“I suggest that research is not the answer,” (Dallin H. Oaks, Apr 11, 2019)
"Having perplexing questions that arise from reasons to doubt is not a problem. But please understand, finding answers to these perplexing questions ultimately is not the solution." (Elder Kyle S. McKay Church Historian)
“| have a hard time with historians because they idolize the truth. The truth is not uplifting; it destroys.....Historians should tell only that part of the truth that is inspiring and uplifting.” (Elder Boyd K. Packer, Faithful History: Essays On Writing Mormon History, p 103, fn 22)
“Some things that are true are not helpful”, so they are hidden. (Do not spread disease germs! Boyd K. Packer. BYU Studies, Summer 1981:259, 262-271).
“You will not get to know it [whether the Book of Mormon is true] by trying to prove it archaeologically, or by DNA, or by anything else... Religious truth is always confirmed by what you feel.” (M. Russell Ballard, Mormon Newsroom, Oct. 4, 2007)
Packer picked a fight with historians of Mormonism, most notably Mike Quinn, back in the early 80s.
https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/manual/teaching-seminary-preservice-readings-religion-370-471-and-475/the-mantle-is-far-far-greater-than-the-intellect?lang=eng
Not sure if this is an exact fit but Nelson's recent Think Celestial talk mandates a strong insularity, especially this part:
Never take counsel from those who do not believe. Seek guidance from voices you can trust—from prophets, seers, and revelators and from the whisperings of the Holy Ghost, who “will show unto you *all* things what ye should do.”
Whole talk:
[https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/general-conference/2023/10/51nelson?lang=eng](https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/general-conference/2023/10/51nelson?lang=eng)
Thank you and glad your response is near the top. This was the first one that came to my mind as this is exactly what he said. No independent thoughts allowed.
Yup, after you share one of the many instances shared here where leaders tell us not to research or trust outsiders, just have her give you one quote from a recent leader that says don’t be afraid to read dissenting opinions. The only one I know of is J Reuben Clark (not recent, didn’t age like a collectors car) saying that if we have the truth it can’t be harmed. And that quote would win your argument from OPs initial post.
That Packer quote about mistrusting historians because they care too much about the truth is gold.
This was recently posted (as a mashup of LDS and JW teachings) and it is quite clearly stated: “Do not go looking toward outside sources, especially apostates who have lost the truth.”
https://www.reddit.com/r/exmormon/s/WoWZG0ywYW
OP here are some other JW and LDS similarities. Its not really what you asked but its pretty powerful.
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C3Lk8H3--Ag](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C3Lk8H3--Ag)
https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/media/video/2019-12-0130-in-search-of-truth?lang=eng
President Dallin H. Oaks of the First Presidency taught that we should be cautious and choose correct sources in our search for truth. When we seek the truth about religion, we should use spiritual methods appropriate for that search.
Consult Reliable Sources:
https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/manual/gospel-topics/seeking-answers/05-consult-reliable-sources?lang=eng#p6
I apologize for bugging y'all again about this--everyone was so helpful the first time and gave me a lot of good ideas and things to think about, so thank you!! First post: https://www.reddit.com/r/exmormon/s/57furqOT31
I might concede to your mother that they haven't said exactly that, but they _often_ emphasize the perilousness of unapproved ideas or information, so it certainly diminishes a typical member's desire to go wading into critical commentary or listen sincerely to the perspective of a critical former member.
I'm going to drop point number 10 from [a document I wrote up a few years ago](https://faenrandir.github.io/a_careful_examination/lds-indoctrination-and-retentive-socialization/)
---
**The perilousness of unapproved ideas or information**
1. Members are warned against seeking information from unapproved sources:
> As seekers of truth, our safety lies in asking the right questions, in faith, and of the right sources—meaning those who only speak truth: such as the scriptures, prophets, and the Lord through the Holy Ghost." (Sheri Dew, [Will You Engage in the Wrestle](http://www.byui.edu/devotionals/sheri-dew))
2. The 7th temple recommend question\* discourages acceptance or promotion of ideas contrary to LDS teachings:
> Do you support or promote any teachings, practices, or doctrine contrary to those of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints?
Potential loss of a temple recommend may then act as a deterrent to critical investigation or the voicing of concerns.
3. Members have been instructed to not attend symposia that include presentations that ...could...detract from [the Church's] mission (General Handbook of Instruction 1999):
> The Church warns its members against symposia and other similar gatherings that include presentations that (1) disparage, ridicule, make light of, or are otherwise inappropriate in their treatment of sacred matters or (2) could injure the Church, detract from its mission, or jeopardize its members' well-being. Members should not allow their position or standing in the Church to be used to promote or imply endorsement of such gatherings.
4. Members are to "disconnect" from proselyting of those who have lost their faith:
> We should disconnect, immediately and completely, from listening to the proselytizing efforts of those who have lost their faith and instead reconnect promptly with the Holy Spirit. (April 2016 BYU Commencement Address, L. Whitney Clayton, [Getting and Staying Connected](https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/church/news/stay-connected-to-god-elder-l-whitney-clayton-tells-byu-graduates?lang=eng))
5. Faith-killers should be shunned:
> Avoid those who would teardown your faith. Faith-killers are to be shunned. The seeds which they plant in the minds and hearts of men grow like cancer and eat away the Spirit. (Oct 1981 GC, Carlos E. Asay, [Opposition to the Work of God](https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/general-conference/1981/10/opposition-to-the-work-of-god?lang=eng))
The example Asay gives of a "faith-killer" is a person who pointed out contradictions in the historical record to a new convert.
LDS members are generally reluctant to consult sources known to be critical of the LDS Church (examples [1](https://askgramps.org/counseled-not-read-anti-mormon-literature/), [2](https://www.reddit.com/r/exmormon/comments/45dfmt/life_after_divorce_is_it_better_or_worse/), [3](https://www.reddit.com/r/exmormon/comments/1cek9w/am_i_seriously_going_to_lose_my_family_because_i/), [4](https://www.reddit.com/r/exmormon/comments/5klhmz/worst_xmas_ever_first_one_since_leaving_tscc/), [5](https://www.reddit.com/r/exmormon/comments/6cf75l/just_had_a_close_tbm_friend_point_out_how_cultish/)) or sometimes resources discussing LDS-related topics which are simply unapproved by the LDS Church ([for example](https://www.reddit.com/r/exmormon/comments/7jl8mo/why_are_the_essays_taboo/)). Avoiding potentially faith-damaging information may even extend to reluctance to read official churchofjesuschrist.org essays meant to faithfully address criticism of the LDS Church (examples [1](https://www.reddit.com/r/exmormon/comments/7v3rqr/i_finally_did_it_i_told_my_wife_sort_of/), [2](https://www.reddit.com/r/exmormon/comments/5jr865/my_father_refuses_to_read_the_essays_on_ldsorg/), [3](https://www.reddit.com/r/exmormon/comments/5t88id/how_do_believing_mormons_react_to_the_official/), [4](https://www.reddit.com/r/exmormon/comments/2s2ghf/its_antimormon_hate_literature/), [5](https://www.reddit.com/r/exmormon/comments/4gmplo/getting_harder_and_harder_to_talk_to_my_dad_and/), [6](https://www.reddit.com/r/exmormon/comments/7jl8mo/why_are_the_essays_taboo/), [7](https://www.reddit.com/r/exmormon/comments/3v68m9/i_want_to_write_a_letter_to_the_first_presidency/)).
---
\* - The temple recommend questions were [updated in October of 2019](https://newsroom.churchofjesuschrist.org/article/october-2019-general-conference-temple-recommend). The previous question, asked for decades (or at least [as early as 2007](https://web.archive.org/web/20070108102337/http://www.lds4u.com:80/lesson5/templequestions.htm)), was:
> Do you support, affiliate with, or agree with any group or individual whose teachings or practices are contrary to or oppose those accepted by the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints?
That's amazing. My brothers and I got into Bach and particularly Bach organ music (we own a few complete sets :sweat-smile:). This is one of our favorite pieces (fun and intense). I don't play organ, but I play enough piano to sense that anyone who can play Bach fugues on the organ is amazing.
> whatever decisions you make… even if I disagree with you 100%, will never change my love for you. Ever.
Hopefully she meant that. Not all parents love unconditionally, and it’s awful
>Never take counsel from those who do not believe. Seek guidance from voices you can trust—from prophets, seers, and revelators..
RM Nielsen, Oct 2024 *Think Celestial*
>**Use Reliable Sources** Encourage people to use reliable sources if they have questions. Explain that not all sources are trustworthy, particularly on the internet. Many sources use information in misleading ways. The best sources for learning about the Church are Church-approved resources.
Peach my Gospel, chapter 10
>When we seek the truth about religion, we should use spiritual methods appropriate for that search: prayer, the witness of the Holy Ghost, and study of the scriptures and the words of modern prophets. I am always sad when I hear of one who reports a loss of religious faith because of secular teachings.
DH Oaks, Oct 2018 *Truth and the Plan*
>Teach and testify of gospel truths:
>Teach doctrine simply and clearly from the scriptures and as revealed through modern prophets.
>Help students examine questions in the context of the plan of salvation and the gospel of Jesus Christ and in the proper historical context.
...
>`Invite students to study scriptures, prophetic counsel, and other uplifting sources, including the Gospel Topics page on LDS.org.
[Helping others ask questions](https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/si/objective/doctrinal-mastery/helping-others-ask?lang=eng)
>I hope we can teach our youth to be discerning when it comes to what they read on the Internet. As both parents and teachers, we can teach our youth to choose sources and information which build faith and testimony in Joseph Smith rather than that which creates doubt and perpetuates falsehoods. These things have been around for ages and are now being repackaged as something new and shocking
Bonnie L. Oscarson, “Greater Expectations,” Seminaries and Institutes of Religion satellite broadcast, Aug. 5, 2014
I think technically, your mom is right.
DH Oaks, *Testimony*, Apr 2008
>The first step in gaining any kind of knowledge is to really desire to know. In the case of spiritual knowledge, the next step is to ask God in sincere prayer.
>We gain or strengthen a testimony by bearing it.
>In addition to those already stated, we need to partake of the sacrament each week...
So, 1) want to believe, 2) pray, 3) say you believe, 4) take sacrament (5 profit?)
No study, from any kind of materials. Just say you believe and act like you believe until you do.
You know your mom best, so you know if she is being fake with that first paragraph. Speaking for my own situation, I'd take it as a huge win if my mom ever said anything even close to that. Even if it was forced.
As a missionary I taught the Moroni promise. Pray in sincerity and the Holy Spirit gives you the warm fuzzies (or something similar). I never taught about reading approved resources. But…that was a long time ago. Most recently Rusty gave his “think celestial” talk which others cited, I think it’s pretty clear that reading only church approved is the way to go. If she argues that point, send her the CES Letter.
i don't know if this has been posted yet, but it was VERY heavily taught in my seminary class to "seek further understanding through divinely appointed sources": [https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/si/doctrinal-mastery/acquiring-spiritual-knowledge/seek-through-divine-sources?lang=eng](https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/si/doctrinal-mastery/acquiring-spiritual-knowledge/seek-through-divine-sources?lang=eng)
In regard to the second paragraph, I found a study manual on the church website that states:
"As part of the Lord’s appointed process for obtaining spiritual knowledge, He has established sources through which He reveals truth and guidance to His children. These divinely appointed sources include the Light of Christ, the Holy Ghost, the scriptures, Church leaders, and faithful family members. The First Presidency and the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles—the Lord’s prophets on the earth today—are a vital source of truth. The Lord has chosen and ordained these individuals to speak for Him."
[https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/manual/foundations-of-the-restoration-teacher-material-2019/lesson-3-class-preparation-material-acquiring-spiritual-knowledge?lang=eng](https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/manual/foundations-of-the-restoration-teacher-material-2019/lesson-3-class-preparation-material-acquiring-spiritual-knowledge?lang=eng)
It's incredibly tricky because although they say these are church appointed sources, they also say this:
We can also learn truth through other trustworthy sources. However, sincere seekers of truth should be wary of unreliable sources of information. Learning to recognize and avoid unreliable sources can protect us from misinformation and from those who seek to destroy faith.
An often pattern I see however is that if you find information that makes you question your faith, then it is misinformation by default---- cult like mindset perhaps?
What makes it tricky is the line between what is presented to the public and what is taught behind closed doors. We all know that when we are to acquire spiritual knowledge that we are "supposed" to be relying solely on church appointed resources bc that's what we were taught.
This idea that if it makes you question your faith then it's wrong is mentioned a lot in this video as well:
[https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/media/video/2016-05-6000-divinely-appointed-sources?lang=eng](https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/media/video/2016-05-6000-divinely-appointed-sources?lang=eng)
It's really funny to be coming back to all of these random church propaganda with a different mindset, it's amazing to see all of the holes in their teachings
About your mom's point that the Church doesn't tell members to stick to church-approved sources, there are actually some references that suggest otherwise. Check these out:
In Search of Truth Video: This video highlights the need to get our info from reliable sources and warns against depending on secular or non-church-approved ones. It says, "We should not consider secular prominence or authority as qualified sources of truth" and encourages using scriptures and prayer for truth.
[https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/media/video/2019-12-0130-in-search-of-truth?lang=eng](https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/media/video/2019-12-0130-in-search-of-truth?lang=eng)
Book of Mormon Seminary Teacher Manual (2024): This manual advises students to look for answers from "divinely appointed sources" and stresses the importance of using sources provided by Heavenly Father and Jesus Christ.
[https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/manual/book-of-mormon-seminary-teacher-manual-2024/04-1-nephi-6-10/042-teacher?lang=eng](https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/manual/book-of-mormon-seminary-teacher-manual-2024/04-1-nephi-6-10/042-teacher?lang=eng)
General Handbook: The handbook advises members to use church resources and avoid sources that promote contention or misinformation. It highlights the importance of seeking guidance from the Holy Ghost and sticking to reliable, church-approved sources.
[https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/manual/gospel-topics/seeking-answers/05-consult-reliable-sources?lang=eng](https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/manual/gospel-topics/seeking-answers/05-consult-reliable-sources?lang=eng)
Foundations of the Restoration Teacher Manual: This manual includes quotes from church leaders like Dieter F. Uchtdorf and Jeffrey R. Holland, who warn against relying on internet sources and emphasize finding truth through faith and church teachings.
[https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/manual/foundations-of-the-restoration-teacher-manual/lesson-10-seek-truth?lang=eng](https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/manual/foundations-of-the-restoration-teacher-manual/lesson-10-seek-truth?lang=eng)
To name just a few :P hope this helps :)
If you have the LDS Library app, open it and search for "trusted sources." That will give you a good start, but here's a link to one example:
https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/liahona/2016/04/youth/spiritual-stability-building-an-unsinkable-ship?lang=eng
For the prayer part simple asked the question: if I pray and get confirmation from the spirit that the church isn’t true or that a different religion is true is that an acceptable method of finding truth? Or is it only acceptable if it confirms that the LDS church is true?
Why are you even engaging with her? She won't charge her beliefs for you, and I assume you won't either. All this will do is cause bad feelings on both sides. Personally I would just ignore the comments and ask about the weather.
“I suggest that research is not the answer,” (Dallin H. Oaks, Apr 11, 2019) "Having perplexing questions that arise from reasons to doubt is not a problem. But please understand, finding answers to these perplexing questions ultimately is not the solution." (Elder Kyle S. McKay Church Historian) “| have a hard time with historians because they idolize the truth. The truth is not uplifting; it destroys.....Historians should tell only that part of the truth that is inspiring and uplifting.” (Elder Boyd K. Packer, Faithful History: Essays On Writing Mormon History, p 103, fn 22) “Some things that are true are not helpful”, so they are hidden. (Do not spread disease germs! Boyd K. Packer. BYU Studies, Summer 1981:259, 262-271). “You will not get to know it [whether the Book of Mormon is true] by trying to prove it archaeologically, or by DNA, or by anything else... Religious truth is always confirmed by what you feel.” (M. Russell Ballard, Mormon Newsroom, Oct. 4, 2007)
I’ve never seen that one from Packer about historians. That’s…a sad and terrifying way to view things.
Packer picked a fight with historians of Mormonism, most notably Mike Quinn, back in the early 80s. https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/manual/teaching-seminary-preservice-readings-religion-370-471-and-475/the-mantle-is-far-far-greater-than-the-intellect?lang=eng
I can’t believe MR Ballard actually said this 😳 All “don’t worry about what the e*vidence *says, the truth is what you f*eel!*”
Not sure if this is an exact fit but Nelson's recent Think Celestial talk mandates a strong insularity, especially this part: Never take counsel from those who do not believe. Seek guidance from voices you can trust—from prophets, seers, and revelators and from the whisperings of the Holy Ghost, who “will show unto you *all* things what ye should do.” Whole talk: [https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/general-conference/2023/10/51nelson?lang=eng](https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/general-conference/2023/10/51nelson?lang=eng)
Thank you and glad your response is near the top. This was the first one that came to my mind as this is exactly what he said. No independent thoughts allowed.
You could ask her for a reference where the church says to look at outside sources. I’m super curious. 🧐
Yup, after you share one of the many instances shared here where leaders tell us not to research or trust outsiders, just have her give you one quote from a recent leader that says don’t be afraid to read dissenting opinions. The only one I know of is J Reuben Clark (not recent, didn’t age like a collectors car) saying that if we have the truth it can’t be harmed. And that quote would win your argument from OPs initial post. That Packer quote about mistrusting historians because they care too much about the truth is gold.
This was recently posted (as a mashup of LDS and JW teachings) and it is quite clearly stated: “Do not go looking toward outside sources, especially apostates who have lost the truth.” https://www.reddit.com/r/exmormon/s/WoWZG0ywYW
OP here are some other JW and LDS similarities. Its not really what you asked but its pretty powerful. [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C3Lk8H3--Ag](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C3Lk8H3--Ag)
https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/media/video/2019-12-0130-in-search-of-truth?lang=eng President Dallin H. Oaks of the First Presidency taught that we should be cautious and choose correct sources in our search for truth. When we seek the truth about religion, we should use spiritual methods appropriate for that search. Consult Reliable Sources: https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/manual/gospel-topics/seeking-answers/05-consult-reliable-sources?lang=eng#p6
I apologize for bugging y'all again about this--everyone was so helpful the first time and gave me a lot of good ideas and things to think about, so thank you!! First post: https://www.reddit.com/r/exmormon/s/57furqOT31
I might concede to your mother that they haven't said exactly that, but they _often_ emphasize the perilousness of unapproved ideas or information, so it certainly diminishes a typical member's desire to go wading into critical commentary or listen sincerely to the perspective of a critical former member. I'm going to drop point number 10 from [a document I wrote up a few years ago](https://faenrandir.github.io/a_careful_examination/lds-indoctrination-and-retentive-socialization/) --- **The perilousness of unapproved ideas or information** 1. Members are warned against seeking information from unapproved sources: > As seekers of truth, our safety lies in asking the right questions, in faith, and of the right sources—meaning those who only speak truth: such as the scriptures, prophets, and the Lord through the Holy Ghost." (Sheri Dew, [Will You Engage in the Wrestle](http://www.byui.edu/devotionals/sheri-dew)) 2. The 7th temple recommend question\* discourages acceptance or promotion of ideas contrary to LDS teachings: > Do you support or promote any teachings, practices, or doctrine contrary to those of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints? Potential loss of a temple recommend may then act as a deterrent to critical investigation or the voicing of concerns. 3. Members have been instructed to not attend symposia that include presentations that ...could...detract from [the Church's] mission (General Handbook of Instruction 1999): > The Church warns its members against symposia and other similar gatherings that include presentations that (1) disparage, ridicule, make light of, or are otherwise inappropriate in their treatment of sacred matters or (2) could injure the Church, detract from its mission, or jeopardize its members' well-being. Members should not allow their position or standing in the Church to be used to promote or imply endorsement of such gatherings. 4. Members are to "disconnect" from proselyting of those who have lost their faith: > We should disconnect, immediately and completely, from listening to the proselytizing efforts of those who have lost their faith and instead reconnect promptly with the Holy Spirit. (April 2016 BYU Commencement Address, L. Whitney Clayton, [Getting and Staying Connected](https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/church/news/stay-connected-to-god-elder-l-whitney-clayton-tells-byu-graduates?lang=eng)) 5. Faith-killers should be shunned: > Avoid those who would teardown your faith. Faith-killers are to be shunned. The seeds which they plant in the minds and hearts of men grow like cancer and eat away the Spirit. (Oct 1981 GC, Carlos E. Asay, [Opposition to the Work of God](https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/general-conference/1981/10/opposition-to-the-work-of-god?lang=eng)) The example Asay gives of a "faith-killer" is a person who pointed out contradictions in the historical record to a new convert. LDS members are generally reluctant to consult sources known to be critical of the LDS Church (examples [1](https://askgramps.org/counseled-not-read-anti-mormon-literature/), [2](https://www.reddit.com/r/exmormon/comments/45dfmt/life_after_divorce_is_it_better_or_worse/), [3](https://www.reddit.com/r/exmormon/comments/1cek9w/am_i_seriously_going_to_lose_my_family_because_i/), [4](https://www.reddit.com/r/exmormon/comments/5klhmz/worst_xmas_ever_first_one_since_leaving_tscc/), [5](https://www.reddit.com/r/exmormon/comments/6cf75l/just_had_a_close_tbm_friend_point_out_how_cultish/)) or sometimes resources discussing LDS-related topics which are simply unapproved by the LDS Church ([for example](https://www.reddit.com/r/exmormon/comments/7jl8mo/why_are_the_essays_taboo/)). Avoiding potentially faith-damaging information may even extend to reluctance to read official churchofjesuschrist.org essays meant to faithfully address criticism of the LDS Church (examples [1](https://www.reddit.com/r/exmormon/comments/7v3rqr/i_finally_did_it_i_told_my_wife_sort_of/), [2](https://www.reddit.com/r/exmormon/comments/5jr865/my_father_refuses_to_read_the_essays_on_ldsorg/), [3](https://www.reddit.com/r/exmormon/comments/5t88id/how_do_believing_mormons_react_to_the_official/), [4](https://www.reddit.com/r/exmormon/comments/2s2ghf/its_antimormon_hate_literature/), [5](https://www.reddit.com/r/exmormon/comments/4gmplo/getting_harder_and_harder_to_talk_to_my_dad_and/), [6](https://www.reddit.com/r/exmormon/comments/7jl8mo/why_are_the_essays_taboo/), [7](https://www.reddit.com/r/exmormon/comments/3v68m9/i_want_to_write_a_letter_to_the_first_presidency/)). --- \* - The temple recommend questions were [updated in October of 2019](https://newsroom.churchofjesuschrist.org/article/october-2019-general-conference-temple-recommend). The previous question, asked for decades (or at least [as early as 2007](https://web.archive.org/web/20070108102337/http://www.lds4u.com:80/lesson5/templequestions.htm)), was: > Do you support, affiliate with, or agree with any group or individual whose teachings or practices are contrary to or oppose those accepted by the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints?
What's your connection to BWV 549? I've played it a handful of times.
That's amazing. My brothers and I got into Bach and particularly Bach organ music (we own a few complete sets :sweat-smile:). This is one of our favorite pieces (fun and intense). I don't play organ, but I play enough piano to sense that anyone who can play Bach fugues on the organ is amazing.
Not amazing, just well trained. You could do it.
I knew you had a page for this, but couldn't figure out which one it was. Glad you posted it.
> whatever decisions you make… even if I disagree with you 100%, will never change my love for you. Ever. Hopefully she meant that. Not all parents love unconditionally, and it’s awful
>Never take counsel from those who do not believe. Seek guidance from voices you can trust—from prophets, seers, and revelators.. RM Nielsen, Oct 2024 *Think Celestial* >**Use Reliable Sources** Encourage people to use reliable sources if they have questions. Explain that not all sources are trustworthy, particularly on the internet. Many sources use information in misleading ways. The best sources for learning about the Church are Church-approved resources. Peach my Gospel, chapter 10 >When we seek the truth about religion, we should use spiritual methods appropriate for that search: prayer, the witness of the Holy Ghost, and study of the scriptures and the words of modern prophets. I am always sad when I hear of one who reports a loss of religious faith because of secular teachings. DH Oaks, Oct 2018 *Truth and the Plan* >Teach and testify of gospel truths: >Teach doctrine simply and clearly from the scriptures and as revealed through modern prophets. >Help students examine questions in the context of the plan of salvation and the gospel of Jesus Christ and in the proper historical context. ... >`Invite students to study scriptures, prophetic counsel, and other uplifting sources, including the Gospel Topics page on LDS.org. [Helping others ask questions](https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/si/objective/doctrinal-mastery/helping-others-ask?lang=eng) >I hope we can teach our youth to be discerning when it comes to what they read on the Internet. As both parents and teachers, we can teach our youth to choose sources and information which build faith and testimony in Joseph Smith rather than that which creates doubt and perpetuates falsehoods. These things have been around for ages and are now being repackaged as something new and shocking Bonnie L. Oscarson, “Greater Expectations,” Seminaries and Institutes of Religion satellite broadcast, Aug. 5, 2014
I think technically, your mom is right. DH Oaks, *Testimony*, Apr 2008 >The first step in gaining any kind of knowledge is to really desire to know. In the case of spiritual knowledge, the next step is to ask God in sincere prayer. >We gain or strengthen a testimony by bearing it. >In addition to those already stated, we need to partake of the sacrament each week... So, 1) want to believe, 2) pray, 3) say you believe, 4) take sacrament (5 profit?) No study, from any kind of materials. Just say you believe and act like you believe until you do.
You know your mom best, so you know if she is being fake with that first paragraph. Speaking for my own situation, I'd take it as a huge win if my mom ever said anything even close to that. Even if it was forced.
There are some shared here; https://old.reddit.com/r/mormon/comments/155078t/looking_for_help_cataloging_the_churchs/
As a missionary I taught the Moroni promise. Pray in sincerity and the Holy Spirit gives you the warm fuzzies (or something similar). I never taught about reading approved resources. But…that was a long time ago. Most recently Rusty gave his “think celestial” talk which others cited, I think it’s pretty clear that reading only church approved is the way to go. If she argues that point, send her the CES Letter.
i don't know if this has been posted yet, but it was VERY heavily taught in my seminary class to "seek further understanding through divinely appointed sources": [https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/si/doctrinal-mastery/acquiring-spiritual-knowledge/seek-through-divine-sources?lang=eng](https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/si/doctrinal-mastery/acquiring-spiritual-knowledge/seek-through-divine-sources?lang=eng)
In regard to the second paragraph, I found a study manual on the church website that states: "As part of the Lord’s appointed process for obtaining spiritual knowledge, He has established sources through which He reveals truth and guidance to His children. These divinely appointed sources include the Light of Christ, the Holy Ghost, the scriptures, Church leaders, and faithful family members. The First Presidency and the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles—the Lord’s prophets on the earth today—are a vital source of truth. The Lord has chosen and ordained these individuals to speak for Him." [https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/manual/foundations-of-the-restoration-teacher-material-2019/lesson-3-class-preparation-material-acquiring-spiritual-knowledge?lang=eng](https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/manual/foundations-of-the-restoration-teacher-material-2019/lesson-3-class-preparation-material-acquiring-spiritual-knowledge?lang=eng) It's incredibly tricky because although they say these are church appointed sources, they also say this: We can also learn truth through other trustworthy sources. However, sincere seekers of truth should be wary of unreliable sources of information. Learning to recognize and avoid unreliable sources can protect us from misinformation and from those who seek to destroy faith. An often pattern I see however is that if you find information that makes you question your faith, then it is misinformation by default---- cult like mindset perhaps? What makes it tricky is the line between what is presented to the public and what is taught behind closed doors. We all know that when we are to acquire spiritual knowledge that we are "supposed" to be relying solely on church appointed resources bc that's what we were taught. This idea that if it makes you question your faith then it's wrong is mentioned a lot in this video as well: [https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/media/video/2016-05-6000-divinely-appointed-sources?lang=eng](https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/media/video/2016-05-6000-divinely-appointed-sources?lang=eng) It's really funny to be coming back to all of these random church propaganda with a different mindset, it's amazing to see all of the holes in their teachings
About your mom's point that the Church doesn't tell members to stick to church-approved sources, there are actually some references that suggest otherwise. Check these out: In Search of Truth Video: This video highlights the need to get our info from reliable sources and warns against depending on secular or non-church-approved ones. It says, "We should not consider secular prominence or authority as qualified sources of truth" and encourages using scriptures and prayer for truth. [https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/media/video/2019-12-0130-in-search-of-truth?lang=eng](https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/media/video/2019-12-0130-in-search-of-truth?lang=eng) Book of Mormon Seminary Teacher Manual (2024): This manual advises students to look for answers from "divinely appointed sources" and stresses the importance of using sources provided by Heavenly Father and Jesus Christ. [https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/manual/book-of-mormon-seminary-teacher-manual-2024/04-1-nephi-6-10/042-teacher?lang=eng](https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/manual/book-of-mormon-seminary-teacher-manual-2024/04-1-nephi-6-10/042-teacher?lang=eng) General Handbook: The handbook advises members to use church resources and avoid sources that promote contention or misinformation. It highlights the importance of seeking guidance from the Holy Ghost and sticking to reliable, church-approved sources. [https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/manual/gospel-topics/seeking-answers/05-consult-reliable-sources?lang=eng](https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/manual/gospel-topics/seeking-answers/05-consult-reliable-sources?lang=eng) Foundations of the Restoration Teacher Manual: This manual includes quotes from church leaders like Dieter F. Uchtdorf and Jeffrey R. Holland, who warn against relying on internet sources and emphasize finding truth through faith and church teachings. [https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/manual/foundations-of-the-restoration-teacher-manual/lesson-10-seek-truth?lang=eng](https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/manual/foundations-of-the-restoration-teacher-manual/lesson-10-seek-truth?lang=eng) To name just a few :P hope this helps :)
If you have the LDS Library app, open it and search for "trusted sources." That will give you a good start, but here's a link to one example: https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/liahona/2016/04/youth/spiritual-stability-building-an-unsinkable-ship?lang=eng
For the prayer part simple asked the question: if I pray and get confirmation from the spirit that the church isn’t true or that a different religion is true is that an acceptable method of finding truth? Or is it only acceptable if it confirms that the LDS church is true?
Why are you even engaging with her? She won't charge her beliefs for you, and I assume you won't either. All this will do is cause bad feelings on both sides. Personally I would just ignore the comments and ask about the weather.