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Unless you have some kind of physical deformity, you can make yourself more attractive. Sorry to say pal, but I think you just may not be putting in the effort. Self care is hard work most people don’t bother with.
I’m gay and doing perfectly fine, but most men are not about to be getting hit on by women in public. That’s exceedingly rare. If the average guy puts in effort, he will have normal experiences and get a few dates sure, but it won’t be a miracle like it seems to have been for this guy.
I can agree to some extent on this. I will say as a small caveat, as a bisexual man, I can confirm that attraction from other gay men is a low bar (in my experience)
I will concede that fashion is an obvious spend not everyone can make. However, haircut, a razor, exfoliator and moisturizer, are all well within reach. On the high end I could MAYBE spend 100$ on these things and that’s accounting for if I went to a male stylist in my area for a cut. As for weight, going for a run doesn’t cost a thing and cardio is a great way to lose weight. If you want to build muscle, budget weight sets are out there, but you could even just watch the ABripper X video for free online. All my friends in college got their abs from religiously doing that routine and it didn’t cost a cent.
I’ll reword what I said slightly and include a health issues such as eczema. I don’t want to call it a deformity per se, but again, a friend from high school had very bad eczema and he just put in the work to commit to a routine. These methods don’t break the bank by any means. Even I have acne and I get accutane, which cost me about 60$ a month. I’m on a 6 month course with a 98% success rate so about 360$ to clear my acne. Again accurate is painful and hurts but it kills the acne, however, dealing with acne in 6 months for 360$ is a bargain in my opinion and I’m happy to make the sacrifice for my health.
While I agree that physical attractiveness is the most important thing to attract women, there is a limit to how attractive you can become. If you are tall, and thin, and a decent face, you can become really attractive by working out and dressing nicely. But a short man isn't going to suddenly become a lady's man just by doing these things.
That’s tricky. A good looking short dude won’t have to worry about attracting someone. There will be women who avoid them, but they probably won’t notice.
Because there are far more parameters like location, race, social network etc that also matter, which the OP left out. Yeah, taking care of yourself helps, but it's not a ticket to dating success.
Nope - not above average maybe 1 point like from a 4 to 5. Men, need to be at least a 6.5 and that is not realistic so men give up. An average man is 4-6 out of ten. There are men that are also at a 1-3. I’m a 3 lol.
This! Absolutely this! I’m like a 2, so I get it. It’s hard. I take care of myself, get a nice hair cut, shave my raggedy beard into a nice goatee (which is what fits my face best, I know goatees are supposedly considered unattractive as I’ve been told before but it fits my face perfectly) and I get people telling me they liked my hair long, they wish I didn’t cut it, I get told I should have kept growing my beard out, or that I was attractive before but how I’m just “ok” so it’s hard to do what this guy says and still be successful, it’s not a guarantee. Not to mention, I live in a town where the only places considered fun are bars. The last, only, place of fun, an axe throwing place with a pool hall inside, shut down. So there’s nothing else in my town. Hard to meet people when there’s nowhere to go.
However, for men it’s my unsolicited advice that’s it’s beneficial to date outside of your race and culture. Allegedly, over 60 percent of African American females are single. African American females are really the silent backbone of our country and get the least amount of credit for their suffering. They are loyal,
Full of heart, spiritual and martyrs for many causes of humanity. Men need to wake up and become who you really are - human beings with love
Most guys are average, though. Maybe you're saying above average, but that's a fallacy to say 97% of guys aren't average. And just assume most are slobs with no self-care or maintenance.
At the same time though a 9 could scale down to a 7 if they aren’t maintaining their hygiene. Imagine being a very average man that works out takes care of his facial hair and hair and wears the right fitting clothes.
Okay here’s the thing, there is a certain threshold of attractiveness that you HAVE to meet to even get a seat at the table. After that, other factors matter but if you don’t get a seat at the table that’s that lol
Absolutely but what table are you trying to sit at to begin with? Are your a 5 trying to sit with the 10's? Or are you a 5 trying to sit at the table with the 7's? A 5 can clean up nice enough to sit with the 7's but you're going to need plastic surgery, muscles, letters after your degree such as PHD/MD, proper etiquette, and money if you want a seat with the 10's. So, you can consider it settling by cleaning up enough to sit with the 7's or you can stay with the 5's. Ugh, I can't believe I had to resort to using that bs number cray to explain something lol
OP is doing well. The only way I can get 200 matches in a day is when I go to New York or Los Angeles for work and I'm in a gigantic new city with a million women who haven't seen me yet.
BUT he is correct about everything he says. Lose weight, dress nicely, get in the habit of talking to strangers, wear cologne. I would also add: develop the skill of banter, and learn how to flirt. But those skills come in handy after you've already attracted the girl to you in the first place.
Yeah, OP didn't word the title of the post very well. He said "being attractive is everything", but really his post is saying "being good looking is everything".
When he gives tips about becoming more attractive the only advice he gives is about improving your appearance (and your smell). He doesn't talk about improving your charisma, social skills, ability to flirt, which is also a critically important part of being attractive.
This. I have met many men who at first impression were not "my type," but after speaking to them, having a lively back and forth banter, and observing their charisma and confidence in themselves, have gone out with them, and subsequently found them *very* attractive, whether I was initially interested or not.
You will never get you foot in the door for those things if you don't improve your looks first. Focus on the things he mentioned first and work on the rest later. There is more than enough attractive women dating guys with zero personality and social skills to back this up.
>You will never get you foot in the door for those things if you don't improve your looks first.
Not necessarily, there's men who are not conventionally good looking but still have a girlfriend. Having said, that as a man there's no downside to improving your looks, so might as well do it.
>Focus on the things he mentioned first and work on the rest later.
Just do both at the same time.
>There is more than enough attractive women dating guys with zero personality and social skills to back this up.
There's also above average looking men who can't keep a woman interested because they're socially awkward / unable to create chemistry. There's two sides to the coin.
Mmm, it's possible, but not on a continual basis. What happens is that when you first light up the app, you are exposed to a lot of new people. But after a few days, most if the active users have seen you, and the rate of matches declines significantly.
I've never gotten 200 in a day, but I've gotten over 100 before. But as I said, that was NYC and LA. Most people don't live in cities that large. And after 3 days, I'm only getting a dozen or so per day even in NYC.
its not even about the quantity, its the way he talks about it. and further, i also don't believe he's "very selective" but getting 200 matches in that time frame because tht implies he's swiped through thousands of profiles in under 48 hours in the first place and i don't think that that comprots with "very selective" vs the time period.
This feels like a grift, just like dropshipping is.
Lol my ex made a Tinder account using pictures of some physically perfect supermodel for funsies and got over 200 likes that day. A third of those profiles were sketchy. So I definitely don't believe that he matched with 200 gorgeous women lol. As a moderately attractive girl I used to get that many when I was on there. Let me assure you it's not the paradise it sounds like.
I like that you put 'dress nicely' versus 'trendy' like OP. I love when my man dresses in HIS style, but in his nicer clothes versus his beat up oil stained or grass stained clothes. A nice pair of Dickies and a Dixxon flannel or he has this one plain t-shirt that I love. The color is very flattering on him and it fits his chest and shoulders well.
>Lose weight, dress nicely,
TBH as far as men go when you figure out the hairstyle/facial hair combo that works best for you, you look proportionately fit for your frame, and you make/care about your clothes looking nice you instantly level up to 6.5 or 7 or 8 depending.
Getting all that nailed down for a man really ups their attractiveness by a huge amount.
It's almost like night n day.
I can absolutely clean up with online dating matches but the last time a woman flirted with me in real life, George W Bush was president. I dress well, am 6'4" and in good shape. I make a lot of money.
I get heaps of compliments on my style, my shoes, my truck, my boat, all sorts of personal style choices. Never a compliment on my looks and never ever a compliment from women ages 22-49. Almost all from men and 55+ women.
The huge blocker for me is that I'm invisible to dating prospects in real life and when I approach women they are always surrounded by friends so the whole "she smiled at you now go talk to her" is never a real setup. She never smiles because she's talking to her girl friends and never sees me, and I never approach because it's too hard going 5 on 1.
I've found that no amount of getting hotter will get me attention in a bar or overcome the fact that women are almost never alone. But it will work on the apps.
I can lose all the weight in the world, I can wear the nicest suits in the world and most expensive cologne, and can be the life of a the party. It doesn’t change the fact that my face just isn’t an attractive face
As a guy you can grow facial hair. Women can't change their face. Makeup only does so much. Most people date someone who matches them on a 1-10 scale. Go up or down 2 on the scale.
Being “ugly hot” is a thing. Coming from a 22F, we definitely like unique facial features when the rest of the man looks fit and put together nicely. I have learned one thing in my life about people and its that almost 99% of everyone is not actually ugly at all. You really gotta have seriously messed up genes to be cast aside when you put in effort
I agree on everything except the EVERYTHING part.
99% of people have some degree of agency with their looks. I am currently doing a lot of the stuff you said, too. But this by itself will not get you very far, depending ok what you're after.
Dating isn't a fashion show, and it should not be treated as such.
It is also important to carry yourself properly. This is extremely important and should not be left to chance.
This applies to women as well. There are some women that men find hot AF, me included, but in retrospect, if you look at them, they don't have a particularly pretty face or even the greatest body out there.
However, they dressed well and treated themselves as if they were already supermodels. This approach works, and I am trying to pull something similar off for myself as well.
Precisely. Attractiveness means nothing if you don’t carry yourself and present yourself in the right way. Confidence outweighs the outside factors imo.
Yeah, and those are the basics that are just regular human practices in everyday life. Confidence, not being needy, and developing an attractive lifestyle are things that should be pointed out.
Yes, an average woman is just as visual as an average man (obviously there are exceptions on both sides), they are just afraid to admit it so as not to be considered superficial. Perpetuating the myth that men are more visual than women does nothing except harm both men and women.
(Only one study showed that men were more visual than women, but even those found fairly small differences. Newer research on this topic seem to indicate that there are no differences between women and men in this regard, men are simply more willing for cultural reasons to admit that they like someone physically. Source: [1](https://www.mindbodygreen.com/articles/men-not-more-visual-or-easily-aroused-than-women-research-shows) and [2](https://www.pnas.org/doi/full/10.1073/pnas.1904975116).)
Good advice from a man. If you're a guy, don't go based on what women say. They tell you how they want you to be after they already decided they want you. Big difference from advice on how to get noticed in the first place.
Yeah women give some of the worst advice you can take as a man. They mostly imagine that women are easier to talk to and impress than they are. Women can give really great fashion advice tho, I used to have a friend i'd call when I went shopping to help me pick things out, she got me some of my best pieces in my wardrobe when I had no clue where to look
I matched with a guy on Hinge and we met up for coffee.
He was wearing a Castlevania t shirt and wrinkled khaki cargo shorts. His beard was unkempt, he had grossly long uncut finger nails. Unwashed hair. He just overall looked like he didn’t give a shit.
It’s wild how many guys show up to dates like they don’t even care to be there.
TBH I'm glad there's dudes out there setting the bar so low like that because in the long run it makes my job a whole hell of a lot easier, lol.
That's kinda crazy that homie thought showing up like that was acceptable though. Why is there such an epidemic of dudes out there who apparently weren't taught that they have to wash their ass before they go outside these days tho? :P
**edit: a word.
>Why is there such an epidemic of dudes out there who apparently weren't taught that they have to wash their ass
The media and double standards. When a man literally doesn't wash his own ass it is indicative he has parents/guardians who never held him accountable for properly cleaning himself.
It's usually the women who are conditioned from day 1 to value their appearance, especially if they want to earn the affection and attention of a man, and keep him. Whereas men are conditioned that they can be "as is" and people will accept them, regardless of how unkempt he is. That's exactly why OP is currently experiencing this revelation, they seemed to be an attractive person who simply wasn't taking care of himself n his appearance
That makes a lot of sense. I’m a man but I’m quite attractive and yet I’m insecure about my looks because my whole life they were commented on (positively) and I was hyper aware that people really do pay attention to looks, similar to why women are more aware of it too. I go to a lot of effort to be as presentable and clean and good looking as possible even if I’m just going to the supermarket. It sounds vain and theatrical but as a teenager I would panic and be on the verge of tears if I had a bad pimple or my hair was sitting badly.
I think it goes both ways though because traditionally women have been told that all you have to do is show up lookin cute and men are expected to just give you things.
But it's a vicious cycle because on the one hand you have these guys who get convinced they're entitled to everything they want without having to put much effort into it simply because they're a man ( like you said ), and then the women are told the very same shit from the other direction- only they aren't promised all the power and wealth and dominance a man is...
Good news is I think with younger and younger generations there's more and more of a pushback against all these backwards ass ideas and these notions of how men ( straight white ones specifically ) should just be handed the keys to the world and all it's power and resources.
Sorry but that is myth as well. Society will very easily discard man that is not so good looking and doesnt take good care of himself. Sure, people will pull up with him because they got to but anything deeper is out of the question.
I understand some women will go with that but lrts face it, they are an outliers. Women used to walk away from guys that are in much better position.
I don't see why my personal opinion has to be invalidated as a myth, simply because you don't agree.
Just going outside n observing ppl, especially in social places it's easily seen that women date all types of men. You don't only see modelesque men walking around w women.
If you surround yourself with women and hear of their dating experiences, many share they've been on dates and have even dated men who are not hygienic and are unkempt. I think this is because the media n society conditions dudes that the pretty girl will accept them because he's a man.
We see this in all kinds of film n TV. Considering the leads/protagonist is most often a white heterosexual male. The male viewers internalize this n assume this is how real life is too. Look at all those coming of age rom coms like the Breakfast club, Pretty in pink, She's All That, Cant hardly wait, 10 things i hate about you etc. All these films perpetuate no matter how a man is, whether he's an asshole, a nerd w low self worth, an over confident jock etc. that he will always get the girl.
Oh yes tell me about it. My first ever friendly meeting with a man is that he came 1 hour late, wore oversized stained shirt, oversized pants, unkept beard, and worse of all he stank like he didn't took a shower. Got traumatized by it and I've never been out on a date ever since then
Crazy how many guys are here focused on why you went to meet with him/matched with him instead of focusing on the guy coming to that date like that. It's like they think we don't have common sense yet they can't put two and two together that he would've looked better on the pictures he put up on his profile.
Guessing they can't even grasp the concept of it lol. They can't even look at the answers you've given to the other people asking the exact same question they are, they probably never even took the time to care to look at a bio
Looks only scratches the surface in dating. Many times I've been into dudes simply because he's handsome and caught my eye, but once we started talking, his personality brought me back down to earth.
Yes it's wonderful to reel in all the likes, but having the personality and mindest to keep a woman, as a girlfriend or wife goes beyond looks
No, I understand the point loud n clear, yall think it's all about the looks, but in reality looks aren't everything.
Looks don't cultivate meaningful connections
Looks don't make dating any easier, it just gives u more options
Looks don't make great connections last long-term
It really is true. I was walking with one of my friends who is decent attractive. These like soccer moms keep coming up to try to talk to him, but he's married so we just keep walking. He asks me what I don't to dodge the women like that... Had to explain to him that that doesn't happen to guys like me..
Wish women admitted this about men. I felt completely invisible until I started hitting the gym and dressing better. I'm so tired of hearing them say looks don't matter and that as long as he's nice and interesting, they'll want to date him..
Whilst I agree being attractive is the single most important factor to get your foot in the door and gain initial interest, it does not help you take things to the next level.
Being attractive does give one more romantic/social opportunities to hone their charm/wit/social skills, though.
They're separate things, but there's some correlation between them.
Lotta cope in these comments. What you say is 100 💯 percent true.
Women are no more paragons of relationship virtue than men are. Women are just as "shallow" as the next guy.
Looks matter a fuck ton. Without attraction, everything else about you? The vast majority of women could care less (depending on the circumstances)
It's true, but the thing that gets left out all the time is the fact that that's only going to get you your foot in the door with most people. Maybe you'll get some booty too, but in the long run if you're boring or an asshole you're still going to be lonely and alone.
I haven’t read the comments but I’d imagine the not so attractive guys are having issues? All those things OP stated are for guys who have potential. If someone like me maxes out my looks, I’ll get a lot of attention, but I guy who’s short and not so attractive in the face? Idk man.
Kind of. But even someone not conventionally attractive may slightly improve their chances by doing some of the things mentioned in the post. To use your example, a short guy that is stylish will stand a better chance than a short guy who presents as a slob.
I suppose it’s about any improvement at all. You can’t change height and you can’t change facial deformities (without surgery). However, my friend is like 5’7” and he looks amazing. His height has never affected his ability to date because he puts in the work elsewhere.
I’m a 5’11” 170 lb white guy, so these tips work for me because I’m the baseline lol. But I will say as I’ve said before, barring deformities anyone can look handsome with the effort.
Edit: typo.
The amount of men who aren’t even doing the bare minimum would put you miles ahead even if you are “ugly”. (I don’t really think anyone is so ugly they’re beyond help.)
Edit: forgot the second half of my thought LOL
I’m assuming you’re a woman? Yes, the reality is, most guys don’t do much. No skincare routine, lack of fashion, unhealthy physique, and an uninteresting life.
It doesn’t take much for a guy to standout but it takes a lot of work for many and that’s really what holds the majority back.
Idk as a woman I feel like there’s “conventionally attractive” and then there’s “what I’m personally attracted to”. It’s a Venn diagram and sure there’s some stuff in the middle but also a bunch of stuff on either side
And how do you expect me to do this when I barely have the motivation to shower everyday??
That also just sounds like ***A LOT*** of work for just a small chance at a little success. I'm 20 and I'm not gonna be working on myself constantly until I'm 22 just to have a small chance at having people approach me
And wtf even are "trendy" clothes?? Like button-downs and polos and whatnot? Cause you're hilarious if you think I'm gonna wear that on a daily basis or even more than twice a year. They're vehemently uncomfortable and have zero personality
you're overthinking it and also probably depressed from the sounds of it. I know some dudes personally who have never been in a relationship since middle school and are now 25, stay home all day, and get their excitement from PC games and doordash. not saying you'll end up like this, but you need self awareness if you desire more from life.
its not a lot of work, and most the time it wil benefit yourself before it benefits anyone else. its like that poem, dont go quietly into the night. either you figure for yourself you need to "fight" or you just agree to the life you're given. i've been ugly and extremely depressed in my life before, i've also been hyperfocused on improvement and dating before. i've been most happy somewhere in between
I think your personality and attitude is the problem man. You sound like a downer to be around and you seem to be mad that the solution to your perceived problem isn’t what you want it to be. If you can’t even shower then why are you dating, you need to fix your mental health. Start by leaving the house, getting sun, then extend how far you walk for etc
I workout and I do have a morning skincare routine and also a nighttime skincare routine. Unfortunately, I was born with deformities so doing all this is kinda pointless. I will never be able to find a haircut that fits my face. Even though I make sure all my clothes are clean and well fitted, I will never look good in them. I will always look like shit.
So what do I do? I can't afford surgery
I just do gym since a year and I must say I did get a lot of difference but now I have no money since no job I am a student so no fashion clothes , but can you tell me what type of skin care brand's I can buy that is not that expensive but also quite good ?
It ain’t EVERYTHING, but it will get you noticed and increase your potential partners 10x. I know guys who are 5/10 looks wise but have hot wives and girlfriends because their self-confidence, humor and charisma are all 8/10. If you don’t have those ratings on any of those then you’ve got no hope unless you look like a 7+ in the looks department, or a narcissists or sociopath who can manipulate their way into relationships, but you don’t want to be that.
But generally speaking, achieving all his bullet points will help you considerably and improve your confidence, maybe not enough if your social kills are non-existent, but you’ll at least get noticed. I can’t talk to Women i’m attracted to for shit, everyone else sure, I can banter and crack the funnies. But because i’m relatively attractive and very fit every now and then the odd hot girl will take the plunge and do the work for me. If I were overweight, poorly groomed and dressed lazily (so your average redditor gamer) then i’d stand no hope.
By the way I think it’s funny I’m an older guy in his 40s. I have two friends that are essentially millionaires with all their wealth and assets and even they have a difficult if not impossible time. When we go out they dress like a normal guy and not any fancy pants, style or clothes and we never talk about money or buy women drinks but women judge a book by the cover (what a man wears - his shoes, shirt, pants, belt, perfect hair style). Since, almost all women ghost them it’s so funny because they are going overseas to find women. American women (not western women because Spain, Italy and Portugal, Netherlands are so cool) in general are way way way way to materialistic and into physical appearance so much that it is a turn off. To be fair, most men really look for women who are sexually attractive (for me I am a psycho creep and like plus size women with curves lol).
Not necessarily perfect and thin but sexually attractive which is like
The lowest bar you can think of and
Still they can’t find a woman lol. I’ve been kicked out of bars (only in America) for talking to women with millionaire men present. It’s just so so funny- it’s just so humorous. I can’t make this up but you have to laugh as we are conditioned by our peer group and society. Just so so so so funny
Not 100% but 90% for sure, people stay in abusive relationships just cause their partner looks good. You’d be surprised how much people are willing to sacrifice for good looking people; one of my pals was willing to relocate states, change careers, and date a single mother despite his dating preference to be in the same borough of NY and to not date people with children. Thank god it ended in incompatibility because he was ready to change his entire life for one albeit attractive and fit woman.
Being attractive is extremely important, but it really isnt everything
Im attractive, and have honestly tried to rely on that on some dates when i was a little tired and not super into it. Its worked, but definitely not always
Getting 200 matches isnt hard if youre attractive (in a high population area that is, took me about a month to get that in a low population area), but who cares about matches if you dont get dates
What about height buddy , how can we change that , BTW ,WHAT IS THE BARE MINIMUM HEIGHT TO DATE , I am working on myself and I know i can make myself attractive because I got some privilege
Some of that is just a test by women, you need your wits about you to over come it or don't attempt it. As for minimum height, you're right, you can't change it but being taller than they girl you approach helps even if its not 6' tall. So I would say some where around 5'8"-5'11" would put you 3"-6" taller the average woman.
I literally wrote the same thing in another subreddit.
It's as much as looking attractive and the confidence that comes with it.
Looking attractive = Looking Healthy.
And clothes/haircut/skin/smell are some parametters we can control.
I would add to that list : Your teeth. Get them clean, do some braces if they look like a mess. It's expensive, but worthy.
Attractiveness is enough to sleep with girls, but not to get a girlfriend. Imo, girls are attracted by your appearance but fall in love with your personality, the way you make her feel, the way your carry yourself and treat her.
Wish guys admitted this about women. I was totally invisible to men until i started working out and wearing more makeup. Im so tired of them saying looks dont matter and as long as she has interest in them they’ll want to date her
People in general care about looks WAY more than they can admit because nobody wants to seem shallow and guys know 'I don't care about looks' is what women want to hear, so they say that shit even when we all know it's a goddamn lie, lol.
And women gaf way more than they actually say they do too. Both sexes are doing the same shit because most people can't seem to scratch beneath the surface and are incapable of reading people and intuiting how they actually feel.
In 30+ years of life as a man, I have literally never heard a man day this.
I have however heard men say that “every woman can get a man”. That is 100% true.
The disconnect seems to be that women interpret this as ‘every woman can get a man [that they want]’ that is not true.
I've seen 200lb women say she only wants gym bros and use a one-night stand with a gym bro as evidence of her having a realistic chance at a long term relationship.
What she didn't understand is while they may exist, they are rare. Additionally, she would have to compete with every other 200lb woman who wants a gym bro. There are more of her than the chubby chasing gym bros.
Women's wants and “standards” keep them single.
Yeah idk if my personality drives them away or what but every man that I want becomes a man I can’t get even if it seems like he was on board initially lol
I can usually tell within five minutes of meeting a woman, why she is single. In all fairness, I can tell within five minutes for men as well.
I don't know you, but I'm willing to bet, if you don't know the reason then you don't have anyone willing to be honest with you.
Its not a standards thing, bud. I didnt have the wild standards you assume all women have. I went for average and below average because i thought those guys wouldn’t reject me and they still did, of course until i changed my looks
I don't know why you personalized my response? I was just telling you that by in large men don't make the statement that you claimed they do.
Then I further explained what you more than likely have heard. Then I gave examples.
None of it was about you.
However, because you said:
> I went for average and below average because i thought those guys wouldn’t reject me and they still did
There appears to be a disconnect here. You may be devaluing the men you are encountering.
Example: I spoke to a woman once who said she went on a date with a guy and she wasn't sure if she was settling.
She said, he's handsome, a multimillionaire at 35, into fitness, in great shape, fun personality, but he was 5’7.
This woman was the epitome of average. In looks, salary, personality, etc. Conversely, he was above average in every metric with the exception of height and she felt she would be settling.
Again, I'm not saying this is you exactly, but you may be devaluing the men for something small.
Men absolutely care about looks in women. For most men it's one of their top considerations.
However, men don't all like the same thing. Most guys like the women who are mainstream hot but also have some other type(s) they go for. These can be things that women might consider flaws but some guys find them super hot. Some guys like super short or tall women. Some guys like big hips and butts. Some guys like really skinny girls with no curves. And so on.
So what you can take away from this is
1. Stop being fucking poor ...you're too poor for women
2. You're fat
3. Just look better women love people who look better than you
4. Shower, ...you stink
5. Do the exact opposite of what you're doing now
This guy deserves a trophy for how he solved everyone's problems...lol
Username checks out. I also am proof your theory is incorrect. I am not attractive and I got a lot of dates. It's about having BDE. All the things you stated will only get you the shallow of the shallow women. The REAL women respond to BDE.
It's not just about being "attractive" sure you might look hot at a glance. But you gotta have the confidence to go with it.
If you don't have the confidence you can carry yourself very wrongly.
On top of that you gotta know how to "talk the talk"
I've seen "attractive" guys completely fail because they don't project themselves well at all.
Then it splits into 2 categories.... Women who ignore the signs and just ooze over an attractive douchebag.
Or the women who see they're attractive but don't have what they want/need so they avoid....
True and all those women who do find a man who makes money are quick to jump ship if that same guy gets laid off or isn’t able to make the exactly the same amount in the future.
A man could be making 80k a year but some women who make slightly higher would reject him even though he makes a great living.
The same women who are lucky enough to find a man who takes care of them are the same ones who will lie cheat and repeat at a moments notice.
Loyalty is not important to a woman. They are quick to jump ship at first sign of stress.
The best thing a man could do for himself is to do what makes him happy and not let his happiness be tied to a woman.
Women are never happy and never satisfied. All they want is more.
I’ll need to downvote this . It’s not everything and this comes across as a very narcissistic post . I am fortunate to have what some deem as good “ physical genes “ . I’m tall 6’1 , fit , green eyes and what some would deem as “good looking “ but to say that it is everything is simply not true and just plays to the stereotype and perpetuates the stigma that you need this to get dates/land a great partner . I’ve seen friends who don’t have all that you listed above and land incredible partners . If you are gearing to the narcissistic sociopathic crowd , this post is excellent. The items you list above can just as easily tread on vanity and self absorption. It’s a fine line between great self care and vanity. Tread carefully.
It's basic but pretty much 100% of things I think when people say "online dating sucks blah blah" and they don't post any profile pics or any reviews etc.
Id say the same thing applies to women seeking a real relationship.
I'm overweight, currently just sitting out until back in shape. It's what I'd recommend to women as well unless they are at a point that they've completely given up on the weight, then just see what you can get.
The guys that are "chubby cute" are like the women that are "chubby cute" they most likely have a higher facial attractiveness, if they lost weight they'd go from average to 10s.
I'm gonna agree that all of this works. But with that said:
Women: just be yourself!
Also women: heavy preference for guys who follow lists like this rather than being themselves.
Losing weight is good advice for anyone overweight, from a health perspective. You should be a healthy weight for your own good, not to attract a partner.
If you're choosing your hairstyle and clothing based on what other people will find attractive rather than what you prefer, then I would call you fake. It'll work, but you're fake.
Personally, when people tell me 'just be yourself!' I'm fully aware that's absolute bullshit as dating advice, but I'm gonna do it anyway. Yes, I could change myself and get better results. Some people would call it 'self improvement'. It's not. It's conformity, plain and simple. If no one likes me the way I am, then I'll stay single. I have no inclination whatsoever to trick people into giving me a chance by putting on a mask, no matter how effective it might be.
I'm an average woman, I'm not looking to date a supermodel. For me EFFORT is the most important thing. If I see a man that is "sloppy" (not taking care of his body, not having a good skincare/hygiene routine, wearing I'll fitting clothes, and/or bad haircut/style) it's definitely a no. Also, with hair loss there is oral finasteride and topical treatments, prevention is key.
Personality will get you the relationship, but a pleasing appearance will get you in the door. A man who puts in effort is already ahead of 95% of other men imo.
Edit: Apparently Finasteride could have side effects I wasn't aware of. I have used rosemary oil blend hair oils and Minoxidil myself without issues. Also, there is nothing wrong with being bald, I was simply giving options, not telling anyone they "should" do anything.
Hey, just a heads up from a dude who's bald at 19: Finasteride (often called "fin") has the potential to fuck you up pretty badly. I actually decided I'd rather go bald than do this shit.
One potential side effect of fin is that it will kill your libido. It’s a low probability side effect but it happened to me. I went to different doctors and they couldn’t figure out why (I was in my early 30s). I eventually reread the side effects and realized that most likely was the cause (doctors ruled out everything else). I stopped taking it. My libido eventually returned but it took years.
Yeah there’s nothing wrong with being bald at all, as long as you make the move to shave your head instead of doing a weird combover thing. A shaved head looks good on most guys (and many women too). Actually, almost all of the OLD guys I’ve met IRL have been bald. So yeah, most women won’t expect you to use harmful hair products. A shaved head is cool.
Saying they should be on finasteride is wild though. Besides the whole erectile dysfunction thing, it has a chance of being present in the semen, which may end up causing birth defects.
In my experience the most important attribute for meeting a woman is having the right type of job or social circle that opportunities are presented to you.
Women both do and don't care about looks. They will absolutely date and marry guys who aren't traditionally hot but have great personalities and other stuff going for them. But it's also very hard for a guy like that to get a chance to demonstrate their other qualities without being able to get a foot in the door. Looks do that.
I know quite a few guys with women far above their "league" looks-wise. Almost all of them have jobs that give them a steady flow of women coming in and a chance to look like experts when they show up. It's better to be a broke bartender than a rich engineer working remote in the dating world.
I'm considering teaching scuba classes that I don't at all need the money from simply because it gives me this chance.
I agree and disagree at the same time. No one will like you if you don’t have anything to offer other than your looks. Being charming can only go so far, and often, a few minutes away from bankruptcy if it’s your only capital.
You'd be surprised at the number of women that don't care about that. I've (34 M) been passed up by my fair share of women for "men" who don't have a job, car, no ambitions, and still live with their parents.
If I may ask, what’s your race? As an Asian man that lost 60+ lbs down from 220 and built some of that back in muscle, has good hair, according to my friends a good fashion sense, great posture, a skincare routine, and a $700+ fragrance collection (I just like to smell good so I have quite a few). I’ve still had no success in dating, I’m not exactly ripped but I’m not fat by any means. I’m still working on getting more fit but it’s felt no different than my experience back in 2018 where I was 220 lbs with no sense of fashion and not really taking care of myself
Good post OP. Man I wish it was that easy . I guess it might be for a semi good looking guy but when you really a fine mfka who's also a bad mfka the epitome of man ,I think it makes it more difficult to get chicks .They all worried I'm a player an gonna not be loyal and devoted and that is completely contrary to my character.Im loyal ,faithful ,attentive , pleasing to the eyes and to providing physical satisfaction ,capable of creating a incredible life for the right woman ,great with kids and pets ,ain't scared of another man on this earth and capable of defending on the ultimate level ,love to have fun , talented skilled in multiple trades ,I don't know how to be a liar , I'm kind and generous and helpful ,love spoiling my lady (when I have one). I'm a all around score for any woman ,if they could ever look past the looks to find not only a attractive outwardly man ,also a inwardly beautiful man . So to all the ladies out there if you see a hot dude and refrain from approaching him bcuz u think he's too good looking prolly a player ,do urself and Al of us sexy Mfkas out here a chance . You may be surprised to discover a total gem who just wants a down ass loyal woman (sorta attractive) who wants you to want them to want you to want him ...if that last part make sense. Take care everyone and as I say everyday and practice it too KEEP SMILING !
Imagine doing all of this, starting to get first dates, but never getting second ones. At what point do people realize the thing they thought was everything isn't actually everything or even remotely close to everything?
This is the sort of thing that will open doors that used to be closed, but it won't get you very far through them, especially as you get older and people start to realize that having a pretty face around is pointless if you can't stand who they are.
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It sounds like you were an already attractive guy who wasn’t taking care of himself.
Yep, according to his exeperiences he is very likely a "Gigachad"
Where are you guys coming up with all these weird ass terms? Now I have to go Google gigaChad?!
On Reddit for 262 days, comment checks out.
Only when you hit rock bottom, you reddit
GigaChad just means a really good looking guy with lots and lots of confidence.
You're better off just not knowing lol
Dumb@ss Gen Z internet slang
MoistMcCuntington is either the name of a Gigachad or an Austin Power villain
Unless you have some kind of physical deformity, you can make yourself more attractive. Sorry to say pal, but I think you just may not be putting in the effort. Self care is hard work most people don’t bother with.
I’m gay and doing perfectly fine, but most men are not about to be getting hit on by women in public. That’s exceedingly rare. If the average guy puts in effort, he will have normal experiences and get a few dates sure, but it won’t be a miracle like it seems to have been for this guy.
I can agree to some extent on this. I will say as a small caveat, as a bisexual man, I can confirm that attraction from other gay men is a low bar (in my experience)
A lot of people have barriers to self care external and internal and reducing it to a choice or will power completely misses the mark.
I will concede that fashion is an obvious spend not everyone can make. However, haircut, a razor, exfoliator and moisturizer, are all well within reach. On the high end I could MAYBE spend 100$ on these things and that’s accounting for if I went to a male stylist in my area for a cut. As for weight, going for a run doesn’t cost a thing and cardio is a great way to lose weight. If you want to build muscle, budget weight sets are out there, but you could even just watch the ABripper X video for free online. All my friends in college got their abs from religiously doing that routine and it didn’t cost a cent. I’ll reword what I said slightly and include a health issues such as eczema. I don’t want to call it a deformity per se, but again, a friend from high school had very bad eczema and he just put in the work to commit to a routine. These methods don’t break the bank by any means. Even I have acne and I get accutane, which cost me about 60$ a month. I’m on a 6 month course with a 98% success rate so about 360$ to clear my acne. Again accurate is painful and hurts but it kills the acne, however, dealing with acne in 6 months for 360$ is a bargain in my opinion and I’m happy to make the sacrifice for my health.
While I agree that physical attractiveness is the most important thing to attract women, there is a limit to how attractive you can become. If you are tall, and thin, and a decent face, you can become really attractive by working out and dressing nicely. But a short man isn't going to suddenly become a lady's man just by doing these things.
That’s tricky. A good looking short dude won’t have to worry about attracting someone. There will be women who avoid them, but they probably won’t notice.
If you’re upfront and humorous about your height, the picky women get filtered out.
Like 97% of guys can become above average if they start taking care of themselves like op specified though.
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Because there are far more parameters like location, race, social network etc that also matter, which the OP left out. Yeah, taking care of yourself helps, but it's not a ticket to dating success.
It's sexist bullshit. Whenever someone says "most" and doesn't back it up by actual, statistical data, they are full of it.
Nope - not above average maybe 1 point like from a 4 to 5. Men, need to be at least a 6.5 and that is not realistic so men give up. An average man is 4-6 out of ten. There are men that are also at a 1-3. I’m a 3 lol.
This! Absolutely this! I’m like a 2, so I get it. It’s hard. I take care of myself, get a nice hair cut, shave my raggedy beard into a nice goatee (which is what fits my face best, I know goatees are supposedly considered unattractive as I’ve been told before but it fits my face perfectly) and I get people telling me they liked my hair long, they wish I didn’t cut it, I get told I should have kept growing my beard out, or that I was attractive before but how I’m just “ok” so it’s hard to do what this guy says and still be successful, it’s not a guarantee. Not to mention, I live in a town where the only places considered fun are bars. The last, only, place of fun, an axe throwing place with a pool hall inside, shut down. So there’s nothing else in my town. Hard to meet people when there’s nowhere to go.
However, for men it’s my unsolicited advice that’s it’s beneficial to date outside of your race and culture. Allegedly, over 60 percent of African American females are single. African American females are really the silent backbone of our country and get the least amount of credit for their suffering. They are loyal, Full of heart, spiritual and martyrs for many causes of humanity. Men need to wake up and become who you really are - human beings with love
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No, I don’t think so. Way more than 3 percent of men are taking care of themselves, and they’re not all above average.
Most guys are average, though. Maybe you're saying above average, but that's a fallacy to say 97% of guys aren't average. And just assume most are slobs with no self-care or maintenance.
At the same time though a 9 could scale down to a 7 if they aren’t maintaining their hygiene. Imagine being a very average man that works out takes care of his facial hair and hair and wears the right fitting clothes.
Okay here’s the thing, there is a certain threshold of attractiveness that you HAVE to meet to even get a seat at the table. After that, other factors matter but if you don’t get a seat at the table that’s that lol
Absolutely but what table are you trying to sit at to begin with? Are your a 5 trying to sit with the 10's? Or are you a 5 trying to sit at the table with the 7's? A 5 can clean up nice enough to sit with the 7's but you're going to need plastic surgery, muscles, letters after your degree such as PHD/MD, proper etiquette, and money if you want a seat with the 10's. So, you can consider it settling by cleaning up enough to sit with the 7's or you can stay with the 5's. Ugh, I can't believe I had to resort to using that bs number cray to explain something lol
OP is doing well. The only way I can get 200 matches in a day is when I go to New York or Los Angeles for work and I'm in a gigantic new city with a million women who haven't seen me yet. BUT he is correct about everything he says. Lose weight, dress nicely, get in the habit of talking to strangers, wear cologne. I would also add: develop the skill of banter, and learn how to flirt. But those skills come in handy after you've already attracted the girl to you in the first place.
Yeah, OP didn't word the title of the post very well. He said "being attractive is everything", but really his post is saying "being good looking is everything". When he gives tips about becoming more attractive the only advice he gives is about improving your appearance (and your smell). He doesn't talk about improving your charisma, social skills, ability to flirt, which is also a critically important part of being attractive.
This. I have met many men who at first impression were not "my type," but after speaking to them, having a lively back and forth banter, and observing their charisma and confidence in themselves, have gone out with them, and subsequently found them *very* attractive, whether I was initially interested or not.
An extremely low probability for most men
You will never get you foot in the door for those things if you don't improve your looks first. Focus on the things he mentioned first and work on the rest later. There is more than enough attractive women dating guys with zero personality and social skills to back this up.
>You will never get you foot in the door for those things if you don't improve your looks first. Not necessarily, there's men who are not conventionally good looking but still have a girlfriend. Having said, that as a man there's no downside to improving your looks, so might as well do it. >Focus on the things he mentioned first and work on the rest later. Just do both at the same time. >There is more than enough attractive women dating guys with zero personality and social skills to back this up. There's also above average looking men who can't keep a woman interested because they're socially awkward / unable to create chemistry. There's two sides to the coin.
You have a better chance by improving your appearance.
I want to see a screenshot of 200 matches in one day. Really, let's see them.....
It's wild that people are taking OP at his word when his post history is all about drop shipping. This all seems like a set up for a grift.
Mmm, it's possible, but not on a continual basis. What happens is that when you first light up the app, you are exposed to a lot of new people. But after a few days, most if the active users have seen you, and the rate of matches declines significantly. I've never gotten 200 in a day, but I've gotten over 100 before. But as I said, that was NYC and LA. Most people don't live in cities that large. And after 3 days, I'm only getting a dozen or so per day even in NYC.
its not even about the quantity, its the way he talks about it. and further, i also don't believe he's "very selective" but getting 200 matches in that time frame because tht implies he's swiped through thousands of profiles in under 48 hours in the first place and i don't think that that comprots with "very selective" vs the time period. This feels like a grift, just like dropshipping is.
I agree, he's exaggerating.
Lol my ex made a Tinder account using pictures of some physically perfect supermodel for funsies and got over 200 likes that day. A third of those profiles were sketchy. So I definitely don't believe that he matched with 200 gorgeous women lol. As a moderately attractive girl I used to get that many when I was on there. Let me assure you it's not the paradise it sounds like.
I like that you put 'dress nicely' versus 'trendy' like OP. I love when my man dresses in HIS style, but in his nicer clothes versus his beat up oil stained or grass stained clothes. A nice pair of Dickies and a Dixxon flannel or he has this one plain t-shirt that I love. The color is very flattering on him and it fits his chest and shoulders well.
A little bit of trendyness is cool, but personal style will always trump draping yourself in all the hypest drip.
>Lose weight, dress nicely, TBH as far as men go when you figure out the hairstyle/facial hair combo that works best for you, you look proportionately fit for your frame, and you make/care about your clothes looking nice you instantly level up to 6.5 or 7 or 8 depending. Getting all that nailed down for a man really ups their attractiveness by a huge amount. It's almost like night n day.
I can absolutely clean up with online dating matches but the last time a woman flirted with me in real life, George W Bush was president. I dress well, am 6'4" and in good shape. I make a lot of money. I get heaps of compliments on my style, my shoes, my truck, my boat, all sorts of personal style choices. Never a compliment on my looks and never ever a compliment from women ages 22-49. Almost all from men and 55+ women. The huge blocker for me is that I'm invisible to dating prospects in real life and when I approach women they are always surrounded by friends so the whole "she smiled at you now go talk to her" is never a real setup. She never smiles because she's talking to her girl friends and never sees me, and I never approach because it's too hard going 5 on 1. I've found that no amount of getting hotter will get me attention in a bar or overcome the fact that women are almost never alone. But it will work on the apps.
Where are you from? Probably an EU country lol
Florida
I can lose all the weight in the world, I can wear the nicest suits in the world and most expensive cologne, and can be the life of a the party. It doesn’t change the fact that my face just isn’t an attractive face
As a guy you can grow facial hair. Women can't change their face. Makeup only does so much. Most people date someone who matches them on a 1-10 scale. Go up or down 2 on the scale.
**Many** men cannot grow dense enough facial hair for a beard, and baby faces/chins hurt men more than women.
I guess I could try facial hair. Or it’ll just complete the negative look I already have.
Being “ugly hot” is a thing. Coming from a 22F, we definitely like unique facial features when the rest of the man looks fit and put together nicely. I have learned one thing in my life about people and its that almost 99% of everyone is not actually ugly at all. You really gotta have seriously messed up genes to be cast aside when you put in effort
Guess I’m the 1% then.
what about rule #2?
Being attractive is about winning the genetic lottery... Some of us don't get that benefit no matter how hard we work out or play dress up.
I agree on everything except the EVERYTHING part. 99% of people have some degree of agency with their looks. I am currently doing a lot of the stuff you said, too. But this by itself will not get you very far, depending ok what you're after. Dating isn't a fashion show, and it should not be treated as such. It is also important to carry yourself properly. This is extremely important and should not be left to chance. This applies to women as well. There are some women that men find hot AF, me included, but in retrospect, if you look at them, they don't have a particularly pretty face or even the greatest body out there. However, they dressed well and treated themselves as if they were already supermodels. This approach works, and I am trying to pull something similar off for myself as well.
Precisely. Attractiveness means nothing if you don’t carry yourself and present yourself in the right way. Confidence outweighs the outside factors imo.
Agreed, also half of what OP listed is borderline just hygiene.
Yeah, and those are the basics that are just regular human practices in everyday life. Confidence, not being needy, and developing an attractive lifestyle are things that should be pointed out.
Yes, an average woman is just as visual as an average man (obviously there are exceptions on both sides), they are just afraid to admit it so as not to be considered superficial. Perpetuating the myth that men are more visual than women does nothing except harm both men and women. (Only one study showed that men were more visual than women, but even those found fairly small differences. Newer research on this topic seem to indicate that there are no differences between women and men in this regard, men are simply more willing for cultural reasons to admit that they like someone physically. Source: [1](https://www.mindbodygreen.com/articles/men-not-more-visual-or-easily-aroused-than-women-research-shows) and [2](https://www.pnas.org/doi/full/10.1073/pnas.1904975116).)
all of this is facts.
Good advice from a man. If you're a guy, don't go based on what women say. They tell you how they want you to be after they already decided they want you. Big difference from advice on how to get noticed in the first place.
Yeah women give some of the worst advice you can take as a man. They mostly imagine that women are easier to talk to and impress than they are. Women can give really great fashion advice tho, I used to have a friend i'd call when I went shopping to help me pick things out, she got me some of my best pieces in my wardrobe when I had no clue where to look
I am pretty honest with my guy friends. Some of them don't like to hear it.
Most importantly, You don’t do that for women. You do that for yourself. Don’t people’s please.
Looks are literally for everyone but you. You do it “for yourself” because of how looks affect the way we are perceived and treated
I matched with a guy on Hinge and we met up for coffee. He was wearing a Castlevania t shirt and wrinkled khaki cargo shorts. His beard was unkempt, he had grossly long uncut finger nails. Unwashed hair. He just overall looked like he didn’t give a shit. It’s wild how many guys show up to dates like they don’t even care to be there.
TBH I'm glad there's dudes out there setting the bar so low like that because in the long run it makes my job a whole hell of a lot easier, lol. That's kinda crazy that homie thought showing up like that was acceptable though. Why is there such an epidemic of dudes out there who apparently weren't taught that they have to wash their ass before they go outside these days tho? :P **edit: a word.
>Why is there such an epidemic of dudes out there who apparently weren't taught that they have to wash their ass The media and double standards. When a man literally doesn't wash his own ass it is indicative he has parents/guardians who never held him accountable for properly cleaning himself. It's usually the women who are conditioned from day 1 to value their appearance, especially if they want to earn the affection and attention of a man, and keep him. Whereas men are conditioned that they can be "as is" and people will accept them, regardless of how unkempt he is. That's exactly why OP is currently experiencing this revelation, they seemed to be an attractive person who simply wasn't taking care of himself n his appearance
That makes a lot of sense. I’m a man but I’m quite attractive and yet I’m insecure about my looks because my whole life they were commented on (positively) and I was hyper aware that people really do pay attention to looks, similar to why women are more aware of it too. I go to a lot of effort to be as presentable and clean and good looking as possible even if I’m just going to the supermarket. It sounds vain and theatrical but as a teenager I would panic and be on the verge of tears if I had a bad pimple or my hair was sitting badly.
Yup exactly. Hopefully today ur able to be more at ease
I think it goes both ways though because traditionally women have been told that all you have to do is show up lookin cute and men are expected to just give you things. But it's a vicious cycle because on the one hand you have these guys who get convinced they're entitled to everything they want without having to put much effort into it simply because they're a man ( like you said ), and then the women are told the very same shit from the other direction- only they aren't promised all the power and wealth and dominance a man is... Good news is I think with younger and younger generations there's more and more of a pushback against all these backwards ass ideas and these notions of how men ( straight white ones specifically ) should just be handed the keys to the world and all it's power and resources.
Right on!
Sorry but that is myth as well. Society will very easily discard man that is not so good looking and doesnt take good care of himself. Sure, people will pull up with him because they got to but anything deeper is out of the question. I understand some women will go with that but lrts face it, they are an outliers. Women used to walk away from guys that are in much better position.
I don't see why my personal opinion has to be invalidated as a myth, simply because you don't agree. Just going outside n observing ppl, especially in social places it's easily seen that women date all types of men. You don't only see modelesque men walking around w women. If you surround yourself with women and hear of their dating experiences, many share they've been on dates and have even dated men who are not hygienic and are unkempt. I think this is because the media n society conditions dudes that the pretty girl will accept them because he's a man. We see this in all kinds of film n TV. Considering the leads/protagonist is most often a white heterosexual male. The male viewers internalize this n assume this is how real life is too. Look at all those coming of age rom coms like the Breakfast club, Pretty in pink, She's All That, Cant hardly wait, 10 things i hate about you etc. All these films perpetuate no matter how a man is, whether he's an asshole, a nerd w low self worth, an over confident jock etc. that he will always get the girl.
Out of curiosity what made mr needs an iron, nail clipper, and a beard trim seem like a decent choice initially?
His profile pictures were of a decent looking dude who appeared to take better care of himself lol
Oh yes tell me about it. My first ever friendly meeting with a man is that he came 1 hour late, wore oversized stained shirt, oversized pants, unkept beard, and worse of all he stank like he didn't took a shower. Got traumatized by it and I've never been out on a date ever since then
You shouldn't let that traumatize you lol. That's terrible he showed up like that, but there's many more mature men out there haha
Yea I know. I'm jumping back into the dating scene and hopefully find someone much cleaner and suits me better
Good luck! Its tough but remember to not put so much pressure on yourself neither, you should take your time on these things
Thank you so much~! 🫂
Crazy how many guys are here focused on why you went to meet with him/matched with him instead of focusing on the guy coming to that date like that. It's like they think we don't have common sense yet they can't put two and two together that he would've looked better on the pictures he put up on his profile.
Right I keep answering the same question like…. I thought we all knew that some people look better in their profile than in person??
Guessing they can't even grasp the concept of it lol. They can't even look at the answers you've given to the other people asking the exact same question they are, they probably never even took the time to care to look at a bio
and yet there are many guys who put 110% effort into themselves and cant even get a date...
On dating apps looks are 95% of being liked. Like OP said don't let anyone gaslight you into believing anything different.
Looks only scratches the surface in dating. Many times I've been into dudes simply because he's handsome and caught my eye, but once we started talking, his personality brought me back down to earth. Yes it's wonderful to reel in all the likes, but having the personality and mindest to keep a woman, as a girlfriend or wife goes beyond looks
Exactly, but you missed the entire point.
No, I understand the point loud n clear, yall think it's all about the looks, but in reality looks aren't everything. Looks don't cultivate meaningful connections Looks don't make dating any easier, it just gives u more options Looks don't make great connections last long-term
Everything you said is true, but its looks that open that door of possibility which makes it the most important factor.
It really is true. I was walking with one of my friends who is decent attractive. These like soccer moms keep coming up to try to talk to him, but he's married so we just keep walking. He asks me what I don't to dodge the women like that... Had to explain to him that that doesn't happen to guys like me..
So in conclusion if your single your ugly
Are you just now finding this out? Pretty privilege is a thing 😂 bigger than racism 😂
Wish women admitted this about men. I felt completely invisible until I started hitting the gym and dressing better. I'm so tired of hearing them say looks don't matter and that as long as he's nice and interesting, they'll want to date him..
Whilst I agree being attractive is the single most important factor to get your foot in the door and gain initial interest, it does not help you take things to the next level.
Being attractive will get you laid. Being a nice and funny person will get and keep you married.
Being attractive does give one more romantic/social opportunities to hone their charm/wit/social skills, though. They're separate things, but there's some correlation between them.
So being nice and funny but not attractive means you’ll be stuck in a marriage where you don’t get laid?
Lotta cope in these comments. What you say is 100 💯 percent true. Women are no more paragons of relationship virtue than men are. Women are just as "shallow" as the next guy. Looks matter a fuck ton. Without attraction, everything else about you? The vast majority of women could care less (depending on the circumstances)
It's true, but the thing that gets left out all the time is the fact that that's only going to get you your foot in the door with most people. Maybe you'll get some booty too, but in the long run if you're boring or an asshole you're still going to be lonely and alone.
I haven’t read the comments but I’d imagine the not so attractive guys are having issues? All those things OP stated are for guys who have potential. If someone like me maxes out my looks, I’ll get a lot of attention, but I guy who’s short and not so attractive in the face? Idk man.
Kind of. But even someone not conventionally attractive may slightly improve their chances by doing some of the things mentioned in the post. To use your example, a short guy that is stylish will stand a better chance than a short guy who presents as a slob.
I suppose it’s about any improvement at all. You can’t change height and you can’t change facial deformities (without surgery). However, my friend is like 5’7” and he looks amazing. His height has never affected his ability to date because he puts in the work elsewhere. I’m a 5’11” 170 lb white guy, so these tips work for me because I’m the baseline lol. But I will say as I’ve said before, barring deformities anyone can look handsome with the effort. Edit: typo.
The amount of men who aren’t even doing the bare minimum would put you miles ahead even if you are “ugly”. (I don’t really think anyone is so ugly they’re beyond help.) Edit: forgot the second half of my thought LOL
I’m assuming you’re a woman? Yes, the reality is, most guys don’t do much. No skincare routine, lack of fashion, unhealthy physique, and an uninteresting life. It doesn’t take much for a guy to standout but it takes a lot of work for many and that’s really what holds the majority back.
Idk as a woman I feel like there’s “conventionally attractive” and then there’s “what I’m personally attracted to”. It’s a Venn diagram and sure there’s some stuff in the middle but also a bunch of stuff on either side
And how do you expect me to do this when I barely have the motivation to shower everyday?? That also just sounds like ***A LOT*** of work for just a small chance at a little success. I'm 20 and I'm not gonna be working on myself constantly until I'm 22 just to have a small chance at having people approach me And wtf even are "trendy" clothes?? Like button-downs and polos and whatnot? Cause you're hilarious if you think I'm gonna wear that on a daily basis or even more than twice a year. They're vehemently uncomfortable and have zero personality
you're overthinking it and also probably depressed from the sounds of it. I know some dudes personally who have never been in a relationship since middle school and are now 25, stay home all day, and get their excitement from PC games and doordash. not saying you'll end up like this, but you need self awareness if you desire more from life. its not a lot of work, and most the time it wil benefit yourself before it benefits anyone else. its like that poem, dont go quietly into the night. either you figure for yourself you need to "fight" or you just agree to the life you're given. i've been ugly and extremely depressed in my life before, i've also been hyperfocused on improvement and dating before. i've been most happy somewhere in between
I think your personality and attitude is the problem man. You sound like a downer to be around and you seem to be mad that the solution to your perceived problem isn’t what you want it to be. If you can’t even shower then why are you dating, you need to fix your mental health. Start by leaving the house, getting sun, then extend how far you walk for etc
I workout and I do have a morning skincare routine and also a nighttime skincare routine. Unfortunately, I was born with deformities so doing all this is kinda pointless. I will never be able to find a haircut that fits my face. Even though I make sure all my clothes are clean and well fitted, I will never look good in them. I will always look like shit. So what do I do? I can't afford surgery
What kind of deformities? Depending what you could lean into a James Bond villain look
I just do gym since a year and I must say I did get a lot of difference but now I have no money since no job I am a student so no fashion clothes , but can you tell me what type of skin care brand's I can buy that is not that expensive but also quite good ?
It ain’t EVERYTHING, but it will get you noticed and increase your potential partners 10x. I know guys who are 5/10 looks wise but have hot wives and girlfriends because their self-confidence, humor and charisma are all 8/10. If you don’t have those ratings on any of those then you’ve got no hope unless you look like a 7+ in the looks department, or a narcissists or sociopath who can manipulate their way into relationships, but you don’t want to be that. But generally speaking, achieving all his bullet points will help you considerably and improve your confidence, maybe not enough if your social kills are non-existent, but you’ll at least get noticed. I can’t talk to Women i’m attracted to for shit, everyone else sure, I can banter and crack the funnies. But because i’m relatively attractive and very fit every now and then the odd hot girl will take the plunge and do the work for me. If I were overweight, poorly groomed and dressed lazily (so your average redditor gamer) then i’d stand no hope.
Facts.
By the way I think it’s funny I’m an older guy in his 40s. I have two friends that are essentially millionaires with all their wealth and assets and even they have a difficult if not impossible time. When we go out they dress like a normal guy and not any fancy pants, style or clothes and we never talk about money or buy women drinks but women judge a book by the cover (what a man wears - his shoes, shirt, pants, belt, perfect hair style). Since, almost all women ghost them it’s so funny because they are going overseas to find women. American women (not western women because Spain, Italy and Portugal, Netherlands are so cool) in general are way way way way to materialistic and into physical appearance so much that it is a turn off. To be fair, most men really look for women who are sexually attractive (for me I am a psycho creep and like plus size women with curves lol). Not necessarily perfect and thin but sexually attractive which is like The lowest bar you can think of and Still they can’t find a woman lol. I’ve been kicked out of bars (only in America) for talking to women with millionaire men present. It’s just so so funny- it’s just so humorous. I can’t make this up but you have to laugh as we are conditioned by our peer group and society. Just so so so so funny
Your point of view leaves me no chance to date except eva ai virtual gf bot
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Vanity and unhealthy obsession about self image.... close friends with insecurities, attention seeking and assbleaching.....
Should share your before/after glow up so others have an idea of the minimum effort they should put in.
Not 100% but 90% for sure, people stay in abusive relationships just cause their partner looks good. You’d be surprised how much people are willing to sacrifice for good looking people; one of my pals was willing to relocate states, change careers, and date a single mother despite his dating preference to be in the same borough of NY and to not date people with children. Thank god it ended in incompatibility because he was ready to change his entire life for one albeit attractive and fit woman.
Yeah I get hundreds of likes but 90% are unattractive women. Dating apps are shit mostly
Show us your hinge account
Bro thought he cooked up an insane guid to becoming attractive 💀
I can confirm: if you have a choice about being born attractive you should definitely choose attractive. The rest of us ...
>ignore what people say Ok ill ignore what you said
Being attractive is extremely important, but it really isnt everything Im attractive, and have honestly tried to rely on that on some dates when i was a little tired and not super into it. Its worked, but definitely not always Getting 200 matches isnt hard if youre attractive (in a high population area that is, took me about a month to get that in a low population area), but who cares about matches if you dont get dates
Some of us aren’t looking for relationships…
What about height buddy , how can we change that , BTW ,WHAT IS THE BARE MINIMUM HEIGHT TO DATE , I am working on myself and I know i can make myself attractive because I got some privilege
Some of that is just a test by women, you need your wits about you to over come it or don't attempt it. As for minimum height, you're right, you can't change it but being taller than they girl you approach helps even if its not 6' tall. So I would say some where around 5'8"-5'11" would put you 3"-6" taller the average woman.
I literally wrote the same thing in another subreddit. It's as much as looking attractive and the confidence that comes with it. Looking attractive = Looking Healthy. And clothes/haircut/skin/smell are some parametters we can control. I would add to that list : Your teeth. Get them clean, do some braces if they look like a mess. It's expensive, but worthy. Attractiveness is enough to sleep with girls, but not to get a girlfriend. Imo, girls are attracted by your appearance but fall in love with your personality, the way you make her feel, the way your carry yourself and treat her.
Wish guys admitted this about women. I was totally invisible to men until i started working out and wearing more makeup. Im so tired of them saying looks dont matter and as long as she has interest in them they’ll want to date her
People in general care about looks WAY more than they can admit because nobody wants to seem shallow and guys know 'I don't care about looks' is what women want to hear, so they say that shit even when we all know it's a goddamn lie, lol. And women gaf way more than they actually say they do too. Both sexes are doing the same shit because most people can't seem to scratch beneath the surface and are incapable of reading people and intuiting how they actually feel.
In 30+ years of life as a man, I have literally never heard a man day this. I have however heard men say that “every woman can get a man”. That is 100% true. The disconnect seems to be that women interpret this as ‘every woman can get a man [that they want]’ that is not true. I've seen 200lb women say she only wants gym bros and use a one-night stand with a gym bro as evidence of her having a realistic chance at a long term relationship. What she didn't understand is while they may exist, they are rare. Additionally, she would have to compete with every other 200lb woman who wants a gym bro. There are more of her than the chubby chasing gym bros. Women's wants and “standards” keep them single.
Yeah idk if my personality drives them away or what but every man that I want becomes a man I can’t get even if it seems like he was on board initially lol
I can usually tell within five minutes of meeting a woman, why she is single. In all fairness, I can tell within five minutes for men as well. I don't know you, but I'm willing to bet, if you don't know the reason then you don't have anyone willing to be honest with you.
Its not a standards thing, bud. I didnt have the wild standards you assume all women have. I went for average and below average because i thought those guys wouldn’t reject me and they still did, of course until i changed my looks
I don't know why you personalized my response? I was just telling you that by in large men don't make the statement that you claimed they do. Then I further explained what you more than likely have heard. Then I gave examples. None of it was about you. However, because you said: > I went for average and below average because i thought those guys wouldn’t reject me and they still did There appears to be a disconnect here. You may be devaluing the men you are encountering. Example: I spoke to a woman once who said she went on a date with a guy and she wasn't sure if she was settling. She said, he's handsome, a multimillionaire at 35, into fitness, in great shape, fun personality, but he was 5’7. This woman was the epitome of average. In looks, salary, personality, etc. Conversely, he was above average in every metric with the exception of height and she felt she would be settling. Again, I'm not saying this is you exactly, but you may be devaluing the men for something small.
Men absolutely care about looks in women. For most men it's one of their top considerations. However, men don't all like the same thing. Most guys like the women who are mainstream hot but also have some other type(s) they go for. These can be things that women might consider flaws but some guys find them super hot. Some guys like super short or tall women. Some guys like big hips and butts. Some guys like really skinny girls with no curves. And so on.
Ok this seems more and more the case lol , if you’re attractive the other stuff is either insurmountable or doesn’t matter at all
as a girl idk why I'm reading this.
So what you can take away from this is 1. Stop being fucking poor ...you're too poor for women 2. You're fat 3. Just look better women love people who look better than you 4. Shower, ...you stink 5. Do the exact opposite of what you're doing now This guy deserves a trophy for how he solved everyone's problems...lol
Yeah who would've guessed that women only like the top 5% of men?!?! Good luck to the short kings who can literally do nothing about it
Username checks out. I also am proof your theory is incorrect. I am not attractive and I got a lot of dates. It's about having BDE. All the things you stated will only get you the shallow of the shallow women. The REAL women respond to BDE.
It's not just about being "attractive" sure you might look hot at a glance. But you gotta have the confidence to go with it. If you don't have the confidence you can carry yourself very wrongly. On top of that you gotta know how to "talk the talk" I've seen "attractive" guys completely fail because they don't project themselves well at all. Then it splits into 2 categories.... Women who ignore the signs and just ooze over an attractive douchebag. Or the women who see they're attractive but don't have what they want/need so they avoid....
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True and all those women who do find a man who makes money are quick to jump ship if that same guy gets laid off or isn’t able to make the exactly the same amount in the future. A man could be making 80k a year but some women who make slightly higher would reject him even though he makes a great living. The same women who are lucky enough to find a man who takes care of them are the same ones who will lie cheat and repeat at a moments notice. Loyalty is not important to a woman. They are quick to jump ship at first sign of stress. The best thing a man could do for himself is to do what makes him happy and not let his happiness be tied to a woman. Women are never happy and never satisfied. All they want is more.
I’ll need to downvote this . It’s not everything and this comes across as a very narcissistic post . I am fortunate to have what some deem as good “ physical genes “ . I’m tall 6’1 , fit , green eyes and what some would deem as “good looking “ but to say that it is everything is simply not true and just plays to the stereotype and perpetuates the stigma that you need this to get dates/land a great partner . I’ve seen friends who don’t have all that you listed above and land incredible partners . If you are gearing to the narcissistic sociopathic crowd , this post is excellent. The items you list above can just as easily tread on vanity and self absorption. It’s a fine line between great self care and vanity. Tread carefully.
"Being Attractive is Everything for Attracting people to you who are interested in how you look"
If you think that almost every person in the dating scene isn’t “interested in how you look” you’re coping.
It's basic but pretty much 100% of things I think when people say "online dating sucks blah blah" and they don't post any profile pics or any reviews etc. Id say the same thing applies to women seeking a real relationship. I'm overweight, currently just sitting out until back in shape. It's what I'd recommend to women as well unless they are at a point that they've completely given up on the weight, then just see what you can get. The guys that are "chubby cute" are like the women that are "chubby cute" they most likely have a higher facial attractiveness, if they lost weight they'd go from average to 10s.
I'm gonna agree that all of this works. But with that said: Women: just be yourself! Also women: heavy preference for guys who follow lists like this rather than being themselves. Losing weight is good advice for anyone overweight, from a health perspective. You should be a healthy weight for your own good, not to attract a partner. If you're choosing your hairstyle and clothing based on what other people will find attractive rather than what you prefer, then I would call you fake. It'll work, but you're fake. Personally, when people tell me 'just be yourself!' I'm fully aware that's absolute bullshit as dating advice, but I'm gonna do it anyway. Yes, I could change myself and get better results. Some people would call it 'self improvement'. It's not. It's conformity, plain and simple. If no one likes me the way I am, then I'll stay single. I have no inclination whatsoever to trick people into giving me a chance by putting on a mask, no matter how effective it might be.
I'm an average woman, I'm not looking to date a supermodel. For me EFFORT is the most important thing. If I see a man that is "sloppy" (not taking care of his body, not having a good skincare/hygiene routine, wearing I'll fitting clothes, and/or bad haircut/style) it's definitely a no. Also, with hair loss there is oral finasteride and topical treatments, prevention is key. Personality will get you the relationship, but a pleasing appearance will get you in the door. A man who puts in effort is already ahead of 95% of other men imo. Edit: Apparently Finasteride could have side effects I wasn't aware of. I have used rosemary oil blend hair oils and Minoxidil myself without issues. Also, there is nothing wrong with being bald, I was simply giving options, not telling anyone they "should" do anything.
Hey, just a heads up from a dude who's bald at 19: Finasteride (often called "fin") has the potential to fuck you up pretty badly. I actually decided I'd rather go bald than do this shit.
One potential side effect of fin is that it will kill your libido. It’s a low probability side effect but it happened to me. I went to different doctors and they couldn’t figure out why (I was in my early 30s). I eventually reread the side effects and realized that most likely was the cause (doctors ruled out everything else). I stopped taking it. My libido eventually returned but it took years.
Yeah there’s nothing wrong with being bald at all, as long as you make the move to shave your head instead of doing a weird combover thing. A shaved head looks good on most guys (and many women too). Actually, almost all of the OLD guys I’ve met IRL have been bald. So yeah, most women won’t expect you to use harmful hair products. A shaved head is cool.
Oh nah I‘m not complaining, but bald plus baby face doesn’t work out for me so it’s a bit frustrating
Saying they should be on finasteride is wild though. Besides the whole erectile dysfunction thing, it has a chance of being present in the semen, which may end up causing birth defects.
Finasteride can really mess with some people's hormones and have some adverse affects so I would be very careful with that recommendation
how does a good fragrance help my online dating? do you have some kind of "smello-phone" exclusively for attractive people? damn.
In my experience the most important attribute for meeting a woman is having the right type of job or social circle that opportunities are presented to you. Women both do and don't care about looks. They will absolutely date and marry guys who aren't traditionally hot but have great personalities and other stuff going for them. But it's also very hard for a guy like that to get a chance to demonstrate their other qualities without being able to get a foot in the door. Looks do that. I know quite a few guys with women far above their "league" looks-wise. Almost all of them have jobs that give them a steady flow of women coming in and a chance to look like experts when they show up. It's better to be a broke bartender than a rich engineer working remote in the dating world. I'm considering teaching scuba classes that I don't at all need the money from simply because it gives me this chance.
I hate to be the one that asks. How tall are you?
This is actually super important, especially USA. Self improvement doesn’t matter if you’re like 5’4
***When you ‘appear’ to care about yourself, others will more easily care about you.
I agree and disagree at the same time. No one will like you if you don’t have anything to offer other than your looks. Being charming can only go so far, and often, a few minutes away from bankruptcy if it’s your only capital.
You'd be surprised at the number of women that don't care about that. I've (34 M) been passed up by my fair share of women for "men" who don't have a job, car, no ambitions, and still live with their parents.
It’s about a foot in the door, OP admitted there’s other parts but this kicks things into gear.
If I may ask, what’s your race? As an Asian man that lost 60+ lbs down from 220 and built some of that back in muscle, has good hair, according to my friends a good fashion sense, great posture, a skincare routine, and a $700+ fragrance collection (I just like to smell good so I have quite a few). I’ve still had no success in dating, I’m not exactly ripped but I’m not fat by any means. I’m still working on getting more fit but it’s felt no different than my experience back in 2018 where I was 220 lbs with no sense of fashion and not really taking care of myself
This is complete bullshit
Too bad your improved looks didnt improve your brain.
Someone is happy to be a slob.
Good post OP. Man I wish it was that easy . I guess it might be for a semi good looking guy but when you really a fine mfka who's also a bad mfka the epitome of man ,I think it makes it more difficult to get chicks .They all worried I'm a player an gonna not be loyal and devoted and that is completely contrary to my character.Im loyal ,faithful ,attentive , pleasing to the eyes and to providing physical satisfaction ,capable of creating a incredible life for the right woman ,great with kids and pets ,ain't scared of another man on this earth and capable of defending on the ultimate level ,love to have fun , talented skilled in multiple trades ,I don't know how to be a liar , I'm kind and generous and helpful ,love spoiling my lady (when I have one). I'm a all around score for any woman ,if they could ever look past the looks to find not only a attractive outwardly man ,also a inwardly beautiful man . So to all the ladies out there if you see a hot dude and refrain from approaching him bcuz u think he's too good looking prolly a player ,do urself and Al of us sexy Mfkas out here a chance . You may be surprised to discover a total gem who just wants a down ass loyal woman (sorta attractive) who wants you to want them to want you to want him ...if that last part make sense. Take care everyone and as I say everyday and practice it too KEEP SMILING !
Imagine doing all of this, starting to get first dates, but never getting second ones. At what point do people realize the thing they thought was everything isn't actually everything or even remotely close to everything? This is the sort of thing that will open doors that used to be closed, but it won't get you very far through them, especially as you get older and people start to realize that having a pretty face around is pointless if you can't stand who they are.
How did you take your photos? It’s not all selfies right?
If you’re SHORT all bets are off…if you are employed in food hospitality same betting odds apply…
Let’s see the before and after
Being tall too I’m 5 8 hope I grow i bit taller I’m 20 right now
If I had a dollar for every time this opinion/topic came up on Reddit, I'd have enough to get surgery to become attractive.