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Hard work or talent alone is not sufficient. You must have luck also to support your project and get traction in the market. If you don't have luck your hard work and talent both will be crushed, amount to nothing. Those who've experienced it will know..
This! I see so many people here claim that hard work is got them success when in reality its luck that got them there. Survivorship bias blinded them. It is all about luck and the connections you make.
People really need to check their privileges. Life is a luck based game and anyone who thinks it is skill based is fooling themselves.
Excuse me if I am wrong, but I think you might have missed u/joydps ‘s point. While they acknowledge that hard work and talent can be useless without some luck, they’re not saying that luck is the only factor that matters. Luck is often seen as purely random chance or statistical probability, where people might find themselves in the “right place at the right time.” However, in the context of success, luck truly works when the “right” people are in the “right place at the right time.” These “right” people are those with hard work and talent. Hard work and talent equip individuals with the skills and readiness to seize fortunate opportunities when they arise. Essentially, “Luck is what happens when preparation meets opportunity.”
Perfect scores, and repeated olympiad wins, you are delulu if you think this is luck, he just won and won some more. Maybe it's talent, maybe it's coaching, but he still probably had an elite mind.
He also chose AI, which is something maybe akin to luck, but again maybe it's his genius.
It's of course not just luck, but it's luck too. You can't even imagine the number of things which could have gone wrong but didn't due to luck. Those things could have gone wrong for others.
he still would have ended up in faangmula. His luck is how ended up stickign with open ai or going to usa or mit. But then maybe it isn't even luck. Maybe it's simply one of the permutation of events that would have likely happened either way.
buddy multiple olympiad wins , shows guy has got an early start with the right if not perfect set of instructors also the thing that the child is willing to learn stuff for such exams , otherwise we also have thousands of kids out there who's interests are different and they are pursuing it , or are not interested in trying something (spoiled brats as u may call them ) even though they come from a good family with better advantages
Point is none of them are winning whether they are trying or not and some of them trying extemely hard. I was one of those kids who thought highly of himself, I even earned some money through tech back then and did cool animations in c++ but did I tangibly ever achieve something in software engineering that only a fraction would be able to come up with, I don't think so.
I couldn't for the life of me be absorb all engineering stuff into my head very easily and I'm not able to do it now as well (I'm enrolled in a masters). I thought it was because I was distracted back then, I'm learning well today but turns out its still pretty tough and if I go deep enough, it's exactly like those early days.
I find this similar to chess competitions, you would consider Magnus Carlsen the most talented player in 2024, because he literally he is the most talented, and let's consider there are similarly talented individuals in the world. I think that'd come out to maybe 10-20 people in the chess world who are his equals with respect to talent alone and it's knowledge battles that he ventured into that made him truly the best. The point still is there is only 10-20 out of 7 billion. Now if we ignore the chess world, that its still probably like 10000 people maximum.
I think this guy is one of those 10000 folks but in software engineering. You can only ever apply yourself so much bro.
This is the same thing Jeff Bezos found out on his own when he was studying physics, and now I find the same holds true for me as well with a hard education.
If it makes any difference to my arguement I do think I'm a top percentile coder.
I understand ur point man and respect it , thing is I got nostalgic 😅 to this as I was genuinely interested in coding math Oly stuff even qualified for a camp in dehradun by nasa but could not go bcz of my family constraint + my father struggling a lot in his job which brought meager money made them think that only gov job can fix them , tried hard on me to manipulate so that I get that job and make my life good but was simply not interested , though I am yet to join corporate but I always had that feeling lingering on me to pursue research in math etc but parents simply denied , life was not good at any point made me feel it is what it is , maybe I will end up in poverty / misery what my parents had , this thing hit so hard that I completely stopped studying and now I realise it is too late for me ( entering some random clg now , don't know where ) but yeah definitely I am trying to make terms with life .
Sorry it was a rant ig 😔
Random college in Engineering / Stem is still great man. Don't you worry at all. I too thought my life was going to be bad and I won't get one of those brand name companies on my resume . I got a brand name co. rihgt now. You'll achieve it too man.
And never underscore the possibility of making it big within a span of a few short days or weeks, this is especially true in the tech industry.
Save aggressively into a mutual fund or stock as well. You and your family will do great.
Thanks sir 🙏 means alot , really having a tough time but always saying myself this shall to pass , everyday with taunts from family members this is become cruel
Once again thanx for the mental support 🙏 I think that is what a man wants at the end of the day
9 out of 10 successful people today are because of generational wealth or referrals . Please don't bait people wasting their money in useless courses or wasting their time for stupid entrance exam let them do their whole thing.
how often then not u hear that a guy could not do XYZ thing because of maybe family, or work or some other constraint ?! if not then stop fooling around with this stupid quote
Our next generations will have similar privileges compared to us, every generation tries to make things better for the next and that propels a society forward.
People who only boost about hardwork hardwork won't accept that in any success luck and privilege are the biggest factor. A guy who can't even afford basic PC won't turn into LC Knight. With hardwork you can reach places but still you'd be way behind of those who come from privilege and had luck. Hatdwork solely isn't enough. There are many guys playing better cricket than Kohli in gully cricket who are more hardworking than him and have no facilities like him but sadly they can't reach the place Kohli or Dhoni is.
This is the reason I have been started thinking this whole merit thing is false concept, most of the STEM guys simply can''t comprehend this and coming from JEE or NEET background they can't stop sticking labels on people.
I and even many here had PC at home in 2007. But I wasted my time of life playing games on PC and learning grammar rather than focusing on doing such innovationm
Wasted is a very strong term for not behaving like a special kid.
And innovation can be done if you start even now.
We should not indirectly underrate all the researchers in the world who have already left and will leave the planet finding micro improvements and 10000's ways to fail for that 1 person to read all papers and connect the dots for a major breakthrough.
true, the development u/Fabulous-Category155 had since the childhood and over the years has made you capable enough of judging your time if it was wasteful or not. I'd consider it as an achievement.. many people don't even bother to look back
You got PC , that's great but there was no one to tell you or guide you that instead of playing games do coding and all , buy guiding i mean a mentor or any person who stayed with that kid until he/she starts to learn and explore the knowledge themselves. Because distractions keep distracting kids, but mentors or guardians keep them focus
Yeah I was 6 years old and I didn't have any basic knowledge about what and how coding works. In fact I didn't know there was someone called a programmer who created all this website and all. All I cared about was to play games or do timepass.
Why is it waste of time, bro don't be so hard on yourself we are not machines, that for every input same and equal output should be there, both of you were probably doing the things you enjoyed at that time.
Nah I’m glad I played those long hours of cricket 07 fifa games rest of times i used to play enjoy on playground playing cricket
I've few brilliant students in school with patents math gold Olympiads but they're hardly doing anything significant in their life.
It's more about the time mindset and fire of a person ( intent ). With persistent efforts such people turn situations in their favours( luck and right time right place matters alot ) stop compare yourself with others instead of focusing more on yourself.
Remember this, "you cannot change your past ,but you can still f your future" , you can definitely achieve all of it when u stop giving excuses and start working on shit which is is in your control.
This is true.
And privilege not only in terms of money, but also resources and access to those resources, time to actually use them, and health.
Most people don't have the same starting point so why compare ? You are on different stages in the race
yeah but i think after some generations , when u already have your grandfathers and father in grade A lvl gov posts , I really feel they should give up on that , bcz that makes them feel that they have got to achieve only what is set as a bar for them in society say less marks or so
There is a book called "Outliers" by Malcolm Gladwell. In it, he presents the "10,000-hour rule," which posits that one needs to practice something for at least 10,000 hours to become an expert.
One of the examples he gives is about the creator of Java, James Gosling. Gosling had access to a computer early in his life due to his parents, which allowed him to become proficient with computers at a young age. This early exposure gave him a significant head start and contributed to his expertise in the field.
In Indian economy... Many successful entrepreneurs are successful because their family already have enough wealth to support them, and same can be said for me too I'm privileged i didn't like my manufacturing job I quit (i was cad designer the only person working on 3d modelling had full freedom as it was a startup), I left it for getting into AI/ML roles it is somewhat breaking my heart now that even though I'm trying hard I'm going nowhere I'll be 30 in some years so there's is that too but any sane middle class person wouldn't be able to do what I did.. Privilege background luck qualifications everything matters in this country to get ahead
I mean they get offended because they know didn't earn the spot tumbad movie has this dialogue "virasat me mili har chiz pe dawa nhi karte",... I live my life by that, me trying and then failing to be a Best CAD designer just taught me the lesson hard way that I'll be a good software engineer as I was good at computer stuff from the start CAD itself is very white collar ac room computer job...
My clg friends in first year used to say you're making a mistake change your branch to cs or it but I was very much influenced by what my father did his whole life (obvio made me believe mech is the best branch in this world) being a field manager..
Ik many who had it all and lost it all because they didn't earn it, when you don't earn it you don't care about it enough and break whatever it is eventually
Finally someone said it. It’s absolutely right.
Being at right time, right place and support system is so much important to become successful
But sadly people don’t talk the support they get, people just glorify success by saying it’s all happened bcz of hardwork
Talent also plays a part here, it looks like many in this sub reddit are ignoring it. I'm studying a masters right now and boy is it tough, I'm spending what feels like 1-3 hours 4-6 days a week and still is beating my ass, I'm not the top of the class, hopefully middle atleast don't know. I'm managing to get through each week with tiny bits being left behind.
I'm not saying he didn't worked hard ? But why did he? He had the passion for it, so it wasn't probably work in the first place and secondly maybe his genius would let him study the material easier than the rest of us.
Thankfully this guy sounds like a nerd when he talks, hope he tries to be more charismatic.
Computer with internet in 2007 was not that big deal. We had one of our own in 2008(as my brother was engineering final). Also internet cafe was prevalent from 2002 had seen My 10th result in cafe in Tier 3 city in Maharashtra. These things are just enablers it's you who do the things.
Yeah its upto a person only to do things but only when that person is capable and smart enough to take best decision for himself/herself.
But those kids in 2007 as you said many people in MH had computers but they lacked the right guidance.
Does it makes sense?
He was privileged enough to be born in a family that can provide an environment where he could study well and give him access to good schooling and coaching.
Ofcourse he did work hard for his accomplishments but he also had some privilege that many others did not.
i guess you haven't read the full post , read the PS at the last.
I am not hating on privileged people, so you should be calm , instead of going in a defensive mode, and tell what privileges you had in your life
i guess you haven't read the full post , read the PS at the last.
I am not hating on privileged people, so you should be calm , instead of going in a defensive mode, and tell what privileges you had in your life
That's just a shitty logic
I am using reddit and living on rent since birth and only have 2 pairs of clothes currently, no property, no savings, nothing
have just 2000 rupees in bank account (including all family members)
Now that means I am more privileged than 95% Indians??
Privileges are relative
[India ships 6.5 Million Branded PCs in 2007, perhaps many more multiples of unbranded computers](https://m.economictimes.com/news/company/corporate-trends/anant-ambanis-vantara-aids-timely-rescue-of-an-ailing-elephant-and-her-calf-team-travels-3500kms-from-jamnagar-to-tripura/articleshow/110134082.cms)
I'm pretty sure even tier-3 cities in Maharashtra had computers around 2005-10. He was still living in Pune.
Getting into MIT takes incredibly hard work, that too getting a 5 GPA there is even tougher. It's not just another university Tom dick and Harry go to for masters. Sure you may not be exposed to these things early in your life. But you are now, you can still be the game changer in the next 15-20 years if you work hard. Guess, what are you choosing to do?
Working hard is tough, giving excuses ranting on the internet is very easy. Appreciate his efforts. Great work by him.
He did his UG at MIT, AFAIK he had some sub 200 rank in JEE Advanced as well. He’s from Pune, I have lived there since childhood and I remember hearing his name as a winner in just about every Math/Science competition. He has gold in IMO which is a big deal and also medals in IPhO and IAO.
I agree, having a PC at home in 2007 wasn’t a big deal.
Done your best is not going to fill my stomach.
Done your best is not going to pay my bills.
I know your idea is to motivate people op and I somewhat agree, it still doesn't make it any better.
It's like you are having a heart attack and the person next to you is telling that it's going to be alright and everything is fine. I get your intention of comforting me, but it doesn't actually help me. I'm having a heart attack.
Genuine why me. I just graduated this year and I don't even have a chance to get a job, because of the market. I am genuinely defeated. No placement in even clg because no company even came to my department. Just customer support job offers.
I bet op you are somewhat privileged, got a job at 2020 and now can easily get a job because you have an experience. Me, I don't . I dont have any experience. No job, no internship , nada, zero, nil. I have tried everything and I am now exhausted. Wake up everyday think about how every decision in my life has lead up to this. Cry myself to sleep. In done. I genuinely love tech and coding. Excited about stuff happening in AI. But I don't fell anything. I have lost everything at this point. No motivation to even wake up let alone do anything. Looking at 100 rejected mails just feels like a slap in face. Nobody cares about individual in this rat race. I'm a loser and a failure. To my parents , to my relatives and to this whole world. The only thing I deserve is to die alone from the side of the road with nobody to remember me. I'm done.
i am just happy that my 5 months of current salary covers my entire life's educational expense (front kg to engg including all the extra tuition) that my parents have spent. (ignoring inflation here)
This is a horrible way to think about and rationalize your actions or cope with them. While certainly these people are privileged, there are also countless who became successful and made their fortune from nothing.
I think the right approach is to understand how important luck plays a role in your progress and the try to maximize that possibility of luck (relocating to the city with the most opportunities from the ones available for you and like maybe try to network more whenever possible instead of being relaxed). IMO never build such a coping system like this, it basically just discourages you to do anything just because.
I got a pc too in 2007 that too LCD. But neither me nor did my parents know about anything else. Not until very late in class 8 did i learn about olympiads and IITs and then i made it my dream. Maybe i could have actually focused on coding and achieved something else today, but You get what you get.
Yep, all the privilege and resources are very important for getting success.
Just deal with card of life you are dealt and make something out of it and be proud 👍
A lot of people had the internet in 2000 or a PC in 2007. Most of them haven't created anything close to what these people have. Internet and PCs seemed like luxuries in India but they were pretty common in developed countries. Don't ignore their hard work and talent.
Hardwork is glorified by vested interests to keep the peasants busy. Hope sells for profits. The sooner you realise it, the better. It's a way of Gaslighting used by governments, billionaires, judges, black money hoarders, to make sure you don't ask for a level playing field.
I have had majority of these things as well. The difference was I went to IIT instead of going to a US college. My friend who went to Berkeley is miles ahead of me career wise.
Its not even privilege but the right kind of privilege who advised this 17 year old kid to go to MIT instead of IIT. Many in that age dont even know that you can write SATs in India. I did not. My friend did and she left for UCB on a scholarship.
The colleges of India are an extension of class 12 for most parts. Those who make it make it on their ability and not the ability of college. This I feel is very different in US at least in BS. MS is filled with Indians so its just rote learn and get a job.
Man, I had a computer in 2000.
I was in 3rd standard.
I knew programming in 4th grade. Html,css, visual basic, basic all that stuff.
Mum used to code in Fortran. Parents were both engineering.
I'm no where near successful as this Praful guy you're talking about.
I've seen people who didn't touch a computer till they entered college and are doing amazing.
Stop comparing, just do you. You don't have to be the best in the world to be happy or successful
You said it wrong. For some people here, privileged people are the most evil. It's their fault they were born in privilege, they worked hard, earned educational merit and then went abroad to study at family's expense. Studying abroad is the biggest crime an Indian can do cuz they had it too easy. Not saying that privilege doesn't make it easier, but it's doesn't make it easy. People who are really talented and determined, they usually find their way regardless of privilege. Meanwhile there are privileged people who don't find any success even if they worked harder than everyone else. It's a matter of destiny.
Yes but are you making full use of the privilege you have right now? That's the point. Many people had the same privileges they had. Other people/kids had the internet and computers in 2007 too, not all of them are where he is.
Less privileged or more privileged has got nothing to do with the success. One must carve his own success out of what he has. Many people take what they have for granted.
Ohh God, same question every night before bed with some sort of self hatred, tbh this reminds of Nanami from jjk.
I got a PC at my home when I was 12 years old but I just used it to play games and I didn't even know about programming back then.
Anyway the past is the past, got to make up for the lost time now, let's do our best fellow programmers.
Another fascinating thread.
Let us unpick what many are simply throwing over to "luck" and using that as an excuse for someones success and not your own.
As the old joke ... "oh lord why do I never win lottery?" ... god responds "Can you meet me halfway and buy a ticket?"
In other words - Luck is when opportunity meets preparation. There is no mystery, no higher power pulling the strings, making others successful while making others failures. You have the sum of all human knowledge, at your fingertips. Think about that for a minute. Everything you ever wanted to know is there for you to read and try to understand.
You may be the best developer the world has ever seen - but if you don't know how to communicate/sell/network then how will people know you exist?
The key to success in this world is communication - or as the business world calls it - networking. Get out there and make friends, in the flesh. 1000 followers on LinkedIn/Reddit/X aren't worth a damn, unless you know them in person.
HOPE is not a strategy.
LUCK is not a rolette wheel.
You have all the tools at your fingertips to be a success - the only person holding you back, is YOU.
Read physiology of money. There’s entire chapter which explains how luck is a major factor in making money or being successful. They give a nice example of Bill Gates.
I think the real privilege is knowing what you really want to do with your life, quite early on. Most of the developers I’ve met got into swe not because they are passionate about it but because they wanted to make big bucks in a short period of time. Nothing wrong with wanting to make money, but when you are truly passionate about something, it shows in the quality of the output, and the great opportunities will come find you.
I didn't have a laptop until 11th grade. In my third year and I'm one of the best in my college with interests and projects spanning across game, web, app, data science and ML.
Cool you can blame it on a privilege or get your ass to actually work. These guys had passion to do it so they made it. They probably also had access tovideo games but they chose to spend time on other stuff
So you kind of agree you dont have any interest in this CS field and were probably pulled in by your parents/money greed and now you cant be successful so you are instead blaming the field? Kind of like "Grapes are sour"? or "Naach na jaane aangan teda" ?
No one has access to Lathe, Mills shapers etc. yet so many excellent Mechanical engineers come out. Also in 2007, PC was pretty common.
Believe me, People like even if have gotten PC earlier, you wouldn't have started with DSA at age of 10. You would rather be complaining some other factors right now.
You had access to books right? Why did you not make any breakthrough in theoretical physics?
its like saying in 2010 people had opportunity of buying Bitcoin for single digits
even generation will have some opportunity but only few capitalise on it .
going with your bitcoin example, -- some kids father already got advice from their privileged group of people back then to buy bitcoin without even thinking and hold it for long term
and you, me or our fathers did not got that advice / guidance from anybody
You got the point right ?
okay agreed, but i used general flair, also there is no subreddit especially for these types of post.
there is flair for referral, personal win, news , tech gadgets review, etc, so i guess its totally fine
This is such a cursed mentality.
Why even bother then ? Since luck is the deciding factor, why work hard ? Why put in any amount of effort ? Why bother ? It’s luck right, you can make it without hard work or talent, just get lucky.
Having access to something that hardly 10% people have is not luck ? No one is discrediting hardwork and intellect here, read the post again. Imagine people who didn't have access to a basic computer or internet while growing up and they're beating themselves up for not being 'smart' or 'hardworking'. This post is meant for them. If you see this as an excuse then you clearly lack comprehension skills
These people just think in binary terms
either luck or hardwork
Reality is luck+hardwork
Getting food in front of you is luck
Eating that food with your hands and mouth is hardwork
It won't come to your stomach automatically even if you are privileged to have it
That's how success can be described
And yet time and time again IIT toppers come from the least privileged families.
And yet time and time again UPSC toppers come from the least privileged families.
Want more ?
Oprah Winfrey : born in a poor family, victim of SA, ran away from home at 13 yo, mother at 14 :)
Leonardo Del Vecchio : son of a widowed mother (she had 5 children), lived in an orphanage at 7. Worked in a moulding factory at 14. Used that money to go to design school. Founded Luxottica.
Sheldon Adelson : son of a cab driver, delivered newspapers at 12
Celine Dion
JK Rowling
Steve Jobs
Larry Ellison
Ralph Lauren
The list goes on … perhaps your excuse is you can’t do that in India ?
So here …
Lakshmi Mittal
Ravi Pillai
Punit Renjen
There are 20 billion more examples and they all made it after not having enough to eat or sleep and your excuse is: “Sorry I didn’t have a computer at 5”
And as for
> having access to something that hardly 10% people have is not luck ?
Sure you can be born lucky, but you don’t need that to be successful. Don’t discredit people’s hardwork, there’s more people who had a computer at 5 and didn’t do shit with it than the number of people who had one and did something and even fewer who think they could’ve done something better if they had one at 5
Besides if being born lucky is your problem, why are you stopping at people who had computer at 5 ? Look higher, there’s people who have enough money that their next 5 generation can spend lavishly without working a single second and it’ll be totally okay.
Ever heard of Survivorship Bias? Your examples mean nothing if you don't present the number of hardworking people who did not succeed.
Again I'm asking how does acknowledging privilege make an eXcUsE to not work hard? Where am I or the OP saying that he didn't work hard?? Is it a rule to never ever acknowledge factors of luck?
This is like walking up to a homeless person and teaching him that the only reason he isn't a millionaire is because he keeps making excuses and doesn't work hard enough. Is the only reason you're not a billionaire or the best in the world in your field because you don't work hard enough?
It's always going to be hard work or luck or both to do exceptionally well. Hard work increases your probability of success and so does privilege. Everyone should obviously work hard and not get into a victim mindset.
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Hard work or talent alone is not sufficient. You must have luck also to support your project and get traction in the market. If you don't have luck your hard work and talent both will be crushed, amount to nothing. Those who've experienced it will know..
This! I see so many people here claim that hard work is got them success when in reality its luck that got them there. Survivorship bias blinded them. It is all about luck and the connections you make. People really need to check their privileges. Life is a luck based game and anyone who thinks it is skill based is fooling themselves.
Excuse me if I am wrong, but I think you might have missed u/joydps ‘s point. While they acknowledge that hard work and talent can be useless without some luck, they’re not saying that luck is the only factor that matters. Luck is often seen as purely random chance or statistical probability, where people might find themselves in the “right place at the right time.” However, in the context of success, luck truly works when the “right” people are in the “right place at the right time.” These “right” people are those with hard work and talent. Hard work and talent equip individuals with the skills and readiness to seize fortunate opportunities when they arise. Essentially, “Luck is what happens when preparation meets opportunity.”
Perfect scores, and repeated olympiad wins, you are delulu if you think this is luck, he just won and won some more. Maybe it's talent, maybe it's coaching, but he still probably had an elite mind. He also chose AI, which is something maybe akin to luck, but again maybe it's his genius.
It's of course not just luck, but it's luck too. You can't even imagine the number of things which could have gone wrong but didn't due to luck. Those things could have gone wrong for others.
he still would have ended up in faangmula. His luck is how ended up stickign with open ai or going to usa or mit. But then maybe it isn't even luck. Maybe it's simply one of the permutation of events that would have likely happened either way.
And luck decides the permutation which is chosen. Luck is nothing more than a dice roll based on weighted probabilities.
I'm saying the all the sides of the dice are gold.
buddy multiple olympiad wins , shows guy has got an early start with the right if not perfect set of instructors also the thing that the child is willing to learn stuff for such exams , otherwise we also have thousands of kids out there who's interests are different and they are pursuing it , or are not interested in trying something (spoiled brats as u may call them ) even though they come from a good family with better advantages
Point is none of them are winning whether they are trying or not and some of them trying extemely hard. I was one of those kids who thought highly of himself, I even earned some money through tech back then and did cool animations in c++ but did I tangibly ever achieve something in software engineering that only a fraction would be able to come up with, I don't think so. I couldn't for the life of me be absorb all engineering stuff into my head very easily and I'm not able to do it now as well (I'm enrolled in a masters). I thought it was because I was distracted back then, I'm learning well today but turns out its still pretty tough and if I go deep enough, it's exactly like those early days. I find this similar to chess competitions, you would consider Magnus Carlsen the most talented player in 2024, because he literally he is the most talented, and let's consider there are similarly talented individuals in the world. I think that'd come out to maybe 10-20 people in the chess world who are his equals with respect to talent alone and it's knowledge battles that he ventured into that made him truly the best. The point still is there is only 10-20 out of 7 billion. Now if we ignore the chess world, that its still probably like 10000 people maximum. I think this guy is one of those 10000 folks but in software engineering. You can only ever apply yourself so much bro. This is the same thing Jeff Bezos found out on his own when he was studying physics, and now I find the same holds true for me as well with a hard education. If it makes any difference to my arguement I do think I'm a top percentile coder.
I understand ur point man and respect it , thing is I got nostalgic 😅 to this as I was genuinely interested in coding math Oly stuff even qualified for a camp in dehradun by nasa but could not go bcz of my family constraint + my father struggling a lot in his job which brought meager money made them think that only gov job can fix them , tried hard on me to manipulate so that I get that job and make my life good but was simply not interested , though I am yet to join corporate but I always had that feeling lingering on me to pursue research in math etc but parents simply denied , life was not good at any point made me feel it is what it is , maybe I will end up in poverty / misery what my parents had , this thing hit so hard that I completely stopped studying and now I realise it is too late for me ( entering some random clg now , don't know where ) but yeah definitely I am trying to make terms with life . Sorry it was a rant ig 😔
Random college in Engineering / Stem is still great man. Don't you worry at all. I too thought my life was going to be bad and I won't get one of those brand name companies on my resume . I got a brand name co. rihgt now. You'll achieve it too man. And never underscore the possibility of making it big within a span of a few short days or weeks, this is especially true in the tech industry. Save aggressively into a mutual fund or stock as well. You and your family will do great.
Thanks sir 🙏 means alot , really having a tough time but always saying myself this shall to pass , everyday with taunts from family members this is become cruel Once again thanx for the mental support 🙏 I think that is what a man wants at the end of the day
You are welcome man. You will definitely succeed.
"Luck" is what happens when "preparation" meets "opportunity".
You can have all the opportunity and all the preparation, but can still die if a garbage truck hits you
9 out of 10 successful people today are because of generational wealth or referrals . Please don't bait people wasting their money in useless courses or wasting their time for stupid entrance exam let them do their whole thing.
how often then not u hear that a guy could not do XYZ thing because of maybe family, or work or some other constraint ?! if not then stop fooling around with this stupid quote
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That’s not true.
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So something is impossible, regardless of how much hard work you do
Dude just proved himself wrong in a span of two comments. lol
What idealistic bullshit
Our next generations will have similar privileges compared to us, every generation tries to make things better for the next and that propels a society forward.
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Also he had computers since childhood
+ a college ( ig georgia tech or some other state univ idr , who is said to have the first super computer got into cllg )
I got a laptop in my last year of college before I used to do it on the phone.
How to do it on the phone?
Termux, Acode, pydroid, cppdroid, replit, Arduinodroid
People who only boost about hardwork hardwork won't accept that in any success luck and privilege are the biggest factor. A guy who can't even afford basic PC won't turn into LC Knight. With hardwork you can reach places but still you'd be way behind of those who come from privilege and had luck. Hatdwork solely isn't enough. There are many guys playing better cricket than Kohli in gully cricket who are more hardworking than him and have no facilities like him but sadly they can't reach the place Kohli or Dhoni is.
This is the reason I have been started thinking this whole merit thing is false concept, most of the STEM guys simply can''t comprehend this and coming from JEE or NEET background they can't stop sticking labels on people.
Wtf is a LC knight. It's sad you associate a good software engineer with leetcode
Wtf is a good software engineer, it's sad that you associate software with a good engineer lol.
Go say this to MAANG recruiters.
I and even many here had PC at home in 2007. But I wasted my time of life playing games on PC and learning grammar rather than focusing on doing such innovationm
Wasted is a very strong term for not behaving like a special kid. And innovation can be done if you start even now. We should not indirectly underrate all the researchers in the world who have already left and will leave the planet finding micro improvements and 10000's ways to fail for that 1 person to read all papers and connect the dots for a major breakthrough.
true, the development u/Fabulous-Category155 had since the childhood and over the years has made you capable enough of judging your time if it was wasteful or not. I'd consider it as an achievement.. many people don't even bother to look back
ahh throwback to age of empires and a bunch of flash games, I won't say it was time wasted!
Technically kids like us encouraged other kids in school to convince their parents to buy a pc in those days😄😄
You got PC , that's great but there was no one to tell you or guide you that instead of playing games do coding and all , buy guiding i mean a mentor or any person who stayed with that kid until he/she starts to learn and explore the knowledge themselves. Because distractions keep distracting kids, but mentors or guardians keep them focus
Yeah I was 6 years old and I didn't have any basic knowledge about what and how coding works. In fact I didn't know there was someone called a programmer who created all this website and all. All I cared about was to play games or do timepass.
Why is it waste of time, bro don't be so hard on yourself we are not machines, that for every input same and equal output should be there, both of you were probably doing the things you enjoyed at that time.
Same
Nah I’m glad I played those long hours of cricket 07 fifa games rest of times i used to play enjoy on playground playing cricket I've few brilliant students in school with patents math gold Olympiads but they're hardly doing anything significant in their life. It's more about the time mindset and fire of a person ( intent ). With persistent efforts such people turn situations in their favours( luck and right time right place matters alot ) stop compare yourself with others instead of focusing more on yourself.
Remember this, "you cannot change your past ,but you can still f your future" , you can definitely achieve all of it when u stop giving excuses and start working on shit which is is in your control.
Right, just deal with the cards you are dealt and make something out of it
This is true. And privilege not only in terms of money, but also resources and access to those resources, time to actually use them, and health. Most people don't have the same starting point so why compare ? You are on different stages in the race
That's logic people use for reservation and it's true as well.
You are 100% correct. Caste plays a major role too.
yeah but i think after some generations , when u already have your grandfathers and father in grade A lvl gov posts , I really feel they should give up on that , bcz that makes them feel that they have got to achieve only what is set as a bar for them in society say less marks or so
A lack of resources (including money) also tremendously affects people psychologically, which is something that is not often talked about.
comparison is everywhere when a man's value is based on how much he earns rather than how he is.
There is a book called "Outliers" by Malcolm Gladwell. In it, he presents the "10,000-hour rule," which posits that one needs to practice something for at least 10,000 hours to become an expert. One of the examples he gives is about the creator of Java, James Gosling. Gosling had access to a computer early in his life due to his parents, which allowed him to become proficient with computers at a young age. This early exposure gave him a significant head start and contributed to his expertise in the field.
she even includes cases from sports programmers , wealthy men etc
Luck plays a major role dude :(
Well not to be that guy but lot of people in India got PC in 2000 ..so definitely he had talent and did all the hard work
Yeah.. I was thinking the same. We bought a PC in 2000 with internet and we were lower middle class.
CAP, every Indian belonging to upper class calls themselves middle class
I haven't had my first laptop till 2020, 3rd year of the clg..., neither my frnds. You are in a bubble.
In Indian economy... Many successful entrepreneurs are successful because their family already have enough wealth to support them, and same can be said for me too I'm privileged i didn't like my manufacturing job I quit (i was cad designer the only person working on 3d modelling had full freedom as it was a startup), I left it for getting into AI/ML roles it is somewhat breaking my heart now that even though I'm trying hard I'm going nowhere I'll be 30 in some years so there's is that too but any sane middle class person wouldn't be able to do what I did.. Privilege background luck qualifications everything matters in this country to get ahead
You are a self aware person who accepts that you were privileged, many people gets offended if someone tell them explicitly
I mean they get offended because they know didn't earn the spot tumbad movie has this dialogue "virasat me mili har chiz pe dawa nhi karte",... I live my life by that, me trying and then failing to be a Best CAD designer just taught me the lesson hard way that I'll be a good software engineer as I was good at computer stuff from the start CAD itself is very white collar ac room computer job... My clg friends in first year used to say you're making a mistake change your branch to cs or it but I was very much influenced by what my father did his whole life (obvio made me believe mech is the best branch in this world) being a field manager.. Ik many who had it all and lost it all because they didn't earn it, when you don't earn it you don't care about it enough and break whatever it is eventually
Finally someone said it. It’s absolutely right. Being at right time, right place and support system is so much important to become successful But sadly people don’t talk the support they get, people just glorify success by saying it’s all happened bcz of hardwork
I had this privilege, my home had the Internet since 1998. All I did was pirating games and movies
you lacked the guidance , but its ok we cannot blame anybody
Acknowledging privilege is a sign of humility.
Nothing matters.. All are gonna die
one statement from a gora is all it takes to make a billion people create a marketing campaign for him lol
I falled in the trap 🤡
fell\*
Talent also plays a part here, it looks like many in this sub reddit are ignoring it. I'm studying a masters right now and boy is it tough, I'm spending what feels like 1-3 hours 4-6 days a week and still is beating my ass, I'm not the top of the class, hopefully middle atleast don't know. I'm managing to get through each week with tiny bits being left behind. I'm not saying he didn't worked hard ? But why did he? He had the passion for it, so it wasn't probably work in the first place and secondly maybe his genius would let him study the material easier than the rest of us. Thankfully this guy sounds like a nerd when he talks, hope he tries to be more charismatic.
Bhai 90% log ko 2000 mai bhi pc dedeta na, tab bhi kuch nahi ukhad paate (including me)
PC is not that important , right guidance and mentorship is , which shapes a child
And the curiosity, if your kid is not curious about it you can't force it on him.
Mere paas to abhi bhi PC nhi h, gharwale greeb nhi h par fir bhi PC nhi dete h, saale chindi kanjoos
Hahaha 😂
Hard work, circumstances, your talent and lastly luck ..these are the things for one's success.
Computer with internet in 2007 was not that big deal. We had one of our own in 2008(as my brother was engineering final). Also internet cafe was prevalent from 2002 had seen My 10th result in cafe in Tier 3 city in Maharashtra. These things are just enablers it's you who do the things.
Yeah its upto a person only to do things but only when that person is capable and smart enough to take best decision for himself/herself. But those kids in 2007 as you said many people in MH had computers but they lacked the right guidance. Does it makes sense?
Have you seen his ranks and qualifications ?, Or just dunking down on someone's hardwork they did in their life
He was privileged enough to be born in a family that can provide an environment where he could study well and give him access to good schooling and coaching. Ofcourse he did work hard for his accomplishments but he also had some privilege that many others did not.
i guess you haven't read the full post , read the PS at the last. I am not hating on privileged people, so you should be calm , instead of going in a defensive mode, and tell what privileges you had in your life
You don't get that without privilege tho?
He clearly mentions it's hard work + privilege in the post itself
probably this. OP is just jealous.
i guess you haven't read the full post , read the PS at the last. I am not hating on privileged people, so you should be calm , instead of going in a defensive mode, and tell what privileges you had in your life
The fact that you are able to commenting and using reddit already puts you in top 5% of indians. You are more privileged than 95% of indians.
That's just a shitty logic I am using reddit and living on rent since birth and only have 2 pairs of clothes currently, no property, no savings, nothing have just 2000 rupees in bank account (including all family members) Now that means I am more privileged than 95% Indians??
Nah, bro here my father earn 10000 a month in a factory job. I don't think I am top 5% by any means lmao.
why would you want to be a swift developer just curious aside from making ios apps?
I wrote that swift developer sentence just as a fact, i mean those who cannot buy mac, is already out of the competition right?
Privileges are relative [India ships 6.5 Million Branded PCs in 2007, perhaps many more multiples of unbranded computers](https://m.economictimes.com/news/company/corporate-trends/anant-ambanis-vantara-aids-timely-rescue-of-an-ailing-elephant-and-her-calf-team-travels-3500kms-from-jamnagar-to-tripura/articleshow/110134082.cms)
I'm pretty sure even tier-3 cities in Maharashtra had computers around 2005-10. He was still living in Pune. Getting into MIT takes incredibly hard work, that too getting a 5 GPA there is even tougher. It's not just another university Tom dick and Harry go to for masters. Sure you may not be exposed to these things early in your life. But you are now, you can still be the game changer in the next 15-20 years if you work hard. Guess, what are you choosing to do? Working hard is tough, giving excuses ranting on the internet is very easy. Appreciate his efforts. Great work by him.
He did his UG at MIT, AFAIK he had some sub 200 rank in JEE Advanced as well. He’s from Pune, I have lived there since childhood and I remember hearing his name as a winner in just about every Math/Science competition. He has gold in IMO which is a big deal and also medals in IPhO and IAO. I agree, having a PC at home in 2007 wasn’t a big deal.
I also appreciate his efforts , read the PS at last of the post
I am not dying coding. I better do something else !
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That means he is god favorite child
Agree. I too got an computer in 2004, at age 7. And I attribute my success to the same.
Done your best is not going to fill my stomach. Done your best is not going to pay my bills. I know your idea is to motivate people op and I somewhat agree, it still doesn't make it any better. It's like you are having a heart attack and the person next to you is telling that it's going to be alright and everything is fine. I get your intention of comforting me, but it doesn't actually help me. I'm having a heart attack. Genuine why me. I just graduated this year and I don't even have a chance to get a job, because of the market. I am genuinely defeated. No placement in even clg because no company even came to my department. Just customer support job offers. I bet op you are somewhat privileged, got a job at 2020 and now can easily get a job because you have an experience. Me, I don't . I dont have any experience. No job, no internship , nada, zero, nil. I have tried everything and I am now exhausted. Wake up everyday think about how every decision in my life has lead up to this. Cry myself to sleep. In done. I genuinely love tech and coding. Excited about stuff happening in AI. But I don't fell anything. I have lost everything at this point. No motivation to even wake up let alone do anything. Looking at 100 rejected mails just feels like a slap in face. Nobody cares about individual in this rat race. I'm a loser and a failure. To my parents , to my relatives and to this whole world. The only thing I deserve is to die alone from the side of the road with nobody to remember me. I'm done.
i am just happy that my 5 months of current salary covers my entire life's educational expense (front kg to engg including all the extra tuition) that my parents have spent. (ignoring inflation here)
This is a horrible way to think about and rationalize your actions or cope with them. While certainly these people are privileged, there are also countless who became successful and made their fortune from nothing. I think the right approach is to understand how important luck plays a role in your progress and the try to maximize that possibility of luck (relocating to the city with the most opportunities from the ones available for you and like maybe try to network more whenever possible instead of being relaxed). IMO never build such a coping system like this, it basically just discourages you to do anything just because.
I made it to an adult age. Privilege played a role.
focus on things which one can control, try not to worry about things one can't control. Peace ✌🏻
I got a pc too in 2007 that too LCD. But neither me nor did my parents know about anything else. Not until very late in class 8 did i learn about olympiads and IITs and then i made it my dream. Maybe i could have actually focused on coding and achieved something else today, but You get what you get.
I will tend to believe that I'll get lucky similarly like them in other field and work my ass of if I genuinely want to do, no rat race thingy
Yep, all the privilege and resources are very important for getting success. Just deal with card of life you are dealt and make something out of it and be proud 👍
What's with the ' poor me ' post op ? Hard work hardly matters todays you're either lucky or unlucky.
well i guess, you are right we can say 20% is preparing for interview, 80% is resume getting shortlisted in a pool of 1000+ candidates
The is again the Dart game in the circus story.
A lot of people had the internet in 2000 or a PC in 2007. Most of them haven't created anything close to what these people have. Internet and PCs seemed like luxuries in India but they were pretty common in developed countries. Don't ignore their hard work and talent.
Hardwork is glorified by vested interests to keep the peasants busy. Hope sells for profits. The sooner you realise it, the better. It's a way of Gaslighting used by governments, billionaires, judges, black money hoarders, to make sure you don't ask for a level playing field.
I have had majority of these things as well. The difference was I went to IIT instead of going to a US college. My friend who went to Berkeley is miles ahead of me career wise. Its not even privilege but the right kind of privilege who advised this 17 year old kid to go to MIT instead of IIT. Many in that age dont even know that you can write SATs in India. I did not. My friend did and she left for UCB on a scholarship. The colleges of India are an extension of class 12 for most parts. Those who make it make it on their ability and not the ability of college. This I feel is very different in US at least in BS. MS is filled with Indians so its just rote learn and get a job.
Man, I had a computer in 2000. I was in 3rd standard. I knew programming in 4th grade. Html,css, visual basic, basic all that stuff. Mum used to code in Fortran. Parents were both engineering. I'm no where near successful as this Praful guy you're talking about. I've seen people who didn't touch a computer till they entered college and are doing amazing. Stop comparing, just do you. You don't have to be the best in the world to be happy or successful
You said it wrong. For some people here, privileged people are the most evil. It's their fault they were born in privilege, they worked hard, earned educational merit and then went abroad to study at family's expense. Studying abroad is the biggest crime an Indian can do cuz they had it too easy. Not saying that privilege doesn't make it easier, but it's doesn't make it easy. People who are really talented and determined, they usually find their way regardless of privilege. Meanwhile there are privileged people who don't find any success even if they worked harder than everyone else. It's a matter of destiny.
Many people got PC early in life, they used it for watching movies, and playing games.
I still remember going to Neighbours house to complete my assignments in 12th standard for CS subject. We have worked hard guys.
Who is this nerd
Yes but are you making full use of the privilege you have right now? That's the point. Many people had the same privileges they had. Other people/kids had the internet and computers in 2007 too, not all of them are where he is. Less privileged or more privileged has got nothing to do with the success. One must carve his own success out of what he has. Many people take what they have for granted.
Outliers is a good book on this
Rare r/developersIndia win
This kid worked hard. Full stop. Having a PC in 2007 was not luxury. I had one and many of my friends.
What a way to diminish this guy's achievements. The year was 2007, not 1987. Lots of kids had PCs at the time and did nothing with it.
Ohh God, same question every night before bed with some sort of self hatred, tbh this reminds of Nanami from jjk. I got a PC at my home when I was 12 years old but I just used it to play games and I didn't even know about programming back then. Anyway the past is the past, got to make up for the lost time now, let's do our best fellow programmers.
Another fascinating thread. Let us unpick what many are simply throwing over to "luck" and using that as an excuse for someones success and not your own. As the old joke ... "oh lord why do I never win lottery?" ... god responds "Can you meet me halfway and buy a ticket?" In other words - Luck is when opportunity meets preparation. There is no mystery, no higher power pulling the strings, making others successful while making others failures. You have the sum of all human knowledge, at your fingertips. Think about that for a minute. Everything you ever wanted to know is there for you to read and try to understand. You may be the best developer the world has ever seen - but if you don't know how to communicate/sell/network then how will people know you exist? The key to success in this world is communication - or as the business world calls it - networking. Get out there and make friends, in the flesh. 1000 followers on LinkedIn/Reddit/X aren't worth a damn, unless you know them in person. HOPE is not a strategy. LUCK is not a rolette wheel. You have all the tools at your fingertips to be a success - the only person holding you back, is YOU.
Read physiology of money. There’s entire chapter which explains how luck is a major factor in making money or being successful. They give a nice example of Bill Gates.
All above are excuses..
Reminds me of android studio burning my 2gb second hand laptop and app build took forever to complete
OMG we will now go about claiming chatgpt/openai is Indian, the next biggest invention after UPI.
[Itna-Galat-Kaise-Ho-Sakte-Ho-Bhai-meme-template-of-Super-30.jpg (1600×900) (humornama.com)](https://humornama.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/08/Itna-Galat-Kaise-Ho-Sakte-Ho-Bhai-meme-template-of-Super-30.jpg)
Thanks for this encouraging post.
i got PC in 2016 hueheu but i used it to play games, am pretty sure if i got Pc in 2000 id play video games
When it comes to lucky people getting success, Elon Musk comes to mind. Also, luck has been a part of my life as well
I think the real privilege is knowing what you really want to do with your life, quite early on. Most of the developers I’ve met got into swe not because they are passionate about it but because they wanted to make big bucks in a short period of time. Nothing wrong with wanting to make money, but when you are truly passionate about something, it shows in the quality of the output, and the great opportunities will come find you.
Cope
I didn't have a laptop until 11th grade. In my third year and I'm one of the best in my college with interests and projects spanning across game, web, app, data science and ML.
Cool you can blame it on a privilege or get your ass to actually work. These guys had passion to do it so they made it. They probably also had access tovideo games but they chose to spend time on other stuff
I love this quote, not sure where I had heard it first “The harder you work, the luckier you get”
So you kind of agree you dont have any interest in this CS field and were probably pulled in by your parents/money greed and now you cant be successful so you are instead blaming the field? Kind of like "Grapes are sour"? or "Naach na jaane aangan teda" ? No one has access to Lathe, Mills shapers etc. yet so many excellent Mechanical engineers come out. Also in 2007, PC was pretty common. Believe me, People like even if have gotten PC earlier, you wouldn't have started with DSA at age of 10. You would rather be complaining some other factors right now. You had access to books right? Why did you not make any breakthrough in theoretical physics?
And how many of those mechanical engineers make breakthroughs like him ?
its like saying in 2010 people had opportunity of buying Bitcoin for single digits even generation will have some opportunity but only few capitalise on it .
going with your bitcoin example, -- some kids father already got advice from their privileged group of people back then to buy bitcoin without even thinking and hold it for long term and you, me or our fathers did not got that advice / guidance from anybody You got the point right ?
What a bunch of losers trying to console themselves for not working hard and smart enough
Avg motivational posts these days please don't make reddit linked in🙏🙏
okay agreed, but i used general flair, also there is no subreddit especially for these types of post. there is flair for referral, personal win, news , tech gadgets review, etc, so i guess its totally fine
Dude you won't get how much inaccurate is your post and assumptions
Tell , i am open to feedbacks and improvements
This is such a cursed mentality. Why even bother then ? Since luck is the deciding factor, why work hard ? Why put in any amount of effort ? Why bother ? It’s luck right, you can make it without hard work or talent, just get lucky.
Having access to something that hardly 10% people have is not luck ? No one is discrediting hardwork and intellect here, read the post again. Imagine people who didn't have access to a basic computer or internet while growing up and they're beating themselves up for not being 'smart' or 'hardworking'. This post is meant for them. If you see this as an excuse then you clearly lack comprehension skills
These people just think in binary terms either luck or hardwork Reality is luck+hardwork Getting food in front of you is luck Eating that food with your hands and mouth is hardwork It won't come to your stomach automatically even if you are privileged to have it That's how success can be described
While I’ll agree with the statement you’ve chosen a terrible example. Getting food in front of you is not luck and eating is not hard work.
And yet time and time again IIT toppers come from the least privileged families. And yet time and time again UPSC toppers come from the least privileged families. Want more ? Oprah Winfrey : born in a poor family, victim of SA, ran away from home at 13 yo, mother at 14 :) Leonardo Del Vecchio : son of a widowed mother (she had 5 children), lived in an orphanage at 7. Worked in a moulding factory at 14. Used that money to go to design school. Founded Luxottica. Sheldon Adelson : son of a cab driver, delivered newspapers at 12 Celine Dion JK Rowling Steve Jobs Larry Ellison Ralph Lauren The list goes on … perhaps your excuse is you can’t do that in India ? So here … Lakshmi Mittal Ravi Pillai Punit Renjen There are 20 billion more examples and they all made it after not having enough to eat or sleep and your excuse is: “Sorry I didn’t have a computer at 5” And as for > having access to something that hardly 10% people have is not luck ? Sure you can be born lucky, but you don’t need that to be successful. Don’t discredit people’s hardwork, there’s more people who had a computer at 5 and didn’t do shit with it than the number of people who had one and did something and even fewer who think they could’ve done something better if they had one at 5 Besides if being born lucky is your problem, why are you stopping at people who had computer at 5 ? Look higher, there’s people who have enough money that their next 5 generation can spend lavishly without working a single second and it’ll be totally okay.
Ever heard of Survivorship Bias? Your examples mean nothing if you don't present the number of hardworking people who did not succeed. Again I'm asking how does acknowledging privilege make an eXcUsE to not work hard? Where am I or the OP saying that he didn't work hard?? Is it a rule to never ever acknowledge factors of luck? This is like walking up to a homeless person and teaching him that the only reason he isn't a millionaire is because he keeps making excuses and doesn't work hard enough. Is the only reason you're not a billionaire or the best in the world in your field because you don't work hard enough? It's always going to be hard work or luck or both to do exceptionally well. Hard work increases your probability of success and so does privilege. Everyone should obviously work hard and not get into a victim mindset.