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The poll, published Tuesday by the Washington Post and the University of Maryland’s Center for Democracy and Civic Engagement, said **36 percent** of Americans believe Biden was illegitimately elected. That number has risen five percentage points from 31 percent in 2021.
Reminds me of my mom.
My mom when I want to do something older kids did - "You're **barely** 10years old"
My mom when I want to do something younger kids did - "You're **almost** 11 years old!"
This sub became insufferable when QAnon and Trump subs got banned and this became the last place on Reddit to allow that kindergarten level "conspiracy" stuff that's so obviously false that it's clearly propaganda.
Now it's more of a sub to pay attention to to see where the bullshit starts.
Ie, stuff gets tested here and then you'll hear those politicians saying it in a week or two.
In the lead up to 2020 elections you'd see some really stupid covid or election claim here and if it got traction on a week or two Trump and the MAGAs would be parroting the propaganda.
It's fascinating to watch.
Yeah yeah. I can just see the illuminati huddled around a computer screen hanging on every word of redditors to get validation of their schemes.
"Brother Marcus, why have we not yet proceeded with phase two of our plans?"
"Forgive me, Elder. It didn't do so well on Reddit. It got like a lot of down votes. We must rethink our approach."
"I see. I trust your next attempt will draw more favorable sentiment, and like more upvotes. Now go. Re-draft your Reddit post. And Marcus... do not fail me again... or it will be the last time."
I mean, marketing agencies do exactly that.
I've worked in marketing consulting and collected and paid for that kind of monitoring data before.
It's really not that weird to think that political groups and enemy actors do the same.
We know Russia and China have done various things over the years. Why would they have stopped?
There's a million that come to mind but the first time I noticed it was right after the 2020 election. A lot of the garbage Trump was floating about voting machines that eventually led to so many lawsuits launched a week or two here first. And there'd be a few versions and the one that stuck always seemed to be what came out of Trump's mouth.
It's continued though after he left office it dropped and after the world killed Russia's cash it dropped a lot. It's picked back up as election season gets going.
It started way before that. It was a concerted effort by foreign entities to weaponize the conspiracy community to sow discord in the west. As it became more politically directed, more and more low IQ people bought into it as it confirmed their own biases. There's a reason why conspiracy theories have taken hold of the Right in the western world.
Trump voters that think he won because everyone they know in their little hometown supported him should try to visit a couple of decent size cities.
Those people aren't afraid of Mexican and Muslims. Diversity and population density leads to tolerance and respect. His attacks on every demographic but one are taken personally.
The American people are in the cities. DC has more American citizens than Wyoming. All that red on election maps is sparsely populated,.empty land. "Biden won LA, Chicago, and New York. Trump won a bunch of back yards and corn fields in Nebraska and Oklahoma.
I remember reading a comment on here not too long ago where someone was like "I drove from west georgia through tennessee and saw a trump sign every few miles. i didn't see any biden signs."
they had no idea most of those counties were populations of like 5k.
it really undermines the argument for the electoral college; when you see that land has more value in our voting system than people, it really disillusions you.
Where do all the tax dollars that pay for all the farm subsidies come from?
"$45.6 billion in calendar year 2020"
Complaining about a City not being self sustaining is most brain dead comment I have seen in a long time.
Its about having a diversified economy in the United States.
Santa Clara doesn't have much farm land but is the headquarters of Apple, They bring in 16 Billion in Tax Revenue, But would we really complain you can't eat a smartphone?
I've failed to explain myself well enough.
I'm not complaining about anything, I'm trying to get you to think about how cities came about in the first place. To facilitate trade. They are built around the farmer Joes that started trading there in the first place. The 100 people living there only came about from the trade that Joes were doing there. Same with Apple in Santa Clara, it's not self sustained, it's sustained by all the actual work the rest of Apple does.
If there is “so much evidence” for Trump winning in 2020. Why hasn’t anyone actually done something with that evidence?
(Also remember, that even in 2016, Trump did not win the popular vote)
It’s not everyday an incumbent gains votes and loses. It’s not everyday the winner of the election loses most important bellwether counties.
It’s more of a statistical anomaly. They made sure to subvert election law and shred the evidence.
Yes, it's not every day, elections happen every 4 year. There have only been like 60 (?) of them. So weird stuff happens. Like Trump losing the popular vote but winning the election.
The bellwether county comment just shows complete political ignorance, the "swing" states/areas are constantly shifting. Ohio, Virginia, and Colorado were all once swing states, now they are not.
Do you think they if something hasn’t happened before then it can’t ever happen?
Are the only the things allowed to happen things that happened before?
Hmm. Well HW lost but he obviously got fewer votes because of Perot. Carter lost but there was a third party then.
So when did the last incumbent lose a 2 party race? Do we have to go back to Herbert Hoover?
See how dumb this is? You read some stat and never bothered to check, is this that crazy? It's really not. Incumbents usually win. Trump though was a particularly weak incumbent considering he barely won in 2016. Turnout was also depressed in 2016 because Hillary was more hated than Biden so it makes sense his vote total went up.
And when incumbents are vulnerable (like HW or Carter) we've seen third parties seize their chances and run which siphons off votes.
So it doesn’t happen every day. Trump was so popular that he gained 10 million votes as the incumbent. Like I said in my first post, it’s the statistical improbability that the guy who was trailing in the Democratic polls became the most popular president in the history of the country.
It can’t be that Trump was so unpopular because love trumps hate.
When was the last election where it was made more convenient for people to vote without having to take time off work and stand in line for an hour or eight in the cold on a specific day?
Wait, is that how we choose Presidents?
Can we get rid of the EC then, and just rely on vote totals?
Here's how that happens: overall voter turnout goes up, and more of that additional voter turnout goes to the other guy. Easy.
Please tell me you aren’t actually this daft, this is the easiest thing to explain and comprehend that is irrefutable with actual numbers.
There was a much higher voter turnout out in 2020 than in 2016, literally everyone got more votes because there were more votes cast.
You mean like the 2000 Mules thing? Well, the problem is that you would dismiss it. Why though? I mean I find it quite interesting and I don't have a ball in the game as I am not an American. But have you actually watched it? I mean if you are going to dismiss it, at least watch it first.
They didn’t do anything with that either. They made a bunch of money with a BS documentary and then sit on the “data” they claim to have used rather than making it public. If they had something they could have gone to court with it.
But they are doing something with it in the form of the True the Vote campaigns. You can disagree with it, but you can't say that there would be nothing and they aren't doing anything with it.
I've seen it. It's hot garbage.
Here's a letter from True the Vote's own lawyers torpedoing the central claims in the documentary:
https://www.gpb.org/news/2021/10/22/gbi-says-gops-cellphone-data-lacks-enough-evidence-prove-ballot-harvesting
Well if you read both the article you link and have seen the documentary, then you know that the article came out before the movie and that the movie actually addresses most of the objections in the article and actually shows the very evidence the article asks for.
Like I said, I don't care about American politics - because in my humble opinion a lot of Americans from both sides like to jump to conclusions and at best selectively look at things to confirm their own bias that they already formed BEFORE looking at anything themselves.
>the movie actually addresses most of the objections in the article
It literally does not. True the Vote never says how close someone needed to get to a drop box in order to be labeled a mule. They spend a lot of time talking about the accuracy of the data. However, the data could be accurate to the millimeter and it wouldn't change the fact that TTV *actively decided* to label anyone who came within 100 feet of ten drop boxes a mule.
They could have been walking by on the other side of the street.
>a lot of Americans from both sides like to jump to conclusions and at best selectively look at things to confirm their own bias that they already formed BEFORE looking at anything themselves.
True. That's why I gave you the information TTV selectively left out of their documentary.
You mean the cherry picked footage of people dropping off ballots for themselves and family members, [like this guy,](https://www.fox5atlanta.com/news/georgia-false-ballot-fraud-dinesh-dsouza-film-2000-mules-lawsuit.amp) who is suing for defamation?
They don't show a single person dropping off ballots more than once, and never more than a family-sized amount (4 or 5 tops).
For someone who claims they want to understand topics fully, you haven't done [much reading on it.](https://apnews.com/article/2022-midterm-elections-covid-technology-health-arizona-e1b49d2311bf900f44fa5c6dac406762)
No, I haven't read on it at all, I have just watched it. You on the other hand have just read on it and haven't watched it cause the film does show the things you claim it doesn't show.
>You on the other hand have just read on it and haven't watched it
I've seen it.
But I would *love* for you to give the timestamp to disprove any of my claims:
1) where do they state how close someone needed to be to a drop box to be labeled a mule (hint: they don't)
2) where do they show CCTV footage of anyone going to more than one drop box? (Hint: they don't)
3) where do they show anyone dropping off more than 4-5 ballots in any state where people can't drop off ballots for their family members (where we might expect 4-5 ballots to be a reasonable amount). (Hint: you guessed it, they don't.)
It would be exceptionally easy to prove me wrong *if these things exist in the documentary.*
>You mean like the 2000 Mules thing? Well, the problem is that you would dismiss it.
I pass a ballot box that's in front of a library literally every weekday (And some weekend days) walking to my car.
By their cellphone tracking criteria, I am probably one of their 2000 Mules.
AMA!
So every day you go to a non profit organization dedicated to "voter inclusivity" and then you go to at least 10 different ballot boxes where public cameras record you putting several ballots into the each ballot box each time?
Cause that's the criteria they use in the film and that's the video footage they show. So if that doesn't apply to you - then I don't mean to be presumptuous myself - but could the reason you didn't know that that was the criteria they use in the movie be because you might not really have completely watched the movie yourself after all?
See, I really don't have an opinion on the matter, I just find it funny that Americans from both sides all seem to be so sure that they already know everything and have no need to actually look at things and feel completely confident that they can judge and even dismiss and even slander things that they didn't even look at themselves.
It should be how they're elected. The electoral college is a relic of the past, a compromise made to appease the smaller states of the newly-founded Republic. Now, it just serves to allow a tyranny of the minority, with some people's votes mattering less and others mattering more.
Edit: Averaged out, your vote is worth 0.62 in Texas and 2.52 in Vermont.
Absolutely untrue. We're a democratic republic, a representative democracy. We were never designed to be a full-on democracy. It isn't fair that CA and NY can decide the fate of the entire country, which is what would happen if we were strictly a democracy; the entire *purpose* of having states is to have some autonomy from a large federal government.
United *States* of America, not United People of America.
>We were never designed to be a full-on democracy.
Did anyone privy to this design ever say *anything* like that?
I think the truth is, America's founding fathers just were not experts in electoral science.
And if they saw how it's turned out, I don't think they'd say it's working exactly how they imagined.
It isn't fair to the people of Texas that a person in Wyoming holds ~~five~~ three times the power over them in deciding who the President is.
Changing the system from an electoral to a popular vote still keeps us as a democratic republic and a representative democracy. Neither of those terms deal with how the President is elected, but rather how laws are decided. Literally every democracy on Earth is a representative one, with sprinkles of direct democracy here and there.
Furthermore, a President doesn't have unlimited authority. There's nothing changing in the balance of power between the state and federal governments of power being redistributed back to the people. The electoral system is just a relic of the past that was necessary in order to keep the newly-founded Republic intact and has outlined its usefulness. The Civil War demonstrated that states do not have the right to secede on a whim, and there wouldn't be any push to secede if the popular vote is instituted other than from the elites that stand to lose from it.
People fail to remember that we are supposed to be 50 countries bound together by commerce & military which is why the electoral college makes sense and why states rights differ from the fed.
People don't fail to remember that. It's just irrelevant, now. States no longer hold the same nationalism that they had prior to the American Civil War, and much less the nationalism that they had when struggling to create a constitution. The same aristocrats and upper class that forced the electoral college compromise no longer exist. As outlined by the constitution, the rights of the *people*, not the *state*, are paramount, and the electoral college is trampling on the rights of the people by not making all votes equal.
Concerning the election of the President, a representative of the *people* of the United States of America, not the states, a popular vote is far more fair than what we have now.
Well, when you don't like the electoral college you can just forge documents and enlist your own unelected alternate electors to disqualify the elected electors. Trump tried it in many states, that's included in his indictments
That's my bad. The website I was looking at was talking about midterm elections rather than the presidential election. Even so, the voting power is still unequal and in favour of the voters in Wyoming.
It doesn't matter. If we are going to believe that our votes count for jack shit... then we are doing ourselves a great delusional disservice. Your vote, your opinion, the policies you support don't mean shit to anyone unless you are a billionaire. The common folk in Wyoming are just as powerless as the common folk in Texas.
O.k. it's still not 5 times. As someone else pointed out... it's about state sovereignty. So the folks on the west coast and east coast can't just decide to flood Wyoming with illegal immigrants or some crazy bullshit like that... oh wait.
They can do that with or without the electoral college if you ask Texas. They’re just sending the immigrants to other states. Whats to stop pritzker from loading a plane in IL and sending them to Wyoming? If abbot and desantis can do it, pritzker and Hochul can do it, right?
The Federal government is suing Texas to stop them from authorizing state and local law enforcement to act as border patrol. Literally suing Texas to prevent them from protecting their own border. Fuck all the liberals and neo-cons that have done NOTHING to protect our border for several decades and who continue to fight AGAINST protecting it. Fuck them. I dream of the day they are all rotting in a prison.
Do you mean the people of Texas have 5x the voting power of people in Wyoming? Wyoming is 3 electoral votes and Texas is 40. Population of texas is 30 millions, Wyoming is 500k. In fact, going by the average rule of 1 elector per 500k population, Wyoming would be better represented with 1 vote and Texas with 60. I dont know if the number is only supposed to include adults of voting age, but regardless the outcomes would be the same but without 2-3 individual states *exclusively* choosing the President every 4 years without fail.
And your comment about how a President doesn't have unlimited power has been basically proven false the last several Presidents, they seem to be able to do whatever they feel like doing for the most part using executive order or other sleazy workarounds.
I was looking at a website talking about the midterm elections rather than the presidential elections, so that's my bad. I corrected my comment.
If it switches to a popular vote, the states become irrelevant. The only reason that a few individual states, like California and Texas, decide the election is because the electoral system makes most of the country irrelevant to the election and useless to campaign in.
The evidence has been put out there. Just gets censored and pegged as a conspiracy, like everything else that would interfere with the narrative.
An astronomical amount of ballots were delivered to drop boxes by a very relatively small amount of people. This can be proven by GIS phone data that anyone can purchase (same way they were able to track down everyone from the January 6th event). There are videos of this happening, people shoving hundreds of ballots into drop boxes.
Democratic donations to fund the Biden campaign went to purchasing drop boxes. Cameras on dozens of drop boxes were mysteriously turned off, or aimed just out of view.
Tons of accounts of people saying they were paid to collect ballots from Indian reservations, homeless camps, mentally incompetent nursing home residents, etc…
Not to mention covid restrictions set the stage for the drop boxes to even be an option.
Twitter was censoring the hunter Biden accusations at the same time, which would have swung the vote even more!
The same reason nothing else justice-related happens.
Because the deep state has gotten their people into most of the highest positions.
And I'm no defender of Trump personally. I don't like Bernie Sanders but he got robbed too. Or I should say his voters got robbed.
We have several instances of top Kraken lawyer, Rudy Giuliani, explicitly stating, in court, to judges, where you are under oath and lawyers are held to certain standards, that they were **not** alleging fraud.
Why should a court be subject to an argument that the Trump team weren't making, since they knew that their case would be utterly destroyed if they tried that argument?
Not one trump appointed judge would hear the case because it lacks merit, the judge would still be a laughing stock today if they even entertained the case and it's lack of evidence.
Because BOTH sides hated him, not just the left. You burn so many bridges nobody wanted to help him when he actually needed it.
I think he cashed in too many favors during the Russiagate bullshit, and a lot of republicans were probably more comfortable letting him go out to pasture. lol
That’s just my take I have nothing to back that up. There was weird things that happened during the election but you could argue this stuff happens in every election.
But Republicans also set up a lane for him to return as POTUS, first to help Trump stay as POTUS, they launched a mass lawsuit to scotus to toss dem votes. Then Rs didn't vote to impeach & convict him for J6 which would've been well justified if they did.
They refused to cooperate with Dems in Jan 6 investigations.
Its just simple Trump lied about the election being stolen and Republicans weren't going to jeopardize themselves following his footsteps.
You think it's obvious the incumbent during the deadliest and most expensive year in American history that celebrates sex trafficking and demonizes Hispanics, blacks, and women obviously won.
The Republican Party has only won the most votes once out of the past our of the last eight Presidential elections. But you think twice impeached, proven a rapist in court, grab em by the pussy and let a million Americans die lost by seven million votes.
You think he obviously won. He was President. If he couldn't claim an election he actually won he must be less competent than "drink bleach" makes him sound.
polls like that, and the headlines about it are used to form political opinions. It is psychological warfare 101. Humans like to align with the larger stronger group and their belief. Don't be a gullible NPC, please, always research for yourself.
Who's they? The people who would want to cover their own ass? You have to be incredibly naïve to believe this propaganda. Mail in ballots were legalized and now they can commit as much fraud as they want. There's hundreds of videos on YouTube of people stuffing mailboxes of ballots - do you honestly believe those votes should count? Especially when ballots that were mailed in account for more than 70% of a candidates votes? 65 million ballots were "mailed in". Any number of those could have been harvested and cast legally which would (in any normal democratic reality) consist of deception.
Even in this comment section there are plenty of folks saying voting doesn't matter. If they don't vote, their vote can be harvested. It's legal in several states. You can't prove fraud anymore because the feds worked to penetrate several states leadership to make it impossible.
If you wanted to design a system to install whoever you wanted to continue the tyrannical agenda of a cabal, this is exactly what it would look like.
Mail in ballots, as handled, didn’t help matters. Handled by the same party to spent the prior 4 years claiming Trump stole the election with Russia’s help (failing to provide any legitimate evidence).
And more people than that believe that their parties politicians will fix things, when there are decades of evidence proving the opposite is true. Neither side of the table matters as far as our politicians go, because they’ve all been bought by the same corporations and answer to the same people. It’s time we accepted those facts.
Do you people have ANY idea how hard it is to rig an election across several states and fake 7 million votes?
It would require AT LEAST tens of thousands of co-conspirators on all levels of society and a cover-up so disproportional to anything done before that it's frankly unreasonable to believe that they managed to even set it up, let alone keep everyone involved from even off-handedly make a suspicious statement.
And for what gain? To get one greedy, old corporate stooge in the pocket of the oil lobby out of office, so they can get another greedy, old corporate stooge in the pocket into office? The only difference is that Trump (and the Republicans as a whole) represent old financial interests such as US based steel and logistics companies and oil money such as the Koch brothers, and the Biden and the Democrats represent newer, more international financial interests such as Big Tech.
The same major interests remain for both sides anyway, your Lockheed Martin, Raytheon, Goldman-Sachs, Unilever and the like, doesn't matter to them who's in office, whoever is there is going to do what they say anyway. No president can tell the military industrial complex to kick rocks, because that's the day the US loses their military hegemony, and no president can do it to Goldman-Sachs either, because they can without exaggeration tank the US economy whenever they want to.
The reality is that Donald Trump is and was a buffoon who wanted to be president to stroke his own ego and dodge some tax and value fraud charges that were coming his way, and a lot of Americans bought into his promises of getting jobs back to places like Detroit, something that never happened, all the while Trump escalated with his anti-minority rhetoric, turning away minority votes while also losing the votes of the people who he promised jobs and never delivered.
And that's not to mention that Trump over his four years as president lost all the meme value that definitely contributed to his vote results, especially in the cities.
I just want to point out that the entire narrative on the right about stolen elections started with Donald trump who certainly has some narcissist traits such as lying… a lot…. For a while now. Even if your super far right maga guy I think you can still agree trump is quite the liar, arguably one of the biggest liars in modern politics. If you don’t agree I could follow this up with examples but my point is that it’s kind of ironic that people who think the election was stolen, blame others for believing lies. Maybe the election was rigged, we all have to remain open minded of that for…. Ever basically. But I’m not gonna overthrow our current system because I took the liars word for it. Not with the amount of drama on the world stage with Russia China.
Wow... 40%? You Americans sure have a lot of right winged extremist terrorists... I mean at that rate, who knows... it might even be possible for someone like Trump to get elected legitimately, which in turn would indeed make it all the harder for his opponents to get elected legitimately...
Most likely they asked 10 people and 4 of them said they didn't believe it. I've never met a single person who's been polled ever and I've never been polled ever. Polls mean nothing...
The lies are OLDER and DEEPER than are superficially advertised.
Edit:
Advertising is perfectly legal;
see Bernays and Coleman.
It's a grand orchestration involving many secret societies, world leaders, and their agencies. It goes back quite a while. Some people have cataloged it well. Including the present power structures and who's pulling the strings?
Have you read these?
(https://archive.org/details/in.ernet.dli.2015.1607/page/n151/mode/1up) \\\\-Crystallizing Public Opinion - Bernays describes selling silks on pg 145.
The black hand is ads. They're selling ideology, not silks. Gestalt, zeitgeist, and emotional investment.
(https://drwho.virtadpt.net/files/The-Engineering-of-Consent.pdf) The Engineering of Consent - Edward L. Bernays (10 pages)
(https://archive.org/details/conspirators-hierarchy-the-story-of-the-committee-of-300-dr.-john-coleman) CIA John Coleman: Conspirators Hierarchy the Story of the Committee of 300 - Coleman,
\\\\\\\\\\\\\-\\\\\\\\-\\\\\-\\\-\\-\ This one!:
The Tavistock Institute Of Human Relations: Shaping the Moral, Spiritual, Cultural, Political, and Economic Decline of The United States of America - Coleman, John https://archive.org/details/coleman-john-the-tavistock-institute-of-human-relations-1/mode/2up Tavistock - Coleman, 2005
Our presidents have been hand-picked for decades. Your vote does not matter.
Even if Trump won, he is no better than Biden. They are both terrible. It's literally "pick your poison".
"Ya, you should just not vote for anything anymore. "
The best propaganda to come out from the last election is convincing people they should just not vote in the next election.
Why should California have more leverage than West Virginia? All of our elections would be won by California and New York and the rest of the country would have no say. We have an electoral college because each state gets equal say. UNITED states of America.
A vote in West Virginia is worth more than a vote in California and Texas, combined. State governments already have the power to dictate their own laws to an extent. Equalizing the votes between citizens wouldn't harm the balance of power between the federal and state governments, while it would allow for a fairer democratic system.
This idea of a fraudulent election makes voting and democracy appear as real and under attack. Utter nonsense!! ...They all work together along with the media and act out this fake left vs right tension to divided and conquer.
It was unconstitutional for governors to change election procedures instead of the legislature as outlined in the Constitution.... But the that ultra right wing maga Nazi supreme Court said no one was harmed therefore there is no case.... Then said "you should have came before the election"
So yeah I guess it was all legit
A) I don't believe that statistic. Almost everyone by now, albeit reluctantly by some people, understands that Biden did not win that election. No chance in hell. B) the American revolution happened with about a 7-11 percent participation rate. 9 out of 10 people even back then were detached, checked out and uninterested in it.
No, it's just the weirdos in their bubble who refuse to accept that even the people who sold them the lie that it was stolen have since admitted they were lying.
i’m not a fan of orange man or alzheimer’s. it’s plain to see this election and plenty others have been fraudulent, including orange man’s first go around simply because hildawg is gonna get named on that little list that’s coming out. so instead, they give orange man four years, steal his next one, then drag him through court for bullshit because if he runs again he wins. joe won’t run, kamala will after she takes over sometime this spring.
Submission statement
Rasmussen had a poll saying roughly the same thing only it was over half of Americans think he was illegitimate?
Because I'm not sure I trust the Washington Post and the University of Maryland on this one.
> The poll, published Tuesday by the Washington Post and the University of Maryland’s Center for Democracy and Civic Engagement, said 36 percent of Americans believe Biden was illegitimately elected. That number has risen five percentage points from 31 percent in 2021.
By the way, this is how The Hill reported it:
https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/4384619-one-third-of-americans-say-biden-election-illegitimate/
Link to article https://archive.ph/DQtzV
>The poll was conducted December 14-18 among a random sample of 1,024 adults, with an error margin of plus or minus 4.1 percentage points.
So if that’s correct that’s not a bad margin of error, and the sample size is decent, but our population is so large the figures from the survey won’t really represent the population as a whole very well. There’s controls for that, and the most studies are capped at a 1000 anyway cause it’s usually good enough, but depending on the questions asked and the people polled, whether or not they took it seriously, etc. it’s pretty likely to be further off than the math suggests.
I get why they do it this way, but it’s never very reliable at the state level, or if one state is overly represented.
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The poll has 33% do not believe, yet of course Breitbart uses "almost 40%". I don't think they know how rounding works.
They follow the Price is Right rounding concept.
I say $1
The poll, published Tuesday by the Washington Post and the University of Maryland’s Center for Democracy and Civic Engagement, said **36 percent** of Americans believe Biden was illegitimately elected. That number has risen five percentage points from 31 percent in 2021.
Reminds me of my mom. My mom when I want to do something older kids did - "You're **barely** 10years old" My mom when I want to do something younger kids did - "You're **almost** 11 years old!"
I'm surprised they didn't say. "Nearly half"
Neither does corn pop.
You guys just imagine how much fun this sub could potentially be if all mentions of trump or biden got you an instaban. We can dream I guess
Bigfoot for president!
Just walks aggressively fast avoiding everyone, just a quick wave and off into the forest. Best president we could ever hope for. Be so chill…
They could set up a trail cam in the Oval Office. We can all watch for sightings.
He’s eating grubs and sitting under the desk….300 million watching…
Reminds me of saxsquatch. He just is there chilling, playing saxophone 🎷.
Bill Clinton?
Hill Clinton
Just ruins it completely. Acting as if politics and elections matter / are real at all
The mods suck
Ok so go to any of the other conspiracy subs. Problem solved.
It’s a conspiracy sub. The 2020 election is the biggest conspiracy out there. Why would we not talk about it?
It only the biggest conspiracy to dummies, everyone who is not a dummy is sick of hearing about it
This sub is turning into a place for people to just bitch about politics
This sub became insufferable when QAnon and Trump subs got banned and this became the last place on Reddit to allow that kindergarten level "conspiracy" stuff that's so obviously false that it's clearly propaganda. Now it's more of a sub to pay attention to to see where the bullshit starts. Ie, stuff gets tested here and then you'll hear those politicians saying it in a week or two. In the lead up to 2020 elections you'd see some really stupid covid or election claim here and if it got traction on a week or two Trump and the MAGAs would be parroting the propaganda. It's fascinating to watch.
lol right right. Reddit is the testing ground for the illuminati. Some people think they're so important. It's wild.
Social media absolutely is a testing ground for propaganda and you can A/B test quickly.
Yeah yeah. I can just see the illuminati huddled around a computer screen hanging on every word of redditors to get validation of their schemes. "Brother Marcus, why have we not yet proceeded with phase two of our plans?" "Forgive me, Elder. It didn't do so well on Reddit. It got like a lot of down votes. We must rethink our approach." "I see. I trust your next attempt will draw more favorable sentiment, and like more upvotes. Now go. Re-draft your Reddit post. And Marcus... do not fail me again... or it will be the last time."
I mean, marketing agencies do exactly that. I've worked in marketing consulting and collected and paid for that kind of monitoring data before. It's really not that weird to think that political groups and enemy actors do the same. We know Russia and China have done various things over the years. Why would they have stopped?
Do you have an example?
There's a million that come to mind but the first time I noticed it was right after the 2020 election. A lot of the garbage Trump was floating about voting machines that eventually led to so many lawsuits launched a week or two here first. And there'd be a few versions and the one that stuck always seemed to be what came out of Trump's mouth. It's continued though after he left office it dropped and after the world killed Russia's cash it dropped a lot. It's picked back up as election season gets going.
it turned into that in 2020. this is my first time on the sub since then lmao. nice to see things havent changed
Buddy, you should been here in 2015/2016 when Hillary was running. This sub was far worse then. It was Wikileaks and Hillary 24/7.
It started way before that. It was a concerted effort by foreign entities to weaponize the conspiracy community to sow discord in the west. As it became more politically directed, more and more low IQ people bought into it as it confirmed their own biases. There's a reason why conspiracy theories have taken hold of the Right in the western world.
Sauce : Screenshot. Well done, critical thinker. You should run for President.
Trump voters that think he won because everyone they know in their little hometown supported him should try to visit a couple of decent size cities. Those people aren't afraid of Mexican and Muslims. Diversity and population density leads to tolerance and respect. His attacks on every demographic but one are taken personally. The American people are in the cities. DC has more American citizens than Wyoming. All that red on election maps is sparsely populated,.empty land. "Biden won LA, Chicago, and New York. Trump won a bunch of back yards and corn fields in Nebraska and Oklahoma.
I remember reading a comment on here not too long ago where someone was like "I drove from west georgia through tennessee and saw a trump sign every few miles. i didn't see any biden signs." they had no idea most of those counties were populations of like 5k. it really undermines the argument for the electoral college; when you see that land has more value in our voting system than people, it really disillusions you.
Who supplies the cities? I'm all for large cities, but they're not really self sustainable.
Does that really matter? Does not every american deserve a voice? Why should farmer joes vote count for 100 city folks votes?
It doesn't work like that, but I'll bite. Would those 100 votes even exist without Joe supplying them food?
Where do all the tax dollars that pay for all the farm subsidies come from? "$45.6 billion in calendar year 2020" Complaining about a City not being self sustaining is most brain dead comment I have seen in a long time. Its about having a diversified economy in the United States. Santa Clara doesn't have much farm land but is the headquarters of Apple, They bring in 16 Billion in Tax Revenue, But would we really complain you can't eat a smartphone?
I've failed to explain myself well enough. I'm not complaining about anything, I'm trying to get you to think about how cities came about in the first place. To facilitate trade. They are built around the farmer Joes that started trading there in the first place. The 100 people living there only came about from the trade that Joes were doing there. Same with Apple in Santa Clara, it's not self sustained, it's sustained by all the actual work the rest of Apple does.
100% of Americans trust bad statistics.
This the one
Nearly 73% of American believe poll statistics they see on the internet
If there is “so much evidence” for Trump winning in 2020. Why hasn’t anyone actually done something with that evidence? (Also remember, that even in 2016, Trump did not win the popular vote)
It’s not everyday an incumbent gains votes and loses. It’s not everyday the winner of the election loses most important bellwether counties. It’s more of a statistical anomaly. They made sure to subvert election law and shred the evidence.
Yes, it's not every day, elections happen every 4 year. There have only been like 60 (?) of them. So weird stuff happens. Like Trump losing the popular vote but winning the election. The bellwether county comment just shows complete political ignorance, the "swing" states/areas are constantly shifting. Ohio, Virginia, and Colorado were all once swing states, now they are not.
When was the last election when the incumbent gained votes and lost the presidential election?
Do you think they if something hasn’t happened before then it can’t ever happen? Are the only the things allowed to happen things that happened before?
Hmm. Well HW lost but he obviously got fewer votes because of Perot. Carter lost but there was a third party then. So when did the last incumbent lose a 2 party race? Do we have to go back to Herbert Hoover? See how dumb this is? You read some stat and never bothered to check, is this that crazy? It's really not. Incumbents usually win. Trump though was a particularly weak incumbent considering he barely won in 2016. Turnout was also depressed in 2016 because Hillary was more hated than Biden so it makes sense his vote total went up. And when incumbents are vulnerable (like HW or Carter) we've seen third parties seize their chances and run which siphons off votes.
So it doesn’t happen every day. Trump was so popular that he gained 10 million votes as the incumbent. Like I said in my first post, it’s the statistical improbability that the guy who was trailing in the Democratic polls became the most popular president in the history of the country. It can’t be that Trump was so unpopular because love trumps hate.
He was also so unpopular that way more people came out to vote for the other guy
Love trumps hate
When was the last election where it was made more convenient for people to vote without having to take time off work and stand in line for an hour or eight in the cold on a specific day?
Wait, is that how we choose Presidents? Can we get rid of the EC then, and just rely on vote totals? Here's how that happens: overall voter turnout goes up, and more of that additional voter turnout goes to the other guy. Easy.
Please tell me you aren’t actually this daft, this is the easiest thing to explain and comprehend that is irrefutable with actual numbers. There was a much higher voter turnout out in 2020 than in 2016, literally everyone got more votes because there were more votes cast.
You mean like the 2000 Mules thing? Well, the problem is that you would dismiss it. Why though? I mean I find it quite interesting and I don't have a ball in the game as I am not an American. But have you actually watched it? I mean if you are going to dismiss it, at least watch it first.
They didn’t do anything with that either. They made a bunch of money with a BS documentary and then sit on the “data” they claim to have used rather than making it public. If they had something they could have gone to court with it.
But they are doing something with it in the form of the True the Vote campaigns. You can disagree with it, but you can't say that there would be nothing and they aren't doing anything with it.
I've seen it. It's hot garbage. Here's a letter from True the Vote's own lawyers torpedoing the central claims in the documentary: https://www.gpb.org/news/2021/10/22/gbi-says-gops-cellphone-data-lacks-enough-evidence-prove-ballot-harvesting
Well if you read both the article you link and have seen the documentary, then you know that the article came out before the movie and that the movie actually addresses most of the objections in the article and actually shows the very evidence the article asks for. Like I said, I don't care about American politics - because in my humble opinion a lot of Americans from both sides like to jump to conclusions and at best selectively look at things to confirm their own bias that they already formed BEFORE looking at anything themselves.
>the movie actually addresses most of the objections in the article It literally does not. True the Vote never says how close someone needed to get to a drop box in order to be labeled a mule. They spend a lot of time talking about the accuracy of the data. However, the data could be accurate to the millimeter and it wouldn't change the fact that TTV *actively decided* to label anyone who came within 100 feet of ten drop boxes a mule. They could have been walking by on the other side of the street. >a lot of Americans from both sides like to jump to conclusions and at best selectively look at things to confirm their own bias that they already formed BEFORE looking at anything themselves. True. That's why I gave you the information TTV selectively left out of their documentary.
That's not what I am referring to. The main objection in the article is that there is no video footage of these people, which the film shows.
You mean the cherry picked footage of people dropping off ballots for themselves and family members, [like this guy,](https://www.fox5atlanta.com/news/georgia-false-ballot-fraud-dinesh-dsouza-film-2000-mules-lawsuit.amp) who is suing for defamation? They don't show a single person dropping off ballots more than once, and never more than a family-sized amount (4 or 5 tops). For someone who claims they want to understand topics fully, you haven't done [much reading on it.](https://apnews.com/article/2022-midterm-elections-covid-technology-health-arizona-e1b49d2311bf900f44fa5c6dac406762)
No, I haven't read on it at all, I have just watched it. You on the other hand have just read on it and haven't watched it cause the film does show the things you claim it doesn't show.
>You on the other hand have just read on it and haven't watched it I've seen it. But I would *love* for you to give the timestamp to disprove any of my claims: 1) where do they state how close someone needed to be to a drop box to be labeled a mule (hint: they don't) 2) where do they show CCTV footage of anyone going to more than one drop box? (Hint: they don't) 3) where do they show anyone dropping off more than 4-5 ballots in any state where people can't drop off ballots for their family members (where we might expect 4-5 ballots to be a reasonable amount). (Hint: you guessed it, they don't.) It would be exceptionally easy to prove me wrong *if these things exist in the documentary.*
I have seen parts of it. And think its weird that they didn’t do anything with it
>You mean like the 2000 Mules thing? Well, the problem is that you would dismiss it. I pass a ballot box that's in front of a library literally every weekday (And some weekend days) walking to my car. By their cellphone tracking criteria, I am probably one of their 2000 Mules. AMA!
So every day you go to a non profit organization dedicated to "voter inclusivity" and then you go to at least 10 different ballot boxes where public cameras record you putting several ballots into the each ballot box each time? Cause that's the criteria they use in the film and that's the video footage they show. So if that doesn't apply to you - then I don't mean to be presumptuous myself - but could the reason you didn't know that that was the criteria they use in the movie be because you might not really have completely watched the movie yourself after all? See, I really don't have an opinion on the matter, I just find it funny that Americans from both sides all seem to be so sure that they already know everything and have no need to actually look at things and feel completely confident that they can judge and even dismiss and even slander things that they didn't even look at themselves.
Popular votes irrelevant it’s not how your presidents are elected
It should be how they're elected. The electoral college is a relic of the past, a compromise made to appease the smaller states of the newly-founded Republic. Now, it just serves to allow a tyranny of the minority, with some people's votes mattering less and others mattering more. Edit: Averaged out, your vote is worth 0.62 in Texas and 2.52 in Vermont.
Absolutely untrue. We're a democratic republic, a representative democracy. We were never designed to be a full-on democracy. It isn't fair that CA and NY can decide the fate of the entire country, which is what would happen if we were strictly a democracy; the entire *purpose* of having states is to have some autonomy from a large federal government. United *States* of America, not United People of America.
>We were never designed to be a full-on democracy. Did anyone privy to this design ever say *anything* like that? I think the truth is, America's founding fathers just were not experts in electoral science. And if they saw how it's turned out, I don't think they'd say it's working exactly how they imagined.
It isn't fair to the people of Texas that a person in Wyoming holds ~~five~~ three times the power over them in deciding who the President is. Changing the system from an electoral to a popular vote still keeps us as a democratic republic and a representative democracy. Neither of those terms deal with how the President is elected, but rather how laws are decided. Literally every democracy on Earth is a representative one, with sprinkles of direct democracy here and there. Furthermore, a President doesn't have unlimited authority. There's nothing changing in the balance of power between the state and federal governments of power being redistributed back to the people. The electoral system is just a relic of the past that was necessary in order to keep the newly-founded Republic intact and has outlined its usefulness. The Civil War demonstrated that states do not have the right to secede on a whim, and there wouldn't be any push to secede if the popular vote is instituted other than from the elites that stand to lose from it.
People fail to remember that we are supposed to be 50 countries bound together by commerce & military which is why the electoral college makes sense and why states rights differ from the fed.
People don't fail to remember that. It's just irrelevant, now. States no longer hold the same nationalism that they had prior to the American Civil War, and much less the nationalism that they had when struggling to create a constitution. The same aristocrats and upper class that forced the electoral college compromise no longer exist. As outlined by the constitution, the rights of the *people*, not the *state*, are paramount, and the electoral college is trampling on the rights of the people by not making all votes equal. Concerning the election of the President, a representative of the *people* of the United States of America, not the states, a popular vote is far more fair than what we have now.
Well, when you don't like the electoral college you can just forge documents and enlist your own unelected alternate electors to disqualify the elected electors. Trump tried it in many states, that's included in his indictments
Hopefully he'll be found guilty for it when his trial starts in March.
Never should and never will happen, good luck
That ceased after the civil war.
The electors are based on population... so how does someone in Wyoming have 5 times the voting power? Texas has 40 electors to Wyoming's 3.
That's my bad. The website I was looking at was talking about midterm elections rather than the presidential election. Even so, the voting power is still unequal and in favour of the voters in Wyoming.
It doesn't matter. If we are going to believe that our votes count for jack shit... then we are doing ourselves a great delusional disservice. Your vote, your opinion, the policies you support don't mean shit to anyone unless you are a billionaire. The common folk in Wyoming are just as powerless as the common folk in Texas.
Now divide their populations by the number of electoral votes....
O.k. it's still not 5 times. As someone else pointed out... it's about state sovereignty. So the folks on the west coast and east coast can't just decide to flood Wyoming with illegal immigrants or some crazy bullshit like that... oh wait.
They can do that with or without the electoral college if you ask Texas. They’re just sending the immigrants to other states. Whats to stop pritzker from loading a plane in IL and sending them to Wyoming? If abbot and desantis can do it, pritzker and Hochul can do it, right?
The Federal government is suing Texas to stop them from authorizing state and local law enforcement to act as border patrol. Literally suing Texas to prevent them from protecting their own border. Fuck all the liberals and neo-cons that have done NOTHING to protect our border for several decades and who continue to fight AGAINST protecting it. Fuck them. I dream of the day they are all rotting in a prison.
Do the math son
I did. It's not 5 times. The point is moot anyway... no ones vote fucking counts anymore regardless of where they live unless they are a billionaire.
Still significantly more voting power by comparison, what's your point?
I updated my comment with my point.
Do you mean the people of Texas have 5x the voting power of people in Wyoming? Wyoming is 3 electoral votes and Texas is 40. Population of texas is 30 millions, Wyoming is 500k. In fact, going by the average rule of 1 elector per 500k population, Wyoming would be better represented with 1 vote and Texas with 60. I dont know if the number is only supposed to include adults of voting age, but regardless the outcomes would be the same but without 2-3 individual states *exclusively* choosing the President every 4 years without fail. And your comment about how a President doesn't have unlimited power has been basically proven false the last several Presidents, they seem to be able to do whatever they feel like doing for the most part using executive order or other sleazy workarounds.
I was looking at a website talking about the midterm elections rather than the presidential elections, so that's my bad. I corrected my comment. If it switches to a popular vote, the states become irrelevant. The only reason that a few individual states, like California and Texas, decide the election is because the electoral system makes most of the country irrelevant to the election and useless to campaign in.
Just move
You sound like that person who told homeless people to "just buy a house."
Well you can see how popular a president is by looking at that vote
The evidence has been put out there. Just gets censored and pegged as a conspiracy, like everything else that would interfere with the narrative. An astronomical amount of ballots were delivered to drop boxes by a very relatively small amount of people. This can be proven by GIS phone data that anyone can purchase (same way they were able to track down everyone from the January 6th event). There are videos of this happening, people shoving hundreds of ballots into drop boxes. Democratic donations to fund the Biden campaign went to purchasing drop boxes. Cameras on dozens of drop boxes were mysteriously turned off, or aimed just out of view. Tons of accounts of people saying they were paid to collect ballots from Indian reservations, homeless camps, mentally incompetent nursing home residents, etc… Not to mention covid restrictions set the stage for the drop boxes to even be an option. Twitter was censoring the hunter Biden accusations at the same time, which would have swung the vote even more!
Sources with full context and evidence of each of your claims?
You don’t have to believe what I’m saying. Look up “2000 mules”. They have plenty of sources on there. I’m not going to type out all of that.
The same reason nothing else justice-related happens. Because the deep state has gotten their people into most of the highest positions. And I'm no defender of Trump personally. I don't like Bernie Sanders but he got robbed too. Or I should say his voters got robbed.
Not one court heard fraud allegations in open court Still believe the Warren Report too?
Trumps legal team was scared to say the word fraud. Tough to hear fraud allegations without alleging fraud.
We have several instances of top Kraken lawyer, Rudy Giuliani, explicitly stating, in court, to judges, where you are under oath and lawyers are held to certain standards, that they were **not** alleging fraud. Why should a court be subject to an argument that the Trump team weren't making, since they knew that their case would be utterly destroyed if they tried that argument?
Not one trump appointed judge would hear the case because it lacks merit, the judge would still be a laughing stock today if they even entertained the case and it's lack of evidence.
List all the Trump appointed judges that refused to hear cases
Lol "If laws are ever broken, then why aren't the lawbreakers simply held accountable? Are they stupid?"
Wait, you think evidence actually matters in the end? That's cute lol Trump and Biden are both fascists, what's the difference?
> fascists I'll take terms that lost all meaning by 2024 for $100, Alex.
Just because you don't understand doesn't mean the rest of us don't.
Because BOTH sides hated him, not just the left. You burn so many bridges nobody wanted to help him when he actually needed it. I think he cashed in too many favors during the Russiagate bullshit, and a lot of republicans were probably more comfortable letting him go out to pasture. lol That’s just my take I have nothing to back that up. There was weird things that happened during the election but you could argue this stuff happens in every election.
But Republicans also set up a lane for him to return as POTUS, first to help Trump stay as POTUS, they launched a mass lawsuit to scotus to toss dem votes. Then Rs didn't vote to impeach & convict him for J6 which would've been well justified if they did. They refused to cooperate with Dems in Jan 6 investigations. Its just simple Trump lied about the election being stolen and Republicans weren't going to jeopardize themselves following his footsteps.
The election wasn’t stolen. You’re perpetuating nonsense, have fun
You think it's obvious the incumbent during the deadliest and most expensive year in American history that celebrates sex trafficking and demonizes Hispanics, blacks, and women obviously won. The Republican Party has only won the most votes once out of the past our of the last eight Presidential elections. But you think twice impeached, proven a rapist in court, grab em by the pussy and let a million Americans die lost by seven million votes. You think he obviously won. He was President. If he couldn't claim an election he actually won he must be less competent than "drink bleach" makes him sound.
Is there any proof as to why the election was rigged other than "the one I support lost therefore it must be"?
No, 40% are just gargling too much of Trump’s cock for the other 60% to have a chance at it
hahaha did just say that 100% of people want to gargle Trump's cock? What is the name of your fanfic erotica going to be?
Wouldn’t really matter who wanted to, there’s no room left🥲
I don't think that is a good title.
60% of Americans believe in the truth. Who would’ve guessed?
67%, not too shabby.
Not too shabby 👌
They surveyed 1000 people and 400 of them said that they believe the election was rigged. Now “40% of Americans” believe the election was stolen.
It was 33% if you actually looked at the poll
Hey man, this a “headlines only” type of community
Screenshots of headlines only
Screenshots of tweets of headlines only
That's typically how polls work, yes. Did you expect them to go to all 300+ million people individually?
Although it was a Rasmussen poll, and their methodologies are notoriously scrappy and lead to tainted results.
1,000 ÷ 340,000,000; get out your calculator and find out how insignificant and irrelevant the 1st number is in relation to the 2nd
Thats not how statistics work
My point is that it’s not an accurate representation of what all Americans think.
They also failed to mention that the poll was conducted at a Walmart in South Carolina.
It was like 4 years ago
This is just what they are ashamed of, that so many people believe it was rigged.
Who I ashamed? There’s only one reason people think it’s rigged and it’s because Fox repeated it enough times until they believed it
Despite knowing that to be a lie.
The Russian Propaganda Machine is working like a charm. Well oiled.
polls like that, and the headlines about it are used to form political opinions. It is psychological warfare 101. Humans like to align with the larger stronger group and their belief. Don't be a gullible NPC, please, always research for yourself.
The interesting thing about polls is that I don't know one person who's ever taken one
Glad to be apart of the majority
Bernie Sanders also had 10X bigger crowds than Hillary Clinton
All serious elections involve fraud, it's just a matter of how much.
They found less than 500 cases of fraud in battle ground states. For both trump and biden.
Who's they? The people who would want to cover their own ass? You have to be incredibly naïve to believe this propaganda. Mail in ballots were legalized and now they can commit as much fraud as they want. There's hundreds of videos on YouTube of people stuffing mailboxes of ballots - do you honestly believe those votes should count? Especially when ballots that were mailed in account for more than 70% of a candidates votes? 65 million ballots were "mailed in". Any number of those could have been harvested and cast legally which would (in any normal democratic reality) consist of deception. Even in this comment section there are plenty of folks saying voting doesn't matter. If they don't vote, their vote can be harvested. It's legal in several states. You can't prove fraud anymore because the feds worked to penetrate several states leadership to make it impossible. If you wanted to design a system to install whoever you wanted to continue the tyrannical agenda of a cabal, this is exactly what it would look like.
I personally think that since JFK, all presidents have been selected, not elected.
downvotes here show this isn’t a conspiracy sub anymore.
Heavily brigaded. Tyranny is a silent snake that eventually bites when everyone is asleep
Fbi working in twitter blocking anything anti biden when everyone stayed at home sounds like simple interference
Mail in ballots, as handled, didn’t help matters. Handled by the same party to spent the prior 4 years claiming Trump stole the election with Russia’s help (failing to provide any legitimate evidence).
No one said stole. Influenced. Which was confirmed by every intelligence agency we have, and a bipartisan Senate committee.
Can you direct me to the report that quantified the product of Russia’s conservative memes?
What is the source, a blog?
That many?
And more people than that believe that their parties politicians will fix things, when there are decades of evidence proving the opposite is true. Neither side of the table matters as far as our politicians go, because they’ve all been bought by the same corporations and answer to the same people. It’s time we accepted those facts.
Let it fucking go already. Both Trump and Biden are shit stains, there, feel better?
And that 40% is made up of 100% of the dumbest people currently in the US.
Do you people have ANY idea how hard it is to rig an election across several states and fake 7 million votes? It would require AT LEAST tens of thousands of co-conspirators on all levels of society and a cover-up so disproportional to anything done before that it's frankly unreasonable to believe that they managed to even set it up, let alone keep everyone involved from even off-handedly make a suspicious statement. And for what gain? To get one greedy, old corporate stooge in the pocket of the oil lobby out of office, so they can get another greedy, old corporate stooge in the pocket into office? The only difference is that Trump (and the Republicans as a whole) represent old financial interests such as US based steel and logistics companies and oil money such as the Koch brothers, and the Biden and the Democrats represent newer, more international financial interests such as Big Tech. The same major interests remain for both sides anyway, your Lockheed Martin, Raytheon, Goldman-Sachs, Unilever and the like, doesn't matter to them who's in office, whoever is there is going to do what they say anyway. No president can tell the military industrial complex to kick rocks, because that's the day the US loses their military hegemony, and no president can do it to Goldman-Sachs either, because they can without exaggeration tank the US economy whenever they want to. The reality is that Donald Trump is and was a buffoon who wanted to be president to stroke his own ego and dodge some tax and value fraud charges that were coming his way, and a lot of Americans bought into his promises of getting jobs back to places like Detroit, something that never happened, all the while Trump escalated with his anti-minority rhetoric, turning away minority votes while also losing the votes of the people who he promised jobs and never delivered. And that's not to mention that Trump over his four years as president lost all the meme value that definitely contributed to his vote results, especially in the cities.
You lost get over it it's part of life and something you need to learn to deal with
The number is actually lower and it's the Maga Republicans who don't Biden was legitimately elected.
Don’t think they’re wrong 😆
I just want to point out that the entire narrative on the right about stolen elections started with Donald trump who certainly has some narcissist traits such as lying… a lot…. For a while now. Even if your super far right maga guy I think you can still agree trump is quite the liar, arguably one of the biggest liars in modern politics. If you don’t agree I could follow this up with examples but my point is that it’s kind of ironic that people who think the election was stolen, blame others for believing lies. Maybe the election was rigged, we all have to remain open minded of that for…. Ever basically. But I’m not gonna overthrow our current system because I took the liars word for it. Not with the amount of drama on the world stage with Russia China.
Wonder what the percentage of people believed Joey B when he said take the vax and you won’t get Covid.
Wow... 40%? You Americans sure have a lot of right winged extremist terrorists... I mean at that rate, who knows... it might even be possible for someone like Trump to get elected legitimately, which in turn would indeed make it all the harder for his opponents to get elected legitimately...
Most likely they asked 10 people and 4 of them said they didn't believe it. I've never met a single person who's been polled ever and I've never been polled ever. Polls mean nothing...
I know exactly one person in real life who believes the election was rigged for Biden and I live and work in *Kentucky*
Well the trump worshippers all live in this sub. I work with people who love and worship trump and still think he lost the election.
The lies are OLDER and DEEPER than are superficially advertised. Edit: Advertising is perfectly legal; see Bernays and Coleman. It's a grand orchestration involving many secret societies, world leaders, and their agencies. It goes back quite a while. Some people have cataloged it well. Including the present power structures and who's pulling the strings? Have you read these? (https://archive.org/details/in.ernet.dli.2015.1607/page/n151/mode/1up) \\\\-Crystallizing Public Opinion - Bernays describes selling silks on pg 145. The black hand is ads. They're selling ideology, not silks. Gestalt, zeitgeist, and emotional investment. (https://drwho.virtadpt.net/files/The-Engineering-of-Consent.pdf) The Engineering of Consent - Edward L. Bernays (10 pages) (https://archive.org/details/conspirators-hierarchy-the-story-of-the-committee-of-300-dr.-john-coleman) CIA John Coleman: Conspirators Hierarchy the Story of the Committee of 300 - Coleman, \\\\\\\\\\\\\-\\\\\\\\-\\\\\-\\\-\\-\ This one!: The Tavistock Institute Of Human Relations: Shaping the Moral, Spiritual, Cultural, Political, and Economic Decline of The United States of America - Coleman, John https://archive.org/details/coleman-john-the-tavistock-institute-of-human-relations-1/mode/2up Tavistock - Coleman, 2005
Thank you! I think everyone should read/know of Bernays. That last link looks super interesting, will read soon
Our presidents have been hand-picked for decades. Your vote does not matter. Even if Trump won, he is no better than Biden. They are both terrible. It's literally "pick your poison".
Dumbest take by far
"Ya, you should just not vote for anything anymore. " The best propaganda to come out from the last election is convincing people they should just not vote in the next election.
Lincoln was left off of almost all southern state ballots, he still won because of the electoral college OUR VOTES MEAN NOTHING
Lincoln won the popular vote, even with ten southern states not having even put him on their ballots.
Why should California have more leverage than West Virginia? All of our elections would be won by California and New York and the rest of the country would have no say. We have an electoral college because each state gets equal say. UNITED states of America.
More people have more say. Duh. One man one vote
A vote in West Virginia is worth more than a vote in California and Texas, combined. State governments already have the power to dictate their own laws to an extent. Equalizing the votes between citizens wouldn't harm the balance of power between the federal and state governments, while it would allow for a fairer democratic system.
How about we abolish the government since they don't work for us or represent us anymore and leave it to state elections
This idea of a fraudulent election makes voting and democracy appear as real and under attack. Utter nonsense!! ...They all work together along with the media and act out this fake left vs right tension to divided and conquer.
It was unconstitutional for governors to change election procedures instead of the legislature as outlined in the Constitution.... But the that ultra right wing maga Nazi supreme Court said no one was harmed therefore there is no case.... Then said "you should have came before the election" So yeah I guess it was all legit
I don’t think it’s as low as 40% it has to be half of America or more
It's not even as high as 40%. Breitbart needed to pump up the numbers from 33 to make these deniers seem less extreme
A) I don't believe that statistic. Almost everyone by now, albeit reluctantly by some people, understands that Biden did not win that election. No chance in hell. B) the American revolution happened with about a 7-11 percent participation rate. 9 out of 10 people even back then were detached, checked out and uninterested in it.
So delusional. Where do you live man? The south clearly.
No, it's just the weirdos in their bubble who refuse to accept that even the people who sold them the lie that it was stolen have since admitted they were lying.
Another subreddit posted this, I was banned for saying he did steal the election.
i’m not a fan of orange man or alzheimer’s. it’s plain to see this election and plenty others have been fraudulent, including orange man’s first go around simply because hildawg is gonna get named on that little list that’s coming out. so instead, they give orange man four years, steal his next one, then drag him through court for bullshit because if he runs again he wins. joe won’t run, kamala will after she takes over sometime this spring.
Submission statement Rasmussen had a poll saying roughly the same thing only it was over half of Americans think he was illegitimate? Because I'm not sure I trust the Washington Post and the University of Maryland on this one. > The poll, published Tuesday by the Washington Post and the University of Maryland’s Center for Democracy and Civic Engagement, said 36 percent of Americans believe Biden was illegitimately elected. That number has risen five percentage points from 31 percent in 2021. By the way, this is how The Hill reported it: https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/4384619-one-third-of-americans-say-biden-election-illegitimate/ Link to article https://archive.ph/DQtzV
>The poll was conducted December 14-18 among a random sample of 1,024 adults, with an error margin of plus or minus 4.1 percentage points. So if that’s correct that’s not a bad margin of error, and the sample size is decent, but our population is so large the figures from the survey won’t really represent the population as a whole very well. There’s controls for that, and the most studies are capped at a 1000 anyway cause it’s usually good enough, but depending on the questions asked and the people polled, whether or not they took it seriously, etc. it’s pretty likely to be further off than the math suggests. I get why they do it this way, but it’s never very reliable at the state level, or if one state is overly represented.
Only 60%? We're making great progress!
The thing that’s always bothered me is the total vote. Usually went up 2-5 million a cycle. 2020 we get 25 million more?!?!?
Yes. Trump truly was so bad that he brought out folks who normally wouldn't vote. Trump lost bigly. Period. End of story.
Anyone else find it funny that no matter who gets elected 50% of the us will be pissed off.
That smirk says he doesn't care and will do any abonation they want and you cannot do anything about it.
All smoke and mirrors! The POTUS is installed not elected.
Theres no way it's only 40%. It was higher than that 1.5 years ago on a Rasmus poll.