Highlights:
* **University of Waterloo economics professor Mikal Skuterud, a specialist in labour, says the Liberal government created a predicament a few years ago when it signalled to the world, particularly those with low skills, that the easiest way to become a citizen of Canada is to show up as a temporary resident.**
* “For migrants, Canada’s immigrant selection system now looks like a lottery, in which a work or study permit is the ticket. That’s a big problem. And it wasn’t like this before 2021.”
* The government made the mistake of dismantling the country’s skills-based immigration system because of a “post-pandemic obsession with labour shortages, which is economic nonsense fuelled by corporate Canada,” Skuterud said.
* Last week, StatCan reported 2.8 million temporary residents in Canada, comprising a record 6.8 % of the population. That’s up from 3.5% two years ago.
* More than one million are foreign students, most with work permits. Others are classified as “temporary foreign workers” or “international mobility” workers. Another 360,000 are asylum claimants.
* In light of Immigration Minister Marc Miller promising this spring to reduce the number of study visas, partly in response to the pressure on housing prices and social services.
* The surge of temporary residents has exacerbated Canada’s housing crisis, says Skuterud. He adds that rapid population growth, almost entirely from international migration, correlates with Canadian wages staying stagnant.
* **Skuterud would like the government to return to emphasizing the more traditional economic-class pathway to permanent resident status, which relied on a transparent, above-board ranking system to select candidates.**
It was definitely mentioned before 2020 how only about 1 in 5 temporary workers/students actually get PR and most were spouses. Then this scammy stuff went into overdrive. It's been insane to witness.
Immigration consultants and educational institutions play a significant role. Many educational institutions conduct sessions overseas, where they paint an overly optimistic picture of the future. They hire student counselors abroad to work with target countries, further promoting this image.
Immigration consultants, both inside and outside Canada do just the same, because it’s also their income.
Not just that, they arrange false paperwork and legit people suffer. The worst is applying for refugee status if your family sat in India's farmer protest.
I know a guy who came from the Congo about a decade ago. He said having a new iPhone and owning a car felt like having made it the first few years he was here.
Although he had the advantage of being fluent in French in terms of a government job almost right off the bat.
Almost everyone I meet in Vancouver is an immigrant and I always ask why they chose here. Usually they say it was between USA, UK, Australia, and Canada, but Canada is the easiest to get in by far so they chose here
They do but they also have less economic and career opportunities.
I am speaking from experience as I saw more professional growth of being 5 years in this country than me living 10 years in Aus/NZ
Dude I thougnthe same when I moved here as a PR for the most part it is if these motherfuckers could have managed their immigration carefully.
Canada could be prosperous with little population but that won't work for the wealthy
Who are we to deny these people their right to be exploited by Canadian elite? They already live in terrible conditions and are used to being exploited, so we really shouldn't feel bad about them having to live packed together like rats. Canadian employers need the stimulus.
Have you even considered the negative effect things like raises and fair working conditions do to wealthy Canadians stock portfolio?
The boomer who bought his 10th property using HELOC and rents it out less than 10% of the year deserves to have his retirement secured with exploitable and replaceable people.
Remember people, a liberal vote is a vote for capitalistic exploitation of vulnerable individuals for corporate gain.
> Remember people, a liberal vote is a vote for capitalistic exploitation of vulnerable individuals for corporate gain.
Yeah the problem is that while everyone agrees with this, they all seem to want to vote for the *other* capitalistic exploiters of vulnerable individuals for corporate gain.
But that's because the actual capitalists that fund these two parties know Canadian voters are too stupid to remember what the other party was like when they were in power. We can't remember that long.
Honestly at this point I’d like a legislature of golden retrievers. We can post every bill on trees and the tree they piss on the most gets passed. It would probably as effective, if not more effective, than our current system.
Plus they’d actually be enjoyable to watch.
Well the cons too, obviously. It's an unholy union of chambers of commerce, provincial conservatives and prosperity christians that created this mess. As long as we're all distracted to screeching at trudeau it'll continue. Poopy pants will just blame trudeau for the next decade.
>Remember people, a liberal vote is a vote for capitalistic exploitation of vulnerable individuals for corporate gain.
The idea that this does not also apply to the cons is pretty funny too
Did I write something to exclude the cons?
Remind me again, which federal government brought in a whole underclass of exploitable and desperate people to serve as fodder for Canadian businesses? Was it the evil conservatives or the pure liberals?
Bitch about the cons all you want, but it will be forever and always the liberal party that used poor Indians to break the backs of Canadian labor. It happened. No amount of gaslighting will put another spin on it. Liberals brought neauveau slavery to Canada.
Congratulations, red voters, on your accomplishment!
This honestly baffles me. I often see people focusing about everything Pierre or the Cons do saying they'll ruin the country while completely ignoring the current government who is actively ruining the country!
I totally agree with them that the Cons won't make things better but can we please focus on the government that has been actively ruling the country for nearly a decade? Instead of fearmongering about what will happen when the Cons inevitably get control.
I quoted the part where you excluded the cons. Was that somehow unclear?
>Remind me again, which federal government brought in a whole underclass of exploitable and desperate people to serve as fodder for Canadian businesses? Was it the evil conservatives or the pure liberals?
It was both. Surely you know it's both. You think it started in 2015?
>Bitch about the cons all you want, but it will be forever and always the liberal party that used poor Indians to break the backs of Canadian labor.
You're just kinda running with being confidently unaware of history, eh?
You're lying to yourself if you think the cons will be any different.
Listing one example does not exclude another.
I find it funny how the Liberal narrative has shifted over the years. Your arguments no longer assume that the liberal party is better than the conservatives, just that you aren't any worse. Oh how the mighty have fallen.
>It was both. Surely you know it's both. You think it started in 2015?
This page paints a pretty clear picture:
https://www.statista.com/statistics/555117/number-of-international-students-at-years-end-canada-2000-2014/
International student permit approvals skyrocketed after the 2020/21 lockdowns.
Prior to that, the numbers grew at a steady pace.
It's no secret that the pause of immigration and international student permits caused a shift in power in labor markets. All of a sudden, there wasn't an endless stream of replaceable bodies to intimidate employees, and employers had to compete for workers.
This forced employers to offer better wages, benefits, and working conditions.
Then suddenly nationwide, regardless of which provincial party was in power, the immigration taps were turned to full in order to break the demands of labor and put them back in their place.
Synchronization is what paints it as a federal problem. It doesn't matter if it was the BCNDP or the Ontario Conservatives. All provincial parties across the political spectrum all got the same idea at the same time. I don't buy it.
>You're just kinda running with being confidently unaware of history, eh?
As far as I'm aware, this is the first time a federal party has taken such a strong hand against labor. If you have an example of conservatives doing so on such a large country-wide scale in recent history, than I'm all ears.
Otherwise, the liberal party is now the reigning champion of siding with corporate interests over Canadian labor.
You're conflating me with the liberal party, as though you're unaware that there are people who are critics of both them and the cons. Weird statements like "oh how the mighty have fallen" don't make any sense to me. Who are you talking to?
Why would you show a graph that doesn't include wages to make an argument about wages? Why wouldnt you just show a graph about wages to make your case about wages? Surely you don't think labour and international students are synonymous?
The only reason I can conclude is that you're just into making a bad faith argument. And the rest of your comment reads like a bad essay written in haste for your grade 11 business class and it's probably going to fail because you didn't understand the assignment. You are ignoring inconvenient facts.
Allow me to point you back to your initial problematic comment:
>Remember people, a liberal vote is a vote for capitalistic exploitation of vulnerable individuals for corporate gain.
"Capitalistic exploitation of vulnerable individuals for corporate gain" is essentially the right's business plan, no matter how much you want to pretend like this is somehow exclusive to the federal liberals.
The difference is that the Liberals right now have adopted one of the hardest anti-labor policies I've ever seen. Even Harper wasn't this anti-labor. Like. You understand that there's a difference between "the conservatives will be" which is an uncertain statement and "the liberals are" which is literally happening right now.
Bitching about what the conservatives might do every time someone bitches about what the liberals ARE DOING is frankly, super annoying, and honestly just comes off as expecting us to not point out our reality because some other guy could be worse, like that makes it okay somehow.
>Bitching about what the conservatives might do every time someone bitches about what the liberals ARE DOING is frankly, super annoying
Maybe people would stop being so annoying about it if Canadians would vote for someone other than the two major parties that keep fucking us over every 10 years.
We're trying to tell you that if you want to FIX the problems you describe, you have to vote for someone ELSE, not the Conservatives again!
Okay, point out the party that actually wants to fix the immigration and temporary resident problem.
So far we have (dubiously) the BQ, which i can't vote for, and the PPC, Which are a racist nightmare.
EVERY OTHER PARTY has either blatantly said they want to increase it, or said nothing, except the CPC who made vague non committal allusions to reducing it.
So which party should I vote for then, given my options? PPC?
So you think statements like this are accurate, good faith statements?
>Remember people, a liberal vote is a vote for capitalistic exploitation of vulnerable individuals for corporate gain.
Because I think they're misleading and disingenuous. I happen to think the cons will be as bad or worse. I'd that's a problem for you, I don't really care. Have a good one.
I mean... Its absolutely accurate, cause thats literally what's happening, I don't know what faith has anything to do with it. It comes off as "vote for literally anyone but the LPC"....which I agree with.
> Remind me again, which federal government brought in a whole underclass of exploitable and desperate people to serve as fodder for Canadian businesses? Was it the evil conservatives or the pure liberals?
It was the Conservatives too.
Here's Justin Trudeau, MP, complaining about Stephen Harper's use of the TFW program, using basically the same language you did, back in 2014:
https://www.thestar.com/opinion/contributors/justin-trudeau-how-to-fix-the-broken-temporary-foreign-worker-program/article_c27f214f-1fa2-5fdf-af61-5a7642e4eb7c.html
I'm sorry but your confidence and authoritative tone notwithstanding, this problem came before the Liberals, and it will continue if the Conservatives are elected again.
Depending how left you are, the Liberals and the Conservatives are both liberal, but it's a weird distinction because all mainstream parties including the NDP are arguably liberal parties as well
The Liberal government made the mistake of dismantling the country’s skills-based immigration system because of a “post-pandemic obsession with labour shortages, which is economic nonsense fuelled by corporate Canada,” Skuterud said.
George Lee, an immigration lawyer in Burnaby, said the “federal government created this problem: They’ve brought in too many people. The government wanted to address labour shortages. But now they say, ‘It’s too much!’ In effect the government is blaming itself.”
lol why would they warn away the low wage labour they're trying to attract?
*We* need to warn them. Our elected government is captured by the corporations and rich people that benefit from these policies.
We should ban misleading advertising by the immigration consultant companies. Much of this is done in India, not here, but if they are linked to a Canadian company we can still sanction them. It is morally reprehensible to lie to desperate people and tell them that a new life as a Canadian citizen is available to them (for a lot of rupees of course).
I saw a video on those consultant in India. Now a days their business is down too ...too many empty classes and shit coz folks over there know now that it is impossible to get PR based on the path they will be undertaking so they are dropping the whole idea.
Why? They can figure it out. The internet also exists in their countries
Btw: love the diversity on display in the photo with those international students
Highlights: * **University of Waterloo economics professor Mikal Skuterud, a specialist in labour, says the Liberal government created a predicament a few years ago when it signalled to the world, particularly those with low skills, that the easiest way to become a citizen of Canada is to show up as a temporary resident.** * “For migrants, Canada’s immigrant selection system now looks like a lottery, in which a work or study permit is the ticket. That’s a big problem. And it wasn’t like this before 2021.” * The government made the mistake of dismantling the country’s skills-based immigration system because of a “post-pandemic obsession with labour shortages, which is economic nonsense fuelled by corporate Canada,” Skuterud said. * Last week, StatCan reported 2.8 million temporary residents in Canada, comprising a record 6.8 % of the population. That’s up from 3.5% two years ago. * More than one million are foreign students, most with work permits. Others are classified as “temporary foreign workers” or “international mobility” workers. Another 360,000 are asylum claimants. * In light of Immigration Minister Marc Miller promising this spring to reduce the number of study visas, partly in response to the pressure on housing prices and social services. * The surge of temporary residents has exacerbated Canada’s housing crisis, says Skuterud. He adds that rapid population growth, almost entirely from international migration, correlates with Canadian wages staying stagnant. * **Skuterud would like the government to return to emphasizing the more traditional economic-class pathway to permanent resident status, which relied on a transparent, above-board ranking system to select candidates.**
It was definitely mentioned before 2020 how only about 1 in 5 temporary workers/students actually get PR and most were spouses. Then this scammy stuff went into overdrive. It's been insane to witness.
[удалено]
Who feeds them this insane fantasy?
I am wondering if it is the program recruiters in the other countries.
It 100% is.
Immigration consultants and educational institutions play a significant role. Many educational institutions conduct sessions overseas, where they paint an overly optimistic picture of the future. They hire student counselors abroad to work with target countries, further promoting this image. Immigration consultants, both inside and outside Canada do just the same, because it’s also their income.
Bingo. I work in Settlement services. There is so much money being made by these entities.
Not just that, they arrange false paperwork and legit people suffer. The worst is applying for refugee status if your family sat in India's farmer protest.
Immigration consultants
We literally have signs outside stores in malls in the Philippines that say "come to Canada"
Eventually Canadian food banks feed them.
Their relatives.
The immigration consultants.
[удалено]
I know a guy who came from the Congo about a decade ago. He said having a new iPhone and owning a car felt like having made it the first few years he was here. Although he had the advantage of being fluent in French in terms of a government job almost right off the bat.
Almost everyone I meet in Vancouver is an immigrant and I always ask why they chose here. Usually they say it was between USA, UK, Australia, and Canada, but Canada is the easiest to get in by far so they chose here
[удалено]
Well they used to be similar, but Canada just sort of removed its floodgate.
They do but they also have less economic and career opportunities. I am speaking from experience as I saw more professional growth of being 5 years in this country than me living 10 years in Aus/NZ
Boy do they have that insanely wrong lmao. Most of us are living pay cheque to pay cheque.
Dude I thougnthe same when I moved here as a PR for the most part it is if these motherfuckers could have managed their immigration carefully. Canada could be prosperous with little population but that won't work for the wealthy
Canada already was prosperous with a small population. We’ve been going backwards
Well its not too late to fix it ...just close the border for few years for things to catch up ....I am sure hell won't froze over it.
Who are we to deny these people their right to be exploited by Canadian elite? They already live in terrible conditions and are used to being exploited, so we really shouldn't feel bad about them having to live packed together like rats. Canadian employers need the stimulus. Have you even considered the negative effect things like raises and fair working conditions do to wealthy Canadians stock portfolio? The boomer who bought his 10th property using HELOC and rents it out less than 10% of the year deserves to have his retirement secured with exploitable and replaceable people. Remember people, a liberal vote is a vote for capitalistic exploitation of vulnerable individuals for corporate gain.
> Remember people, a liberal vote is a vote for capitalistic exploitation of vulnerable individuals for corporate gain. Yeah the problem is that while everyone agrees with this, they all seem to want to vote for the *other* capitalistic exploiters of vulnerable individuals for corporate gain. But that's because the actual capitalists that fund these two parties know Canadian voters are too stupid to remember what the other party was like when they were in power. We can't remember that long.
Honestly at this point I’d like a legislature of golden retrievers. We can post every bill on trees and the tree they piss on the most gets passed. It would probably as effective, if not more effective, than our current system. Plus they’d actually be enjoyable to watch.
Well the cons too, obviously. It's an unholy union of chambers of commerce, provincial conservatives and prosperity christians that created this mess. As long as we're all distracted to screeching at trudeau it'll continue. Poopy pants will just blame trudeau for the next decade.
>Remember people, a liberal vote is a vote for capitalistic exploitation of vulnerable individuals for corporate gain. The idea that this does not also apply to the cons is pretty funny too
Did I write something to exclude the cons? Remind me again, which federal government brought in a whole underclass of exploitable and desperate people to serve as fodder for Canadian businesses? Was it the evil conservatives or the pure liberals? Bitch about the cons all you want, but it will be forever and always the liberal party that used poor Indians to break the backs of Canadian labor. It happened. No amount of gaslighting will put another spin on it. Liberals brought neauveau slavery to Canada. Congratulations, red voters, on your accomplishment!
This honestly baffles me. I often see people focusing about everything Pierre or the Cons do saying they'll ruin the country while completely ignoring the current government who is actively ruining the country! I totally agree with them that the Cons won't make things better but can we please focus on the government that has been actively ruling the country for nearly a decade? Instead of fearmongering about what will happen when the Cons inevitably get control.
I quoted the part where you excluded the cons. Was that somehow unclear? >Remind me again, which federal government brought in a whole underclass of exploitable and desperate people to serve as fodder for Canadian businesses? Was it the evil conservatives or the pure liberals? It was both. Surely you know it's both. You think it started in 2015? >Bitch about the cons all you want, but it will be forever and always the liberal party that used poor Indians to break the backs of Canadian labor. You're just kinda running with being confidently unaware of history, eh? You're lying to yourself if you think the cons will be any different.
Listing one example does not exclude another. I find it funny how the Liberal narrative has shifted over the years. Your arguments no longer assume that the liberal party is better than the conservatives, just that you aren't any worse. Oh how the mighty have fallen. >It was both. Surely you know it's both. You think it started in 2015? This page paints a pretty clear picture: https://www.statista.com/statistics/555117/number-of-international-students-at-years-end-canada-2000-2014/ International student permit approvals skyrocketed after the 2020/21 lockdowns. Prior to that, the numbers grew at a steady pace. It's no secret that the pause of immigration and international student permits caused a shift in power in labor markets. All of a sudden, there wasn't an endless stream of replaceable bodies to intimidate employees, and employers had to compete for workers. This forced employers to offer better wages, benefits, and working conditions. Then suddenly nationwide, regardless of which provincial party was in power, the immigration taps were turned to full in order to break the demands of labor and put them back in their place. Synchronization is what paints it as a federal problem. It doesn't matter if it was the BCNDP or the Ontario Conservatives. All provincial parties across the political spectrum all got the same idea at the same time. I don't buy it. >You're just kinda running with being confidently unaware of history, eh? As far as I'm aware, this is the first time a federal party has taken such a strong hand against labor. If you have an example of conservatives doing so on such a large country-wide scale in recent history, than I'm all ears. Otherwise, the liberal party is now the reigning champion of siding with corporate interests over Canadian labor.
You're conflating me with the liberal party, as though you're unaware that there are people who are critics of both them and the cons. Weird statements like "oh how the mighty have fallen" don't make any sense to me. Who are you talking to? Why would you show a graph that doesn't include wages to make an argument about wages? Why wouldnt you just show a graph about wages to make your case about wages? Surely you don't think labour and international students are synonymous? The only reason I can conclude is that you're just into making a bad faith argument. And the rest of your comment reads like a bad essay written in haste for your grade 11 business class and it's probably going to fail because you didn't understand the assignment. You are ignoring inconvenient facts. Allow me to point you back to your initial problematic comment: >Remember people, a liberal vote is a vote for capitalistic exploitation of vulnerable individuals for corporate gain. "Capitalistic exploitation of vulnerable individuals for corporate gain" is essentially the right's business plan, no matter how much you want to pretend like this is somehow exclusive to the federal liberals.
The difference is that the Liberals right now have adopted one of the hardest anti-labor policies I've ever seen. Even Harper wasn't this anti-labor. Like. You understand that there's a difference between "the conservatives will be" which is an uncertain statement and "the liberals are" which is literally happening right now. Bitching about what the conservatives might do every time someone bitches about what the liberals ARE DOING is frankly, super annoying, and honestly just comes off as expecting us to not point out our reality because some other guy could be worse, like that makes it okay somehow.
>Bitching about what the conservatives might do every time someone bitches about what the liberals ARE DOING is frankly, super annoying Maybe people would stop being so annoying about it if Canadians would vote for someone other than the two major parties that keep fucking us over every 10 years. We're trying to tell you that if you want to FIX the problems you describe, you have to vote for someone ELSE, not the Conservatives again!
Okay, point out the party that actually wants to fix the immigration and temporary resident problem. So far we have (dubiously) the BQ, which i can't vote for, and the PPC, Which are a racist nightmare. EVERY OTHER PARTY has either blatantly said they want to increase it, or said nothing, except the CPC who made vague non committal allusions to reducing it. So which party should I vote for then, given my options? PPC?
Just to be clear, the accusations that the PPC are a racist nightmare are because they want to fix the immigration and temporary resident problem?
So you think statements like this are accurate, good faith statements? >Remember people, a liberal vote is a vote for capitalistic exploitation of vulnerable individuals for corporate gain. Because I think they're misleading and disingenuous. I happen to think the cons will be as bad or worse. I'd that's a problem for you, I don't really care. Have a good one.
I mean... Its absolutely accurate, cause thats literally what's happening, I don't know what faith has anything to do with it. It comes off as "vote for literally anyone but the LPC"....which I agree with.
I'd call it a lie by omission and generally misleading. I've made my case.
> Remind me again, which federal government brought in a whole underclass of exploitable and desperate people to serve as fodder for Canadian businesses? Was it the evil conservatives or the pure liberals? It was the Conservatives too. Here's Justin Trudeau, MP, complaining about Stephen Harper's use of the TFW program, using basically the same language you did, back in 2014: https://www.thestar.com/opinion/contributors/justin-trudeau-how-to-fix-the-broken-temporary-foreign-worker-program/article_c27f214f-1fa2-5fdf-af61-5a7642e4eb7c.html I'm sorry but your confidence and authoritative tone notwithstanding, this problem came before the Liberals, and it will continue if the Conservatives are elected again.
Depending how left you are, the Liberals and the Conservatives are both liberal, but it's a weird distinction because all mainstream parties including the NDP are arguably liberal parties as well
More than 1:20 people in a Canada are temporary residents? Jesus Christ that’s a jump.
The Liberal government made the mistake of dismantling the country’s skills-based immigration system because of a “post-pandemic obsession with labour shortages, which is economic nonsense fuelled by corporate Canada,” Skuterud said. George Lee, an immigration lawyer in Burnaby, said the “federal government created this problem: They’ve brought in too many people. The government wanted to address labour shortages. But now they say, ‘It’s too much!’ In effect the government is blaming itself.”
lol why would they warn away the low wage labour they're trying to attract? *We* need to warn them. Our elected government is captured by the corporations and rich people that benefit from these policies.
We should ban misleading advertising by the immigration consultant companies. Much of this is done in India, not here, but if they are linked to a Canadian company we can still sanction them. It is morally reprehensible to lie to desperate people and tell them that a new life as a Canadian citizen is available to them (for a lot of rupees of course).
I saw a video on those consultant in India. Now a days their business is down too ...too many empty classes and shit coz folks over there know now that it is impossible to get PR based on the path they will be undertaking so they are dropping the whole idea.
What they (the Liberals) have done to the is country is a travesty.
Why? They can figure it out. The internet also exists in their countries Btw: love the diversity on display in the photo with those international students
[удалено]
Dumb and uneducated/exploited are NOT the same things.