Hi there Final_Ad6654. **Because we have a lot of deleted posts on this subreddit, here is a backup of the title and body of this post:** Is it a strength issue? I've been struggling with this one for some time. It feels like whenever I'm trying to reach with my left hand, my right hand seems to weak to keep my body on the wall.
Are my arms/hands just to weak or maybe there is something wrong with my feet or body positioning? I've lost count on failed attempts and make me feel pretty powerless :(
Pls help"
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Its 100% technique here, you are half bending your arm, your body is too low, your foot is to high, you aren’t actually driving off your foot, you don’t commit to a grip position on the right hand, you don’t have a full crimp and switch to a drag, your right foot isn’t doing anything because you don’t press your flag against the wall or volume, your left hand isn’t doing anything, you hesitate and double pump before throwing, because of all of this you throw half assed.
I don’t even think this is necessarily the right beta, I’d like for you to walk the feet up and heel the other volume, but even if I read it wrong and this is the beta there’s so many micro and not so micro beta opportunities you are losing here no way it’s your strength. I would like you to commit to the right hand, pull in so you are locked off, your body will sit taller put your left foot a bit lower and you’ll be able to push trough with the leg and stand up.
Depending on his years of climbing which I’m assuming isn’t a whole lot, full crimping is absolutely not needed here. Swapped to a drag do to him not being strong enough in crimps and/not feeling comfortable.
I think his beta is ok, but as you said he’s half assing it. He needs to turn his whole left hip into the wall and over his foot. Bet he could do it totally static if he did.
Yeah deeper drop knee to bring the hips below the right handhold.... Could be the backstop goes in the scoop but probably good where he has it. Right for maybe out further and lower if possible.
Using the outside edge of the left foot will push his body out of the ideal pipeline position. The only way your suggestion would work is if the foot was lower and if it were an edge. Neither of those are the case here.
That would be true if I was saying he should be driving off his foot or if this were an entirely different situation. He should be OVER his foot, basically sitting on his heel (perched if you want to get technical). It will not push him away.
You cannot passively “perch” on your heel on a slopey feature. Try balling yourself up and smearing with your heel on a volume, you’ll smear right out. There are in general little cases where a route setter will purposefully force something cramped and awkward as the position you suggest. It’s just bad technique!
Oh my god. Sitting on your heels means the balls of your feet are on the ground while the rest of your foot is near vertical and is in contact or close to contact with your butt. Like a catcher in baseball or squatting down to be eye level with a table.
In climbing, having your toe or, in cases where you have access to a nice big hold like this one, the balls of your feet on a hold and your heel up against your butt is called perching. It does generally require a decent amount of flexibility. This is especially true when you are square to the wall as your hips must be totally open. The benefit though, is it allows you to transfer a lot of your body weight into your foot without requiring a ton of body tension. In this case, the climber has plenty of room to get his hip right up against the wall while perching on the volume, he has a jug slightly above hip height for a little stabilization, and the upper volume is shallow enough to not really get in the way of his torso. There’s nothing awkward about that position and is in fact a pretty classic rest position in sport climbing. In rare boulders like this one, it’s a great way to make efficient hand movements.
I don’t know you or what your background is. Maybe there was just some miscommunication, but it seems like you’ve got a lot of learning to do before you go spraying on the internet.
Big hold meaning smearing the opposite side of a macro? The only reason he is able to stand on that hold is the right hand creating opposition for his left smear. Your suggestion to sit on the heel nevertheless, won’t work without a smear. I am well aware that it’s a common position to sit deep in the hips, what I’m saying here is that your suggestion lacks positional awareness. The foot is underneath his pulling arm, which means he must shove his hips out left in order to create opposition. He does this by using an outside flag, yet the foot is too high, which spits his hips out as soon as he releases his left hand. For him to perch, op would need a left foothold allowing him to open his hips, away from his pulling arm, as you stated. While I’m not the strongest climber, I’ve flashed up to 7a+ and have sent 7b+ out in Bleau (Person IG as proof: @justin.kim93). Don’t take my criticism personal, but I am 100% sure your advice is technically flawed.
I think the difference is intent and fluidity, if you double pump in a bouncy way it’s good, the first pump is like a spring for the second, in this case op does a mini pump, freezes at the bottom for a second then pulls, this just wastes energy since it tightens the arms in a half bent position but doesn’t transfer force into the second pull
Tbf, scrawny 16yr old is peak climbing physique. They've got a better strength to weight ratio so I wouldn't beat yourself up too much.
But yeah, technique is king ultimately.
Getting jacked in the right muscle groups will skyrocket your climbing ability though. I mean look at all the IFSC athletes, pretty much zero of them look like a scrawny kid. You need to have pretty strong muscles at a certain point, otherwise putting yourself into "unsafe" double digit positions will just get you injured.
Strong muscle =/= big muscle, plus the lighter you are, the less muscle you need. That's why we see actual scrawny kids send V15 boulder and 9a+ routes. Take Adam Ondra for example. When he was still a scrawny 17 year old kid, he managed to win almost every comp and also sent the hardest boulders he ever had. What ultimately made him put on the muscle years later was the power required by modern bouldering comps, but it hardly made him a better climber overall.
So you're telling me the climber sending v15 at an elite level has done zero supplementary lifting? I still don't see the argument. Get some muscle so you can be safer and pull harder.
Yup, in 2011 Adam Ondra sent five V15 and two V16 boulders, at a time where his training was litterally just climbing (you can find many interview saying so) and he was a scrawny as it gets.
Okay, so how many of us have what adam ondra has? You aren't wrong, but there are not many around with the ability to be ondra. The argument being that muscles will help a physical sport. The usual punter will benefit having some muscle. I really don't see any comparison to someone climbing from a young age with every utility to his advantage to the average joe, or above average john appleby.
Elite climbers very rarely/typically don't do supplemental traditional strength training. They just get lean and climb more to strengthen the muscles climbing uses.
Adam Ondra has put on the muscle since then but arguably his best years were 2010-2011, when he was 17 years old and won gold in almost every lead **and** bouldering ifsc comps all while taking the time to send **five** 9b routes, six V15 and two V16 boulders...
And that what at a time where he looked like [this](https://www.climbing.de/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/adam_ondra_in_puntx.jpg) or [that](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/38/Adam_Ondra_climbing_%282009%29.JPG). So pretty much as scrawny as it gets.
Eh, he has a sleeper build in some of this. That second pic he absolutely isn’t scrawny. He just looks really young.
And he sent Silence when he was pretty jacked.
Schubert, Raboutou, Graham, Seb, none of them are scrawny at all.
I'd say so. He has a lot of footage of him shirtless, and man is jacked in all the right areas. Skinny muscle from low bf % is non-comparable to the raw sinew of a climber's muscles from decades of training. You can be jacked without insane, mostly useless hypertrophy of that akin to a body builder. I think most people are sleeping on strength and resistance conditioning when it will absolutely help you climb.
Strength isn't really the best word for it.
Even after eliminating every technique issue, leaving behind only the so called strength related ones, they are rarely fixed by getting stronger in the broad sense of the word since it will take you further away from the body of a scrony 16yr old.
I've stopped saying I don't have the "strength" for it when I can smoke every climber at my gym in any barbell sport of their choice. I see them climbing well, but I don't see them having any luck moving washing machines or throwing uchimatas either. Makes you think what it is climbers really mean when they use the word "strength" since said scrony 16yr olds aren't particularly strong on any objective output metric.
That being said, OP's problem is 100% technique related.
EDIT: It seems that I wasn't being clear enough that my point is that strength is a broad, relative and context-sensitive term. *I need to constantly remind myself of that* before blaming my poor climbing on a lack of "strength" since I might have plenty of it in the general sense, but not much in the narrow context of climbing. If all it took to be a great climber was to get stronger in the broadest sense among the biggest set of contexts, one would still be elliciting physiological changes that are counterproductive for climbing as a specific context for strength.
Hopefully that clears up some misunderstandings.
If you're really as weightlifting-strong as you claim, you definitely should understand different types of strength. Yes, it is strength. There are infinite possibilities when it comes to strength, muscles, tendons, even skin and bones all adapt to the activity through repeated exercise. Technique also plays a role in strength because you need to have the know how of how to execute movements in any feat of strength, a similar thing applies to flexibility, and you don't always need good form to apply strength, but more so to not get hurt in the long run. All that being said, one video of some Ronnie Coleman-type of guy getting obliterated by a seemingly scrawny dude in an arm-wrestling competition says more than I can with a thousand words.
Tl;Dr: there are different types of strength, for instance, a guy who carries bricks all day might have better grip strength than a weightlifter and in this case they might have better balance, grip endurance and grip to weight ratio, so brick carrying "strength" would transfer better to climbing than weightlifting in this imaginary scenario.
it's weight to power ratio.
most sports just look for power and you can increase power by just increasing weight. powerlifters don't have a great ratio.
climbing is one of the few sports where ratio is more important than pure strength or weight.
another would be gymnastics I think.
in day to day life you mostly ignore ratio since you are grounded.
it's the difference between a monster truck and a race car.
Why are you trying to measure climbing strength with barbell lifting and washing machine pushing lmao
Do a strength test on the muscles you actually climb with, like the 9c test or the lattice training plan assessment and these kids would smoke you
Different types of strength. In climbing people use the term "strength" to mean "strength to weight ratio", which is imo a much more impressive form of strength. Anyone can eat shit loads of protein and get super strong, it's much harder to get that strong while maintaining a low BF%. Plus, grip strength varies wildly person to person. Those scrawny 16 year old crushers might struggle with compound lifts but pull twice the weight you can off a 20mm edge.
there are different types of strength other than the barbell lifting that you might think of. most are probably stronger than you at weighted pullups, rows, and weighted hangs for instance. and you cant equate strength with body size
Then you see that skinny 16 year old repping one armers and you realize that he is stronger than you. (relative to bodyweight, which is the only thing that matters)
Alex megos in a baggy t shirt looks skinny af, hes still stronger than i ever will be even though i look more jacked.
https://preview.redd.it/vw8kzgd84l8d1.png?width=246&format=png&auto=webp&s=ef1fd1096180c1c56aac65e04a566edd0f330ec7
In this particular frame it's definitely not a right hand strength issue. It is close to impossible to keep it in place with that angle. And since you lose your legs there as well, you are basically hanging on nothing.
It is difficult to see exactly how the holds look, or the wall angle. But I'd advise figuring out a way to load your legs more. Maybe try heel hook on the left big red hold. Also + to other advise about overall body and hip position.
Can you get your body more under the hold you have in your right hand? Is the little chip ok to stand on? Try right foot on the little chip and drop your left foot in a flag down to balance, then reach for the crimp.
If you can use the volume, that would help. Another thing is that your flagging (right foot) can be a few inches higher to give you more control. At 0:08 see how low your right foot it. Put it higher at hip level. With left foot, experiment with using the foot chip (slightly above what you are using now) see which one it better.
Looks like you fell off mostly because you can't find a stable position. So I'd say this is more body positioning/technique related than strength.
Also. OP, a way you can tell if it's a strength issue or a different issue:
Look at your video and look at how you fell from the wall. Your hand wasn't what fell first. It was your feet. If your hand fell first you would fall in a different way.
It's a movement issue that could be resolved by increased strength, although there are other options. You're pushing your hips out from the wall, actually jumping more outwards than upwards, when you go for the next hold. Try to instead make sure your hips have some momentum going into the wall before you jump. Alternatively, you can change your trajectory using another method, perhaps moving your feet to a position that will hold your hips so that your force is only/mostly moving you upwards or locking off hard with your right hand to bring yourself into the wall.
You're doing this as a deadpoint, and to do a deadpoint optimally you want the position you're in at the apex of your upwards momentum to be the most optimal position to use the holds available. Try to find that optimal position and aim for it when you do the move. If that still doesn't work because the holds are too bad, you could try to find a way to get onto the next hold statically instead.
Teens climbing coach here. Using that high foot and outside flag would be ideal if you had a lower foothold. What’s happening here is that you’re scrunching into a ball and barndooring out. You have no weight under the sloper in an ideal position for you to maintain leverage, thus you getting spat out. Idk how good that first right hold is, but I’d try either using the right volume as a foot and smearing, or probably better would be to hook the left starting hold with the left heel.
When you press up, you push with your leg outward, which results in your hips going out from the wall instead of up. Try fixing that.
Also, I feel like there are many different ways to get over that structure, so just keep experimenting
Yeah I would’ve got my right foot on top of the right hold and then heel hooked the left hold and just statically reached up with my left hand? This looks more like a beta/technique issue.
I agree with the posters that mentioned hip and leg position. The OP's reach will increase if the left hip and shoulder are rolling toward the hold instead of being in "drop bum" position.
I wonder if you could move your left hand higher on that hold, adjust your right foot position, and heel hook the hold at the bottom of that left hand hold.
I was also thinking that instead of matching your left foot, you could let it hang and then pogo to the destination hold (at least this would open your hips).
Yeah I find the answer most of the time to this question for my own climbing is that yes. It would work if I were stronger. But also my current strength is usually enough when I find beta that works for me. Just figured out a climb on slopers that go sideways to a couple of dead points to more slopers then small crimps to more slopers. At first everything felt IMPOSSIBLE but once I figured out my beta the whole thing felt very doable. Almost almost easy. Not really easy but certainly within my abilities. And I’m sure my strength did not significantly change.
Cant see the angle of the wall from the video, but perhaps you could try to do a left heel hook before reaching out with your left hand for the next hold
That left half moon looks huge and has some rubber marks on the bottom. Could you get a left foot heel hook/foothold before you let go with the left hand?
Left foot on the left bucket, right foot on the chip over the right bucket. Left hand to the crimp on the volume, gaston right to the jug over the volume. Left to the finish jug. It’s a bunch of jugs. All you need is a good beta.
The answer is yes and no. You are probably strong enough to do this as is, if you had the right beta. But if you were stronger you could do it the way you tried
You are pushing yourself away from the wall when generating momentum. If you start with a slight swing out, then use that momentum to stay closer to the wall when pushing off. Gives you a solid second to grab to the hold, instead of the panic inducing 100ms you get right now
Looks like you're not utilizing that hold properly, try to readjust your body so you are confidently pulling in the opposite direction that the hold is oriented. good luck!
Swap your feet.. have your left foot out left.. and try sit on your right foot.. keeping your body as central to the hold above before making the reach up..
I think it is mostly a strength issue because it looks like you can't pull in tight enough and to the right enough to properly engage to the foot on the volume. If you are trying this beta, which I think looks fine, you would probably want a ton of weight on the volume foot to oppose the handhold so you can off-weight your left hand and just move static. It would be a backstep like you are trying, but your right foot would not come off and you would be locked in tighter to the wall.
The left heelhook idea here sounds questionable to me because both it and the right foot are quite high. If both were 1 foot lower I would like the idea more
I agree with your footing assement and would suggest exactly the same thing. That said, I don't think it's a strength issue at all. I think OP just doesn't know how to use his feet.
Sure he probably also doesn't know to get further right and push on the volume harder as a footwork thing, but it looks like he literally can't bend his arm further in this position either way. It looks like his right elbow opens the instant he lets go with his left hand, idk how people can look at that and not think getting stronger is also a good idea lol
Hi there Final_Ad6654. **Because we have a lot of deleted posts on this subreddit, here is a backup of the title and body of this post:** Is it a strength issue? I've been struggling with this one for some time. It feels like whenever I'm trying to reach with my left hand, my right hand seems to weak to keep my body on the wall. Are my arms/hands just to weak or maybe there is something wrong with my feet or body positioning? I've lost count on failed attempts and make me feel pretty powerless :( Pls help" *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/bouldering) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Its 100% technique here, you are half bending your arm, your body is too low, your foot is to high, you aren’t actually driving off your foot, you don’t commit to a grip position on the right hand, you don’t have a full crimp and switch to a drag, your right foot isn’t doing anything because you don’t press your flag against the wall or volume, your left hand isn’t doing anything, you hesitate and double pump before throwing, because of all of this you throw half assed. I don’t even think this is necessarily the right beta, I’d like for you to walk the feet up and heel the other volume, but even if I read it wrong and this is the beta there’s so many micro and not so micro beta opportunities you are losing here no way it’s your strength. I would like you to commit to the right hand, pull in so you are locked off, your body will sit taller put your left foot a bit lower and you’ll be able to push trough with the leg and stand up.
Depending on his years of climbing which I’m assuming isn’t a whole lot, full crimping is absolutely not needed here. Swapped to a drag do to him not being strong enough in crimps and/not feeling comfortable.
To summarise: Skill issue
Yeah, it's definitely the wrong beta.
I think his beta is ok, but as you said he’s half assing it. He needs to turn his whole left hip into the wall and over his foot. Bet he could do it totally static if he did.
Yeah deeper drop knee to bring the hips below the right handhold.... Could be the backstop goes in the scoop but probably good where he has it. Right for maybe out further and lower if possible.
Using the outside edge of the left foot will push his body out of the ideal pipeline position. The only way your suggestion would work is if the foot was lower and if it were an edge. Neither of those are the case here.
That would be true if I was saying he should be driving off his foot or if this were an entirely different situation. He should be OVER his foot, basically sitting on his heel (perched if you want to get technical). It will not push him away.
You cannot passively “perch” on your heel on a slopey feature. Try balling yourself up and smearing with your heel on a volume, you’ll smear right out. There are in general little cases where a route setter will purposefully force something cramped and awkward as the position you suggest. It’s just bad technique!
Oh my god. Sitting on your heels means the balls of your feet are on the ground while the rest of your foot is near vertical and is in contact or close to contact with your butt. Like a catcher in baseball or squatting down to be eye level with a table. In climbing, having your toe or, in cases where you have access to a nice big hold like this one, the balls of your feet on a hold and your heel up against your butt is called perching. It does generally require a decent amount of flexibility. This is especially true when you are square to the wall as your hips must be totally open. The benefit though, is it allows you to transfer a lot of your body weight into your foot without requiring a ton of body tension. In this case, the climber has plenty of room to get his hip right up against the wall while perching on the volume, he has a jug slightly above hip height for a little stabilization, and the upper volume is shallow enough to not really get in the way of his torso. There’s nothing awkward about that position and is in fact a pretty classic rest position in sport climbing. In rare boulders like this one, it’s a great way to make efficient hand movements. I don’t know you or what your background is. Maybe there was just some miscommunication, but it seems like you’ve got a lot of learning to do before you go spraying on the internet.
Big hold meaning smearing the opposite side of a macro? The only reason he is able to stand on that hold is the right hand creating opposition for his left smear. Your suggestion to sit on the heel nevertheless, won’t work without a smear. I am well aware that it’s a common position to sit deep in the hips, what I’m saying here is that your suggestion lacks positional awareness. The foot is underneath his pulling arm, which means he must shove his hips out left in order to create opposition. He does this by using an outside flag, yet the foot is too high, which spits his hips out as soon as he releases his left hand. For him to perch, op would need a left foothold allowing him to open his hips, away from his pulling arm, as you stated. While I’m not the strongest climber, I’ve flashed up to 7a+ and have sent 7b+ out in Bleau (Person IG as proof: @justin.kim93). Don’t take my criticism personal, but I am 100% sure your advice is technically flawed.
I learnt from this sub that double pumping before jumping was good because it activated the muscles? Anyone know what’s correct?
Not needed in most cases, pumping is a psychological preparation more than a physical one.
I think the difference is intent and fluidity, if you double pump in a bouncy way it’s good, the first pump is like a spring for the second, in this case op does a mini pump, freezes at the bottom for a second then pulls, this just wastes energy since it tightens the arms in a half bent position but doesn’t transfer force into the second pull
Every time I climb I think it’s a strength issue then I see some scrony 16yr old complete and I’m forced to realize I’m bad
Tbf, scrawny 16yr old is peak climbing physique. They've got a better strength to weight ratio so I wouldn't beat yourself up too much. But yeah, technique is king ultimately.
When I was like 17 I was a camp counselor and out climbed the climbing instructor 💀 I wish I could still do that
Getting jacked in the right muscle groups will skyrocket your climbing ability though. I mean look at all the IFSC athletes, pretty much zero of them look like a scrawny kid. You need to have pretty strong muscles at a certain point, otherwise putting yourself into "unsafe" double digit positions will just get you injured.
Strong muscle =/= big muscle, plus the lighter you are, the less muscle you need. That's why we see actual scrawny kids send V15 boulder and 9a+ routes. Take Adam Ondra for example. When he was still a scrawny 17 year old kid, he managed to win almost every comp and also sent the hardest boulders he ever had. What ultimately made him put on the muscle years later was the power required by modern bouldering comps, but it hardly made him a better climber overall.
So you're telling me the climber sending v15 at an elite level has done zero supplementary lifting? I still don't see the argument. Get some muscle so you can be safer and pull harder.
Yup, in 2011 Adam Ondra sent five V15 and two V16 boulders, at a time where his training was litterally just climbing (you can find many interview saying so) and he was a scrawny as it gets.
Okay, so how many of us have what adam ondra has? You aren't wrong, but there are not many around with the ability to be ondra. The argument being that muscles will help a physical sport. The usual punter will benefit having some muscle. I really don't see any comparison to someone climbing from a young age with every utility to his advantage to the average joe, or above average john appleby.
Elite climbers very rarely/typically don't do supplemental traditional strength training. They just get lean and climb more to strengthen the muscles climbing uses.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jeSP073AWHM&pp=ygUWbGF0dGljZSB3ZSBhc2tlZCBlbGl0ZQ%3D%3D They lift.
Is Adam Ondra jacked?
Well, [yes](https://gripped.com/profiles/adam-ondra-onsights-5-13-cracks-indian-creek/attachment/adam-ondra-canada-4/)
In a way yes
Adam Ondra has put on the muscle since then but arguably his best years were 2010-2011, when he was 17 years old and won gold in almost every lead **and** bouldering ifsc comps all while taking the time to send **five** 9b routes, six V15 and two V16 boulders... And that what at a time where he looked like [this](https://www.climbing.de/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/adam_ondra_in_puntx.jpg) or [that](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/38/Adam_Ondra_climbing_%282009%29.JPG). So pretty much as scrawny as it gets.
Eh, he has a sleeper build in some of this. That second pic he absolutely isn’t scrawny. He just looks really young. And he sent Silence when he was pretty jacked. Schubert, Raboutou, Graham, Seb, none of them are scrawny at all.
I'd say so. He has a lot of footage of him shirtless, and man is jacked in all the right areas. Skinny muscle from low bf % is non-comparable to the raw sinew of a climber's muscles from decades of training. You can be jacked without insane, mostly useless hypertrophy of that akin to a body builder. I think most people are sleeping on strength and resistance conditioning when it will absolutely help you climb.
Strength isn't really the best word for it. Even after eliminating every technique issue, leaving behind only the so called strength related ones, they are rarely fixed by getting stronger in the broad sense of the word since it will take you further away from the body of a scrony 16yr old. I've stopped saying I don't have the "strength" for it when I can smoke every climber at my gym in any barbell sport of their choice. I see them climbing well, but I don't see them having any luck moving washing machines or throwing uchimatas either. Makes you think what it is climbers really mean when they use the word "strength" since said scrony 16yr olds aren't particularly strong on any objective output metric. That being said, OP's problem is 100% technique related. EDIT: It seems that I wasn't being clear enough that my point is that strength is a broad, relative and context-sensitive term. *I need to constantly remind myself of that* before blaming my poor climbing on a lack of "strength" since I might have plenty of it in the general sense, but not much in the narrow context of climbing. If all it took to be a great climber was to get stronger in the broadest sense among the biggest set of contexts, one would still be elliciting physiological changes that are counterproductive for climbing as a specific context for strength. Hopefully that clears up some misunderstandings.
If you're really as weightlifting-strong as you claim, you definitely should understand different types of strength. Yes, it is strength. There are infinite possibilities when it comes to strength, muscles, tendons, even skin and bones all adapt to the activity through repeated exercise. Technique also plays a role in strength because you need to have the know how of how to execute movements in any feat of strength, a similar thing applies to flexibility, and you don't always need good form to apply strength, but more so to not get hurt in the long run. All that being said, one video of some Ronnie Coleman-type of guy getting obliterated by a seemingly scrawny dude in an arm-wrestling competition says more than I can with a thousand words. Tl;Dr: there are different types of strength, for instance, a guy who carries bricks all day might have better grip strength than a weightlifter and in this case they might have better balance, grip endurance and grip to weight ratio, so brick carrying "strength" would transfer better to climbing than weightlifting in this imaginary scenario.
it's weight to power ratio. most sports just look for power and you can increase power by just increasing weight. powerlifters don't have a great ratio. climbing is one of the few sports where ratio is more important than pure strength or weight. another would be gymnastics I think. in day to day life you mostly ignore ratio since you are grounded. it's the difference between a monster truck and a race car.
Why are you trying to measure climbing strength with barbell lifting and washing machine pushing lmao Do a strength test on the muscles you actually climb with, like the 9c test or the lattice training plan assessment and these kids would smoke you
I mean it’s obviously relative strength, different for a kid that’s 50 kilos soaking wet to lift 50 kilos than a 100 kilo guy to do the same.
Different types of strength. In climbing people use the term "strength" to mean "strength to weight ratio", which is imo a much more impressive form of strength. Anyone can eat shit loads of protein and get super strong, it's much harder to get that strong while maintaining a low BF%. Plus, grip strength varies wildly person to person. Those scrawny 16 year old crushers might struggle with compound lifts but pull twice the weight you can off a 20mm edge.
there are different types of strength other than the barbell lifting that you might think of. most are probably stronger than you at weighted pullups, rows, and weighted hangs for instance. and you cant equate strength with body size
Then you see that skinny 16 year old repping one armers and you realize that he is stronger than you. (relative to bodyweight, which is the only thing that matters) Alex megos in a baggy t shirt looks skinny af, hes still stronger than i ever will be even though i look more jacked.
Have you tried flipping your right foot to a toe and heel hooking the higher volume on the left?
Alternatively you could try to stay in the same position but with a deeper and static left drop knee
https://preview.redd.it/vw8kzgd84l8d1.png?width=246&format=png&auto=webp&s=ef1fd1096180c1c56aac65e04a566edd0f330ec7 In this particular frame it's definitely not a right hand strength issue. It is close to impossible to keep it in place with that angle. And since you lose your legs there as well, you are basically hanging on nothing. It is difficult to see exactly how the holds look, or the wall angle. But I'd advise figuring out a way to load your legs more. Maybe try heel hook on the left big red hold. Also + to other advise about overall body and hip position.
I feel this picture with “is it a strength issue” caption, should be on the other subreddit.
True, but I didn’t want to post myself :D
Can you get your body more under the hold you have in your right hand? Is the little chip ok to stand on? Try right foot on the little chip and drop your left foot in a flag down to balance, then reach for the crimp.
Don't use your arms to brace your fall next time. Keep your arms on front of you as you fall. Your falling form here is asking for injury.
If you can use the volume, that would help. Another thing is that your flagging (right foot) can be a few inches higher to give you more control. At 0:08 see how low your right foot it. Put it higher at hip level. With left foot, experiment with using the foot chip (slightly above what you are using now) see which one it better. Looks like you fell off mostly because you can't find a stable position. So I'd say this is more body positioning/technique related than strength.
Thank you all for the comments, I'll definitely try to make use of it!
Also. OP, a way you can tell if it's a strength issue or a different issue: Look at your video and look at how you fell from the wall. Your hand wasn't what fell first. It was your feet. If your hand fell first you would fall in a different way.
Have you tried not falling off
Yeah the secret is to try harder
Specifically trying harder in an upwards direction
It's a movement issue that could be resolved by increased strength, although there are other options. You're pushing your hips out from the wall, actually jumping more outwards than upwards, when you go for the next hold. Try to instead make sure your hips have some momentum going into the wall before you jump. Alternatively, you can change your trajectory using another method, perhaps moving your feet to a position that will hold your hips so that your force is only/mostly moving you upwards or locking off hard with your right hand to bring yourself into the wall. You're doing this as a deadpoint, and to do a deadpoint optimally you want the position you're in at the apex of your upwards momentum to be the most optimal position to use the holds available. Try to find that optimal position and aim for it when you do the move. If that still doesn't work because the holds are too bad, you could try to find a way to get onto the next hold statically instead.
Good to see a fellow Mood climber from Cracow here :)
Same :D
Teens climbing coach here. Using that high foot and outside flag would be ideal if you had a lower foothold. What’s happening here is that you’re scrunching into a ball and barndooring out. You have no weight under the sloper in an ideal position for you to maintain leverage, thus you getting spat out. Idk how good that first right hold is, but I’d try either using the right volume as a foot and smearing, or probably better would be to hook the left starting hold with the left heel.
When you press up, you push with your leg outward, which results in your hips going out from the wall instead of up. Try fixing that. Also, I feel like there are many different ways to get over that structure, so just keep experimenting
Is the volume you are touching with your feet allowed? Press it hard
There’s probably something you can do with your feet so it’s not as dynamic
Yeah I would’ve got my right foot on top of the right hold and then heel hooked the left hold and just statically reached up with my left hand? This looks more like a beta/technique issue.
I agree with the posters that mentioned hip and leg position. The OP's reach will increase if the left hip and shoulder are rolling toward the hold instead of being in "drop bum" position. I wonder if you could move your left hand higher on that hold, adjust your right foot position, and heel hook the hold at the bottom of that left hand hold. I was also thinking that instead of matching your left foot, you could let it hang and then pogo to the destination hold (at least this would open your hips).
Idk if I where you is full lunge and fall into the top crescent. But I also have not tried this climb maybe I’m being decieved
Skill issue
I'd probably try to stand on the volume and toe hook the left hold and then figure thungs out
It looks like you gave up halfway into the pull. It’s a belief in yourself issue.
Yeah I find the answer most of the time to this question for my own climbing is that yes. It would work if I were stronger. But also my current strength is usually enough when I find beta that works for me. Just figured out a climb on slopers that go sideways to a couple of dead points to more slopers then small crimps to more slopers. At first everything felt IMPOSSIBLE but once I figured out my beta the whole thing felt very doable. Almost almost easy. Not really easy but certainly within my abilities. And I’m sure my strength did not significantly change.
Strength? You don't even straighten your left leg.
Cant see the angle of the wall from the video, but perhaps you could try to do a left heel hook before reaching out with your left hand for the next hold
That left half moon looks huge and has some rubber marks on the bottom. Could you get a left foot heel hook/foothold before you let go with the left hand?
Rarely, if ever a strength issue. Technique. Keep your body close to the wall and progress more with your arms before putting your foot so high.
Left foot on the left bucket, right foot on the chip over the right bucket. Left hand to the crimp on the volume, gaston right to the jug over the volume. Left to the finish jug. It’s a bunch of jugs. All you need is a good beta.
Not strength at all. Your weight is totally in the wrong place and moving the wrong direction.
The answer is yes and no. You are probably strong enough to do this as is, if you had the right beta. But if you were stronger you could do it the way you tried
Commit to the right foot, and use your legs to get up. Try doing it statically first and see how far you can reach then try it with momentum
Just try going slow and controlled rather than dynamic
Would it be hard to hook your left foot into the left handhold? They look pretty comfy, but idk.
You are pushing yourself away from the wall when generating momentum. If you start with a slight swing out, then use that momentum to stay closer to the wall when pushing off. Gives you a solid second to grab to the hold, instead of the panic inducing 100ms you get right now
Try to hook left hold and stand on right hold, maybe thats a way for you to grab the next one.
There is no wrong beta. There is intended beta and unintended beta. Bring that undercling into your chest and you’re fine.
If it doesn't work it's wrong beta
If it works for me but doesn’t work for you. It’s wrong beta?
For me it is, for you it's not
Looks like you're not utilizing that hold properly, try to readjust your body so you are confidently pulling in the opposite direction that the hold is oriented. good luck!
Could you try left hand onto hold and then using your left foot on the small foothold and right foot higher up on the volume?
Left heel seems to be the way.
skill issue
Swapping to a higher left heel hook when you stick the last right hand?
Can you do a pull up?
Mood! Truly getting to the top of structure hold without letting the heel hook out.
Have you tried *[[[INTENSE BURST OF WHITE NOISE]]]*
Just go up
Swap your feet.. have your left foot out left.. and try sit on your right foot.. keeping your body as central to the hold above before making the reach up..
I think it is mostly a strength issue because it looks like you can't pull in tight enough and to the right enough to properly engage to the foot on the volume. If you are trying this beta, which I think looks fine, you would probably want a ton of weight on the volume foot to oppose the handhold so you can off-weight your left hand and just move static. It would be a backstep like you are trying, but your right foot would not come off and you would be locked in tighter to the wall. The left heelhook idea here sounds questionable to me because both it and the right foot are quite high. If both were 1 foot lower I would like the idea more
I agree with your footing assement and would suggest exactly the same thing. That said, I don't think it's a strength issue at all. I think OP just doesn't know how to use his feet.
Sure he probably also doesn't know to get further right and push on the volume harder as a footwork thing, but it looks like he literally can't bend his arm further in this position either way. It looks like his right elbow opens the instant he lets go with his left hand, idk how people can look at that and not think getting stronger is also a good idea lol