 20 seconds left. After he just looked at me confused, I just smirked and said good job. After he left to leave the mat. His dad walked to his son to congratulate his son for his good job.
I let people work. Especially our teens and most of the women. Give up positions or if I pass I'll restart from open guard. When they are attacking, if I feel like their pressure or grips are strong enough to finish the sub, pass or whatever attack vs. a person of their size, I won't fight it. Kinda a lot of discretion and feeling out process
I don’t “lose on purpose” but I usually don’t try very hard. I feel silly going hard unless it’s someone I know and it’s a mutual thing. People think they stack up better than they do but I’m not trying to impress anyone.
Sometimes, especially at a new gym or after a long break. I'll intentionally take it really easy my first round, which usually results in me getting subbed. Helps me work out some anxiety and reinforces that 'losing' is ok. This helps me approach rolls in more of a learning state of mind.
I've always thought of it like this, I never give anyone anything but against new or less experienced people I won't use my full skillset.
I'll use whatever skills that puts me at a "them +1" level at a normal rolling intensity and speed, this results in less experienced people submitting me somtimes.
Could I have gotten out if I used X,Y, or Z technique they don't know or aren't used to, maybe. But that's not really the point and I feel like the "them +1" method not only helps who I'm working with but allows me to practice a more "basic" skill set without the crutch of more advanced techniques. (I.E. leglocks, less common guards, weird submission setups, Etc.)
Yeah sometimes. If someone is having a bad day. Maybe instead of countering everything they do. I let them work on what they have been working on. But not in an obvious way. Like if they take too long to advance a position I do what I have to do.
Don’t lose on purpose, but put yourself in bad positions and try to work out of them. Also, focus on doing things to improve instead of trying to win practice.
Perhaps a more useful idea in the long run would be to either start in bad situations or immediately allow the pass or the back take. Work to simply escape safely and with technique. No explosive movements. If you get back to a guard allow the pass again. This is really helpful because it resets your brain as to what constitutes a win and also helps if you have trouble with death battles against people the same level as you. Also it can help prevent injury and there are no massive dynamic movements or shifting of weight.
Yeah any time a leg lock is put on my left leg I just tap, to many meniscus tears I don’t care at all bro u win if you even hold my foot for a sec lmfao
I don't "lose on purpose", but if someone new or a lower belt is working something, sometimes I just won't fight the escape as much as I could and they might finish it. That being said I'm not gonna GIVE it to them. They gotta work.
Yeah I generally won't give actual submissions away but I'm happy to be as facilitating as possible with positions and sweeps in order to make things fun and active.
Exactly, lowering your strength and speed let's you practice making your technique absolutely perfect less it fails. They have an easier time working theirs and you've got an opportunity to work the exact angles and pressure without getting duped right away by someone at your skill level
No, I'm too busy losing on accident.
" " i think you are missing those XD
I used to train with a guy that did this, he called it Project Mayhem. Weird dude though if I'm being honest, could seem like two completely different people.
Was he in some sort of group he couldn't talk about?
Aren't they both in the same club though?
Yeah was friends with Robert Paulson.
There was always a weird chick who’d come sit in on classes but never participate
I knew her in grade school.
underrated comment 🤣🤣🤣🤣
Hahahahah *Chris Hansen has entered the chat
It was a black belt's birthday, and the coach was doing Ego Busters. First half of the round, lower belt picks the starting position. Second half, upper belt does. Except if you're going against the birthday boy, then you get to pick 100% of the time. Coach's suggestion was to start with subs 90% locked in, and if he escapes, tap immediately so you can reset to another 90% sub.
Maybe instead of losing on purpose, work on letting yourself get into a bad spot and finding a way to get out. Or work on a specific technique that you're not good at or don't use often.
This is legit. I have been doing this the last couple months to give myself more experience in tough spots with people who don't really pose a threat and it's been great!
I’ll often roll with guys who it’s their first time grappling or are very new. I don’t lose on purpose, but I will sometimes let my opponent get into positions that I could have easily stopped them from getting into including letting them sink in subs.
If you are forgetting what you want to work on after 30 seconds then that means your partner is better than you to the point where you have no choice but to resort to survival mode. You just aren’t experienced enough to work on any specific thing. Keep training and as you get better you will relax and be able to actually think through your positions. You aren’t struggling with competitiveness. Nobody likes to lose. You are struggling with your own insecurities. Probably goes beyond jiu jitsu. Start there.
Yes I did exactly that and it was a good learning experience. To break a habit you have to over correct the other way.
BJJ got so much more fun when I stopped caring. In side control? Shrimp the wrong way and let them take my back then try escaping when things are worse. I feel a lot more comfortable in bad positions and I’ve come up with a few escapes that I get a lot of folks with because I wasn’t afraid to try them/care if I lose.
Sometimes I *tell* people I lost on purpose, when in reality, I got smashed by the trial class whitebelt.
Last week I was all “ah he’s competing this weekend, he’ll want the morale boost”. Reality was the little shit has a mean fuckin’ straight ankle lock and it hurt.
If you’re thinking “win” or “lose” in class you’re doing It wrong.
Scrolled way too far to find this. There is no winning and losing in class just learning. You should be trying new things, you should be getting tapped.
I never get tapped, I usually either fake a stroke or stop the roll the explain how they could do it better
Hahaha the concerning thing to me is how many white/blue belts are in these posts talking about letting people work, ego is a crazy thing.
No blue should be getting tapped by any but the best of the whites. Those whites should be near promotion or have significant wrestling or raw talent. Being a good training partner is something more coaches should teach and reinforce. Spazzy egomaniacs should be tossed into the cage with the fighters for a couple of hours to learn with guys they can’t hurt easily. In my experience most fighters enjoy working each other over but would never hurt somebody if they can help it. That’s the control we’re looking for. Take the tap… reset, try not to f it up the same way again.
All the time. Just wait till I see red though
I'm colorblind so I'm always calm.
I find if I go into a roll with a specific position I want to get to my training partners will sense it and stop me from getting there, and then if I try to force it anyway things degenerate into using strength instead of technique. So I think it's better just to treat rolling as free/fun and let things lead wherever they will. Working on specific things is good too but rolling is not the right time.
So true. Never articulated it but 100% felt you when I read that.
I dont lose on purpose. But my win conditions are not making the other person tap. Each day Ive studied something I want to improve on. It is best if I only pick one thing. I watch instructionals. Then before rolls I remind myself of what Im working on. I do this before every roll. During the roll Im laser focused on getting it. A win is when I remember to even try. Some days I forget every single roll, but most of the time Im able to practice it. If it is complex I might ask my partner to let me positional spar it like 5 times. Over 5-10 rounds I can get a lot of reps in without imposing too much on a single person. A month before a comp Im just rolling with what I know, not trying to add anything new. In those cases Im rolling to win rounds, but I let people know Im training for a comp and make sure they are ok with it.
Yeah 90% of my wins i just let my opponents win. If i even use 20% of my power i'd just maul all the coloured belts. Oh gawd life is hard as a white belt.
If you don’t consider being tapped in the training room as “losing”, you probably won’t obsess as much on “winning”. While I don’t think letting people tap you on purpose is super useful, I found that focusing on controlling position and seeing the tap (on either end) as a way to reset position and getting a chance to establish control again worked well for me.
I cant say it s on purpose , but when I see that someone way smaller than me nomatter man or woman, are making it difficult for me ,i a take a second to think how would it be if that person was at the same size like I am , and then I give them a the tap to acknowledge that theyvwere good. On the next round though I let them face reality
Not on purpose. Often, with lower belts or women who are my belt rank, or significantly smaller, I’m not going to go 100%. If they use good technique, I’ll fight it a bit but not as if my life depends on it. If they finish it, they finish it.
I spam bolos, I’m terrible at them. It’s basically me losing on purpose.
I tell myself it’s good to learn to defend from bad positions but it’s just cope because I’m bad.
I help coach intro classes at my gym now so I partially feel responsible for students improvement. So i usually won’t go very hard when rolling with white belt and will let them work. Also. I will often give up good positions against blue or purple belts in order to work in being defensive. This often leads to me losing the round, but it’s a learning process. Rolling isn’t competing, the whole point is for you to practice against an unwilling opponent and learn what works and doesn’t work in a live scenario.
I let white and smaller blue/purple belts (usually women) work on things and won’t block them, if I can tell they’re trying it with proper technique, and some times I get submitted. And that’s totally okay for me. Or I let myself get 90% of the way there and then work on escaping with proper technique.
Not exactly - but we do have some smaller but very talented women at our academy. I use very little resistance or strength when rolling with them, instead I let them work. I can very easily muscle out of most positions but I don’t. I do make them work hard for it, but don’t explode out of things. Occasionally I’ll turn it up gradually and let them know so they can also learn to cope with and adapt to higher pressure and strength - I think that is hugely important so as not to build a false sense of security, especially from a self-defence perspective.
I will tailor down my strength/skill to my opponents level if I can tell they are inexperienced or there is a gap in one of the areas. It doesn’t benefit me to beat up on newbies or guys significantly smaller/weaker than me.
lol, I lose enough. I don’t have to start manufacturing losses
Honestly kinda yeah. I start guard most times even though I’m much better on top. Most rolls I won’t go apeshit to stop someone from passing or submitting me. I’d rather take the L and keep rolling and executing techniques than get stuck in a 3 minute war over some tiny change in position. It’s a switch. Training mode for me is ok with taking L’s. Competition mode will grind my forehead through your neck to pass from half guard into side control. Humility really increases my learning capacity and also learning “outcome independence”. When I’m not scared of the outcome; I’m much more willing to experiment and learn
I think you are mistaking training for competition. You can't lose in training. There is no win or lose condition. I mean unless you are playing a task based games with a wim condition. Tapping or being tapped in training is neither winning or losing its a part of learning. Do I put myself into position where a training partner might have a higher chance of tapping me, sure all the time. Am I going to fight out of every single submission like my joints or consciousness actually depends on escape. Hell no. Do I not finish a submission in hopes that a training partner can work escape and survive absolutely.
Try reframing what “winning” and “losing” mean. If you think “winning” is getting a sub then you are going to get tough, or good at Jiu Jitsu. However, if you make “winning” getting a particular sweep or escape, then you will start to see faster improvement. It’s good to have that killer instinct, but you need to learn how to control it. Just like with any attribute you have.
I sometimes smash people then let them work and even feel like they’ve smashed me. Letting someone build confidence is fine. If I’m much better than someone else overall…it’s not much different from training with a kid. I’ll let them get certain things but only after I’ve made it clear I’m letting them do certain things to also confirm to them this stuff works
I'm a purple belt and I have this problem. Not necessarily with people much more or less skilled but it's mostly with people who I know I could give a really challenging roll and even come out on top.
I honestly see rolling as training, for myself and my partners. I try not to roll the “win at all cost” people. This is not a competition, we are training. So if my partner is doing well, i dont fight too hard and let the, get the move, if they are just bouncing around, then I work on my techniques.
I lose on purpose all the time. That’s what I tell myself.
Sometimes if I tap someone quickly in a round I’ll just chill and let them work for the rest of the round just to kinda….not be greedy I guess?
I'm not sure if I ever lose on purpose but I definitely roll with people knowing that I'm going to lose. Alright. That sounds a little bit weird. But ill try to focus on stuff that isn't my A game and more often than not, I get punished for it.
I let lower belts sub me every once in a while.
Sort of...I may coast the round. An example is if I was comfortably winning a round or subbing my opponent and there's 1-2minutes left on the clock, I'll let them pass or turtle and then hold them off/re-guard until the buzzer. It's good for defense and gives my opponent new opportunities to work too. Also, if I'm rolling with people lower weight/women, and they are using superior technique, and if the only way out for me is using my strength rather than technique, its a tap.
I’ve been training two years and have only tapped once to my Sensei.
I’d suggest you find a better gym
I have started tapping to super light pressure with a guy who rolls too damn hard on every single roll. I'm athletic, my cardio is better than his, I'm Stronger than him, but man I just don't need him constantly trying to sink stuff to prove he can. When we roll live I will just control him and tire him out until the time is up because he goes full spazz and he's not good enough to pass or maintain guard. If I'm being honest at first my ego really didn't work for me to tap to light stuff. If he happened to catch something I'd hang there too long and let him apply too much pressure. Now I tap, we reset and it stops him from being able to ramp up to end up hurting me. I would get mad if he did catch something and then I'd want to go hard on the next roll. Since then I've realized, I'm not that good at this stuff since nobody is asking me for autographs. There's a gal I regularly roll with who is one of my favorite training partners and she has actually tapped me for real and doesn't believe it because I tap to everything with that guy. It's kinda sad really
Work on late stage sub defence. Tell them before the roll. They get close to a sub, then you start escaping. This way you 'win' by not getting subbed, but if you get subbed.... It's not a big deal because you let them get almost to that point with no resistance. The best part is - your Jiu jitsu will massively improve from this. And hopefully it's easier on your ego
What? "Losing on purpose" is different from "not trying to win". You can do either of the above and still learn absolutely nothing. Focus on doing the thing you set yourself to do and learning from what goes right/wrong from it.
Against everybody vaguely close to your level and below, tell yourself you will give them openings until they put you in a sub. Then you get to practice an escape, potentially a pretty late-stage one, and you may only get back to guard or turtle or something. Then go back to defending suboptimally, until they start making you suffer again and briefly try again. See it as survival-only training. You don't have to lose, but if you give them like twice as many sub opportunities, you will lose more. And if you do lose this was, then you must have waited to long to try. As long as you were thinking hard during, you can learn a lot from those "points of no return." Also, verbally saying to myself that I might lose helps me relax and let them work more as well. I have the same problem, but luckily I suck enough to lose plenty on accident.
You're a white belt. You're not supposed to be rolling to win. You're supposed to be rolling to learn. Learn to escape more effectively. Learn to pass more effectively. Learn to stop attacks more effectively. If getting the tap is all you're aiming for, you're probably also giving yourself the reputation as the overly aggressive (and possibly spazzy) white belt at the gym.
Yes - frequently, it’s how to probe other people’s style in depth
When it comes to other white belts, I just let them work. I would never let them get me into a scenario where they might tap me, but I let them dominate me an entire round. The higher belts let me do it to them too, it just boosts confidence/allows me to develop skills. It’s all about how they sell it though. If it’s obvious they aren’t trying…. I just lose interest.
Not losing on purpose but deliberately opening my game up to take more risks, empty out the gas tank, be on the offensive instead of shelling up trying desperately to not get tapped, losing was just a natural by product of that. But every time I lost, I deliberately forced my brain to take it as a learning experience and giving myself props for going out on my shield rather than taking it as an attack on my ego/self worth.
Yes. Sometimes a against very eager whitebelts, I just give them 1 or 2 taps; sometimes so they know their pace is a bit aggressive for me, sometimes it just gives them enough satisfaction so they are chill and easy to work with the rest of the round.
I wouldn’t say on purpose, but I try things that I know will most likely get me caught in something I can’t get out of.
I train with a lot of guys bigger and stronger. I was able to win, but I was physically redlining it and was sore all the time. So I stopped that. Now I get tapped a lot more by white belts. But I’m also starting to develop a bit more of a relaxed game. I suspect it starts to work in my favour when they can’t feel me resisting everything all the time. Also, if I need to be a bit explosive to free an arm or break a grip, it’s more effective.
I give some people a certain handicap and then I start working seriously at a point depending on what I expect from them. Sometimes I misjudge, give them too much and they submit me.
I let folks work. I try to figure out how late is “too late”. It’s not realistic to just push for my A game all the time.
I was just thinking it would be beneficial when going to a new place, rolling with someone you usually beat or out rank. Let them work for something and tap you, but then do what you want. That might be the thing that makes their day and makes them want to stay with it. And for you it makes you a less intimidating, fun roll. I want people to be happy to see me and want to roll with me instead of avoiding eye contact when I’m looking for someone.
Sometimes I try to work on one single thing and keep trying to get to that position/move, sometimes I am just trying fun moves like granby rolls or berimbolos, or I just blank out and become a dead body, to where I "lose rolls", but I don't really care because I'm just there to have fun I only try not to "lose" when I'm training for a comp or when I'm rolling with somebody that is getting ready for a comp
I don't "lose on purpose" however even when in competition I try to do a technique or game that I am trying out to see if it is good or not. I have a shit comp record which this attitude is partially to blame. In the gym I will do dumb shit like let a purple belt start on my back to see if I can get out. Which bites me in the ass all the time but I have gotten far better at escapes due to it.
I will sometimes let myself get into bad positions if I'm getting bored with a roll.
Yeah.. it's totally on purpose...
No, but I rarely ever try to "win" I think you'll naturally weed out this mentality of winning/losing mattering much as you continue to train more.
Any time I roll with a higher belt and I'm about to tap them, I let them get out and reverse it at the very end of the round so they don't leave the roll with a vendetta against me; some of them will get a little wild if their ego is hurt.
No, but I do "lose" to people I could beat. This is because practice IE sparing is mainly about skill development unless you're getting ready for a competition. That means I am trying new things I have not perfected. When working these moves, folks may get passes, back control, etc. that they would not ordinarily get and occasion even a sub. You will find as your skill improves, your ego will want you to continue tapping people with you A game. The issue with this is that you will never get better at anything else.
There have been a few points in my training where for a couple weeks or a month I've asked to start in a rubbish position (like bottom half) and immediately to reset if I advance to anything better. This is not 'losing on purpose' but trying to improve some specific things that I felt I did especially badly. I wouldn't say any miracles happened, but I definitely got something out of it.
When i submit a 4decade old, father of a family hobbyist, i feel guilt. Like i respect them so much just for showing up even though the hardness of life. So i submit them first and only once just to make sure to myself that i can do it, then i let them dominate, so they feel good. When you have to do it in a way to not make it obvious, and when u add that « wow nice move can you show me how u did it? » at the end of the roll. It makes losing on purpose an art and an even more refined learning method to improve your skills in my opinion.
I intentionally put myself into inferior positions all time to see if I can defend/escape. I also unintentionally put myself into inferior positions all the time.
If it’s a lower belt or someone I know has been struggling I usually give it to them when I notice they’re going for a move and the coaches start giving them advice on how to finish it. I won’t suddenly become limp and let them do whatever tho, there are some people who don’t take the chance so I escape but I definitely slow it down and if I feel that they’re just about to get it I even tell them and give them advice.
I start every roll giving my arms to my partner. I like to just work on reacting. I know starting in bad positions is probably better, but I like to let them take the lead so I'm just working on defense and then if I get lucky enough to get in an advantageous position, I'll go for the sub. I like to go into turtle for white belts and let them work on getting hooks while I work on defending the back. They never know what to do when they get the back though so it's not really high risk lol
I’ve not lost for that reason but i can see it being helpful Every once in a while I will let up on my defense if someone is discouraged with their progress, to let them get a sub
Lower belts that I trust and like tap me all the time cause that’s who I let get me in bad positions. Lower belts that’s spaz and think they are competing at worlds get smashed. My point is I “lose” all the time cause good blue and white belts get deep on a sub that I couldn’t get out of but doing that has for sure helped me for when higher belts catch those positions in a more serious roll.
Maybe reframe your win condition as making progress on the move you are working on? If I am working on a guard pass, hit it, but got swept/subbed I still consider that a win.
I wouldn't say loose on purpose but I bitch tap if i'm feeling lazy and want to restart.
Yeah 100%, or at least open myself up to the possibility of losing. Example: 1. Im working turtle escapes today, in particular Im working quad pod escapes. 2. Okay, go grab scrappy white/blue belt and turtle. Let them have one hook and a seatbelt. 3. Alright, time to quad pod. “Oh wtf did he just go double unders/power half? Sheeeit” 4. Get back taken. 5. Escape from back, turtle again. Try again with new gripping strategy. So yeah, not saying I give up everything but I work on stuff with people who might get me.
Reframe this from "losing on purpose" to "maintaining the self discipline to focus on my training goals". The wins and losses will happen as they happen but your bigger problem is you can't stay on task because your ego. Losing on purpose won't fix that.
I lost once on purpose. The initial part of class just ended, and it was time for open mat. There was one teenage boy was about to leave, but his dad insisted that he stay and get one roll. I asked him to roll, we were just rolling as usual, however I noticed his dad watching intently, with his hand clutched almost trying to cheer his son on. I was on top mount, I then laid flat on my partner, then hugged him and rolled him on to top mount, then I whispered to him to just go for a choke choke, it wasn't even set in that good, but after 5 seconds I tapped. After we reset, and finished the round with like 20 seconds left. After he just looked at me confused, I just smirked and said good job. After he left to leave the mat. His dad walked to his son to congratulate his son for his good job.
Sometimes I will tap or just let them finish when I know I could potentially escape if I had energy left
I let people work. Especially our teens and most of the women. Give up positions or if I pass I'll restart from open guard. When they are attacking, if I feel like their pressure or grips are strong enough to finish the sub, pass or whatever attack vs. a person of their size, I won't fight it. Kinda a lot of discretion and feeling out process
I don’t “lose on purpose” but I usually don’t try very hard. I feel silly going hard unless it’s someone I know and it’s a mutual thing. People think they stack up better than they do but I’m not trying to impress anyone.
Sometimes, especially at a new gym or after a long break. I'll intentionally take it really easy my first round, which usually results in me getting subbed. Helps me work out some anxiety and reinforces that 'losing' is ok. This helps me approach rolls in more of a learning state of mind.
I don’t lose on purpose but I experiment with shitty blue belt ideas all to often (which is like losing on purpose I guess)
I intentionally let everyone tap me.
I've always thought of it like this, I never give anyone anything but against new or less experienced people I won't use my full skillset. I'll use whatever skills that puts me at a "them +1" level at a normal rolling intensity and speed, this results in less experienced people submitting me somtimes. Could I have gotten out if I used X,Y, or Z technique they don't know or aren't used to, maybe. But that's not really the point and I feel like the "them +1" method not only helps who I'm working with but allows me to practice a more "basic" skill set without the crutch of more advanced techniques. (I.E. leglocks, less common guards, weird submission setups, Etc.)
Yeah sometimes. If someone is having a bad day. Maybe instead of countering everything they do. I let them work on what they have been working on. But not in an obvious way. Like if they take too long to advance a position I do what I have to do.
Don’t lose on purpose, but put yourself in bad positions and try to work out of them. Also, focus on doing things to improve instead of trying to win practice.
Perhaps a more useful idea in the long run would be to either start in bad situations or immediately allow the pass or the back take. Work to simply escape safely and with technique. No explosive movements. If you get back to a guard allow the pass again. This is really helpful because it resets your brain as to what constitutes a win and also helps if you have trouble with death battles against people the same level as you. Also it can help prevent injury and there are no massive dynamic movements or shifting of weight.
Yeah any time a leg lock is put on my left leg I just tap, to many meniscus tears I don’t care at all bro u win if you even hold my foot for a sec lmfao