Im shocked no one has put questions here.
Whats your best methods for using existing bills / expenses and counting it all towards eligible transactions?
Any cheats to just easily get a lump sum expense without actually spending anything
Top 5 Tips that not many people know?
To start off with I have a family of 5. So we have 3 kids. To reach a minimum spend of 3k to 6k a month is not too difficult for us. What I do, is as soon as I receive my new credit card, I will link it with my Paypal and Apple Pay. This way I can easily pay all my bills and any other ongoing payments with this card, as nearly everyone allows payments through Paypal. I then give the credit card to my wife so she can purchase everything from shopping to miscellaneous items on the card. You will be surprised how quickly the minimum spend will be reached this way.
If I can see I'm going to be short a couple of hundred dollars by the end of the month, I may buy a gift card, pay a bill on time or try and plan out any future bills. This is very rare as our normal monthly spend is enough for the minimum spend. I guess you could say I'm lucky in this case for credit card churning and it may not work so easily for others.
The top 5 tips that I would suggest people are the following.
1. Always ask for your annual fee to be refunded. You will save thousands of dollars over the year by not having to pay fees. This will make your credit card churning very profitable and worthwhile. It's super easy to do and I have a topic dedicated to this tip, as not many people know about it.
2. Track your credit cards using a spreadsheet of some type. On my website, I have available the one I use for free to download. Before I started using a spreadsheet, I had lost over $600 by applying for a credit card twice within 1 year and so on. So a bit of organization really pays off.
3. When applying for a new card, make sure you have the cancellation email or letter, and the credit card appears closed on your credit report. This is because sometimes the bank will say your card is closed, and the bank's app will show it's closed, but it is still pending closure. This will then still appear open when you do a credit enquiry for your next card and you may be rejected as it will appear you have multiple credit cards open. I had this issue twice with Westpac.
4. Don't change your spending habits to chase points. By doing this you will end up spending more than you normally would, negating any profits the points or rewards your signup bonuses give you. I can't overstate this enough. Credit is also not free money!
5. Don't get greedy and start to apply for too many cards as you can be rejected and your credit score may take a hit.
It varies. They can take upto 90 days from your minimum spend being hit. Usually, like 80% of the time, if you meet your minimum spend by your first statement period the points should drop on your first statement. If they haven’t, you will have to wait till the second statement, they won’t come somewhere in between statements. They always appear a day or two after a statement period.
>5. Don't be scared to apply for multiple cards a year, or worry you will be black listed or such rubbish that people say. This is not true and I am a living example of this. Also don't get greedy and start to apply for too many cards as you will be rejected and your credit score will take a hit. Just follow a system and be patient.
A few things:
* User mileage will vary. Your experience is not universal, every case is different, and lending criteria frameworks can be fickle (source: I used to develop them across multiple institutions).
* Credit scores are a sense check tool, not a silver bullet (it is not a metric that banks actually use). People with fantastic scores routinely get their applications rejected once other factors are applied (e.g. serviceability).
* For liability purposes, be weary of offering financial advice like this. That's a big no-no.
You’re right about offering financial advice which none of this is. I’m just giving my personal experience on a discussion forum. I probably should have worded my response differently.
>3. When applying for a new card, make sure you have the cancellation email or letter, and the credit card appears closed on your credit report. This is because sometimes the bank will say your card is closed, and the bank's app will show it's closed, but it is still pending closure. This will then still appear open when you do a credit enquiry for your next card and you may be rejected as it will appear you have multiple credit cards open. I had this issue twice with Westpac.
How did you get around your Westpac issue? I have recently cancelled with them and have a cancellation letter but it's still showing on credit report for example, so reluctant to apply for a new one in case of rejection. Currently sitting on 921 credit score according to Clearscore, so don't want to mess that up.
I was lucky enough that they let me hand in my closure letter via email when I asked for a review. However now I just wait till it appears closed on my credit report. Different credit reporting agencies update their reports at different times and this can cause an issue as well, as different banks will use different credit reporting agencies.
your account and website are really handy resources. Im only 20 and just beginning churning as I have started to earn decent income but determined to maximise potential value for as long as things like this exist. Just got my first 90k point bonus, your site helped me decide which to move onto after cancelling this one.
Your welcome, when I started churning there was very little easy to understand information about how to start and what to do. I don’t know all the fine details but I can only write about what worked for me over the years. If you want me to write about anything specific let me know and I’m happy to write a blog about it to help out. Once again appreciate your kind words and good luck on your journey!
Hi, I came across your posts, which are very helpful.
I just got my first credit card a couple of months ago. My credit limit is $16.5K, with no annual fee, flybuys reward type.
I just paid off my first statement in full last week.
My income is above $75k
I'm debating whether I should apply for another credit card with Qantas points now or I should wait for a few more months before applying for another one.
I would appreciate your thoughts on this.
Thanks again for sharing these tips.
Hi, I’m glad I was able to help.
First question, have you received your bonus and are ready to cancel your credit card?
As soon as you have cancelled and receive your letter/email of closure, you can apply for another credit card. You don’t have to wait any predetermined time. I have found no evidence that waiting, increases your chances to be approved for the next credit card.
I believe you should wait at least a month if you don’t get approved.
But it’s up to you. If you feel ready go for it, if not you can hold onto the card a bit longer.
Also how many credit cards do you have open at the moment?
My current card doesn’t have any bonuses. I only get flybuys points on every transaction I spend on this credit card.
This is the only credit card I have.
thanks for your advice.
I will try to find the way to downgrade the credit amount. It’s just a default amount they gave me when I applied for this card. I have never used up to that.
I don't know if you still monitor this, but what do you do with the AMEX bonus of $450 credit? Do you actually use this before you cancel? I'm stuck with our current AMEX because of this.
If you visit RWRDS[https://www.rwrds.com.au](https://www.rwrds.com.au) you can compare all the cards available with their different rewards and criteria. Maybe you can find something that suits your personal lifestyle and financial goals. Read all the T&C carefully for each card.
Hi OP do you know how long should I wait before I apply for credit card again after returning from mat leave? I applied for a NAB card before I went on leave, it took ages and they rejected it after running the credit check :/ my credit score is excellent and I always able to get a card no issue.
I’m my personal situation I only keep the card for a max of 4 months. So why should I pay for a year worth of fees if I only owned the the card for a couple of months. Seems logical to me.
Came here to congratulate you OP on your incredible post. Thanks heaps. I just churned ANZ Black Reward Points cashback card. Cancelled it today but there is a $150 credit on it.
I am in the market for a new card as we have
many household expenses coming up - new blinds and fridge. What would be good card for these? A bit onerwhelmed by the choices. frankly. Is there a “must get” card that really stands out - cashback or FF points?
Thanks again churners.
AMEX Qantas Ultimate highly recommend this one, however make sure you have not opened any other AMEX cards within the last 18 months or you will not be eligible for the sign up bonus.
Thanks for the very useful content. Quick question - if I already have an ANZ credit card, is there any additional risk of rejection if I apply for another ANZ card? I have ANZ Travel Rewards 6k Limit and Citi Rewards 10K limit. My salary is mid 100ks and credit score 731 (good).
Hi! Thank god I found you. I've been wanting to know for the longest time. Can you redeem the bonus points for the credit cards as much as you want throughout the year? Or you can only get those bonus points once every year?
I used a CC in November and redeemed the 70,000k bonus points advertised. Do I have to wait until November? Or I can apply for any CC and get those Bonus Points again? Does it have to be different cards? Different bank institutions?
If I get a Commbank CC and get X amount of Bonus points, I'm able to get a ANZ CC and receive X amount of bonus points at the same time?
Can you cancel a card after getting points etc and still use lounge passes? As in, can you get a certificate or something or do you still have to have the card in your possession when you enter the lounge?
When you receive your points or lounge passes which are now digital and they appear in your Qantas account, you no longer need the credit card. So you can cancel the card and it will not affect the points or lounge passes once they hit your Qantas account.
I’m late to the party and regret not having this done the first day I started to earn. If I had a Time Machine, I would go back in time and ask my younger dumb fuck to start churning like your life depends on it.
Anyway, I'm trying to close my Amex and St George cards now. I have initiated the closure , but I still have current month unbilled payments to be made.
My question is, when does the card actually gets closed? Is it when I actually pay off all the amount that’s due, including the current unbilled payment?
Ive only recently started churning and am wondering if i should soley focus on qantas points or are velocity points also worth considering, also is there any harm in keeping a card open (preferably a high accumulator) and churning a second card for the bonus introductory offers
I can’t recommend a method for you, I can just let you know that I always have 2 credit cards. I have a high point earning per spend backup card which I have had open long term and pay no annual fees as it’s bundled with my home loan and then churn a second card. This way in between churning I always have a credit card to use. This works for my personal situation, however your goals may be different.
I like to focus on one type of points which is Qantas, so I can accumulate faster and get points club plus with Qantas. But it’s up to you. Depending on which points program you prefer and what benefits you are after.
Tips for using Qantas points to help towards house deposit. Obviously, the best use of points is flights. I am taking a break from holidays until i can get my first property, are there any decent ways i can use my existing points to shave money off expenses, rent etc to get there quicker and save more of my paychecks?
There are different ways of doing this. Non of them abide by the airlines T&C and you can get your frequent flyer account shut down. You can always try churning bank specific credit cards and use the points earned from the bank as credit on your credit card. Not worth as much but can convert your points to a form of cash.
Hi There,
I am an international, currently on temporary visa and working full time. I am a big fan of your content. Since I am still pursuing my PR, I rarely go on trip. I have been accumulating bank points as opposed to FF points. I might change my strategy once I get my PR.
With the cost of living rising, I have been using sign up bank points bonus to redeem Gift card (mostly woolies). I find the conversion rate of Bank points is better for essential gift card (like groceries) than FF points (around 0.44 - 0.66 cents). I might be wrong since I never actually accumulate FF points via credit card or use my FF points so far.
So far I have always been opting for Bank points Black card rather than the FF one.
My question is:
1. In my case, is it actually better to accumulate Bank points than FF points? Or I am missing out on something here.
2. From what I understand after researching online, FF points is generally more valuable than bank points. I heard that you still need to pay tax on FF points when you redeem them for flights.
a. What's your personal favorite FF program and why? I would assume its Qantas but still keen to hear from you :)
b. For Oz to Asia travel (Japan/Korea), is Asia miles a better value than Qantas/Virgin? Most of my travel bucket lists are in Asia so it'd be good to know which FF program is the best one in this regard.
c. What's the best way to use FF points in your opinion?
Thanks again for your content and keep it up! 😊
Thank you so much for your kind words. To answer some of your question.
1. The only reason I collect FF points is because I use them to travel with my family for cheap. It’s almost like a way of budgeting in travel without spending money. That being said, during the 2 years of covid I switched primarily to banks points. The bonus of bank points is that you can basically redeem them for cash as gift cards or credit on your credit card.
I try to value my points based on 1c per point being good value. Anything above that is excellent and anything below that I would consider only if you have to. I used to sell points for cash and the going rate was 1c. So I could match that with bank pints than I would consider that good.
So for example if Citi offers 70k QFF points or 200k bank pints and the equivalent value of the bank points is $600 cash back then I would value the QFF points as more valuable as I could get 1c per point back which is $700. But if you don’t plan on flying then the bank points pose better value as cash back is instant and you don’t have to redeem gift cards ect.
Some credit cards offer large flybuys bonus offer as they are around $500 back in flybuys points which is easy to redeem as most people shop at Coles.
a. I like Qantas points as there is a lot of CC to churn offering these points. Also they offer more flights than Virgin ( Velocity ) even though their taxes are higher. All are worth collecting to be honest.
I booked at least 50 QFF seats in the last 18 months on points and the value has been over 2c for the majority of the bookings for me, occasionally far more than 2c also. Add to this, you'll also likely get points club plus, with free Qantas club and some other perks. So like you, I'd usually go for QFF, and realistically look at it like a 2c value.
Counterpoint - I prefer Velocity points as they can be transferred to Singapore Airlines Krisflyer points at 1:1.55. Award bookings are plentiful with Singapore Air, and taxes are very low (wife and I are flying Perth-Taiwan on business class on points soon. Have only booked one way so far, taxes were $205 in total).
Downside is there aren't quite as many credit cards & bonus offers available.
My question is why have you focused on earning qantas points? I can’t find premium (J or F) reward seat availability with qantas for a family of 4 or greater to travel internationally anywhere, ever.
I just decided to go with Qantas as I usually book economy anyways. I know it’s not the best use of points but what use is premium for kids. Qantas also offers more cards and has far more options then Virgin for flights and hotels. Lounge passes are great as well.
Mainly cause It’s easier to maintain one account. I have done velocity before but rather focus on Qantas.
Before I had kids I used to sell my points and Qantas got a better rate.
Fair enough. My strategy has been to earn flexible points like amex ascent premium that can be transferred to pretty much any airline or hotel program. Has worked well for me, and having the kids in J/F is sure a luxury, but I prefer to keep ‘em where I can see them!
You are right about AMEX points. I would collect those as well when it came to churning the AMEX rather than Qantas’s points. They are better value overall and gives more flexibility. I didn’t like the free Qantas’s flight especially if you were not planning on flying in the couple months you owned the card.
I prefer Velocity points as they can be transferred to Singapore Airlines Krisflyer points at 1:1.55. Award bookings are plentiful with Singapore Air, and taxes are very low (wife and I are flying Perth-Taiwan on business class on points soon. Have only booked one way so far, taxes were $205 in total).
Downside is there aren't quite as many credit cards & bonus offers available.
Started with an AMEX Platinum - big sign up bonus, flexible points and big perks. Not for everyone, but worth it for us.
This is all well and good until you need a loan for a mortgage. Then you'll get knocked back... There's a hidden credit score the banks don't tell you.
If you look at my blog [here](https://www.howtocreditcardchurn.com/post/do-credit-cards-affect-home-loan-applications), I got a mortgage no problems whilst me and my wife were credit card churning. Then I got a successful refinance as well with no problems last year. So no issues at all in my experience.
This is all based on your personal experience.
I can tell you from mine an a few others experience that this depends on the bank. Specifically smaller banks will care if you have multiple credit card apps.
Good idea on closing them before hand - this helps - however this as you mentioned also factors in your total capacity. For those with a larger LVR, many credit card apps will definitely hurt their chances of a mortgage.
Yes it is based of personal experience. Others have had the same experience as me as well so I know I’m not an outlier but I understand there’s people who have potentially had issues as well, just like with everything.
I have an amex platinum and paid for the annual fee. The reason why i signed up for it was because I was buying a place and managed to sign up for the bonus 220,000 points.
My goal is to fly business class with my partner. With this information, should i cancel the Amex platinum and sign up for a new card? If so, which one do you recommend. My salary is well above average.
AMEX offers a lot of other benefits that normal credit cards don't.
If you would like to fly business class then you need to start collecting points. The fastest way is to apply for credit cards for their signup bonuses.
Here is a websites to compare cards
[https://www.rwrds.com.au/](https://www.rwrds.com.au/)
I will ask for it when I cancel my credit card over the phone. Banks are under no obligation to do the refund. From my personal experience, more often than not, I will usually get a refund.
Do you also apply for the low rates credit cards to get the cash back bonus or exclusively the rewards ones?
And do you keep an account open in all those banks?
i’ve applied for amex explorer but then realised it cannot be transferred to QFF. my goal is to use it to gain reward points for travel. what’s your take on amex qantas vs amex explorer.
It all depends what kind of travel you want to do.
AMEX Explorer gives you around $500 worth of MR points sometimes which you can use as credit back to your credit card and also $400 travel credit which can be used for any hotels or flights and even experiences. So basically like $900 in potential credit for any travel needs.
AMEX Qantas if your accumulating Qantas points and are also planning to fly using Qantas as you receive a free flight credit as well.
Purely depends on your needs. I personally go with the Explorer when they have a large bonus and use a referral as it provides more flexibility.
Thanks for this thread and your YouTube videos. I've found them very helpful and hopefully I'll soon be able to go on a holiday with my family I couldn't otherwise afford. Appreciate all the time you've put in to sharing your knowledge.
Hello! Thank you for sharing your journey and learnings, it is so insightful and helpful to read.
I read in one of your blog posts that you hold two cards max at any time - your churn card and your long-term card. I wanted to ask what was the long-term credit card you have decided to hold? How long term are you talking - have you held this since the beginning of your journey or do you change this long term card every few months/years too? What was the factors that made your decide on that card?
Thanks!
I hold a commbank gold rewards card. I hold it as I have a wealth package with my home loan bundle and therefore don’t have to pay any fees on it as it’s covered by the package. I’ve held this card for about 5 years now. I plan on refinancing soon so will probably change and get a new credit card with a new bank.
Hi, do you keep an account open with all those banks or close the account when you cancel the card?
And do you apply also to the low rated CC to get the cash back bonus or only rewards/points CC?
I usually don’t open an account with any of the banks, expect if they offer a signup to do so. You don’t need an account to have a credit card with a bank.
I just apply for the biggest earning credit cards for points or cash back. I prefer points, but in the end what ever is more profitable for my personal needs. I don’t apply for low end or low rated credit cards as I only can take a limited amount of cards out per year, so I don’t want to waste time on taking cards out that don’t offer the most value I can get.
I'm a bit late to the post but I;ve got a question!
I;ve just started churning like 2 months ago? I had HSBC - closed that - applied Coles (took too long like over a month to approve, got sick and tired of waiting and applied NAB).
RN I have Coles and NAB (both together at $11,000 total). I;m wanting to close Coles too once my payment has gone through.
So my question is, when I closed HSBC, they said it may take up to 55 days for my account to close on credit report. Last I checked on credit savvy, it is still open. I wanted to apply ANZ Rewards Black this month. But because HSBC is still open, it appears as though I am currently holding 3 credit cards. I feel like this will make me be rejected. Should I wait until HSBC and Coles appears closed on my credit account before applying for ANZ?
I usually wait till it is showing closed. You can call up the bank and say you need to have it closed so that they close your accounts. I had to do this once. With 3 credit cards showing opened, it may be risky trying to open a 4th.
Thank you for the reply!
So usually, when you churn, do you always wait for the account to close on the credit file first before applying for a new one?
Yes. That’s correct. I have risked it on some cards cause a really good offer was expiring, but in general, especially in todays economic climate where it’s harder to get approved for credit cards compared to during covid for example, I try and play it safe.
Thank you so much. I was under the assumption that I could apply straight after getting a closure letter. Thankfully I realised that it doesn't reflect on my credit file immediately.
Appreciate your help :)
Hi,
I am relatively new to the cc churning but am glad I have started.
I only just came across this subreddit so in hindsight I may try to spread out my applications and make sure more accounts are closed before I apply.
I currently have 2 cc's open and am just waiting for my points to be awarded before I start the closing process (just saw the article of getting the annual fee refunded so I will try that when I do close.)
I just applied for a 3rd card (with Westpac) as I have some bigger bills coming up that would be good to pay on as new credit card as I have already met the minimum spend criteria on my first two cards. (I don't have a lot of expenses so a little harder for me to make minimum spends at times if I miss some bigger expenses aligning timewise)
So I applied for a 3rd and on the call one of the bank reps said they could see the two enquiries for credit on my file when they did the credit check but asked me specifically whether I had taken up the offers and for how much.
(From what I can see in my credit savvy app, I can see my two previous enquiries and I can also see only the first one as an open credit account, the 2nd cc I can't see as an open credit account (can see the enquiry though) but it is open and I have the card etc...) Not sure how much that differs from what they see.
I was just wondering whether I have to answer that question? (Or whether that's beyond the scope of what I legally have to disclose?)
Obviously it looks a bit odd I imagine if I am asking for a 3rd credit cards in under 2 months and ideally I wouldn't be doing that. And I imagine they would look more favourably on someone with a good score and limited accounts open. I wonder if legally I don't have to answer that or whether I do as part of their process?
Or if somehow they're trying to crack down on people churning cards and ask further questions to see if they can weed them out? (Pure speculation on my part)
I did let them know I had taken up the two offers and confirmed the credit limits on the cards but in retrospect wondering whether I needed to.
Appreciate any thoughts, cheers
Hi, too be honest, I have never experienced anyone asking me what credit cards I have held before or that I have had to many enquiries. Were you applying online and got a call back from the bank? Or did you call up to apply? The only time I ever get called up as part of my application is to check or confirm payslip information or the information I have for expenses is correct.
I don’t think you’re under any obligation to give that information out. Although as it’s up to the discretion of the operator he may decide you’re not being transparent with him.
Yes, I had an online application that they had called me back about and were getting clarity on the details of my income as well as to get details about 'proof of credit situation' (that's how it was worded in my app when I had a look just before)
Now that I think about it, I believe I had already disclosed that information in the online application too saying I had two credit cards and their limits.
So maybe they just needed verbal confirmation?
Still arrives at the potential dilemma of if I had or hadn't provided that info earlier and they asked on the phone whether I should have said:
a) I don't believe I'm under any obligation to tell you that (and either see see if the operator presses the point or have the scrutiny of them wondering why you would refuse to tell them. After all, I am only one customer and now seem more risky I imagine)
b) No, I didn't take the other credit cards up. And see if it potentially comes back to bite me.
c) Yes and provide the details and potentially disqualify myself from getting the current card based on too many cc applications in a short period.
d) Say yes in some other carefully constructed way that reassures them I am a good customer and they should approve my application.
Maybe I'll just call up a bank one day anonymously and ask them their legal obligations in relation to credit information.
I guess mainly I'm curious if there was a better way I could have responded in the moment along the lines of d). (assuming that I'm not obligated to provide that depth of information.)
>ne they would look more favourably on someone with a good score and limited accounts open. I wonder if legally I don't have to answer that or whether I do as part of their process? Or if somehow they're trying to crack down on people churning cards and ask further questions to see if they can weed them out? (Pure speculation on my part)
>
>I did let them know I had taken up the two offers and confirm
How did you end up going with this application?
In the end my application was denied. Now in the process of closing my other two cards now I have recieved points and waiting for them to show closed on file before applying again. A pity because the 100k Amex card looked so good.
I was pretty surprised they asked you that but will know now to prepare an answer in case I'm asked. I've found westpac/stg the most annoying to deal with, who either don't ask the right questions or don't ask at all and just auto declined an application.
Also I think it is probably better to wait 3 months due to your declined application and already had 2 cards in 2 months.
That's good to know. I'm curious to see how Westpac will go in the future for myself.
Yes, I think that is wise. I'm going to try to apply for another card around May or late April at this stage. Hopefully the time and limited applications in recent months will assist and getting back onto the churning path.
First off, I would just like to say how much I've appreciated you sharing your knowledge. As a novice churner, you have filled in so many gaps that I haven't considered.
Just got a quick question on applying for credit cards that I have held in the past:
I've applied for the NAB Qantas Rewards Signature Card, received the 120k bonus points and have cancelled the credit card.
Is there a wait time before I can apply for the same credit card and get the 120k bonus points again? Or is it that I can no longer apply for the same credit card to gain the bonus points?
OP maybe be able to offer some further info but I looked at the T&C's and found this:
"This bonus Qantas Points offer is not available to existing customers who have received or are entitled to receive NAB Qantas Rewards bonus points for a new personal NAB Qantas Rewards credit card in the 18 months prior to the opening of a NAB Qantas Rewards Signature Card or NAB Qantas Rewards Premium Card. This advertised offer of bonus points is not applicable or valid in conjunction with any other advertised or promotional offer."
So seems like 18 months after closing you could open again if they have a bonus points offer. (Also limits some other NAB Qantas cards)
Unfortunately fees are part and parcel of playing. All cards which give any type of bonus will charge a fee. Sometimes the first year fee is greatly reduced, but it’s very rare that they will make it $0 fee. It happens but very not often. Checkout [RWRDS](https://www.rwrds.com.au) website for all the deals.
It’s just including myself. This is over 7 years with an average of 6 credit cards a year. Started with less during my journey and peaked at about 10 credit cards during covid. On average I get about 500k+ points a year. Some years more some less. Depending on what rewards I opt in for.
Yes I would, as credit card applications don’t undergo checks to your partner you can both churn. In the last 4 years have had three kids so my wife has not been churning as often she has not been working as much. But I try to keep us both churning and then pool our points by transferring them.
what about your direct debits each time you change credit cards? I really want to start this but scared of my phone etc being cut off if i dont pay on time bcos my old card is cancelled and the new one hasnt come thru yet ? i see you said link paypal but that presents same issue .
I personally have two credit cards open at 1 time. This works in my own personal situation. One is a long term credit card with either no fee or low fee, in my case I have it linked to my home loan bundle so pay no fees but get rewards. I have all my direct debits (usually small amount) like Netflix and phone bills. All my other payments go through my other churning credit card. I also use PayPal to link my churning credit card so I don’t have to update more than one or two places with the new credit card which I churn.
Hi there, you mentioned you can buy gift cards to reach minimum spend. Theoretically could you open multiple credit cards, purchase gift cards with all of them to reach minimum spend and rewards, then sell these gift cards to your friends and family and use that money to pay off your credit card?
Sounds too good to be true. Is there a catch to that or anything I may have misunderstood?
You can buy gift cards to reach a minimum spend. However, usually each store only allows a certain amount of gift cards to be purchased per day. So you will theoretically have to buy these gift cards over a period of time especially if you’re trying to reach a higher minim spend such a a $6000. Not sure how easy it will be to sell $3000 or more worth of gift cards to family or friends. But if you can then yes this method would work I guess.
Any way for an American to churn QF points? Churning in AU seems much easier than in the US. Here, we can get shutdown by banks for canceling a card before we've had the card for 12 months, so it means that annual fees can really add up if you're not careful, since you are always paying the full fee for at least one year, and potentially two if you don't cancel fast enough after year one. I personally have $350 in Additionally, for airline miles, there's just not nearly as many cards as Qantas has available in Australia. We can transfer Amex points to Qantas points, and I did that for my most recent flight from Sydney back to the US, but the velocity is just so much slower.
Also hoping to live and work in Australia for at least a few years, so getting a healthy stockpile of QF points would be amazing.
Sorry don’t have any knowledge about this topic. I know on all the credit card applications it asks if you’re a permanent resident or citizen of Australia. Maybe post ut up as a question to see if the community knows.
I currently have 3 cards with $15k limits.
I tried getting a 4th (Amex) and got rejected (wouldn't tell me the reason).
Within the next 15-20 days, i will be able to cancel all 3.... How soon after that would be safe in order to apply for another (Not Amex... I believe I have to wait 3 months before I can re-apply)?
I can’t tell you when it will be safe as there are too many factors at play and I don’t know your personal circumstances. I wait till the credit card I have cancelled is showing closed on my credit report. Then I will try and apply for another one. This works in my personal situation.
I use credit savvy, I find they update your credit score as soon as there is a change to it rather than at the end of the month. It’s also free to use.
Im shocked no one has put questions here. Whats your best methods for using existing bills / expenses and counting it all towards eligible transactions? Any cheats to just easily get a lump sum expense without actually spending anything Top 5 Tips that not many people know?
To start off with I have a family of 5. So we have 3 kids. To reach a minimum spend of 3k to 6k a month is not too difficult for us. What I do, is as soon as I receive my new credit card, I will link it with my Paypal and Apple Pay. This way I can easily pay all my bills and any other ongoing payments with this card, as nearly everyone allows payments through Paypal. I then give the credit card to my wife so she can purchase everything from shopping to miscellaneous items on the card. You will be surprised how quickly the minimum spend will be reached this way. If I can see I'm going to be short a couple of hundred dollars by the end of the month, I may buy a gift card, pay a bill on time or try and plan out any future bills. This is very rare as our normal monthly spend is enough for the minimum spend. I guess you could say I'm lucky in this case for credit card churning and it may not work so easily for others. The top 5 tips that I would suggest people are the following. 1. Always ask for your annual fee to be refunded. You will save thousands of dollars over the year by not having to pay fees. This will make your credit card churning very profitable and worthwhile. It's super easy to do and I have a topic dedicated to this tip, as not many people know about it. 2. Track your credit cards using a spreadsheet of some type. On my website, I have available the one I use for free to download. Before I started using a spreadsheet, I had lost over $600 by applying for a credit card twice within 1 year and so on. So a bit of organization really pays off. 3. When applying for a new card, make sure you have the cancellation email or letter, and the credit card appears closed on your credit report. This is because sometimes the bank will say your card is closed, and the bank's app will show it's closed, but it is still pending closure. This will then still appear open when you do a credit enquiry for your next card and you may be rejected as it will appear you have multiple credit cards open. I had this issue twice with Westpac. 4. Don't change your spending habits to chase points. By doing this you will end up spending more than you normally would, negating any profits the points or rewards your signup bonuses give you. I can't overstate this enough. Credit is also not free money! 5. Don't get greedy and start to apply for too many cards as you can be rejected and your credit score may take a hit.
>Always ask for your annual fee to be refunded. Keen to hear more about this. Could you please share a link to your topic on it?
Sure here’s the [link](https://www.howtocreditcardchurn.com/post/everything-you-need-to-know-about-credit-card-annual-fee-refunds)
Thanks
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It varies. They can take upto 90 days from your minimum spend being hit. Usually, like 80% of the time, if you meet your minimum spend by your first statement period the points should drop on your first statement. If they haven’t, you will have to wait till the second statement, they won’t come somewhere in between statements. They always appear a day or two after a statement period.
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Yer no point checking.
What kind of success rate do you have with annual fee refunds? Do they ever give it to you at a pro rata rate?
So far it’s been 100% but I know now banks such as NAB are no longer doing refunds. All the other banks seem to still be doing refunds.
Is this recent, they did for me earlier this year?
Yer it’s from last quarter
>5. Don't be scared to apply for multiple cards a year, or worry you will be black listed or such rubbish that people say. This is not true and I am a living example of this. Also don't get greedy and start to apply for too many cards as you will be rejected and your credit score will take a hit. Just follow a system and be patient. A few things: * User mileage will vary. Your experience is not universal, every case is different, and lending criteria frameworks can be fickle (source: I used to develop them across multiple institutions). * Credit scores are a sense check tool, not a silver bullet (it is not a metric that banks actually use). People with fantastic scores routinely get their applications rejected once other factors are applied (e.g. serviceability). * For liability purposes, be weary of offering financial advice like this. That's a big no-no.
You’re right about offering financial advice which none of this is. I’m just giving my personal experience on a discussion forum. I probably should have worded my response differently.
>3. When applying for a new card, make sure you have the cancellation email or letter, and the credit card appears closed on your credit report. This is because sometimes the bank will say your card is closed, and the bank's app will show it's closed, but it is still pending closure. This will then still appear open when you do a credit enquiry for your next card and you may be rejected as it will appear you have multiple credit cards open. I had this issue twice with Westpac. How did you get around your Westpac issue? I have recently cancelled with them and have a cancellation letter but it's still showing on credit report for example, so reluctant to apply for a new one in case of rejection. Currently sitting on 921 credit score according to Clearscore, so don't want to mess that up.
I was lucky enough that they let me hand in my closure letter via email when I asked for a review. However now I just wait till it appears closed on my credit report. Different credit reporting agencies update their reports at different times and this can cause an issue as well, as different banks will use different credit reporting agencies.
Thanks for the quick response!
What do you use to check your credit report? I have WeMoney and it’s gives me score but not report?
I use credit savvy. I find it’s good cause it updates my credit report as soon as there is a change rather than at a certain time every month.
your account and website are really handy resources. Im only 20 and just beginning churning as I have started to earn decent income but determined to maximise potential value for as long as things like this exist. Just got my first 90k point bonus, your site helped me decide which to move onto after cancelling this one.
Your welcome, when I started churning there was very little easy to understand information about how to start and what to do. I don’t know all the fine details but I can only write about what worked for me over the years. If you want me to write about anything specific let me know and I’m happy to write a blog about it to help out. Once again appreciate your kind words and good luck on your journey!
Can you send me link please to your site for more detail on how to get started? :)
Here is a link to the getting started section https://www.howtocreditcardchurn.com/getting-started-credit-card-churning
Hi, I came across your posts, which are very helpful. I just got my first credit card a couple of months ago. My credit limit is $16.5K, with no annual fee, flybuys reward type. I just paid off my first statement in full last week. My income is above $75k I'm debating whether I should apply for another credit card with Qantas points now or I should wait for a few more months before applying for another one. I would appreciate your thoughts on this. Thanks again for sharing these tips.
Hi, I’m glad I was able to help. First question, have you received your bonus and are ready to cancel your credit card? As soon as you have cancelled and receive your letter/email of closure, you can apply for another credit card. You don’t have to wait any predetermined time. I have found no evidence that waiting, increases your chances to be approved for the next credit card. I believe you should wait at least a month if you don’t get approved. But it’s up to you. If you feel ready go for it, if not you can hold onto the card a bit longer. Also how many credit cards do you have open at the moment?
My current card doesn’t have any bonuses. I only get flybuys points on every transaction I spend on this credit card. This is the only credit card I have.
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thanks for your advice. I will try to find the way to downgrade the credit amount. It’s just a default amount they gave me when I applied for this card. I have never used up to that.
You can usually do it on their website/app although sometimes you have to call them directly and request it
I don't know if you still monitor this, but what do you do with the AMEX bonus of $450 credit? Do you actually use this before you cancel? I'm stuck with our current AMEX because of this.
I'm not OP but the answer is yes, just use the credit to book a flight and then cancel the card (wait for the $450 reimbursement first of course).
Is this something that could be done on a smaller spend? Say 3-4k per month? I'm looking to get into this and learn
If you visit RWRDS[https://www.rwrds.com.au](https://www.rwrds.com.au) you can compare all the cards available with their different rewards and criteria. Maybe you can find something that suits your personal lifestyle and financial goals. Read all the T&C carefully for each card.
Hi OP do you know how long should I wait before I apply for credit card again after returning from mat leave? I applied for a NAB card before I went on leave, it took ages and they rejected it after running the credit check :/ my credit score is excellent and I always able to get a card no issue.
On what grounds would I even ask for my annual fee to be refunded ?
I’m my personal situation I only keep the card for a max of 4 months. So why should I pay for a year worth of fees if I only owned the the card for a couple of months. Seems logical to me.
Thanks very much! Worth a try
Came here to congratulate you OP on your incredible post. Thanks heaps. I just churned ANZ Black Reward Points cashback card. Cancelled it today but there is a $150 credit on it. I am in the market for a new card as we have many household expenses coming up - new blinds and fridge. What would be good card for these? A bit onerwhelmed by the choices. frankly. Is there a “must get” card that really stands out - cashback or FF points? Thanks again churners.
AMEX Qantas Ultimate highly recommend this one, however make sure you have not opened any other AMEX cards within the last 18 months or you will not be eligible for the sign up bonus.
I cannot get even one credit card
Thanks for the very useful content. Quick question - if I already have an ANZ credit card, is there any additional risk of rejection if I apply for another ANZ card? I have ANZ Travel Rewards 6k Limit and Citi Rewards 10K limit. My salary is mid 100ks and credit score 731 (good).
Hi! Thank god I found you. I've been wanting to know for the longest time. Can you redeem the bonus points for the credit cards as much as you want throughout the year? Or you can only get those bonus points once every year? I used a CC in November and redeemed the 70,000k bonus points advertised. Do I have to wait until November? Or I can apply for any CC and get those Bonus Points again? Does it have to be different cards? Different bank institutions? If I get a Commbank CC and get X amount of Bonus points, I'm able to get a ANZ CC and receive X amount of bonus points at the same time?
Can you cancel a card after getting points etc and still use lounge passes? As in, can you get a certificate or something or do you still have to have the card in your possession when you enter the lounge?
When you receive your points or lounge passes which are now digital and they appear in your Qantas account, you no longer need the credit card. So you can cancel the card and it will not affect the points or lounge passes once they hit your Qantas account.
Thanks!
I’m late to the party and regret not having this done the first day I started to earn. If I had a Time Machine, I would go back in time and ask my younger dumb fuck to start churning like your life depends on it. Anyway, I'm trying to close my Amex and St George cards now. I have initiated the closure , but I still have current month unbilled payments to be made. My question is, when does the card actually gets closed? Is it when I actually pay off all the amount that’s due, including the current unbilled payment?
Ive only recently started churning and am wondering if i should soley focus on qantas points or are velocity points also worth considering, also is there any harm in keeping a card open (preferably a high accumulator) and churning a second card for the bonus introductory offers
I can’t recommend a method for you, I can just let you know that I always have 2 credit cards. I have a high point earning per spend backup card which I have had open long term and pay no annual fees as it’s bundled with my home loan and then churn a second card. This way in between churning I always have a credit card to use. This works for my personal situation, however your goals may be different. I like to focus on one type of points which is Qantas, so I can accumulate faster and get points club plus with Qantas. But it’s up to you. Depending on which points program you prefer and what benefits you are after.
Thanks very much
Thanks very much
Tips for using Qantas points to help towards house deposit. Obviously, the best use of points is flights. I am taking a break from holidays until i can get my first property, are there any decent ways i can use my existing points to shave money off expenses, rent etc to get there quicker and save more of my paychecks?
There are different ways of doing this. Non of them abide by the airlines T&C and you can get your frequent flyer account shut down. You can always try churning bank specific credit cards and use the points earned from the bank as credit on your credit card. Not worth as much but can convert your points to a form of cash.
Hi There, I am an international, currently on temporary visa and working full time. I am a big fan of your content. Since I am still pursuing my PR, I rarely go on trip. I have been accumulating bank points as opposed to FF points. I might change my strategy once I get my PR. With the cost of living rising, I have been using sign up bank points bonus to redeem Gift card (mostly woolies). I find the conversion rate of Bank points is better for essential gift card (like groceries) than FF points (around 0.44 - 0.66 cents). I might be wrong since I never actually accumulate FF points via credit card or use my FF points so far. So far I have always been opting for Bank points Black card rather than the FF one. My question is: 1. In my case, is it actually better to accumulate Bank points than FF points? Or I am missing out on something here. 2. From what I understand after researching online, FF points is generally more valuable than bank points. I heard that you still need to pay tax on FF points when you redeem them for flights. a. What's your personal favorite FF program and why? I would assume its Qantas but still keen to hear from you :) b. For Oz to Asia travel (Japan/Korea), is Asia miles a better value than Qantas/Virgin? Most of my travel bucket lists are in Asia so it'd be good to know which FF program is the best one in this regard. c. What's the best way to use FF points in your opinion? Thanks again for your content and keep it up! 😊
Thank you so much for your kind words. To answer some of your question. 1. The only reason I collect FF points is because I use them to travel with my family for cheap. It’s almost like a way of budgeting in travel without spending money. That being said, during the 2 years of covid I switched primarily to banks points. The bonus of bank points is that you can basically redeem them for cash as gift cards or credit on your credit card. I try to value my points based on 1c per point being good value. Anything above that is excellent and anything below that I would consider only if you have to. I used to sell points for cash and the going rate was 1c. So I could match that with bank pints than I would consider that good. So for example if Citi offers 70k QFF points or 200k bank pints and the equivalent value of the bank points is $600 cash back then I would value the QFF points as more valuable as I could get 1c per point back which is $700. But if you don’t plan on flying then the bank points pose better value as cash back is instant and you don’t have to redeem gift cards ect. Some credit cards offer large flybuys bonus offer as they are around $500 back in flybuys points which is easy to redeem as most people shop at Coles. a. I like Qantas points as there is a lot of CC to churn offering these points. Also they offer more flights than Virgin ( Velocity ) even though their taxes are higher. All are worth collecting to be honest.
I booked at least 50 QFF seats in the last 18 months on points and the value has been over 2c for the majority of the bookings for me, occasionally far more than 2c also. Add to this, you'll also likely get points club plus, with free Qantas club and some other perks. So like you, I'd usually go for QFF, and realistically look at it like a 2c value.
Counterpoint - I prefer Velocity points as they can be transferred to Singapore Airlines Krisflyer points at 1:1.55. Award bookings are plentiful with Singapore Air, and taxes are very low (wife and I are flying Perth-Taiwan on business class on points soon. Have only booked one way so far, taxes were $205 in total). Downside is there aren't quite as many credit cards & bonus offers available.
My question is why have you focused on earning qantas points? I can’t find premium (J or F) reward seat availability with qantas for a family of 4 or greater to travel internationally anywhere, ever.
I just decided to go with Qantas as I usually book economy anyways. I know it’s not the best use of points but what use is premium for kids. Qantas also offers more cards and has far more options then Virgin for flights and hotels. Lounge passes are great as well. Mainly cause It’s easier to maintain one account. I have done velocity before but rather focus on Qantas. Before I had kids I used to sell my points and Qantas got a better rate.
Fair enough. My strategy has been to earn flexible points like amex ascent premium that can be transferred to pretty much any airline or hotel program. Has worked well for me, and having the kids in J/F is sure a luxury, but I prefer to keep ‘em where I can see them!
You are right about AMEX points. I would collect those as well when it came to churning the AMEX rather than Qantas’s points. They are better value overall and gives more flexibility. I didn’t like the free Qantas’s flight especially if you were not planning on flying in the couple months you owned the card.
I prefer Velocity points as they can be transferred to Singapore Airlines Krisflyer points at 1:1.55. Award bookings are plentiful with Singapore Air, and taxes are very low (wife and I are flying Perth-Taiwan on business class on points soon. Have only booked one way so far, taxes were $205 in total). Downside is there aren't quite as many credit cards & bonus offers available. Started with an AMEX Platinum - big sign up bonus, flexible points and big perks. Not for everyone, but worth it for us.
This is all well and good until you need a loan for a mortgage. Then you'll get knocked back... There's a hidden credit score the banks don't tell you.
If you look at my blog [here](https://www.howtocreditcardchurn.com/post/do-credit-cards-affect-home-loan-applications), I got a mortgage no problems whilst me and my wife were credit card churning. Then I got a successful refinance as well with no problems last year. So no issues at all in my experience.
This is all based on your personal experience. I can tell you from mine an a few others experience that this depends on the bank. Specifically smaller banks will care if you have multiple credit card apps. Good idea on closing them before hand - this helps - however this as you mentioned also factors in your total capacity. For those with a larger LVR, many credit card apps will definitely hurt their chances of a mortgage.
Yes it is based of personal experience. Others have had the same experience as me as well so I know I’m not an outlier but I understand there’s people who have potentially had issues as well, just like with everything.
I have an amex platinum and paid for the annual fee. The reason why i signed up for it was because I was buying a place and managed to sign up for the bonus 220,000 points. My goal is to fly business class with my partner. With this information, should i cancel the Amex platinum and sign up for a new card? If so, which one do you recommend. My salary is well above average.
AMEX offers a lot of other benefits that normal credit cards don't. If you would like to fly business class then you need to start collecting points. The fastest way is to apply for credit cards for their signup bonuses. Here is a websites to compare cards [https://www.rwrds.com.au/](https://www.rwrds.com.au/)
Does the Amex points transfer to qantas based on your experience? Ill have a look at the ANZ right now
AMEX Platinum does transfer to Qantas. The other non-Qantas only cards like the Explorer and Platinum Edge do not.
which anz card should i get for qantas points you think
Choose one from here based on annual fee vs points https://www.rwrds.com.au/qantas
How exactly do you get the annual fee refunded? Ask them when applying?
I will ask for it when I cancel my credit card over the phone. Banks are under no obligation to do the refund. From my personal experience, more often than not, I will usually get a refund.
Do you also apply for the low rates credit cards to get the cash back bonus or exclusively the rewards ones? And do you keep an account open in all those banks?
i’ve applied for amex explorer but then realised it cannot be transferred to QFF. my goal is to use it to gain reward points for travel. what’s your take on amex qantas vs amex explorer.
It all depends what kind of travel you want to do. AMEX Explorer gives you around $500 worth of MR points sometimes which you can use as credit back to your credit card and also $400 travel credit which can be used for any hotels or flights and even experiences. So basically like $900 in potential credit for any travel needs. AMEX Qantas if your accumulating Qantas points and are also planning to fly using Qantas as you receive a free flight credit as well. Purely depends on your needs. I personally go with the Explorer when they have a large bonus and use a referral as it provides more flexibility.
Thanks for this thread and your YouTube videos. I've found them very helpful and hopefully I'll soon be able to go on a holiday with my family I couldn't otherwise afford. Appreciate all the time you've put in to sharing your knowledge.
Hello! Thank you for sharing your journey and learnings, it is so insightful and helpful to read. I read in one of your blog posts that you hold two cards max at any time - your churn card and your long-term card. I wanted to ask what was the long-term credit card you have decided to hold? How long term are you talking - have you held this since the beginning of your journey or do you change this long term card every few months/years too? What was the factors that made your decide on that card? Thanks!
I hold a commbank gold rewards card. I hold it as I have a wealth package with my home loan bundle and therefore don’t have to pay any fees on it as it’s covered by the package. I’ve held this card for about 5 years now. I plan on refinancing soon so will probably change and get a new credit card with a new bank.
Hi, do you keep an account open with all those banks or close the account when you cancel the card? And do you apply also to the low rated CC to get the cash back bonus or only rewards/points CC?
I usually don’t open an account with any of the banks, expect if they offer a signup to do so. You don’t need an account to have a credit card with a bank. I just apply for the biggest earning credit cards for points or cash back. I prefer points, but in the end what ever is more profitable for my personal needs. I don’t apply for low end or low rated credit cards as I only can take a limited amount of cards out per year, so I don’t want to waste time on taking cards out that don’t offer the most value I can get.
I'm a bit late to the post but I;ve got a question! I;ve just started churning like 2 months ago? I had HSBC - closed that - applied Coles (took too long like over a month to approve, got sick and tired of waiting and applied NAB). RN I have Coles and NAB (both together at $11,000 total). I;m wanting to close Coles too once my payment has gone through. So my question is, when I closed HSBC, they said it may take up to 55 days for my account to close on credit report. Last I checked on credit savvy, it is still open. I wanted to apply ANZ Rewards Black this month. But because HSBC is still open, it appears as though I am currently holding 3 credit cards. I feel like this will make me be rejected. Should I wait until HSBC and Coles appears closed on my credit account before applying for ANZ?
I usually wait till it is showing closed. You can call up the bank and say you need to have it closed so that they close your accounts. I had to do this once. With 3 credit cards showing opened, it may be risky trying to open a 4th.
Thank you for the reply! So usually, when you churn, do you always wait for the account to close on the credit file first before applying for a new one?
Yes. That’s correct. I have risked it on some cards cause a really good offer was expiring, but in general, especially in todays economic climate where it’s harder to get approved for credit cards compared to during covid for example, I try and play it safe.
Thank you so much. I was under the assumption that I could apply straight after getting a closure letter. Thankfully I realised that it doesn't reflect on my credit file immediately. Appreciate your help :)
Hi, I am relatively new to the cc churning but am glad I have started. I only just came across this subreddit so in hindsight I may try to spread out my applications and make sure more accounts are closed before I apply. I currently have 2 cc's open and am just waiting for my points to be awarded before I start the closing process (just saw the article of getting the annual fee refunded so I will try that when I do close.) I just applied for a 3rd card (with Westpac) as I have some bigger bills coming up that would be good to pay on as new credit card as I have already met the minimum spend criteria on my first two cards. (I don't have a lot of expenses so a little harder for me to make minimum spends at times if I miss some bigger expenses aligning timewise) So I applied for a 3rd and on the call one of the bank reps said they could see the two enquiries for credit on my file when they did the credit check but asked me specifically whether I had taken up the offers and for how much. (From what I can see in my credit savvy app, I can see my two previous enquiries and I can also see only the first one as an open credit account, the 2nd cc I can't see as an open credit account (can see the enquiry though) but it is open and I have the card etc...) Not sure how much that differs from what they see. I was just wondering whether I have to answer that question? (Or whether that's beyond the scope of what I legally have to disclose?) Obviously it looks a bit odd I imagine if I am asking for a 3rd credit cards in under 2 months and ideally I wouldn't be doing that. And I imagine they would look more favourably on someone with a good score and limited accounts open. I wonder if legally I don't have to answer that or whether I do as part of their process? Or if somehow they're trying to crack down on people churning cards and ask further questions to see if they can weed them out? (Pure speculation on my part) I did let them know I had taken up the two offers and confirmed the credit limits on the cards but in retrospect wondering whether I needed to. Appreciate any thoughts, cheers
Hi, too be honest, I have never experienced anyone asking me what credit cards I have held before or that I have had to many enquiries. Were you applying online and got a call back from the bank? Or did you call up to apply? The only time I ever get called up as part of my application is to check or confirm payslip information or the information I have for expenses is correct. I don’t think you’re under any obligation to give that information out. Although as it’s up to the discretion of the operator he may decide you’re not being transparent with him.
Yes, I had an online application that they had called me back about and were getting clarity on the details of my income as well as to get details about 'proof of credit situation' (that's how it was worded in my app when I had a look just before) Now that I think about it, I believe I had already disclosed that information in the online application too saying I had two credit cards and their limits. So maybe they just needed verbal confirmation? Still arrives at the potential dilemma of if I had or hadn't provided that info earlier and they asked on the phone whether I should have said: a) I don't believe I'm under any obligation to tell you that (and either see see if the operator presses the point or have the scrutiny of them wondering why you would refuse to tell them. After all, I am only one customer and now seem more risky I imagine) b) No, I didn't take the other credit cards up. And see if it potentially comes back to bite me. c) Yes and provide the details and potentially disqualify myself from getting the current card based on too many cc applications in a short period. d) Say yes in some other carefully constructed way that reassures them I am a good customer and they should approve my application. Maybe I'll just call up a bank one day anonymously and ask them their legal obligations in relation to credit information. I guess mainly I'm curious if there was a better way I could have responded in the moment along the lines of d). (assuming that I'm not obligated to provide that depth of information.)
>ne they would look more favourably on someone with a good score and limited accounts open. I wonder if legally I don't have to answer that or whether I do as part of their process? Or if somehow they're trying to crack down on people churning cards and ask further questions to see if they can weed them out? (Pure speculation on my part) > >I did let them know I had taken up the two offers and confirm How did you end up going with this application?
In the end my application was denied. Now in the process of closing my other two cards now I have recieved points and waiting for them to show closed on file before applying again. A pity because the 100k Amex card looked so good.
I was pretty surprised they asked you that but will know now to prepare an answer in case I'm asked. I've found westpac/stg the most annoying to deal with, who either don't ask the right questions or don't ask at all and just auto declined an application. Also I think it is probably better to wait 3 months due to your declined application and already had 2 cards in 2 months.
That's good to know. I'm curious to see how Westpac will go in the future for myself. Yes, I think that is wise. I'm going to try to apply for another card around May or late April at this stage. Hopefully the time and limited applications in recent months will assist and getting back onto the churning path.
First off, I would just like to say how much I've appreciated you sharing your knowledge. As a novice churner, you have filled in so many gaps that I haven't considered. Just got a quick question on applying for credit cards that I have held in the past: I've applied for the NAB Qantas Rewards Signature Card, received the 120k bonus points and have cancelled the credit card. Is there a wait time before I can apply for the same credit card and get the 120k bonus points again? Or is it that I can no longer apply for the same credit card to gain the bonus points?
OP maybe be able to offer some further info but I looked at the T&C's and found this: "This bonus Qantas Points offer is not available to existing customers who have received or are entitled to receive NAB Qantas Rewards bonus points for a new personal NAB Qantas Rewards credit card in the 18 months prior to the opening of a NAB Qantas Rewards Signature Card or NAB Qantas Rewards Premium Card. This advertised offer of bonus points is not applicable or valid in conjunction with any other advertised or promotional offer." So seems like 18 months after closing you could open again if they have a bonus points offer. (Also limits some other NAB Qantas cards)
Thanks for this u/InternalWheel8540 Looks like banks may have different time frames
So where is the best place to find the best reward credit cards. Everything I look there's always fees and I don't want to be paying fees
Unfortunately fees are part and parcel of playing. All cards which give any type of bonus will charge a fee. Sometimes the first year fee is greatly reduced, but it’s very rare that they will make it $0 fee. It happens but very not often. Checkout [RWRDS](https://www.rwrds.com.au) website for all the deals.
Awesome thanks for the info!
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It’s just including myself. This is over 7 years with an average of 6 credit cards a year. Started with less during my journey and peaked at about 10 credit cards during covid. On average I get about 500k+ points a year. Some years more some less. Depending on what rewards I opt in for.
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Yes I would, as credit card applications don’t undergo checks to your partner you can both churn. In the last 4 years have had three kids so my wife has not been churning as often she has not been working as much. But I try to keep us both churning and then pool our points by transferring them.
what about your direct debits each time you change credit cards? I really want to start this but scared of my phone etc being cut off if i dont pay on time bcos my old card is cancelled and the new one hasnt come thru yet ? i see you said link paypal but that presents same issue .
I personally have two credit cards open at 1 time. This works in my own personal situation. One is a long term credit card with either no fee or low fee, in my case I have it linked to my home loan bundle so pay no fees but get rewards. I have all my direct debits (usually small amount) like Netflix and phone bills. All my other payments go through my other churning credit card. I also use PayPal to link my churning credit card so I don’t have to update more than one or two places with the new credit card which I churn.
Hi there, you mentioned you can buy gift cards to reach minimum spend. Theoretically could you open multiple credit cards, purchase gift cards with all of them to reach minimum spend and rewards, then sell these gift cards to your friends and family and use that money to pay off your credit card? Sounds too good to be true. Is there a catch to that or anything I may have misunderstood?
You can buy gift cards to reach a minimum spend. However, usually each store only allows a certain amount of gift cards to be purchased per day. So you will theoretically have to buy these gift cards over a period of time especially if you’re trying to reach a higher minim spend such a a $6000. Not sure how easy it will be to sell $3000 or more worth of gift cards to family or friends. But if you can then yes this method would work I guess.
When do you ask for the annual fee to be refunded? As you are closing or after?
As I am closing.
Any way for an American to churn QF points? Churning in AU seems much easier than in the US. Here, we can get shutdown by banks for canceling a card before we've had the card for 12 months, so it means that annual fees can really add up if you're not careful, since you are always paying the full fee for at least one year, and potentially two if you don't cancel fast enough after year one. I personally have $350 in Additionally, for airline miles, there's just not nearly as many cards as Qantas has available in Australia. We can transfer Amex points to Qantas points, and I did that for my most recent flight from Sydney back to the US, but the velocity is just so much slower. Also hoping to live and work in Australia for at least a few years, so getting a healthy stockpile of QF points would be amazing.
Sorry don’t have any knowledge about this topic. I know on all the credit card applications it asks if you’re a permanent resident or citizen of Australia. Maybe post ut up as a question to see if the community knows.
Has anyone had luck getting a refund on the annual fee? I just tried with ANZ and they refused.
just tried with NAB and they refused. Said they will only pro-rata if you hold for more than 12 months.
I couldn't get a refund on my ANZ Black Rewards points card as a cashback promo of $150 was applied. Tough luck.
I currently have 3 cards with $15k limits. I tried getting a 4th (Amex) and got rejected (wouldn't tell me the reason). Within the next 15-20 days, i will be able to cancel all 3.... How soon after that would be safe in order to apply for another (Not Amex... I believe I have to wait 3 months before I can re-apply)?
I can’t tell you when it will be safe as there are too many factors at play and I don’t know your personal circumstances. I wait till the credit card I have cancelled is showing closed on my credit report. Then I will try and apply for another one. This works in my personal situation.
And what’s the best/fastest way of checking your score?
I use credit savvy, I find they update your credit score as soon as there is a change to it rather than at the end of the month. It’s also free to use.
Appreciate your advice mate