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It's funny how their whole logic about this is that they're taking very literally Jesus words "keep doing this" as though that means literally doing it on the same day.
But it you were to truly, faithfully going to apply that literalist logic to it's completion, everyone should rent houses in Jerusalem in groups of twelve for the night, dress in period clothes, wash each other's feet, and perform the whole ceremony in Aramaic.
We *observe* not celebrate. It's a solemn occasion. Everything is too solemn though. I had someone say Happy Fathers Day to me today, I just said thanks, can't see anything wrong with it tbh.
Some potential responses:
- Iām not sure how that statement from a 5 year old indicates itās wrong to celebrate Fatherās Day.
- How is that any different than siblings day?
- The logic doesnāt make any sense. For example, how is that any different from anniversaries? The fact that we are supposed to love and respect our spouses *every day* doesnāt prevent us from celebrating our anniversaries once a year.
- It seems strange that you think celebrating Fatherās Day is wrong (so much so that you sent me this message), but you donāt have any good, rational, or clear reasons for that belief.
To me it seems like the 5 year old explained how he personally felt about the matter but that has nothing to do with us. We each make our own choices on conscience matters. Plus there was no scriptural backingĀ
I thought your original response was good. It's clear you will not get through to this kind of pimi. But you could say you've done research, examined the scriptures presented, and that ultimately your Bible trained conscience has no problem with fathers day.
It's important sometimes to remember that the PIMI brain doesn't fully work. It has been compromised, limited and sometimes outright damaged by cult conditioning. They are victims of a sort of lifelong cognitive violence.
Yeah if nothing else, this cult has taught me just how malleable the human brain is š§ . We'd all like to think we wouldn't fall for this or that š¤. But truthfully, it is easy to be indoctrinated into some nonsense.
I think it may be a little different for born ins as we have no basis for comparison. Itās all we were allowed to know. I always felt it was not completely right.
Same! But still, I have to check myself when I catch some of their warped teachings sneaking around my brain. It's very hard when you were taught this from infancy and taught that these doctrines are infallible. But I am proud of all the work I have done to fix the way I think and the person I am now.
Thatās so true. I canāt believe that I believed for so long š but also I never really dug into anything too deeply just went along with it cuz my family did
āThatās really courageous of Dorian to defend his personal stance in front of so many people! When it comes to celebrating Fatherās Day, itās not about respecting and obeying parents. Itās about taking a day to honor, to express my love and appreciation, and to devote time to my father. So itās confusing to me why someone would imply that by celebrating Fatherās Day, children would somehow not be respecting and obeying their parents every day š¤ I donāt really see the connection there. Also, I still donāt see any scriptural references for a basis on why itās wrong to celebrate it - unless Iām missing something. But feel free to not celebrate Fatherās Day! It doesnāt offend me āŗļøā¤ļø I understand that we all have to exercise our own conscience when it comes to personal observancesā.
Thank you for this! Also I really donāt believe that a 5 year old wrote a 10 minute talk š I have a 5 year old & she canāt even read and hardly wipes her own butt lol
I had to do a few presentations at district assemblies a few times as a kid and they always asked us the questions and then workshopped our honest answers into the ācorrectā answers every time. It seemed at the time like they were editing for clarity and such but it was just generic bullshit lol
About 5 years ago I learned that a book was put out called the illustration library. Every illustration or āpersonal experienceā I had ever heard from the platform (especially assemblies and co visits) or read in a magazine was from that book! It was my understanding that many COās and elders used this illustration library! Just hastened my disillusionment in the organization. Nothing is real
I'm invested now. Please update us, cause this is crazy hilarious š. I am the type to say I honor my mom and dad every day in the sense that I want them to feel special, I don't need a government holiday for commercialism to this. But to say it has to do with respecting parents is to imply those who celebrate it are disrespectful to parents š¤
Guess that could be said about my view too. But I don't believe that because some celebrate mothers or fathers day they don't honor their parents. (I also don't believe that some kids don't ignore their parents existence until a single day) People are all so different and honestly I like that. Well unless it actually hurts someone reasonably like ignoring your parents existence for days until a day šš¤£
Update! She blocked me after I sent these messages š more in comments
https://preview.redd.it/9uj3gq2yiy6d1.jpeg?width=1289&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=02b00e2ade68650312a28c9f5d7accb740a060c8
The speed read ššš. It's never about the Bible or even the article. It's about whether the GB supports it and right now the GB is anti holidays
EXACTLY. wait til the next announcement saying they can now celebrate holidays and this idiot will have egg on their face. but don't expect an apology from them! she'll just unblock you and comment on how cute your family is š„°š
They always talk about a 'Bible teained conscience'....
that you're apparently not supposed to use š
Like WHAT other 'holidays' are there?
If no military holidays or 'pagan-based' holidays, and most certainly not Mother's Day, because WOMEN, what else is there?
It's a "conscience matter" has never meant chose what's right for you, it has always meant there is one correct choice and you need to choose it without us holding a gun to your head otherwise we will judge you and maybe kick you out but please don't interpret that as us holding a gun to your head because we actually love you want what's best for you. So choose for yourself...and choose right...Or else."
Wouldve been nice if they said 'Jehovah has opened our eyes' in a humble manner, but instead they hit the rocky craig like Moses without giving credit š³š«Øš«Øš«Ø
š¤Øš Or something š¤
We know what happened to Moses as a result of taking credit for God. No Heavenly calling for the so called sole channel of communication between God and Man!
Itās how they keep control of the āflockā
If witnesses start celebrating holidays that say you shouldnāt they are able to see that they are losing controlā¦
Perfect example of them displaying one image to the public, but having unwritten rules in private. Their public FAQ says that each witness weighs Bible principles to decide for themselves what is appropriate. But in actuality, celebrating anything other than the memorial is frowned upon and heavily discouraged. Theyāre trying to appear more reasonable to the public than they are. And her response proves that itās not about what the Bible actually says about it, itās about what is expected of them from the governing body. Not even a shred of personal responsibility to think for yourself.
Thereās no point continuing because she has no further points to argue, lol. Sheās stopping before her own mind realizes that her thinking is completely illogical.
If you are PIMO make sure to check your box that you shared in the ministry this month š¤£.. seems like this PIMI shut down when you started using the WTās own publications to make your point. I am a PIMO spouse with a very PIMI MS husband and he does the same thing, just canāt circular reason himself out of things sometimes so has to physically leave the convo.
Close minded. Itās just a stigma and even their own publications canāt break their preconceived notions.
And they HATE when you donāt just fall in line.
Blocked you!!! Wow. Even after you show it to her with their own literature. That's a lot like my very PIMI family, just absolutely no reason or critical thinking, or even healthy discussion! Sounds like she was looking for any excuse to label you and block you, she has to exalt herself, you know, and have something to talk about out in service. You don't need that insanity in your life.
Tell them they do celebrate Fatherās Day. If they didnāt, why would there be an article right on the homepage about being a good dad today? š
https://preview.redd.it/7d8h4fravy6d1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=6732e66a02c073312c28f585739087d8e76edde7
I soooo hope the gb comes out with an update about fathers / Motherās Day š it would be hilarious to see ppls reaction after all the backlash I got from my post.
They do this with every holiday or world event. They use the fact that the event is in the public consciousness and post a shitty Watchtower indoctrination article about the topic.
###That's what I called the *PiƱata Argument*
You can cite the following publications of the organization as supporting evidence:
[g03 9/22 22-24](https://wol.jw.borg/en/wol/pc/r1/lp-e/1200276790/0/0)
> A main concern is, not what the practice meant hundreds of years ago, but how it is viewed today in your area. Understandably, opinions may vary from one place to another. Hence, it is wise to avoid turning such matters into big issues. The Bible says: āLet each one keep seeking, not his own advantage, but that of the other person.āā1 Corinthians 10:24.
And the following question from a reader posted a little later:
[g04 7/8 30](https://wol.jw.borg/en/wol/pc/r1/lp-e/1200276790/1/0)
>if it is very obvious that a custom has no current false religious significance and involves no violation of Bible principles, each Christian must make a personal decision as to whether he will follow such a custom.
After that you can say that the little boy falls to the **false dilemma fallacy**. In this case, the statement implies that one must either _celebrate Father's Day_ **or** _show respect and obedience to one's father every day_, **without considering that it is possible to do both**. You can consistently respect and obey your father while also taking the opportunity on Father's Day to specially acknowledge and celebrate him.
You can ask her why she, with the same logic, celebrates her wedding anniversary or even the commemoration of Jesus' death. Doesn't she respect and love her man every day? Does she not think of the redemptive sacrifice of Jesus?
Edit: Changed links to not link directly to the organization's website. As always, **remove the b from borg.**.
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This is ticking me off so much. They get so rattled off the most smallest things. If you donāt want to see it keep scrolling. If you have an issue unfriend the person. But to message them to say I see youāre celebrating father day. Pfft šĀ
Yes, it shouldnāt be! Thatās why I donāt have them as friends on anything. I just say I donāt have social media. Because I donāt have time for all that explaining. Iām a grown woman! Plus Iām not holding back no more. You approached me with something dumb. Iāll let you know youāre an idiot.Ā
THE HISTORY OF FATHERāS DAY
Father's Day has its origins in the United States and is celebrated to honor fatherhood and paternal bonds. The idea of a special day to honor fathers was proposed by Sonora Smart Dodd in Spokane, Washington, in 1909. Inspired by Mother's Day, which had become well-established by then, Dodd wanted to create a similar day for fathers. She was particularly motivated by her own father, William Jackson Smart, a Civil War veteran who raised six children as a single parent after his wife died.
The first Father's Day was celebrated on June 19, 1910, in Spokane. The idea gained popularity over the years, but it wasn't until 1972 that Father's Day became a permanent national holiday in the United States, when President Richard Nixon signed it into law. The celebration of Father's Day has since spread to many countries around the world, often celebrated on the third Sunday in June, though the exact date varies by country.
Here is my goto reply:
1 Thessalonians 4:11, which advises believers to āmake it your ambition to lead a quiet life, to mind your own business and to work with your hands, just as we told you.ā This guidance emphasizes living a peaceful, industrious life, focusing on personal responsibilities rather than meddling in othersā affairs. The look on a PIMIās faceā¦Priceless!
Excellent verse! and vs 12, "so that you may walk decently in the eyes of people outside and not need anything."
So many jws have no clue how to mind their own business.
Her comments are so judgemental and petty.
The boys comment that we should respect our fathers each day is off point, we should always respect our fathers even when we disagree with them and them with us. What is important is mutual respect and I've had some huge arguments with my father in the name of mutual respect.
Jehovah's witnesses don't know what respect is.
If anyone believes the school asked a 5 year old to give a ten minute talk, not just a 2 minute what do you think comment, I have another bridge to sell them.
ā¢ ā The logic doesnāt make any sense. For example, how is that any different from anniversaries? The fact that we are supposed to love and respect our spouses every day doesnāt prevent us from celebrating our anniversaries once a year.
This was my ex husband (not a JW) reasoning for not celebrating our anniversary once I became a witness. Iām not saying he was completely in the right, but I now understand his logic. He reasoned that if we could no longer celebrate birthdays, fatherās day or Motherās Day, why celebrate our anniversary. I had no comeback to that
My husband could be vindictive when he wanted to.
- "Do not go beyond what is written" (1 Corinthians 4:6).
- "One person considers one day more sacred than another; another considers every day alike. Each of them should be fully convinced in their own mind. Whoever regards one day as special does so to the Lord. Whoever eats meat does so to the Lord, for they give thanks to God; and whoever abstains does so to the Lord and gives thanks to God." (Romans 14:5-6).
Why can't we respect our parents all year and also celebrate Fathers day? They are not mutually exclusive.
Also a 5 year old was asked to speak to the entire school about his beliefs about fathers day so he wrote a 10 minute lecture on the subject? Really? A 5 year old?
I checked and in the US 1st grade students should be around 6yo. so that puts him in kindergarten. Lets just think about that again, a kindergartener was *asked* to write a 10 minute lecture and present it in front of 500 people? What school did he go to, and what part of the administration thought this was a good idea?
His classmates are singing their ABC's and learning to count all the way to 30, even working on how to spell such complex words as "cat" and "dog" while he's writing a dissertation on "The Responsibilities of a Father?
This story is like tea from China, far-fetched!
I started laughing when I saw her reply with the story about this child being the evidence for why Witnesses donāt celebrate Fathers Day but then I started laughing again when I read your comment š
This was my first thought too lol but itās the only thing she could find š I bet she would feel dumb if she thought about it for more then a second
If we are not allowed to come up with holidays then who entitled the Governing Body to tell us to celebrate these conventions / assemblies three times a year?!
I hate that they have robbed our holidays from us. Now it is confusing my family that I congratulate them to their birthday and my nieces and nephews receive presents for their birthday and ChristmasĀ
Your response should beā¦āI recommend you unfriend me because I may post something that could stumble you, as you are clearly spiritually weak.ā And then never talk to that person again.
"That's so sweet! Do you have any scriptures that could easily be used to combat any confusion that may arise from that young man's presentation? I'd love to look them up as none immediately come to mind āŗļø"
Would be my response personally, but I love watching people squirm. š¤£
If JW's got one thing, they got AUDACITY š¤Ø. Imagine messaging a grown ass adult about what they posted on their page. I would never... You even gave them an out, offered them to unfriend you. But no, instead they want to continue policing you. I hate this cult so much. The way they have warped people's mind is beyond belief.
That is a non argument.
The bible itself is completely silent on father's day (and mother's day) for obvious reasons.
Using a likely fabricated example (because we can't actually verify the experience with the subject) of some kid arguing that setting a designated day to celebrate your parents somehow bars them from being respected for the rest of the year, as proof that Father's Day is bad, is illogical and stupid.
There is no biblical condemnation for father's day.
Celebrating someone you love in a more special way, during a particular time of year, does not keep you from loving and respecting them outside of that time.
The common extrapolation (not mentioned here but it's used alot) of it being argued as "creature worship" is also DUMB, because their doctrine literally demands that we pray through Jesus and commemorate him yearly .... Even though Jesus is a creation that we're supposedly not supposed to bow to or worship. Does going to the memorial every year suddenly mean that JWs don't respect or love him outside of that?
Jehovah's Witnesses just regurgitate whatever they hear from the platform without fact checking any of the sources and illicit virtually no critical thought during the process.
My grandma šµš¾ always told me not to lean on my own understanding, and it is not for man to direct his own step š blah blah blah š. They really despise logic and critical thinking.
Omg š pimis and their āI NEED to know where you stand so I can unfollow youā
I would just reply with āitās none of your business, have a beautiful day!ā
those stupid, made up stories drive me insane.
SURE, let's get the 5-year-old up in front of the school for a random presentation, let's have him give a ten minute "talk" on the responsibilities of a father. let him make it scripture -based and let him determine the holiday part is bad.
because you know when this was read a bunch of old ladies smile and nod their heads and then look to their little 5yr old grandkids and think, why don't you give these talks? why aren't you scriptural enough to get in nana's WT study?
it makes me feel SO dumb that i believed any of this, even as a small child.
Itās crazy that anyone who has seen a real 5 year old would think that story was real. A 5 year old canāt even read usually š and this person has multiple kids! Iām also ashamed I was once like this lol
Haha I try to find any reference on the wol but it looks like its deleted or something, I try to search on the webside and found that they have a front cover article of how to be a good dad! Wtf now we can celebrate father's day? There is nothing what it say is wrong.
The **only** reference I've ever been able to find is an obscure two-page article in the May 8, 1956 *Awake!* that poorly attempted to connect Mother's Day with ancient pagan stuff, and equated both Mother's and Father's Days as creature worship. No JW today would even remember those articles. If pressed, they would have to admit something like, "I don't know why we don't. We just don't. Creature worship or something."
As a kid it was always so embarrassing to try & explain why i couldnāt celebrate stuff. Would always just default to because my parents are jwās lol
You canāt explain- non of your fking business; Anymore than you can explain the ridiculous. Just shun and write them off first. Then go on doing you.
This is a Cult, led by men with No Holy Spirit. Once youāve reached that conclusion personally, no one elseās thoughts matter.
"I don't understand? That's not from the Bible though? At Matthew 19:19, Jesus reiterated that we must 'honor your father and mother.' Father's day is just a day that we remember to honor our fathers like he said."
āItās true that we should honour a father and mother as the Bible commands every day. And similarly we should honour, love and respect marriage partners daily.
But setting aside a specific day to honour a father, or setting aside a specific day to honour a marriage (like an anniversary party), why is that wrong?
We can actually do both. This isnāt an either/or situation. We show appreciation for Jesus sacrifice every day but also have a special day once a year to memorialize his death. We can do both.
So I ask you: Why canāt we honour a marriage mate daily but also set aside a special day specifically to focus on celebrating that marriage? Of course we can do both. Of course there is nothing wrong with doing both. Why canāt we do both with honouring a father?ā
This is just a response to the false dichotomy of only being able to do one or the other, since thatās the reasoning they provided you with.
Iām sure the response to this would be that itās āworldlyā or something vague like that, that has no refutation.
A minute ago beards were worldly. A minute ago wearing pants to meeting for women was worldly.
āDo not go beyond the things written,ā the Bible warns. (1 Cor 4:6)
"I'm sorry, I can see how my message might have been unclear. When I asked if Father's Day is 'unbiblical' I meant to ask for a reference *from the bible*.
The reference you gave me, is an *interpretation* of bible writings - and a five year old child's interpretation at that. Can you please provide a scripture where we are instructed to disregard the June holiday? I myself am unaware of one"
Just adjust it to add some flowery words, depending on how nice you want to be.
I can only keep you in my friend zone if you PROMISE to NOT pay ANY extra respect whatsover to your Father when 99% of society is doing so on this very day. Or, God will strike you down! Shame!
https://youtu.be/1GiPcP30cFc?si=sTa1flkBbssjGf1h
Hereās how I would reply:
Colossians 2:16ā17 says, "Therefore let no one pass judgment on you in questions of food and drink, or with regard to a festival or a new moon or a Sabbath. These are a shadow of the things to come, but the substance belongs to Christ".
Notice the scripture addressed all types of celebrations, not just Jewish ones. You may want to dial back on the judgment, and āgoing beyond what is writtenā. That mentality is likely to be a cause for stumbling others. We want to remember to be lovers of God rather than lovers of men. Iāll pray for you.
Thatās how Iād reply. Then again, Iām not trying to keep any Dub friends.
If we donāt enforce clear direct commands from the bible like donāt be gluttons or donāt wear makeup, why is something thats not even in the bible so important to you?
This is an excellent answer because it's not hostile or argumentative, yet raises an excellent question that forces one to actually have to actually have to think or possibly even research, in order to come up with their own answer (even if their answer is "because the society says we can't, and here's the random scriptures thrown together in an attempt to support this man-made rule of theirs"). Ask them to please reply with their answer using only the Bible itself to support why it's wrong. Then, don't forget to ask once more, why they feel it's not a sin in Jehovah's eyes to ignore what the Bible has to say against the use of makeup, jewelery, hair braids, etc...
While I appreciate the thought, I am only interested in actual biblical verses as reference - I am not interested in publications especially without full scriptural quotes.
If you want to be less polite say that you don't particularly intend to take moral and religious advice from the talk of a kindergartener.
There are worse sins and wrongs JWs are committing and yet they speak of this one as a grave sin.
āāHow terrible for you, teachers of the Law and Pharisees! You hypocrites! You give to God a tenth even of the seasoning herbs, such as mint, dill, and cumin, but you neglect to obey the really important teachings of the Law, such as justice and mercy and honesty. These you should practise, without neglecting the others. Blind guides! You strain a fly out of your drink, but swallow a camel!ā
āāMatthewā¬ ā23ā¬:ā23ā¬-ā24ā¬ āGNBDCā¬ā¬
It really doesn't matter what you say. PIMI people are ~~brainwashed~~ trained to twist everything that isn't blatant regurgitation of watchtower rhetoric.
I don't know why people celebrate things only sometimes, for me, it's so hard being straight 11 months of the year. Instead of pride, why can't we be ourselves every day, smh. /s
My parents relented years ago and now look forward to, even gift me back on Mothers Day and Fathers Day.
It is a day of recognition nothing more nothing less.
You should say "I agree" and then proceed to post on your social media "Happy Fathers Day! Because we should love and respect our fathers every day." ....
Every single day until they defriend you.
I love how they privately celebrate stuff like Thanksgiving but in person theyāre like āoh no thatās paganā and do mental gymnastics to CREATE the proof.
Silly geese
That line is their go to for every non religious holiday. Why doesnāt that logic apply to memorial and wedding anniversaries? Instead of celebrating our spouse once a year, we should love and respect them everyday.
Itās strange how they do not want witnesses to celebrate days like Fatherās Day or any other days except wedding anniversaries. If they want to say that those celebrations are pagan,well technically if you look up where the customs associated with weddings are pagan. But the governing body wonāt acknowledge that.
Another reason why I believe they wonāt celebrate is due to the fact that I believe Satan is backing them so the GB wants our exclusive devotion to go to him with no distractions.
By the way, the Bible says to āhonor your father and your mother,ā which we should do every day. But this one day a year giving them special honor brings joy to their hearts.
Out of curiosity, did anyone else here celebrate Father's Day but not Mother's Day? I was raised in the religion and all of my extended family are witnesses. For some reason, we were always allowed to celebrate Father's Day but not Mother's and I was curious if anyone else had this experience?
Right! I was sooooooo quiet as a kid in school cuz being a jw was unbearably embarrassing. Thank goodness I woke up before I forced my kids to believe this nonsense
First, I would point out the following -
What he sent doesn't say NOT to celebrate Father's Day. It says "children should respect and obey their parents every day" which is not what Father's Day is about. Father's Day is about showing appreciation for your dad.
JWs celebrate wedding anniversaries. By that logic, wedding anniversaries should not be observed because we should love and cherish our husband/wife every day of the year.
And JWs should not observe the Memorial, because they should be thankful for Jesus' sacrifice every day.
Then I would ask my question again, where in the Bible does it say NOT to celebrate Father's Day? The scripture referenced in his text, Ephesians 6:4 just says what a father is supposed to do. Which has absolutely nothing to do with Father's Day.
I can't tell you how many parties I've seen thrown for bethelites (right IN Brooklyn BETHEL, no less) for someone with 20+ years of service... not to mention the parties thrown for full-time pioneers who've dedicated the same amount of time/service!!
Where in the Bible did Jesus ever instruct or set this type of example for us to follow? Never? Were the 1st century Christians ever known to praise and celebrate people for their years of preaching or service to Jehovah in this way? No, again?? Do you feel this is committing a sin then? No?? Can you explain, using only your Bible, why you feel Jesus wouldn't be bothered by that, but considers it evil if others want to set aside a day each year to honor all their parents do, even though they love and honor them all year round?
Perhaps in the future, when the Governing Body explains this has been unscriptural all along, you'll suddenly be ok with it... just like you all quickly grew beards and women started wearing pants to the KH, without ANY guilt. I look forward to the day the GB is humble enough to recognize and correct this error in their belief as well. I'll keep praying for Jehovah to speed up their understanding in this until then.
(This approach, particularly being specific about the very recent and abrupt changes to their "truth", drives them insane, and has proven very effective for me in recent months. They hate it, but they can't refute it).
Why are all the weird congregations in America? I've been a witness for 22 years, never knew fathers day and mothers day was an issue.
Probably just an over zealous publisher
Nothing wrong with appreciating your parents
Well that quote from a Wt or whatever publication, soon showed us how it is so unscriptural to celebrate Fatherās Day š but wait a minute, doesnāt Ephesians 6 :4 just say fathers do not exasperate your children? Where does that scripture indicate God hates Fatherās Day? False reasoning or what.
Tell them to actually read Ephesians 6:4 and then ask them to explain how that conflates to not celebrating father's/mother's day?
Ā Of course no JW actually cares what the Bible says, it's all about what mother WT says in the articles.
Ā Also laughable is the fact that it is implied that wordlyĀ children only show respect to their fathers on father's day, yet somehow JW kids respect them all throughout the year ???
I wouldnāt engage further- they think if they can keep you talking (responding) theyāve got you.
They are making you feel like you owe them an explanation.
Just my opinion, but Iād probably just say, ātake care.ā
Or send some safe emoji and then stop answering.
Ewww this made me puke!! Like why the fuck do they care like if it bothers you soo much delete me! I recommend you to delete all jws from your page fuck that you donāt need to deal with none of that!
Curious as to why he would question you on a āholidayā not mentioned in scripture to refrain from celebrating which should lead to it being a āconscience decisionā when on the same day numerous people around the world were observing Pentecost or the Feast of Weeks, a Feast of Jehovah or āHoly Dayā aka āholidayā that is mentioned in scripture numerous times and according to Leviticus 23 it should be observed forever no matter where you live,
āOn that same day you are to proclaim a sacred assembly and do no regular work. This is to be a lasting ordinance for the generations to come, wherever you live.ā
āāLeviticusā¬ ā23ā¬:ā21ā¬ āNIVā¬ā¬
Again curious as to why the focus on a holiday God never mentions when a holiday God commanded āhis peopleā to observe forever isnāt even on his radar?
I think Jesus said it better than I could ever say it, āYou blind guides! You strain out a gnat but swallow a camel.ā
āāMatthewā¬ ā23ā¬:ā24ā¬ āNIVā¬ā¬
Im pretty sure you asked if fathers day was unbiblical in anyway, correct? His reply was that there was plenty of "references." What he failed to mention was that these references were not from the bible but from WT produces publications. In addition, his "reference" was not even a biblical reference, it was an anecdotal story. This is the same trick all JW's play. No need to use the bible to prove a point when you have WT publications. The very definition of "going beyond whats written" - 1 Cor 4:6.
Celebrate and honor are synonymous. Scripture does say honor your father and mother. So celebrate their good work. If youāre supposed respect and obey them everyday, isnāt Fatherās Day one of those days too and the times make it more convenient as wellšššš
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"Instead of celebrating the Memorial once a year, Christians should show appreciation for Jesus' sacrifice every day."
Love this one haha š
Not even necessary. Just sayā¦.. sorry I donāt get this reference, can you show me from the bible please.
Exactly spot! Where in the Bible?.. and not your interpretation!
Ray Franz has entered the chatā¦
This right here is the perfect logical reasoning.
It's funny how their whole logic about this is that they're taking very literally Jesus words "keep doing this" as though that means literally doing it on the same day. But it you were to truly, faithfully going to apply that literalist logic to it's completion, everyone should rent houses in Jerusalem in groups of twelve for the night, dress in period clothes, wash each other's feet, and perform the whole ceremony in Aramaic.
ā¦and everyone should partakeā¦ The Bible only teaches 2 resurrections, not three
? Seriously. I donāt know, lol
Hahahahahaah
We *observe* not celebrate. It's a solemn occasion. Everything is too solemn though. I had someone say Happy Fathers Day to me today, I just said thanks, can't see anything wrong with it tbh.
Yes top comment
BOOM, gotāem.
There you go!...Confusing everyone with your logic again! š¤£š¤£š¤£š¤£
Perfect
I agree!
If OP replied this please post their reply. I'm so interested in how they will respond LMAO
ā¦but when Catholics do mass every week āit diminishes the weightiness of gods sacrifice.ā
Some potential responses: - Iām not sure how that statement from a 5 year old indicates itās wrong to celebrate Fatherās Day. - How is that any different than siblings day? - The logic doesnāt make any sense. For example, how is that any different from anniversaries? The fact that we are supposed to love and respect our spouses *every day* doesnāt prevent us from celebrating our anniversaries once a year. - It seems strange that you think celebrating Fatherās Day is wrong (so much so that you sent me this message), but you donāt have any good, rational, or clear reasons for that belief.
Wow I wish I was this good at coming up with responses!
Hang out here and you will be !
š„°thanks
But why even respond to begin with? These are really their issuesā¦
To me it seems like the 5 year old explained how he personally felt about the matter but that has nothing to do with us. We each make our own choices on conscience matters. Plus there was no scriptural backingĀ
I was going to sit and think about a response and take the time to type it out, but it appears mic has already been dropped.
The last one is a 360 no scope killshot to their flawed belief system. š„
Per usual your response is right on the nose
I thought your original response was good. It's clear you will not get through to this kind of pimi. But you could say you've done research, examined the scriptures presented, and that ultimately your Bible trained conscience has no problem with fathers day.
Thanks for the advice! Yah itās so frustrating trying to make any sense of how a pimiās brain works š
It's important sometimes to remember that the PIMI brain doesn't fully work. It has been compromised, limited and sometimes outright damaged by cult conditioning. They are victims of a sort of lifelong cognitive violence.
Yeah if nothing else, this cult has taught me just how malleable the human brain is š§ . We'd all like to think we wouldn't fall for this or that š¤. But truthfully, it is easy to be indoctrinated into some nonsense.
I think it may be a little different for born ins as we have no basis for comparison. Itās all we were allowed to know. I always felt it was not completely right.
Same! But still, I have to check myself when I catch some of their warped teachings sneaking around my brain. It's very hard when you were taught this from infancy and taught that these doctrines are infallible. But I am proud of all the work I have done to fix the way I think and the person I am now.
Thatās so true. I canāt believe that I believed for so long š but also I never really dug into anything too deeply just went along with it cuz my family did
That was all of us at one time!
Their brains are fried from hours of indoctrination.we somehow escaped from it .
Thatās because it doesnāt and Iām speaking from personal experience š
True š you kinnda have to turn your brain off to believe any of this bs
āThatās really courageous of Dorian to defend his personal stance in front of so many people! When it comes to celebrating Fatherās Day, itās not about respecting and obeying parents. Itās about taking a day to honor, to express my love and appreciation, and to devote time to my father. So itās confusing to me why someone would imply that by celebrating Fatherās Day, children would somehow not be respecting and obeying their parents every day š¤ I donāt really see the connection there. Also, I still donāt see any scriptural references for a basis on why itās wrong to celebrate it - unless Iām missing something. But feel free to not celebrate Fatherās Day! It doesnāt offend me āŗļøā¤ļø I understand that we all have to exercise our own conscience when it comes to personal observancesā.
Thank you for this! Also I really donāt believe that a 5 year old wrote a 10 minute talk š I have a 5 year old & she canāt even read and hardly wipes her own butt lol
None of those stories actually happened. Just like a Smurf doll never ran out during a meeting cursing.
He didnāt run out the Hall. He moon walked out. Because that was Michael Jacksonās dance and he was also full of demons in the 80s if you recall!
I love all the different versions over the years. Itās like playing Joho nonsense telephone!
I ran into Michael Jackson at pur hall in the book room. His sister went to the same hall we did. This was before the thriller album
Michael Jackson was great.
MJ was cool in the 80s. He disassociated in the 90s.
I had to do a few presentations at district assemblies a few times as a kid and they always asked us the questions and then workshopped our honest answers into the ācorrectā answers every time. It seemed at the time like they were editing for clarity and such but it was just generic bullshit lol
About 5 years ago I learned that a book was put out called the illustration library. Every illustration or āpersonal experienceā I had ever heard from the platform (especially assemblies and co visits) or read in a magazine was from that book! It was my understanding that many COās and elders used this illustration library! Just hastened my disillusionment in the organization. Nothing is real
What!?! Now you tell meā¦ all these years avoiding the Smurf section at Walmart! ššš Love the old crazy stories lol
They always have some extreme made up story to "encourage" people lol in the words of Judge Judy it's "BALONEY!"
I'm invested now. Please update us, cause this is crazy hilarious š. I am the type to say I honor my mom and dad every day in the sense that I want them to feel special, I don't need a government holiday for commercialism to this. But to say it has to do with respecting parents is to imply those who celebrate it are disrespectful to parents š¤ Guess that could be said about my view too. But I don't believe that because some celebrate mothers or fathers day they don't honor their parents. (I also don't believe that some kids don't ignore their parents existence until a single day) People are all so different and honestly I like that. Well unless it actually hurts someone reasonably like ignoring your parents existence for days until a day šš¤£
Wow, your response is so much better than mine. Well done.
āInstead of celebrating a marriage once, we should celebrate it every dayā - how does that make sense? Itās not even an argument.
Right! I was so confused by that lol
Update! She blocked me after I sent these messages š more in comments https://preview.redd.it/9uj3gq2yiy6d1.jpeg?width=1289&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=02b00e2ade68650312a28c9f5d7accb740a060c8
https://preview.redd.it/e85l36uziy6d1.jpeg?width=1290&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=76a61f34e9f797a6090d8c2f1c39cee41ce7834a
https://preview.redd.it/c8szt1o0jy6d1.jpeg?width=1290&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c19365b3227d6aa4ce6eb949bdd486ed6f0fcbab
The speed read ššš. It's never about the Bible or even the article. It's about whether the GB supports it and right now the GB is anti holidays
EXACTLY. wait til the next announcement saying they can now celebrate holidays and this idiot will have egg on their face. but don't expect an apology from them! she'll just unblock you and comment on how cute your family is š„°š
They always talk about a 'Bible teained conscience'.... that you're apparently not supposed to use š Like WHAT other 'holidays' are there? If no military holidays or 'pagan-based' holidays, and most certainly not Mother's Day, because WOMEN, what else is there?
It's a "conscience matter" has never meant chose what's right for you, it has always meant there is one correct choice and you need to choose it without us holding a gun to your head otherwise we will judge you and maybe kick you out but please don't interpret that as us holding a gun to your head because we actually love you want what's best for you. So choose for yourself...and choose right...Or else."
Yup just like the beard policy change when the GB said āwe have decidedā. You can now grow a beard. youāre welcome.
Wouldve been nice if they said 'Jehovah has opened our eyes' in a humble manner, but instead they hit the rocky craig like Moses without giving credit š³š«Øš«Øš«Ø š¤Øš Or something š¤
We know what happened to Moses as a result of taking credit for God. No Heavenly calling for the so called sole channel of communication between God and Man!
So true š
They always have to micro-manage everything, and worry about what others are doing.
Itās how they keep control of the āflockā If witnesses start celebrating holidays that say you shouldnāt they are able to see that they are losing controlā¦
Perfect example of them displaying one image to the public, but having unwritten rules in private. Their public FAQ says that each witness weighs Bible principles to decide for themselves what is appropriate. But in actuality, celebrating anything other than the memorial is frowned upon and heavily discouraged. Theyāre trying to appear more reasonable to the public than they are. And her response proves that itās not about what the Bible actually says about it, itās about what is expected of them from the governing body. Not even a shred of personal responsibility to think for yourself.
šš Yep. No point to go on is right š
Thereās no point continuing because she has no further points to argue, lol. Sheās stopping before her own mind realizes that her thinking is completely illogical.
Good riddance to bad rubbish.
How convenient when the trash takes itself out šāāļø
If you are PIMO make sure to check your box that you shared in the ministry this month š¤£.. seems like this PIMI shut down when you started using the WTās own publications to make your point. I am a PIMO spouse with a very PIMI MS husband and he does the same thing, just canāt circular reason himself out of things sometimes so has to physically leave the convo.
Close minded. Itās just a stigma and even their own publications canāt break their preconceived notions. And they HATE when you donāt just fall in line.
wild, WILD stuff the governing body will do anything to isolate it's members from society
Blocked you!!! Wow. Even after you show it to her with their own literature. That's a lot like my very PIMI family, just absolutely no reason or critical thinking, or even healthy discussion! Sounds like she was looking for any excuse to label you and block you, she has to exalt herself, you know, and have something to talk about out in service. You don't need that insanity in your life.
Most likely! Jwās have no life & loooove gossip. Everyone still talks about my friend who left before me years ago cuz their lives are so boring š
So her answer is that a brain washed five year old can parrot words. Got it. How inspired.
Tell them they do celebrate Fatherās Day. If they didnāt, why would there be an article right on the homepage about being a good dad today? š https://preview.redd.it/7d8h4fravy6d1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=6732e66a02c073312c28f585739087d8e76edde7
Snap! I don't believe it! I wonder if this is them testing the waters?
I soooo hope the gb comes out with an update about fathers / Motherās Day š it would be hilarious to see ppls reaction after all the backlash I got from my post.
They will just say they never told us not to celebrate it. That came from the brothers talking amongst themselves!
They do this with every holiday or world event. They use the fact that the event is in the public consciousness and post a shitty Watchtower indoctrination article about the topic.
I doubt it, they have their heads up so far their own asses.
###That's what I called the *PiƱata Argument* You can cite the following publications of the organization as supporting evidence: [g03 9/22 22-24](https://wol.jw.borg/en/wol/pc/r1/lp-e/1200276790/0/0) > A main concern is, not what the practice meant hundreds of years ago, but how it is viewed today in your area. Understandably, opinions may vary from one place to another. Hence, it is wise to avoid turning such matters into big issues. The Bible says: āLet each one keep seeking, not his own advantage, but that of the other person.āā1 Corinthians 10:24. And the following question from a reader posted a little later: [g04 7/8 30](https://wol.jw.borg/en/wol/pc/r1/lp-e/1200276790/1/0) >if it is very obvious that a custom has no current false religious significance and involves no violation of Bible principles, each Christian must make a personal decision as to whether he will follow such a custom. After that you can say that the little boy falls to the **false dilemma fallacy**. In this case, the statement implies that one must either _celebrate Father's Day_ **or** _show respect and obedience to one's father every day_, **without considering that it is possible to do both**. You can consistently respect and obey your father while also taking the opportunity on Father's Day to specially acknowledge and celebrate him. You can ask her why she, with the same logic, celebrates her wedding anniversary or even the commemoration of Jesus' death. Doesn't she respect and love her man every day? Does she not think of the redemptive sacrifice of Jesus? Edit: Changed links to not link directly to the organization's website. As always, **remove the b from borg.**.
What a surprise that the PiƱata religion used the piƱata argument.
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This is ticking me off so much. They get so rattled off the most smallest things. If you donāt want to see it keep scrolling. If you have an issue unfriend the person. But to message them to say I see youāre celebrating father day. Pfft šĀ
Sooooo many people messaged me! I didnāt even realize it would be such a controversy to tell your husband you appreciate him being a good father lol
Yes, it shouldnāt be! Thatās why I donāt have them as friends on anything. I just say I donāt have social media. Because I donāt have time for all that explaining. Iām a grown woman! Plus Iām not holding back no more. You approached me with something dumb. Iāll let you know youāre an idiot.Ā
More evidence that its a cult.
Exactly.Ā
THE HISTORY OF FATHERāS DAY Father's Day has its origins in the United States and is celebrated to honor fatherhood and paternal bonds. The idea of a special day to honor fathers was proposed by Sonora Smart Dodd in Spokane, Washington, in 1909. Inspired by Mother's Day, which had become well-established by then, Dodd wanted to create a similar day for fathers. She was particularly motivated by her own father, William Jackson Smart, a Civil War veteran who raised six children as a single parent after his wife died. The first Father's Day was celebrated on June 19, 1910, in Spokane. The idea gained popularity over the years, but it wasn't until 1972 that Father's Day became a permanent national holiday in the United States, when President Richard Nixon signed it into law. The celebration of Father's Day has since spread to many countries around the world, often celebrated on the third Sunday in June, though the exact date varies by country.
Here is my goto reply: 1 Thessalonians 4:11, which advises believers to āmake it your ambition to lead a quiet life, to mind your own business and to work with your hands, just as we told you.ā This guidance emphasizes living a peaceful, industrious life, focusing on personal responsibilities rather than meddling in othersā affairs. The look on a PIMIās faceā¦Priceless!
Follow that up with, "Perhaps you have some knitting to do?"
This is the best scripture lol
Excellent verse! and vs 12, "so that you may walk decently in the eyes of people outside and not need anything." So many jws have no clue how to mind their own business.
They are encouraged to snoop so as to rat out others.
Yes. I once heard an elder's wife say it was her "job" to spy on the congregation and report back to her husband.
Her comments are so judgemental and petty. The boys comment that we should respect our fathers each day is off point, we should always respect our fathers even when we disagree with them and them with us. What is important is mutual respect and I've had some huge arguments with my father in the name of mutual respect. Jehovah's witnesses don't know what respect is.
Furthermore if anyone believes a 5 year old wrote a ten minute talk based on scripture then I have a bridge to sell 'em!
If anyone believes the school asked a 5 year old to give a ten minute talk, not just a 2 minute what do you think comment, I have another bridge to sell them.
Bridges. Bridges everywhere! š
ššš
ā¢ ā The logic doesnāt make any sense. For example, how is that any different from anniversaries? The fact that we are supposed to love and respect our spouses every day doesnāt prevent us from celebrating our anniversaries once a year. This was my ex husband (not a JW) reasoning for not celebrating our anniversary once I became a witness. Iām not saying he was completely in the right, but I now understand his logic. He reasoned that if we could no longer celebrate birthdays, fatherās day or Motherās Day, why celebrate our anniversary. I had no comeback to that My husband could be vindictive when he wanted to.
I mean, he's an asshole. But he was a consistent asshole, so there's that? lol
Yes, he was. We probably wouldnāt have stayed together in any event, but even so, I get his point.
Good job he's your ex.
- "Do not go beyond what is written" (1 Corinthians 4:6). - "One person considers one day more sacred than another; another considers every day alike. Each of them should be fully convinced in their own mind. Whoever regards one day as special does so to the Lord. Whoever eats meat does so to the Lord, for they give thanks to God; and whoever abstains does so to the Lord and gives thanks to God." (Romans 14:5-6).
Why can't we respect our parents all year and also celebrate Fathers day? They are not mutually exclusive. Also a 5 year old was asked to speak to the entire school about his beliefs about fathers day so he wrote a 10 minute lecture on the subject? Really? A 5 year old? I checked and in the US 1st grade students should be around 6yo. so that puts him in kindergarten. Lets just think about that again, a kindergartener was *asked* to write a 10 minute lecture and present it in front of 500 people? What school did he go to, and what part of the administration thought this was a good idea? His classmates are singing their ABC's and learning to count all the way to 30, even working on how to spell such complex words as "cat" and "dog" while he's writing a dissertation on "The Responsibilities of a Father? This story is like tea from China, far-fetched!
I started laughing when I saw her reply with the story about this child being the evidence for why Witnesses donāt celebrate Fathers Day but then I started laughing again when I read your comment š
This was my first thought too lol but itās the only thing she could find š I bet she would feel dumb if she thought about it for more then a second
If we are not allowed to come up with holidays then who entitled the Governing Body to tell us to celebrate these conventions / assemblies three times a year?! I hate that they have robbed our holidays from us. Now it is confusing my family that I congratulate them to their birthday and my nieces and nephews receive presents for their birthday and ChristmasĀ
Your response should beā¦āI recommend you unfriend me because I may post something that could stumble you, as you are clearly spiritually weak.ā And then never talk to that person again.
thatās amazing haha
if everything is special, then nothing is special.
Love a good The Incredibles reference.
I love how his/her answer is not answering the question
They probably have to ask the elders for an answer.
"That's so sweet! Do you have any scriptures that could easily be used to combat any confusion that may arise from that young man's presentation? I'd love to look them up as none immediately come to mind āŗļø" Would be my response personally, but I love watching people squirm. š¤£
Iām bad cuz seeing her squirm is one of the reasons I kept pressing her š
Consider yourself taken off their spiritually upbuilding friend list š š
If JW's got one thing, they got AUDACITY š¤Ø. Imagine messaging a grown ass adult about what they posted on their page. I would never... You even gave them an out, offered them to unfriend you. But no, instead they want to continue policing you. I hate this cult so much. The way they have warped people's mind is beyond belief.
Itās impressive how much they care about random peoples lives lol Iāve never even meet this girl in real life & she lives in a different country
Wtf? That's so wild. Well, I am sure you will be just fine without her spiritually uplifting friend group lmao š¤£.
That is a non argument. The bible itself is completely silent on father's day (and mother's day) for obvious reasons. Using a likely fabricated example (because we can't actually verify the experience with the subject) of some kid arguing that setting a designated day to celebrate your parents somehow bars them from being respected for the rest of the year, as proof that Father's Day is bad, is illogical and stupid. There is no biblical condemnation for father's day. Celebrating someone you love in a more special way, during a particular time of year, does not keep you from loving and respecting them outside of that time. The common extrapolation (not mentioned here but it's used alot) of it being argued as "creature worship" is also DUMB, because their doctrine literally demands that we pray through Jesus and commemorate him yearly .... Even though Jesus is a creation that we're supposedly not supposed to bow to or worship. Does going to the memorial every year suddenly mean that JWs don't respect or love him outside of that? Jehovah's Witnesses just regurgitate whatever they hear from the platform without fact checking any of the sources and illicit virtually no critical thought during the process.
My grandma šµš¾ always told me not to lean on my own understanding, and it is not for man to direct his own step š blah blah blah š. They really despise logic and critical thinking.
Ugh that saying always rubbed me the wrong way even as a kid
I feel like nobody does research on why jwās believe what they doā¦or they wouldnāt believe anymore
JWs be so silly. Happy Father's Day! We sure are celebrating it in our house haha
Thank you š„° I hope you guys have a fun day!
Great responses, youāre a better person than me because I probably would have told her to fu*k off.
It was hard not too lol
Omg š pimis and their āI NEED to know where you stand so I can unfollow youā I would just reply with āitās none of your business, have a beautiful day!ā
So incredibly nosy & unnecessary to message someone about their personal life. But I guess jwās donāt have anything else to do so why not.
those stupid, made up stories drive me insane. SURE, let's get the 5-year-old up in front of the school for a random presentation, let's have him give a ten minute "talk" on the responsibilities of a father. let him make it scripture -based and let him determine the holiday part is bad. because you know when this was read a bunch of old ladies smile and nod their heads and then look to their little 5yr old grandkids and think, why don't you give these talks? why aren't you scriptural enough to get in nana's WT study? it makes me feel SO dumb that i believed any of this, even as a small child.
oh right, and he was ASKED to talk about WHAT HE BELIEVED because he was a witness and people are SO INTERESTED in understanding witness beliefs....
Itās crazy that anyone who has seen a real 5 year old would think that story was real. A 5 year old canāt even read usually š and this person has multiple kids! Iām also ashamed I was once like this lol
āKeep my friends list as upbuilding and spiritually focused as possibleā??? Tell this clown to fuck all the way off!
Haha I try to find any reference on the wol but it looks like its deleted or something, I try to search on the webside and found that they have a front cover article of how to be a good dad! Wtf now we can celebrate father's day? There is nothing what it say is wrong.
I noticed there was a deleted one too lol so idk what she was trying to talk about
The **only** reference I've ever been able to find is an obscure two-page article in the May 8, 1956 *Awake!* that poorly attempted to connect Mother's Day with ancient pagan stuff, and equated both Mother's and Father's Days as creature worship. No JW today would even remember those articles. If pressed, they would have to admit something like, "I don't know why we don't. We just don't. Creature worship or something."
As a kid it was always so embarrassing to try & explain why i couldnāt celebrate stuff. Would always just default to because my parents are jwās lol
You canāt explain- non of your fking business; Anymore than you can explain the ridiculous. Just shun and write them off first. Then go on doing you. This is a Cult, led by men with No Holy Spirit. Once youāve reached that conclusion personally, no one elseās thoughts matter.
"I don't understand? That's not from the Bible though? At Matthew 19:19, Jesus reiterated that we must 'honor your father and mother.' Father's day is just a day that we remember to honor our fathers like he said."
Who dis. New phone.
āItās true that we should honour a father and mother as the Bible commands every day. And similarly we should honour, love and respect marriage partners daily. But setting aside a specific day to honour a father, or setting aside a specific day to honour a marriage (like an anniversary party), why is that wrong? We can actually do both. This isnāt an either/or situation. We show appreciation for Jesus sacrifice every day but also have a special day once a year to memorialize his death. We can do both. So I ask you: Why canāt we honour a marriage mate daily but also set aside a special day specifically to focus on celebrating that marriage? Of course we can do both. Of course there is nothing wrong with doing both. Why canāt we do both with honouring a father?ā
This is just a response to the false dichotomy of only being able to do one or the other, since thatās the reasoning they provided you with. Iām sure the response to this would be that itās āworldlyā or something vague like that, that has no refutation. A minute ago beards were worldly. A minute ago wearing pants to meeting for women was worldly. āDo not go beyond the things written,ā the Bible warns. (1 Cor 4:6)
What does some reference about some kidās story (most likely fabricated) have to do with anything?
"I'm sorry, I can see how my message might have been unclear. When I asked if Father's Day is 'unbiblical' I meant to ask for a reference *from the bible*. The reference you gave me, is an *interpretation* of bible writings - and a five year old child's interpretation at that. Can you please provide a scripture where we are instructed to disregard the June holiday? I myself am unaware of one" Just adjust it to add some flowery words, depending on how nice you want to be.
āOh great! can you tell me which scriptures this viewpoint is supported by?ā
I can only keep you in my friend zone if you PROMISE to NOT pay ANY extra respect whatsover to your Father when 99% of society is doing so on this very day. Or, God will strike you down! Shame! https://youtu.be/1GiPcP30cFc?si=sTa1flkBbssjGf1h
Hereās how I would reply: Colossians 2:16ā17 says, "Therefore let no one pass judgment on you in questions of food and drink, or with regard to a festival or a new moon or a Sabbath. These are a shadow of the things to come, but the substance belongs to Christ". Notice the scripture addressed all types of celebrations, not just Jewish ones. You may want to dial back on the judgment, and āgoing beyond what is writtenā. That mentality is likely to be a cause for stumbling others. We want to remember to be lovers of God rather than lovers of men. Iāll pray for you. Thatās how Iād reply. Then again, Iām not trying to keep any Dub friends.
I was trying to keep a low profile & friends but its so hard to go along with everything once you wake up
If we donāt enforce clear direct commands from the bible like donāt be gluttons or donāt wear makeup, why is something thats not even in the bible so important to you?
She probably feels bad sheās not ever celebrated her husband on Fatherās Day š¤Ŗ
This is an excellent answer because it's not hostile or argumentative, yet raises an excellent question that forces one to actually have to actually have to think or possibly even research, in order to come up with their own answer (even if their answer is "because the society says we can't, and here's the random scriptures thrown together in an attempt to support this man-made rule of theirs"). Ask them to please reply with their answer using only the Bible itself to support why it's wrong. Then, don't forget to ask once more, why they feel it's not a sin in Jehovah's eyes to ignore what the Bible has to say against the use of makeup, jewelery, hair braids, etc...
While I appreciate the thought, I am only interested in actual biblical verses as reference - I am not interested in publications especially without full scriptural quotes. If you want to be less polite say that you don't particularly intend to take moral and religious advice from the talk of a kindergartener.
No five year old did or said any of this. It is straight JW propaganda...
āSee ya, wouldnāt wanna be yaā
There are worse sins and wrongs JWs are committing and yet they speak of this one as a grave sin. āāHow terrible for you, teachers of the Law and Pharisees! You hypocrites! You give to God a tenth even of the seasoning herbs, such as mint, dill, and cumin, but you neglect to obey the really important teachings of the Law, such as justice and mercy and honesty. These you should practise, without neglecting the others. Blind guides! You strain a fly out of your drink, but swallow a camel!ā āāMatthewā¬ ā23ā¬:ā23ā¬-ā24ā¬ āGNBDCā¬ā¬
It really doesn't matter what you say. PIMI people are ~~brainwashed~~ trained to twist everything that isn't blatant regurgitation of watchtower rhetoric.
I noticed that recently š unfortunately itās impossible to have a conversation that involves rational thinking
Sounds like a self righteous judgemental asshole,you know,a typical jwĀ
I don't know why people celebrate things only sometimes, for me, it's so hard being straight 11 months of the year. Instead of pride, why can't we be ourselves every day, smh. /s
My parents relented years ago and now look forward to, even gift me back on Mothers Day and Fathers Day. It is a day of recognition nothing more nothing less.
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Thatās how i feel about that
You should say "I agree" and then proceed to post on your social media "Happy Fathers Day! Because we should love and respect our fathers every day." .... Every single day until they defriend you.
I love how they privately celebrate stuff like Thanksgiving but in person theyāre like āoh no thatās paganā and do mental gymnastics to CREATE the proof. Silly geese
That line is their go to for every non religious holiday. Why doesnāt that logic apply to memorial and wedding anniversaries? Instead of celebrating our spouse once a year, we should love and respect them everyday.
Itās strange how they do not want witnesses to celebrate days like Fatherās Day or any other days except wedding anniversaries. If they want to say that those celebrations are pagan,well technically if you look up where the customs associated with weddings are pagan. But the governing body wonāt acknowledge that. Another reason why I believe they wonāt celebrate is due to the fact that I believe Satan is backing them so the GB wants our exclusive devotion to go to him with no distractions. By the way, the Bible says to āhonor your father and your mother,ā which we should do every day. But this one day a year giving them special honor brings joy to their hearts.
Out of curiosity, did anyone else here celebrate Father's Day but not Mother's Day? I was raised in the religion and all of my extended family are witnesses. For some reason, we were always allowed to celebrate Father's Day but not Mother's and I was curious if anyone else had this experience?
What's the actual bible verse? Post the verse and a ? Ask them to explain how they correlate
And not to forget to honour father and mother.
I wouldn't reply or say feel free to unfriend me.
S I L E N C E...You can't reason with stupid.
If this were a real-life example, Dorian would have been clowned by the entire school till they all graduated from high school. SMH.
This is so true šÆ š¤£
Right! I was sooooooo quiet as a kid in school cuz being a jw was unbearably embarrassing. Thank goodness I woke up before I forced my kids to believe this nonsense
First, I would point out the following - What he sent doesn't say NOT to celebrate Father's Day. It says "children should respect and obey their parents every day" which is not what Father's Day is about. Father's Day is about showing appreciation for your dad. JWs celebrate wedding anniversaries. By that logic, wedding anniversaries should not be observed because we should love and cherish our husband/wife every day of the year. And JWs should not observe the Memorial, because they should be thankful for Jesus' sacrifice every day. Then I would ask my question again, where in the Bible does it say NOT to celebrate Father's Day? The scripture referenced in his text, Ephesians 6:4 just says what a father is supposed to do. Which has absolutely nothing to do with Father's Day.
I can't tell you how many parties I've seen thrown for bethelites (right IN Brooklyn BETHEL, no less) for someone with 20+ years of service... not to mention the parties thrown for full-time pioneers who've dedicated the same amount of time/service!! Where in the Bible did Jesus ever instruct or set this type of example for us to follow? Never? Were the 1st century Christians ever known to praise and celebrate people for their years of preaching or service to Jehovah in this way? No, again?? Do you feel this is committing a sin then? No?? Can you explain, using only your Bible, why you feel Jesus wouldn't be bothered by that, but considers it evil if others want to set aside a day each year to honor all their parents do, even though they love and honor them all year round? Perhaps in the future, when the Governing Body explains this has been unscriptural all along, you'll suddenly be ok with it... just like you all quickly grew beards and women started wearing pants to the KH, without ANY guilt. I look forward to the day the GB is humble enough to recognize and correct this error in their belief as well. I'll keep praying for Jehovah to speed up their understanding in this until then. (This approach, particularly being specific about the very recent and abrupt changes to their "truth", drives them insane, and has proven very effective for me in recent months. They hate it, but they can't refute it).
Why are all the weird congregations in America? I've been a witness for 22 years, never knew fathers day and mothers day was an issue. Probably just an over zealous publisher Nothing wrong with appreciating your parents
There arenāt enough arguments to reply a JW
Well that quote from a Wt or whatever publication, soon showed us how it is so unscriptural to celebrate Fatherās Day š but wait a minute, doesnāt Ephesians 6 :4 just say fathers do not exasperate your children? Where does that scripture indicate God hates Fatherās Day? False reasoning or what.
Ewwwwwww
Tell them to actually read Ephesians 6:4 and then ask them to explain how that conflates to not celebrating father's/mother's day? Ā Of course no JW actually cares what the Bible says, it's all about what mother WT says in the articles. Ā Also laughable is the fact that it is implied that wordlyĀ children only show respect to their fathers on father's day, yet somehow JW kids respect them all throughout the year ???
I wouldnāt engage further- they think if they can keep you talking (responding) theyāve got you. They are making you feel like you owe them an explanation. Just my opinion, but Iād probably just say, ātake care.ā Or send some safe emoji and then stop answering.
Best response to a pimi is block their number
Ewww this made me puke!! Like why the fuck do they care like if it bothers you soo much delete me! I recommend you to delete all jws from your page fuck that you donāt need to deal with none of that!
Yeah, I would just block and deleteššš
Curious as to why he would question you on a āholidayā not mentioned in scripture to refrain from celebrating which should lead to it being a āconscience decisionā when on the same day numerous people around the world were observing Pentecost or the Feast of Weeks, a Feast of Jehovah or āHoly Dayā aka āholidayā that is mentioned in scripture numerous times and according to Leviticus 23 it should be observed forever no matter where you live, āOn that same day you are to proclaim a sacred assembly and do no regular work. This is to be a lasting ordinance for the generations to come, wherever you live.ā āāLeviticusā¬ ā23ā¬:ā21ā¬ āNIVā¬ā¬ Again curious as to why the focus on a holiday God never mentions when a holiday God commanded āhis peopleā to observe forever isnāt even on his radar? I think Jesus said it better than I could ever say it, āYou blind guides! You strain out a gnat but swallow a camel.ā āāMatthewā¬ ā23ā¬:ā24ā¬ āNIVā¬ā¬
Im pretty sure you asked if fathers day was unbiblical in anyway, correct? His reply was that there was plenty of "references." What he failed to mention was that these references were not from the bible but from WT produces publications. In addition, his "reference" was not even a biblical reference, it was an anecdotal story. This is the same trick all JW's play. No need to use the bible to prove a point when you have WT publications. The very definition of "going beyond whats written" - 1 Cor 4:6.
Unfriend them please. But drop a witty comment first
Celebrate and honor are synonymous. Scripture does say honor your father and mother. So celebrate their good work. If youāre supposed respect and obey them everyday, isnāt Fatherās Day one of those days too and the times make it more convenient as wellšššš
"I keep my friends group uplifting and spiritually focused " š¤¢š¤¢š¤¢š¤¢š¤¢