Here are many things I disagree with:
- popularization of snowball method, when research shows that the avalanche is the most economic way of paying off loans
- 8% withdrawal rate when research showed 4% is the sustainable rate
- AUM 1% fees to manage investments. How do they manage it? Just basically buying index funds
- pausing 401k contributions with match to pay off even 4% loans
- outdated housing advice
- telling people to work 80 hours instead of focusing on the long term
There are many many more. People shouldn’t listen to him beyond the “don’t spend more than you make” advice.
P.S. r/debtfree moderator runs a free newsletter that talks about strategies, tips, and effective debt payoff methods weekly. Join 3,600 readers - https://debtadvice.io
I can’t stand his complete arrogance and how he can’t fathom that what he says might not work for every single person.
I heard him tell a caller one time “You can follow my advice, or you can be wrong… those are your only two options” and that was when it hit me that he has no clue what real life is like, and it’s sad.
I remember I saw a video where a family doctor called in asking how to handle a six figure debt from med school and Ramsey starts incorrectly stating that her specialty should make way more than what she claimed and that she is silly for taking a lowball offer (it wasn’t lowball, Ramsey just acted like he knew what he was talking about) and she tried to say that her salary was on par with others. But good ole know it all Ramsey just kept saying she was wrong and he was right cuz he knows other doctors that make bank yada yada yada. How u gonna tell a doctor they’re wrong about how much they make?
I’ve seen him do this a couple of times, I think once or twice I interpreted this more as “why the heck did you take on $300K worth of debt if you knew the cap for your specific job is only $110K/yr?” Less so than challenging the actual market value/salary of that particular job. I do agree and think that challenging someone on whether their salary is competitive is stupid and unproductive when he’s basically spitballing and doesn’t know that exact area’s job economy, but at the same time I think the point to be made is that just because you become a “doctor” of any kind doesn’t mean the degree and debt are worth it for the salary, unless it pays dividends later via higher pay.
His advice is good for people who have a high income, but they're bad with money. That's his target demographic. When people call in who have a low income his best advice is to get "a bigger shovel". Of course most poor people would make more money if they could or knew how.
I love it hearing the generic "get a bigger shovel," "spend less than you make", and "find a way to increase your income" advise.
I mean, it's not wrong, but also, no fucking shit...
Agree he preaches to the masses an I do know quite a few people who have used his system and it really helped but for some this is not the way. Not all debt is bad and honestly learning how to use debt and manage risk is truly how to advance up
If it’s for something that makes money then sure, debt can be useful. The average American has 5k in credit card debt and pays nearly $1000 in interest to credit card companies every year. That is not good debt.
I don’t think Dave Ramsey is meant to be for everyone. People find him when they’re at the bottom and can’t manage money well and Dave’s rules are great for those people imo and gives them a good kick in the rear to getting out of bad debt. He’s not mean for people that know what they’re doing or have the discipline to effectively evaluate risk. Ppl go after Dave and say he’s wrong on some things and in a vacuum, he is. But that disregards the type of people that are his main audience and who r the people he can help the most. For those people, his advice is great.
Have you heard about the weird, religious contracts he makes all of his employees sign? Or the mandatory charitable donations his program requires people make?
The guy literally just gives you a plan to avalanche or snowball, and suddenly thinks he’s Jerome fucking Powell. Dave Ramsey is a shameless clown. He’s up there with doctor Oz or doctor Phil.
If you work at Ramsey, you know his values, I don't agree with firing pregnant unwed moms and fighting firing a guy who makes you $ but is cheating repeatedly on his wife but he's open. If you fit in the evangelical atmosphere and want your money and life an open book, never work at home, it's fine. One wife of an ex employee used to have to hide she used credit because it's part of working there, your family doesn't. But if you aren't a "personality" why does it matter? Or the employee?
His daughter cringes at times...I don't think they are the same politically or in other ways but it's her bread and butter and she tries to get him off rants and politics. They weren't dirt poor, he made bad decisions and blames credit card companies for wanting the money he put on the cards. Duh. If you say you want to put balances (like I did) on 0% card and pay it off interest free, he'll balk. Why? It's not on his snowball. I would have taken much long to pay it off and I never put anything on the transfer card but that since the interest would have been 12% at the time I did it.
He helps people who are totally disorganized and the AA type that really can't handle having a venue to take money they don't have, such as credit or loans.
Dave Ramsey is severely out of touch with the real world at this point. You should trust his financial advice just as much as you would trust Dr. Phil with mental health advice
Yeah in high school our finance class followed the program he had. In high school I thought it was awesome and I started doing more research and realized how stupid his advice is. Can be good for some situations, but a lot of it is just awful
I'm pretty sure his program is just a plagiarized version of Crown Financial's Money Map, which I've heard is a plan he followed in his younger years. They're pretty much the same thing, but Crown's is much more reasonable and doable.
You need to cherry pick. He's good for the type who need for lack of a better example, an "AA" type of program, you follow these rules and don't do anything else. You can't handle credit or money so you need me to guide you.
I wonder though how many of his "debtfree screams" stay that way after the adrenaline goes away.
Dave Ramsey offers your standard, run of the mill advice for getting out of and staying out of debt. If you had a financial debt advisor they would be offering the same or similar advice. He also has some ludicrous ideas on how to live that just are not realistic for the average person. I personally don’t believe that he is any kind of financial savant.
Step 1: File for bankruptcy. Step 2: Create a financial course with 0 nuance. Step 3: Sprinkle in some Bible verses. Step 4 (complete the grift): Use churches to buy and/or distribute your course as if it is the fifth gospel.
Step 5: Repeat catchy marketing phrases like "Debt is dumb" to charge tens to hundreds of dollars for books, programs, and seminars that fit on one side of a note card.
He's made millions of dollars telling people
"Sell asset pay debt"
99/100 times he just confirms the other person's plan that they came in with, without giving real advice
Dave Ramsey, like any of these financial experts, give some good advice. Some not so good advice. You can’t read one article and know everything. You have to read a lot, take everything with a grain of salt, and figure out what works best for you and your individual situation.
His advice is good for consumer mindset people. If you are trying to build big wealth debt is a tool used for investments. Just depends on the type of person you are regarding money. As for 99% of people he has the right idea. Debt and credit should not be used for buying shoes, game consoles, or cars. Use debt to buy assets that generate more income than the payment on that debt. Real estate, watch trading, markets, business, etc.
Yes exactly. The type of people who finance 50k trucks, shop shop shop and make financially irresponsible decisions will work well with Dave ramsey. I like that he encourages people to do the boring thing of simply saving, budgeting and not getting into debt. Usually these financial advice people encourage people to look for tricks and hacks to get rid of their debts. There is no better trick than being frugal, budgeting and saving.
But if you are already financially competent and savvy already then you will find him very unhelpful. I think there are alot of financially savvy people here critising his methods not realising that he is not targeted to them at all.
Not a fraud but overly simplistic. his general advice works for people that have no self control or desire to learn how things work.
The worst in his simplistic examples is ignoring taxes and other costs. He'll say to someone 40k in debt that makes 80k, ok live on 40k and you'll be debt free in a year. Uhh yeah, not quite Dave. FICA, federal, state, healthcare premiums often knock that down 25-35%. Then he'll say do not contribute anything to retirement while getting out of consumer debt. Stupid to leave an employer match on the table.
Pretty sure he has! Again only when in consumer debt like CCs or student loans.. It's part of "baby steps"...BS 2 payoff all debt other than mortgage before BS4 which is retirement savings
Here is an article where he has said it too
https://finance.yahoo.com/news/employer-401-k-match-pay-110014543.html
Okay well I just listened to his newest episodes today and he literally told at least 2 people to keep matching their employer even while paying down debt.
I am an avid Dave Ramsey fan (go ahead, downvote me lol), and Dave has NEVER said to keep an employer match if you are in debt. I have listened to every episode of The Ramsey Show this year, and you are simply wrong.
This bald lunatic is the reason rent is unaffordable everywhere, because he is constantly ranting about raising rent until it hurts.
Fuck him and anyone who doesn't see what a prick he is.
He actually did enjoy his life, I was trying to say that it hits closer to home when someone you know dies "young" and Ramsy would have advised this guy to not buy the cars and the boat and not take the trips because he wasn't a millionaire.
Agreed, I did say save but don't eat beans and rice for years like Ramsey says to just to pay your debts. Maybe he is extra conservative in this way to get the point across?
If you are in heavy debt that’s his advice to quickly get out of debt. I can’t say I disagree with it. If you’re in heavy debt you can’t go buying boats to enjoy now.
Dave Ramsey is good for people who are:
1. Scared of money
2. Terrible with money
3. Don’t understand money
You’ll never catch the rich following his advice.
Ramsey also has a specific demographic of people who call in who have potential to be millionaires due to their income, they're just terrible with money. I feel like anytime I've listened to his show, he's taking a call from someone who's making 6 figures or close to it, or part of a 6 figure dual income house hold. And because they make so much, they made really dumb financial decisions thinking they could afford it when they couldn't.
The amount of people who don't keep a budget in the US is insane. A large portion of people making over $100k are living paycheck to paycheck, and it isn't always because rent is too high, they're just stupid when it comes to money.
I personally know a guy who lives with his GF, and they eat out so much, he and his GF spend about $1500 on just eating out each month.
You are wrong. Real rich people have a lot of debt. They typically borrow money to make more money. In another word, they use other people's money to make money.
I may be in the minority but the baby step process works and worked for me. Life’s been an adventure but most of that wouldn’t have been possible without hearing people’s debt free screaming gives hope to people who are desperate like I was.
Is life perfect? Not exactly. But am I in a stare of peace financially? Absolutely. Is it Dave’s fault? Yes.
And what’s crazy is I found the show through This American Life!
I worked a Dave Ramsey show once, he made the entire tech crew stand in a circle to pray at the top of every morning. Really rubbed me the wrong way. The arrogance, to assume everyone shares your religion!
Most that work there are Christians of his faith or said they'd adhere to his policies. I don't like hypocrites though who keep a guy who is cheating because he is making him money and fire a woman who got pregnant with no caring but if they call on the phone, he's all nice to them. I always think he is secretly thinking bad things since he could do that to someone without forgiveness at work.
He constantly flips back and forth. He'll ask about take home pay and then he'll ask how much do you make. IRL people use gross pay when talking about how much they make.
I've wondered about this too. And he tells people to pay off student loan debt even if they qualify for forgiveness. Wondering how much debt he had forgiven.
He's against it if you are in a weird contract with the employer where you have to stay for years to be forgiven. Otherwise pay it back. He's all about independence. He's not against it if it's just giving out though he has said that on the show he's happy for people if it actually passes and it's just a freebie.
He still does, so many that come on say their church does FPU. He is always asking what one and thanks them. I'm sure a job at Ramsey is calling new churches or ones that stopped and trying to sell them the packages again. He still travels and does book tours and talks and cruises, he gets so much money from that, from his real estate rentals and investments. He has his personalites write books when they've only been on the set a year or so...whatever they can make is good and then he discounts them and pushes them again. I don't think Rachel's book or George's sells well after the first few months. Then he gives them away.
Please for the love of god do some math and start back up your 401k if your employer offers a match. Personal finance is personal and it is math. Your individual plan should have nuance and math involved.
And when you're done with bs3 run away from dave and check out the r/bogleheads for investment advice instead of being sold to his high front load fee advisor network.
You're still on BS2 after 15 years??? Just imagine how lightning ahead you'd be if you did bankruptcy 10-15 years ago.
(And yes I know BK only helps if you can change your personal financial outlook going forward and not go back to bad habits)
"Live like a pauper till you get out of debt."
There's no nuance, no balance, no acknowledgement that there's more to life than being debt free ASAP. People can't sustain it, because it's a miserable existence.
If it's a matter of living reasonably well and taking 7 years, or being a prisoner to your debt for 4 years, the former is healthier. Debt-paying fanaticism brings life-costs that can't be quantified with money.
He kept saying having a paid off car drives different. I'm sitting here with 2 paid off cars and it feels no different. Pretty sure the grass will feel the exact same when my 2.5% mortgaged house is paid of in 27 years.
Dave Ramsey's formula for wealth.....sell car, buy used car, eat rice and beans, work overtime or 2 or 3 jobs until you are debt free then become a millionaire like him. Otherwise you are just plain stupid.
His advice is general and for people with low IQ. For 65% of people it works great because they spend more than they make on stupid financial decisions. Like making 40k and driving an 80k SUV. He fixes people with no financial literacy, which is like 65% of the USA.
The other 35% of us are smart enough to realize that debt isn’t all that terrible if it’s not on stupid consumer goods. If you have cash flowing assets, high pay, and an understanding of investing Dave is not for you.
He does admit sales is his thing, sold houses young with his charisma and fast talking. He just did a lot of dumb things. Now he blames credit when that wasn't his issue. Even most people who carry way too much debt aren't "hurting" It's not good but they aren't bankrupt, they just live with loans and can pay them and don't have trouble sleeping. I'm not advocating that at all, but he is wrong that most are unhappy. He never had his wife work as he asks others to do, she had 3 kids with debt, she had a home, not a shack, they had food, clothes and no extras for awhile. but the kids had toys and their own rooms. Rachel talked about how he was with picking up their stuff and cleaning their rooms and how they got allowances to save and give with.
His advice boils down to spending less than you make, paying off debt, saving a percentage of surplus income and investing it to take advantage of compound interest. Pretty solid advice.
Yep. Half of these people talking crap about him are either,
A. In a significant amount of debt themselves
B. Preach about other get rich quick schemes
C. Think they’re more intelligent because his advice is simple and easy to understand, therefore they think it’s for the poor / Low IQ individuals.
I’m gonna do me, follow the baby steps as planned, build enough to enjoy life later on. That’s it.
His basic principles are legit but basically common sense things people should already inherently know. Sadly many don’t know common principles such as living withhin their means and basic math.
Ramsey is a hardened prick.
No one has gone broke following his method. And many people need his swift kick in the ass.
But the model is sound. Stick with it, and you will reach financial security.
And they would have been even further behind without his advice.
His target audience isn't ready to optimize. His target audience is trying to use a $60k income to pay for $40k in credit card debt because they can't afford to eat anymore.
I don't follow him or anything, but have helped several friends/family get out of the holes they dug themselves into by using very similar methods to his. It works. Budgeting and sticking to a budget are skills way too many people don't have. That's where his style of advice works.
Ramsey is not speaking to finance bros.
The family of six with credit card interest consuming 50% of their split schedule hourly wage is not interested in optimization.
He's said that he did. I don't know if he's ever given any definite proof of this, but he has claimed that after rebuilding his wealth, he went back and repaid all the debtors that he had bankrupted on.
He was a millionaire that flew close to the sun. Spent too much money flipping properties and leveraging debt to his advantage until a law came into action and banks called their dues.
He doesn't actually know the struggle of the single mom calling into his show about making $100 last.
Have you read his experiences? He had two kids when he filed bankruptcy, and the bank took everything from him. He had no house, no car, nothing, and he had two kids to provide for. Dave has been in the same situation.
Yes it is fair that he can give that advice. He was significantly in debt and bankrupt and had to pull himself up to where he is. You don’t just have a 700mil company and not work hard. He knows what it means to work hard and tells people that.
Dave Ramsey’s advice is extremely surface level basic advice, but what he’s really doing is changing the mindset. Telling someone to cut up their credit cards is extremely basic, yes, but it’s adjusting the mindset that they aren’t there to fall back on.
I agree that if you're in serious debt that one way to overcome it is to "slave away" and work 80-90 hours a week. Basic personal finance... increase income, decrease expenses, ideally both. I don't know anything about Dave Ramsey, but do agree that using that approach is a way to pay down/off debt faster.
I was taught to be financially responsible from my dad who had almost nothing and shared his mistakes.
Wife and I have been "cash only" for maybe 25-28 years, own multiple homes and did about what Dave suggests before he was famous...
We lived poor for 15 years or so while our friends lived in up, today were retired, live the life we want, and have no worries about money.
We taught our kids early, long before I was savvy at that age... and they were financially secure younger than we were...
Of those of you who have replied are debt free with assets over, say 3 million please share..
Were mid 70's and have only purchased 4 new cars in our married life because they loose 20% in the first month of ownership... but we own 6 homes, have cash in the bank and live or life, basically on his program....
We froze our credit when we were 50, no clue what our credit score is and don't care...
We, with our kids are teaching financial responsibility to our college age grandkids with no college debt...
Thanks for listening
He tells us to eat beans and rice and work 2 full-time jobs with very little sleep. That level of stress, sleep deprivation and a shitty diet will literally cause disease. I hate him for this.
He is a real surly bastard if people don't take his advice and he seems to have a disdain for people asking genuine questions because they just simply don't know how to approach a situation
As others in here say, he is out of touch. However, you can’t deny that the foundation of what he preaches is solid advice for being smart and keeping yourself from getting in a bind. Paying down debt, investing long-term, and keeping a safety net are pretty hard rules to argue against.
I take what works and leave the rest Out of consumer debt 6 mo energy fund
I use credit cards but have never carried a balance tho
Helped me with the drive to pay off car way early I started to hate looking at finance charges
but if you listen to him it didn't stop with bankruptcy. [https://youtu.be/r1NJzEYARlM?si=UFJeH-2Cad9BBArp](https://youtu.be/r1NJzEYARlM?si=UFJeH-2Cad9BBArp)
Not a fraud but yes probably not the greatest either. There is a staggering percentage of westerners who live week to week with staggering amounts of debt and no idea on how to get out of that loop. That is his target audience and it works for him. He helps people with poor financial planning skills become just okay at financial planning and that’s something at least.
Is he solving problems yes. Is he the best at doing that? Probably not but oh well.
It’s good advice for the average person. And he’s right about people being stupid with their money. However, if you are trying to be, let’s a say a millionaire, by 40 - he’s not the guy to take advice from. Most people that are in a position to make a ton of money aren’t having the issues that people call his show have.
Definitely a charlatan. His "methods" are really just a ploy to get poor sods into a religious cult. He's bonkers. He's over there criticizing people for buying anything, but it's totally cool to piss away money on his books and workshops. Not to mention the evangelical to Dave pipeline. Lol
If you believe he is right, follow his principles or live with the life you choose face the outcome of those decisions. Whether he is fraud or not has nothing to do how you choose to live. If you are in 40k credit card debt. First thing in his advice he says never use credit card due to 26% interest. However someone people find it absurd not use credit card but his message is, if you use cash it give you hard stop on spending habit while credit card makes you overspend due to convenience. Other people believe if I get 3% cash back on everything why should I not spend using credit card. But those people fail to realize that not everyone has that much discipline where you can control your spending.
One of the bigger gripes I have is that he tells people, "You're eating beans and rice for the next for years until this debt is gone."
I would fucking kill myself if i had to eat the exact same thing every single day of my life. If this crushing debt is making me depressed beyond belief, let me at least find happiness in the occasional steak or hamburger every now and then.
His system only works for people who are absolutely horrible I mean suck ass when it comes to finances. Other than that I don’t like him at all..his investing philosophy suck ass..and these mutual funds he talk about. If you just put your money in sp500 they will outperform that crap and way less expense ratio
No one is 100% right or wrong … he does have good advice for certain people in certain stages or areas of life
Not all applies and I wouldn’t follow all of it
For example I don’t agree of not using a credit card to accumulate points to travel for free they money will be spent anyways so might as well get free travel out of it etc
Is he a fraud? No. Whatever else he says his life and the mistakes he made to get him to embrace being debt free are an open book. You can find numerous resources where he went through his journey.
Idk imo the vase advice if “never use money you don’t have” and “work your ass off to get out of debt” is pretty good, if not incredibly basic advice.
I worked full time while going to college and aimed for zero days off during the summer because I didn’t want student debt. I think he’s good at encouraging that kind of mindset.
Of course, but we’re talking about just getting out of debt, not becoming a millionaire.
Imo he’s a good source to look to when it comes to just having a positive net worth; and then using better resources that are more with-the-times when it comes to building wealth for yourself and the next generation.
His advice to get out of debt is good. He gives you a path to follow and if you follow it, it will work out. I went through his “financial peace university” and am completely debt free.
Would I follow him on investment advice, no. Would I follow him to get out of debt, yes and it works.
Dude is closer to a fraud than he is a "financial guru". As with most boomers, they think it was all their smarts and wits that got them their riches, not the fact they lived in one of the most prosperous times in America and could buy houses for less than the price of a car and watch them appreciate 1,000% over the next couple decades.
Everything he says is utter garbage. And I don’t know how I stumbled to this subreddit but being debt free is stupid. Apple takes out debt for everything they do. They’re 108 billion in the hole. Yet sitting on 162 billion in cash reserves. They know they can make more money on the debt than the interest accrued. There’s good debt and bad debt. Learn the differences, and stop listening to Dave Ramsey. He’s a fucking quack. When I had credit card debt, I just got another balance transfer card and paid it down with 0 interest, and utilization went down too, raised my credit score. Debt is as bad as you make it, if you’re irresponsible you’ll be like Dave Ramsey and stay the hell away from it if you’re smart. But if you’re really smart you’ll use it as leverage.
He annoys me. Especially with his work 80 hours a week/slave away pitch. That isn’t a reality for some who are also caregivers. That stance leaves no room for nuanced lifestyles.
Just like any other financial guru, you have to know what advice is good versus bad. Overall, I think he’s solid and he does offer some good insight, especially compared to all the new wannabe financial gurus on IG and TikTok
Ramsey really grinds my gears. He isn’t a licensed advisor anymore so he can give out blanket advice to the masses and not get in trouble for it.
Advice that is good for you may not be good for me. Everyone is different so advice should be tailored to each individual and their situation.
Once someone gains a modicum of knowledge regarding investing, any level of sophistication at all, Ramsey’s advice is no longer relevant.
At the end of the day, he’s a hack.
Edited because I had to add another thought so I rearranged my entire comment.
Idk if he's a fraud, but he has not kept up with the times and has no awareness of the current economy. His advice isn't bad if you apply it a few decades ago
Nah.
He’s basically “personal finance for dummies.” And he says really stupid shit sometimes because he has to remain “on brand.” But for the most part he provides what’s overly simplistic but generally sound advice for irresponsible and/or financially illiterate people.
He makes it very clear that his stance is coming from: been there, done that, and it was the worst thing he has gone through and he doesn't want others to go through the same. He teaches personal responsibility and independence. I haven't paid him a penny other than a $10 book. And I got my family out of $80k in debt following his plan. Meanwhile the rest of my family who despise him are still about 80,000 in student loan debt all these years. So, who came out on top here? I'm the one that listened to him but everyone else poo pooed it and didn't do anything. It takes strong discipline..that's exactly what he teaches. Other financial advisors teach different tactics but they really don't harp on the discipline part and the discipline part is exactly what is needed for most people.
I can come up with a litany of things I really dislike about DR.
I wouldn't put "fraud" on the list. He has life experience that caused him to come up with a program that is clear and prescriptive for getting out of debt. It works.
It's an island of good that has grown shitshow tentacles.
I'm waiting for him to open his mythical car dealership with all these perfectly good $1000 cars. I'll take any piece of shit with heat, ac, and no leaks. The cheapest cars I can find that aren't shit are $6000 and too cheap to finance or it's a big enough amount to get a loan and takes 5 years to pay off.
There are no $1000 cars DAVE!
I'm waiting for him to open his mythical car dealership with all these perfectly good $1000 cars. I'll take any piece of shit with heat, ac, and no leaks. The cheapest cars I can find that aren't shit are $6000 and too cheap to finance or it's a big enough amount to get a loan and takes 5 years to pay off.
There are no $1000 cars DAVE!
🤣 you’re asking a bunch of liberal minded people if a wealthy conservative Christian is a fraud. Without reading the comments I’ll assume yes. But if you listen to the show he lives out his principles. He just started from a different place than most do. (Bankruptcy vs severely in debt)
He's badly out of touch but I don't think he's a fraud. He's pretty open about the fact that his philosophy is based on his own past mistakes.
Where does this 80-90 hours thing come from? I've never heard him say anything like that on his show and have watched a few hours worth at least.
His advice is good for broke people who are financially illiterate. But it’s horrible if you don’t have a spending problem are trying to actually build wealth. Absolutely asinine to pay off a low interest mortgage early when you can invest the money in a low risk fund that will pay far more in returns.
His program has saved a lot of people. Personally I was one of them in the late 90s. Today I’m retired in my 50s and I live like no one else. I don’t encounter many people my age that are where I am. Like none. I credit the Ramsey program with much of that. All I spent with Dave was a $15 book.
TLDR: Not a fraud. Ramsey lost everything in the bankruptcy. He learned his lesson. Built his new wealth based on the principles he teaches now.
Dave's advice is debatable, but he isn't a fraud.
To actually answer your question about his background. He would tell you that he before filing bankruptcy, he had paid all of his debts down from the $2m to around $300k. He did not file of his own accord, but was forced into bankruptcy by court order. He lost everything personally. Only after losing his entire net worth did he come up with the baby steps and his advice. He followed it from ground zero into building what he has today.
His bankruptcy was not like the popularization of bankruptcy. He lost it all, not just his business assets, and he was trying to pay it all off before the courts made him go into bankruptcy. Plus, all of his advice based in lessons he learned post-bankrupcty. His anti-debt radicalism is due to the nightmare he experienced of (in his words) doing it the wrong way and having to start over. If you listened to his story you'd know this.
Dave Ramsey is the right finance guru for people who have the discipline for his systems. Many people can live on rice and beans then beans and rice while they save money to pay down debt.
The important thing to remember is that there are lots of financial strategies to look for and find the debt gospel that you can work with.
OP, not sure if it has been mentioned already, but he did repay the bank later in life when he re-established himself.
He’s not being hypocritical. He’s simply teaching people to avoid the mistakes in life that he made and learned from. I do the same with those I care about.
Many people out there dislike his advice. On the contrary, he’s been a blessing to me and taught me so much about handling money.
I do agree that he can be aggressive at times, but I like the tough approach. Reminds me of Judge Judy.
Money is such a personal and touchy topic. You should do whatever works for you.
No. He's not a fraud. He is the FIN101 for the world. He has advised people to declare bankruptcy.
He isn't going to admit there is a FIN202, because the people he deals with have zero control over their financial lives.
If someone tried to run their life like mine, they would most likely ruin their lives.
Because I have extreme control over my finances. Meaning, I check my finances multiple times per day.
And, I buy everything with debt. I even pay my debt with debt.
But, I also pay everything off twice a month.
He has some very helpful things for people who do not have a solid grasp of financial planning. If you are an intelligent financiallly/business savvy person who can utilize leverage to make outstanding returns it will not work for you but if you're broke as fuck with little light at the end of the tunnel it's a good starting path for you to figure out how to not screw yourself over
He is a bully to his staff and his callers. His entire show is a grift for his books and financial peace university and then you can become a trusted advisor. All horse shit.
I know he researches a lot of things but I wonder if anyone (and they hide it) ever went over the thousands of "debt free screams" and success cases and saw they stayed that way. It's not his fault if they don't but having a plan, having a goal of going on the show etc is now gone and reality sets in that they sold all their stuff and now have no debt but feel let down. I guess it doesn't matter but it reminds me of diets when people lose 20 pounds and love Atkins etc and then they don't. It needs to be a lifestyle and not a cult following and that takes a lot more work.
His baby step number 1 of only having $1,000 saved for emergencies is beyond stupid. Any homeowner knows that $1,000 doesn’t do jackshit for you on most home repairs that come up
I wasn't managing money well at all and I didn't do a deep dive into him. Just followed his baby steps and they have worked wonders for me! I'm slowly getting back on track. I'm not rich by any means, I am middle class. I think there are alot of avenues out there and you find what works for you. The babysteps approach works for me.
Here are many things I disagree with: - popularization of snowball method, when research shows that the avalanche is the most economic way of paying off loans - 8% withdrawal rate when research showed 4% is the sustainable rate - AUM 1% fees to manage investments. How do they manage it? Just basically buying index funds - pausing 401k contributions with match to pay off even 4% loans - outdated housing advice - telling people to work 80 hours instead of focusing on the long term There are many many more. People shouldn’t listen to him beyond the “don’t spend more than you make” advice. P.S. r/debtfree moderator runs a free newsletter that talks about strategies, tips, and effective debt payoff methods weekly. Join 3,600 readers - https://debtadvice.io
I can’t stand his complete arrogance and how he can’t fathom that what he says might not work for every single person. I heard him tell a caller one time “You can follow my advice, or you can be wrong… those are your only two options” and that was when it hit me that he has no clue what real life is like, and it’s sad.
Hes been rich so long he forgot what it meant to be poor
Some people are so poor, all they have is money.
Damn...idk if people realize how deep that is
He was just one of the first rich guys who figured out he could make easy money.
I remember I saw a video where a family doctor called in asking how to handle a six figure debt from med school and Ramsey starts incorrectly stating that her specialty should make way more than what she claimed and that she is silly for taking a lowball offer (it wasn’t lowball, Ramsey just acted like he knew what he was talking about) and she tried to say that her salary was on par with others. But good ole know it all Ramsey just kept saying she was wrong and he was right cuz he knows other doctors that make bank yada yada yada. How u gonna tell a doctor they’re wrong about how much they make?
I’ve seen him do this a couple of times, I think once or twice I interpreted this more as “why the heck did you take on $300K worth of debt if you knew the cap for your specific job is only $110K/yr?” Less so than challenging the actual market value/salary of that particular job. I do agree and think that challenging someone on whether their salary is competitive is stupid and unproductive when he’s basically spitballing and doesn’t know that exact area’s job economy, but at the same time I think the point to be made is that just because you become a “doctor” of any kind doesn’t mean the degree and debt are worth it for the salary, unless it pays dividends later via higher pay.
His advice is good for people who have a high income, but they're bad with money. That's his target demographic. When people call in who have a low income his best advice is to get "a bigger shovel". Of course most poor people would make more money if they could or knew how.
I love it hearing the generic "get a bigger shovel," "spend less than you make", and "find a way to increase your income" advise. I mean, it's not wrong, but also, no fucking shit...
Agree he preaches to the masses an I do know quite a few people who have used his system and it really helped but for some this is not the way. Not all debt is bad and honestly learning how to use debt and manage risk is truly how to advance up
If it’s for something that makes money then sure, debt can be useful. The average American has 5k in credit card debt and pays nearly $1000 in interest to credit card companies every year. That is not good debt. I don’t think Dave Ramsey is meant to be for everyone. People find him when they’re at the bottom and can’t manage money well and Dave’s rules are great for those people imo and gives them a good kick in the rear to getting out of bad debt. He’s not mean for people that know what they’re doing or have the discipline to effectively evaluate risk. Ppl go after Dave and say he’s wrong on some things and in a vacuum, he is. But that disregards the type of people that are his main audience and who r the people he can help the most. For those people, his advice is great.
He’s frozen in time is the problem, isn’t in touch with cost if life today, he’s still basing it on when he started his whole schtick.
Have you heard about the weird, religious contracts he makes all of his employees sign? Or the mandatory charitable donations his program requires people make? The guy literally just gives you a plan to avalanche or snowball, and suddenly thinks he’s Jerome fucking Powell. Dave Ramsey is a shameless clown. He’s up there with doctor Oz or doctor Phil.
If you work at Ramsey, you know his values, I don't agree with firing pregnant unwed moms and fighting firing a guy who makes you $ but is cheating repeatedly on his wife but he's open. If you fit in the evangelical atmosphere and want your money and life an open book, never work at home, it's fine. One wife of an ex employee used to have to hide she used credit because it's part of working there, your family doesn't. But if you aren't a "personality" why does it matter? Or the employee?
Or the "Your plan got you where you are now" even when its not accurate (or I might have more than one plan)
His daughter cringes at times...I don't think they are the same politically or in other ways but it's her bread and butter and she tries to get him off rants and politics. They weren't dirt poor, he made bad decisions and blames credit card companies for wanting the money he put on the cards. Duh. If you say you want to put balances (like I did) on 0% card and pay it off interest free, he'll balk. Why? It's not on his snowball. I would have taken much long to pay it off and I never put anything on the transfer card but that since the interest would have been 12% at the time I did it. He helps people who are totally disorganized and the AA type that really can't handle having a venue to take money they don't have, such as credit or loans.
Dave Ramsey is severely out of touch with the real world at this point. You should trust his financial advice just as much as you would trust Dr. Phil with mental health advice
Dave Ramsey gives outdated advice. The only good thing is that he introduces people into the world of financial planning.
Yeah in high school our finance class followed the program he had. In high school I thought it was awesome and I started doing more research and realized how stupid his advice is. Can be good for some situations, but a lot of it is just awful
I'm pretty sure his program is just a plagiarized version of Crown Financial's Money Map, which I've heard is a plan he followed in his younger years. They're pretty much the same thing, but Crown's is much more reasonable and doable.
You need to cherry pick. He's good for the type who need for lack of a better example, an "AA" type of program, you follow these rules and don't do anything else. You can't handle credit or money so you need me to guide you. I wonder though how many of his "debtfree screams" stay that way after the adrenaline goes away.
Dave Ramsey offers your standard, run of the mill advice for getting out of and staying out of debt. If you had a financial debt advisor they would be offering the same or similar advice. He also has some ludicrous ideas on how to live that just are not realistic for the average person. I personally don’t believe that he is any kind of financial savant.
But common sense makes one a financial savant compared to the general population.
Is that the "better than I deserve ' guy?
To be fair, he is correct. He is always doing better than he deserves.
I think that's most people... I wouldn't consider myself one of them...
Step 1: File for bankruptcy. Step 2: Create a financial course with 0 nuance. Step 3: Sprinkle in some Bible verses. Step 4 (complete the grift): Use churches to buy and/or distribute your course as if it is the fifth gospel.
Step 5: Repeat catchy marketing phrases like "Debt is dumb" to charge tens to hundreds of dollars for books, programs, and seminars that fit on one side of a note card.
Step 0: Be a middle-aged, bald, white man with a southern drawl.
He's made millions of dollars telling people "Sell asset pay debt" 99/100 times he just confirms the other person's plan that they came in with, without giving real advice
Soon as I heard that "god is in control of your finances" crap I decided he was a total idiot
Dave Ramsey, like any of these financial experts, give some good advice. Some not so good advice. You can’t read one article and know everything. You have to read a lot, take everything with a grain of salt, and figure out what works best for you and your individual situation.
His advice is good for consumer mindset people. If you are trying to build big wealth debt is a tool used for investments. Just depends on the type of person you are regarding money. As for 99% of people he has the right idea. Debt and credit should not be used for buying shoes, game consoles, or cars. Use debt to buy assets that generate more income than the payment on that debt. Real estate, watch trading, markets, business, etc.
You really snuck watch trading in there lol
Yes exactly. The type of people who finance 50k trucks, shop shop shop and make financially irresponsible decisions will work well with Dave ramsey. I like that he encourages people to do the boring thing of simply saving, budgeting and not getting into debt. Usually these financial advice people encourage people to look for tricks and hacks to get rid of their debts. There is no better trick than being frugal, budgeting and saving. But if you are already financially competent and savvy already then you will find him very unhelpful. I think there are alot of financially savvy people here critising his methods not realising that he is not targeted to them at all.
Watch trading is worth getting into debt over? Is it a good investment for most or does it take the right kind of person for it?
Please don’t go into debt over watches lol
Almost anything that people give money for can be a good investment or business opportunity if you’re smart about it.
Use margin for trading? Ok
No, just an asshole. He likes to call people stupid, thinks he knows it all.
Not a fraud but overly simplistic. his general advice works for people that have no self control or desire to learn how things work. The worst in his simplistic examples is ignoring taxes and other costs. He'll say to someone 40k in debt that makes 80k, ok live on 40k and you'll be debt free in a year. Uhh yeah, not quite Dave. FICA, federal, state, healthcare premiums often knock that down 25-35%. Then he'll say do not contribute anything to retirement while getting out of consumer debt. Stupid to leave an employer match on the table.
Nobody should be discussing gross income during a budgeting conversation.
He’s never once since I’ve listened to him say to not match your employer..
He says that all the time. It's his worse piece of advice.
Pretty sure he has! Again only when in consumer debt like CCs or student loans.. It's part of "baby steps"...BS 2 payoff all debt other than mortgage before BS4 which is retirement savings Here is an article where he has said it too https://finance.yahoo.com/news/employer-401-k-match-pay-110014543.html
Okay well I just listened to his newest episodes today and he literally told at least 2 people to keep matching their employer even while paying down debt.
Interesting. Seems he may change his answer based on the scenario. I listen occasionally I'll have to check it out.
This person is wrong. Dave has never recommended to contribute to retirement while you are in debt.
I am an avid Dave Ramsey fan (go ahead, downvote me lol), and Dave has NEVER said to keep an employer match if you are in debt. I have listened to every episode of The Ramsey Show this year, and you are simply wrong.
I've heard him tell multiple callers to stop saving for retirement altogether while on bs2. I think he flips on this take, depending on the situation.
This bald lunatic is the reason rent is unaffordable everywhere, because he is constantly ranting about raising rent until it hurts. Fuck him and anyone who doesn't see what a prick he is.
My co worker died last week, one year from retiring. You can't take the money with you. Yes you should save, but you should also enjoy life.
What makes you think he/she didn’t enjoy their life. Everyone needs to work to live. That’s just how it is.
He actually did enjoy his life, I was trying to say that it hits closer to home when someone you know dies "young" and Ramsy would have advised this guy to not buy the cars and the boat and not take the trips because he wasn't a millionaire.
Well you can blow it all and then not have a good retirement. Everything in moderation.
Agreed, I did say save but don't eat beans and rice for years like Ramsey says to just to pay your debts. Maybe he is extra conservative in this way to get the point across?
If you are in heavy debt that’s his advice to quickly get out of debt. I can’t say I disagree with it. If you’re in heavy debt you can’t go buying boats to enjoy now.
Dave Ramsey is good for people who are: 1. Scared of money 2. Terrible with money 3. Don’t understand money You’ll never catch the rich following his advice.
I have a feeling you are wrong, paying down debt and living within your means is exactly how the majority of millionaires are made.
Ramsey also has a specific demographic of people who call in who have potential to be millionaires due to their income, they're just terrible with money. I feel like anytime I've listened to his show, he's taking a call from someone who's making 6 figures or close to it, or part of a 6 figure dual income house hold. And because they make so much, they made really dumb financial decisions thinking they could afford it when they couldn't. The amount of people who don't keep a budget in the US is insane. A large portion of people making over $100k are living paycheck to paycheck, and it isn't always because rent is too high, they're just stupid when it comes to money. I personally know a guy who lives with his GF, and they eat out so much, he and his GF spend about $1500 on just eating out each month.
You are wrong. Real rich people have a lot of debt. They typically borrow money to make more money. In another word, they use other people's money to make money.
I also filed for bankruptcy when I was 26. I'd do it again so fast it worked as intended. Zero regrets
I may be in the minority but the baby step process works and worked for me. Life’s been an adventure but most of that wouldn’t have been possible without hearing people’s debt free screaming gives hope to people who are desperate like I was. Is life perfect? Not exactly. But am I in a stare of peace financially? Absolutely. Is it Dave’s fault? Yes. And what’s crazy is I found the show through This American Life!
He’s a zealot who fired a woman because she got pregnant out of wedlock. Also a staunch anti-wfh boomer.
I worked a Dave Ramsey show once, he made the entire tech crew stand in a circle to pray at the top of every morning. Really rubbed me the wrong way. The arrogance, to assume everyone shares your religion!
Most that work there are Christians of his faith or said they'd adhere to his policies. I don't like hypocrites though who keep a guy who is cheating because he is making him money and fire a woman who got pregnant with no caring but if they call on the phone, he's all nice to them. I always think he is secretly thinking bad things since he could do that to someone without forgiveness at work.
Dave also forgets taxes exist when giving people action plans. Someone making 100k a year can’t simply live off 50 and save 50. TAXES DAVE
Normally when people call into the show he asks them what is their take home after taxes.
He constantly flips back and forth. He'll ask about take home pay and then he'll ask how much do you make. IRL people use gross pay when talking about how much they make.
He’s never said live off 50 and save 50, man… Come on with that exaggeration…
Dave Ramsey is a fucking moron and anyone who follows his advice is a moron as well
Am I a moron for getting out of 80k of debt?
I've wondered about this too. And he tells people to pay off student loan debt even if they qualify for forgiveness. Wondering how much debt he had forgiven.
To be fair, most people who apply for student loan forgiveness don’t get approved.
True, but he opposes it on principle. He goes off about how if you borrow the money you need to pay it back.
Yeah, that's just bad advice. Take what advantages you can get as long as they make sense in the big picture.
He's against it if you are in a weird contract with the employer where you have to stay for years to be forgiven. Otherwise pay it back. He's all about independence. He's not against it if it's just giving out though he has said that on the show he's happy for people if it actually passes and it's just a freebie.
Yes he’s a fraud! He sold financial courses at churches and weekend retreats and that’s how he got himself out of debt.
He still does, so many that come on say their church does FPU. He is always asking what one and thanks them. I'm sure a job at Ramsey is calling new churches or ones that stopped and trying to sell them the packages again. He still travels and does book tours and talks and cruises, he gets so much money from that, from his real estate rentals and investments. He has his personalites write books when they've only been on the set a year or so...whatever they can make is good and then he discounts them and pushes them again. I don't think Rachel's book or George's sells well after the first few months. Then he gives them away.
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Please for the love of god do some math and start back up your 401k if your employer offers a match. Personal finance is personal and it is math. Your individual plan should have nuance and math involved. And when you're done with bs3 run away from dave and check out the r/bogleheads for investment advice instead of being sold to his high front load fee advisor network.
You're still on BS2 after 15 years??? Just imagine how lightning ahead you'd be if you did bankruptcy 10-15 years ago. (And yes I know BK only helps if you can change your personal financial outlook going forward and not go back to bad habits)
"Live like a pauper till you get out of debt." There's no nuance, no balance, no acknowledgement that there's more to life than being debt free ASAP. People can't sustain it, because it's a miserable existence. If it's a matter of living reasonably well and taking 7 years, or being a prisoner to your debt for 4 years, the former is healthier. Debt-paying fanaticism brings life-costs that can't be quantified with money.
He kept saying having a paid off car drives different. I'm sitting here with 2 paid off cars and it feels no different. Pretty sure the grass will feel the exact same when my 2.5% mortgaged house is paid of in 27 years.
I think he's just out of touch & his advice is definitely geared towards people who are simply irresponsible with money
Dave Ramsey's formula for wealth.....sell car, buy used car, eat rice and beans, work overtime or 2 or 3 jobs until you are debt free then become a millionaire like him. Otherwise you are just plain stupid.
No, that's his plan to get out of debt. Building wealth is different.
Was goofing on him. I know.
Yes
His advice is general and for people with low IQ. For 65% of people it works great because they spend more than they make on stupid financial decisions. Like making 40k and driving an 80k SUV. He fixes people with no financial literacy, which is like 65% of the USA. The other 35% of us are smart enough to realize that debt isn’t all that terrible if it’s not on stupid consumer goods. If you have cash flowing assets, high pay, and an understanding of investing Dave is not for you.
He is. Also he is a salesman but he doesn’t show/tell it to his audience. Money over everything.
He does admit sales is his thing, sold houses young with his charisma and fast talking. He just did a lot of dumb things. Now he blames credit when that wasn't his issue. Even most people who carry way too much debt aren't "hurting" It's not good but they aren't bankrupt, they just live with loans and can pay them and don't have trouble sleeping. I'm not advocating that at all, but he is wrong that most are unhappy. He never had his wife work as he asks others to do, she had 3 kids with debt, she had a home, not a shack, they had food, clothes and no extras for awhile. but the kids had toys and their own rooms. Rachel talked about how he was with picking up their stuff and cleaning their rooms and how they got allowances to save and give with.
His advice boils down to spending less than you make, paying off debt, saving a percentage of surplus income and investing it to take advantage of compound interest. Pretty solid advice.
Yep. Half of these people talking crap about him are either, A. In a significant amount of debt themselves B. Preach about other get rich quick schemes C. Think they’re more intelligent because his advice is simple and easy to understand, therefore they think it’s for the poor / Low IQ individuals. I’m gonna do me, follow the baby steps as planned, build enough to enjoy life later on. That’s it.
He’s just another data point for people to consider. He’s not infallible.
Pretty much yeah. And he's a huge hypocrite.
His basic principles are legit but basically common sense things people should already inherently know. Sadly many don’t know common principles such as living withhin their means and basic math.
Ramsey is a hardened prick. No one has gone broke following his method. And many people need his swift kick in the ass. But the model is sound. Stick with it, and you will reach financial security.
Maybe not but they're a lot farther behind than if they would have optimized.
And they would have been even further behind without his advice. His target audience isn't ready to optimize. His target audience is trying to use a $60k income to pay for $40k in credit card debt because they can't afford to eat anymore. I don't follow him or anything, but have helped several friends/family get out of the holes they dug themselves into by using very similar methods to his. It works. Budgeting and sticking to a budget are skills way too many people don't have. That's where his style of advice works.
Ramsey is not speaking to finance bros. The family of six with credit card interest consuming 50% of their split schedule hourly wage is not interested in optimization.
He is to financial experts as chiropractors are to the medical field.
Except chiropractors can actually relieve some pain, he just gives you a headache from listening to him blather
You should listen to the whole story some time. He didn’t just file for bankruptcy and go about his merry way.
Did he repay the debt he owed?
😂
He's said that he did. I don't know if he's ever given any definite proof of this, but he has claimed that after rebuilding his wealth, he went back and repaid all the debtors that he had bankrupted on.
He probably did, if for no other reason than so that those creditors couldn't later come back and slander his current business.
He was a millionaire that flew close to the sun. Spent too much money flipping properties and leveraging debt to his advantage until a law came into action and banks called their dues. He doesn't actually know the struggle of the single mom calling into his show about making $100 last.
Have you read his experiences? He had two kids when he filed bankruptcy, and the bank took everything from him. He had no house, no car, nothing, and he had two kids to provide for. Dave has been in the same situation.
His advise is very unrealistic and outdated.
Yes it is fair that he can give that advice. He was significantly in debt and bankrupt and had to pull himself up to where he is. You don’t just have a 700mil company and not work hard. He knows what it means to work hard and tells people that. Dave Ramsey’s advice is extremely surface level basic advice, but what he’s really doing is changing the mindset. Telling someone to cut up their credit cards is extremely basic, yes, but it’s adjusting the mindset that they aren’t there to fall back on.
I agree that if you're in serious debt that one way to overcome it is to "slave away" and work 80-90 hours a week. Basic personal finance... increase income, decrease expenses, ideally both. I don't know anything about Dave Ramsey, but do agree that using that approach is a way to pay down/off debt faster.
Yup. I have debt, with zero disposable income, and I’m fixing both by doing an extra 16 hours a week overtime. Simple really.
I was taught to be financially responsible from my dad who had almost nothing and shared his mistakes. Wife and I have been "cash only" for maybe 25-28 years, own multiple homes and did about what Dave suggests before he was famous... We lived poor for 15 years or so while our friends lived in up, today were retired, live the life we want, and have no worries about money. We taught our kids early, long before I was savvy at that age... and they were financially secure younger than we were... Of those of you who have replied are debt free with assets over, say 3 million please share.. Were mid 70's and have only purchased 4 new cars in our married life because they loose 20% in the first month of ownership... but we own 6 homes, have cash in the bank and live or life, basically on his program.... We froze our credit when we were 50, no clue what our credit score is and don't care... We, with our kids are teaching financial responsibility to our college age grandkids with no college debt... Thanks for listening
He tells us to eat beans and rice and work 2 full-time jobs with very little sleep. That level of stress, sleep deprivation and a shitty diet will literally cause disease. I hate him for this.
He is a real surly bastard if people don't take his advice and he seems to have a disdain for people asking genuine questions because they just simply don't know how to approach a situation
I’ve noticed people calling to give actual advice get ridiculed.
As others in here say, he is out of touch. However, you can’t deny that the foundation of what he preaches is solid advice for being smart and keeping yourself from getting in a bind. Paying down debt, investing long-term, and keeping a safety net are pretty hard rules to argue against.
Yes
I take what works and leave the rest Out of consumer debt 6 mo energy fund I use credit cards but have never carried a balance tho Helped me with the drive to pay off car way early I started to hate looking at finance charges
but if you listen to him it didn't stop with bankruptcy. [https://youtu.be/r1NJzEYARlM?si=UFJeH-2Cad9BBArp](https://youtu.be/r1NJzEYARlM?si=UFJeH-2Cad9BBArp)
He still had about $300,000 in debt to pay off after Bankruptcy, and he had to deal with debt collectors.
Add to the conclusion, do not borrow from your future as well… I’m sure Dave says that too.
Not a fraud but yes probably not the greatest either. There is a staggering percentage of westerners who live week to week with staggering amounts of debt and no idea on how to get out of that loop. That is his target audience and it works for him. He helps people with poor financial planning skills become just okay at financial planning and that’s something at least. Is he solving problems yes. Is he the best at doing that? Probably not but oh well.
It’s good advice for the average person. And he’s right about people being stupid with their money. However, if you are trying to be, let’s a say a millionaire, by 40 - he’s not the guy to take advice from. Most people that are in a position to make a ton of money aren’t having the issues that people call his show have.
Oh and there is NOTHING like being debt free. NOTHING. IT IS WONDERFUL. You answer to No one.
Definitely a charlatan. His "methods" are really just a ploy to get poor sods into a religious cult. He's bonkers. He's over there criticizing people for buying anything, but it's totally cool to piss away money on his books and workshops. Not to mention the evangelical to Dave pipeline. Lol
Dave Ramseys baby step 1 is great for people bad with money. All his advice is awful for people good with money.
If you believe he is right, follow his principles or live with the life you choose face the outcome of those decisions. Whether he is fraud or not has nothing to do how you choose to live. If you are in 40k credit card debt. First thing in his advice he says never use credit card due to 26% interest. However someone people find it absurd not use credit card but his message is, if you use cash it give you hard stop on spending habit while credit card makes you overspend due to convenience. Other people believe if I get 3% cash back on everything why should I not spend using credit card. But those people fail to realize that not everyone has that much discipline where you can control your spending.
One of the bigger gripes I have is that he tells people, "You're eating beans and rice for the next for years until this debt is gone." I would fucking kill myself if i had to eat the exact same thing every single day of my life. If this crushing debt is making me depressed beyond belief, let me at least find happiness in the occasional steak or hamburger every now and then.
He,s lived through everything! And it works
His system only works for people who are absolutely horrible I mean suck ass when it comes to finances. Other than that I don’t like him at all..his investing philosophy suck ass..and these mutual funds he talk about. If you just put your money in sp500 they will outperform that crap and way less expense ratio
No one is 100% right or wrong … he does have good advice for certain people in certain stages or areas of life Not all applies and I wouldn’t follow all of it For example I don’t agree of not using a credit card to accumulate points to travel for free they money will be spent anyways so might as well get free travel out of it etc
I sincerely hate it every time he opens his mouth.
Is he a fraud? No. Whatever else he says his life and the mistakes he made to get him to embrace being debt free are an open book. You can find numerous resources where he went through his journey.
Idk imo the vase advice if “never use money you don’t have” and “work your ass off to get out of debt” is pretty good, if not incredibly basic advice. I worked full time while going to college and aimed for zero days off during the summer because I didn’t want student debt. I think he’s good at encouraging that kind of mindset.
You think millionaires became millionaires by using their own money? They took advantage of the tax code and systems like bankruptcy’s.
Of course, but we’re talking about just getting out of debt, not becoming a millionaire. Imo he’s a good source to look to when it comes to just having a positive net worth; and then using better resources that are more with-the-times when it comes to building wealth for yourself and the next generation.
His advice to get out of debt is good. He gives you a path to follow and if you follow it, it will work out. I went through his “financial peace university” and am completely debt free. Would I follow him on investment advice, no. Would I follow him to get out of debt, yes and it works.
Dude is closer to a fraud than he is a "financial guru". As with most boomers, they think it was all their smarts and wits that got them their riches, not the fact they lived in one of the most prosperous times in America and could buy houses for less than the price of a car and watch them appreciate 1,000% over the next couple decades.
Everything he says is utter garbage. And I don’t know how I stumbled to this subreddit but being debt free is stupid. Apple takes out debt for everything they do. They’re 108 billion in the hole. Yet sitting on 162 billion in cash reserves. They know they can make more money on the debt than the interest accrued. There’s good debt and bad debt. Learn the differences, and stop listening to Dave Ramsey. He’s a fucking quack. When I had credit card debt, I just got another balance transfer card and paid it down with 0 interest, and utilization went down too, raised my credit score. Debt is as bad as you make it, if you’re irresponsible you’ll be like Dave Ramsey and stay the hell away from it if you’re smart. But if you’re really smart you’ll use it as leverage.
"Fair?" To whom? Are you suggesting he should be thrown in jail for unfairness?
He annoys me. Especially with his work 80 hours a week/slave away pitch. That isn’t a reality for some who are also caregivers. That stance leaves no room for nuanced lifestyles.
Just like any other financial guru, you have to know what advice is good versus bad. Overall, I think he’s solid and he does offer some good insight, especially compared to all the new wannabe financial gurus on IG and TikTok
No
Yeah he has given some of my clients bad advice. They came back many months later asking for help.
Ramsey is a fraud because of his network of scamsters that he runs, he's also a truely terrible human being.
Ramsey really grinds my gears. He isn’t a licensed advisor anymore so he can give out blanket advice to the masses and not get in trouble for it. Advice that is good for you may not be good for me. Everyone is different so advice should be tailored to each individual and their situation. Once someone gains a modicum of knowledge regarding investing, any level of sophistication at all, Ramsey’s advice is no longer relevant. At the end of the day, he’s a hack. Edited because I had to add another thought so I rearranged my entire comment.
I wouldn't say he's a fraud for failing at life a few times, he even admits he's done stupid things and that's how he learned from them.
Idk if he's a fraud, but he has not kept up with the times and has no awareness of the current economy. His advice isn't bad if you apply it a few decades ago
Nah. He’s basically “personal finance for dummies.” And he says really stupid shit sometimes because he has to remain “on brand.” But for the most part he provides what’s overly simplistic but generally sound advice for irresponsible and/or financially illiterate people.
This.
Yes he’s a fraud. Why else would he be doing his grift?
Don’t take your companies 401k match, but be sure to give at least 10% of your income to “the church”. Yeah, no thanks.
He makes it very clear that his stance is coming from: been there, done that, and it was the worst thing he has gone through and he doesn't want others to go through the same. He teaches personal responsibility and independence. I haven't paid him a penny other than a $10 book. And I got my family out of $80k in debt following his plan. Meanwhile the rest of my family who despise him are still about 80,000 in student loan debt all these years. So, who came out on top here? I'm the one that listened to him but everyone else poo pooed it and didn't do anything. It takes strong discipline..that's exactly what he teaches. Other financial advisors teach different tactics but they really don't harp on the discipline part and the discipline part is exactly what is needed for most people.
I can come up with a litany of things I really dislike about DR. I wouldn't put "fraud" on the list. He has life experience that caused him to come up with a program that is clear and prescriptive for getting out of debt. It works. It's an island of good that has grown shitshow tentacles.
He’s legit. He gives you reality. Reality usually sucks.
I'm waiting for him to open his mythical car dealership with all these perfectly good $1000 cars. I'll take any piece of shit with heat, ac, and no leaks. The cheapest cars I can find that aren't shit are $6000 and too cheap to finance or it's a big enough amount to get a loan and takes 5 years to pay off. There are no $1000 cars DAVE!
I'm waiting for him to open his mythical car dealership with all these perfectly good $1000 cars. I'll take any piece of shit with heat, ac, and no leaks. The cheapest cars I can find that aren't shit are $6000 and too cheap to finance or it's a big enough amount to get a loan and takes 5 years to pay off. There are no $1000 cars DAVE!
🤣 you’re asking a bunch of liberal minded people if a wealthy conservative Christian is a fraud. Without reading the comments I’ll assume yes. But if you listen to the show he lives out his principles. He just started from a different place than most do. (Bankruptcy vs severely in debt)
He's badly out of touch but I don't think he's a fraud. He's pretty open about the fact that his philosophy is based on his own past mistakes. Where does this 80-90 hours thing come from? I've never heard him say anything like that on his show and have watched a few hours worth at least.
I’m noticing most people here agree. Internet for the win.
His advice is good for broke people who are financially illiterate. But it’s horrible if you don’t have a spending problem are trying to actually build wealth. Absolutely asinine to pay off a low interest mortgage early when you can invest the money in a low risk fund that will pay far more in returns.
Like Cramer. Filling his coffers, instructing the rubes
Hypocrite might be a more accurate word to use than fraud
Yes.
Dudes a moron
Yes
I hate Dave Ramsey and I think he needs to shut the fuck up and go away
His program has saved a lot of people. Personally I was one of them in the late 90s. Today I’m retired in my 50s and I live like no one else. I don’t encounter many people my age that are where I am. Like none. I credit the Ramsey program with much of that. All I spent with Dave was a $15 book.
He's an idiot.
TLDR: Not a fraud. Ramsey lost everything in the bankruptcy. He learned his lesson. Built his new wealth based on the principles he teaches now. Dave's advice is debatable, but he isn't a fraud. To actually answer your question about his background. He would tell you that he before filing bankruptcy, he had paid all of his debts down from the $2m to around $300k. He did not file of his own accord, but was forced into bankruptcy by court order. He lost everything personally. Only after losing his entire net worth did he come up with the baby steps and his advice. He followed it from ground zero into building what he has today. His bankruptcy was not like the popularization of bankruptcy. He lost it all, not just his business assets, and he was trying to pay it all off before the courts made him go into bankruptcy. Plus, all of his advice based in lessons he learned post-bankrupcty. His anti-debt radicalism is due to the nightmare he experienced of (in his words) doing it the wrong way and having to start over. If you listened to his story you'd know this.
Dave Ramsey is the right finance guru for people who have the discipline for his systems. Many people can live on rice and beans then beans and rice while they save money to pay down debt. The important thing to remember is that there are lots of financial strategies to look for and find the debt gospel that you can work with.
Do bears shit the wood?
If you like getting ripped apart for being human, watch Dave Ramsey 🤣 So many people have probably needed counselling after talking to him
His program worked for me. His advice on collection agencies, what to pay first. It’s all sound.
Your favorite grifter's favorite grifter
Dave Ramsey makes his money selling books, not giving good advice
OP, not sure if it has been mentioned already, but he did repay the bank later in life when he re-established himself. He’s not being hypocritical. He’s simply teaching people to avoid the mistakes in life that he made and learned from. I do the same with those I care about. Many people out there dislike his advice. On the contrary, he’s been a blessing to me and taught me so much about handling money. I do agree that he can be aggressive at times, but I like the tough approach. Reminds me of Judge Judy. Money is such a personal and touchy topic. You should do whatever works for you.
He's not a fraud per se, but he thinks his advice is closer to universal truth than it actually is.
No. He's not a fraud. He is the FIN101 for the world. He has advised people to declare bankruptcy. He isn't going to admit there is a FIN202, because the people he deals with have zero control over their financial lives. If someone tried to run their life like mine, they would most likely ruin their lives. Because I have extreme control over my finances. Meaning, I check my finances multiple times per day. And, I buy everything with debt. I even pay my debt with debt. But, I also pay everything off twice a month.
Yep
That's why I don't watch him. Every person has different situation and some of his advice is not applicable to others.
You can talk shyt as much you like but he has more than you and no debts! Prove me wrong
I can’t stand him for the most part. But maybe he learned a hard lesson in life by fucking up at just 28 ?
He has some very helpful things for people who do not have a solid grasp of financial planning. If you are an intelligent financiallly/business savvy person who can utilize leverage to make outstanding returns it will not work for you but if you're broke as fuck with little light at the end of the tunnel it's a good starting path for you to figure out how to not screw yourself over
I prefer Suze Ormon.
He is a bully to his staff and his callers. His entire show is a grift for his books and financial peace university and then you can become a trusted advisor. All horse shit.
I know he researches a lot of things but I wonder if anyone (and they hide it) ever went over the thousands of "debt free screams" and success cases and saw they stayed that way. It's not his fault if they don't but having a plan, having a goal of going on the show etc is now gone and reality sets in that they sold all their stuff and now have no debt but feel let down. I guess it doesn't matter but it reminds me of diets when people lose 20 pounds and love Atkins etc and then they don't. It needs to be a lifestyle and not a cult following and that takes a lot more work.
Didn’t he make his first mil by talking about how to be rich?? Screams con artist to me
His baby step number 1 of only having $1,000 saved for emergencies is beyond stupid. Any homeowner knows that $1,000 doesn’t do jackshit for you on most home repairs that come up
I wasn't managing money well at all and I didn't do a deep dive into him. Just followed his baby steps and they have worked wonders for me! I'm slowly getting back on track. I'm not rich by any means, I am middle class. I think there are alot of avenues out there and you find what works for you. The babysteps approach works for me.