Nope, the Hospital scene can be explained, Shinji needed absolute rock bottom to bound from. Is it Pretty? No. But it does work.
What was the narrative importance of the test plug suit?
Ill allow it, but piss poor choice that was certainly aimed at that subgroup of fandom that keeps masturbating to Asuka long after it has ceased to be a natural part of exploring a healthy teenage sexual drive and moved straight to the creepzone.
I didn’t check the source of what i’m saying but i saw somewhere that the Hospital scene was here bc Hideaki Anno wanted to trigger the fan that harassed him bc of the anime ending
I really really loved the part in 3.0+1.0 where they lived in the village. That move all together was pretty amazing. But still NGE is still better overall for sure.
For me, the village was my favorite part. Had they simply returned to the village at the end of the movie instead of "rewriting the world", I'd probably ultimately have felt ok about the rebuilds. Instead, I think they're pretty terrible.
I thought that the village was in a very precarious position and was gradually failing. Returning there at the end would've been only a stay on extinction, and the beauty/peace only a temporary respite. They had already lost at this point, and rewriting the world was necessary and inevitable.
Edit- imo
Since world-building wasn't extremely tight in the rebuilds, the writers could ultimately decide the post-ending state of the village. And they had plenty to work with for returning to the village and revitalizing the world.
1. Opening scene shows that "decorification" can happen very quickly in-universe. When they're in Paris they're able to restore the city using some technomagic almost instantaneously. That'd suggest that Wille would be able to heal the world pretty quickly once Nerv was defeated.
2. Kaji had preserved all that animal life on the ark. It seems odd that we dedicated time to that plot point only to have it not matter in a "re-written world.
3. Life in the village looked pretty nice. Sure, they had to deal with rations and other issues. But it hardly looked post-apocalyptic compared to other post-apocalyptic works of fiction.
4. Shinji had access to godlike magic powers. He probably could've just de-corified the world and returned all the people. For some reason, the writers didn't want this to happen and instead chose to "re-write the world" without ever providing any clarity on what that means.
Oh, I thought “re-writing the world” was exactly this, removing the effects of evangelions. Shinji says he didn’t want to go back in time or create a vastly different alternate world. The only people we see afterwards were Eva pilots, which are weird cases, but I think the rest of the world was just decorified.
It seems to me that you just described what actually happened.
Yeah. the train station seemed to be in a totally normal world where Eva didn't happen. The looking at the other pilots and not responding seemed to point to a memory wipe for Shinji regarding everyone but Mari.
To your point, there's a theory that that last scene is the anti-verse and they're running out to return to their world. To me that'd make more sense thematically, but the fact that the last cut is of "Our world" and not of the "Eva world" seems to create a pretty strong feeling that that's not the case. For some reason, they chose not to show them literally returning to the Eva world. Whether that's just a symbolic choice or because of the fact that he re-wrote the past completely is unclear. But it feels really strongly like he did re-write the past. And that seems to be the more widely held view as far as I can tell. I'd like to be wrong though.
The Rebuilds ended the moment Shinji saved everyone during Instrumentality. Everything else was just a bonus, so I don't think it in any way warrants hating the Rebuilds over the last few scenes.
If the "removing all Evangelions" part came right after Misato sending off the last spear to Shinji and then it cut to credits, I would be furious and 100% would agree with you.
However, with all the tiny details, goosebump - inducing scenes of this sequence and how well it ties in with the parallel META - narrative (interestingly, both "Goodbye, All Evangelions" and "Goodbye, All of Evangelion" have been used as official advertising slogans for the movie), I personally love the last sequence...
I get so sad every time the final angel attacks and interrupts Rei's dinner to bring Shinji and his dad closer together 😔 the rebuilds really focused on making Rei more human and seeing her try so hard to them together all for it to be for nothing just breaks my heart a little
Unpopular opinion: 3.0 + 1.0s ending hurt more.
Hear me out.
End of Evangelion sent me through a roller-coaster of emotions. I left that movie extremely satisfied. I only understood a good half of it, but that doesn't matter with Evangelion if we're being honest - what matters is how it makes you feel about yourself. EoE made me feel very hopeful and while the movie itself had tons of highly depressing themes and motifs, the ending was a light of hope.
I liked 3.0 + 1.0; not nearly as much as EoE but it was still a very good movie. However, this one left me feeling kinda sad - not because the journey is over but because of *how* it ended. I'm not a fan of "everybody forgets who their friends from another life are and then leads a happy life without them" endings. Mari made this feel a lot worse for me because of how shoehorned she was and how big of a role she played in the end (and I'm still wondering who she even is; ik about the theories and all but I can't see why she's been put into these movies). It *looked* like they're living a happy life in the end of 3.0 + 1.0 but seemed a bit shallow compared to EoE where you won't see how everyone turns out to be after Shinji rejects instrumentality.
EoE just seems more "realistic": Everyone lived through a crisis and (at least the ones who want to) survived and can live a life outside of the LCL soup. Life goes on. The world is bombed but people can still build a society (like the villages in 3.0 + 1.0), whereas the last movie just seemed like a generic happy ending with some basic characters.
As I said, I liked 3.0 + 1.0, especially because of things like Gendo's redemption arc etc. (it was good imo, but his original story was just as good. You don't need good characters only) but people who say EoE was depressing seem to not get the message of it.
Most of what I've said though is up to debate and personal opinion. The fact that I don't like these type of endings is just my taste and doesn't mean that they're objectively bad
Hey i don’t have very much to add but just read this and wanted to thank you for your comment. It put into words some thoughts and feelings i’ve been having about 3.0+1.0. I didn’t hate it, but it felt hollow and left me sadder than the original movie left me, and i think you may have expressed a part of the reason. Thank you!
Oh for sure, but considering the way the story changed in 3.33 & 3.0 + 1.0, her being around added some legitimacy to Wünder as a whole with both her and Asuka piloting alongside them, as the other 3 pilots were all on NERV's side technically. I definitely think the original series and ending is better overall and fits what the series was getting at, but the rebuild was a more fun action-oriented thrill ride that brought a lot of newcomers into the fold, such as myself.
Gendo doesn't really get any new development in the first 2 movies. He's fairly absent from the last two outside of being a caricature evil villain.
Then we get to instrumentality. We learn nothing particularly new that wasn't in the original series' flashbacks. But we do get a "Sorry, I was mean and ignored you your whole life. I swear I was just doing it because I thought it was best for you." Which to me, doesn't even sound like an apology. It kind of sounds like continuing to avoid responsibility.
Then he gets to embrace Yui after literally trying to destroy all of humanity to do so. Seems kinda fucked up that he gets rewarded withe his megalomaniacal goal after a simple half-baked apology like that.
I saw this as brief - Shinji destroys all the EVAs, so what happens to their souls after Unit 01 and 13 are unmade is a mystery to us.
If there is a hell in EVA, I’m not sure that version of Gendo avoided it.
>Then he gets to embrace Yui after literally trying to destroy all of humanity to do so.
You mean saving, right?
Without him humanity just gets fucked by angels, the end.
First of all - nothing is ruined, as this timeline exists as a separate reality from the original timeline.
Second - Gendo's arc in the Rebuilds is really an extension of Shinji's arc. Meaning, Anno wrote it so that SHINJI could go somewhere he hadn't gone before.
Rebuilds consistently deliver a Shinji who is willing to go all the way, face all his fears (not without struggles, of course).
It was the fact that he did the ultimate thing - confronting the generational trauma he inherited from his father - that makes the Rebuilds a worthy addition to the franchise, IMO.
Should mention that Gendo’s and Yui’s souls’ whereabouts are a mystery to us. Unit-01 and 13 have been unmade and without vessels for soul storage, it’s to the afterlife!
If we’re discussing Mari’s old classmates beyond narrative purpose, the difference between Yui’s purity and Gendo’s corruption matters.
> this timeline exists as a separate reality
Isn’t it possible that the EVAs were destroyed in *all* realities?
>Should mention that Gendo’s and Yui’s souls’ whereabouts are a mystery to us. Unit-01 and 13 have been unmade and without vessels for soul storage, it’s to the afterlife!
Yes true - I think this contributes to the sense of closure. Best ending either of them has had; their karma and narrative utility is now completely fulfilled.
>Isn’t it possible that the EVAs were destroyed in all realities?
Yes, sure, but my point is simply that people who don't like the rebuilds are free to disregard them, in the same way that hardcore original Star Trek fans can conveniently dismiss the JJ universe because in-universe it is recognized as a parallel timeline. Nothing from the new timeline actually is obligatory *to fans* even if the events of the new timeline seem to impact the original timeline are obligatory for characters in-universe.
Yeah but in EoE wouldn’t he end up in instrumentality or inside Eva 1 with Yui anyways? All human souls go back to instrumentality or “after life,” either way
But wouldn't the soul go to the same place though? Cos it could pull back those who were dead too right?
I have so far confused instrumentality as a jumpstart heaven.
No, Gendo was specifically not allowed to enter instrumentality even after death. The bodies of the Nerv employees who were killed during the ambush on Nerv HQ all turned into LCL, but Gendo was chomped by Eva-01 and didn't turn into LCL.
Shinji had a tough time interacting with Yui while absorbed in EVA-01 at 400% synch ratio. I’m not sure Gendo would be able to “find her” if she was disinterested after knowing what he did to Shinji. I think it’s Yui’s call, but I have a feeling she is forever disappointed in the guy.
EDIT: I always see Gendo as the tragic, “my goal is within arms reach, but I *still* can’t have it!”
Lol no, Jesus Christ, grow up zoomers. People can compare similar things, and arrive at the conclusion that they like certain aspects of one more than the other. Don't even try to compare it to racism/sexism/nationalism etc.
There’s a difference between disliking something and giving fair criticism and hating something deeply and everyone who likes it. Remember the console wars?
I don’t compare it as in it’s the same as racism. I’m saying the routes and response is the same. Your the one who needs to grow up.
It's a continuation that undermines the original, by letting the protagonist get a deus ex machina to "rewrite the world" to solve his problems. Whereas the original made the argument that life could be worth living even if your circumstances were brutal, this one simply says "use magic to make your problems go away".
On the level of plot analysis, true, the entire ending depicts a magical solution, but if. you take it less literally, there is a psychological truth being expressed that is every bit as worthwhile as to the EoE ending, and that is a necessary counterpart -- and that is that we can choose to lay down our grief, we can choose to move forward into a life of thriving.
Striving is not meant to be man's permanent state of affairs. We are meant to thrive. Or at the very least, we are capable of it - but ONLY if we conceive of it as a possibility, first.
What you described sounds like a really valuable truth to express in a movie. But I don't see how this movie is expressing that point of view. Is there something I'm missing here?
I don't see how someone who's wish is "use magic to rewrite reality" is laying down their grief. That seems like the kind of wish a person would make who is still holding on to their grief and hasn't yet moved on and processed it. That person might be able to thrive for some time in the new world they've created, but I imagine they'd lack the maturity to continue to thrive once inevitable suffering happens in that new world.
I can't go into detail about this at the moment, but here are my quick thoughts:
To answer your first question, yes, I think this is a major theme.
It felt completely explicit to me. It is, for example, explicitly brought up (though in a subtle, well-written way), in all those lessons that Rei learns.
I.E. "it's something we do hoping we can get along."
These are all expressions of a state of affairs I'd call thriving. And that entire village sequence seems to point thematically to the prospect of living a good life, despite the challenges that life presents and the doom which seems to be inevitable.
I thought the sound design was incredible on the rebuilds and expanding Kaworu as a character more really helped me understand him. I do think NGE and EoE definitely has more raw emotions and artistic qualities pushing it forward. Incredibly happy for both iterations to exist at the same time.
Both yes and no. While the animation of Rebuild is more consistent in quality and art style the cgi fight scenes of 3.0+1.0 look weightless and inconsequential compared to the hand drawn cel animated glory of Asuka vs the Eva series.
I feel this critique is in bad faith. Paris scene is deliberately off-the-ground--I think a puppet eva is unique and new. The ship battles are airborne. The freefalling machine gun sequence is also sick. None of these fights make sense to be compared to Asuka v MPE.
We could all see I'd be critiquing EOE in bad faith if I said "the dated techniques, copy-paste Eva's, and recycled setting of Asuka VS MPE makes it clearly inferior to the variety, fidelity, and bombast of Thrice's high flying action spectacle." Like. Do you see what I mean?
I am genuinely confused at what you are trying to argue here. From reading your comment it seems you have a preference towards the larger scale and more flashy fight sequences of 3.0+1.0. I have my own preferences for more grounded and brutal fights which favors EOE. If you had argued about dated animation techniques and redundant setting I would take them at face value and try to see from that point of view. No, I don’t see what you mean.
>I have my own preferences for more grounded and brutal fights which favors EOE.
The Rebuilds are pretty consistently shown to be just as brutal if not more brutal than NGE/EOE. I mean you can just compare the [Bardiel fight](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YgiESzLrCHc) in [both series](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nwFxyMxUqPE). Catching Sahaquiel is similarly more violent in the Rebuilds as well, same with Zeruel.
As far as grounded goes, Eva's always had its super robot tendencies. I mean, the Evas are constantly getting nuked without issue in NGE, Unit 00 throws the lance with enough force to move hundreds of miles worth of clouds, the AT field as a whole is not grounded at all, and they're capable of running at supersonic speeds, episode 8 even ends [with a Super Inazuma Kick](https://youtu.be/Gv7cW_ijtQQ?t=13).
The Rebuilds take it further, but it's not like the NGE Evas' abilities were particularly grounded outside of EOE in the first place.
I am talking about End Of Evangelion and 3.0+1.0 specifically.
By "grounded" I do not necessarily mean realism but practicality, I am referring towards smaller scale fights that have less visual flair. Not to mention the EOE fight is literally much closer to the physical ground than the ones in 3.0+1.0.
I don’t agree. Doing CGI does not take less skill to do. It’s very hard to do good CGI, people just take it for granted because Disney/Pixar and Dreamworks are pretty much the only people to get it right and they’re constantly putting out high quality stuff.
The fact so many anime studios fail to do good CGI when there are examples of how CGI can be done well just shows how difficult it really is.
It’s not simple to make a Pixar tier animation. They’ve been doing it for over 2 decades and are now very skilled at it. If anime studios keep practicing they’ll eventually get better too.
Pretty much anything Masaaki Yuasa had a hand in (Devilman Crybaby, Eizouken, etc.). It’s still clearly digitally colored - cels are pretty much dead as a medium for anime - but my guy goes apeshit with the hand-drawn animation.
Well it's not that anime no longer have hand drawn animation it's usually just a blend of cgi and hand drawn. Every big series is like this. It's not out of laziness but out of difficulty and time. AOT by with studios was actually really popular for its implementation of cgi with hand drawn scenes. If everything was hand drawn we wouldn't get seasons of anime for 4+ years die to how much work would be needed
EoE has way better animation that the rebuilds.
Try to name one scene that looked janky in EoE then compare it with the plethora of weird looking CGI in the rebuilds.
rebuild is too happy. EoE seems more realistic in the way it ends on a good note but also "not everything is or will ever be how you want it, you gotta accept life and try to be happy the way you are. You won't always get a hot gf and all of your friends around and happy all the time"
I don’t care what anyone says, 3.0 + 1.0 is such a phenomenal movie and it speaks to the audience outside of the realms of the movie. Be the best you that you can be. Don’t be a sad boi shinji. Nothing good comes from it. The first rebuild movie is dog shit though.
Rebuild 1: first few episodes summarized and reanimated
Rebuild 2: more episodes summarized and reanimated
Rebuild 3: Starts off as more summarized & reanimated episodes but the world goes to shit in a different way than in EoE
Rebuild 4: Hyperboric fever dream with fucking floating WW2 ships and HQs, where the communists take over and everyrhing is red except for a little village with funny capitalist pillars and has a """"happy"""" ending, still pretty good tho
Kaworu, Rei (specifically 4.0), and Gendos character arc/Resolve. You could say Shinji too ig but Manga Shinji is just a better Rebuild Shinji. Those are the only things I’d say are better, and regarding animation I’d say that part is subjective so it’s just up to taste.
Hnnnng I love rebuild Kaworu, because he’s not downright emotionally manipulative towards Shinji, he actually cares about him and bonds with him over a long period of time.
I mean, not really?
The impermanence of the rei clone and her experiences taught Shinji that life is fleeting and short and temporary, and that there’s no point in dwelling on the misery filled parts of life, and to instead appreciate the simple pleasures of life. After all, life is meaningless without struggle, and with struggle comes a better appreciation of life. I don’t get what you mean by “out of nowhere”; it felt very logical to me.
I honestly liked that decision to make his arc happen off-screen, as we already saw how it resolves with Neon Genesis. Woulda been wasting time to do that. Plus seeing the Miss Look-a-like have an arc was great
I can’t agree. The rebuilds want to be it’s own thing but the same thing at the same time.
It’s never good to have your character development offscreen, especially since this is a different Shinji. All we see this time around is Shinji sad, Rei Q dies, Shinji now epic.
I would say it's subtle, not "off screen."
Shinji spends what feels like a month or even a season mulling over losing Kaworu. Kensuke deliberately is hands off. Rei has her moment, where she says everyone likes him. That's step one. Working with Kensuke is step two. He understands the stakes a little better. Meeting Kaji Junior and hearing about Misato. Step three. His fishing is one sign of his growth. He's more confident when he decides he can't find a name for Rei Q. When Shinji arrives at the Wunder, he's red around the eyes. One can infer that all this time did change him, he knew he couldn't sit around, he was better prepared for the grief.
Time, and Rei saying everyone liked him, allowed him to open up and be honest about his feelings. That's the Asuka scene.
I don't think "missing" his development counts as not having any. And I don't think "subtle" is bad. Evangelion, I feel, was never about spoonfeeding.
I will say, those village scenes in the latest movie had top notch worldbuilding, character development, and were absolutely gorgeous. It was like a breath of fresh air
One of the most appealing aspects of NGE and EoE for me was the art and the pacing. Like the moments of sheer silence or nothing but cicadas made it that much darker... they just set a certain mood so well. The rebuilds, being newer, are of course more flashy and they're just faster-paced and so they have a totally different tone which is fine but it misses what I loved so much about the original series.
This, I'm amazed at how many people on here are saying they disliked EoE, and praise this as the more satisfying conclusion... EoE was the pinnacle of Eva. The rebuilds appeal far more to the average zoomer shonen fan.
Yeah, it's hilarious. "Y-you see, the CGI fight between two Evas looks like dogshit because it's supposed to be a kaiju joke... because... I mean... like, it's super smart actually!"
Nope. My guess is that they wanted to make it as fast and cheap as possible, so they resorted to using motion capture instead of hand animation for that fight. And because mo-cap + CGI is the worst thing imaginable in an anime, they then resorted to turning how terrible it looks into the butt of a joke.
And it still manages to look terrible. The joke falls flat. Buildings don't get thrown around like empty boxes in kaiju movies, they get destroyed in a blaze of sparks. Also, the actors usually try to give the monster some weight instead of brawling like two regular humans. 3.0+1.0's fight scene looks more like two drunk guys smacking each other in a room full of empty boxes.
Joke or not, it looks laughably terrible.
It made sense how bad it looked to me. Especially after it was revealed to be a stage.
When Gendo explained how the fight they were having can’t be won with physical might it clicked why it looked so blatantly off, especially when we were going back and forth between that and the fight occurring outside of their mindscape leading up to Misato’s sacrifice.
Yeah. Normally, when a movie makes you laugh by exaggerating tropes of the genre, people call them parodies. But since this is Evangelion, people call it "brilliant meta-criticism of the anime industry."
I think my favorites were Ritsuko shooting gendo followed by brain ooze getting put back in his cyclops brain, and CGI floating head Rei. Both had no context or reasonable build-up in the rebuilds, but were like these goofy parodies of scenes that made sense in the originals.
I re watched the original and the rebuild series recently and you know I think I like the original a lot more. It feels like the rebuild just wastes so much time.
NGE was made by a desperate young Anno. Rebuild was built by an older Anno who wanted a Shinji that could save everyone, and not just himself. Its not that NGE was selfish, Shinji was in a terrible state. Its his situation that changed, I think.
Anno made one unpopular movie and automatically rebuilds suck. as someone who personally saw EoE when it released in the states and it's my favorite piece of Eva media, 3.0+1.0 absolutely made rebuilds worth the watch and is just as good. If Anno makes it, it's how it was intended. He put his heart and soul into rebuilds just as much as he did with NGE/EoE. To dismiss his works all together is not only foolish but disrespectful. I actually didn't mind 3.0 much unlike most, but for me, if it's Eva and it's Anno, then I know he made it a certain way for a certain reason. In short, people gotta stop bashing rebuilds just because it wasn't made in the 90's and actually appreciate the new directions it took the franchise. Plus you can NOT tell me the rebuild soundtracks (especially for 2.0 and 3.0) don't go absolutely hard.
Shiro Sagisu is an absolute genius who has consistently delivered. He was a massive part of what made NGE and EoE especially, so incredible. I had no doubt he would produce stellar tracks for these movies as well.
Also, disliking or having issues with the final product (3.0+1.0) is not disrespectful or dismissing of Anno... People are allowed to make criticisms...
I just finished the rebuilds like 40min ago and although i mostly agree, I really think you can't truly compare them. Both are beautiful in their own ways, both are satisfying in their own ways.
Animation, pacing, fight choreography, ramiel, Shinii and Rei’s relationship in 2.22, overall I liked the mix of lighter and darker tones opposed to NGE’s dark tone, and I like the rebuilds just as much as I like the original series and I see them as equals
Rebuild has 100% more eyepatches tho?
IIRC, Asuka has one on the beach in EoE, and Rei has one at some point in both NGE and NTE.
Ok, so 75% more eyepatch, but 110% more pirate.
Might wanna check those percentages with Melchior
Ah, the Magi System. The only supercomputer that can be made into delicious pate'.
NTE?
Neon [1st] Thessalonians Evangelion
This joke has no business being this funny
New Theatrical Edition; the rebuild movies
I really don’t remember watching NGE/EoE and thinking you know what this needs? Eyepatches.
Seeing Rei the first time being wheeled out to operate Unit 01 gave me an eyepatch fetish, no joke.
Based
better ass shots that are integral to the story
"I assure you, making Asuka's plugsuit transparent is essential to the new story."
This almost has the same energy as explaining the importance of the hospital scene on EOE.
Nope, the Hospital scene can be explained, Shinji needed absolute rock bottom to bound from. Is it Pretty? No. But it does work. What was the narrative importance of the test plug suit?
Considering how Asuka was exposing her body to the camera and her mind to Misato at the same time, I say that that's sufficient narrative importance.
Ill allow it, but piss poor choice that was certainly aimed at that subgroup of fandom that keeps masturbating to Asuka long after it has ceased to be a natural part of exploring a healthy teenage sexual drive and moved straight to the creepzone.
this was a horrible attempt at convincing me to stop fapping to Asuka
I didn’t check the source of what i’m saying but i saw somewhere that the Hospital scene was here bc Hideaki Anno wanted to trigger the fan that harassed him bc of the anime ending
Well fuck that asshole in particular.
Integral huh..
I really really loved the part in 3.0+1.0 where they lived in the village. That move all together was pretty amazing. But still NGE is still better overall for sure.
For me, the village was my favorite part. Had they simply returned to the village at the end of the movie instead of "rewriting the world", I'd probably ultimately have felt ok about the rebuilds. Instead, I think they're pretty terrible.
I thought that the village was in a very precarious position and was gradually failing. Returning there at the end would've been only a stay on extinction, and the beauty/peace only a temporary respite. They had already lost at this point, and rewriting the world was necessary and inevitable. Edit- imo
Since world-building wasn't extremely tight in the rebuilds, the writers could ultimately decide the post-ending state of the village. And they had plenty to work with for returning to the village and revitalizing the world. 1. Opening scene shows that "decorification" can happen very quickly in-universe. When they're in Paris they're able to restore the city using some technomagic almost instantaneously. That'd suggest that Wille would be able to heal the world pretty quickly once Nerv was defeated. 2. Kaji had preserved all that animal life on the ark. It seems odd that we dedicated time to that plot point only to have it not matter in a "re-written world. 3. Life in the village looked pretty nice. Sure, they had to deal with rations and other issues. But it hardly looked post-apocalyptic compared to other post-apocalyptic works of fiction. 4. Shinji had access to godlike magic powers. He probably could've just de-corified the world and returned all the people. For some reason, the writers didn't want this to happen and instead chose to "re-write the world" without ever providing any clarity on what that means.
Oh, I thought “re-writing the world” was exactly this, removing the effects of evangelions. Shinji says he didn’t want to go back in time or create a vastly different alternate world. The only people we see afterwards were Eva pilots, which are weird cases, but I think the rest of the world was just decorified. It seems to me that you just described what actually happened.
Yeah. the train station seemed to be in a totally normal world where Eva didn't happen. The looking at the other pilots and not responding seemed to point to a memory wipe for Shinji regarding everyone but Mari. To your point, there's a theory that that last scene is the anti-verse and they're running out to return to their world. To me that'd make more sense thematically, but the fact that the last cut is of "Our world" and not of the "Eva world" seems to create a pretty strong feeling that that's not the case. For some reason, they chose not to show them literally returning to the Eva world. Whether that's just a symbolic choice or because of the fact that he re-wrote the past completely is unclear. But it feels really strongly like he did re-write the past. And that seems to be the more widely held view as far as I can tell. I'd like to be wrong though.
The Rebuilds ended the moment Shinji saved everyone during Instrumentality. Everything else was just a bonus, so I don't think it in any way warrants hating the Rebuilds over the last few scenes. If the "removing all Evangelions" part came right after Misato sending off the last spear to Shinji and then it cut to credits, I would be furious and 100% would agree with you. However, with all the tiny details, goosebump - inducing scenes of this sequence and how well it ties in with the parallel META - narrative (interestingly, both "Goodbye, All Evangelions" and "Goodbye, All of Evangelion" have been used as official advertising slogans for the movie), I personally love the last sequence...
NGE has better Slice of life bits
The virgin rebuild vs NGE VS The chad rebuild + NGE
>453ReplyGive AwardShareReportSaveFollow I gots to play the organ cause you be preaching
THIS
Indeed. I see them as a whole
based take
I like this
give this more likes than og post
Is this a joke I don’t understand or is there some weird variant of rebuild that I haven’t seen!?!?
Exactly - they’re all part of the same series. They’re not “remakes”.
You can like both
⠀⠀⠘⡀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⡜⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠑⡀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⡔⠁⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀⠈⠢⢄⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⣀⠴⠊⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⢸⠀⠀⠀⢀⣀⣀⣀⣀⣀⡀⠤⠄⠒⠈⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠘⣀⠄⠊⠁⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀ ⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⡿⠿⠛⠛⠛⠋⠉⠈⠉⠉⠉⠉⠛⠻⢿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿ ⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⡿⠋⠁⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠉⠛⢿⣿⣿⣿⣿ ⣿⣿⣿⣿⡏⣀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⣀⣤⣤⣤⣄⡀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠙⢿⣿⣿ ⣿⣿⣿⢏⣴⣿⣷⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⢾⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⡆⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠈⣿⣿ ⣿⣿⣟⣾⣿⡟⠁⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⢀⣾⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣷⢢⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⢸⣿ ⣿⣿⣿⣿⣟⠀⡴⠄⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠙⠻⣿⣿⣿⣿⣷⣄⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⣿ ⣿⣿⣿⠟⠻⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠶⢴⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣧⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⣿ ⣿⣁⡀⠀⠀⢰⢠⣦⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⢀⣼⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⡄⠀⣴⣶⣿⡄⣿ ⣿⡋⠀⠀⠀⠎⢸⣿⡆⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⣴⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⠗⢘⣿⣟⠛⠿⣼ ⣿⣿⠋⢀⡌⢰⣿⡿⢿⡀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠙⠿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⡇⠀⢸⣿⣿⣧⢀⣼ ⣿⣿⣷⢻⠄⠘⠛⠋⠛⠃⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⢿⣧⠈⠉⠙⠛⠋⠀⠀⠀⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿ ⣿⣿⣧⠀⠈⢸⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠟⠀⠀⠀⠀⢀⢃⠀⠀⢸⣿⣿⣿⣿ ⣿⣿⡿⠀⠴⢗⣠⣤⣴⡶⠶⠖⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⣀⡸⠀⣿⣿⣿⣿ ⣿⣿⣿⡀⢠⣾⣿⠏⠀⠠⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠛⠉⠀⣿⣿⣿⣿ ⣿⣿⣿⣧⠈⢹⡇⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⣰⣿⣿⣿⣿ ⣿⣿⣿⣿⡄⠈⠃⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⢀⣠⣴⣾⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿ ⣿⣿⣿⣿⣧⡀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⢀⣠⣾⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿ ⣿⣿⣿⣿⣷⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⢀⣴⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿ ⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣦⣄⣀⣀⣀⣀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠘⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿ ⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣷⡄⠀⠀⠀⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿ ⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣧⠀⠀⠀⠙⣿⣿⡟⢻⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿ ⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⠇⠀⠁⠀⠀⠹⣿⠃⠀⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿ ⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⡿⠛⣿⣿⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⢐⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿ ⣿⣿⣿⣿⠿⠛⠉⠉⠁⠀⢻⣿⡇⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⢀⠈⣿⣿⡿⠉⠛⠛⠛⠉⠉ ⣿⡿⠋⠁⠀⠀⢀⣀⣠⡴⣸⣿⣇⡄⠀⠀⠀⠀⢀⡿⠄⠙⠛⠀⣀⣠⣤⣤⠄⠀
Mari is in them and Gendoh gets a better resolved arc imo
For me, Ayanami is more likeable also
I get so sad every time the final angel attacks and interrupts Rei's dinner to bring Shinji and his dad closer together 😔 the rebuilds really focused on making Rei more human and seeing her try so hard to them together all for it to be for nothing just breaks my heart a little
Sometimes a lot of work is put into something wonderful for naught. Didn’t make it worthwhile to try. EVA is *real* like that, ya know?
Exactly
This. I really think NGE is better overall but Rei is a much better character in the Rebuilds.
[удалено]
Unpopular opinion: 3.0 + 1.0s ending hurt more. Hear me out. End of Evangelion sent me through a roller-coaster of emotions. I left that movie extremely satisfied. I only understood a good half of it, but that doesn't matter with Evangelion if we're being honest - what matters is how it makes you feel about yourself. EoE made me feel very hopeful and while the movie itself had tons of highly depressing themes and motifs, the ending was a light of hope. I liked 3.0 + 1.0; not nearly as much as EoE but it was still a very good movie. However, this one left me feeling kinda sad - not because the journey is over but because of *how* it ended. I'm not a fan of "everybody forgets who their friends from another life are and then leads a happy life without them" endings. Mari made this feel a lot worse for me because of how shoehorned she was and how big of a role she played in the end (and I'm still wondering who she even is; ik about the theories and all but I can't see why she's been put into these movies). It *looked* like they're living a happy life in the end of 3.0 + 1.0 but seemed a bit shallow compared to EoE where you won't see how everyone turns out to be after Shinji rejects instrumentality. EoE just seems more "realistic": Everyone lived through a crisis and (at least the ones who want to) survived and can live a life outside of the LCL soup. Life goes on. The world is bombed but people can still build a society (like the villages in 3.0 + 1.0), whereas the last movie just seemed like a generic happy ending with some basic characters. As I said, I liked 3.0 + 1.0, especially because of things like Gendo's redemption arc etc. (it was good imo, but his original story was just as good. You don't need good characters only) but people who say EoE was depressing seem to not get the message of it. Most of what I've said though is up to debate and personal opinion. The fact that I don't like these type of endings is just my taste and doesn't mean that they're objectively bad
Hey i don’t have very much to add but just read this and wanted to thank you for your comment. It put into words some thoughts and feelings i’ve been having about 3.0+1.0. I didn’t hate it, but it felt hollow and left me sadder than the original movie left me, and i think you may have expressed a part of the reason. Thank you!
I've never watched the rebuild, but I just hate "The magic goes away" endings.
She has nipples.
*I* have nipples, Greg. Could you milk *me?*
> imo Gendo gets a better arc. I do prefer NGE/EoE, but Gendo’s arc was worth it. And Kaji gets even more accomplished.
You could argue that Mari is an unnecessary character though.
Wouldn't have to argue very hard either.
Oh for sure, but considering the way the story changed in 3.33 & 3.0 + 1.0, her being around added some legitimacy to Wünder as a whole with both her and Asuka piloting alongside them, as the other 3 pilots were all on NERV's side technically. I definitely think the original series and ending is better overall and fits what the series was getting at, but the rebuild was a more fun action-oriented thrill ride that brought a lot of newcomers into the fold, such as myself.
Gendo doesn't really get any new development in the first 2 movies. He's fairly absent from the last two outside of being a caricature evil villain. Then we get to instrumentality. We learn nothing particularly new that wasn't in the original series' flashbacks. But we do get a "Sorry, I was mean and ignored you your whole life. I swear I was just doing it because I thought it was best for you." Which to me, doesn't even sound like an apology. It kind of sounds like continuing to avoid responsibility. Then he gets to embrace Yui after literally trying to destroy all of humanity to do so. Seems kinda fucked up that he gets rewarded withe his megalomaniacal goal after a simple half-baked apology like that.
I saw this as brief - Shinji destroys all the EVAs, so what happens to their souls after Unit 01 and 13 are unmade is a mystery to us. If there is a hell in EVA, I’m not sure that version of Gendo avoided it.
>Then he gets to embrace Yui after literally trying to destroy all of humanity to do so. You mean saving, right? Without him humanity just gets fucked by angels, the end.
#JetAloneDidNothingWrong
Jet Alone couldn't mess with AT fields, though. It wouldn't have really amounted to anything more than regular tanks and aircraft did.
Didn’t artificial At-Fields exist or something? Idk if my memory is bad or it’s the funny sugar kicking in.
Gendoh gets a perfect resolution in End of Evangelion, in 3.0 + 1.0 I felt they jumped the shark with his character
[удалено]
First of all - nothing is ruined, as this timeline exists as a separate reality from the original timeline. Second - Gendo's arc in the Rebuilds is really an extension of Shinji's arc. Meaning, Anno wrote it so that SHINJI could go somewhere he hadn't gone before. Rebuilds consistently deliver a Shinji who is willing to go all the way, face all his fears (not without struggles, of course). It was the fact that he did the ultimate thing - confronting the generational trauma he inherited from his father - that makes the Rebuilds a worthy addition to the franchise, IMO.
Should mention that Gendo’s and Yui’s souls’ whereabouts are a mystery to us. Unit-01 and 13 have been unmade and without vessels for soul storage, it’s to the afterlife! If we’re discussing Mari’s old classmates beyond narrative purpose, the difference between Yui’s purity and Gendo’s corruption matters. > this timeline exists as a separate reality Isn’t it possible that the EVAs were destroyed in *all* realities?
>Should mention that Gendo’s and Yui’s souls’ whereabouts are a mystery to us. Unit-01 and 13 have been unmade and without vessels for soul storage, it’s to the afterlife! Yes true - I think this contributes to the sense of closure. Best ending either of them has had; their karma and narrative utility is now completely fulfilled. >Isn’t it possible that the EVAs were destroyed in all realities? Yes, sure, but my point is simply that people who don't like the rebuilds are free to disregard them, in the same way that hardcore original Star Trek fans can conveniently dismiss the JJ universe because in-universe it is recognized as a parallel timeline. Nothing from the new timeline actually is obligatory *to fans* even if the events of the new timeline seem to impact the original timeline are obligatory for characters in-universe.
> their karma and narrative utility is now completely fulfilled. Agreed. Well said.
To each their own. I much preferred him getting a relatable and sympathetic send off.
After treating Shinji like that, why?
Healing is healing.
Well, there's the fact that he's personally responsible for the salvation of humanity, for starters.
Yeah but in EoE wouldn’t he end up in instrumentality or inside Eva 1 with Yui anyways? All human souls go back to instrumentality or “after life,” either way
No. He literally died. With blood, not LCL.
But wouldn't the soul go to the same place though? Cos it could pull back those who were dead too right? I have so far confused instrumentality as a jumpstart heaven.
No, Gendo was specifically not allowed to enter instrumentality even after death. The bodies of the Nerv employees who were killed during the ambush on Nerv HQ all turned into LCL, but Gendo was chomped by Eva-01 and didn't turn into LCL.
Ok. Would he then still reunited with Yui in Eva’s core? Since it seems anything the Evas consume end up in their core?
Shinji had a tough time interacting with Yui while absorbed in EVA-01 at 400% synch ratio. I’m not sure Gendo would be able to “find her” if she was disinterested after knowing what he did to Shinji. I think it’s Yui’s call, but I have a feeling she is forever disappointed in the guy. EDIT: I always see Gendo as the tragic, “my goal is within arms reach, but I *still* can’t have it!”
No, since rei, who is literally the embodiment if instrumentality, told he he wouldnt join them
Yeah I always assumed he did, he just went very painfully
With the type of crazy he was, I don't think he cared about physically dying because death is not an end...but it was fitting for sure.
Obligatory "you opinion comment" has been typed.
The train station hug scene made me pretty happy, tbh.
I don't understand why people act like it's a competition. The rebuilds are a continuation, not a replacement
exactly, why can’t we just love all of them?
[удалено]
I'm sure this would not happen if you'd merge all of mankind's consciousness into one collective mind. Edit: conscious -> consciousness
*”I know, I know I’ve let you down…🎵”*
"I've been a fool to myself..."
I thought that I could live for no one else
but now, through all the hurt and pain, it's time for me to respect, the ones you love mean more than anything
So with sadness in my heart, I feel the best thing I could do, is end it all and leave forever
what's done is done, it feels so bad what once was happy now is sad I'll never love again my world is ending
Even with all those problems that’s what makes us human. Were not supposed to be perfect
Lol no, Jesus Christ, grow up zoomers. People can compare similar things, and arrive at the conclusion that they like certain aspects of one more than the other. Don't even try to compare it to racism/sexism/nationalism etc.
There’s a difference between disliking something and giving fair criticism and hating something deeply and everyone who likes it. Remember the console wars? I don’t compare it as in it’s the same as racism. I’m saying the routes and response is the same. Your the one who needs to grow up.
Continuations are supposed to be as good as the og material though, not incredibly lazy and inferior
It's a continuation that undermines the original, by letting the protagonist get a deus ex machina to "rewrite the world" to solve his problems. Whereas the original made the argument that life could be worth living even if your circumstances were brutal, this one simply says "use magic to make your problems go away".
On the level of plot analysis, true, the entire ending depicts a magical solution, but if. you take it less literally, there is a psychological truth being expressed that is every bit as worthwhile as to the EoE ending, and that is a necessary counterpart -- and that is that we can choose to lay down our grief, we can choose to move forward into a life of thriving. Striving is not meant to be man's permanent state of affairs. We are meant to thrive. Or at the very least, we are capable of it - but ONLY if we conceive of it as a possibility, first.
What you described sounds like a really valuable truth to express in a movie. But I don't see how this movie is expressing that point of view. Is there something I'm missing here? I don't see how someone who's wish is "use magic to rewrite reality" is laying down their grief. That seems like the kind of wish a person would make who is still holding on to their grief and hasn't yet moved on and processed it. That person might be able to thrive for some time in the new world they've created, but I imagine they'd lack the maturity to continue to thrive once inevitable suffering happens in that new world.
I can't go into detail about this at the moment, but here are my quick thoughts: To answer your first question, yes, I think this is a major theme. It felt completely explicit to me. It is, for example, explicitly brought up (though in a subtle, well-written way), in all those lessons that Rei learns. I.E. "it's something we do hoping we can get along." These are all expressions of a state of affairs I'd call thriving. And that entire village sequence seems to point thematically to the prospect of living a good life, despite the challenges that life presents and the doom which seems to be inevitable.
Ramiel was done better in the rebuild of evangelion, but that's about it. The whole franchise is great though and work well together.
I can't tell you how many times I've busted a nut to rebuild Ramiel
Aaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhhh
What
Did he stutter?
Ramiel is overrated,i nutted to Zeruel
I thought the sound design was incredible on the rebuilds and expanding Kaworu as a character more really helped me understand him. I do think NGE and EoE definitely has more raw emotions and artistic qualities pushing it forward. Incredibly happy for both iterations to exist at the same time.
How about just enjoying both
Hot take: 3+1 felt like a parody of EoE
*Porn parody
I liked rebuild but the original was definitely better.
animation, though the NGE/EOE are still better overall
Both yes and no. While the animation of Rebuild is more consistent in quality and art style the cgi fight scenes of 3.0+1.0 look weightless and inconsequential compared to the hand drawn cel animated glory of Asuka vs the Eva series.
I feel this critique is in bad faith. Paris scene is deliberately off-the-ground--I think a puppet eva is unique and new. The ship battles are airborne. The freefalling machine gun sequence is also sick. None of these fights make sense to be compared to Asuka v MPE. We could all see I'd be critiquing EOE in bad faith if I said "the dated techniques, copy-paste Eva's, and recycled setting of Asuka VS MPE makes it clearly inferior to the variety, fidelity, and bombast of Thrice's high flying action spectacle." Like. Do you see what I mean?
I am genuinely confused at what you are trying to argue here. From reading your comment it seems you have a preference towards the larger scale and more flashy fight sequences of 3.0+1.0. I have my own preferences for more grounded and brutal fights which favors EOE. If you had argued about dated animation techniques and redundant setting I would take them at face value and try to see from that point of view. No, I don’t see what you mean.
>I have my own preferences for more grounded and brutal fights which favors EOE. The Rebuilds are pretty consistently shown to be just as brutal if not more brutal than NGE/EOE. I mean you can just compare the [Bardiel fight](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YgiESzLrCHc) in [both series](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nwFxyMxUqPE). Catching Sahaquiel is similarly more violent in the Rebuilds as well, same with Zeruel. As far as grounded goes, Eva's always had its super robot tendencies. I mean, the Evas are constantly getting nuked without issue in NGE, Unit 00 throws the lance with enough force to move hundreds of miles worth of clouds, the AT field as a whole is not grounded at all, and they're capable of running at supersonic speeds, episode 8 even ends [with a Super Inazuma Kick](https://youtu.be/Gv7cW_ijtQQ?t=13). The Rebuilds take it further, but it's not like the NGE Evas' abilities were particularly grounded outside of EOE in the first place.
I am talking about End Of Evangelion and 3.0+1.0 specifically. By "grounded" I do not necessarily mean realism but practicality, I am referring towards smaller scale fights that have less visual flair. Not to mention the EOE fight is literally much closer to the physical ground than the ones in 3.0+1.0.
Hand drawn is aesthetically better than cgi but full cgi is cheap and requires less skill. That said, the era of hand drawn is over.
I don’t agree. Doing CGI does not take less skill to do. It’s very hard to do good CGI, people just take it for granted because Disney/Pixar and Dreamworks are pretty much the only people to get it right and they’re constantly putting out high quality stuff. The fact so many anime studios fail to do good CGI when there are examples of how CGI can be done well just shows how difficult it really is. It’s not simple to make a Pixar tier animation. They’ve been doing it for over 2 decades and are now very skilled at it. If anime studios keep practicing they’ll eventually get better too.
unless they want to make quality work
Can you point me in the direction of some modern hand drawn anime please? I'm not being snarky, I just really miss hand drawn anime.
Pretty much anything Masaaki Yuasa had a hand in (Devilman Crybaby, Eizouken, etc.). It’s still clearly digitally colored - cels are pretty much dead as a medium for anime - but my guy goes apeshit with the hand-drawn animation.
Devilman crybaby had an interesting running animation
Well it's not that anime no longer have hand drawn animation it's usually just a blend of cgi and hand drawn. Every big series is like this. It's not out of laziness but out of difficulty and time. AOT by with studios was actually really popular for its implementation of cgi with hand drawn scenes. If everything was hand drawn we wouldn't get seasons of anime for 4+ years die to how much work would be needed
I understand, you are not the only one who misses the hand made animation
the original series has better animation
The hand drawn shit is timeless meanwhile I cant tell what the fuck is going on in the rebuilds when 16 million cgi objects fly across the screen.
EoE has way better animation that the rebuilds. Try to name one scene that looked janky in EoE then compare it with the plethora of weird looking CGI in the rebuilds.
Animation over substance is basically just swinging some car keys around in the audience’s faces.
rebuild is too happy. EoE seems more realistic in the way it ends on a good note but also "not everything is or will ever be how you want it, you gotta accept life and try to be happy the way you are. You won't always get a hot gf and all of your friends around and happy all the time"
I don’t care what anyone says, 3.0 + 1.0 is such a phenomenal movie and it speaks to the audience outside of the realms of the movie. Be the best you that you can be. Don’t be a sad boi shinji. Nothing good comes from it. The first rebuild movie is dog shit though.
Rebuild 3 & 4 > rebuild 1 & 2, no cap
2 and 4 were the best films
2 was the best rebuild film, 3 was awful, 4 was a mixed bag and the 1st one was average and done better in the original series.
[удалено]
The beginning sequence was the best part of that movie
Rebuild 1: first few episodes summarized and reanimated Rebuild 2: more episodes summarized and reanimated Rebuild 3: Starts off as more summarized & reanimated episodes but the world goes to shit in a different way than in EoE Rebuild 4: Hyperboric fever dream with fucking floating WW2 ships and HQs, where the communists take over and everyrhing is red except for a little village with funny capitalist pillars and has a """"happy"""" ending, still pretty good tho
Kaworu, Rei (specifically 4.0), and Gendos character arc/Resolve. You could say Shinji too ig but Manga Shinji is just a better Rebuild Shinji. Those are the only things I’d say are better, and regarding animation I’d say that part is subjective so it’s just up to taste.
Hnnnng I love rebuild Kaworu, because he’s not downright emotionally manipulative towards Shinji, he actually cares about him and bonds with him over a long period of time.
you really think Shinji is a better character in the rebuilds? where he basically lost 2/3 of his complexity
Shinji is not better in the rebuilds. Especially in 3+1 where he just decides to be the hero out of nowhere.
I agree, NGE/EoE Shinji is definitely the best Shinji (wasn’t trying to say he wasn’t)
I mean, not really? The impermanence of the rei clone and her experiences taught Shinji that life is fleeting and short and temporary, and that there’s no point in dwelling on the misery filled parts of life, and to instead appreciate the simple pleasures of life. After all, life is meaningless without struggle, and with struggle comes a better appreciation of life. I don’t get what you mean by “out of nowhere”; it felt very logical to me.
I honestly liked that decision to make his arc happen off-screen, as we already saw how it resolves with Neon Genesis. Woulda been wasting time to do that. Plus seeing the Miss Look-a-like have an arc was great
I can’t agree. The rebuilds want to be it’s own thing but the same thing at the same time. It’s never good to have your character development offscreen, especially since this is a different Shinji. All we see this time around is Shinji sad, Rei Q dies, Shinji now epic.
I would say it's subtle, not "off screen." Shinji spends what feels like a month or even a season mulling over losing Kaworu. Kensuke deliberately is hands off. Rei has her moment, where she says everyone likes him. That's step one. Working with Kensuke is step two. He understands the stakes a little better. Meeting Kaji Junior and hearing about Misato. Step three. His fishing is one sign of his growth. He's more confident when he decides he can't find a name for Rei Q. When Shinji arrives at the Wunder, he's red around the eyes. One can infer that all this time did change him, he knew he couldn't sit around, he was better prepared for the grief. Time, and Rei saying everyone liked him, allowed him to open up and be honest about his feelings. That's the Asuka scene. I don't think "missing" his development counts as not having any. And I don't think "subtle" is bad. Evangelion, I feel, was never about spoonfeeding.
I will say, those village scenes in the latest movie had top notch worldbuilding, character development, and were absolutely gorgeous. It was like a breath of fresh air
People on /r/EvangelionMemes when you ask them to not shit on the rebuilds for three seconds
u/Kk_to_the based pin
Are there actually people who think the rebuilds are better or is this a meme?
One of the most appealing aspects of NGE and EoE for me was the art and the pacing. Like the moments of sheer silence or nothing but cicadas made it that much darker... they just set a certain mood so well. The rebuilds, being newer, are of course more flashy and they're just faster-paced and so they have a totally different tone which is fine but it misses what I loved so much about the original series.
... Ramiel
Rebuild fans explaining how the rebuilds were dogshit on purpose
It’s coming to light just how many people enjoyed NGE solely for big robot and 14 year old ass.
[удалено]
This, I'm amazed at how many people on here are saying they disliked EoE, and praise this as the more satisfying conclusion... EoE was the pinnacle of Eva. The rebuilds appeal far more to the average zoomer shonen fan.
It’s about as believable as when Tommy Wiseau started saying The Room was meant to be a comedy.
the entire comment section
Yeah, it's hilarious. "Y-you see, the CGI fight between two Evas looks like dogshit because it's supposed to be a kaiju joke... because... I mean... like, it's super smart actually!"
But, isnt it? That is quite literally the point, at least for that one scene where they fight in a movie studio.
Nope. My guess is that they wanted to make it as fast and cheap as possible, so they resorted to using motion capture instead of hand animation for that fight. And because mo-cap + CGI is the worst thing imaginable in an anime, they then resorted to turning how terrible it looks into the butt of a joke. And it still manages to look terrible. The joke falls flat. Buildings don't get thrown around like empty boxes in kaiju movies, they get destroyed in a blaze of sparks. Also, the actors usually try to give the monster some weight instead of brawling like two regular humans. 3.0+1.0's fight scene looks more like two drunk guys smacking each other in a room full of empty boxes. Joke or not, it looks laughably terrible.
It made sense how bad it looked to me. Especially after it was revealed to be a stage. When Gendo explained how the fight they were having can’t be won with physical might it clicked why it looked so blatantly off, especially when we were going back and forth between that and the fight occurring outside of their mindscape leading up to Misato’s sacrifice.
Yeah. Normally, when a movie makes you laugh by exaggerating tropes of the genre, people call them parodies. But since this is Evangelion, people call it "brilliant meta-criticism of the anime industry." I think my favorites were Ritsuko shooting gendo followed by brain ooze getting put back in his cyclops brain, and CGI floating head Rei. Both had no context or reasonable build-up in the rebuilds, but were like these goofy parodies of scenes that made sense in the originals.
>thinking of inventing a new type of person to get mad at on here. maybe people who carry too many keys around.. i dont know yet. —dril
Why the fuck is this shit pinned now?
Some mod didn’t like rebuilds and this meme made him feel smart I guess
Score, ending, character development... the list could go on
I re watched the original and the rebuild series recently and you know I think I like the original a lot more. It feels like the rebuild just wastes so much time.
Shiro Sagisu’s battle themes like Fate, In My Spirit, and The Wrath of God in All Its Fury are incredible
The Ramiel and Zeruel battles are better imo
NGE was made by a desperate young Anno. Rebuild was built by an older Anno who wanted a Shinji that could save everyone, and not just himself. Its not that NGE was selfish, Shinji was in a terrible state. Its his situation that changed, I think.
Anno made one unpopular movie and automatically rebuilds suck. as someone who personally saw EoE when it released in the states and it's my favorite piece of Eva media, 3.0+1.0 absolutely made rebuilds worth the watch and is just as good. If Anno makes it, it's how it was intended. He put his heart and soul into rebuilds just as much as he did with NGE/EoE. To dismiss his works all together is not only foolish but disrespectful. I actually didn't mind 3.0 much unlike most, but for me, if it's Eva and it's Anno, then I know he made it a certain way for a certain reason. In short, people gotta stop bashing rebuilds just because it wasn't made in the 90's and actually appreciate the new directions it took the franchise. Plus you can NOT tell me the rebuild soundtracks (especially for 2.0 and 3.0) don't go absolutely hard.
I saw somewhere that Anno once said: "You will not find anything new, since you have understood everything in the old Evangelion"
Shiro Sagisu is an absolute genius who has consistently delivered. He was a massive part of what made NGE and EoE especially, so incredible. I had no doubt he would produce stellar tracks for these movies as well. Also, disliking or having issues with the final product (3.0+1.0) is not disrespectful or dismissing of Anno... People are allowed to make criticisms...
The chad “respecting differing opinions” fan Vs. The virgin “superiority complex” fan
Rebuilds are over now
It wasn’t even an argument Graphics are better, but they’re from 10/20 years late, so even that is not really a point
I'm not a rebuild fan, but if i was, i would say graphics
I just joined this sub today, I found my people
Mari
Ass and tiddies
Ramiel but that’s it
Direction is better in the original + EoE. As are the fight scenes (don’t @ me, loads of shit happening on screen at once is not a good fight scene)
"i just think they're neat"
I just finished the rebuilds like 40min ago and although i mostly agree, I really think you can't truly compare them. Both are beautiful in their own ways, both are satisfying in their own ways.
More Kaworu screen time and Gendo's ending. Thats it really.
I like both...
are we acting like rebuild angels dont totally shit all over og angels? Ramiel? Sahaquiel?
Rebuilds are just fan service Fight me
[удалено]
Ramiel was cooler
Ramiel. Thats all, everything else is worse
Animation, pacing, fight choreography, ramiel, Shinii and Rei’s relationship in 2.22, overall I liked the mix of lighter and darker tones opposed to NGE’s dark tone, and I like the rebuilds just as much as I like the original series and I see them as equals