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You answered your own question my friend. You have to choose to accept her as she is or not. It sounds like you fail to notice that she is deliberately trying to change her situation by being with you. You arent the "safe choice" your a better choice for her.
College is the time to make connections, sexually and otherwise, to learn about what you like in a partner. If she matches with you, talk with her about it. Im not sure if this is entirely clear in your post but are the 2 guys shes been with in the frat living with you? Because that would be terrible for your mental health.
Be vigilant of her behavior, it is the most telling thing you can observe. If she is disrespectful or starts up with her old ways, end it quickly
How she behaved with them absolutely matters just as much as previously cheating, previously playing people. It shows how they were okay with that kind of behaviour and it can come back any time.
Why is it that we stigmatize past poor behavior in terms of cheating but not in terms of promiscuity when talking about adequacy for a long term relationship?
IMO it’s a big difference because I think morally wrong to mislead or deceive people in the form of cheating in a relationship, but I don’t think it’s morally wrong to drink, party or have sex with consenting adults.
From the eyes of a monogamous person it is. They usually value physical intimacy to a level which prevents them from casual hookups. And differences in values reflected on one's behavior is immorality itself from the monogamous' POV. On top of picking toxic partners reflects toxic needs or unresolved traumas. If someone values healthy connections then they might deem this act as immoral too.
Same as doing drugs, selling drugs, selling your body...you dont necessarily hurt others but it goes against one's values and it is immoral.
Immorality doesnt depend on hurting someone although it definitely makes it easier to decide on it.
You have a fair point with the value system and it’s important to find someone with a similar value system. But there’s a difference between something being bad because you don’t like it and something being bad because it’s knowingly harmful to someone else. In the context of someone’s own life choosing their partner they can have whatever standards they want for their partner, but as far as making someone out to be a bad person because hey have a different value system, as long as that system isn’t hurtful to an involved third party.
Also society certainly does stigmatize drug use and promiscuity that you mention
It all depends on the context. Slapping on someone's wrist is hurtful to others, yet it is not worsely stigmatized than prostitution.
She is not a bad person, she is just immoral from where OP and also I stand from. She might have changed, change is also a factor. There is still a reasonable doubt associated with commitment if her past doesnt reflect any.
It really depends on the group of people we talk about. In my country society as a whole stigmatizes drug usage, and people who seek long term relationships stigmatize promiscuity or at least sceptical when it comes to relationship with promiscuous people.
Fair enough I just wouldn’t consider someone’s promiscuity outside of a relationship indicative of their level of commitment once in a relationship. In the same way I wouldn’t consider someone who plays a violent sport like boxing, American football, or rugby indicative of them being more likely to be violent toward me outside of that sport. But I guess others would be. To each their own with their value system I guess
You are rephrasing your argument time and time again until I wont bother to reply or whats the strategy here? :D
If a fuckboy who is notorious about pumping and dumping women came into your daughter's life. Would you be like, yeah trust him feel free to start a family with him and tell how **someone’s promiscuity outside of a relationship indicative of their level of commitment once in a relationship**? I you say yes you are lying, if you say no you just went against your own argument.
Your analogy is not an ideal one. A good one would be if they were a boxer any you wouldnt expect them to be able to protect themselves despite them defending themselves time and time again during the box match.
Well your situation implies said person treated women poorly if he’s a fuckboy so no I would not like that. But if someone has slept with lots of people but is known to be faithful while in a relationship than I would prefer that over someone whose slept with less people but hasn’t been in a relationship
I am a monogamous person who does not drink or do drugs, but I absolutely do not think that someone having some hook ups in their teens and twenties, or trying a few drugs or getting drunk a few times means they are morally 'wrong'. I understand that it is a personal opinion, however, please do not lump other monogamous people in with your judgements, as, from my experience and the other monogamous people I know, it is **not** morally wrong *'in the eyes of a monogamous person',* especially considering one night stands by a single person has nothing to do with cheating.
She had a series of toxic hookups and situationships by the age of 21. Would you consider a long term relationship with them?
If a fuckboy came to your daughter's life, who is known about pumping and dumping women, would you be like ohh a perfect candidate for her to have kids with? If yes then I know you are just lying to me.
I would judge someone on how they treat others, not how many people they slept with.
If they were open and honest then I would have zero interest or care about who or how many people they slept with in the past - as long as they get a clean STD result.
If they were a nasty person who had slept with one or no people then I wouldn't date them at all.
I am sorry your world view is so poisonous and I hope you get to a place of happiness and security in the future. Best wishes.
Yeah now I know you are full of bullshit. I already pity your daughter.
She would deserve a better and more protective parent not a pretentious someone who cant even give proper advice to prevent her from inevident hurt just because their woke and hypocrite mindset wouldnt let him to be honest.
Good luck not to you but to your daughter.
I can think of two potential outcomes, either she is truly trying to change and become a better person who chooses better partners and makes better decisions or she could regress back into that lifestyle and end up dumping you/cheating
All that matters in the end is if you trust her and are willing to risk the 2nd outcome for a chance at the 1st.
If you don't want to risk it, that is fine. End it for both your sakes and move on. If you don't but want to, then that's something for the two of you to work on.
Don't be afraid to end it if you so desire, if you know that you can not handle it, you'd save the two of you a lot of headache
I tend to not worry about the things I can do nothing to change. What could you possibly do about her past at this point? What matters more is the future, which you have some control over. If you seriously can't get over it then maybe let her go find a guy who will be more concerned with who she is now instead of her past. Would you think it's fair if she judged you for your past?
What exactly about her past is making you worried? Are you afraid that she's going to regress and go back to her wild ways? Or are you embarrassed that you know of 2 people she hooked up with and are wondering if they were better than you? You have to be honest with yourself on why her past is making you insecure.
Your insecurities are not a reflection of her. Trust me, making her feel bad about her past can have a serious impact on herself. And can ultimately affect the relationship.
Work with your insecurities or move on. Just because she can't change her past doesn't mean she can't grow and change herself.
Remember that human behavior is influenced by so many things, consciously and unconsciously, so there may have been situations in her life that made her act or be that way. Take this as a chance to get to know different aspects of her past, not just what you mentioned. Which can lead you to know her better and connect with her.
And even if she had that past for no deep reason, look at it with the perspective that she actually decided to change and be with you. Not every person is willing to do that for anybody.
you are focused on the past that you forget what the present situation is. She decided YOU, to have a relationship with YOU, that YOU are the one she wants to see dailey.
you are valuing yourself lower then the frats, its your mentaliteit that needs to change in my opinion. why you dont see yourself as the winner from the 2 other guys?
Her past is there and it's impossible to change and it isn't gonna go away, so you've either gotta talk to her about it and try to get over whatever you're hung up on, or you've gotta break up with her.
If you can’t get over her past it might just mean that you two aren’t compatible, and share different values when it comes to sex and love. I’d would keep looking for a better match.
There’s an abundance of women out there, you don’t have to settle for one that have incompatible values.
And sometimes but not always, past behaviors is an indicator of future behavior. Maybe she has changed, but maybe that’s still not your cup of tea.
Why is everyone in the comments absolving her of her own past and responsibility? Like bro, I get that people change, but PLEASE take accountability for your past actions & understand that they will affect the way people perceive you, permanently.
You’re suffering from retro active jealousy. Fuelled by low self esteem.
Research the topic. You can’t change what’s happened, only you react emotionally. DM me if you want me to elaborate more on why you’re feeling the way you are feeling.
She’s probably had some trauma in the past. She’s human. It’s up to you to accept her as she is. Has she made the conscious decision to change her life? Is she taking action? The proof is in the pudding.
"Does anyone know how to overlook this?" It can't be overlooked, nor should it. Many years ago, if a woman had sex before marriage, she was considered "damaged goods". If you have the notion that she is somehow 'damaged goods', you need to change your attitude, if you want happiness. She has done nothing wrong. Life presents itself in ways that show youth how to have lots of fun. Part of growing up is running full-speed into brick walls. We'd been told by the old fuddy-duddies there were bricks walls, but all the cool music vids, sitcoms, and everything else in the banal "fight for your right to party" culture show them as Barney playing in a world of foam.
If she has learned from her mistakes, and you are mature to realize the realities of life, the future is bright.
What's wrong with her past? Can she not play the field to figure out what she wants in life?
You shouldn't feel anything about her past, liking sex isnt bad and doesn't mean she's a cheater. She's just a sexual person, which is something that can be so fun for you. Believe me, when I talk to my friends, in their 40s+ they're avoiding sex with their husbands, meanwhile my husband knows I'm all about him and I'm very happy to demonstrate.
It sounds like you have a woman who loves how you love her and that includes sex. Enjoy what you have together instead of listening to all these weak men on here or getting into your head.
Anyways, don't shame her, just appreciate her and the fulfilment that comes from a woman who will show you her appreciation both emotionally AND physically.
I don't know what she needs to be 'reformed' from - she was not a criminal lmao.
If you are too insecure to date someone with a history then don't date someone with a history but the older you get the less likely common it will become to meet people who haven't had exes.
I think you need to get a grip tbh. You are mad at someone for doing things they did before they even knew you existed :S how would you feel if she started saying she couldn't get over crushes or porn you watched before you ever met, or anyone you may have been intimate with. It's weird and insecure and really your options are to either seek professional help for your issues, or leave her because to stay or make her feel bad about it would not be a good option. :S
well id like to say first off that she uses the term reformed, not me lmao and i would say made but i guess a reflection of my insecurities, i absolutely dont make her feel bad about it has ive expressed my concern in a way that does not blame her or make her feel bad for her past but let her know its something im struggling with especially becuase i have to see and hear about these guys nearly every day
I've got no golden nugget advice. Except that over the next few years you'll come to realize that people have few and people have many partners and that even people who aren't very promiscuous can end up having lots of partners. And it doesn't mean they value sex less or their own bodies or that they will struggle with not cheating.
I'd say the best solution is to talk through your insecurities around this with your GF. Brutally honest exposure and talking things through has always been smartest in hindsight for me. And every time I've done it reaction from parties have always been why on earth didn't we talk about this sooner.
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You answered your own question my friend. You have to choose to accept her as she is or not. It sounds like you fail to notice that she is deliberately trying to change her situation by being with you. You arent the "safe choice" your a better choice for her. College is the time to make connections, sexually and otherwise, to learn about what you like in a partner. If she matches with you, talk with her about it. Im not sure if this is entirely clear in your post but are the 2 guys shes been with in the frat living with you? Because that would be terrible for your mental health. Be vigilant of her behavior, it is the most telling thing you can observe. If she is disrespectful or starts up with her old ways, end it quickly
If you can’t live with it you can’t live with it. I’ve been there before
Most people have previous partners. What matters is not how she behaved with them but how she behaves with you.
How she behaved with them absolutely matters just as much as previously cheating, previously playing people. It shows how they were okay with that kind of behaviour and it can come back any time. Why is it that we stigmatize past poor behavior in terms of cheating but not in terms of promiscuity when talking about adequacy for a long term relationship?
IMO it’s a big difference because I think morally wrong to mislead or deceive people in the form of cheating in a relationship, but I don’t think it’s morally wrong to drink, party or have sex with consenting adults.
From the eyes of a monogamous person it is. They usually value physical intimacy to a level which prevents them from casual hookups. And differences in values reflected on one's behavior is immorality itself from the monogamous' POV. On top of picking toxic partners reflects toxic needs or unresolved traumas. If someone values healthy connections then they might deem this act as immoral too. Same as doing drugs, selling drugs, selling your body...you dont necessarily hurt others but it goes against one's values and it is immoral. Immorality doesnt depend on hurting someone although it definitely makes it easier to decide on it.
You have a fair point with the value system and it’s important to find someone with a similar value system. But there’s a difference between something being bad because you don’t like it and something being bad because it’s knowingly harmful to someone else. In the context of someone’s own life choosing their partner they can have whatever standards they want for their partner, but as far as making someone out to be a bad person because hey have a different value system, as long as that system isn’t hurtful to an involved third party. Also society certainly does stigmatize drug use and promiscuity that you mention
It all depends on the context. Slapping on someone's wrist is hurtful to others, yet it is not worsely stigmatized than prostitution. She is not a bad person, she is just immoral from where OP and also I stand from. She might have changed, change is also a factor. There is still a reasonable doubt associated with commitment if her past doesnt reflect any. It really depends on the group of people we talk about. In my country society as a whole stigmatizes drug usage, and people who seek long term relationships stigmatize promiscuity or at least sceptical when it comes to relationship with promiscuous people.
Fair enough I just wouldn’t consider someone’s promiscuity outside of a relationship indicative of their level of commitment once in a relationship. In the same way I wouldn’t consider someone who plays a violent sport like boxing, American football, or rugby indicative of them being more likely to be violent toward me outside of that sport. But I guess others would be. To each their own with their value system I guess
You are rephrasing your argument time and time again until I wont bother to reply or whats the strategy here? :D If a fuckboy who is notorious about pumping and dumping women came into your daughter's life. Would you be like, yeah trust him feel free to start a family with him and tell how **someone’s promiscuity outside of a relationship indicative of their level of commitment once in a relationship**? I you say yes you are lying, if you say no you just went against your own argument. Your analogy is not an ideal one. A good one would be if they were a boxer any you wouldnt expect them to be able to protect themselves despite them defending themselves time and time again during the box match.
Well your situation implies said person treated women poorly if he’s a fuckboy so no I would not like that. But if someone has slept with lots of people but is known to be faithful while in a relationship than I would prefer that over someone whose slept with less people but hasn’t been in a relationship
Isnt in OPs situation she was a fuckgirl? She is not know to be faithful thats the point.
I am a monogamous person who does not drink or do drugs, but I absolutely do not think that someone having some hook ups in their teens and twenties, or trying a few drugs or getting drunk a few times means they are morally 'wrong'. I understand that it is a personal opinion, however, please do not lump other monogamous people in with your judgements, as, from my experience and the other monogamous people I know, it is **not** morally wrong *'in the eyes of a monogamous person',* especially considering one night stands by a single person has nothing to do with cheating.
She had a series of toxic hookups and situationships by the age of 21. Would you consider a long term relationship with them? If a fuckboy came to your daughter's life, who is known about pumping and dumping women, would you be like ohh a perfect candidate for her to have kids with? If yes then I know you are just lying to me.
I would judge someone on how they treat others, not how many people they slept with. If they were open and honest then I would have zero interest or care about who or how many people they slept with in the past - as long as they get a clean STD result. If they were a nasty person who had slept with one or no people then I wouldn't date them at all. I am sorry your world view is so poisonous and I hope you get to a place of happiness and security in the future. Best wishes.
Yeah now I know you are full of bullshit. I already pity your daughter. She would deserve a better and more protective parent not a pretentious someone who cant even give proper advice to prevent her from inevident hurt just because their woke and hypocrite mindset wouldnt let him to be honest. Good luck not to you but to your daughter.
I can think of two potential outcomes, either she is truly trying to change and become a better person who chooses better partners and makes better decisions or she could regress back into that lifestyle and end up dumping you/cheating All that matters in the end is if you trust her and are willing to risk the 2nd outcome for a chance at the 1st. If you don't want to risk it, that is fine. End it for both your sakes and move on. If you don't but want to, then that's something for the two of you to work on. Don't be afraid to end it if you so desire, if you know that you can not handle it, you'd save the two of you a lot of headache
I tend to not worry about the things I can do nothing to change. What could you possibly do about her past at this point? What matters more is the future, which you have some control over. If you seriously can't get over it then maybe let her go find a guy who will be more concerned with who she is now instead of her past. Would you think it's fair if she judged you for your past?
People say don't worry about the past but geez if her past is nothing but a bunch of toxic relationships that's something to be concerned about.
What exactly about her past is making you worried? Are you afraid that she's going to regress and go back to her wild ways? Or are you embarrassed that you know of 2 people she hooked up with and are wondering if they were better than you? You have to be honest with yourself on why her past is making you insecure.
Your insecurities are not a reflection of her. Trust me, making her feel bad about her past can have a serious impact on herself. And can ultimately affect the relationship. Work with your insecurities or move on. Just because she can't change her past doesn't mean she can't grow and change herself. Remember that human behavior is influenced by so many things, consciously and unconsciously, so there may have been situations in her life that made her act or be that way. Take this as a chance to get to know different aspects of her past, not just what you mentioned. Which can lead you to know her better and connect with her. And even if she had that past for no deep reason, look at it with the perspective that she actually decided to change and be with you. Not every person is willing to do that for anybody.
you are focused on the past that you forget what the present situation is. She decided YOU, to have a relationship with YOU, that YOU are the one she wants to see dailey. you are valuing yourself lower then the frats, its your mentaliteit that needs to change in my opinion. why you dont see yourself as the winner from the 2 other guys?
Exactly. OP may think he’s inferior to the frat guys but obviously she doesn’t.
Her past is there and it's impossible to change and it isn't gonna go away, so you've either gotta talk to her about it and try to get over whatever you're hung up on, or you've gotta break up with her.
If you can’t get over her past it might just mean that you two aren’t compatible, and share different values when it comes to sex and love. I’d would keep looking for a better match. There’s an abundance of women out there, you don’t have to settle for one that have incompatible values. And sometimes but not always, past behaviors is an indicator of future behavior. Maybe she has changed, but maybe that’s still not your cup of tea.
Why is everyone in the comments absolving her of her own past and responsibility? Like bro, I get that people change, but PLEASE take accountability for your past actions & understand that they will affect the way people perceive you, permanently.
You’re suffering from retro active jealousy. Fuelled by low self esteem. Research the topic. You can’t change what’s happened, only you react emotionally. DM me if you want me to elaborate more on why you’re feeling the way you are feeling.
If u can’t get over it. End it. That’s it. That’s all u can do.
She’s probably had some trauma in the past. She’s human. It’s up to you to accept her as she is. Has she made the conscious decision to change her life? Is she taking action? The proof is in the pudding.
"Does anyone know how to overlook this?" It can't be overlooked, nor should it. Many years ago, if a woman had sex before marriage, she was considered "damaged goods". If you have the notion that she is somehow 'damaged goods', you need to change your attitude, if you want happiness. She has done nothing wrong. Life presents itself in ways that show youth how to have lots of fun. Part of growing up is running full-speed into brick walls. We'd been told by the old fuddy-duddies there were bricks walls, but all the cool music vids, sitcoms, and everything else in the banal "fight for your right to party" culture show them as Barney playing in a world of foam. If she has learned from her mistakes, and you are mature to realize the realities of life, the future is bright.
What's wrong with her past? Can she not play the field to figure out what she wants in life? You shouldn't feel anything about her past, liking sex isnt bad and doesn't mean she's a cheater. She's just a sexual person, which is something that can be so fun for you. Believe me, when I talk to my friends, in their 40s+ they're avoiding sex with their husbands, meanwhile my husband knows I'm all about him and I'm very happy to demonstrate. It sounds like you have a woman who loves how you love her and that includes sex. Enjoy what you have together instead of listening to all these weak men on here or getting into your head. Anyways, don't shame her, just appreciate her and the fulfilment that comes from a woman who will show you her appreciation both emotionally AND physically.
I don't know what she needs to be 'reformed' from - she was not a criminal lmao. If you are too insecure to date someone with a history then don't date someone with a history but the older you get the less likely common it will become to meet people who haven't had exes. I think you need to get a grip tbh. You are mad at someone for doing things they did before they even knew you existed :S how would you feel if she started saying she couldn't get over crushes or porn you watched before you ever met, or anyone you may have been intimate with. It's weird and insecure and really your options are to either seek professional help for your issues, or leave her because to stay or make her feel bad about it would not be a good option. :S
well id like to say first off that she uses the term reformed, not me lmao and i would say made but i guess a reflection of my insecurities, i absolutely dont make her feel bad about it has ive expressed my concern in a way that does not blame her or make her feel bad for her past but let her know its something im struggling with especially becuase i have to see and hear about these guys nearly every day
When you started asked for our advice, you have already got the answer
I've got no golden nugget advice. Except that over the next few years you'll come to realize that people have few and people have many partners and that even people who aren't very promiscuous can end up having lots of partners. And it doesn't mean they value sex less or their own bodies or that they will struggle with not cheating. I'd say the best solution is to talk through your insecurities around this with your GF. Brutally honest exposure and talking things through has always been smartest in hindsight for me. And every time I've done it reaction from parties have always been why on earth didn't we talk about this sooner.
You don't have to be okay with it, and there are other girls who didn't live that life. All that "but she chose YOU" stuff is nonsense.