My BIL is a senior fire-fighter & station officer with QFES. His view is that people should generally not do this unless the emergency vehicle is basically pushing you through the intersection. They know how important their emergency is and will drive accordingly. Usually if they don't think it is safe or warranted for people to go through a red light to get out of the way, they will turn their siren off and wait.
His words were "we've got the big red truck, we'll do the dangerous stuff. We've already got one emergency to attend to, we don't want to create another one".
Good advice...some motorists panic at the sound of a siren nearby and on the spur of the moment, make a most unwise decision and cause or become involved in another accident..
I’ll just call that for what it is. Bullshit. Things happen when an emergency vehicle is under lights and sirens: A closer unit becomes available. A fresh crew closer could be dispatched. A call gets downgraded as more facts become evident at the call-taking stage. There’s literally 100 different circumstances where a crew enroute to an emergency can be downgraded or called off a job. If their next move after a cancelled dispatch is to try to get a rare feed or coffee before the next job, then so be it. Nobody is going to be stupid enough to put their career or other road users lives on the line for a loud joyride as you’d view it.
I have seen fire trucks put on their lights so they can clear the traffic so they can easily get back into the fire station. They don't have the same level of restrictions Qld has about using lights and sirens.
As ridiculous as that reads, it happens here but not as an education for motorists but because of the individual dim wits in the emergency vehicle and we've witnessed it numerous times in Brisbane including all these emergency services...
to word everything better ---- In Sydney everyone moves into the slow lanes and stops or keeps moving forward to allow other motorist into the slow lane. This allows the fast lane to be clear for emergency vehicles. Both directions of traffic do this so the emergency vehicle can jump across the medium strip if there is a traffic blockage.
I don't believe this for one second.
Ive been on both sides of this coin.
From a laymans perspective, some para drivers can be c***s and so forceful that they are almost ramming you out of the way within a quarter of a second of approaching a peak hour intersection, blowing their horns and waving their hands about. You just know they are swearing at you in there. They put the pressure on, and get shitty when the 10 layman drivers of the cars in front of them cannot co-ordinate their parting to allow the ambulance to pass.
And then theres the view from inside the truck, where we get tailgated, aggressively overtaken, abused, and assaulted by dangerous inconsiderate drivers.
To be allowed to move through an intersection on a red light would save some grey hairs.
Driving lights and sirens gets old pretty quick, it can actually be quite fatiguing also. You're not only processing the information you are receiving via radio and planning your response once on scene you're also trying to plan the route in your head, predict motorists behaviours and keep everyone safe in general.
So if we don't have to go like a bat out of hell, we won't.
They're going to respond according to the criticality of the call and will be constantly doing risk assessments. If they're being called to a fire alarm at a block of units around dinner time (most likely false alarm) they're probably going to be less likely to take risky manoeuvres than if they were on their way to a car getting swept away in flood water.
Predictable Driving. When driving lights and sirens it’s about expediting to someone else emergency.. not getting there as fast as possible. If getting there safely is critical that’s what’s needed
IIRC QLD is the only state that allows this. I've heard stories from other states where people were still fined for going through red light cameras and such to make way for emergency vehicles.
Yeah I've heard that also.
Looks like a fellow r/Brisbane Redditor did get stung though, I wonder how it turned out:
https://www.reddit.com/r/brisbane/s/An0OkeFv6S
Red light cameras will always give you a ticket. I know someone who fought it for almost 2 years, and ended up paying the fine because there was no way he could prove there was an emergency vehicle behind him (The light went green just after he entered the intersection).
Believe it or not, the red light cameras will even issue a ticket to the emergency vehicle, so they absolutely _could_ have proven it. The catch is that the ticket is automatically waived when the adjudicator sees the green LED beside the number plate, which lights up whenever an ambulance or new police car switches on lights and sirens.
I got stung by a red light camera on my P's many years ago doing this in NSW, I went down to the police station, got given an event number, chucked that in the appeal and it was all sweet, got a letter saying the fine was dismissed and no mark would be on my record
Under Road Rule 78 (1), drivers must move out of the path of an approaching police or emergency services vehicle (including an ambulance) that is displaying a flashing blue or red light or sounding an alarm.
If a driver is already in the path of an approaching police or emergency services vehicle, including when stopped at a red light, a driver is required to move out of the path of that vehicle under Road Rule 78 (2).
If I go through a red light to make run to emergency vehicle and cause a traffic accident, I am at fault. Different scenario if I can move left.
I'm not going through a red light for an emergency vehicle.
If you go through a green light and cause a traffic accident, you are still at fault. You causing the accident is the reason you would be at fault. The colour of the light and the presence of an emergency vehicle are irrelevant to that.
The emergency vehicle with lights and sirens just means you can cross the stop line with a red light if it is safe to do so. It doesn't give you a free pass to drive into the intersection without checking.
The thing with insurance is: if you get into an accident in this scenario - it wasn’t safe to do so. That is a critical part that I feel like people reading this will gloss over. They only see their “get out of a ticket free” card.
So in summary - if I just fuckin sit in the middle of the road like a bell-end - I might get some cunt killed in the delay, but at least there's no chance of something being my fault?
Like, I get it. You don't want dumb cunts doing dumb cunt shit in an emergency - but maybe a little encouragement to gtfo would be nice.
I mean you can then get booked for failing to give way or for obstructing an emergency vehicle.
For what it’s worth I try to avoid forcing people through an intersection - and where I do, I’m watching to make certain it’s safe for you to do so. With Brisbane roads and in peak traffic, *you have to move so I can get through.*
I agree, but that's like saying you can get booked for going too slow. You're more likely to get a ticket running a red light or speeding than not giving way to an emergency vehicle.
I'd rather take the risk on not giving way to an emergency vehicle (which needs to be seen in person) rather than a red light ticket which is issued automatically by a computer.
I've been driving for decades and have never heard of a single person getting a fine for moving out of the way of an emergency vehicle. Also if one ticket is going to cause loss of your license maybe there are other things you need to consider. As a parent who has held their turning blue and unbreathing child in their arms waiting for an ambulance. Go Fuck yourself! I could not think of anything more selfish than deliberately slowing down an emergency team on their way to try to save another person's life.
Oh and to all the emergency crews out there, Thank you for what you do!
The fine would be for running a red light. See below as an example.
https://www.reddit.com/r/brisbane/s/RAizENvl11
>As a parent who has held their turning blue and unbreathing child in their arms waiting for an ambulance. Go Fuck yourself!
I don't give a shit. I'm not risking my licence.
If you got into an accident after a car with sirens pushed you through the intersection, you should claim you were following emergency services instructions.
But also, like, don't get into an accident. Just don't think "I must stay here cause insurance will certainly fuck me over" cause they probably wouldn't, to be honest.
Only person in the right lane once at a red and moved in front of the left (slightly in intersection) to get out of ambo way and had multiple people in the left lane honk me and get mad. People are crazy
I am the occasional driver of an emergency service vehicle travelling under lights and sirens. Generally I would prefer people didn't do this, I will usually aim to drive around the line of traffic or split the line of traffic, if you start proceeding into the live intersection then you might even get in my way even more.
I'm assuming you're QFRES or something who get coded to pretty much anything. Even QAS get codes easily.
Police will generally only get a coded job where someone is facing a real risk of injury and/or death.
It's true that QAS get codes pretty easily, and I think QFES get codes more often than not, but police don't need a risk of injury or death for a L&S code. Just the possibility that the alleged offenders are still on scene is often enough.
You can get a fine for not moving out of the way too. Damned if you do, damned if you don't. Only difference is that giving way, you can dispute it. Only argument that you might have for not giving way is that you didn't feel safe to do so.
Exactly, plus how do you prove you entered the red light to allow passage of the emergency vehicle apart from costly legal representation in court at your expense.
They would have a photo of the emergency vehicle also passing through. Noting the emergency vehicle wouldn't have gotten a ticket providing lights are activated so that the greenlight on the front and back is illuminated. There would still be a photo of it.
You're very trusting, if you moved through the intersection to allow the emergency vehicle passage and that vehicle was 100 metres behind you, there would be no evidence of same, do you really think the pubic servants in the red light camera office would link the two together and how do you get evidence this happened, you'd be lumped with the infringement.
> do you really think the pubic servants in the red light camera office would link the two together
Well, yes. Since you would tell them you were vacating the path of an emergency services vehicle, and they could easily cross-check with their record of waived TINs. That said, if it’s 100 metres away, you made the call to move into the intersection way too quickly, and clearly didn’t assess if it was safe - which means you actually _did_ break the law.
That’s why ambos,BRT and some police cars are starting to get GATSO lights on them.
They are the green light near number plates that goes on with the disco lights.
The disco lights DO NOT always show up in the photo when responding,but solid green does.
And in case anyone gets ideas, the ticket is still raised when the green light is on, it’s just that RSCO adjudicators will waive it once they confirm the vehicle is in fact registered to the commissioner of police/ambulance (firies do not currently have this feature).
Surely the camera would also detect the emergency services vehicle entering the intersection after the initial detection. They used to take 2 photos for every activation, now I believe they are just constantly capturing video and save the snippets relevant to the activation
[https://www.couriermail.com.au/news/emergency-services/brisbane-woman-fights-575-fine-after-running-red-light-to-get-out-of-way-of-ambulance/news-story/2cf0116d0e27c8515540794dcdc0a102](https://www.couriermail.com.au/news/emergency-services/brisbane-woman-fights-575-fine-after-running-red-light-to-get-out-of-way-of-ambulance/news-story/2cf0116d0e27c8515540794dcdc0a102)
> Under Queensland law, motorists are permitted to drive through a red light to clear the way for emergency services, so Carla appealed the fine expecting it to be overturned.
>
>However, her appeal has been denied because her claim an ambulance was present was “not substantiated by photographic evidence”.
>
>Carla has not opted to take her fight to court in what is shaping as an expensive and lengthy process.
>
>...
>
>Whenever a person disputes an infringement notice, QRO reviews other images taken around the time of the offence and in other lanes to identify if an emergency vehicle can be seen just before or after the offence.
>
>If the images indicate the offence was committed when making way for the emergency vehicle, the infringement notice will be withdrawn.
So yeah, some risk involved sadly.
Going to traffic court to prove this costs nothing. All you have to do is attend with the details and tell the Magistrate the circumstances of the emergency vehicles that you moved out of the way for, “ Your Honor, I was moving out of my lane to allow the passage of an ambulance with lights and sirens active!”, and the response will be something to the effect of “Thank you for doing the right thing driver, case dismissed!”. You can also help your case by going to the relevant Emergency Service facility and get the relevant crew to back your story up.
And what, the police prosecutor idly sits by and doesn't object, like .. produce evidence of your claim, your honour there is no evidence of any emergency vehicle in the vicinity at the time the offence was committed, no proof = guilty and with additional costs now included ..
This is it. Disputing my red light fine that is literally a photo of me driving through a green light has been costly and mentally taxing beyond reason.
Qld is the only state. Other states specify not to cross a red light. In fact, people have gone through red light cameras due to emergency vehicles, copped fines and have been told it didnt matter.
I actually had a client that’s a cop and he said. “If you stop completely at a red light, then drive through it. You won’t get flashed for going through a red light” this is in qld
Saw the red light camera flash nice and bright the other night at Kedron park on that big sweeper bend going back into the city. Driver had just taken off from a red light through a green light, accelerating so couldn’t have been doing more than 20-25kph.
Totally not a clue why he got a photo done, but one of the reasons I’m not a huge fan of them seeing as of a pics in the system, it’s now technically on him to prove why they shouldn’t be paying some massive fines. Or a as m I missing something there??
Yeah you’re not missing anything there. I’m currently fighting a red light fine that has a clear image of me driving through a green light. TRS and QPS don’t have to argue why they should fine me, I have to argue why they shouldn’t, and the fees and bureaucracy is designed to make you want to give up and give in.
Love how we have gone from a country where everyone was innocent until proven guilty to now being policed by remote control with the constant attitude of “prove your innocent” from the police which shits me when I hear the idiots who give the old cheer of “well if you don’t have anything to hide you shouldn’t care about total full government surveillance”.
Oh yes we should be; we should very much be worried about it.
Absolutely.
Look I don’t like dealing with the cops, but in 2017 I had to after a bit of a scrap in the city where my car keys got stolen, leaving me unable to get my car out from a paid carpark. I had to make a police report to get my car out without paying by the hour for the next 3 days and so I did. There was cctv of the incident, and one of the guys was caught by the piggies, but when I went in they told me I had to do a brief witness statement, I got a few sentences in when the detective told me I had to say the kid assaulted a police officer. He never assaulted a cop lol, the cop in question was built like Toad from wind in the willows and slipped over on the pavement outside of the Queen street public toilet as he APPROACHED the already lined up lot of us.
I said I wasn’t gonna lie, then the cop I was talking to told me that if I’m not gonna help them out they’re not gonna help me out. “Maybe we have your car keys and maybe we’ve got your purse, maybe your memory is just blurry”. Nope. Not going to lie and not going to incriminate some poor kid for assault of a police officer over a bloody theft. Completely different game right there.
Anyway, it ended with the cop saying “well we have no cctv and I guess we don’t have your belongings either. No need for a qps number, good luck getting your car out”.
Fuck them. “Cctv makes things safer” no it doesn’t. Not when it’s in the hands of governments or corporations.
For real. I’ve had more corrupt run ins with them but what I typed out here was the most blatant experience I’ve had. Just straight up for some sort of work comp or extra charges etc too & putting the onus on myself who was classed as a witness to lie was fucked.
Yeah, that is not true.
That said, I’ve worked directly with police who’ve admitted that at _dangerously excessive_ speeds, you’re outside the manufacturer’s certified margin of error. That said, we’re talking don’t ever do this because your car probably can’t anyway, and you _will_ kill someone speeds.
Hell, if any civvie planted the foot through a red for an emergency vehicle they deserve the ticket. I think we can both agree that crawling into the intersection at about 10km/ph is the safer option (for the civvie, not the responding unit)
That… does not sound entirely right. As soon as your vehicle triggers the induction loop, it should trigger the camera to take a picture (with flash). That said, I can see scenarios where it might play out the way you’re saying - the first picture would have been of you _with brake lights lit_ and I can’t say for sure how it links the pre-stop-line picture with the in-the-intersection picture.
I failed my first learner's test because of a question like this. The answer was something around the lines of "YOU MAY NEVER BREAK THE SACRED ROAD RULES! YOU WANKER! HOW COULD YOU THINK OF SEVERING THIS SACRED OATH YOU MADE".
I hope the QDOT put that extra learner's fee I paid to good use, I guess.
Yeah I often ride in ambulances to transport sick patients and was blown away to learn that sirens are like a final resort for when your patient is truly crashing. It turns out that when sirens come on, everyone on the road decides its time to act like a complete idiot and relearn how to drive from the very beginning. Its truly mad to see.
The other night we were on the M1 after midnight, sirens on and getting cut off by the only idiot on the motorway who decided he should be on the right lane, when no other cars are around except for one ambulance bombing down the highway.
Literally, are driver's licences being given away in cereal boxes?
Trying to explain any road rules to Brisbane drivers is like trying to explain quantum physics to a penguin. Maybe we should say NOT to use indicators and to NEVER look when merging so that Brisbane drivers will do the opposite out of nature
The government actually doesn’t get to use the money from red light and speed cameras, it’s legally required to be spent on road safety and medical care for people who get into an accident with people that don’t have CTP. It’s even really clearly spelled out in the law to prevent it being used to pay for more cameras.
I was the first car at red light single-lane intersection when I heard the ambo siren with lights flashing. I only moved to the left to make room for the ambulance to drive through.
I gave up a long time ago on expecting motorists to react as per the road rules, now I just duck and dive my way around them.
I regularly respond through Sunnybank....that's a test of the reflexes.
I have a simple policy, move your car, or I’ll do it for you. Now you don’t have to go through the intersection, just cut across the other lane, they only need 2m of room. But we have moved cars forcibly out of the way, someone who has minutes to live is more of a priority then you questioning your insurance.
The green lights above the numberplates on emergency vehicles (excluding RFS appliances) indicate that the response lights (red & blues) are active should a red light camera be triggered while responding to a callout. In addition the driver informs their comms centre of the activation, and what intersection.
My BIL is a senior fire-fighter & station officer with QFES. His view is that people should generally not do this unless the emergency vehicle is basically pushing you through the intersection. They know how important their emergency is and will drive accordingly. Usually if they don't think it is safe or warranted for people to go through a red light to get out of the way, they will turn their siren off and wait. His words were "we've got the big red truck, we'll do the dangerous stuff. We've already got one emergency to attend to, we don't want to create another one".
Good advice...some motorists panic at the sound of a siren nearby and on the spur of the moment, make a most unwise decision and cause or become involved in another accident..
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I’ll just call that for what it is. Bullshit. Things happen when an emergency vehicle is under lights and sirens: A closer unit becomes available. A fresh crew closer could be dispatched. A call gets downgraded as more facts become evident at the call-taking stage. There’s literally 100 different circumstances where a crew enroute to an emergency can be downgraded or called off a job. If their next move after a cancelled dispatch is to try to get a rare feed or coffee before the next job, then so be it. Nobody is going to be stupid enough to put their career or other road users lives on the line for a loud joyride as you’d view it.
I have seen fire trucks put on their lights so they can clear the traffic so they can easily get back into the fire station. They don't have the same level of restrictions Qld has about using lights and sirens.
As ridiculous as that reads, it happens here but not as an education for motorists but because of the individual dim wits in the emergency vehicle and we've witnessed it numerous times in Brisbane including all these emergency services...
to word everything better ---- In Sydney everyone moves into the slow lanes and stops or keeps moving forward to allow other motorist into the slow lane. This allows the fast lane to be clear for emergency vehicles. Both directions of traffic do this so the emergency vehicle can jump across the medium strip if there is a traffic blockage.
I don't believe this for one second. Ive been on both sides of this coin. From a laymans perspective, some para drivers can be c***s and so forceful that they are almost ramming you out of the way within a quarter of a second of approaching a peak hour intersection, blowing their horns and waving their hands about. You just know they are swearing at you in there. They put the pressure on, and get shitty when the 10 layman drivers of the cars in front of them cannot co-ordinate their parting to allow the ambulance to pass. And then theres the view from inside the truck, where we get tailgated, aggressively overtaken, abused, and assaulted by dangerous inconsiderate drivers. To be allowed to move through an intersection on a red light would save some grey hairs.
I've done this on Ipswich Rd for both ambos and fire trucks before, headed into the Gabba.
Wouldn't they want to get to each call out as fast as possible? Coz they can?
Driving lights and sirens gets old pretty quick, it can actually be quite fatiguing also. You're not only processing the information you are receiving via radio and planning your response once on scene you're also trying to plan the route in your head, predict motorists behaviours and keep everyone safe in general. So if we don't have to go like a bat out of hell, we won't.
They're going to respond according to the criticality of the call and will be constantly doing risk assessments. If they're being called to a fire alarm at a block of units around dinner time (most likely false alarm) they're probably going to be less likely to take risky manoeuvres than if they were on their way to a car getting swept away in flood water.
Predictable Driving. When driving lights and sirens it’s about expediting to someone else emergency.. not getting there as fast as possible. If getting there safely is critical that’s what’s needed
Very good advice.
IIRC QLD is the only state that allows this. I've heard stories from other states where people were still fined for going through red light cameras and such to make way for emergency vehicles.
Yeah I've heard that also. Looks like a fellow r/Brisbane Redditor did get stung though, I wonder how it turned out: https://www.reddit.com/r/brisbane/s/An0OkeFv6S
They went to court and lost.
Red light cameras will always give you a ticket. I know someone who fought it for almost 2 years, and ended up paying the fine because there was no way he could prove there was an emergency vehicle behind him (The light went green just after he entered the intersection).
Believe it or not, the red light cameras will even issue a ticket to the emergency vehicle, so they absolutely _could_ have proven it. The catch is that the ticket is automatically waived when the adjudicator sees the green LED beside the number plate, which lights up whenever an ambulance or new police car switches on lights and sirens.
I got stung by a red light camera on my P's many years ago doing this in NSW, I went down to the police station, got given an event number, chucked that in the appeal and it was all sweet, got a letter saying the fine was dismissed and no mark would be on my record
NSW you can too.
Not true. You absolutely can not do this in NSW.
Under Road Rule 78 (1), drivers must move out of the path of an approaching police or emergency services vehicle (including an ambulance) that is displaying a flashing blue or red light or sounding an alarm. If a driver is already in the path of an approaching police or emergency services vehicle, including when stopped at a red light, a driver is required to move out of the path of that vehicle under Road Rule 78 (2).
If I go through a red light to make run to emergency vehicle and cause a traffic accident, I am at fault. Different scenario if I can move left. I'm not going through a red light for an emergency vehicle.
If you go through a green light and cause a traffic accident, you are still at fault. You causing the accident is the reason you would be at fault. The colour of the light and the presence of an emergency vehicle are irrelevant to that. The emergency vehicle with lights and sirens just means you can cross the stop line with a red light if it is safe to do so. It doesn't give you a free pass to drive into the intersection without checking.
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The thing with insurance is: if you get into an accident in this scenario - it wasn’t safe to do so. That is a critical part that I feel like people reading this will gloss over. They only see their “get out of a ticket free” card.
So in summary - if I just fuckin sit in the middle of the road like a bell-end - I might get some cunt killed in the delay, but at least there's no chance of something being my fault? Like, I get it. You don't want dumb cunts doing dumb cunt shit in an emergency - but maybe a little encouragement to gtfo would be nice.
For example, I wouldn't ride faster than 10km on the Kurilpa bridge to get out of the way for the cops...
This is me. I won't take the chance. The emergency services can do that themselves.
Wtf, it’s the law to move for emergency vehicles when safe to do so
The law has failed when people have to think twice out of fear of other laws.
Exactly.
Don't care. I'm not rising the demerit points.
I mean you can then get booked for failing to give way or for obstructing an emergency vehicle. For what it’s worth I try to avoid forcing people through an intersection - and where I do, I’m watching to make certain it’s safe for you to do so. With Brisbane roads and in peak traffic, *you have to move so I can get through.*
I agree, but that's like saying you can get booked for going too slow. You're more likely to get a ticket running a red light or speeding than not giving way to an emergency vehicle. I'd rather take the risk on not giving way to an emergency vehicle (which needs to be seen in person) rather than a red light ticket which is issued automatically by a computer.
Because: Fuck the person who needs help: could be your mother or child for all you know!
The emergency service workers can find their own way around. My child needs me at work, and to work I need a licence.
I've been driving for decades and have never heard of a single person getting a fine for moving out of the way of an emergency vehicle. Also if one ticket is going to cause loss of your license maybe there are other things you need to consider. As a parent who has held their turning blue and unbreathing child in their arms waiting for an ambulance. Go Fuck yourself! I could not think of anything more selfish than deliberately slowing down an emergency team on their way to try to save another person's life. Oh and to all the emergency crews out there, Thank you for what you do!
The fine would be for running a red light. See below as an example. https://www.reddit.com/r/brisbane/s/RAizENvl11 >As a parent who has held their turning blue and unbreathing child in their arms waiting for an ambulance. Go Fuck yourself! I don't give a shit. I'm not risking my licence.
I know you don't give a shit. Kind of my point.
Blame the road rules which punish people who do the right thing.
yeah, lets never blame fuckwit car drivers for not doing the obvious thing.
Found the cyclist
If you got into an accident after a car with sirens pushed you through the intersection, you should claim you were following emergency services instructions. But also, like, don't get into an accident. Just don't think "I must stay here cause insurance will certainly fuck me over" cause they probably wouldn't, to be honest.
Only person in the right lane once at a red and moved in front of the left (slightly in intersection) to get out of ambo way and had multiple people in the left lane honk me and get mad. People are crazy
Also experienced this the other night... no situational awareness to lights/sirens at all from the Ambulance behind
There are a lot of times I don’t know we’re the sirens are coming from especially in the city. Brisbane
Only had this conversation today. You’ll still lose in an insurance case if you have an accident while doing so.
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Why? It’s fact. You’ll be at fault.
It literally says "only if it is safe to do so." If you hit a car it obviously wasn't safe and you're at fault.
I am the occasional driver of an emergency service vehicle travelling under lights and sirens. Generally I would prefer people didn't do this, I will usually aim to drive around the line of traffic or split the line of traffic, if you start proceeding into the live intersection then you might even get in my way even more.
I'm assuming you're QFRES or something who get coded to pretty much anything. Even QAS get codes easily. Police will generally only get a coded job where someone is facing a real risk of injury and/or death.
It's true that QAS get codes pretty easily, and I think QFES get codes more often than not, but police don't need a risk of injury or death for a L&S code. Just the possibility that the alleged offenders are still on scene is often enough.
I got a ticket from a red light camera doing this... I'm not doing it again.
You are able to dispute it if you did in fact cross the intersection whilst moving for emergency vehicles.
> dispute it yeah sounds like the easiest option is to just sit in park and let whoever the fuck die
you can dispute it, but there’s no guarantee you’ll be successful
You can get a fine for not moving out of the way too. Damned if you do, damned if you don't. Only difference is that giving way, you can dispute it. Only argument that you might have for not giving way is that you didn't feel safe to do so.
Exactly, plus how do you prove you entered the red light to allow passage of the emergency vehicle apart from costly legal representation in court at your expense.
They would have a photo of the emergency vehicle also passing through. Noting the emergency vehicle wouldn't have gotten a ticket providing lights are activated so that the greenlight on the front and back is illuminated. There would still be a photo of it.
You're very trusting, if you moved through the intersection to allow the emergency vehicle passage and that vehicle was 100 metres behind you, there would be no evidence of same, do you really think the pubic servants in the red light camera office would link the two together and how do you get evidence this happened, you'd be lumped with the infringement.
> do you really think the pubic servants in the red light camera office would link the two together Well, yes. Since you would tell them you were vacating the path of an emergency services vehicle, and they could easily cross-check with their record of waived TINs. That said, if it’s 100 metres away, you made the call to move into the intersection way too quickly, and clearly didn’t assess if it was safe - which means you actually _did_ break the law.
That’s why ambos,BRT and some police cars are starting to get GATSO lights on them. They are the green light near number plates that goes on with the disco lights. The disco lights DO NOT always show up in the photo when responding,but solid green does.
And in case anyone gets ideas, the ticket is still raised when the green light is on, it’s just that RSCO adjudicators will waive it once they confirm the vehicle is in fact registered to the commissioner of police/ambulance (firies do not currently have this feature).
Surely the camera would also detect the emergency services vehicle entering the intersection after the initial detection. They used to take 2 photos for every activation, now I believe they are just constantly capturing video and save the snippets relevant to the activation
[https://www.couriermail.com.au/news/emergency-services/brisbane-woman-fights-575-fine-after-running-red-light-to-get-out-of-way-of-ambulance/news-story/2cf0116d0e27c8515540794dcdc0a102](https://www.couriermail.com.au/news/emergency-services/brisbane-woman-fights-575-fine-after-running-red-light-to-get-out-of-way-of-ambulance/news-story/2cf0116d0e27c8515540794dcdc0a102) > Under Queensland law, motorists are permitted to drive through a red light to clear the way for emergency services, so Carla appealed the fine expecting it to be overturned. > >However, her appeal has been denied because her claim an ambulance was present was “not substantiated by photographic evidence”. > >Carla has not opted to take her fight to court in what is shaping as an expensive and lengthy process. > >... > >Whenever a person disputes an infringement notice, QRO reviews other images taken around the time of the offence and in other lanes to identify if an emergency vehicle can be seen just before or after the offence. > >If the images indicate the offence was committed when making way for the emergency vehicle, the infringement notice will be withdrawn. So yeah, some risk involved sadly.
Dash cam...
Going to traffic court to prove this costs nothing. All you have to do is attend with the details and tell the Magistrate the circumstances of the emergency vehicles that you moved out of the way for, “ Your Honor, I was moving out of my lane to allow the passage of an ambulance with lights and sirens active!”, and the response will be something to the effect of “Thank you for doing the right thing driver, case dismissed!”. You can also help your case by going to the relevant Emergency Service facility and get the relevant crew to back your story up.
And what, the police prosecutor idly sits by and doesn't object, like .. produce evidence of your claim, your honour there is no evidence of any emergency vehicle in the vicinity at the time the offence was committed, no proof = guilty and with additional costs now included ..
This is it. Disputing my red light fine that is literally a photo of me driving through a green light has been costly and mentally taxing beyond reason.
Bullshit.
Qld is the only state. Other states specify not to cross a red light. In fact, people have gone through red light cameras due to emergency vehicles, copped fines and have been told it didnt matter.
I actually had a client that’s a cop and he said. “If you stop completely at a red light, then drive through it. You won’t get flashed for going through a red light” this is in qld
Saw the red light camera flash nice and bright the other night at Kedron park on that big sweeper bend going back into the city. Driver had just taken off from a red light through a green light, accelerating so couldn’t have been doing more than 20-25kph. Totally not a clue why he got a photo done, but one of the reasons I’m not a huge fan of them seeing as of a pics in the system, it’s now technically on him to prove why they shouldn’t be paying some massive fines. Or a as m I missing something there??
Yeah you’re not missing anything there. I’m currently fighting a red light fine that has a clear image of me driving through a green light. TRS and QPS don’t have to argue why they should fine me, I have to argue why they shouldn’t, and the fees and bureaucracy is designed to make you want to give up and give in.
Love how we have gone from a country where everyone was innocent until proven guilty to now being policed by remote control with the constant attitude of “prove your innocent” from the police which shits me when I hear the idiots who give the old cheer of “well if you don’t have anything to hide you shouldn’t care about total full government surveillance”. Oh yes we should be; we should very much be worried about it.
Absolutely. Look I don’t like dealing with the cops, but in 2017 I had to after a bit of a scrap in the city where my car keys got stolen, leaving me unable to get my car out from a paid carpark. I had to make a police report to get my car out without paying by the hour for the next 3 days and so I did. There was cctv of the incident, and one of the guys was caught by the piggies, but when I went in they told me I had to do a brief witness statement, I got a few sentences in when the detective told me I had to say the kid assaulted a police officer. He never assaulted a cop lol, the cop in question was built like Toad from wind in the willows and slipped over on the pavement outside of the Queen street public toilet as he APPROACHED the already lined up lot of us. I said I wasn’t gonna lie, then the cop I was talking to told me that if I’m not gonna help them out they’re not gonna help me out. “Maybe we have your car keys and maybe we’ve got your purse, maybe your memory is just blurry”. Nope. Not going to lie and not going to incriminate some poor kid for assault of a police officer over a bloody theft. Completely different game right there. Anyway, it ended with the cop saying “well we have no cctv and I guess we don’t have your belongings either. No need for a qps number, good luck getting your car out”. Fuck them. “Cctv makes things safer” no it doesn’t. Not when it’s in the hands of governments or corporations.
Another story that never happened.
No matter how much you don’t believe it happened it doesn’t change the fact it did lol.
I believe you, QPS is corrupt AF
For real. I’ve had more corrupt run ins with them but what I typed out here was the most blatant experience I’ve had. Just straight up for some sort of work comp or extra charges etc too & putting the onus on myself who was classed as a witness to lie was fucked.
Sounds about right, shit system. The only thing you're missing is the typo at the end 
Government bureaucracy just slowly breaking me brain 🥴
Nah, it's the world. There is no immunity.
If you crawl over the line, generally they don't trigger.
Yeah, that is not true. That said, I’ve worked directly with police who’ve admitted that at _dangerously excessive_ speeds, you’re outside the manufacturer’s certified margin of error. That said, we’re talking don’t ever do this because your car probably can’t anyway, and you _will_ kill someone speeds.
I am the police and go through red lights regularly, in my experience crawling over the line after stopping is much less likely to trigger the camera.
Hell, if any civvie planted the foot through a red for an emergency vehicle they deserve the ticket. I think we can both agree that crawling into the intersection at about 10km/ph is the safer option (for the civvie, not the responding unit)
That… does not sound entirely right. As soon as your vehicle triggers the induction loop, it should trigger the camera to take a picture (with flash). That said, I can see scenarios where it might play out the way you’re saying - the first picture would have been of you _with brake lights lit_ and I can’t say for sure how it links the pre-stop-line picture with the in-the-intersection picture.
If you don't know this get the fuck off the road and catch the bus.
I failed my first learner's test because of a question like this. The answer was something around the lines of "YOU MAY NEVER BREAK THE SACRED ROAD RULES! YOU WANKER! HOW COULD YOU THINK OF SEVERING THIS SACRED OATH YOU MADE". I hope the QDOT put that extra learner's fee I paid to good use, I guess.
Yeah I often ride in ambulances to transport sick patients and was blown away to learn that sirens are like a final resort for when your patient is truly crashing. It turns out that when sirens come on, everyone on the road decides its time to act like a complete idiot and relearn how to drive from the very beginning. Its truly mad to see. The other night we were on the M1 after midnight, sirens on and getting cut off by the only idiot on the motorway who decided he should be on the right lane, when no other cars are around except for one ambulance bombing down the highway. Literally, are driver's licences being given away in cereal boxes?
I often say that TMR needs to cancel their agreement with Sanitarium to include driver’s licenses in every Weet-Bix box.
Just once I'd love to see an ambulance PIT someone
Hah nice try - I aren't getting no ticket that easy Mr Policeman.
it's in the road rules set by the government
Just watch BRT and ambos coming EB down the WB lane in Hamo or Rode Rd towards Gympie Rd. Never seen cars scatter so fast.
It’s bad around the royal aswell, and the corner of Newmarket and Bowen bridge road
Trying to explain any road rules to Brisbane drivers is like trying to explain quantum physics to a penguin. Maybe we should say NOT to use indicators and to NEVER look when merging so that Brisbane drivers will do the opposite out of nature
This is an indictment on law enforcement, so hungry for fines that people would even think twice.
>..when they slow down at *interesectoins*. Someone might need to proofread that again
Must be low on funds for the xmas party for this to be going around this time of year, nice try ya scallywags
The government actually doesn’t get to use the money from red light and speed cameras, it’s legally required to be spent on road safety and medical care for people who get into an accident with people that don’t have CTP. It’s even really clearly spelled out in the law to prevent it being used to pay for more cameras.
You must be fun at parties https://i.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/original/000/021/665/DpQ9YJl.png
I was the first car at red light single-lane intersection when I heard the ambo siren with lights flashing. I only moved to the left to make room for the ambulance to drive through.
YES.
[удалено]
Clearly it isn’t by the way people react when I’m running code 1 behind them.
I gave up a long time ago on expecting motorists to react as per the road rules, now I just duck and dive my way around them. I regularly respond through Sunnybank....that's a test of the reflexes.
I can't even remember the last time I saw everyone move to the left as opposed to splitting left and right or just sitting there
Its really not. Not for the first time, i just watched a driver completely panic in this situation, waiting for the light to change.
I have a simple policy, move your car, or I’ll do it for you. Now you don’t have to go through the intersection, just cut across the other lane, they only need 2m of room. But we have moved cars forcibly out of the way, someone who has minutes to live is more of a priority then you questioning your insurance.
do emergency vehicles drivers still need to submit stac decs on why they ran red lights in QLD?
The green lights above the numberplates on emergency vehicles (excluding RFS appliances) indicate that the response lights (red & blues) are active should a red light camera be triggered while responding to a callout. In addition the driver informs their comms centre of the activation, and what intersection.
nice thanks for the information.
Gatso light.
True!